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RE: FW: my view of the conference (fwd)



---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 10:12:40 +-1100
From: April Sampson-Kelly <askpv@ozemail.com.au>
To: "'llondon@patrick.mathernet.com'" <llondon@patrick.mathernet.com>
Subject: RE: FW: my view of the conference

You wrote>That would be a great thing to do. List all the PC mailing lists and 
organic agriculture newsgroups on our homepages.

Larry I personally got the impression or came to the conclusion -
how can one know which thoughts are truly unique to ones
brain anyway, 
that 
in keeping with our aims for a truly self-evolving positive
movement we need to flatten our structure, Mollison
listened to our small internet group which I thought was
encouraging, he spoke about himself in a way that 
showed his weariness, he showed that what was in
his head would take a lifetime for someone else to extrude
and so - I think he had hoped for some better means of
imparting knowledge - a kind of cerebral osmosis.
He talked about teams of specialist surgeons etc having
the same difficulties.
I think we have to set up structures that allow access and 
contribution WITHOUT having to be vetted, having to 
be in the know, without having to be famous or infamous
as may be in my case!!
You must realise, that I am at your instruction on the jargon
and guts of these internet animals, 
I only hope to set up a beast that I can have link with
me, preserve freedom of speech, not cost me extra 
net time (and this seems VERY important to people
non-academic esp. in USA where complaints about a
slow net) and welcome isolated people - it has got to 
plain english man.  Just press here kind of stuff.

What you are proposing sounds terrific - won't it cost you a lot
of your time L?  Spammers are spammers and this is an
interactive medium, so we could get burnt regardless of
our safety gear
What we need is to assist people in protocol.  Establish
protocol instruction as part of the web site/newgroup
Advise people on how to handle private letters and what to
put up for public veiw - this is essential as it has upset some
people in years past I hear from Adam Tiller (who regrets that
some of his views expressed privately were publicised on the net)
I think that now is the time to start a permaculture _newsgroup_; not
just another Internet mailing list. I wonder, what with all the
spamming, whether doing one in the Usenet mainstream heirarchy is
a good idea, something like alt.agriculture.permaculture or maybe
alt.permaculture. To avoid the spammers I hope _soon_ to be
able to offer a PC newsgroup out of the mainstream via a publically
accessable nntp newsserver. You will be able to add our server to your 
news reader (i.e. Netscape, Internet Explorer, Free Agent) and pull down
the full or partial news spool at any time. We will not expire articles
so that we will have a permanent archive to refer to as needed.
that will save everyone a lot of time and open up discussions over time
to allow maturity of concepts and 
input from a wider range of people, given more time to contemplate.
You can also plug our new PC newsgroup into a URL on your homepage; it
will look something like this:
<a href="nntp:[our news site's name]/[newsgroup heirarchy
name>.permaculture]>Permaculture Newsgroup</a>  

or something like that - I'll have to figure
out the proper command syntax for the tag. 
A lot of people will co-operate on this one./
PS I hear there is an Australian mailing list - do you
'know them?  I haven't found them yet, don't see them as
competition here, rather an appendage.
ALSO
lets get support from the PIJ magazine (this is one power
that needs flattening, more open acess)

I will also bidirectionally gate the permaculture-mg mailing list into
this newsgroup - this way folks can post & read the way they prefer
and we will have an archive to access to read all past articles.

I would like to make this combo Permaculture newsgroup/mailing list 
resource our main global Permaculture discussion forum.
I too, and lets make it special with a permaculture cultural design
that offers new paths on the net, new protocol and structure.
Is it possible to do automatic linking - up to know people have to beg to
get linked to other sites.
You can warn visitors that the links are not vetted - enter at own risk 
and force people to lift their link if it isn't ethical/satisfactory 
rather than just exclude them.
 If necessary I
could gate (unidirectionally) any/all other Permaculture mailing lists
into our newsgroup. Those wishing to can also forward relevant articles
from other lists or newsgroups into our newsgroup (or into
permaculture-mg).

Do you and others think this resource will fill the present and future
needs of the global Permaculture community for networking on the Web &
Internet? What might Bill Mollison have to say about this? 
In our very small group (15 max) of internet people, I was the only
female with any experience on the net.  Mollison's current companion, Lisa
was in the group and this I saw as exciting, I think the net is a wonderful space
for women, expecially isolated women.  
and after the conference I have decided to stay isolated!!!  yeah, one guy asked
once I living under a rock of something?  I said yes! and I love my rock.
anyway Lisa, is a connection we could foster.  bill obviously sees our work
as important, had a few comments to make about putting the designers manual
onto CD rom, has had rediculous proposals made - into the $2millon mark
all we wanted has a dump with a search facility - this would be cheap.
so anyone willing has a performance clause according to Mollison
- get it done in 18months or loose the rights.  Thats sounds fair to me.
Lets get someone onto it - FAST, and not someone greedy

Recently I got a letter from someone in USA, hopping that that this
mailing list would not become more expensive to access, if I can find 
it in this pile of letters I'll forward it.
Let me hear any comments or suggestions that come to mind, including a
name for the newsgroup.
I don't even know what the current mailing list name is.
make sure it has permaculture in the name for a start, I guess
Keep it simple 
April

Lawrence
- dweller among a few hundred bees who survived the summer 
and are feverishly making preparations for winter -

-- 
Lawrence F. London, Jr. - Venaura Farm - Chapel Hill, NC, USA
mailto:london@sunSITE.unc.edu  http://sunSITE.unc.edu/InterGarden
mailto:llondon@mathernet.com  http://mathernet.com/llondon
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