From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Feb 28 08:22:28 2009 Return-Path: <> X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.8 (2007-02-13) on industrial X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-86.6 required=2.4 tests=ADVANCE_FEE_1,AWL, MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR,SPF_HELO_PASS,USER_IN_WHITELIST autolearn=disabled version=3.1.8 X-Original-To: adamf@IBIBLIO.ORG Delivered-To: adamf@IBIBLIO.ORG Received: from listserv.albany.edu (unknown [169.226.1.24]) by metalab.unc.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD06048FF3 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2009 08:17:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from listserv.albany.edu (listserv.albany.edu [169.226.1.24]) by listserv.albany.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n1SDAZdm011456 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2009 08:17:23 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 08:17:18 -0500 From: "University at Albany LISTSERV Server (14.5)" Subject: File: "BEE-L LOG0307B" To: adamf@IBIBLIO.ORG Message-ID: Content-Length: 109922 Lines: 2483 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2003 19:27:04 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: allen dick Subject: Re: Eastern Apicultural Society Deadline MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Given offers to answer "any questions", but no reply to the offers, > let alone specific questions, wasn't it a certainty that no answers > would result? I wasn't expecting personal attention from EAS, I was just asking my BEE-L friends for some hints. A deadline was looming within hours and I was lacking the info to make a decision. Once the deadline has passed and I decided not to pre-register, I cared a whole lot less. As for asking the EAS people specific questions, the moment had passed, and the subject was not sufficiently important to bother them if they did not see fit to post more info for all -- and, besides one of the oficers who wrote after reading my BEE-L post, said, in his email, that he did not have the information that is most obviously lacking and most important to me -- a detailed program for the Short Course. > Are you saying that there is no similar type of guidebook for RVs in North America? If not, let's publish one! Of course there is, and that, or something similar, is what my truck driving friend consulted. What I was pointing out was that he could see one of my problems and helped how he could, with real info. FWIW, real RVers don't stay in campgrounds very often. The truckers guide is more helpful to many of us, as is finding the nearest Wal-Mart -- or a marina. > jim (Who notes that a Google search for "schedule change" > yields 3,610,000 hits, while "schedule unchanged" only yields > 276,000 hits, and infers that any one schedule has a 90% > chance of being changed.) That is flawed logic presented as proof. Let's just give it a quick test: Which of the following would you be more desperate (and hence more likely) to announce on the net, and which would pass without notice to all? 1.) That the schedule was toast, and/or the keynote speaker died, fell ill, was disredited and defrocked, went on a bender, or was offered a larger fee elsewhere, etc.? 2.) That the schedule was not changed and would go on pretty much as expected with minor, if any, changes? How huge a change would it take to qualify to have the words "schedule change" in a program? Not very, I'd wager. Back to EAS: As I said previously, I don't expect miracles, but I was expecting a reasonably detailed and useful schedule. But please understand. I am not unhappy. I had unrealistically high expectations of EAS, and now that I have come to my senses and accept EAS for what it is, I am again in tune with the universe. I may, or may not, attend. allen http://www.honeybeeworld.com/diary/ Now up to 71 hives again, and growing fast! :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2003 13:51:34 GMT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: waldig@NETZERO.COM Subject: 2-queen hive. Content-Type: text/plain Being in a hurry and a bit short on equipment at the moment, I recently hived a sizeable 'queenright' swarm in a deep over an excluder on top of an existing colony that was in a single deep. Only the original hive entrance was left to both colonies' use. The swarm was collected over 30 miles from my apiary. Since then, I've noticed that just about half of the swarm bees have drifted to the adjacent hives in the apiary. This brings me to a question about 2-queen hives: when bees from the upper colony leave the 2-queen hive for a flight and, up return, smell the workers/queen scent from the lower colony, do they get confused and look for another hive to enter? By the way, both queens in the dual hive are laying well. Waldemar Long Island, NY :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2003 21:56:47 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Kilty Subject: Re: How To Lose A Queen Comments: To: jfischer@supercollider.com In-Reply-To: <00bb01c343e5$8b116290$7604c518@gollum> MIME-Version: 1.0 In message <00bb01c343e5$8b116290$7604c518@gollum>, James Fischer writes >Something "scary" happened yesterday. snip >The odds against both "losing the queen", and also finding her right >under your nose? I dropped a queen and not finding her, thought she must have dropped into the hive. After looking through all the ret of the hives, I went past that hive and discovered a small cluster of bees ushering her back towards the leg of the hive stand on the opposite side to where I thought I'd dropped her. But a friend reported losing a clipped queen, then found her in a neighbouring colony where the clipped queen had also been lost, but entered at a stage where he had already reduced the cells to just one. The queen laid a few eggs then the virgin hatched and went off in a swarm leaving the foreign queen to take over. I will get the full story as I think he said the second queen had done the same and had gone into a mating nuc with a cell. -- James Kilty :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2003 18:07:08 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Lloyd Spear Subject: Ross Round Sections MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have a buyer looking for "all he can get" of Ross Round sections. He knows he has to pay top dollar, because of the extracted honey price situation. Anyone expecting 500 or more sections to sell, please contact me privately. Lloyd Lloyd Spear, Owner Ross Rounds, Inc. Manufacturers of Ross Rounds Comb Honey Equipment, Sundance Pollen Traps and Custom Printer of Sundance Labels. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2003 18:26:42 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: allen dick Subject: how to make the bees use an upper entrance MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I found this interesting: allen --- From: "islander" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: super entrance Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2003 20:05:49 +0400 somebody wrote about how to make the bees use an upper entrance. I had problems with humidity in the hives, mycosis on frames and combs, ants living on the hive roof with all the ants eggs... I had idear to remove the roof elements by simply a sheet of thick, clear glass, just 1 centimeter larger and longuer than the body hive. A french master Alain Caillas wrote "they produce almost 3 times more in clear hives", and they become so kind girls. It's known Clear hives are much expensive than ordinary, But I thought maybe I'm clever than the others(!!! we never know!!!), and only replacing original roof by a glass I could earn a part of a clear one benefits. I thought I will 1) guet rid of ants over the hive 2) help to guet the hive more dry 3) say good bye to the mites as they hate the light 4) maybe if Caillas was right, they would become more kind it happens they immediatly want to go out thru the upper of the hive, thru the glass (impossible) so they stay all along the day colliting with the glass here. and also I had a lot of water condensation on the glass inside.And some day with sun, the hive become very hot, too much in fact. after that I did experimentations. I let some small openings under the glass, the side the sun is(because they insist go out that place only), I put a layer of plastic insulation that let maybe 40% of the light coming in, no more, so protect from hard sun and also keep better the warm during the night (but I am in tropical area in Reunion Island), with just 2 centimeter not covered by insulation, in the sun direction, so they can see hard sun from that and quicky go out at work from that place, because the small openings are near. It works very well. an important amount of bees use the openings, very quickly after put the glass, just need a few days so they become used about where exactly are the openings. It seems as they see the sun they wake up and directly go at work ! I even see sometimes bees with pollen, enter into the hive from the bottom, and arrived inside they forguet they are still loaded, and then go out for work from the upper openning, then realise they are still loaded and enter again. mites have a few. ants none.with the isolation, no condensation inside, and the small upper openings give better ventilation. and the girls really became very very kind.They love the light, can see what their job inside... I don't know what's the reason.Why keeping these sun lover's in the dark ? it's simple. the same hive if you remove the roof without smoke, you guet 20 girls on you after 2 seconds in a very bad mood you know what I mean, and now with light, I open without protection on me and without smoke, they don't mind ! I can even put my bare hand into the hive, they don't bother. And the season is not good : rainy, cold, and no flowers, and they have a few honey reserve. I don't know if I can go far, remove frames, etc without smoke. This is not shure. Later on I will try. So for the person who wants have upper openings, this is an immediate way, and it works nearly immediatly. for them to go out at least. To enter, it's not immediat. because when they arrive, flying on the hive they remember only the old entrance. But the new born bees guet used to go out using the upper, and return into the upper again after work returning into the hive. If somebody have done similar experiences, I would be curious to know about. sorry if English mistakes, I'm only french ! this file is very interesting. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2003 23:04:18 -0400 Reply-To: jfischer@supercollider.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Fischer Organization: Bedford Advanced Technology Test Lab Effort Subject: Re: how to make the bees use an upper entrance > I had idear to remove the roof elements by simply a sheet of thick, > clear glass, just 1 centimeter larger and longuer than the body hive. > A french master Alain Caillas wrote "they produce almost 3 times more in > clear hives", and they become so kind girls. Whoa! Pull over to the side of the road, and come to a full stop. License and registration please. I'm officer Fischer of the Physics Highway Patrol. Isn't a hive body with glass on top the most simple form of a SOLAR WAX MELTER?!!!??? I'm afraid I'm going to have to cite you for: A 101.5-L: Premeditated hive-a-cide, by um, baking or frying bees, melting wax comb, and causing honey to run down to the bottom board. A 917.3-H: Willful and reckless ignorance of not only the most basic laws of physics, and failure to even notice that YOU get very hot when you set in front of a window in the full sun. A 987.12: Cruelty to animals, to wit, putting a pane of glass between the bees and full sunlight, prompting them to smash themselves endlessly into the glass until they die, perhaps even before they are slow-roasted by the concentrated heat in the hive. Stop pointing that "top entrance", that's not going to vent enough air to make up for covering the top of an entire hive with a sheet of glass. Lucky for you, I am not in a mood to do paperwork, or go to court on my day off, so I'll just take that sheet of glass, lean it here up against a tree, and have some target practice will you go fetch a proper cover for the hive. Run quickly now, because after I shoot the glass, I'm going to need another target... jim :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2003 22:13:49 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Harrison Subject: Re: how to make the bees use an upper entrance MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I find Allen's post most interesting . Enough to experiment on a hive with a glass top. Why not? Frenchman said: I put a layer of plastic insulation that let maybe 40% of the light coming in, no more, so protect from hard sun and also keep better the warm during the night I wonder what type of insulation would work. I thought of 1/2 inch bubble wrap as I have got plenty around for shipping. Frenchman said: I even see sometimes bees with pollen, enter into the hive from the bottom, and arrived inside they forguet they are still loaded, and then go out for work from the upper openning, then realise they are still loaded and enter again. The Frenchman is very observant but if he watched any hive long enough without the glass on top he would see the same thing happen every once in a while. I sat around three hours the first time I saw a bee fly from the hive with a load of pollen and then return. One has to wonder would a hive of africanized bees become docile in a hive with a glass top? Wyatt Mangum showed us there were many early patents for screened bottom boards. Any patents for glass tops on a bee hive Wyatt? Back when the pyramid craze (70's U.S.) was on a friend built a Plexiglas pyramid shaped hive. The bees got to hot and absconded and the comb melted when the heat of summer set in. Perhaps all my friend needed was insulation like the Frenchman used? For those not knowing what I mean by the *pyramid craze* I will explain. People in the U.S. were selling these little plastic pyramids to keep your bread, meat, and other things in to keep from spoiling.Even razor blades were said to stay sharp forever if kept in one of these little plastic pyramids Many other claims were made but I do not remember as I was only interested in my friends pyramid bee hive experiment. One vender was even selling a pyramid tent to put in your bedroom to sleep in. Bob :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 06:06:21 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "Paul D. Law (aka Dennis)" Subject: Another use for honey: in butter MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >From the FoodNetwork Show: Tyler's Ultimate Episode: Pancakes http://www.foodnetwork.com/food/recipes/recipe/0,1977,FOOD_9936_23254,00.html Maple Butter: 2 sticks unsalted butter, softened 1/4 cup pure maple syrup 2 tablespoons honey 1 piece parchment or greaseproof paper :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 21:55:45 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Christine Gray Subject: Re: how to make the bees use an upper entrance MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bob Harrison said: I find Allen's post most interesting . Enough to experiment on a hive with a glass top. Why not? > I have an observation hive for a full sized colony which has an uncoverable glass side (pointing north) and can have a glass cover , usually covered by a wooden roof. Condensation on the roof glass is always a problem. , so I will watch this thread with interest. Using thick (10mm) plastic was better but not perfect. Even my plastic glasses always mist up when I breathe on them. It might be worth chasing up the Russian experiments on hives with one or two glass walls to the brood chamber, referred to (enthusiastically) by Wedmore in the first (1932) edition of 'A Manual of Beekeeping', paras 925 to 931. Avantages claimed were: bees used to light were less disturbed when the hive was opened; wax moth were discouraged; brood rearing was accelerated; bees worked for 2 hours longer a day; bees were hardier and good queens were raised; light discouraged moulds and fungus (??? should there be any to discourage??). However, in 1945 the reference is reduced to a few lines in para 757 in the second edition, saying 'Experimenters in Great Britain and elsewhere have been unable to obtain comparable results....a case has not been made for further development of such hives'. There are obvious technical problems to year- round use of glass panels, but the first question is whether or not there really are beneficial effects on bee behaviour. In another list, leaving the hive alone for 2 minutes after opening is being said to quieten the bees due to the effect of light - I would have thought it was really the effect of letting the excitement die down that was generated by the vibration caused by levering off the cover. Effects are not always due to the first assigned cause. So glass roofed or glass sided hives may work better due to say increased ventilation introduced at the same time (to keep the glass clear). If raising the ambient light level within a hive is indeed beneficial, might it work if hives were modified so the light enters from below rather than the top or sides? In my pattern of hive, the body is raised 16 inches off the ground (on legs) and the floor is stainless steel mesh - for monitoring varooa. Obviously light gets in - the amount could be increased with reflectors. I once commented to my bee inspector that introducing an irritable colony seemed to have quitetened it, but he scoffed - as beekeepers (and other humans) tend to do when confronted with something outside their experience. But perhaps the bees had seen the light! Robin Dartington :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 17:56:00 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Michael Housel Subject: TEXAS A&M HONEY BEE LAB FUND LANDS LEAD GIFT MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit http://agnews.tamu.edu/ :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 18:02:01 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: TxBeeFarmer Organization: The Little ~ Coldiron Farm Subject: Hive Body Jig MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit After searching the archives for a hive body jig, with no luck, thought I'd ask if anyone out there has made one or knows of plans for making one. Thanks (West Texas) Mark :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 19:27:11 -0400 Reply-To: jfischer@supercollider.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Fischer Organization: Bedford Advanced Technology Test Lab Effort Subject: Hive Body Jig > After searching the archives for a hive body jig, with no luck, thought > I'd ask if anyone out there has made one or knows of plans for making one. Sure, it's called a "box joint jig", assuming that you want the "traditional" interlocking-fingers approach. Here's a decent example, which you will need to modify to do the bigger wider joints on a hive body or super. http://www.diydata.com/projects/plans/tool_plans.htm Scroll down to "Box-Joint Jig", and click. ...and DO buy the "stackable" type dadoo blade for your table saw. The "adjustable" or "wobbling" type that Sears sells is a pain to set to the correct width, and not matter how hard I tried, varied slightly, forcing me to make lots of "test" cuts on scrap and tweak, twiddle, and frobnicate the width adjustment. And you want CARBIDE blades. There is a series of drills and blades that claim to be "Cobalt" blades being sold at the mega-super home improvement stores, as if cobalt was a steel tempering additive of any value. It isn't. (Next year, someone will start selling "Kryptonite" blades. I will bet serious money on this.) jim (Who makes sawdust in winter, and honey in summer) :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 19:57:29 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Donald Campbell Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT TxBeeFarmer, I make my own hive bodies large brood and medium. If you make good finger joints the boxes are self squaring, just bang them together with a rubber mallet. But I must admit, I always check the diagonals before I let the glue dry. The whole operation, finger joints, rabbit, hand holds, ect, is done with a good table saw. I always make at less 4 boxes at a time. The setup is the same for 1 box or 50, so it saves time. I can make over half a dozen boxes in one afternoon (not counting painting). I'm sure a jig could be conjured up but you really don't need one. Don Campbell Mohegan Lake, NY > After searching the archives for a hive body jig, with no luck, thought I'd > ask if anyone out there has made one or knows of plans for making one. > > Thanks > (West Texas) Mark > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 23:16:47 -0400 Reply-To: jfischer@supercollider.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Fischer Organization: Bedford Advanced Technology Test Lab Effort Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig Don Campbell said: > I can make over half a dozen boxes in one afternoon > (not counting painting). > I'm sure a jig could be conjured up but you really don't need one. The reason for getting a book of jigs, and making jigs is that you CAN make 50 boxes in an afternoon without really working hard. With a Wagner power-painter, you can paint them in the same afternoon. I'm lazy, so I'd do the painting after dinner. :) jim (No books, no learning. No learning, no knowledge. No knowledge, no wisdom. No wisdom, no ethics. No ethics, no conscience. No conscience, no community. No community, no bread. No bread, no people.) :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 21:29:42 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: TxBeeFarmer Organization: The Little ~ Coldiron Farm Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I've been making 70 hive bodies at a time. After soaking in Copper Quinolate, the sides tend to cup slightly. I was looking for something that will hold everything tight while I nail them together to make the joints tight. Clamps are pretty slow and clumsy. Thanks (West Texas) Mark :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 07:20:55 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Kilty Subject: Varroa resistance to Apistan In-Reply-To: <001f01c324c6$42708220$21ac58d8@BusyBeeAcres> MIME-Version: 1.0 In message <001f01c324c6$42708220$21ac58d8@BusyBeeAcres>, Bob Harrison writes >I predict when resistance to Apistan happens you will soon find fault with >thymol. The still effective Apistan treatment (U.K.) is making the thymol >treatment seem more effective in my opinion. I replied Mite falls have settled down now and all colonies have recovered or are recovering. by concentrating on the beneficial effect of Apiguard, I might have given the impression that colony recovery was contrary to Bob's observation that there is a critical point past which they do not recover. I omitted to say I had to add brood and bees to some colonies to help them recover and 2 colonies never expanded normally (without additional frames). They have been united to this years' nucs. The little boost from the old bees helped the nucs to production level. One even had a queen and about 100 bees in the spring and given a couple of frames of emerging brood and young bees, kicked off, to profit later from another frame. She only just made it. As far as Apistan assisting the thymol, I do change comb in a 3 year cycle. All my wax has come from sources which predate the application of Apistan, so there will be a decreasing amount of Apistan in the wax. -- James Kilty :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 08:04:38 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Todd Subject: Painting Hives MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The post about building hive bodies got me to thinking about painting = hives: it seems that a lot of people don't understand the basics about = paint, so I thought I'd share what I know. I own a small sign shop, so = paint is very central to what we do. =20 The very best (and longest lived) paints on the market now are 100% = acrylic latex (both primer and topcoat). They have huge advantages over = oil base (especially on bee hives) due to their flexibility, = breathability and resistance to UV, which destroys oil base. Oil base = will not stay on bee hives long term, because of the high vapor pressure = from driving lots of moisture off. This is especially true in the = winter. That moisture builds up behind the oil base paint film (seeking = equilibrium), and actually pushes it off the wood (same thing in old, = uninsulated houses). =20 Properly applied 100% acrylic latex won't peel because it's permeable, = and allows water vapor to pass through. The only caveat with acrylic = latex paints is that they need a bit of help to "lock" into the wood. = You need to break the "mill glaze" (the shiny look) of freshly planed = lumber. I use a palm sander and 60 grit paper. Just a quick scuff to = "key" the surface, and your primer (we all use primer, right?) will lock = into the wood. Two coats of 100% acrylic latex top coat, and you now = have a durable finish (15 years or more in the North). Regards, Todd. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 07:50:54 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Todd Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I've used butt joints and a biscuit joiner with good success for deeps and mediums. Very fast, very strong, and self clamping if you add a couple of screws. The newer torx drive exterior screws are great - they're self drilling, and won't split white pine even when placed close to the end of a board. If you build a simple squaring jig, you'll have strong, square hive bodies in a fraction of the time it would take to do box joints. Regards, Todd. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 07:45:53 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bill Truesdell Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit James Fischer wrote: > Don Campbell said: > > >>I can make over half a dozen boxes in one afternoon >>(not counting painting). >>I'm sure a jig could be conjured up but you really don't need one. > > > The reason for getting a book of jigs, and making jigs is that you > CAN make 50 boxes in an afternoon without really working hard. I only make a few boxes at a time, but the homemade jig I use insures consistent cuts and good fit, so it is worth the time to make it. Also agree with Jim to get stacked dado blades for the same reason - easy to set up and consistent. Bill Truesdell Bath, Maine :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 10:10:50 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Brent Farler Subject: Making Box Jointed Hive Bodies MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > After searching the archives for a hive body jig, with no luck, thought > I'd ask if anyone out there has made one or knows of plans for making one. >...and DO buy the "stackable" type dado blade for your table saw. BeeSource has an article on making hive bodies - http://www.beesource.com/plans/boxjoint/index1.htm Also, Here are a couple links that show how to build a box joint jig: http://www.woodmagazine.com/woodmall/projects/boxjntjig.html http://www.netexperts.cc/~lambertm/Wood/lynnjig.html Spend the $55 to get a high quality stackable dado set with shims from a woodworker's shop (e.g. Woodcraft) rather than a homeowners store. Will make your life easier and your boxes last a lot longer. The quality of your joints will have a big impact on how much moisture can get into and decay the wood. A box joint jib runs around $110 or you can make one with the plans above. The commercial jib allows a lot of flexibility - something you may not want to pay for if your just making hive bodies and supers over and over. One word of caution - the standard box joint is a 3/4" cut, some starter model table saws have trouble handling a Dado of that width. Either the shaft is too short or the horizontally mounted motor cannot handle the weight. But clearly (IMHO) the table saw is much easier and faster than trying to use your router. There are different claims on how many hives you can make, some have claimed 40 per hour, some 40 per afternoon, I personally can make 1 in an afternoon and two evenings but that includes several scraps and a couple of trips to Home Depot. brent farler Carabella Farm (self professed Serial Remodeler) This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privileged, proprietary, or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any other use of the email by you is prohibited. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 11:10:05 -0400 Reply-To: jfischer@supercollider.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Fischer Organization: Bedford Advanced Technology Test Lab Effort Subject: Re: how to make the bees use an upper entrance Advantages and disadvantages of "lighting systems for beehives" aside, has anyone ever actually NEEDED to (as the subject says) "make" the bees use an upper entrance, or any "alternate" entrance? I've never seen a case where bees are reluctant to take advantage of any "additional entrance". a) If you add a super and fail to align it properly, the bees will be using the opening within hours. b) I use the old trick of cutting an upper entrance in the "thick side" of the inner cover. Again, the bees adapt quickly. c) Imrie Shims? Same thing. d) Open or close the pollen trap? This is the one that causes the most obvious confusion/entertainment, as the bees come in for a landing, but have to abort their final approach and hover while they look for the new entrance location, or land on the wood where the entrance WAS, and crawl around. But even then, I have yet to see it take longer than a day for efficient operations to reappear. I have seen some hives that "liked" their upper entrance so much, that the lower entrance was hardly ever used. Even carrying out dead bees was done via the top entrance. This made me suspect that something was amiss, so I took the colony apart to see if a mouse had taken up residence on the bottom board. Nope, nothing wrong, they just "preferred" the upper entrance, for reasons unknown. On the lighting, I'll give it a fair test: I've got a bunch of 4-inch-square solar panels, and a bunch of electroluminescent panels (backlighting panels salvaged from old and dead laptops). I can cut the electrolume panels to any shape I want, and tape them to the underside of an inner cover, and wire one solar panel to each electrolume panel. I can then point each solar panel in a different direction (sunrise, mid-morning, noon, mid-afternoon, sunset), so that the appropriate area of the hive is lit as if sunlight were coming into the hive, but without any heat gain. If the bees forage any later, I'll notice. Time of last sortie or return from last sortie is an objective metric, and has a clear direct advantage to the beekeeper. The other claimed advantages are just too subjective to test. I empty pollen traps on these hives every evening, so I'll be able to check. But even if it "works", I can't see this as a practical and cost-effective enhancement. Unless one has this sort of junk lying around, it is expensive stuff. jim (Who, when installing an 8-pin connector on an inner and outer cover and soldering cables, will be sure to hear SOMEONE in the lab say "WIRE you doing that?") :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 22:58:58 +0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter Detchon Subject: Re: Painting Hives MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Todd's post was fascinating....."we all use primer right?" Of course we don't. In this part of the world, if you can buy it, its as expensive as the paint, (which is too expensive for a mere beekeeper surviving on the returns from bulk honey production!). A far cheaper alternative here is a product called "Bondcrete", a product designed, believe it or not, to enable concrete to bond to other layers of set concrete or other materials. Also widely used as a water based sealant for concrete surfaces and fibrecement products. It mixes perfectly with water based paints, and mixed into the paint at a ratio of 1 part "Bondcrete" to 8 parts paint, will transform your nondescript, cheap-as-chips, discount warehouse, economy acrylic paint, into an indestructible weatherproof coating worthy of the most generous appreciation! When you have to paint large amounts of beehive equipment that is going to be exposed to the extremes of the elements for a long time, and want to be assured that it ain't going to need sanding down and recoating in the foreseeable future, you need something more than the paint manufacturers have written into their product profiles! "Bondcrete", or its equivalent in your part of the world, is the answer! Peter Detchon ( in southern Western Australia, where the sun has gone missing and 3 weeks of long overdue rain has created a very soggy environment that the bees don't much like!) :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 09:07:56 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: TxBeeFarmer Organization: The Little ~ Coldiron Farm Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Book of jigs? Do you mean a real book, or is this your term for a collection of jigs? If you know of a book, please let me know. (West Texas) Mark ----- Original Message ----- > The reason for getting a book of jigs, and making jigs is that you > CAN make 50 boxes in an afternoon without really working hard. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 15:25:56 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Lynn Douchette Subject: I hope you can help MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello, I am not sure you can help me or if you could tell me how to get in touc= h with someone who could? I found a bee that is uncommonly large for the = area I live in. The bee is all black with a small yellow dot on it's face= . I have looked on the internet for a picture of this bee and found nothi= ng on it.Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://expl= orer.msn.com :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 17:53:33 -0400 Reply-To: jfischer@supercollider.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Fischer Organization: Bedford Advanced Technology Test Lab Effort Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig > Book of jigs? Do you mean a real book, or is this your term for a > collection of jigs? If you know of a book, please let me know. Sure - nearly any "fine woodworking" book will contain some basic jig plans. Some are for routers, some are for table saws. The same basic ideas apply to each tool. Here's what's on my bookshelf of "woodworking" books in the way of "jig references". Kirby, Ian J. "The Accurate Table Saw: Simple Jigs and Safe Setups" Linden Publishing, 1998. Spielman, Patrick "Router Jigs and Techniques" Sterling Publishing, 1988. Daffron, Joe "Woodworker Project and Techniques" Davis Publications, 1980. I don't know if these are still published, but I find nearly every old book I am looking for at http://www.abebooks.com , a website where most of the decent used book dealers list their books. jim :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 20:28:06 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: John Wiebe Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'm ok with the box joint jig, however, I'm wondering how the hand holes are cut proffessionally. What kind of tools is used? A regular straight dado or route bit cut work ok, but they feel and look cheap to me. Any ideas? John Wiebe :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 18:29:35 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Mea McNeil Subject: Re: Frame Jig In-Reply-To: <006801c3466e$1c277280$2c80c641@me> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed >After searching the archives for a hive body jig, with no luck, thought I'd >ask if anyone out there has made one or knows of plans for making one. I've also been looking for plans for a jig -- for building one or preferably several frames. If anyone has directions or plans, will you kindly post them? Thanks. MEA McNeil :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 20:47:56 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Scott L Wiegel Subject: Re: Frame Jig In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.1.20030710182558.026afad0@pop.lmi.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > I've also been looking for plans for a jig -- for building one or > preferably several frames. If anyone has directions or plans, will you > kindly post them? Thanks. > See http://www.beesource.com/plans/boxjoint/index1.htm for a complete description of building a jig and using it to produce correct box joints. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 22:20:14 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bill Skriba Subject: Re: Frame Jig MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit http://beesource.com/plans/framejig.htm :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 01:33:15 -0400 Reply-To: jfischer@supercollider.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Fischer Organization: Bedford Advanced Technology Test Lab Effort Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig > I'm wondering how the hand holes are cut proffessionally. > What kind of tools is used? A regular straight dado or > route bit cut work ok, but they feel and look cheap to me. They use specialized tools. Steve Forest of Brushy Mountain gave me the grand tour of his expanded facilities, and showed me a number of quaint Victorian antiques that he has for making woodenware. Most of them are dedicated to specific operations in the making of beekeeping woodenware, and some of them look like they date from the days of steam power, and were only adapted to electricity after World War II. :) Note the curved inner surface of the handhold. Dead give-away. The shape of the handhold itself shows that the saw bade is rotated through 90 degrees, from parallel to the surface of the wood, down to perpendicular with the surface of the wood. Another way to do this would be to keep the blade still, and rotate a set of clamps that hold the board around the blade. But many table saws do not allow the blade to rotate down below the work surface when the blade depth is 1/2 inch, so the board to be cut will have to sit on spacers that allow it to sit above the blade when the blade is at it's smallest angle. But if your table saw angle crank is anything like mine, this would be a very slow and tedious process. Here's what I'd do, as this will give you "more to grab onto" than the usual handhold: a) Use the dado, but set it at a 45-degree angle. (This is much less dangerous than it looks, moreso if one uses the "stacked blade" type dado.) b) Set the height to the appropriate height for the stock you are using. c) Lower the blade, counting how many full rotations of the crank are required to get the blade below the work surface. d) Clamp the board in position on the work surface. e) Crank the blade up whatever number of crank rotations you lowered it in (c), and then crank it back down. f) Remove board, replace with another g) Lather, rinse, repeat h) Dream about motorizing the cranks with a worm gear and a reversible servomotor, as the process is as tedious as heck. i) Get bored, stop cutting gouges in your supers, and simply screw on wood blocks as "handles", making sure to check clearance for outer covers above the handle. j) Add similar wood blocks to all supers, even the ones that were store-bought. jim :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 21:48:06 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: allen dick Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > I'm ok with the box joint jig, however, I'm wondering how the hand > holes are cut proffessionally. What kind of tools is used? There are always new ideas and sources, but a lot of the basic info on box building and choice of woods, dimensions, etc. is in our BEE-L archives. See the tag line at the bottom of every post for easy access to the archives, a BEE-L search engine, and more BEE-L info. allen :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 06:40:37 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Michael Palmer Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig In-Reply-To: <001501c3468b$1f526d80$7981c641@me> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed > I was looking for something that >will hold everything tight while I nail them together to make the joints >tight. Clamps are pretty slow and clumsy. I screwed a 2" x 2" x 24" piece of hardwood to the back of my workbench...against the wall. Perpendicular to that, I screwed another to the bench. This forms a right angle, on the right side. I then mounted two toggle clamps on the left side. Fit the hive body sides together, and place them against the jig. Engage the toggles. The box is square. I use two quick clamps on the top edge of the hive body, when the boards are cupped. You can use the same set-up for all sized boxes, and covers, too. Mike :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 07:07:35 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Harrison Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jim said: i) Get bored, stop cutting gouges in your supers, and simply screw on wood blocks as "handles", making sure to check clearance for outer covers above the handle. j) Add similar wood blocks to all supers, even the ones that were store-bought. I buy and use used supers with slats if the slats are only on the ends (although many of my fellow beekeepers will not). They want the supers to stack both in storage and on trucks both ways. If the slats are on the side I have to use a hatchet or at times an ax to remove the slats (if glued) leaving an ugly scar. You simply can not get a load of supers (especially dry supers or ones which have not been on the bees in awhile) with slats on the side.to ride any distance without shifting on trucks. Does work better when all supers have got slats. Many commercial beekeepers use slats on the end but I have never seen a professional beekeeper put slats on the side. I am sure to most hobby beekeepers you are going to put the slats anyplace you feel needs a slat but most hobby beekeepers equipment usually ends up in a commercial operation years later and resale could be a problem. If using a slat on the end run the slat the length of the end instead of only a six inch piece of wood.. Excellent points made on jigs etc. by Jim and others! Bob Ps. Keeping ax close by to knock off side slats. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 06:49:26 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Michael Palmer Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig In-Reply-To: <3F0E12A6.7010108@prairie.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed > I'm wondering how the hand holes >are cut proffessionally. What kind of tools is used? I use a stackable dado. First build the super. This gives you something to hold onto when you cut the hand holes. Clamp a block onto the fence of your saw. Place the back edge of the super against the block, and carefully lower the super onto the dado blade. When down all the way, push super a couple inches forward to make the hand hole as long as you want. If the super isn't against the block when you start the cut, it may kick-back. Also...don't use an adjustable dado for this job! They kick-back every time. Maybe this system doesn't make a "pretty" hand hole, but one that is functional, and quick to make. Mike :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 09:29:18 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Tim Vaughan Subject: Side by side spliting After learning about this method from people who post here, I tried it on a hive about 2 months ago. Day before yesterday I went to that apiary and found 2 thriving hives. What a great time/labor saving trick! I just divided up the hive as per usual, then aligned them up with the two new hives touching where the middle of the original hive was. Regards to the list. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 16:12:43 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Dave Cushman Subject: Table saw hand hold MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all A simple way to make a 'D' shaped hand grip... Working from the side of a table saw so that the blade has it's flat surface facing you. Place two wooden 'fences' at the width of the board and a front stop that registers the part with the top edge of the 'D'. Two wooden ramps are set inside the fences so that as the board is pushed away from the operator, the blade penetration decreases to nothing. Watch out for the exposed saw blade! Best Regards & 73s... Dave Cushman G8MZY Beekeeping and Bee Breeding Website http://website.lineone.net/~dave.cushman Best Regards & 73s... Dave Cushman G8MZY Beekeeping and Bee Breeding Website http://website.lineone.net/~dave.cushman :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 10:03:54 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "adrian m. wenner" Subject: Re: I hope you can help In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Lynn Douchette asked: > I am not sure you can help me or if you could tell me how to get in >touch with someone who could? I found a bee that is uncommonly large >for the area I live in. The bee is all black with a small yellow dot >on it's face. I have looked on the internet for a picture of this >bee and found nothing on it. Yesterday I saw a carpenter bee visiting a passion flower. It was large, shiny black, and had yellow pollen on its face. Perhaps that is what she saw. Adrian -- Adrian M. Wenner (805) 963-8508 (home office phone) 967 Garcia Road wenner@lifesci.ucsb.edu Santa Barbara, CA 93103 www.beesource.com/pov/wenner/index.htm ***************************************************** * * "We not only believe what we see: * to some extent we see what we believe." * * Richard Gregory (1970) * ***************************************************** :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 08:13:36 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Donald Aitken Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Bob: For several years I have been making shallow (6 5/8) supers from free plywood offcuts using one biscuit and two screws for the joints. The plywood is exterior grade fir and I use titebond II glue. One can make about 50 in an 8 hour day. They seem to give equally good service as the commercial finger joint ones. I do not cut handholds. I find that I can carry them quite nicely without. Best regards Donald Aitken ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Harrison" --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.498 / Virus Database: 297 - Release Date: 08/07/2003 :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 13:01:35 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: allen dick Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Note the curved inner surface of the handhold. Dead give-away. > The shape of the handhold itself shows that the saw bade is > rotated through 90 degrees, from parallel to the surface of > the wood, down to perpendicular with the surface of the wood. Although scooped handholds can be formed as described above, any made by this method will bear only a slight resemblance to the commercially produced scooped handholds we all love and admire. Using a saw blade as described, in my experience tends to make an uneven, rough surface, and, regardless of the saw radius, a very short, odd-looking handhold. When we were making scooped handholds, we used a butterfly cutter and a jig that allowed a plunge cut, and which also allowed moving the board about two inches lengthwise (inside restraints) and back, after the plunge was made, to give a longer, more comfortable, and more professional-looking handhold. Rounded profile butterfly cutters can be purchased -- or ordered -- in various widths at any good specialty tool shop. They are normally used for making mouldings and decorative trim. (Of course, I learned that after we had our own special profile cutters made by a saw-sharpening shop). For that matter, though, the only practical advantage of the scoop -- and this advantage is slight -- over a simple 7/8" dado groove is that water willl not sit in the scooped groove, and thus not rot or split the wood, and, of course, they look a bit fancier. That having been said, though, a simple dado cut is cheaper, simpler, and just as useful. Butterflys dull very easily and are expensive to sharpen. A dado stays sharp longer and is less likely to burn or chip if the plunge is made too quickly or showly. A lot of equipment in commercial and hobby use has just dado handholes, and rabbetted joints. Such boxes work every bit as well, and last just as long as the box-cornered supers with scooped handholes, or longer. Some of us even prefer them. For those who are inexperienced wood workers, please note: It is much easier and safer to make the plunge after the box is assembled, rather than to try to put a groove in an unattached board. It is also easier to cut handholes upside down. Oooopps! No matter how they are accomplished, plunge cuts can be very dangerous. Boards and boxes can instantly -- without any warning -- become high-speed projectiles, that leave the work surface in the blink of an eye, and leave a naked spinning blade exposed. NEVER push towards a blade with any body part you wish to keep long-term. Bee careful out there. allen http://www.honeybeeworld.com :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 18:09:19 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Kathy E Cox Subject: wax Comments: To: KATHYECOX@aol.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have an interesting thing that has happened. I have a farm stand out in front of my house. In it is; honey, pollen and candles. The bees started coming there and now they are in greater numbers! They are chewing off the wax and putting it in their pollen baskets! It looks so strange with many colors of wax. Although the bees are all taking only one color each, as if it were a flower. Kathy Cox, Northern California, Italian, 18 hives :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2003 02:45:56 +0200 Reply-To: jtemp@xs4all.nl Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: jan tempelman Organization: home sweet home Subject: Re: I hope you can help MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit adrian m. wenner wrote: > carpenter bee ON http://www.ces.ncsu.edu/depts/ent/notes/Urban/carp-bee.htm -- Met vriendelijke groet, Jan Jan Tempelman Annie Romein-Verschoorpad 2-4 NL 4103 VE Culemborg tel.:0345-524433 mobile: 06 10719917 -- http://www.xs4all.nl/~jtemp/index3.html mailto:jtemp@xs4all.nl -- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 22:03:33 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Daiell Dempsey Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig In-Reply-To: <008601c347b6$9e6cdb60$f4b3de42@HAL> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii -To hold the box square to assemble. Take 4 pices of 3/4 MDF 6 x 6" cut a dato the width of your super stock 1/2 way through the pices 2" from the sides of each pice makeing sure the cuts are 90 degres to each other. Set each corner of the super in this jig and screw or nail the corners. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! http://sbc.yahoo.com :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2003 08:08:33 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: shilliff@JUNO.COM Subject: removal of wax from floor Comments: To: LISTSERV@listserv.albany.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi All, Need advise on how to remove beeswax and propolis from an untreated concrete honey house floor. We should have epoxy coated this a few years ago, but were too busy. Now we are cleaning it up to coat it. We are using floor machine with a wire brush attachment, but it will not remove the small spots of wax and propolis. What will remove these? Thanks Nick :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2003 08:35:50 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: John Wiebe Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I now have all the tools and know how as to how to manufacture a proffessional looking super. Only one major problem exsists, if I price the lumber needed to build one super, at our local lumber yard, it'll cost me more in lumber to cut my own than it "wood" to out rite buy a new unassembled factory cut super. Question: Any leads out there to suitable rough bee box lumber? John Wiebe :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2003 10:25:02 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: al boehm Subject: Re: removal of wax from floor MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Sat, 12 Jul 2003 08:08:33 -0400 shilliff@JUNO.COM writes: > Hi All, > Need advise on how to remove beeswax and propolis from an untreated > concrete honey house floor. We should have epoxy coated this a few > Thanks > Nick > Hey Nick Use some paint and varnish remover, I have used Zip-Strip. A small can goes a long way. Al > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: > -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info > --- > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2003 09:07:45 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Harrison Subject: Re: removal of wax from floor MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Nick said: Need advise on how to remove beeswax and propolis from an untreated concrete honey house floor. I just finished doing mine and will tell you what I did but there are many ways to prepare floors for epoxy. Do a search of the net for *concrete etching* for the best information. 1. power washed floor 2. I stripped the old epoxy. 3. power washed 4. acid etched 5. power washed 6. put down a piece of plastic and when no moisture appeared under the plastic in 24 hours I applied epoxy (on a low humidity day). Use a push scraper to get up propolis and then power wash with at least a 2,000 psi power washer. You can rent a steam cleaner but those run around a $100 U.S. a day in our area plus gasoline and diesel fuel. Both rented steam cleaners and the power washer I use will take up concrete if you stay in one spot two long. I never saw any propolis they would not remove but as I said they will take up concrete also. Hope I have helped. Bob Ps. Do it right the first time and your new floor will last for years. If not expect to do the job again next year . :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2003 09:21:17 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Charles Harper Subject: Re: removal of wax from floor In-Reply-To: <20030712.080845.-832551.6.shilliff@juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A steam cleaner or a hive tool, both are slow. shilliff@JUNO.COM wrote: but it will not remove > the small spots of wax and propolis. What will remove these? > Thanks > Nick > > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: > -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2003 09:59:23 -0400 Reply-To: jfischer@supercollider.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Fischer Organization: Bedford Advanced Technology Test Lab Effort Subject: Re: removal of wax from floor > Need advise on how to remove beeswax and propolis from an > untreated concrete honey house floor. Wax should be easy - hot water. Wax melts at about 160 F, so you don't even need boiling. If you have a large floor, you can rent a steam carpet cleaner at many grocery stores for $10, and soften or melt the wax with it. Then you can just wipe up or soak up the wax with a paper towel. The heat may also help to "melt" the propolis. For propolis, I have had good results from the chemicals used to degrease engines sold at the usual auto parts stores ("Purple Power" says the jug on the shelf in the garage) I bought some to clean off some oil after fixing a seeping front camshaft seal, and gave it a try on the brick walkway that leads to my honey house door, where equipment tends to come to rest briefly while to door is opened. It did not appear to harm the brick, but I would not leave it on too long. Pretty easy to use, spray on, hose off. jim :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2003 18:34:42 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Todd Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Only one major problem exsists, if I price > the lumber needed to build one super, at our local lumber yard, it'll > cost me more in lumber to cut my own than it "wood" to out rite buy a > new unassembled factory cut super. > Question: Any leads out there to suitable rough bee box lumber? > >John Wiebe If you have any local saw mills, check them out. Most don't kiln dry, so you'd have to stack it and dry it ahead of time, but it's *very* cheap compared to lumber store prices. You can go a step further, and ask for rejects. I've a local sawmill a few miles away that sells "red rot" lumber for $ .30/bdft - cheap compared to the $1.20 - $1.75/bdft most stores charge today. It's perfectly fine for hives, with a little culling: all white pine, and I can get it in wide widths. It's not planed, but bandsawn, so it's not overly rough. Chances are good that there is a mill near you. Regards, Todd. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2003 18:00:46 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Denise Hubler Subject: Re: wax MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kathy, I'm glad you posted this--it confirmed what I've been seeing for the past two years. I have some old frames with old wax leaning against my garden shed. I see an occasional bee coming and filling up her pollen baskets with the wax. Quite interesting to watch. Would be even more so if it was the colored wax as you're experiencing! Regards, Denise-thinking I'm glad I attended the HAS 2003 conference--it was great to connect with other likeminded folks Luna Apiaries KY :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2003 19:59:03 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Mike Rossander Subject: Re: Handholds (was Hive Body Jig) In-Reply-To: <006c01c347de$db1f76d0$3db85ad1@Pegasus> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii So much has been said about cutting handholds that I thought I'd chime in. I've switched to a different type of handhold and I don't think I'll go back. I am using the styrofoam hive bodies. When I put wood supers on top the first time, I discovered that I had not painted the top of the styrofoam. Since the wood wall is thinner than the styrofoam wall, I had a lip of unpainted styrofoam exposed to the elements. I suppose I could have just painted the styrofoam. For some reason instead I cut some scrap one-by-ones to make a rim around the top and bottom of the wood supers so the thickness would be the same as the thickness of the styrofoam walls. A little wood glue and a couple of self-starting screws in each piece and, presto, no more exposed styrofoam. I discovered the real benefits a few weeks later when I went to work the hive. The rims were sturdy enough that I used them to lift the supers. Since they ran the whole length of the box, they were very easy to use and let me adjust my grip. Being right at the top of the box was a help, too. No more groping for the handhold. My posture was better and the lifting easier. The supers also seemed to be easier to separate. (My hypothesis is that the deeper wood-to-wood contact leaves fewer gaps and therefore the bees laid down less propolis.) Because I put the rims on both tops and bottoms, they stand on end neatly (solving the problem of the commercial keeper who complained about tipping when he buys hobbyist boxes). In fact, I think they do one better because they get ventilation when sitting on a damp floor. Note: I do use the styrofoam top covers which are larger to fit over a box with the wider walls. If you have a lot of older telescoping covers, this probably wouldn't work. Mike Rossander --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2003 08:35:48 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Mike Stoops Subject: Re: BEE-L Digest - 11 Jul 2003 to 12 Jul 2003 (#2003-193) In-Reply-To: <200307130400.h6D3ud2d012939@listserv.albany.edu> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit on 7/12/03 23:00, John Wiebe wrote: > Question: Any leads out there to suitable rough bee box lumber? Whatever you do, Make sure the lumber you use is properly seasoned. If you don't, when you finish constructing your supers/hive bodies, they will end up short after they finish drying out. Use kiln dried wood or wood that has dried out in a dry location for a number of months. There are others out there who can give you a better idea of how long the lumber should dry out before use, and will probably/hopefully do so. Also, after construction with green wood, the final product will warp and twist to some lesser or greater degree as it dries out. Not pretty at all. Mike Stoops :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2003 10:24:31 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Lloyd Spear Subject: What will remove wax and propolis? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit HOT vegetable oil (over 150 degrees F, but not smoking) will emulsify the wax and propolis so it can be picked up with ordinary detergent or soap. Lloyd Lloyd Spear, Owner Ross Rounds, Inc. Manufacturers of Ross Rounds Comb Honey Equipment, Sundance Pollen Traps and Custom Printer of Sundance Labels. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2003 12:16:22 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: beekeeper Organization: none Subject: Auctions MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all, I know buying used equipment for many is a no, however, just in case some of you are looking and are interested, there are 2 auctions next Saturday in Michigan that have bee equipment listed. One is in Grand Ledge the other near Pierson( just south of Howard City). If interested please contact me off list and I will provide Auction company info. Coleene :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2003 12:30:15 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: beekeeper Organization: none Subject: HAS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Just returned from this year's annual HAS Convention. As with last year, it was a memorable experience. The workshops were well attended and all provided essential information for the beginner through advanced beekeeper. I know I am looking forward to next year and years to follow. Wonderful job done by everyone! Coleene :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2003 17:23:22 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Ruary Rudd Subject: Vita's new field testing kit for AFB MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear All, As some of you may know Vita-Europe has developed a field diagnosis kit for confirming the presence of AFB in a colony. In use a larva ,suspected of being infected, is removed from the frame and placed in a bottle with re-agent. The larva and liquid are shaken for 2 minutes and then two drops are placed on the tester. There are two lines; one shows the control, if the second one appears then AFB is confirmed, (rather like a pregnancy test). Vita-Europe, through Jeremy Owens, have very kindly agreed to send me some kits to demonstrate at Gormanstown, I have discussed this with Redmond Williams and the demonstrations will done at the microscopy workshops held on the mornings of Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday. Yours Ruary Rudd :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2003 17:00:36 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Denise Hubler Subject: Re: HAS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I agree with Coleene. I met some great people and came back motivated with a lot of knowledge. I appreciate all the efforts everyone put in to organizing this great event. Since HAS 2004 will be in Tennessee I will definitely be attending again! Denise Luna Apiaries :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2003 23:43:54 +0200 Reply-To: Derek Steed Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Derek Steed Subject: Re: Painting Hives MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hallo Everyone! I´m new to your group, I´m English with a German wife and have lived in Germany for 31 years - otherwise known as a European. I have kept bees in the UK and now in Germany for 7 years.I kept black devils in the UK 45 years ago - long before varroa, the talk then was of acarine.Now I keep Buckfast bees in Dadant hives - much easier than the old double-walled WBC hives so long ago and the bees are docile.I trained first as a chemist then studied surface coating technology for 4 years. I worked 20 years in the paint industry UK & Germany.Now for my 2cents worth: When it comes to painting hives I still think that solvent-based coatings are superior to aqueous dispersions. The Scandinavians have long experience in painting their houses constructed of softwood. They use what the Germans call Holzlasur - based on long-oil alkyd resins pigmented with ultrafine ( micronised ) iron oxide pigments and solvated with mineral spirit ( white spirit, paraffinic hydrocarbon solvent ).The coating penetrates the wood deeply and sticks like s**t to a blanket, a cross-section of painted wood shows pigment deep in the pores, this you can NEVER get with even the finest aqueous polymer dispersions.The paint films are semi-transparent, not as thick as conventional paints and not so inclined to crack, embrittle and flake. Think of Scandinavian winters, temperatures of -30°C and below.Of course these Holzlasur contain fungicides - a bone of contention for the bio-beekeepers, these people make their own varnishes of vegetable oils and beeswax and without pigment; as a paint chemist I simply do not believe that such coatings are UV resistent.I do not think that the low levels of fungicide employed are likely either to harm the bees or contaminate the honey; I have never seen a honey analysis indicating the presence of such fungicides. I have seen aqeous dispersion paints blistering off hives in Portugal. Whilst they allow the escape of water vapour, their wet adhesion to softwood is I think questionable.Brother Adam of Buckfast Abbey UK had Dadant hives painted with solvent-based paints which lasted 60 years - OK the wood was probably better than one gets nowadays.The Lasur I buy is called Bondex but there are many others.Hope you are still awake. Regards Derek Steed :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2003 20:49:10 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Jack Grimshaw Subject: Hive Jig MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I modified the frame jig plans from Beesource.com to assemble two deeps or three meds.or smalls at one time.The jig holds the sides more or less square while I slap on some glue and then staple the ends.Flip over and repeat.I use rabbeted joints to reduce end grain exsposure.After assembly,remove from jig,square with framing square(or 2 cleats nailed at 90 deg on work bench) and tack a temporary diagonal until glue sets. free sources of wood are specialty machine shops.Many shipping crates are 1 x 12 # 2 pine and are free for the asking. Jack http://www.beesource.com/plans/framejig.htm :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2003 20:01:27 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Todd Subject: Re: Painting Hives MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Derek said: > I have seen aqeous dispersion paints blistering off hives in Portugal. > Whilst they allow the escape of water vapour, their wet adhesion to softwood > is I think questionable. As I mentioned in my original post, water based paints require "keying" (sanding) of the surface to adhere well (a step many omit). The only peeling I have ever experienced in 14 years of professional use was when I did not sand/scuff the material first. I also specified 100% acrylic latex. Not all water based paints are of equivalent quality. Many contain vinyl compounds which degrade. If one is really opposed to sanding, oil primer is an option, but that renders the paint film impermeable, and cancels one of the benefits of acrylic latex. >The Scandinavians have long experience in painting >their houses constructed of softwood. They use what the Germans call >Holzlasur - based on long-oil alkyd resins Yes, I forgot that we "inexperienced" Americans have only been painting our houses for around 400 years :) Although long oil resins (slower drying) last longer outdoors than short oil (faster drying), alkyd (oil base) paints all share the same vulnerabilities: 1) Oil base paints are severely susceptible to UV degradation. This is why oil base paint films "chalk" and fade. 100% acrylic latex resins are *immune* to UV. 2) Alkyd paint films continue to cure indefinitely, getting harder and more inflexible as time passes. Eventually the paint film becomes brittle, and can't absorb the radical expansion and contraction of wood. 3) Alkyd paint films are more susceptible to mildew, thus the need for higher levels of protection (biocides) than acrylic latex paints. 4) With the newer VOC (volatile organic compound) limitations, oil based paint quality has suffered relative to it's water based counterparts. I have used the finest paints of both types available anywhere (including those containing lead, which further enhances "weatherability") in Zone 3-4 (-40F winters) in the context of road-side wooden signs, which suffer the worst summer/winter abuse imaginable. I almost never use oil based paints today. I can say conclusively that nothing compares to the new generation 100% acrylic latex paints. If you ask any paint tech. worth their salt, they'll pretty much all tell you the same thing - on unpainted wood, 100% acrylic latex will far outlast alkyd/oil base paints. High performance water based acrylics are even used on ferrous metals today. The only advantage that oil paints offer is higher resistance to abrasion. Regards, Todd. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2003 11:48:12 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: beekeeper Organization: none Subject: Re: What will remove wax and propolis? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Just an FYI, I have also found that Pledge with orange oil in the hand spray bottle will emulsify wax. I have not tried it on propolis. Coleene :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2003 04:45:52 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Larry Krengel Subject: Re: Hive Body Jig MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thinking of the cost of planed lumber... I have given up on the lumber yard and use rough sawn lumber of a local saw mill. I buy air dried pine that is a real one inch thick. It provides a much sturdier hive body ( and nuc box ) than the finished 3/4 inch wood. Besides that, a 1 X 10 is a real ten inches wide. I am able to get a deep hive body from one of these rather than having to buy a finished 1 X 12 that I much rip down at a lumber yard. I pay about $3.00 US for an eight foot board. Larry Krengel Marengo, IL :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2003 13:36:55 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Ed Geels Subject: Painting Hive Bodies Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'm new to beekeeping and have been following the painting thread. I've painted my hive bodies both inside and out with oil-based primer and two coats of oil-based house paint (white). I'm assuming that since moisture from the inside causes the problems of pushing the paint off the outside in my case it can't get into the board at all since it is sealed from the inside of the hive with oil based paint also. But I'm wondering if this will cause too much buildup of moisture in the inside of the hive during the winter? Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Dr. Edwin J. Geels Professor of Chemistry Dordt College 712-722-6284 :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2003 07:59:52 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter Edwards Subject: Re: Vita's new field testing kit for AFB > Vita-Europe, through Jeremy Owens, have very kindly agreed to send me some > kits to demonstrate at Gormanstown, I have discussed this with Redmond > Williams and the demonstrations will done at the microscopy workshops held > on the mornings of Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday. I do hope that they work for you. At a recent demonstration at Stoneleigh it took our Seasonal Bee Inspector (SBI) three attempts to get a positive result from a comb of AFB - and these kits are around £5 each! Not wishing to be too critical, I wonder why anyone would want to but a kit to test for AFB when it is so easy to diagnose positively in the field. Of course EFB is a different matter, but I doubt that many beekeepers would pay £5 - even if they worked perfectly every time - when they can get it tested free by their SBI. Peter Edwards beekeepers@stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk www.stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk/ :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2003 22:25:53 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter Edwards Subject: Re: What will remove wax and propolis? Washing soda (sodium carbonate, not caustic soda) destroys oils and waxes and will dissolve propolis. Peter Edwards beekeepers@stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk www.stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk/ :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2003 16:19:26 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bill Truesdell Subject: Re: Painting Hive Bodies MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ed Geels wrote: > I'm assuming that since > moisture from the inside causes the problems of pushing the paint off > the outside in my case it can't get into the board at all since it is > sealed from the inside of the hive with oil based paint also. But I'm > wondering if this will cause too much buildup of moisture in the inside > of the hive during the winter? > Does anyone have any thoughts on this? We have probably too many thoughts about moisture in the hive. If you check the archives you will see many, many posts about moisture. The problem with painted interiors (I, at one time, painted the inside also) is when you do any cleaning with your hive tool (such as normal spring cleaning), you take off paint as well as burr comb and propolis. So the integrity of the painted interior will not last long, hence you will have moisture migration. Latex paint will be the better choice, even with interior hive paint. Bill Truesdell Bath, Maine :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2003 18:15:18 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: TxBeeFarmer Organization: The Little ~ Coldiron Farm Subject: Re: Painting Hives MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Glad to hear we have some paint experts in the group. Soooo, let me ask Derk and Todd their opinion on using nothing but white stain on wood treated (soaked and dried) in Copper Quinolate or Copper Napthinate. I live in West Texas with an average rain fall of 15 - 17 inches a year. Thanks (West Texas) Mark :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2003 19:55:20 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Todd Subject: Homemade Swarm Lures MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I was perusing the archives, and found a reference to a homemade Nasonov = lure. What intruiged me was that one of the three main indredients = (Geraniol) is found in bee balm (genus Monarda). Since I seem to be = experiencing unusual swarming/supersedure problems this year (5 of 7 = hives, two lost swarms last week), I thought I'd throw a little bee balm = into my swarm traps, just for the hell of it (along with some old comb = and a used queen cage). =20 I probably missed a queen cell or two today (the blighters are getting = very sneaky lately - I found a queen cell on a frame of honey!), so I'm = hopeful that this might actually work, since I don't actually have any = Nasonov pheromone in the bee cupboard at the moment. =20 Anyone on the list had any experience with using bee balm in this = manner? Thanks, Todd. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2003 20:24:02 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "adrian m. wenner" Subject: Re: Homemade Swarm Lures In-Reply-To: <001d01c34a63$62dbb710$83b472d8@SOD> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Todd inquired: >I was perusing the archives, and found a reference to a homemade >Nasonov lure. What intruiged me was that one of the three main >ingredients (Geraniol) is found in bee balm (genus Monarda). CLIP >Anyone on the list had any experience with using bee balm in this manner? Bee balm works fine, as pointed out by Virgil some two thousand years ago. Columella (a beekeeper and writer in the southern part of Spain during the Roman occupation) expanded upon Virgil's method. He advocated that beekeepers use swarm hives scented with bruised balm and wax-flowers "...and other similar herbs in which this kind of creatures takes delight, and rub the hives thoroughly with them, so that the scent and juice stick to them; then, after cleaning them, they sprinkle them with a little honey and place them here and there in the woods not far from the springs..." Lemon balm grows easily in our area and is somewhat of a pest once it gets established -- spreading over large areas unless kept under control. One can also use lemon grass for the same effect. For more on the role of these scents, one can read my 1992 January article ("Swarm movement: A mystery explained") in the American Bee Journal -- now readily available at: http://www.beesource.com/pov/wenner/abjjan1992 Adrian -- Adrian M. Wenner (805) 963-8508 (home office phone) 967 Garcia Road wenner@lifesci.ucsb.edu Santa Barbara, CA 93103 www.beesource.com/pov/wenner/index.htm ***************************************************** * * "We not only believe what we see: * to some extent we see what we believe." * * Richard Gregory (1970) * ***************************************************** :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::