From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Feb 28 09:37:53 2009 Return-Path: <> X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.8 (2007-02-13) on industrial X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-87.0 required=2.4 tests=ADVANCE_FEE_1,AWL, MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR,SPF_HELO_PASS,USER_IN_WHITELIST autolearn=disabled version=3.1.8 X-Original-To: adamf@IBIBLIO.ORG Delivered-To: adamf@IBIBLIO.ORG Received: from listserv.albany.edu (unknown [169.226.1.24]) by metalab.unc.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 24EAD48F68 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2009 09:35:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from listserv.albany.edu (listserv.albany.edu [169.226.1.24]) by listserv.albany.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n1SEVNj6013404 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2009 09:35:38 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 09:35:35 -0500 From: "University at Albany LISTSERV Server (14.5)" Subject: File: "BEE-L LOG0502B" To: adamf@IBIBLIO.ORG Message-ID: Content-Length: 71327 Lines: 1724 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 00:15:31 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Nelson Subject: Re: Bees moving >what areas are left to >cover for bees for beekeepers needing replacements? > Good question which I do not know the answer. Except that as in the past there will be bees (established hives) available after the almonds. Bob Nelson :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 07:10:43 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Andrew Dewey Subject: First Trailer MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Greetings all, As my bees get their first good chance for cleansing flights this winter, my thoughts have are increasingly focused on upcoming spring and summer activities. My big question is how am I going to move 12-14 hives 80 miles for blueberry pollination? In the past I have crammed my pickup (6 cyl Sierra) bed full of boxes, but I don't like lifting boxes that high and I also can't fit all the hives into one load. What should I be thinking about and looking for as I begin shopping for trailers? I do not anticipate expanding hive numbers much beyond this level. After blueberries the hives will need to go somewhere else (raspberries?) for the summer, and then back to my winter yard. There will be some off road/open field travel. Many Thanks, Andrew Dewey Southwest Harbor, Maine :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 08:29:54 -0500 Reply-To: Lloyd Spear Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Lloyd Spear Subject: Moving a few hives Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Andrew asks about moving a few hives for pollination. I don't know the answers, but I can help you ask the right questions. These questions are: 1. What are the Sierra's weight limits? If you are going to put 14 hives on a trailer you are possibly looking at 3,000 pounds, and are certainly looking at 1,500 lbs., for the hive weight alone. Can the Sierra pull that much, plus the weight of the trailer? 2. Do you have a transmission oil cooler? If you don't know, you don't have one! For the distance you are talking about, you need one; which will cause you to balance the cost against the pollination fees. 3. For on-road use, a single axel trailer will be fine for 1,500 lbs., but not for 3,000 lbs. A single axel trailer usually will not have brakes. A double axel trailer will have electric brakes. A double axel trailer is the better deal (money-wise and safety wise), but it will be 500 lbs more than the single axel. 4. For off road use, does the Sierra have 4WD? Will the off road use be on cut and maintained roads or across rough fields? If you don't have 4WD I strongly suggest you not attempt going across rough fields with a trailer. 5. Is the Sierra an important vehicle to you? Or a junker? If it is important for personal use you should think long and hard before commiting to the kind of use you are suggesting. In particular, moving from a summer pollination source to the winter yard might involve hive weights of 3,000, plus a trailer weight of 1,500 lbs. for a total of 4,500 lbs. While this is done 'all the time', it will almost certainly shorten the life of the Sierra, particularly if it does not have the proper equipment for off road towing. Are the fees worth it? Good luck. -- Lloyd Spear Owner Ross Rounds, Inc. Manufacture of equipment for round comb honey sections, Sundance Pollen Traps, and producer of Sundance custom labels. Contact your dealer or www.RossRounds.com :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 08:38:59 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Scott Plante Subject: Re: Bees moving MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit If a desperate beekeeper in the southern states discovered he had heavy varroa loads in his hives. Would it not be wise, for him, to bring the hives up north to stop the brood rearing. At that point treat with oxalic while the hives are broodless?? Scott Plante :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:08:59 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Michael Palmer Subject: Re: Bees moving; Desperate Beekeeper In-Reply-To: <001c01c50de3$8c2e29a0$0100a8c0@Plante> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed If the beekeeper is desperate, because his bees have a heavy mite load, moving them north, and waiting until the colonies are broodless wouldn't work. That's exactly what happens up north...and the colonies crash before they can be treated with oxalic. They need to be treated with something before they have high mite loads...perhaps ApiLife, or flash formic. Mike -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.5 - Release Date: 2/3/2005 :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 16:58:56 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Roger White Subject: bees moving MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-7" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >>At that point treat with oxalic while the hives are broodless??<< Why not just cage the queens? Roger White Superbee Cyprus. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 08:22:20 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: allen dick Subject: Re: First Trailer MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > What should I be thinking about and looking for as I begin shopping > for trailers? > > I do not anticipate expanding hive numbers much beyond this level. > After blueberries the hives will need to go somewhere else > (raspberries?) for the summer, and then back to my winter yard. > There will be some off road/open field travel. Lloyd gives some good suggestions. Let me add a few. Consider renting a truck and/or trailer, or, better still, finding someone who will assist you by lending the truck or even picking up the hives at your yards. The growers often have flat-deck trucks perfect for carrying the few hives you are discussing. If you rent or borrow, you will have first-hand experience on what to buy later without being locked in to something you discover you don't like. IMO, a small flat-deck truck is ideal for that number of hives -- I'd choose a trailer only if I had a good tow vehicle already or could not manage owning an extra vehicle -- but, if you choose to use a trailer, U-Haul has closed trailers that are ideal. You can also rent a truck, for that matter, and they have nice likke cube vans that are nice to use. Youll need a good ramp and a handcart. With a closed van or trailer, you can load in the early morning dusk, drive to the destination, if it is only an hour or two and the weather is cool, then unload in full daylight without problems. I don't know whether you plan to haul singles or doubles and how you are set up, and as Lloyd says, watch the weight. Don't guess,or you'll have a flat -- or maybe several at once! And, since bees are perishable and a potential nuisance, carry a jack, and a spare, a wrench (that fits) for _both_ the trailer and the towing vehicle. Make sure, in advance, that you know how to use them, and that the wheel nuts are not seized. Rehearse the procedure, if you are smart. allen -- The voice of experience. A Beekeeper's Diary: http://www.honeybeeworld.com/diary/ :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:01:06 -0500 Reply-To: Lloyd Spear Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Lloyd Spear Subject: Moving for Varroa Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "Would it not be wise, for him, to bring the hives up north to stop the brood rearing. At that point treat with oxalic while the hives are broodless??" Sure does sound like desperation, but I guess that is what this is all about. Need to wait 3 weeks for all brood to emerge. Would brood raising really be stopped? Dunno, but in early Feb. in upstate NY, brood rearing has started (by Carniolans), albeit only a small amount. What would happen when the bees were moved back south? Would killing the bees and starting over with packages be less expensive and more productive? Of course, we can't comment on using the Oxalic as it is not legal. As one opinion, this sounds like too desperate a move. -- Lloyd Spear Owner Ross Rounds, Inc. Manufacture of equipment for round comb honey sections, Sundance Pollen Traps, and producer of Sundance custom labels. Contact your dealer or www.RossRounds.com :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 08:02:46 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: allen dick Subject: Re: Bees moving MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Scott Plante wrote: > If a desperate beekeeper in the southern states discovered he had > heavy varroa loads in his hives. Would it not be wise, for him, to > bring the hives up north to stop the brood rearing. At that point > treat with oxalic while the hives are broodless?? Thatb would depend on a lot of things. Moving hives from one climatic region to another is not without its costs, risks, and effects on the bees. It can a logistical nightmare if there are many hives involved, the distance is great, and the destination unfamiliar. Moreover, stressed hives with large amounts of brood would be adversely affected and losses are certain. In severe cases, the losses could be almost total. On the other hand, there are methods that can be used on-site, anywhere. They may not be as easy as opening a lid and inserting a strip, and they will require consultation, education, experimentation, observation, and a little expense, but they are likely cheaper and less risky than moving north in Winter. Again, the best solution is not to get into this state in the first place. I've heard often of beekeepers who suddenly discovered they have massive infestations, but NEVER of a beekeeper who was monitoring steadily, conscientiously, and effectively who was unable to head off a critical mite problem. Montitor, monitor, monitor. allen A Beekeeper's Diary: http://www.honeybeeworld.com/diary/ And Backup, backup, backup. A friend called me over the other day. His Hard drive had been slowly dying, but he did not recognise the signs, and he had no backups either. AFAIK, everything on his drive was lost. With the current price of large external USB drives, external hard drives, networked computers, DVD burners, and Internet storage (like Yahoo! and Gmail), there in no reason to lose important documents. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:24:53 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Michael Palmer Subject: Re: First Trailer In-Reply-To: <200502081210.j18CAi0n012492@aphrodite.gwi.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Andrew asks about moving a few hives for pollination. Lloyd says: Are the fees worth it? Is the loss of honey crop worth it? With only 14 hives, to invest in a trailer, move the bees at least two times, and maybe three...and lose at least a super of honey...Why?? So you can be a pollinator? Wouldn't it be better to leave the bees on their locations, and spend your time managing them for the honey crop? Mike -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.5 - Release Date: 2/3/2005 :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 15:24:26 EST Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Rick Green Subject: Re: First Trailer, my two cents MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit bought a 4x6 trailer 10 years ago upgraded recently to a 5x10, incredibly useful for a hundred things, an investment in the bee business gets rewarded, more contracts, picking up used stuff, not making return trips to the home yard, with my trailer recently I moved into a house, moved 5 pigs, help other people, if you are not sure I would say take the plunge...if it is a bad decision you can always sell it, Rick Rick Green 8 Hickory Grove Lane Ballston Lake, NY 12019 (518) 384-2539 gothoney@aol.com :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 17:36:49 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Mea McNeil Subject: Re: availability of bees in CA In-Reply-To: <1ad.30f7032f.2f3a79fa@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At our beekeepers' meeting last night in Marin County (Northern California) widespread losses were reported. We were wiped out completely (and decided to start with all new woodenware). We even lost a feral colony in a tree. The only member with bees to sell in the spring was asking $65 for a 3# package. Today I found out that several sources either have no bees this year or are pre-sold out; the group order from Tabor's in Vacaville will be $67.50 for 3#. Are there packages available anywhere for a reasonable price? We are a small organic farm. Are there similar losses in other places at the latitude of San Francisco? (I realize that microclimates vary wildly.) :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 01:47:42 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "H.Kroese" Subject: Re: Moving for Varroa In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "Would it not be wise, for him, to bring the hives up north to stop the brood rearing. At that point treat with oxalic while the hives are broodless??" This is what I would do. I would stay, and use the trickle method. This has effect 2 to 3 weeks. Works slower and longer then the vaporizing method. Remember worker brood is 12 days closed and drone brood 16 days. The Varoa on the bees are killed in 2-7 days. The oxalic will overlap a important part of the closed brood, so it will still kill most of the emerging varoa's. The affect will not be as high as with broodless, but will prevent the colony from collapse. Use for a colony in 2 chambers maximum 50 ml divided over the 2 chambers. Better no honey chambers. Smaller colony's 5 Ml per frame with bees. For very good pictures and explanation: See the site from Gustafson Sweden: http://www.algonet.se/~beeman/index-f.html Click onto research - Varoa. You will be able to read about Formic and Oxalic. and my page: If your interested in the results numbers, and the graphics, visit my site. http://home.hetnet.nl/~kroese/ sub page "Varoa bestrijding" (sorry Dutch language) I will try to translate it in English later. But the numbers and the graphics speak for themselves. Hennie Kroese Netherlands........... :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 17:13:33 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: davidbrowder Subject: Re: First Trailer MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I've got a nice low trailer which is great for loading/unloading. It's been "hungup" a time or two though, something I'd bear in mind when shopping for a "off road trailer". ----- Original Message ----- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 18:31:33 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Andrew Dewey Subject: 1st Trailer - I forgot to mention MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit That the blueberry fields are mine. If I don't pollinate them then I have to pay someone else to. Thanks for all the feedback, especially the questions about what my truck is capable of pulling. I'm taking notes! Andrew :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 03:31:32 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: allen dick Subject: Re: Moving for Varroa MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > I would stay, and use the trickle method... > The oxalic will overlap a important part of the closed brood, so it > will still kill most of the emerging varoa's. > The affect will not be as high as with broodless, but will prevent the > colony from collapse. I guess the question is what to do next, after that, since the season is still ahead in the case we are discussing (in the South), and the varroa are only cut back a little. As an example, let's take a look at what happened in my own operation after oxalic was trickled into my hives at the end of September: Take a look at the red cells in the table at http://www.honeybeeworld.com/diary/2004/diary110104.htm, and compare them to the cells immediately to the left. We see that, on October 22nd, in a matter of about a month after the treatment, with various amounts of brood in the hives, the *phoretic* varroa numbers have either stayed the same or increased by up to ten times! The *total load* of the hives remains unknown, however, since we assume there was still lots of brood in some of the hives when the oxalic was applied and we can also assume there was much less brood a month later. Therefore, maybe the load has not increased -- or actually diminished, but, if the mite load has diminished, it has not gone down by as much as we might hope -- or, perhaps, by as much as a southern beekeeper would need, IMO. This is one specific case we happen to have measurements for. The case we are discussing might be different, in a number of ways. For one thing, I can safely assume, from previous observations, that we had no drone brood in Fall. The problem with trickling, is that -- I am told -- we can only use oxalic *once* on a generation of bees, and must wait until the bees have replaced themselves -- about six weeks in summer -- to treat again with trickling. Is this true? I had heard that in respect to elevated wintering loss in cases where the trickling was done more than once in Fall. Maybe it is not a concern in Spring and Summer? Anyhow, I have read that repeated treatments with oxalic vapour do not increase losses, and so have tended to favour evaporation over trickling. Some of these things may not be proven, but just speculation. Anyone know the facts? allen A Beekeeper's Diary: http://www.honeybeeworld.com/diary/ :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 06:31:21 -0500 Reply-To: Buckner Lewis Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Buckner Lewis Subject: Re: First Trailer MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Trailer axles come in various weight limits. You can have a trailer made to you special needs, single, double or triple axle. Remember that a trailer is measured from the hitch point, not the bed.. I have a single axle Bobcat trailer, the axle is rated for 6000 lbs., with 235R16LT radials, 3042lbs single @80psi., electric brakes.. I also have a car hauler, (cost $2100) double axles @3500lbs ea., with surge brakes, 700X15 LT bias ply tires..As trailers are idle more, these type tires last longer in the weather that radials. Surge brakes work great and no brake control is necessary, therefore they can be pull by any vehicle capable of hauling a trailer. To haul bees, an over the tire, flatbed trailer would be ideal, with axles and tires rated to haul the load.. I haul 64 ten frame, story an a half, hives on pallets with a 12 foot flat bed truck plus pull my Bobcat...In fact I am going to the orange woods in Lake Wales, Florida tonight.. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 16:08:04 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu Comments: DomainKeys? See http://antispam.yahoo.com/domainkeys From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Herv=E9=20Log=E9?= Subject: Re: OA trickling In-Reply-To: <000301c50e40$f66b2540$c100000a@hennie> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit > This is what I would do. I would stay, and use the > trickle method. This has > effect 2 to 3 weeks. Works slower and longer then > the vaporizing method. > Remember worker brood is 12 days closed and drone > brood 16 days. The Varoa > on the bees are killed in 2-7 days. > The oxalic will overlap a important part of the > closed brood, so it will > still kill most of the emerging varoa's. I am not sure I understand. Do you mean there will still be active OA solution in hives after 2 to 3 weeks ? Or would it be because of OA in bees hemolymphe ? May I ask your sources of information ? If OA solution trickling kills most emerging varroa for 2 weeks, I would expect a high % of efficiency even in brood period. Hervé, Laval, Qc, Canada Découvrez le nouveau Yahoo! Mail : 250 Mo d'espace de stockage pour vos mails ! Créez votre Yahoo! Mail sur http://fr.mail.yahoo.com/ :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 16:39:09 -0000 Reply-To: j.a.p.earle@qub.ac.uk Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Philip Earle Organization: Queens University Belfast Subject: Re: OA trickling In-Reply-To: <20050209150804.66437.qmail@web20824.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit OA does accumulate in bee heam for a shot time see http://www.apimondiafoundation.org/foundation/files/164.pdf :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 16:40:31 -0000 Reply-To: j.a.p.earle@qub.ac.uk Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Philip Earle Organization: Queens University Belfast Subject: Re: OA trickling In-Reply-To: <20050209150804.66437.qmail@web20824.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Interesting thought - OA in the heamolymph suggests that we could feed bees OA solution - has anyone investigated or tried this ? :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 10:48:16 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: allen dick Subject: Re: OA trickling MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Interesting thought - OA in the heamolymph suggests that we could feed > bees OA solution - has anyone investigated or tried this ? When trickling, as I understand it, all the OA syrup _is_ consumed by the bees. At least, they clean it all up, so I assume they 'swallow' it. I have heard that repeated treatments using OA in syrup is hard on the bees, and perhaps this is why. There are several aspects to this question. What is the concentration and total dose of OA that bees can stand? 1) in one dose, and 2) over time, in multiple doses Another point is that adding any acid to syrup causes chemical reactions in the syrup that are damaging to bees, at least if the bees are in a situation where they have only the acid-treated feed, like wintering. The instructions for OA syrup treatments emphasize maixing fresh solution, and not using any that is over a few days old. I very much doubt that OA is good for bees, as such. Its attraction is that, apparently, used jusdiciously, in carefully measured doses, it is not as hard on bees as it is on varroa. Nonetheless, above certain levels and frequencies, OA can be harmful. allen A Beekeeper's Diary: http://www.honeybeeworld.com/diary/ :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 13:43:58 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Rosalind James Subject: Re: Bees moving; Desperate Beekeeper Moving bees to a cold climate to kill varroa might not get you what you want. We find that varroa reduces a hive's ability to overwinter. Controlling varroa in the fall greatly decreased overwintering losses in our cold climate (Logan, Utah). If you don't have too many hives, you could try removing and destroying the capped brood and then treating the bees, perhaps getting almost the same effect you were hoping for. --Rosalind James :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 11:28:23 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "Medhat Nasr, Ph. D." Subject: Re: OA trickling Comments: To: j.a.p.earle@qub.ac.uk In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Earle said, Interesting thought - OA in the heamolymph suggests that we could feed bees OA solution - has anyone investigated or tried this ? Answer; Researchers has investigated the use of OA, the only effective methods of application against varroa were trickling or evaporation. Keep in mind adding OA to sugar syrup would convert sugar into HMH. HMF is toxic to bees. medhat Medhat Nasr, Ph. D. Provincial Apiculturist Crop Diversification Centre North 17507 Fort Road Edmonton, AB, Canada T5Y 6H3 Tel: (780) 415-2314 Fax: (780) 422-6096 Mailto:medhat.nasr@gov.ab.ca :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 00:27:19 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "H.Kroese" Subject: Re: OA trickling In-Reply-To: <20050209150804.66437.qmail@web20824.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "Do you mean there will still be active OA solution in hives after 2 to 3 weeks ? " We compared the results from the colleges who used both methods. There is no registration of these results, only my own, published on my website. http://home.hetnet.nl/~kroese/ subdir "varoa bestrijden" the peeks with vaporizing drops after 5-6 days back to lowest level. Faster than with the trickle method. My peak stayed from 16 December to 25 December above > 1000 mites total (14 hives)(1600 per day top) In the period 26 December to 12 January the drop is around 200 per day. After that date the drop was around 50 per day. 14 January I gave 1 hive 30 Ml for the second time. No bees lost. 14 days later I checked, the queen had some open brood started. Normal start this time of the year. Hennie Kroese.... :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 22:57:34 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Roger White Subject: OA trickling MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-7" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable We used Oxalic last winter by dripping the sugar solution onto the bees = in mid-winter. The usual dosage is 50cc. for a full brood chamber. My = business partner accidentally spilled about 600cc into a single brood = chamber. There was no apparent negative effect upon the hive and it was = one of the strongest in the spring! Just an interesting observation. = Maybe here, where the weather allows the bees to move around more, the = ''overdose'' didn't have any detrimental effect that could be seen. = It's probably different in colder climates where the bees can't move out = of the hive for weeks or months. Best regards Roger White Superbee Cyprus. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 10:23:57 -0000 Reply-To: j.a.p.earle@qub.ac.uk Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Philip Earle Organization: Queens University Belfast Subject: Re: more on OA Comments: To: irishbeekeeping@yahoogroups.co.uk In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: Some thoughts: It seems that trickling is a favoured means of application, also overdosing may not appear to harm the bees. OA reacts with sugar to produce HMF if stored in sugar solution for too long (how long? If solutions were stored at 4 degrees or -20 would this prolong life of the OA/sucrose soln?) therefore must be prepared fresh. How does HMF formation compare to the natural rate of HMF formation in honey, there is acids in honey too ? OA / sugar solution is consumed by bees, is the toxic effect of OA known on bees and brood ? The quoted figure appears to be in the range of 3-4% OA ,does this equate to an LD100 for varroa? What is the LD50 for bees/larvae? OA / sugar is consumed by bees, how long does OA stay in the bee as OA. It may be possible that a feeding mite is killed by the OA in heam. OR, is it a metabolic product of OA produced by the bee/larvae that kills the feeding varroa mite. The delayed and prolonged killing time may suggest that it is not OA directly that kills mites but a metabolic product ? if this is the case then what is it? Since radio labeled OA can be detected as labeled CO2 in bees then metabolism is taking place. What about an oxalate oxidase producing H2O2 which in turn stimulates a defensive 'immune' response in bees/larvae ? Does OA or secondary product of OA regulate gene expression of a defensin type gene giving bees either a chemical/protein type weapon against varroa....? Is 'anyone' working on the mode of action of OA ? Phil :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 15:13:59 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu Comments: DomainKeys? See http://antispam.yahoo.com/domainkeys From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Herv=E9=20Log=E9?= Subject: Re: OA trickling In-Reply-To: <000201c50efe$e6d83be0$c100000a@hennie> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Thanks Henri for all that (these? those? Never know...) info. I always appreciate charing results. Do you think the dead varroas peak is delayed (when compared to OA vaporizing) because the OA solution is longer effective or is it because lethal effect is less acute ? Hervé Qc, Canada Découvrez le nouveau Yahoo! Mail : 250 Mo d'espace de stockage pour vos mails ! Créez votre Yahoo! Mail sur http://fr.mail.yahoo.com/ :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 12:59:41 -0500 Reply-To: jkriebel@speakeasy.net Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Jonathan Kriebel Organization: Veritec, Ltd Subject: HFCS-off spec? In-Reply-To: <000801c4e36c$cbe879c0$16bc59d8@BusyBeeAcres> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Bob Harrison Wrote: *Fellow BEE-L people please beware of off spec HFCS as beekeepers have reported problems and bee kills.* What is off-spec? I lost 50% this year, and it was the first for feeding HFCS. Coincidence or not, what does off-spec mean? Thanks... Jonathan B. Kriebel Das Sauen Õhr Farm 3229 Zepp Rd. Green Lane, PA 18054-2357 Telephone: (610) 864-8581 Facsimile: (215) 234-8573 jbkriebel@speakeasy.net :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 23:14:30 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "H.Kroese" Subject: Re: OA trickling In-Reply-To: <20050210141359.64476.qmail@web20827.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit "Do you think the dead varroas peak is delayed (when compared to OA vaporizing) because the OA solution is longer effective or is it because lethal effect is less acute ? Hervé Qc, Canada" (Guess) Maybe the bees give the oxalic/sugar solution from tong to tong to the other bees in the cluster, burn some off it, and store the rest direct above the nest, for later. ??? The acid is concentrated in the bee nest. With 1 gram vaporising the cloud divides trough the inside off the hive. It immediately crystallizes every ware. On the wood, frames and the outside off the bee cluster. The bees will cleanout the nest/cluster. The mites will die when there is contact with the crystals. Maybe this cleaning does not take much time. It could be a reason for the shorter time that mites will drop. These questions should be investigated. Hennie Kroese........ :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 15:09:39 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?iso-8859-1?B?S29tcHBhLVNlcHDkbOQ=?= Subject: blueberry mead MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit As there is no acute beekeeping work I decided to start again an old hobby - making mead. >From internet I found an interesting recipie for blueberry mead. But as not native english speaker I have one problem in the recipie >I took those frozen blueberries and ran them through the salad shooter into my just cooked must Does this mean that the berries are crushed somehow before going to must. What does a salad shooter do ? Ari from Finland :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 10:30:06 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Aaron Morris Subject: Re: blueberry mead MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > What does a salad shooter do ? Hi Ari, A salad shooter is a kitchen appliance that slices vegatables. The user loads say a carrot or radish into the salad shooter, holds it over a bowl of lettuce, pulls the trigger, a circular blade spins in the salad shooter, and carrot or radish slices are shot out of the barrell of the salad shooter. I always thought it was a rather useless device intended for those unable to figure out how to use a knife, but the blueberry mead idea sheds a new light on my consideration. Personally when I make a blueberry mead I simply freeze the berries first. The freezing ruptures the cell walls of the berries, and when they thaw they release copious amounts of blueberry juices. Far easier than the salad shooter! Aaron Morris - thinking Ronco Oxalic Evaporator!!! :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 19:37:44 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?iso-8859-1?B?S29tcHBhLVNlcHDkbOQ=?= Subject: Vs: Re: [BEE-L] blueberry mead MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit > A salad shooter is a kitchen appliance that slices vegatables Thanks Aaron Actually I own such a machine, or to be true it might by my wifes, but that is not going to be problem. She likes mead as well. > Personally when I make a blueberry mead I simply freeze the berries first. > The freezing ruptures the cell walls of the berries, and when they thaw they > release copious amounts of blueberry juices. Far easier than the salad > shooter! The recipie called for frozen berries + slicing. So there seems to be different opinions. I'll melt some and see how much they are broken before I make my decision to slice or not. Mead making is like beekeeping - three makers have three opinions of the right way. Somehow quite often they all come out finally with good product. ( but maybe some throw away more failed batches ... ) Remains me of the recent discussion in bee-l about the use of oxalic acid. As my opinion both liquid and vapour work, the difference is only in the amount of work. Within few weeks I'll have my own opinion about blueberries + slicing. Ari Finland :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 12:51:39 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: preacher Subject: pure russian packages MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello folks I am looking to buy pure russian packages. Where can I find them. thanks preacher :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 18:03:21 -1000 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Howard McGinnis Subject: Large quantity creamed honey Seattle Washington? In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed I'm going to be in Seattle for a few days and would like to bring back to Hawaii a gallon or two of a creamed honey - any suggestions on where I might find some on Sunday or Monday? Thanks, Howard BK in HI :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 09:24:39 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Jimmy Odom Subject: russian honey bees preacher; why do you want russian honey bees???? thanks jimmy :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 14:57:34 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: davidbrowder Subject: Re: Vs: Re: [BEE-L] blueberry mead MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I've been using a Steam Juicer for juicing Blueberries,Blackberries, "Asian" Pears (A new one this year, going to carbonate it like sparkling cider when it's ready.) ect.,ect.,. It's oh so true that ya get more juice when you freeze the fruit first. With a steam juicer there's no waiting for things to thaw out, just throw it in the juicer and turn on the heat. Works for me!! :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 11:24:11 EST Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "James W. Hock" Subject: Honey Bee Pollination Crisis MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Here is a story about the honey bee "crisis" in California that I found on AOL business news. http://aolsvc.news.aol.com/business/article.adp?id=20050211081809990017 Jim Hock Wethersfield, CT :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 09:40:57 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu Comments: DomainKeys? See http://antispam.yahoo.com/domainkeys From: Mike Stoops Subject: Re: russian honey bees In-Reply-To: <200502121424.j1CENDHd018559@listserv.albany.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >From what I have heard, the Russians are very tollerant to varroa, either living with them or getting rid of them in the colony (to the point that the infestation level is acceptable to the bees and provides no, or little, detrimental effect on the colony. At several of my state meetings (Alabama) now I have heard that the Russians require little in the way of chemical varroa control measures. Have also heard that a company is coming out in mid summer with a fungus control for the mite. It won't have any effect on honey quality. Just drop a pill down the hand hold hole in the inner conver and the hive is treated. Hope it works! Mike in southern Alabama --- Jimmy Odom wrote: preacher; why do you want russian honey bees??? thanks jimmy __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 20:14:14 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Erwan Cassard Subject: Fwd: abeille noire en danger au danemark Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit > If you want to help danish beekeeper (their black bee) and > bio-diversity. > Send this letter to the Danish minister at hcsc@fvm.dk. Thanks to all Erwan > > > ====================== > LETTRE > > To the Danish Minister of Agriculture and Food > Hans Christian Schmidt > Address : Friggsvang 3, 6500 Vojens, > Denmark > Email : hcsc@fvm.dk > > > > I heard you decided to allow other races of bees on the Island of > Læsø. You know that the Læsø Black Bee is preserved under 1) The > Convention of Biological Diversity which Danish Government is a > signatory too, 2) The Danish Government also is a signatory to The > Food and Agriculture Organisation Global Strategy from 1999 on the > preservation of Global Gene resources, 3) The EU Court In Luxemburg > has ruled that the Preservation Order on the Læsø Black Bee was a > requirement on The Danish Government, and that no other race of bees > were to be allowed on the Island of Læsø, 4) SICAMM, The International > Organisation on the preservation of the Northern European Black Bee, > held a conference on Læsø in September 2004, and agreed it was > important to preserve this unique bee. > Today several European countries are aware of the importance of bee > biodiversity. They initiate various actions of conservation ; for > example, the city of Chimay in belgium just set up a zone of > protection of the dark bee on all its territory. > I do not understand your unexpected and unacceptable decision opposed > to the European Community biodiversity strategy (COM/98/0042). > I steadily ask you to maintain the statute of protection of the dark > bee of Laeso. > Yours sincerely. > > > > Copie à l’association apicole danoise ; email : bjs@byogbyg.dk > > > ========================= > > COMMUNIQUE > > Danish Minister of Agriculture Removes the Conservation order on Black > Bees > > ( Apis melliffera mellifera ) on Danish Island of Læsø > > > > The Danish Minister of Agriculture and Food, Hans Christian Schmidt, > Email > > address hcsc@fvm.dk Has decided because it goes > against his libertine > > instincts of how a free market economy should function to remove the > > conservation orders on the unique Danish Black Bee ( Apis melliffera > > mellifera ) which has survived on the Danish Island of Læsø in the > Kattegat > > Sea, for many hundreds of thousands of years. He has decided to allow > other > > races of bees on the Island of Læsø as he say " To improve the previous > > arrangements " ( in Danish " for at forbedre den hidtige indsats ) . > The > > Queen honey bee mates up to 15 - 16 times at a height of up to 1000 > metres > > in the air, males bees 'drones', are able to fly over 15 kilometre's; > as > > the Island of Læsø is only 25 Kilometres long there will be there for, > no > > were on the Island that the unique black Læsø bee will not be mated by > other > > species of honey bee. The Læsø Black Bee is preserved under 1) ' The > > Convention of Biological Diversity 1992 ' which Danish Government is a > > signatory too 2) The Danish Government also is a signatory to ' The > Food > > and Agriculture Organisation ' FAO Global Strategy from 1999 on the > > preservation of Global Gene resources 3) The EU Court In Luxemburg has > > ruled that the Preservation Order on the Læsø Black Bee was a > requirement on > > The Danish Government, and that no other race of bees were to be > allowed on > > the Island of Læsø . 4) SICAMM 'The International Organisation on the > > preservation of the Northern European Black Bee' held a conference on > Læsø > > in September 2004, and agreed it was important to preserve this unique > bee. > > A Danish Beekeeper Ditlev Blume, who shares Hans Christian Schmidt, > > Libertine Philosophy has fought all the above International > Judgements, and > > has now got the backing of the Danish ' Liberal ' Minister of Food And > > Agriculture, to allow other races of bees like ligustica ( yellow Bee > )on > > the Island of Læsø. He has now also got the Danish minister backing to > > ignore all international judgements on the importance of preserving the > > unique Black Bee which absorbs the suns rays better in northern > Climates, > > and in fact is a lot older genetic version of the other honey bee > varieties. > > > > Professor Bo Vest Pedersen from Copenhagen Universities, ' Zoological > > Institute' is now convinced that another species of our planets > > increasingly endangered species, the Læsø black bee will now disappear > > unless International pressure can be brought to bare on the Danish > Minister > > of Food & Agriculture. Danish Beekeepers a through their ' Denmark's > > Biavlerforening ' ( Danish Beekeepers Association ) Chairman Bjarne > > Sørensen Email : bjs@byogbyg.dk are appealing > to all beekeepers, > > conservation interested people, and friends of our planet earth, to > raise a > > massive ' Press & Media Storm' to this Danish government minister who > > would like the world to think that Denmark is a civilised democratic > > country. By emailing, or writing personally to Danish Minister of Food > and > > Agriculture, Hans Christian Schmidt, Address : Friggsvang 3, 6500 > Vojens, > > Denmark, Tel : 0045 33922002 or email hcsc@fvm.dk > your own protest in your > > own words, or using the information above. The author of this article > has > > found out on ' the principle of five ' , that if you send some > important > > information to five important people within seven days every one in the > > world will know about it. Asks you to send this information to The > Press, > > Journalists, BBC, Opinion Formers, in fact any one you can think of. > For > > further information you can contact Denmark's National Beekeeping > Advisor > > and President of Apimondia, Asger Søgaard Jørgensen, on > asj@biavl.dk web > > page www.biavl.dk Tel : 0045 57561777 . > > > > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 15:49:54 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: preacher Subject: splits MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello folks. I have another stupid question for some of you . I am wanting to make splits and increase hive numbers this year. I have taken a two deep hive and split once. But I am thinking about splitting a hive into possible 4 to 5 splits. Would this be possible and have them fill a two body hive by winter. I live in central missouri. preacher :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 05:05:40 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "Malcolm T. Sanford" Subject: Off spec syrup In-Reply-To: <200502110510.j1B4wqBw000348@listserv.albany.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed > From the pages of the Apis newsletter: > http://apis.ifas.ufl.edu/apis97/apfeb97.htm#3 OFF-SPEC CORN SYRUP IN CANADA--SOME HFCS MAY NOT BE A BARGAIN Last winter, some Canadian beekeepers saw many indoor-wintered colonies die. The reason was not immediately apparent, but research finally provided a great deal of evidence that the culprit was what is known as "off-spec" corn syrup. This is high fructose corn syrup (HFCS) that cannot be used by the eventual customer for some reason and is subsequently sold by the manufacturer at a discount. In the past, many beekeepers used such products with great success. At the Manitoba Beekeepers Association meeting in Winnipeg, Dr. Rob Currie, University of Manitoba, revealed how his research led to the above conclusion. After sorting through many variables, including incidence of nosema, effects of pesticide applications, and/or granulation of feed, all signs pointed to off-spec HFCS. One piece of evidence was the wide variability in content of hydroxy-methyl-furfural, or HMF, in these products. There is evidence that high levels of HMF have injured bees. A high level of HMF is considered 114 parts per million (ppm); honey could have as high as 40 ppm. However, Dr. Currie does not consider this the full answer. Undissolved solids or incomplete hydrolysis also could have contributed. High acidity levels (low pH) may be an indication of this. However, honey itself is often low in pH (a level of 3-4 is not unusual for the sweet on the pH scale of one through 14, seven being neutral). Dr. Currie found almost by accident, however, that many syrups are in fact produced using acid hydrolysis (those required in beer making, for example) instead of enzymes (the usual production technology). Acid hydrolysis is known to result in syrup injurious to honey bees. Although there is a good deal of evidence that off-spec syrup is indeed the culprit in the Manitoba incident, Dr. Currie cannot point to the actual mechanism causing the problem. He does warn beekeepers, however, to be aware of two possible problems in off-spec HFCS: low pH (four or lower), and a colored syrup. Most HFCS is colorless; colored syrup may be an indication that it was manufactured by acid hydrolysis. Malcolm T. Sanford Professor Emeritus, University of Florida http://beeactor.vze.com 352-336-9744 :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 13:32:27 +0100 Reply-To: Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Jorn Johanesson Subject: SV: [BEE-L] Fwd: abeille noire en danger au danemark In-Reply-To: <48734ED1-7D2A-11D9-A917-003065546B7E@tiscali.fr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit The Judgment from the EU court about the Danish Black Bee, can be read at http://apimo.dk/laesoebee.htm Best regards Jorn Johanesson maybe the best and Only Multilingual software for beekeeping on the net. With integrated update facility. Version 8.0.3.0 now translated into 13 languages with more to come. hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software. the palmOS 5+ is now also supported. home page = HTTP://apimo.dk forum = http://apimo.dk/apimo_forum e-mail apimo@apimo.dk > -----Oprindelig meddelelse----- > Fra: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu [mailto:BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu]På > vegne af Erwan Cassard > Sendt: 12. februar 2005 20:14 > Til: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu > Emne: [BEE-L] Fwd: abeille noire en danger au danemark > > > > If you want to help danish beekeeper (their black bee) and > > bio-diversity. > > Send this letter to the Danish minister at hcsc@fvm.dk. > Thanks to all > Erwan :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 08:25:09 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: John & Christy Horton Subject: Re: russian honey bees MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I know Russians are somewhat tolerant of the varroa and tracheal, as I have seen in some studies in the American Bee Journal-the mite levels on average being less than 4% after one year if I am not mistaken. My question is this: What about the second and third year? Anybody got any real experience or hard data? Thanks much John Horton PS I have one yard of Russians(mix) I bought from a guy named Bobby Howard here in Alabama and they are among the hardiest bees I have- I have only lost 1 out of 25 colonies in 2-1/2 years.I have treated for mites every year but this one, and I may yet before the flow starts, once I do a check :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 18:16:37 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Rob Green Subject: ISBA Journal Free Download In-Reply-To: <200502130500.j1D48Sfr018624@listserv.albany.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed http://www.hoosierbuzz.com/document/i0502.pdf :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 19:00:28 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Tim Vaughan Subject: Arizona bees Is there an online list of areas in the US where one can't import bees from into California? I've a friend there who's thinking about raising queens from his AHB hives to help with the shortage. Thanks :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 09:31:51 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu Comments: DomainKeys? See http://antispam.yahoo.com/domainkeys From: David Kraus Subject: Re: BEE-L Digest - 11 Feb 2005 to 12 Feb 2005 (#2005-44) In-Reply-To: <200502130500.j1D48Sfr018624@listserv.albany.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mike Stoops wrote: <> Care to elaborate? I've heard rumors, but nothing solid. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The all-new My Yahoo! - What will yours do? http://my.yahoo.com :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 14:18:40 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "D. Murrell" Subject: Latest Mite Treatment Device Hi Guys, Check out: http://www.honeybeeworld.com/diary/images/terry1.jpg I would like to see a video of this beast operating. It's obviously smart and might be self propelled? Feet could be much better, in rough terrain, than wheels :>) Any additional info Allen? Regards Dennis Thinking my little OA pipe has really been outclassed! :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::