From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Feb 28 09:36:12 2009 Return-Path: <> X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.8 (2007-02-13) on industrial X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-82.7 required=2.4 tests=ADVANCE_FEE_1,AWL, MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR,SARE_OEM_B_3,SPF_HELO_PASS,TVD_DOLLARS_US, USER_IN_WHITELIST autolearn=disabled version=3.1.8 X-Original-To: adamf@IBIBLIO.ORG Delivered-To: adamf@IBIBLIO.ORG Received: from listserv.albany.edu (unknown [169.226.1.24]) by metalab.unc.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id E629A482A7 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2009 09:35:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from listserv.albany.edu (listserv.albany.edu [169.226.1.24]) by listserv.albany.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n1SEVNiq013404 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2009 09:35:37 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 09:35:36 -0500 From: "University at Albany LISTSERV Server (14.5)" Subject: File: "BEE-L LOG0507" To: adamf@IBIBLIO.ORG Message-ID: Content-Length: 191643 Lines: 4252 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jul 2005 12:15:58 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: CSlade777@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Get swarm out of a drum? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit it sounds to me that what was a 'swarm' is now a 'hive-in-a- drum'. Even so - it's a hive that's a month old or less. Any tips on getting the bees transferred to a hive would be appreciated. tfl. Drumming would seem the obvious way. Chris :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jul 2005 10:35:09 -0400 Reply-To: Lloyd Spear Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Lloyd Spear Subject: honey flow Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Here near Albany NY we have a monster of a flow and have had since early June. Some hives have 3 mediums full, but most are at about 2 full and working on the third. Comb honey supers are being filled without difficulty. Blooming is milkweed, sumac, basswood, and dutch and askine clover. Our major sources of summer honey are knapweed, which is just starting, and loosestrife, which will start in about 2 weeks. Should be a good year. -- Lloyd Spear Owner Ross Rounds, Inc. Manufacture of equipment for round comb honey sections, Sundance Pollen Traps, and producer of Sundance custom labels. Contact your dealer or www.RossRounds.com :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jul 2005 20:18:26 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: P-O Gustafsson Subject: Re: How Good is Good Enough? In-Reply-To: <200507010401.j61401t7023275@listserv.albany.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >I find this interesting... I have wondered about the possibility of strains >that use supersedure not being as likely to co-operate in a queen rearing >operation. > > Hi Dave, Almost all of my hives will supersede the old queen when she is due to be replaced. Any swarms are my own fault when I don't give them space enough, or make some other mistake. That is for the first generation from selected stock mated in area where I control the drone population. F2 queens in production hives mated with local drones have a bigger chance of swarming the second year. They are usually replaced by me with reared queens within a year. I would not use hives prone for swarming as finishers. They will try to make their own queens and generally cause all kinds of trouble. I don't see a link between bees prone to swarming and ability to produce good cells. >I am using strains with high AMM content, what race are you using ? > > Buckfast with a mix of monticola, saharensis, carnica, ligustica, and heaven knows what else... ;-) Even some AMM, I'm afraid. I deliberately mixed in as much different genetics I could find when starting this breeding program. All gentle non swarming bees that produced good was selected. After 4 years they produce good, have more vigour, and are still so gentle we rarely use veils. That is a closed population program. -- Regards P-O Gustafsson, Sweden beeman@algonet.se http://www.algonet.se/~beeman/ :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jul 2005 17:19:52 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: mark esterly Subject: Re: hive in a whiskey barrel In-Reply-To: Automatic digest processor 's message of Fri, 1 Jul 2005 00:00:10 -0400 Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=ISO-8859-1 MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit if i were permitted to cut the barrel top i would make cuts at 0° and 180° longer than a 2x4 is wide. screw a 2x4 that is longer than the top to the top over the cuts and then finish the cuts around the barrel. now you have the top free of the barrel and secured to the 2x4 holding it from falling inside. cut the comb to fit the inside of a hive body and set inside. super UNDER the whole bit and when they move down and empty the upper body you can remove it. mark esterly (former lurker) :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jul 2005 18:11:15 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Dan & Jan Subject: Type of sugar for "measuiring" mites MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable We are confused about the type of sugar to use when testing for Varroa = mites. Some of us understand that confectioners sugar is what is indicated BUT = a very respected and informed beekeeper has told us that we should be = using just plain granulated table sugar What should we be using? Are there any significant differences?=20 Dan Veilleux 225 Indigo Road=20 Vilas, NC 28692 PH&FAX 828-297-6900 :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Jul 2005 10:06:28 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Dave Cushman Subject: Re: How Good is Good Enough? In-Reply-To: <42C588F2.4060009@algonet.se> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi P-O > Buckfast with a mix of monticola, saharensis, carnica, ligustica, and > heaven knows what else... ;-) Even some AMM, I'm afraid. I deliberately > mixed in as much different genetics I could find when starting this > breeding program. All gentle non swarming bees that produced good was > selected. After 4 years they produce good, have more vigour, and are > still so gentle we rarely use veils. That is a closed population program. I like this approach... It shows what can be done in as little as four years. Maybe this technique would help those in USA, Canada and Alaska to develop strains that are well suited to their particular environment ?? With results like that in four years... Think what the possibilities would be after ten years of selection ! Regards & Best 73s, Dave Cushman, G8MZY http://website.lineone.net/~dave.cushman or http://www.dave-cushman.net Fall Back M/c, Build 5.02 (stable) :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 3 Jul 2005 08:01:53 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Aaron Morris Subject: Re: What Kind of Beekeeper Are You? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This message was originally submitted by nbehr@IASTATE.EDU to the BEE-L list at LISTSERV.ALBANY.EDU. It was edited to remove quoted of = previously posted material. ------- Original message (ID=3DAB2156D8) (103 lines) ---------Date: Sun, = 03 Jul 2005 00:16:01 -0500 To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Nicholas S Behrens Subject: Re: [BEE-L] What Kind of Beekeeper Are You? I have very seldom posted to the list as a whole, normally reply to people individually. I also am pry the youngest person that is on this = list at 21. I got interested in bee's when I was in elementary school, = and had very supportive parents, who also found it interesting. Our = minister at the time had bees and showed us a few things and put us in = touch with the local bee supply store, we are lucky and have Dadants in = out town. We got our first two Nucs from none other than Erwin Glew, = which I am sure many people on this list knew. He was a great person and = beekeeper. After getting our bees we decided we didn't know enough (my = father and I) and took a short class by Marion Ellis. This was all by = around the time I was entering middle school. (6th grade, about 1994 or = 1995) In High school, we bought out another guy, and ended the season = with 15 hives, and have kept around that many since then. In high = school, while most guys are worried about girls, I was too, but a = different kind, Queens. The Summer of 1997 I took along with my father = Dr. Marion Ellis's Master Beekeeping workshop. I learned a lot. The = following year I alone took Marla's queen course at UNL. After high = school, I attended Iowa State University, majoring in Civil Engineering. = Well, by mid semester of my sophomore year, and calculus kicking me = hard, I started taking Entomology classes. I now am a Ent. major and = love it. I also work for the USDA in town raising honey bee's for = pollination. I was told I was the first person to apply for a job there = that only wanted to work with bee's and actually had experience in it. = All of this was after 3 years of not touching a beehive. (After moving = to college, I didn't help much and left my parents with the duties, = which they still are doing good with, I now recently have helped when I = am back) I still keep in touch with Marion, and try to visit him when I = am in Lincoln. I owe him many thanks for showing me all of the different = facets of Entomology. I would like to say for anyone else out there that = is High school age or about that, and don't know what they want to do, = find a place with an under grad Entomology degree, and try it. I started = out loving Honey bee's, and still like them, but are starting to find = beetles just as interesting. I however, if I can=20 find a school to give me money for grad school, I would love to do=20 something with honey bee's. Toxicology has become a second or third=20 interest after taking Organic Chemistry. So that's what kind of beekeeper I am. I am the partial product of two great beekeepers, Dr. = Marion Ellis and Erwin Glew. Nick Behrens Entomology Senior, but will be a super senior trying to get a Chem Minor. Ames Iowa, originally from Sioux City Iowa :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 3 Jul 2005 21:17:42 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Larry Krengel Subject: section honey prices MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit For the first time I have a big enough stock of section honey to make it worth marketing it. I have the problem that I am not sure what a 4X4 basswood section sells for. It is not listed in the honey price section of Bee Culture (likely because so little is sold). I found no guidance in the archives. I tend to think that the old fashioned wood box with the comb in a Kelly (also old looking) package would fetch a premium price in the right market place. Yet to get a following I would consider keeping the initial price low. I would appreciate any thoughts on wholesale and retail prices that others charge for these. Larry Krengel Marengo, IL USA :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 07:51:38 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bill Gowan Subject: How do I wax coat plastic frames MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have a bunch of plastic frames and the bees really are not building comb on them properly. They do attach the comb to the frames but most of it doesn't even touch the plactic. Is there a way I can coat these plastic frames with bee's wax? Thanks in advance for any help! Bill :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 05:06:24 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Grant Gillard Subject: Re: section honey prices In-Reply-To: <00b601c5803e$8fed04d0$645b70d1@Tom> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Larry Krengel wrote: For the first time I have a big enough stock of section honey to make it worth marketing it. I would appreciate any thoughts on wholesale and retail prices that others charge for these. Response: I'm going to sell mine for $4.00, and if they're a retail establishment, they can add their 25% or whatever to it. I'm giving fewer discounts and would rather sell my honey for what I think it's worth (and let the market decide). How are you going to go about marketing/packaging your section boxes? I have "clam shells" to hold the section box, but would like something a little more "professional" looking. I do not care for the old fashioned cardboard boxes with the cellophane window--too tempting for little, and mature fingers. Grant Jackson, MO --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 09:08:53 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Larry Krengel Subject: Re: section honey prices MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > How are you going to go about marketing/packaging your section boxes? I > have "clam shells" to hold the section box, but would like something a > little more "professional" looking. I do not care for the old fashioned > cardboard boxes with the cellophane window--too tempting for little, and > mature fingers. > > Grant > Jackson, MO I have not thought of the plastic boxes. The basswood boxes seem rather classic (old fashioned?) and I would like to promote the idea of the down-home, healthy feel. I like the Kelly boxes... Though this is my first adventure in section honey. Time will teach me what really works. I am pondering whether to use the plastic bag inside the box. Is it necessary? Larry Marengo, Illinois :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 10:16:03 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Tim Vaughan Subject: Re: section honey prices Grant, you could try the Hogg's plastic squares. I do this, and while it does cost a bit more, little fingers can't get inside the plastic cassettes. Here are some pictures of mine http://www.pbase.com/beekeeper/image/22424566 The biggest drawback that I have is that they weigh in at 1.5 pounds (it varies) and if I sell them at 5 dollars, I make a buck profit less than with my regular bottled 1.5 pound jar, and when I offer them for 6 dollars, they don't sell. So I stopped doing them, but some guy this Saturday offered to pay more if I custom produce them, so we'll see what happens. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 16:07:42 +0100 Reply-To: j.a.p.earle@qub.ac.uk Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Philip Earle Organization: Queens University Belfast Subject: new type of smoker!! Comments: To: irishbeekeeping@yahoogroups.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, Anyone who gets the Am.B.J. will have seen the article about the new expensive smoker Design that works on the same principle as a burgess fogger. The author comments that the material for producing the smoke is freely available from any grocery store - my question is, does anyone know what is used to make the smoke? I suspect mineral oil plus something that burns in the coils - any ideas For those who don't get Am.B.J. see http://www.newbeesmoker.com for enlightenment. Phil :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 12:09:41 -0400 Reply-To: dutchmansgold Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: dutchmansgold Subject: Re: How do I wax coat plastic frames MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >Bill asked "I have a bunch of plastic frames and the bees really are not >building comb" > on them properly. We have been using Pierco Plastic Frames for a few years now. We have found that the only reliable way to get bees to work on them is to put a full box of 10 new frames directly over a single brood chamber during a good honey flow. Otherwise the bees will do everything in their power to avoid using them. Once they have been filled, the bees will accept them like any other built out comb. Regards John Van Alten----- > -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: > > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 14:33:59 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Coleene Subject: Another Auction MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi All, First the standard disclaimer-we all know purchasing used equipment can be dangerous. Now for the info. There is an auction this coming Saturday near Evart, MI that has the standard used stuff as well as a Stainless extractor that has only been used once. Not too much info, but it sounds as though it was motorized by the owner. I will try to gather more info. Please email off list for further info including location. Thanks, Coleene :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 15:07:28 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: AL BOEHM Subject: Re: How do I wax coat plastic frames MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Gowan" To: Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 7:51 AM Subject: [BEE-L] How do I wax coat plastic frames? I use pierco foundation and when it needs scraped down i melt some cappings in a coffee can and use a paint brush. works well and is readily accepted by the bees. A couple coats can give extra wax for the bees to use. AL BOEHM :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 13:10:09 -0600 Reply-To: MWestall Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: MWestall Subject: Re: How do I wax coat plastic frames MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "Bill Gowan" asks: >I have a bunch of plastic frames and the bees really are not building comb > > Is there a way I can coat these plastic frames with bee's wax? Hi Bill, That's the fun of plastic foundation, getting the bees to work it properly. To answer your question on re-coating the wax foundation --- forget about it. Not worth it. Spend your time working the bees with the plastic foundation as-is. You'll find tips & tricks on drawing plastic if you research old Bee-L posts as we've talked about this many times. You can mix drawn frames with undrawn, add full deeps of undrawn, pull up brood, etc.. lot's of ways to get the bees to work plastic and you'll find some successful on some hives & others not. In your situation - if I understand your post you have bees drawing 'parallel comb' between the frames? If so, shake off the bees and use a hive-tool or paint scraper to mash/roll the comb onto the surface of the frame. Any large wax particles should be scraped/rolled enough to leave small particles on the imprint is still revealed and the bees can pick up right where you want them to start. You don't have to cover the entire frame, just a good 4"-6" dab in the center. Make SURE to scrape off every bit of the cell imprint the bees used to 'start' their parallel comb or you'll find the exact same problem. Once the bees are drawing the centers correctly then move them apart & insert other undrawn frames. Dipping frames in heavy sugar-water-slurry will keep them busy, letting the frames drip-dry enough before placing them in the hive so the bees aren't overwhelmed by sticky sugar-slurry. Check your frames every 4 or 5 days. If/when the bees draw out parallel comb or burr comb, simply shake off the bees and scrape it down & throw it back in the hive. Eventually you'll end up with (far) superior frames than anything else you can use (wax/duragilt/etc) considering the numerous long-term advantages over other foundation types. But it takes work. Matthew Westall E-Bees - Castle Rock, CO -where for the first time in many years we're seeing bees work yellow clover as a major crop instead of the usual knapweed & thistle, turning out to be a great start -- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 21:59:39 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Christopher Reed Subject: Section Honey Prices MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have been selling basswood sections for $6.50 lately. That's retail. Christopher Reed Arlington, Virginia :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2005 07:26:10 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Gauthier Buddy Subject: Re: Get swarm out of a drum? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Chris, I had the same problem 2 years ago. Since the barrel was under a canopy with the original owner (where the bees set up camp), I took it home and put it under a canopy as well. I noticed one way in, one way out and figured I could use a one-way gate for the bees, but they found alternate ways out. Thus, I set the drum out in the middle of the yard in direct sunlight. It took 3 days, but it got so hot, they left. It was the biggest swarm I've seen, actually darkening the sky and making the birds flying in the sky jitter as they were flying. They landed on a fence post in my yard and the size of the swarm was as large as a person. I was able to capture them and I still have the bees till today. I have a big piece of property, thus it worked. If the barrel has one way in, one way out, I'd try using a one way gate to an empty hive and see how that will work. Buddy Gauthier=20 =20 Information Technology Analyst / Beekeeper Hobbyist CAMECO(r) Industries, Inc.=20 Thibodaux, LA =20 :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2005 12:35:33 GMT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "waldig@netzero.com" Subject: Sevin & honey bees. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain A while ago I was told about a bee colony that had been killed with Sevin spray. I looked up Sevin and it's a non-residue insecticide that's used on vegetables and fruit trees that's very toxic to honey bees. Even though it's supposed to be non-residue, I'd hesitate to re-use any honey and comb from such a colony for honey bees. Does anyone know if it would be safe? Waldemar Long Island, NY :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2005 14:02:20 GMT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "waldig@netzero.com" Subject: Re: Get swarm out of a drum? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Buddy wrote: >>Thus, I set the drum out in the middle of the yard in direct sunlight. It took 3 days, but it got so hot, they left. <....> I was able to capture them and I still have the bees till today. Did you save the combs (brood & honey) in the drum? (I assume the combs did not melt and make a mess in the intense heat.) Waldemar Long Island, NY :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2005 10:32:35 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bill Truesdell Subject: Re: Sevin & honey bees. In-Reply-To: <20050705.053626.17473.332396@webmail28.nyc.untd.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit waldig@netzero.com wrote: >A while ago I was told about a bee colony that had been killed with Sevin spray. > If so, it was sprayed directly on the bees. Generally Sevin is applied as a powder and that is brought back to the hive (if the bee can make it that far) and that is what can kill off a colony. If it was actually powder (dust), it could be in pollen and honey. I would not use it. I use liquid Sevin early in the season on my cucumber and squash when they are at their first leaf stage to kill off cucumber beetles. The bees do not frequent the plants and, since it is a spray, I have no problems with bee kills. I would not use the powder as bees would pick it up and take it back to the hive. I have more questions than answers here, since most (most is the operative word here, since there are several deadly pollen sized pesticides that are deadly to the colony itself, but most are not) field pesticides kill bees remotely from the colony and it is the one that is directly sprayed on the colony that are the actual colony killers. So if Sevin was sprayed, then someone was trying to kill the colony, which means opening it up, or spraying into it and contaminating everything. With all the other problems that are out there that can kill a colony, I would not attach everything to Sevin if sprayed remotely and not on the colony directly. I was talking to a beekeeper in the area and he lost two colonies this spring. He said it a from starvation. Maybe. If the Sevin killed the bees remotely, the colony may have lost most of its field bees and other things may have led to the colony death, including starvation, mites or EFB. Many possibilities. A good inspection of the colony would tell you more. There might be no Sevin contamination. Bill Truesdell Bath, Maine :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2005 11:12:15 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Frank Wyatt Subject: Re: Type of sugar for "measuiring" mites Confectioners sugar should not be used because it contains starch which is not digestable by bees. 10X powdered sugar should be used when using a sugar shake for mites. Frank Wyatt Eden, NC :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2005 20:09:13 GMT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "waldig@netzero.com" Subject: Re: Sevin & honey bees. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Bill wrote: >>So if Sevin was sprayed, then someone was trying to kill the colony, which means opening it up, or spraying into it and contaminating everything. The colony was located in the wall of a house and the owner sprayed liquid Seven into the opening. I assume everything was contaminated. I only wondered about the 'non-residue' description of Sevin. Does it disintegrate into harmless components after a period of time? Waldemar Long Island, NY :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2005 16:41:50 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Russ Dean Subject: market value of wax MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit What is the price of beeswax? At this store it's $2.50 oz. http://britishshop.com/product_info.php?cPath=5_13&products_id=1169 Russ :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2005 19:45:16 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Alan Fiala Subject: Re: Section Honey Prices In-Reply-To: <200507050402.j653mv7q015403@listserv.albany.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In Northern Virginia we have one member who produces the basswood sections (12 oz) - except this year he had no nectar flow and he didn't get any. Last year I think he sold them at $6 - $6.50 in farm markets. Ross Rounds at 8 oz sell for around $5.50 - $5.75 this year. For comparison, farm market prices for 1 pound extracted is $5.25 - 6.50. Supermarket price of Sioux Bee clover is $5.29/lb plus tax. Alan Fiala Fairfax/Falls Church :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2005 19:50:47 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Christopher Reed Subject: Section Honey Prices MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I wrap the basswood sections in a 6 3/4 inch X 13 inch cellophane sheet heat sealed at the overlaps to make a leak-proof package. Then I insert the cellophane-wrapped section in a standard cardboard box with a cellophane window. I have found that if the section is packaged only in the cardboard box, it will probably end up a sticky box. Christopher Reed Arlington, Virginia :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2005 20:07:52 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bill Truesdell Subject: Re: Sevin & honey bees. In-Reply-To: <20050705.131011.16498.338110@webmail24.nyc.untd.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit waldig@netzero.com wrote: > The colony was located in the wall of a house and the owner sprayed > liquid Seven into the opening. I assume everything was contaminated. I > only wondered about the 'non-residue' description of Sevin. Does it > disintegrate into harmless components after a period of time? I have not seen the data that says it is non-residue, since it is there for some time after spraying. Non-residue is just that, nothing is left after spraying, sort of like electrical contact cleaner. It is highly volatile and soon gone (generally a couple of days is the outside limit). Sevin is a persistent pesticide. Plenty in the literature that says that. My own observations confirm that, since I can see it after I spray the squash leaves. It is typical of many pesticides in that the half life listed is only when it is used used according to directions. You do not have that here. Sevin breaks down in sunlight and alkaline soils fairly quickly, but here you have darkness and an acidic liquid (honey), both conducive to extending the half life of Sevin. And if the "applier" is like many home owners, the necessary amount needed was probably greatly exceeded. Under ideal conditions the half life can be just a few days on the plant but two to four weeks in the soil around the plant. And remember, we are speaking only of having half of it around after that amount of time. It takes another period to get to 1/4 then 1/8th etc. so to get to 1/16 left could be as long as 4 months when used properly! From a health point of view, there is probably not great danger in using either the honey or wax since Sevin is not an extremely dangerous pesticide. But why chance it and expose anyone to possible health problems? I would not think of using any honey or wax that had been sprayed with it. Just add the PR problems of Sevin found in honey and it is just not worth it. From a removal perspective, there is little danger removing the wax and honey, even if you did so right after the spray, not because it decomposes but because it is not in the very dangerous category. Just used rubber gloves and wash up afterwards. A respirator wouldn't hurt. As far as how long it can be around, there will be some around for a long time. Under the circumstances you described, I can only guess since the amount sprayed may be three to five times the amount needed, and even if it has decomposed by half, there may still be a lot there. Add the fact that it is more stable in an acidic environment (honey), it may be many months or even a year before you get to a "safe" low level. Bill Truesdell Bath, Maine :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2005 20:34:39 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Dan & Jan Subject: Re: Sevin & honey bees. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Here is the scoop on Sevin- First pesticides really pose little threat to honeybees UNLESS they are foraging the plants for nectar. pollen or dew in dry periods The most dangerous formulations to bees are dusts, wettable powders, flowable liquids and finally emusifable liquids in that order Dust formulations are purposely milled to a coarse size ~ 50 microns to reduce drift and to enhance foliar deposition and 50 microns is the approximate size of many pollen grains and are readily picked up on the bees pollen baskets, Wettable powders are somewhat finer ~ 10-20 microns and transport is somewhat reduced, especially if using Newfilm 17 sticker The flowable liquids are ~ 2-5 microns and many have sophisticated stickers such as Sevin XLR Plus which bind Sevin to the foliage making it much less available to the bees and will extend rainfastness through one inch of rain. Emulsifiable concentrates are soluabilized in a solvent to the molecular level causing them to bind tightly to the foliage making pollen basket transport almost impossible. Bottom line Do not spray when bees are working the crop OR weeds Do not use dust formulations when bees are working the crop If you use Sevin, use the XLR Plus formulation Sevin is NOT the only insecticide that will track back to the colony causing brood kill from contaminated pollen IF YOU MUST APPLY A PESTICIDE ON A BLOOMING CROP SPRAY BEFORE 8 IN THE AM OR LATE IN THE DAY AFTER THE BEES ARE BACK IN THE HIVE. USE A QUICK KNOCKDOWN PESTICIDE SUCH A PYRETHROID, MALATHION, LANNATE as they will kill field bees BUT they will not contaminate the hive where the most damage will occur. Dan Veilleux Boone area In the Mountains of NC :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2005 22:41:17 -0300 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Eunice Wonnacott Subject: Re: Sevin & honey bees. MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=response Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT I always deliberately avoided any use of this and similar chemicals in my garden, since the bees worked it for pollen as well. It is possible to avoid chemical insecticide measures on small areas. Huge fields would present an different problem, of course EDW > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 6 Jul 2005 07:31:37 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Gauthier Buddy Subject: Re: Get swarm out of a drum? Comments: To: waldig@netzero.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable No, I couldn't save the comb or the brood, which was a shame. I had no way to open the barrel up without destroying it. That was the whole problem. I was trying to keep the barrel in tact. That's why if there was just one hole for the bees to go in and out, the best way would have been to put the "one-way bee gate" at the entrance/exit and wait for them to move. Buddy Gauthier=20 Thibodaux LA :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 6 Jul 2005 11:08:56 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Mike Randell Subject: Re: Section Honey Prices A very interesting discussion of section prices. I have a few hundred of the old style section honey boxes- that use the 4" X 5" basswood section, and produce a couple cases of sections a year. I am running out of the basswood sections, and can't find a new supplier. Does anyone know of a supplier of 4" X 5" basswood secton strips? Not the Kelly beeway section, which is smaller, but the larger 4X5, that used to be called a one pound section (although they run a little more when properly full). Thanks in advance. Mike Randell Vernon, BC, Canada where the honey flow is finally under way. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 6 Jul 2005 09:38:03 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Dan & Jan Subject: Re: Sevin & honey bees. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sevin does have a residue and I would consider the honey etc as contaminated Dan Veilleux Boone area In the Mountains of NC :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 6 Jul 2005 16:19:56 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Randy Mellberg Organization: Missaukee Conservation District Subject: New to the world of beekeeping MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit New to beekeeping...I have spent a lot of time with the books......information overload. 1. Can't seem to find information on what type of paint or stain two buy. Some books talk about using paints that allow the wood to breathe. Would like to know what product (Name Brand) Paint or stain I should use. Time is an issue do to issue #2 2. I bought a hive from a local beekeeper, came with two deep supers(broud chambers/excluder and a shallow super, ready to go with all the fixins.........I bought an extra super with frames that had comb on them. After a day of being on our homestead.....I placed the extra super on the hive. I checked (2 weeks) later and the extra shallow super I place on top is full of honey not yet capped. Not a bad thing....I have two new deep body supers and one new shallow super with frames and foundation but comb is not drawn out.... I do not want to create a problem by placing a deep super on top of the brood chambers and have the workers completely use up the honey reserve to produce comb. I can't seem to find any resources that say exactly how to draw out the comb with out depleting the honey reserves. I'm not interested in lot of honey production..and realize that there is a trade off in honey production or making bees.....but would like to build on what I have to about 4 or 5 hives, before we start taking any honey.........I want to get stuff inline for a split but only have frames with foundation. Any help would be great. Thanks ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Randy :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 7 Jul 2005 00:52:28 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Scot Mc Pherson Subject: Iowa Beekeeping Comments: To: beekeeping@yahoogroups.com, Organicbeekeepers@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Can anyone in/near the quad city area of iowa tell me about the beekeeping climate there? -- Scot Mc Pherson The Mc Pherson Family Honey Farms Bradenton, FL USA http://beewiki.linuxfromscratch.org http://groups.yahoo.com/groups/OrganicBeekeepers/ mailto:scot@linuxfromscratch.org . ` , ` ' .,';`,. ``. '. _/^\_ :;.,';`'.,` `., ' '`, /_____\ .:.,"'` /\_____/\ .,:`'" \###/.,';` :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 7 Jul 2005 14:11:53 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Jerry Hathaway <4thebees@MCHSI.COM> Subject: Re: Iowa Beekeeping In-Reply-To: <000101c582af$b12be9e0$94fbf704@workstation> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I am a hobby beekeeper on the Illinois side of the Quad Cities (Geneseo). I have 5 hives and have averaged about 100 LB per hive over the last few years. This year the weather is pretty dry so far, but the bees are still filling supers. Further west (Iowa City) it is not as dry this year so they should be doing better then us. We can get as cold as 20 below in the winter and as hot as 100 in the summer. Last winter I don't think we went below 0 for more then a day and the bees had several good flight days during most winter months. Hope this answers your questions. If not, let me know what information you are looking for. Jerry Hathaway 4thebees@mchsi.com :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Jul 2005 08:47:58 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Mike Stoops Subject: Re: Price Check In-Reply-To: <200507080401.j6840Yh9018630@listserv.albany.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Fellow Beekeepers, Just endured the passage of Hurricane Dennis. Will be going out shortly to check damage, if any. Would like a price check on regular gas prices for the past week from your area. Just before Dennis arrived our prices jumped ten cents a gallon. I'd like to see if the same thing happened in your area so as to check for price gouging. If you respond to this post, would like to know your area (city & state) and any price changes for the past week ( July 3 through July 10). Please, don't muck up this forum with responses. Send response directly to me at . Thanks in advance for any responses. Mike Stoops Located 1/2 way between Mobile and Montgomery, Alabama and within ten miles of the passage of Dennis's eye. ____________________________________________________ Sell on Yahoo! Auctions – no fees. Bid on great items. http://auctions.yahoo.com/ :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 10:05:12 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Aaron Morris Subject: Successful sideline MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi all, I am preparing a presentation on growing from a hobby to a successful sideline beekeeping operation. The most important consideration in my estimate is that as one grows their operation, TIME becomes one's most valuable asset. Certainly there are other considerations, but as I look at things, one must budget their time more efficiently to run a couple hundred colonies, whereas when one runs tens, time isn't a consideration (although it should be). I remember the days of running 6 or 10 hives, when I could leisurely examine all the frames of every colony and still have time for the drive in on a warm summer night. Now I examine colonies thoroughly two or three times in the spring and pretty much go by bottom board activity to choose the colonies to examine during the production season, and the last drive in movie I saw was Casablanca! TIME indeed becomes a precious commodity. But I digress. I'm asking of the list for input on important considerations as one grows from a hobby to a sideline business. Locations, locations, locations! What are you going to do with all that honey? Marketing. Equipment, new vs. used. Getting bees. There's more than honey production. Better tools for increased production. Hired help. Tax tips. And that last word (tips) is my biggest interest. What tips should be passed on to the hobbyist considering growing their operation to a successful sideline business? Thanks in advance for your input. Sincerely, Aaron Morris, successful (?) sideliner :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 11:27:57 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Nathan Lawrence Subject: Maxant 1400 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v618) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Does anyone know where I can buy a Maxant 1400 extractor? I don't know of anyone who has one in stock, and the waiting list is 3-4 months. I would buy new or used. THanks. --Nathan Lawrence :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 11:36:19 -0400 Reply-To: Lloyd Spear Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Lloyd Spear Subject: Successful sideline Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sounds as if Aaron has quite a topic! One of the Dadant branch managers last week told me that 'pre-varroa' they could count on a certain progression of some beekeepers from hobbyist to sideliner, but that (for them) is not in the past. Their experience is that hobbyists last 3-5 years, get discouraged and run out of money, and give it up entirely! But that was a digression...what is a sideliner? I used to be told that the consensus was 200 hives and 'commercial' was 500 hives. Under 200 was still hobbyist. Sideliner, it was explained to me, meant that a 'substantial' portion of one's income came from beekeeping, 'and that wasn't possible with fewer than 200 hives'. What say you all? Can one consistently have $10,000 net cash flow with 200 hives? With 100 hives? How about $5,000? -- Lloyd Spear Owner Ross Rounds, Inc. Manufacture of equipment for round comb honey sections, Sundance Pollen Traps, and producer of Sundance custom labels. Contact your dealer or www.RossRounds.com :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 18:32:35 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Tim Vaughan Subject: Re: Successful sideline I also think the hours of study and experience are the most valuable thing one can have. But as to specifics, with me one of the nicest things is that keeping bees and landscaping help each other, so I would encourage people thinking about this to try to look to see how bees could complement what they are already doing. I need a truck to go to both jobs, for instance, so that's an expensive piece of equipment that I have anyway. Lots of my landscape customers ask me to bring a bottle of honey with me, so that's time and gas I don't have to spend. If I get a call to fix someones sprinklers next to an apiary, I can work the hives then, and that saves more time and gas. As to how much a hobby/sideliner can make, I imagine it's all over the map. For me, I keep money from honey, pollination, killing yellow-jackets etc.. in a separate account, so I've a good idea of what I really make. For me at 100 (more or less) hives last year income was 11000 dollars. Minus depreciation and 5.5% interest from my homeowners line of credit on the 17 thousand dollars I spent 5 years ago to build up from a couple hives (I somewhat arbitrarily funded one truck from the bee money) I recon I made about 8 thousand dollars. That works out to about 15 bucks per hour, which wouldn't allow one to even rent a house on the Central Coast here, let alone eat three meals per day. But since I can do it when the contracting is slow, and since I get lots of contracting work in the course of working with the bees, and since I love it, it 's worth doing, and I think fair to say profitable. At least it's a welcome break from digging irrigation trenches all day. Oh, and honey money is usually cash! :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 16:42:06 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Grant Gillard Subject: Re: Successful sideline In-Reply-To: <9D95C2906FCCE04F836ECA17C4CE09210C8FF5@UAEXCH.univ.albany.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit My thoughts on moving from hobby beekeeping to sideliner: I'm headed in the direction of a sideliner, though at present I'm only at 60-some hives. 200 hives seems a long way off. One thing I miss is the leisurely time spent actually observing colonies frame by frame. I also wrestle with the time required to let go fo the phone, get up from the computer, get out and visit the yards. I find I need to "make" the time instead of trying to "take" the time. The weather is always something to work around as my time seems to be fairly unencumbered on rainy, windy days. Location: I've got bee yards set up within 30 minutes of my home. I had some 1 hour away, but that was too much of an obstacle to overcome, mostly a mental obstacle of getting in the car rather than a physical obstacle of actually driving the car. I have my yards "linked" to major highways that allow me to take an afternoon and visit all the "north" hives (four locations), and on another day visit the "south" hives (one location), and the "west" (two locations). Box sizes: As I've purchased a bunch of used equipment, I have several different sizes of hive bodies and frames. I've made it a point to limit cetain yards to only medium supers and keep my home yards in shallow supers. I would do best to make all my yards uniform, but I have the equipment and it's still in great shape. Equipment: I keep everything I need (smoker, fuel, lighter, veil, hive tool, etc.) together in a "traveling" box. Too often a piece of equipment was left behind at the last yard, or completely forgotten back at the home yard or garage. Most of my yards do not have any storage so everything I need must be brought with me, and since I often visit yards at a moment's notice (as my schedule allows), I need to be ready to go and have everything ready. I have one central storage shed at my home yard. Number of hives per yard: In the expansion process, I find I need enough hives at each location to justify the visit. Still, I don't have 30 hives to establish a new yard, so some of my yards have only six hives, but my goal will be twenty hives per yard as I expand. I'm always looking for new yards, but access to some of these yards is an issue (farm gates, low water bridges). Rate of expansion: In a previous lifetime, I was a debt-slave. Sure, you can borrow and pay the interest, but having been down that road, I'm now a pay-as-you-go type beekeeper. I've made a bunch of equipment on my table saw from used shelving lumber. I trap swarms rather than buy packages. I'm learning to raise my own queens. I buy used equipment when it turns up at reasonable prices. Hired Help: I have yet to hire any help. With a flexible schedule, I'm often going out to bee yards with little notice. Scheduling help to fit my chaotic schedule, which often changes at a moment's notice and greatly subject to change, is too much for me to embrace. I'm a one man operation. Marketing: I've moved from selling out of my driveway to two farmer's markets, to wholesale sales in retail stores. I pack my own honey, and demand is such that I buy bulk honey to repack from other producers to consistently supply the retail stores. Intermitent supplies do not engender a store manager's confidence. I hope to grow into selling only my own honey, but for me, I need to insure the market is ready to absorb my production. I've been at the place with a bunch of honey and no sales income to service the debt. I also find that when I'm with my bees, I'm in the proverbial "land that time forgot." I never seem to have enough time when I'm in my yards, and either family responsibilities call or sundown tells me my time is up. Good luck with your talk, Grant --------------------------------- Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2005 01:14:55 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: bob darrell Subject: Re: Successful sideline In-Reply-To: <20050712234206.63248.qmail@web33003.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v728) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Jul 12, 2005, at 7:42 PM, Grant Gillard wrote: > My thoughts on moving from hobby beekeeping to sideliner: > > I'm headed in the direction of a sideliner, though at present I'm > only at 60-some hives. 200 hives seems a long way off. Hmmmm!!! How do you determine the boundary between hobby beekeeping and sideliner? Do you use $$$$s earned, #####s produced, or number of colonies? I am retired, does that make me a full time beekeeper? (my wife thinks I spend too much time with the bees). I have kept bees for over 30 years with as many as 20 colonies and as few as 3. My production has never exceeded 2000 lbs. I likely produced 2000 lbs with the 20 colonies but 2 years ago produced 1000 lbs with 4 colonies. I got tired of colonies that would be OK if I just gave them time. Why keep colonies that produce 50 lbs or less when hives in the same yard produce 300 lbs I thought. Quality queen-stock from a reputable breeder is the answer. I sell all my honey at the end of the driveway. I live in an area that attracts tourists, especially in the autumn. I have sold $3500 - $4000 in liquid and comb honey each year for the last 3 years with a maximum of 6 colonies and always run out of honey before I run out of customers. I don't know how much honey I can sell here before I have to try additional marketing approaches, but hope that the splitting I did this spring will bring me close to $10000 from 16 colonies. $10000 is not enough to live on but is a substantial portion of the pension we are living on. Does this make me a sideliner? Bob Darrell Caledon, Ontario Canada 80W44N PS Anyone going to Apimondia in Dublin Ireland? Maybe we can meet for a pint :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2005 08:22:30 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Aaron Morris Subject: Re: Maxant 1400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit A quick google search for Maxant 1400: http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rls=RNWE,RNWE:2005-04,RNWE:en&q=Maxant+1400 lists models available at Betterbee (I did not call to see if they have one in stock), a used one for $500 in New Mexico, plus a few other catalog listings. You also might try some of the used beekeeping equipment services. http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&rls=RNWE,RNWE:2005-04,RNWE:en&q=used+beekeeping+equipment&spell=1 Watch the wrod wrap on quoted urls. Both urls should be a single line only. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2005 21:56:36 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Michael Palmer Subject: Honey Bee Anatomy Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-7FA9441B Today, I was installing queens from a batch I harvested from my mating nucs. I was removing the attendants...I'm an attendant remover...when I noticed a hair thin piece of string in one of the cage screens. When I attempted to remove it, I saw it was attached to the queen. The only way to remove the string, was to remove the queen from her cage. The screen was lifted off. The string, which at first I thought was merely caught on her leg, was firmly wound around her...I'll call it her waist. Holding her in my left hand, I surgically removed the string...which actually took me 10 minutes. I was finally able to open a loop in the string, and cut it against my thumb nail with my trusty "Old Timer." Odd. I haven't a clue as to where the string came from. I caged the queen, and added the attendants. No string at that point. When trying to describe, to my assistant, where the string was attached...I could only come up with "waist." Looking in my bee books...even though they have labeled drawings of bee anatomy, neither named the location. What is the name of the connection between the thorax, and the abdomen? Mike -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 267.8.11/44 - Release Date: 7/8/2005 :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Jul 2005 09:03:54 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Dave Cushman Subject: Re: Honey Bee Anatomy In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20050713214234.039b41f8@pop.together.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Mike & all > have labeled drawings of bee anatomy, neither named the location. What is > the name of the connection between the thorax, and the abdomen? Propodeum Regards & Best 73s, Dave Cushman, G8MZY http://website.lineone.net/~dave.cushman or http://www.dave-cushman.net Fall Back M/c, Build 5.02 (stable) :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Jul 2005 09:55:19 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter Edwards Subject: Re: Honey Bee Anatomy MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mike asked: > What is the name of the connection between the thorax, and the abdomen? The petiole. It is formed by the first abdominal segment, the propodeum, which actually forms part of the thorax. Peter Edwards beekeepers@stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2005 19:34:39 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Dick Allen Subject: Re: Honey Bee Anatomy In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20050713214234.039b41f8@pop.together.net> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >What is the name of the connection between the thorax, and the abdomen? Isn’t that called the petiole or sometimes called the pedicel? Regards, Dick Allen :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Jul 2005 05:26:40 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Harrison Subject: Re: Successful sideline MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Aaron asks: And that last word (tips) is my biggest interest. What tips should be passed on to the hobbyist considering growing their operation to a successful sideline business? Would take a couple posts on (tips) and right now is my busy time of the year so simply not possible for me. 1. The rules which apply to all small business also apply to beekeeping. The business has to be sustainable. Or supported by outside the business money. 2. Aaron said *grow* into a larger operation. Really is best but not the trend today. Many are jumping in without the beekeeping knowledge and paying a steep price. If they have got the determination to make a go then a few survive. However the expense and long term toll of not having free time takes a toll. Worry & stress! Small sideline is profitable for those willing to spend the time and establish a niche market but those markets take time to establish. 3. Commercial will kill you without proper equipment. The best example I give is from high school. The first year of woodworking you can only use hand tools. The second year you can use power tools. I still remember my first year project cut with a hand saw and sanded by hand. Looked OK but the amount of time involved! Time savers and back savers are the key but equipment puts your first year in the black farther away and can cause many a beekeeper to fail. The most important consideration today for profitability in beekeeping is being able to keep alive strong and healthy colonies of bees. I would say at least fifty percent of sideline beekeepers depend on larger beekeepers for their part of their honey . A love of beekeeping has to be a requirement. If you get bigger solely for the money you will never be happy in my opinion. I have advised many a beekeeper over the years. I always tell tells things as I see things and not what they want to hear. Always remember your friends will be positive until you ask for an honest opinion. For many getting a small business into the black never comes. Very few make a successful attempt at sideline & especially commercial beekeeping if they consider sustainability. Sideline you can grow into but starting out at the commercial level you need a mentor if you don't want to make costly mistakes. Buying a running business after looking over the books and getting the former owner to work with you for the first year works best for commercial. Bob :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Jul 2005 06:50:06 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Pat Subject: Re: Honey Bee Anatomy In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20050713214234.039b41f8@pop.together.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Michael Palmer wrote: > When trying to describe, to my assistant, where the string was > attached...I > could only come up with "waist." Looking in my bee books...even though > they > have labeled drawings of bee anatomy, neither named the location. What is > the name of the connection between the thorax, and the abdomen? > Mike > The first abdominal segment is the propodeum. I can't find a better description of the "waist". Patrick :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Jul 2005 10:44:51 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Rosalind James Subject: Honey Bee Anatomy A bees waist: You could say the string was wrapped between the thorax and the abdomen. If you wanted to be more technical, you could say it was wrapped around the "propodium". I am sure that if you had said that, your worker would have known exactly what you meant! --Rosalind James :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Jul 2005 15:01:27 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: CSlade777@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Apimondia MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 14/07/2005 05:02:22 GMT Standard Time, LISTSERV@listserv.albany.edu writes: > Bob Darrell > Caledon, Ontario > Canada > 80W44N > PS Anyone going to Apimondia in Dublin Ireland? Maybe we can meet > for a pint > > I shall be going and am happy to meet anybody for a pint. I understand the US pint gives short measure, 16 ounces instead of 20 in Ireland and UK, which causes confusion whan exchanging recipes for syrup for bee feed etc. How big is a Canadian pint? Chris :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Jul 2005 15:37:03 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "Medhat Nasr, Ph. D." Subject: Re: Honey Bee Anatomy In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20050713214234.039b41f8@pop.together.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Mike asked: What is name of the connection between the thorax, and the abdomen? Simply, It is called petiole or propodium. Propodium is a Latin word that means front of the abdomen. Medhat Medhat Nasr, Ph. D. Provincial Apiculturist Crop Diversification Centre North 17507 Fort Road Edmonton, AB, Canada T5Y 6H3 Tel: (780) 415-2314 Fax: (780) 422-6096 Mailto:medhat.nasr@gov.ab.ca :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Jul 2005 21:54:36 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: bob darrell Subject: Re: Apimondia In-Reply-To: <127.602e4bd6.30081087@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v728) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Jul 14, 2005, at 3:01 PM, CSlade777@AOL.COM wrote: >> > I shall be going and am happy to meet anybody for a pint. I > understand the > US pint gives short measure, 16 ounces instead of 20 in Ireland and > UK, which > causes confusion whan exchanging recipes for syrup for bee feed > etc. How big > is a Canadian pint? > Hi Chris and all In the past, Canada used imperial measure and our pint was 20 oz like yours. We are now metric and therefore get our beer served in various sized glasses. An interesting fact is that a US ounce is bigger than ours. Beer cans used in Canada are 12US oz(355ml) whereas reusable returnable beer bottles are 12Imp oz(341ml). See you in Dublin Bob Darrell Caledon Ontario Canada 80W44N :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 09:29:07 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Dave Cushman Subject: Re: Apimondia In-Reply-To: <60496FFA-01CF-4670-A2A6-EB83FC5894C3@interlog.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all Chris & Bob Darrell, have organised a meet at Apimondia, I will be there and willing to 'chew the fat' over a large bottle of Guinness. I would be pleased to meet up with a few names from this list, because although I know a few of you quite well via the medium of Email, I have only ever met a handful of the non-UK subscribers. But before Apimondia, we have a very important gathering in Gormanston, Ireland (a few miles north of Dublin) The program of lectures and workshops runs from MONDAY JULY 25th TO SATURDAY JULY 30th (inclusive). Bookings can be made up to 22nd July, and you will be surprised at how inexpensive your weeks stay will be. Various types of Guinness will also be on hand, and conversation about bees in large measure.... It not too late !! Regards & Best 73s, Dave Cushman, G8MZY http://website.lineone.net/~dave.cushman or http://www.dave-cushman.net Fall Back M/c, Build 5.02 (stable) :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 10:38:09 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: John Howe Subject: Re: Apimondia MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Cushman" To: Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 4:29 AM Subject: Re: [BEE-L] Apimondia > Hi all > > I will be there and willing to 'chew the fat' over a large bottle of > Guinness. > I won't be able to make it, but just want to say thgat it won't be a BOTTLE of Guiness. It's on draught there and MUCH better than the bottled brew, so enjoy! John Howe :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 12:17:13 -0300 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Eunice Wonnacott Subject: Re: Apimondia MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=response Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT In Canada, we will confuse you once more. We are on the metric system, by law, and any imports from other systems must include the metric measures or not be allowed to be imported!! Our 500 ml (half a liter, would be roughly the same as the US pint, Tthe liter,( 1000 millileters) roughly equates to your quart. 5 liters is roughly equivalent to one Imperial gallon, where 4 Imperial quarts make one Imperial gallon! Are you mixed up yet??? A chart would be easier to read, but not as much fun for your brain!! All the best Eunice > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 09:37:25 +1000 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: queenbee Subject: Re: Apimondia MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Chris & Bob Darrell, have organised a meet at Apimondia, I will be there > and > willing to 'chew the fat' over a large bottle of Guinness. Where is the meet? Trevor Weatherhead AUSTRALIA :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 22:17:37 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: bob darrell Subject: Re: Apimondia In-Reply-To: <003201c58996$2af07ab0$b453443d@new1> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v728) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Jul 15, 2005, at 7:37 PM, queenbee wrote: >> Chris & Bob Darrell, have organised a meet at Apimondia, I will be >> there >> and >> willing to 'chew the fat' over a large bottle of Guinness. >> > > Where is the meet? > > Trevor Weatherhead > AUSTRALIA My son lives in Dublin, but on the North side so I dont know any good spots near RDS. Any suggestions? Maybe Tom Barrett is reading! Bob Darrell :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 04:34:22 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: CSlade777@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Apimondia MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 16/07/2005 05:04:07 GMT Standard Time, LISTSERV@listserv.albany.edu writes: > >Chris &Bob Darrell, have organised a meet at Apimondia, I will be there > >and > >willing to 'chew the fat' over a large bottle of Guinness. > > Where is the meet? > > Trevor Weatherhead > Dunno. We need guidance from a local as to a good watering hole. I am sure somebody will tell us. I am with Dave on the subject of Guinness. The bottled variety still having some yeast has more vitamins and an extra edge to its flavour and the draught is bland by comparison. We can do blind tastings if you like. Chris :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 11:00:57 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Dave Cushman Subject: Re: Apimondia In-Reply-To: <003201c58996$2af07ab0$b453443d@new1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Trevor > Where is the meet? A simple question that I cannot answer yet... I will be able to find you on the Apimondia 2007 stand. I will be around in several guises, I have been asked to help out on a number of stands... I am fairly large and bespectacled, with short cropped hair and a slow walk, I go by the nickname of 'fat and ugly' but if you find someone that fits the description it may not always be me :-) I can be seen on... http://www.dave-cushman.net/bee/newhome.html but the picture is a couple of years old and I am now sporting facial hair of the white mutton chops variety. I am a BIBBA, GBBG and BIIG member and will be associated closely with any of their efforts... As my physical energy is limited I am likely to spend most afternoons on such stands and if manpower is short I may put on a green 'T' shirt and become an honorary Irishman on occasions. However anyone that is wearing a green Apimondia T shirt, should be able to point me out if asked, I will be pleased to meet any BEE-L subscribers, either in the hall or later for a drink. But I imagine that we will not find out what place suits us as a drinking establishment until we have travelled between our digs at UCD and the venue at RDS. Regards & Best 73s, Dave Cushman, G8MZY http://website.lineone.net/~dave.cushman or http://www.dave-cushman.net Fall Back M/c, Build 5.02 (stable) :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 09:40:00 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: John & Julie Mayer Subject: Comb Honey MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, I am a newbie and ignorant. Did I see in the recent discussion about comb honey that it should/could be stored in the freezer? Did I mis-understand that this will prevent it from granulating in the comb? That doesn't seem right ..... isn't it cold temperature that speeds up granulation? John Mayer West-Central Missouri :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 20:29:48 -0300 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Eunice Wonnacott Subject: Re: Comb Honey MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT I am not actually sure of the answer to storing comb honey in the freezer. However, I have been told that once it is removed and warmed to room temperature, the crystallization will then be greatly accelerated! EDW > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 20:30:28 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: George Fielder Subject: Re: Comb Honey MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Freezing comb is indeed a good way to keep it for longer periods. Not recommended for short term storage. Honey whether in comb or not granulates fastest at 14 degrees C. (57 degree F) yet very slowly at temperatures much above or below that point. Thus, for storage, the trick is to take the comb honey through that granulating point as fast as possible. For freezing that means a freezer as cold as possible and not too many comb in at a time. (Keep air space around the new comb and or place them directly on well frozen stuff in the freezer) Returning the comb to room temperature can often ruin it. It is just as important to warm fast as it is to cool fast. But a high temperature can melt the wax. I use a food dehydrator set at 130 to 140 deg. F. Once running for a while it blows air at about 130 deg. F which does a nice job of warming the comb honey up fast. The comb is in individual plastic boxes ready for market. I have been storing comb honey this way for a couple of decades. Most years I freeze several dozen boxes of individual comb chunks with good success. But Canola honey is a challenge. It likes to end up awfully thick - like "Molasses in January" which most customers do not like. Buckwheat honey thick like that really has people guessing!! Remember take the honey through the crystallisation point just as fast as possible! Good Luck George :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 21:02:52 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Aaron Morris Subject: Re: Comb Honey MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This message was originally submitted by kc4qn@NTELOS.NET to the BEE-L = list at LISTSERV.ALBANY.EDU. It was edited to remove quoted of previously = posted material. ----------------- Original message (ID=3DF352B7BB) (42 lines) = ------------------- Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 20:20:05 -0400 To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology = From: Mike Brumfield Subject: Re: [BEE-L] Comb Honey In-Reply-To: <01a801c58a14$852b65c0$42c84ad8@dec01gateway> References: <1ec.3f07a551.300a208e@aol.com> 01a801c58a14$852b65c0$42c84ad8@dec01gateway I keep some comb honey in the freezer. After a year in a deep freeze it sill looks like the day I took it off the hive. This also kills wax moth eggs which may be present in any honey. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 20:04:24 -0500 Reply-To: "E. Whalen-Pedersen" Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "E. Whalen-Pedersen" Subject: Honey Crystallization MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The NHB has a decent information sheet on honey crystallization: http://www.nhb.org/download/factsht/crystal.pdf To paraphrase -- - Below 50F retards crystallization. (Like freezing -- the best.) - 40F-70F can PROMOTE crystallization. - 70F-80F can delay crystallization but darkens/degrades honey. The other factors are the honey source, filtering, and moisture: - Some honeys crystallize more than others. - Unfiltered honey may crystallize faster. - Lower moisture may generally promote crystallization. Erik :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Jul 2005 12:39:10 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bill Mares Organization: Mares Apiaries Subject: Re: comb honey In-Reply-To: <200507170401.j6H400up020330@listserv.albany.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit At this moment I have 130 Ross Rounds stored in a freezer in my basement. As retail and wholesale orders come in, I take the combs out, let them thaw overnight and then deliver them to the customers. In ten years, I've never had a complaint about crystallization. -- Bill Mares/Mares Apiaries 429 S. Willard Street Burlington, VT 05401 (802) 863-4938 Bee Happy in Your Work! :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 06:40:01 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Andrew Dewey Subject: identifying bees carrying nectar MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Watching a busy hive yesterday afternoon it was easy to see bees returning to the hive with pollen. But I couldn't make out for certain any visual indications that the other returning bees were carrying nectar. The activity was fast paced, and I don't imagine the bees were just out for joy flights on what was a beautiful summer day. What does a nectar loaded bee look like? Regards, Andrew Dewey Southwest Harbor, Maine :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 07:13:53 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Rip Bechmann Subject: Re: comb honey MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I agree with the comments of Bill Mares and others regarding the storage of comb honey in freezers with the exception of the "quick reheating" advice. I have had no experience in that regard and have never had a "complaint about crystallization." The big point which has not been pointed out is the "weeping" that can occur on thawing. You should pack your comb honey in plastic "zip lock" freezer bags before freezing, excluding as much air as possible, preferably on a day with low relative humidity and as soon as possible after removing from the hive. When you need them, allow them to completely thaw at room temperature before opening the plastic bag. Thaw time will vary based on the number of units per bag and even singles should sit for at least 24 hours before opening. When you think they are ready, give them another "24". Preplanning your needs is a must. I sold off the back porch and packed in lots of six. When I was down to about two, or so, I took out another bag. Freezing to control wax moth and bee fly larvae is a must for a quality product. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 15:50:53 GMT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "waldig@netzero.com" Subject: Tree id. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain The other day, my wife and I watched a couple of yellow-blooming trees in the neighborhood being worked by numerous honey bees and bumble bees but can't figure out the trees' name. The trees are about 30-ft high and are similar to evodia (the bee bee tree) in shape and leaves except that the leaves' edges are a bit serrated. The blooms are small, bright yellow in conical clusters. The trees are blooming right now - 2nd half of July - in lower New York state (zone 7/8) when the nectar flow is practically over in this neck of the woods. Would anyone know the name of this ornamental tree? I'm thinking of planting 1 or 2. Also, is there more than one variety of the tulip tree? Thanks! Waldemar Long Island, NY :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 15:04:18 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: OhioBeeFarmer Subject: Re: comb honey MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit What is the standard size that most people cut their comb? I was looking at getting a cutter and containers and was wondering what size people use or sell the best. I know that there is a size that uses the most of your frame according to the size of the frame shallow or medium.. not sure which. Also, I've seen three ways to cut comb with a knife and box looking cutter and a box looking cutter with a push out on it. What do most folks use? Many Thanks Bob ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rip Bechmann" To: Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 7:13 AM Subject: Re: [BEE-L] comb honey > > Freezing to control wax moth and bee fly larvae is a must for a quality > product. > > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: > -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 15:27:19 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "J. Waggle" Subject: Re: Tree id. In-Reply-To: <20050718.085122.13621.29463@webmail06.nyc.untd.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit --- "waldig@netzero.com" wrote: > ....The blooms are small, bright yellow in conical clusters.... Need more info, flowers pointing up, or down? Are you sure flowers conical shape? Planted in front yards and around town right? Did it start blooming maybe late first or second week in July? Best Wishes, Joe ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 20:39:01 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Aaron Morris Subject: Re: BEE-L: approval required (E5606A07) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This message was originally submitted by gfcg7312003@YAHOO.COM to the = BEE-L list at LISTSERV.ALBANY.EDU. Ir was edited to remove quotes of = previously posted material. ----------------- Original message (ID=3DE5606A07) (70 lines) = ------------------- Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 15:41:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Grant Gillard Subject: Re: [BEE-L] comb honey To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology = In-Reply-To: My biggest seller is cut comb in a wide-mouth pint jar, surrounded with = honey. Yes, this isn't really comb honey, but I use a shallow frame, = and cutting it just wide enough to fit into a wide-mouth pint jar will = give me seven sections of comb, each just the right height for the jar. I've also used clear boxes and clam shells from Kelley's, which yeilds = four sections per shallow frame. I also do Ross Rounds, Kelley's = section boxes, Bee-o-pac and Hogg Half-cassettes. People are funny and = will buy one over another for no apparent reason. Having tried those "cutters," it is my humble opinion (and I'm only one = voice) that says they are better "mashers" than cutters. I used mine = for a while as a pattern. A good, sharp knife (not serrated) works = sooooo much better, but this is just my experience and my opinion. = You're more than free to disagree. If you can make them work, more = power to you! Grant OhioBeeFarmer wrote: ... I was looking at getting a cutter and containers and was wondering what size people use = or sell the best.=20 :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 21:43:03 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Michael Palmer Subject: Re: comb honey In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-55F832A9 > What is the standard size... >there is a size that uses the most of your >frame according to the size of the frame > Use a thin top bar shallow frame. Either a grooved top bar, or a slotted top bar. I like slotted, as the foundation is easier to install, the grooved gives a straighter comb, but foundation must be glued in with melted beeswax. Kelley has slotted thin top bar frames. Wedge top bars don't give a wide enough comb to fill the 4 1/8 square cut comb container. Medium frames are wastful. Install foundation 3/8" from bottom bar. If you install full sheet, it will sag when drawn, and will give a curved comb. Cut the comb 4 1/8 x 4 1/8. I use two sharp, serrated knives. They follow the edge of the frame, without cutting in. Place them in a pan of hot water on a hot plate. Use one for a few cuts, and switch. Keep the knives hot. Mike -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 267.8.16/50 - Release Date: 7/15/2005 :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 22:04:37 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Robert Barnett Subject: Re: Tree id. In-Reply-To: <20050718.085122.13621.29463@webmail06.nyc.untd.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v733) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Try this for tree ID: Golden Rain Tree Blooms in Alabama Mid-Late June (From June 6 to last of Julycountry wide according my information). Please see: http://www.colostate.edu/Depts/CoopExt/4DMG/Trees/golden.htm On Jul 18, 2005, at 3:50 PM, waldig@netzero.com wrote: > a couple of yellow-blooming trees. honey bees and bumble bees but > can't figure out the trees' name. > Also, is there more than one variety of the tulip tree? Only one that I know of here in Alabama. > Waldemar > Long Island, NY > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2005 07:41:45 -0400 Reply-To: Lloyd Spear Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Lloyd Spear Subject: Re: comb honey Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Please DO NOT use one of the 'cutters' shaped like a four-inch square. In fact, these are improperly described in catalogs as 'cutters'. Instead, they are 'crushers', ruining the appearance of what cost you and your bees so much effort to produce. Instead, use on of these 'crushers' to very lightly mark the comb. Then take as sharp a knife as you can get and cut along these marks. This will produce sharp delinations of the cells and be very attractive in a package. All dealers sell square 4" clear rigid boxes for cut comb. Unfortunately, they now cost $.75 to $.90 each. Please use these and not the cheap (not inexpensive, but CHEAP) 'meat trays' being sold that have a clear (flexible) top and an opaque bottom. Again, these give an image of CHEAP to the consumer rather than the image of one of nature's finest products! Lloyd -- Lloyd Spear Owner Ross Rounds, Inc. Manufacture of equipment for round comb honey sections, Sundance Pollen Traps, and producer of Sundance custom labels. Contact your dealer or www.RossRounds.com :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2005 12:46:26 GMT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "waldig@netzero.com" Subject: Re: Tree id. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Joe and others, Thank you all for your help. A friend pointed out that's probably a Golden Raintree (Koelreuteria paniculata). I looked up pictures on the net that he recommended (http://www.cnr.vt.edu/dendro/dendrology/syllabus/factsheet.cfm?ID=296 ) and it looks like a good match. Another web site says this plant yields 100-200 kg/ha when there are very few other blooms for bees to forage. Definitely, a good choice for the ornamental suburban garden/yard. Regards, Waldemar Long Island, NY :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2005 13:05:04 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "J. Waggle" Subject: Re: Tree id. In-Reply-To: <20050718.085122.13621.29463@webmail06.nyc.untd.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Glad you successfully ID'd your tree. > > Also, is there more than one variety of the tulip > tree? > Yellow Popular (Liriodendron tulipiferais) Aka, Tulip Tree, Tulip Popular is a member of the Magnolia family. Some of the Magnolias will have the large solitary upright 6 petal flower similar to the Tulip Tree flower. Magnolias provide good forage for bees and food for wildlife. Cucumbertree (Magnolia acuminata) Aka - Cucumber Magnolia, Giant Magnolia, Mountain Magnolia, Yellow-Flower Magnolia, Yellow Cucumbertree, Native, a fast growing stately shade tree with branches that spread out more than the Yellow Popular. Grows 60 - 80", almost as tall as the Yellow Popular, with a flower that I think looks near identical to the Tulip Tree flower. The tree resembles so closely to the Yellow Popular tree in growth, that the wood is often marked as such by the logging companies. Seeds are eaten by birds and other wildlife. Sweetbay (Magnolia Virginiana L.) Range includes Long Island. Native, generally grows 20 - 40". Good ornamental tree, patio tree or small yard. The flowers looks to be different than the tulip with 9 to 12 petals, Host plant for swallow tail butterflies, Seeds eaten by birds. To my knowledge, the rest of the Magnolias grow in the more southerly areas, medium to small size trees, and a few are almost evergreens, should grow fine in Long Island. Just check any nursury, any Magnolia you choose will be related to the Tulip Tree and will provide good forage for bees and food for wildlife. Best Wishes, ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2005 17:57:18 -0400 Reply-To: Lloyd Spear Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Lloyd Spear Subject: comb honey Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Mike Palmer is twice the beekeeper I will ever be...that tends to happen when you must support a family from beekeeping...and his points on using the slotted bar are exactly right. (I use them also.) But... One does not have to melt the comb in! I raise the comb just enough so about 1/4" shows ABOVE the top bar. Then I fold the 1/4" over so it is at 90 degrees to the comb inside the frame. THEN I put three staples in the top to hold the slots firmly together. The staples plus the folding amount to wearing both a belt and suspenders...but it is a lot better than having the comb break loose. Mike is also correct about having the pan of very hot water and rotating the knives used to cut the comb. I forgot that. I produce a lot of cut comb, this year about 50 supers. I use it all for chunk honey. But all beekeepers can surely see (from this discussion) that it is a LOT of work. You know what is coming...if you are selling your cut comb as comb honey (in boxes), you should save yourself an awful lot of work by producing Ross Rounds instead! Advantages: Comb never falls out of frames; no cleaning of frames before reloading; no cutting, no draining, and no leaking once in consumer packages. And Ross Rounds shares with cut comb the tremendous advantage of using 'real beeswax' as foundation, instead of plastic or plastic coated with beeswax. This year I am wholesaling 8-ounce Ross Rounds sections for $4.00 each and they are retailing for $6.00-$8.50 in most stands. But I know one merchant retailing them for $13 and another for $15! If you are selling your cut comb in boxes, try RR next year. I predict you will never go back. Lloyd -- Lloyd Spear Owner Ross Rounds, Inc. Manufacture of equipment for round comb honey sections, Sundance Pollen Traps, and producer of Sundance custom labels. Contact your dealer or www.RossRounds.com :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 18:56:33 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bill Ruzicka Subject: New Varroa Research MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Below is a very exciting abstract of research that has been done in the Canary Islands with formic acid. You can access the entire paper through the following link: http://www.mitegone.com/forms/Fleitas%20Rodriguez%20Corbera%20Research.pdf I think the most interesting finding of this research is that with substances like formic acid being used to treat the Varroa, judging the treatment by doing tests immediately before, during, and after the treatment may not be the best way to evaluate the efficacy of such a treatment. Measuring the levels of mites before the treatment in the fall and in the spring may be the better way. In the Canary Islands’ tests, the immediate application drops showed relatively low multiples; almost suggesting a low efficacy of treatment. However, hives with high mite populations in the fall, (drops of hundreds) were found in the spring with drops of only a few mites reaching a 90-95% reduction of the mite population since the fall treatment. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - SCIENTIFIC ASSAYS ABOUT MITEGONE METHOD TM (Varroa destructor ORGANIC TREATMENT). GRAN CANARIA ISLAND. SPAIN. By: Fleitas, J.L. *; Rodriguez, A.B.; De la Fe, C; Corbera, A.S. . Author Address: JUAN LUIS FLEITAS RAMÓN. VETERINARIO. TFNO: +34 687 311 429. E-MAIL: jfleitas@becarios.ulpgc.es ABSTRACT: Varroa destructor is the most serious sanitary problem of the professional apian world. Varroa destructor has built up resistance to traditional chemical pesticides. This resistance has created a very dangerous situation; beekeepers are now seeking alternative organic and natural substance solutions to these problems. Natural substance treatments have several advantages as they are less costly, do not leave residues in hives, which is ideal for organic honey production, and do not build resistance in Varroa; however, these treatments have several problems: they are often more complicated in application and have a much lower efficacy than chemical pesticides. MiteGone is an application method that uses formic acid, an organic treatment that was designed by Bill Ruzicka of Mitegone Enterprises Inc., in Canada. The scientific research that follows examines this method in an apiary of Gran Canaria (Canary Islands) that has severe Varroa destructor infection and very bad sanitary status (PMS, chalk brood, and deformed wing virus). We have done Natural drop and MiteGone drop (after treatment) of Varroa to identify the infection level of the apiary and the evolution of this level after the application of the Mitegone treatment. Our results show that if the MiteGone method is used following the maker’s instructions and the MiteGone dose tables for Spain (designed by H&T SL Enterprises), this type of treatment can achieve very high efficacy against Varroa infection (between 90-100%) and greatly improve the sanitary status for the apiary. In our research, after the Mitegone treatment, the putrid brood and chalk brood signs disappeared. Also the colonies increased in strength. Our conclusions show that the MiteGone method is an easy application method for formic acid. The treatment is less expensive than chemical pesticides, has high efficacy levels, and helps to improve the general sanitary status of the colonies and the apiary; therefore, using the MiteGone applicator and formic acid is a serious alternative treatment for Varroa control. Chemical pesticides cannot do all of this; they can only kill the mite. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2005 07:26:46 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter Edwards Subject: Re: New Varroa Research MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is a very odd paper. It gives the appearance of being a scientific paper, but does not indicate the status of the authors and uses some very peculiar terms and spelling: 'tratment', 'putrid brood', 'macroscopically study', 'foretic', 'grave', 'varroas', 'economic looses', 'mycosis', 'nosoema'. Peter Edwards beekeepers@stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2005 08:03:30 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Aaron Morris Subject: Re: comb honey MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit > This message was originally submitted by > OhioBeeFarmer@HOTMAIL.COM to the BEE-L > list at LISTSERV.ALBANY.EDU. It was edited to remove > quotes of previously posted material. > > ----------------- Original message (ID=052E728F) (61 lines) > ------------------- > From: "OhioBeeFarmer" > To: > References: > Subject: Re: [BEE-L] comb honey > Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2005 07:51:28 -0400 > > I also have been using the RR for years and this year didn't > have enough > boxes to do what I wanted to do so I tried a different > method. The only > problem I have found with my RR is that when separating the > sides, the comb > gets stuck to one side and rips off the comb making it not > useable for comb > as it would leak out of the side that is damaged. > > Thoughts? :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2005 10:33:10 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Aaron Morris Subject: Re: BEE-L: approval required (DC48283E) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit This message was originally submitted by Medhat.Nasr@GOV.AB.CA to the BEE-L list at LISTSERV.ALBANY.EDU. It was edited to remove quotes of previously posted material. > ----------------- Original message (ID=DC48283E) (80 lines) > ------------------- > From: Medhat.Nasr@gov.ab.ca > In-Reply-To: <001a01c58cf4$016f2fe0$76772a50@office> > To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology > > Subject: Re: [BEE-L] New Varroa Research > > Mr. Edwards Said: This is a very odd paper. It gives the > appearance of > being a scientific > paper, but does not indicate the status of the author. > > Can Mr. Ruzicka provide the name of the scientific journal > and a reference > to where this paper was published? > > Thanks > > > medhat > > Medhat Nasr, Ph. D. > Provincial Apiculturist > Crop Diversification Centre North > > 17507 Fort Road > Edmonton, AB, Canada T5Y 6H3 > Tel: (780) 415-2314 Fax: (780) 422-6096 > Mailto:medhat.nasr@gov.ab.ca :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2005 10:58:11 -0400 Reply-To: Lloyd Spear Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Lloyd Spear Subject: comb honey Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Ohio Bee Farmer said "The only > problem I have found with my RR is that when separating the > sides, the comb > gets stuck to one side" Are you using 8 frames with spacer boards in your supers? Or are you using 9 frames? I've never had anyone complain of the problem you are having...but then I know one dealer in Ohio promotes using 9 frames, and no spacer boards, instead of 8 frames. Please let me know, and we'll try to work our way through this problem. -- Lloyd Spear Owner Ross Rounds, Inc. Manufacture of equipment for round comb honey sections, Sundance Pollen Traps, and producer of Sundance custom labels. Contact your dealer or www.RossRounds.com :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2005 11:16:15 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Aaron Morris Subject: Re: comb honey MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Ohio Bee Farmer wrote: > "I have found with my RR ... the comb gets stuck to one side" I too have had this problem. It happens on occasion, with the standard RR configuration (8 plastic frames fitted with rings and foundation, spacer boards held firmly in place with springs). On occasion, the bees will brace the face of the completed comb to the plastic frame. When that round is removed, the face of the comb gets torn off and the completed section becomes a flawed second that leaks into the contained when the covers are put on the section. An opaque cover will hide this flaw, but the comb still leaks. How to keep the bees from attaching the face of the comb to the plastic frame is the question. Fortunately this happens only on an occasional comb, it is not a regular occurence. But it is disappointing to have an otherwise perfect comb relegated to second when it does happen. Aaron Morris - I think, therefore I bee! :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2005 11:55:02 -0500 Reply-To: Hroller McKnutt Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Hroller McKnutt Subject: Re: comb honey In-Reply-To: <9D95C2906FCCE04F836ECA17C4CE09210C9021@UAEXCH.univ.albany.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit > How to keep the bees from attaching the face of the comb to the plastic frame is the question. Fortunately this happens only on an occasional comb, it is not a regular occurence. But it is disappointing to have an otherwise perfect comb relegated to second when it does happen. > Maybe a tool to run around the back side of the frame/comb juncture to seperate it before you pull the RR. I don't know, as I don't have RR's but I do want to give them a try sometime. Mike in Warrensburg, MO :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2005 19:11:15 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Ron/Eefje van Mierlo Subject: Re: New Varroa Research MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello all, Having read the whole PDF file that was referred to by the person submitting the original message, I too have to agree with Peter Edwards that a lot of spelling mistakes were made and some odd expressions used. This is likely due to the fact that the author translated everything from Spanish to English, while not fully mastering English. What I missed in the PDF file were any comparisons and side-by-side tests using the other well known acids, just as any other methods that do apply formic acid in the fight against Varroa mites. Ron van Mierlo :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2005 14:48:51 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: OhioBeeFarmer Subject: Re: comb honey MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Aaron, you hit it exactly on the nail! This is exactly what is happening. I guess using the opaque covers might work as long as the stores don't turn the upside down and they leak to the otherside : ) I don't know that 9 or 8 frame position would make any difference as the comb that is sticking is inside of the frames\cases. I might think that will 9 frames would less room in the super but since the RR cases\frames are the same size it wouldn't matter.. unless RR makes different size frames?! Lloyd? I do like RR they are pretty when it comes to packaging. I just never had this issue so I guess this can be rare. > How to keep the bees from attaching the face of the comb to the plastic > frame is the question. Fortunately this happens only on an occasional > comb, it is not a regular occurence. But it is disappointing to have an > otherwise perfect comb relegated to second when it does happen. > > Aaron Morris - I think, therefore I bee! > > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: > -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2005 17:02:49 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Rip Bechmann Subject: Did I miss something? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Why would the owner of Ross Rounds be producing non-Ross Round comb honey and telling the whole world about it? It doesn't come across as very good advertising for Ross Round equipment but I do admire his candor. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2005 18:11:01 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: CSlade777@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Comb honey MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I generally use inch-wide top bars with no frames set in castellated spacers. A bead of wax drawn down the centre of the underside of the bars gives the bees a good guide. A sheet of polythene on top of the super below will prevent them joining them together. I cut a cardboard template the size of the cut comb containers, lay the combs on a cake rack on a metal tray, and with the guidance of the template cut out the pieces of comb with a sharp knife. I separate them slightly and allow them to drain for a couple of minutes before transferring them to the containers. Offcuts of a good size are put in jars for chunk honey. The remainder is pressed and the resulting honey used for the fluid part of chunk honey. Chris :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2005 19:54:06 -0400 Reply-To: Lloyd Spear Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Lloyd Spear Subject: Telling the world Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Rip said "Why would the owner of Ross Rounds be producing non-Ross Round comb honey and telling the whole world about it? " My 'telling the world' is not new, and has been going on since just after dirt was discovered! I guess I don't mind because there is no question that we (Ross Rounds) don't have all the answers. We know that because we are serious beekeepers, with just over 200 hives AND we buy a few tons every year. Cut comb has its place, principally for chunk honey, which is a wonderful product, that I never seem capable of producing enough of to serve demand. In comparison to the capabilities of honey bees, I stand humble. We have, IMHO, great products in the form of section comb honey equipment, Sundance Pollen Traps, and custom labels. But these only allow us beekeepers to properly take advantage of the natural tendencies of honey bees. We don't pretend otherwise (unlike some others who would like to think they are our competitors). Lloyd -- Lloyd Spear Owner Ross Rounds, Inc. Manufacture of equipment for round comb honey sections, Sundance Pollen Traps, and producer of Sundance custom labels. Contact your dealer or www.RossRounds.com :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Jul 2005 16:27:23 +1200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Barry Donovan Subject: Re: BEE-L Digest - 19 Jul 2005 to 20 Jul 2005 (#2005-193) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Re: comb honey. Many years ago a beekeeper told me that he thought that brace wax was built between the surface of a sealed section and the facing divider only if there was a spot of wax or maybe propolis already on the divider. Cleaning dividers thoroughly before assembling them and the new sections into the supers may be worth trying. Regards to all. Barry Donovan New Zealand. Visit our website at http://www.crop.cri.nz ______________________________________________________ CAUTION: The information contained in this email is privileged and confidential. If you read this message and you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination, distribution or reproduction of all or part of the contents is prohibited. If you receive this message in error, please notify the sender immediately. Any opinions or views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not represent those of their employer. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Jul 2005 09:31:00 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bill Truesdell Subject: Re: Telling the world Comments: To: Lloyd Spear In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lloyd Spear wrote: >Cut comb has its place, principally for chunk honey, >which is a wonderful product, that I never seem capable of producing >enough of to serve demand. > When our State chapter sold at a local fair, the chunk honey sold out first at a premium price. The nice thing about it, compared to comb honey, is you do not have to worry about "neatness" (honey dripping from the cut edges or irregular size) since they are immersed in honey. Plus, a little goes a long way, since the "chunks" are smaller than cut-comb honey. Does take more work, but is a moneymaker. I usually used combs from frames that needed replacement anyway, so there was no real loss of combs. They also are unusual and appreciated gifts, as part of the happy neighbor program. Bill Truesdell Bath, Maine :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Jul 2005 14:28:57 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "EXT-Smart, Billy Y" Subject: Re: Telling the world MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I've been getting requests for chunk comb honey but I've never produced it before. I have a question on pricing. What do you folks sell you chunk comb honey for? I had a customer call me on the phone to specifically ask for some and I quoted her a price of $12 for a quart jar of chunk comb honey. She indicated that the price was low and now I do too. Billy Smart Rock, KS :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Jul 2005 20:56:03 -0400 Reply-To: Lloyd Spear Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Lloyd Spear Subject: Telling the world Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit There are a number of formulas for determining the price of chunk honey, mostly dealing with valuing the comb and liquid seperately and then adding them together. But I have observed that the outcome is usually that the chunk price is 150% of the liquid price for the same size container. So, if 44 ounces of honey (a quart?) sells for $7, chunk in that size container might sell for $10.50-$11. But watch this. A guy around here puts a single slice of comb in a 1 pound jar and calls it 'chunk'. Mine has 3 slices of comb. Stick with a quality product, even if you have to raise the price. The idea is to put all the chunk in that the container will hold, and then pour liquid to fill. I sell a five pound chunk, wholesale, for $17.50 ( cartons of 6 jars). By weight, it has 3 lbs of comb and about 2 lbs. of liquid. Retail it sells for $25-$30, and the retailers always sell out! My one-pound chunk wholesales (cartons of 12) for $4.50 each, and my 2.5 lb. chunk (cartons of 12) wholesales for $7.50. Markup for retail runs from 140% to 200%. Hope th is helps. -- Lloyd Spear Owner Ross Rounds, Inc. Manufacture of equipment for round comb honey sections, Sundance Pollen Traps, and producer of Sundance custom labels. Contact your dealer or www.RossRounds.com :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 22 Jul 2005 11:39:43 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "Bogansky,Ronald J." Subject: Comb/Chunk Honey MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi Everyone, I am amazed at some of the comments on the comb honey posts over the past few days. Unfortunately, for me, I don't experience the same results. The market where I sell is located on an interstate highway. I get a variety of potential customers passing through, however the majority and the "regulars" come from basically two areas; Northeastern Pennsylvania/Southern New York, and Philadelphia, PA. I do not sell a lot of comb honey. I offer one lb jars and Ross Rounds. Most folks stopping by don't even know what comb honey is and a question I get asked at least three times a day is, "Are the any bees in it?". Our answer is usually, "No way, the bees are much too valuable to give away." Almost always the only folks that readily recognize it are either from the South or elderly. As for the latter, they usually comment they have not seen it in years or since their beekeeping relative stopped keeping bees or passed away, ironically, they do not buy any. Another exception is foreign travelers. Asians, eastern Europeans, those from the Middle East are good customers for this product. As much as I am a firm believer in the value of honey, this is one product I have to price on the low end. I get $5 for each although we are raising the price to $5.50. Still low by what I have been reading in the recent posts. Last year I had an individual that wanted to buy "all the Ross Rounds I could supply him", but at $2.25 a section. He was from out of the area and insisted that is what he is paying for it from his current supplier. Needless to say we did not do any business. This is probably going to be our last year at this market. I have decided that I would much rather work bees then spend 10-12 hr. days at the market. I don't know what it is about the area I live, but there is not the appreciation for honey that I have seen in other parts of the country. I will say that I have made some good steady customers, in that once they tried a jar they have returned for more and larger sizes. One other point related to Lloyd Spear who is synonymous with comb honey. Lloyd has always done a lot to promote beekeeping regardless of whether you are using his Ross Rounds or not. His posts to BeeL, articles in Bee Culture and personal conversations/correspondents we have had, are always extremely helpful and enjoyable. There are a few folks on this list that year-in-year-out are always there to offer guidance. Most of us that have been around this list for a long time know who they are and Lloyd is definitely one of them. New members to this list would do wise in searching the archives for some of his posts and if possible read some of his back articles to the journals. You will get good sound advice that has stood the test of time. Ron Ron Bogansky Kutztown, (eastern) PA, USA :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 19:43:04 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Marvin Moose III Subject: Brood Wax I have heard of chemical residue building up in your wax and the cells getting smaller over time. How often should the brood wax be changed out and what problems if any could this cause in the hive? Also how often, if needed should the wax in the supers be changed out? :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 19:57:59 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Marvin Moose III Subject: Non-laying Queen I have a hive that has a queen that is only one and a half years old. Up until about three weeks ago was very strong and was an excellent laying queen. I went into the hive today and she is alive looks healthy but there is no sign of eggs or larva and the hive is very weak. I would like to hear from others as to what might be causing this. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 22:29:02 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Tim Moran Subject: Re: Non-laying Queen MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit First thing that comes to mind is that they swarmed and the new queen has not begun laying yet, assuming she has even mated. The first question: Was the queen marked? :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Jul 2005 01:11:04 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Harrison Subject: Re: Brood Wax MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >I have heard of chemical residue building up in your wax and the cells getting smaller over time. Beeswax is a sink for all kinds of environmental contamination besides contamination from treatments for beekeeping problems. Research ( Elbert Jaycox)has shown that brood nest cells do get smaller (up to 17%) after years of use but found no problem with smaller cells. > How often should the brood wax be changed out and what problems if any could this cause in the hive? Every beekeeper you ask will give a different opinion. In days gone past comb rotation was considered a waste of time and money. Now annual removel of some comb (2 frames per hive is the most often talked about number) is considered normal. Many beekeepers which have used Apistan (fluvalinate)or Checkmite (choumaphos) or both are in the process of changing all comb (I finnished mine this year after three years of work). So far your questions have been easy. The next is complicated. "what problems if any could this cause in the hive" Tests to determine exactly which environment chemicals and levels are in your brood comb are very expensive. Tests for chemicals used to treat varroa etc.are not needed as most likely the contamination was done by you. Our bee labs have given us accurate amounts of contamination levels for per label use of approved chemicals. Illegal use falls in the unknown catagory. In my opinion contaminated brood nest comb is a major cause of hive loss in the U.S. today and base the fact on the big improvement in all areas of the hive by those which have rotated contaminated comb from their hives. Many problems such as queen raising problems (coumaphos) and sterile drones (fluvalinate) have been documented. Many other problems are suspected but hard to prove. >Also how often, if needed should the wax in the supers be changed out? I only change out super wax on rare occasions. I am of the opinion old dark super comb ddoes tend to darken honey. Rather than replace the comb I like to sell the supers with loose corners and dark comb to other beekeepers ( many calls for supers from beekeepers this year)and replace with new supers, with new frames and new foundation. Others may not agree with me but I do believe that the lightest honey comes from comb which has never had brood in it and is not very old but only my opinion. I really don't worry much about super comb. The archives are filled with opinions on brood nest wax contamination. Sincerely, Bob Harrison :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Jul 2005 05:53:36 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: CSlade777@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Brood Wax MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 24/07/2005 05:02:02 GMT Standard Time, LISTSERV@listserv.albany.edu writes: > > I have heard of chemical residue building up in your wax and the cells > getting smaller over time. How often should the brood wax be changed out > and what problems if any could this cause in the hive? Also how often, if > needed should the wax in the supers be changed out? > This will happen only if you, yourself, put chemicals into the hive. Depending where you are and the legalities you could use chemicals that soon break down to carbon dioxide and water, or are found in honey anyway. If you use persistent chemicals and don't want them ending up on your toast you should renew brood combs regularly and frequently. The practice in Denmark, for example, is to use formic acid for varroa treatments and to renew comb annually. This seems to be 'best practice' towards which we should aim, but from which most fall far short. With this turnover of brood comb most of the health problems disappear thus reducing the need for chemicals. Bees do, to some extent, move wax around within a hive (I can't quote a source for this information, but think it is correct). If so, there is a chance that noxious chemicals placed below will find their way upstairs. Chemical can form part of Integrated Pest Management but do need thought. As an example, again depending on your local honey flows, climate etc, you could treat against varroa after removal of the honey crop by using whatever chemical is currently in vogue, and then shake the colony onto fresh foundation/starter strips in spring, sacrificing what brood there is, complete with mites, nosema, and unnoticed foul brood. The super wax can go on for years, but I find that sooner or later I get a crop of brassica that sets within the comb and so I simply either scrape down to the foundation or cut out the whole comb, so there is a steady turnover. Wax moth (the beekeeper's friend) can ensure some turnover but usually doesn't go into super comb much unless the queen has been up there. Chris :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 02:54:34 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Aleksandar Mihajlovski Subject: Ticker poison in old queens? I came to an very interesting explanation for question: why young queen almost always is winner when she must fight for survival with an old queen on the other side. Explanation (in one book) says that reason is that old queen (older than 1,5 year) has a ticker poison in her poison sack. Is there anyone who has come across scientific prove of this claim? Any reference? :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 12:55:05 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: mike@KEYRELEVANCE.COM Subject: Re: Ticker poison in old queens? In-Reply-To: <200507270654.j6R6SWiR005140@listserv.albany.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Assuming that the old queen's poison is thicker, how does this translate into a disadvantage in a fight with the new queen? I would assume that the simple wear and tear on the old queen over time would be sufficient to make her less likely to win. -- Mike Churchill | This message sold by weight, KeyRelevance | not by volume. Some settling 972 429-1222 | of content may have occurred. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 15:40:32 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bill Lord Subject: Hot weather grafting Hello from HOT North Carolina (102 F today). Does anyone have any tips for getting grafts accepted and cells built in hot weather? My precentages go way down once it gets hot. We have pollen coming in and drones present. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 22:31:20 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter Edwards Subject: Re: Hot weather grafting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "Bill Lord" asked: > Does anyone have any tips > for getting grafts accepted and cells built in hot weather? My > precentages go way down once it gets hot. Don't complain! Here in the UK we have returned to winter - two weeks ago 30C - today 16C, grey, cold wet and windy - we have the central heating back on. The forecast shows little sign of improvement. I heard a very appropriate description of our weather the other day - schizophrenic weather! So my question would be, does anyone have any tips for getting grafts accepted in cold weather? Yesterday I was grafting in an apiary where the temperature at lunchtime was just 15C. Peter Edwards beekeepers@stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 18:55:50 -0300 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Eunice Wonnacott Subject: Re: Hot weather grafting MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=Windows-1252; reply-type=original Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Above a certain temperature, it may become impossible for the bees to maintain their optimum internal hive temperature. Are other cooling methods available to you?? :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 19:56:16 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Michael Palmer Subject: Re: Hot weather grafting In-Reply-To: <200507271940.j6RJYkaS009401@listserv.albany.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-57873132 > My >precentages go way down once it gets hot. We have pollen coming in Is there anything else that has changed? We just had an extended hot humid spell, and I had good percentage of cells built. You have plenty of nurse bees? You say pollen is coming in...do you include a pollen comb next to the graft, and a syrup feeder full at all times? Mike -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 267.9.4/57 - Release Date: 7/22/2005 :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Jul 2005 10:10:35 +0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter Detchon Subject: Re: Hot weather grafting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Bill Lord said " Does anyone have any tips for getting grafts accepted and cells built in hot weather? My percentages go way down once it gets hot." Bill, there are 2 main problems associated with raising queens in the = field in hot weather.=20 The first is preventing the grafted larva from drying out during = grafting and transfer of the cell bar back into the cell builder colony. = Here in Western Australia, most of my grafting is done in the the field = in very hot (30-40 degrees centigrade) conditions, often with drying = easterly winds. My method to prevent grafted larvae drying out is, as = each cell bar is grafted it is placed into an empty nucleus hive which = has several layers of towelling in the bottom. This towelling is soaked = with boiling water from my s/s Thermos flask when I start grafting, and = then closed up. This keeps a warm HUMID atmosphere which is very = important for larval survival. It is also vital to ensure that the frame = of larvae being grafted is well fed so that the grafted larva is lying = in a plentiful supply of royal jelly when it is lifted out. This is best = done by feeding thin sugar syrup to the colony for a few days prior to = grafting (assuming natural pollen supplies are also plentiful). Using = this method I can usually achieve 90% graft survival under sometimes = very difficult conditions.Prior to adopting this method my success rates = in these conditions could be almost zero! The second problem is ensuring that the cell builder colony is not = stressed by the weather/nutritional conditions so that it can go about = its job normally and happily. There are many different configurations = for cell builders, but a common feature of all is being well supplied = with young nurse bees, and food. No matter how good the floral = conditions, keep up the supply of thin sugar syrup to them, and if = necessary shade the hive from the full sun to prevent overheating. Provided you pay full attention to the absolute basics of good queen = cell rearing practice, hot weather should not lessen your success rates. Peter Detchon in Western Australia, where the season is getting started, floral = prospects look good, and honey prices have crashed...again. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Jul 2005 09:14:04 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Ron/Eefje van Mierlo Subject: Re: Hot weather grafting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Considering the danger of larvae drying out during grafting in hot weather conditions: Should we perhaps regardless of the weather conditions and circumstances have an extra amount of royal jelly ready and use, so that each larva can be given some extra jelly apart from the amount that followed from the original cell? I found that much of the royal jelly stays behind as the larva is lifted from the original cell bottom, regardless of the tools and method used. The larva placed in the new cell or cup will then be missing out on the amount of royal jelly that it would naturally have had. Giving an extra amount and letting the larva swim in royal jelly again no drying out should occur apart from just in the air during the 5 seconds that the actual grafting action takes. BTW Peter, did you get my pollen images? Ron van Mierlo Sweden :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Jul 2005 08:42:54 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Jerry Bromenshenk Subject: Lidar Tracking/Mapping of Bees Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Hello all, This note is to let you know that the paper about the Ft. Leonard Wood bee lidar experiment is in this week's issue of Optics Express: Current issue of Optics Express: http://www.opticsexpress.org/default.cfm Ft. Leonard Wood bee lidar paper summary: http://www.opticsexpress.org/abstract.cfm?URI=OPEX-13-15-5853 Full paper: http://www.opticsexpress.org/view_file.cfm?doc=%24%29LO%2DJ%40%20%20%0A&id=%25%28%2C7%29IL%5C%20%0A We've had lots of requests for this information. I doubt that many Bee-L readers follow the Optics journals. Our current projects are working on a portable, invisible, eye-safe system that can be keyed in on the wing beat of specific species of insects. Enjoy Jerry :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Jul 2005 13:35:54 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Chuck Norton Subject: Re: Hot weather grafting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Bill Lord asked for, "tips for getting grafts accepted and cells built in hot weather". The conditions and the time of day with a temperature of 102 degrees that Mr. Lord described is simply too hot to be out grafting larvae for either a hobbyist or a commercial queen breeder although I will work my bees and install 14 day old mature queen cells into mating boxes during the heat of the day if I have to. I am quite concerned with the phrase “getting grafts accepted and cells built” more than a temperature of “102 F” degrees”. Nurse bees will build onto cups with viable larvae and accept and feed grafted larvae if they are healthy, in new cups, and if there are enough nurse bees to feed the number of cups given with grafted larvae. This of course assumes that one either works with a queenless hive full of capped brood and nurse bees or a queenright hive with an excluder separating the queen below which must still have copious quantities of nurse bees. If either of these two conditions are met, and only temperature is the variable to one’s successful grafting I suggest that one must look at some of the grafting techniques that will cause the loss of accepted cells. Note: With this specific thread in mind I must assume that the creator has not changed his methods of grafting nor has he changed his methods of cell building or starting. Most grafting is usually done in the morning hours in a sheltered area after the field bees have started flying. A sheltered area can be a building, the cab of a pickup truck, a van, or even in the shade under a tree. The mid-day summer sun is quite high in the sky and not only will ambient air temperature affect 1/2 day old larvae, direct sunlight containing the full spectrum of radiation from the infrared to ultra violet, approximately 400 to 700 nanometers, can quite quickly kill honeybee larvae. Larvae are susceptible to both heat and light. Grafting techniques that include open grafting without any cover or protection may produce acceptable percentages of queen cells in late spring or early summer, but the hot summer sun may cause an increase in larvae mortality with open grafting even when the relative humidity is high and larvae do not dry out. Dr. Clarence Collison in the July 2005 issue of Bee Culture gave three additional dangers associated with grafting larvae: “Damaging the young larva while transferring.” “Having the larva dry out while you are grafting a frame.” And, “ A break in the larva’s royal jelly supply since the larva is not moved intact with its food supply. Cheers, Chuck Norton Norton’s Nut & Honey Farm Reidsville, NC :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Jul 2005 16:19:14 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Aleksandar Mihajlovski Subject: Re: Ticker poison in old queens? Mike Churchill asks: "Assuming that the old queen's poison is thicker, how does this translate into a disadvantage in a fight with the new queen?" Author says that thicker poison cannot pass trough stinger channel as easily as thinner poison which is in young queen sack. Regards, Aleksandar :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Jul 2005 23:16:28 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter Edwards Subject: Re: Apimondia MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I will be there too and will be more than happy to share a few large Guinnesses. We need a meeting place and some means of recognising each other - as it is August, perhaps a sprig of heather might be more appropriate than wearing red carnations! Peter Edwards beekeepers@stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Jul 2005 20:51:37 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Michael Palmer Subject: Re: Hot weather grafting In-Reply-To: <009001c59344$09fa1250$842665d5@roneefje> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-46CD2E7A > >I found that much of the royal jelly stays behind as the larva is lifted >from the original cell bottom, regardless of >the tools and method used. >Ron van Mierlo Have you used the "Chinese" grafting tool? It scoops the entire puddle of jelly, and deposits it, along with the larvae, in the cup. Mike -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 267.9.4/57 - Release Date: 7/22/2005 :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Jul 2005 22:17:01 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: bob darrell Subject: Re: Apimondia In-Reply-To: <001d01c593c2$0048b2b0$f7712a50@office> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v728) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Jul 28, 2005, at 6:16 PM, Peter Edwards wrote: > I will be there too and will be more than happy to share a few large > Guinnesses. > > We need a meeting place and some means of recognising each other - > as it is > August, perhaps a sprig of heather might be more appropriate than > wearing > red carnations! > Where does a poor Canuk find sprigs of heather in Dublin? Why not write Bee-L on our nametags. Hoping to meet lots of Bee-L friends! Bob Darrell Caledon Ontario Canada 80W44N :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2005 09:36:37 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: allen dick Subject: Hummingbird Feeders MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This came in from a lady in Skiatook, North of Tulsa, Oklahoma. Any suggestions? > > I would love to find out how to get rid of my honey bees so > > that my humming birds have had their fill. The bees have > > taken over. Can you tell me how I can detour them to another area? > > I'm in desperation... > Are you talking about a hummingbird feeder? If so, a good > hummingbird feeder will have bee guards that keep bees away. > > I have the ones with the guards but they are all over them too. > > Can you recommend one....Maybe I'm not looking where > > I'm supposed to be....I buy from bird shed allen :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2005 12:26:09 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Dick Shaw Subject: Re: Hummingbird Feeders In-Reply-To: <002f01c59453$4efeb940$b77ba8c0@Nemo> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have 5 colonies in the back yard 20 feet from the back of the house and a Humming Bird feeder at the front porch. Not one bee has bothered it - I don't think a bee could get to the syrup past the little plastic flowers around the base. Sounds like the feeder in question is allowing bees access or is leaking in some way. If syrup is available I doubt you could keep the bees away. Dick 5 hives in Memphis and counting. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2005 13:49:17 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "Viktor E. Sten" Subject: Re: Hummingbird Feeders MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Problem suggestions: 1) The feeder is leaking. 2) The feeder was not cleaned after filling. Viktor in Ontario :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2005 13:49:50 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Timothy Eisele Subject: Re: Hummingbird Feeders In-Reply-To: <002f01c59453$4efeb940$b77ba8c0@Nemo> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Fri, 29 Jul 2005, allen dick wrote: > This came in from a lady in Skiatook, North of Tulsa, Oklahoma. Any > suggestions? > Well, we have had hummingbird feeders not 500 feet from 8 beehives for years, and the bees never show the slightest interest in them. We are using the "Perky-Pet" brand feeders, if I recall, with an hourglass-shaped glass body that screws into a one-piece feeder head. The feeding holes are only about 1/16 inch in diameter and quite deep, so there is no way for the bees to reach the sugar solution, unless they have sugar spilled on the outside while filling. This particular brand of feeder resists spillage very well, others I have seen are not so good about this. We have, on occasion, had bald-faced hornets come around, but that was only when we had sugar on the outside due to not cleaning the feeder head thoroughly between refillings. As long as it is kept clean, the only kind of insect that gives any trouble are tiny little ants that can fit into the feeder holes. -- Tim Eisele tceisele@mtu.edu :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2005 15:57:15 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Robert Barnett Subject: Re: Hummingbird Feeders In-Reply-To: <002f01c59453$4efeb940$b77ba8c0@Nemo> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v733) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Jul 29, 2005, at 10:36 AM, allen dick wrote This came in from a lady in Skiatook, North of Tulsa, Oklahoma. Any suggestions? > Are you talking about a hummingbird feeder? If so, a good > hummingbird feeder will have bee guards that keep bees away. > > allen I have had honeybees, humming bird feeders, and humming birds in my back yard for years here in Alabama, and have only on a couple of very rare occasions seen a single bee around a feeder. The problem here is YELLOW JACKETS at the feeders. At this moment yellow jackets are chasing humming birds and vice versa, off and on every day. Very rarely a red wasp comes to the feeder, and the hummers will not contest the wasp, which is larger and more nervous than the yellow jacket; unless you can find the yellow jacket's nest, pour in a few ounces of gasoline and plug it with a rock after dark, and quickly; TAKE CARE, one can certainly get stung doing this! The only other thing have done is kill the offender off the feeder with a fly swatter. My feeders are just a foot outside a pair of windows. My personal belief is that the hummingbirds will be unharmed by none of the above; they nest and raise their young right in my yard - I have two of their nests on a bookshelf. Another small story: four or five years ago a neighbor, two blocks away, called to complain that my honey bees were all over her H. bird feeders on her patio. I went up immediately with a couple of honeybees in a jar. Obviously, even to her, her "bees" were nothing like my "bees"; i.e., she also had yellow jackets. From now until the first freeze, here in Alabama, there are going to be lots of yellow jackets. Oklahoma? I can't say! Robert Barnett Birmingham, AL > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: > -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info > --- > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2005 19:38:05 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Glen & Mary Lawson Subject: Re: Hummingbird Feeders In-Reply-To: <002f01c59453$4efeb940$b77ba8c0@Nemo> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This came in from a lady in Skiatook, North of Tulsa, Oklahoma. > >> > I would love to find out how to get rid of my honey bees so >> > that my humming birds have had their fill. > I concur with other replies that it probably isn't honeybees. I have a hummer feeder in my backyard near the pool and the bees will swarm all over my pool filter which has a small leak but never show any interest in the hummer feeder. I do have 3 varities of wasps and yellow jackets around my hummer feeders except the ones treated with Vicks VapoRub. Vaporub seems pretty good about keeping the wasps away but it doesn't bother the hummers. For the ants, I coat the hook or wire leading to the feeder with Crisco and no more ants. I suspect if the lady puts a little Vaporub on her feeders about once or twice a month she won't have any more problem with her "honeybees" Glen Lawson :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2005 20:46:35 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Aaron Morris Subject: Re: Hummingbird Feeders MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =20 ________________________________ From: L-Soft list server at University at Albany (1.8d) = [mailto:LISTSERV@listserv.albany.edu] Sent: Fri 2005.07.29 19:42 To: Aaron Morris Subject: BEE-L: approval required (5E29735C) This message was originally submitted by grumpy7@MSN.COM to the BEE-L = list at LISTSERV.ALBANY.EDU. It was edited to remove quotes of previously posted = material. ----------------- Original message (ID=3D5E29735C) (69 lines) = ------------------- From: "walter weller" To: "Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology" = References: <002f01c59453$4efeb940$b77ba8c0@Nemo> Subject: Re: [BEE-L] Hummingbird Feeders Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2005 18:38:47 -0500 Are we sure those are honeybees and not bumblebees? I have hummingbird = =3D feeders and bees, and I have often seen bumblebees displace hummers at = =3D the feeders, but I haven't seen honeybees do so. Walter :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2005 20:48:38 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Aaron Morris Subject: Re: Hummingbird Feeders MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This message was originally submitted by greycharleigh@HOTMAIL.COM to = the BEE-L list at LISTSERV.ALBANY.EDU. It was edited to remove quotes of = previously posted material. ----------------- Original message (ID=3DC53CA213) (64 lines) = ------------------- From: "Angela Copi" To: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu Subject: RE: [BEE-L] Hummingbird Feeders Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2005 20:02:59 -0400 One other suggestion would be to smear a little Vicks Vapo-rub over the "flowers" surface. The smell deteres bees and yellow jackets, but = humming birds don't even notice it. Keith Copi Richmond, VA :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: -- Visit www.honeybeeworld.com/BEE-L for rules, FAQ and other info --- ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::