From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Feb 28 11:08:27 2009 Return-Path: <> X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.8 (2007-02-13) on industrial X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-85.8 required=2.4 tests=ADVANCE_FEE_1,AWL, FUZZY_PRICES,MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR,SPF_HELO_PASS,USER_IN_WHITELIST autolearn=disabled version=3.1.8 X-Original-To: adamf@IBIBLIO.ORG Delivered-To: adamf@IBIBLIO.ORG Received: from listserv.albany.edu (unknown [169.226.1.24]) by metalab.unc.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id D230549082 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2009 11:03:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from listserv.albany.edu (listserv.albany.edu [169.226.1.24]) by listserv.albany.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n1SG3YWl017258 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2009 11:03:38 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 11:03:35 -0500 From: "University at Albany LISTSERV Server (14.5)" Subject: File: "BEE-L LOG0807A" To: adamf@IBIBLIO.ORG Message-ID: Content-Length: 130384 Lines: 2999 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Jun 2008 22:54:45 -0700 Reply-To: deelusbybeekeeper@yahoo.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Dee Lusby Subject: Re: Beyond the Honeybee In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Waldig: And the sucky part ,half of the honey I produce is bakery,which sucks in price... Reply: I sell table and bakery at same price to local stores for resale and people that buy direct. Never had any problems, and many think the darker honeys are better also. But I sell by season of year, and variel too. Could it be a pricing structure worked out by packers to help keep prices low? instead of how buyers in stores actually perceive the honey, and are willing to pay for it? Dee A. Lusby **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jul 2008 09:48:43 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Dave Cushman Subject: Conference on BEE Breeding MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi all I appreciate that this conference is in UK, but there are a number of BEE-L subscribers that may be interested on generating a breeding programme based on locally available bees. Full details, prices and programme of the forthcoming BIBBA conference, which is aimed at informing beekeepers on how they can obtain/achieve their own Native bees. Conference on Saturday September 20th and Sunday September 21st 2008 at the National Bee Centre, NAC, Stoneleigh, Warwickshire, CV8 2LG. Conference theme: ‘Strategies for improving your own bees – with a little help from your friends’. Saturday 20th September £45.00 (includes lunch, tea and coffee) 9.00 Arrival and register 9.15 Welcome and start – Terry Clare (President BIBBA) 9.30 ‘The basics of bee breeding’ - Professor R Pickard 10.45 Coffee 11.15 ‘Selection and culling to improve our bees’ - Mr. D Ryan (FIBKA) 12.30 Buffet lunch 1.30 ‘Instrumental Insemination’ - Mr. R Jackman 2.30 ‘Morphometry – Two techniques’ - Mr T. Clare 3.30 Tea 4.00 ‘The use of mini-nucs in queen rearing’ - Mr. C. deBruyn 5.00 Finish 7.30 Conference dinner - £25.00 at Ryton Garden Organic Restaurant after a tour around their organic gardens and bees. Sunday 21st September £45.00 (includes lunch, tea and coffee) 9.30 ‘Sharing the best – group queen rearing in Northern Ireland’ Mr. M Eddie 10.45 Coffee For demo/practicals numbers are limited so sign up early 11.15 Demonstration of II (RJ and MC) 11.15 Demonstration/practical of morphometry (TC) 11.15 Demonstration/practical of using mini-nucs (CdB) 12.30 Buffet lunch 1.30 Demonstrations/practical as above 2.45 Panel – Brainstorm – The future of the native or near native bee? 3.45 Tea/coffee – Good byes (A large attendance may cause some changes to the Sunday programme.) Conference fee £45 per day or £80 for 2 days, Send cheque payable to BIBBA with stamped addressed envelope to - Tom Robinson (Treasurer), 71, Broadway, York, YO10 4JP. Bookings for conference will be accepted up to Saturday 6th September, 2008. Accommodation will need to be booked and paid for separately. Either at Stoneleigh - Blackdown Village (basic) approx. £30 Phone:- 02476 690123 or look at wide selection on website http://www.stoneleighpark.com/directions/where/index.asp Please send information with cheque payable to BIBBA with a stamped self addressed envelope to - Tom Robinson (Treasurer of BIBBA) 71, Broadway, York. YO10 4JP. Please send the following information as appropriate... Conference fee for Saturday 20th September, £45.00 includes attendance at lectures lunch, tea/coffee....................................................................... Conference fee for Sunday 21st September, £45.00 includes attendance at lectures, practicals, lunch, tea and coffee....................................... Attendance at both days - £80.00( includes a discount for attendance at both days)........................ Conference dinner on Saturday evening - £25.00.......................... Total amount payable to BIBBA........................................... Bookings must arrive no later than 6th September, 2008 Accommodation will need to be booked and paid for separately – see programme above for telephone and website details. -- Regards & Best 73s, Dave Cushman, G8MZY http://www.dave-cushman.net (http://website.lineone.net/~dave.cushman) Short FallBack M/c, Build 7.01/2.01 -- Regards & Best 73s, Dave Cushman, G8MZY http://www.dave-cushman.net (http://website.lineone.net/~dave.cushman) Short FallBack M/c, Build 7.01/2.01 **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jul 2008 11:17:34 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Juanse Barros Subject: Bees suffer 'death by a thousand cuts' MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline http://www.owensoundsuntimes.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=1087816 -- Juanse Barros J. APIZUR S.A. Carrera 695 Gorbea - CHILE +56-45-271693 08-3613310 http://apiaraucania.blogspot.com/ juanseapi@gmail.com **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jul 2008 09:56:48 GMT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "waldig@netzero.com" Subject: Re: the life span of the honey bee Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >>...human life is related to the number of heart beats. <..> a good case to be made against working out in the gym! Good cardiovascular exercise will temporarily boost your heartrate (undesirable) but it will result in a significantly lower heartbeat rate during the non-exercise, resting period (very desirable). This extends the time life of the heart. We live as long as our major organs function. Humans are 'programmed' to live 140 years in optimum conditions. Waldemar **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Jun 2008 17:33:56 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Walter Weller Subject: Re: Government support: Who needs it? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, deknow - You say: > please note that one does not have to keep doing things the way they > always have...learning, changing, and evolving one's own operation is > always an option. > Some will, some won't. That's the point. Variation, you know. Those who try something good, survive. Those who don't, go extinct. It's called "natural selection", I believe. My intent was simply to say that it's not necessarily bad if some of us go broke. Let it happen. Part of life. Walter Weller > **************************************************** **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Jun 2008 19:20:47 -0400 Reply-To: bee-quick@bee-quick.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Fischer Subject: Re: Germany and France Ban Pesticides MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > this claim that since organic beekeepers have lost > colonies, than pesticides (or beekeeper applied > treatments) can't be the cause keeps getting repeated. The "claim" is backed up by extensive data from multiple operations. Dismissing it as a mere "claim" is extremely misleading, given that the data to support the statement makes it "fact". Sadly, I fear that this was a deliberate attempt to advocate at the expense of the facts. > it seems to me that dee's operation is an important > resource in the hunt for a cause I think I can speak for the entire "scientific community" when I say that this would be akin to doing aerodynamic research in the middle of "Area 51" or doing work on new sailing hulls in the "Bermuda Triangle". No matter what results came out of the work, no matter how compelling the data, the location alone would tend to become a bigger issue of discussion and contention than the data, results, and findings themselves. > but as far as i know, testing has not yet been performed. The tests HAVE been performed. Jerry delivers on promises, and I am offended by your implication that someone who works so hard was anything less than prompt. He is ALSO discreet. Because he is discreet, he is now accused of not being prompt. Every good deed is likewise rewarded, it seems. > as the samples were taken last fall, and dee is in a rather > unique situation...the results could be very telling. The results certainly were very "telling". Clearly, Dee is NOT telling, and no one else is so indiscrete as to presume to tell before she does. That would be telling. If Dee wishes to make the test results public, she can. She has had her results for a while. Clearly, she does not wish to make them public. Any thinking person will conclude that the results do not support the contention that "organic" colonies fare any better than any other colonies under the onslaught of Nosema and other pathogens that are we call "CCD". I challenge you to go back to Dee and demand that she come clean to the many people who hang on her every word. She should tell them exactly what killed her bees, and she should simply retype the actual results from the tests to do so. No sugar coating allowed. I'll cover any bet you want to make that what killed her bees was one or more pathogens. (Groundrules would include a written statement by Dee, checked for accuracy by Jerry B.) My bet is that even Dee's data supports the exact contention that I made and you challenged. So, you wanna ante up, or fold? > i did spend 2 weeks going through virtually all of > dee lusby's hives Dee Lusby's operation is the sort of data point that needs several inconveniently large 55-foot tractor trailer truckloads of metadata and footnotes to explain. Just to start with, Dee is of the opinion that her bees are descended from bees that predated the arrival of Apis mellifera in the Western Hemisphere with the European exolorers and settlers, so if we are to agree with Dee, we cannot even call her bees Apis mellifera. If we were to rely upon DNA testing done in Florida on marked queens Dee shipped to a certain Michael Housel, we would be forced to classify them as Apis mellifera, but more specifially Apis mellifera scutella. I'd go on, but Dee is better-equipped to explain the many things that she has claimed about her bees that imply that they are nothing at all like yours or mine. Its been years, and the list is long. Dee can speak for herself, and she does it better than I could. > it seems to me that there is more than one route to > hive contamination.. Of course there is, but none of your speculation about Dee's bees explain any of the nationwide data set, which includes data from many other yards where organic practices are followed, AND organic forage is foraged. > it seems to me that no matter who you cite, that it is > a rather large leap to assume that if the beekeeper > isn't putting chemicals in the hive that there cannot > be chemicals in the hive. Hold on, you are confusing two different things - the organic operations cited by May Berenbaum were known to exclude not just beekeeper-installed miticides and chemicals, but also a forage area free of pesticide use. Note that true "organic" as applied to honey implies that the hives are free of both kinds of pesticides. "Organic" is more than beekeeper practices, and the USDA seems to be firm on this point. Yes, there are non-organic things within flight range of Dee's bees, and this means that Dee would not be considered an "organic" operation in the strict sense, even if she does follow organic practices. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jul 2008 03:51:27 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: C Hooper Subject: Water-Soluble Propolis =?UTF-8?Q?=E2=80=98Significantly=E2=80=99?= Inhibi ts Tumor Growth Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Water-Soluble Propolis ‘Significantly’ Inhibits Tumor Growth Anti-Tumor Effects of Water-Soluble Propolis on a Mouse Sarcoma Cell Line In Vivo and In Vitro The American Journal of Chinese Medicine (AJCM), 2008 Vol: 36 Issue: 3 (2008), 625 - 634 http://apitherapy.blogspot.com/2008/07/water-soluble-propolis-significantly.html This study was designed to investigate whether water-soluble propolis (WSP) inhibits tumor growth… **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jul 2008 12:46:05 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Eric Simms Subject: Re: Beyond the Honeybee Comments: To: bee-quick@bee-quick.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable To bee a better beekeeper, it might seem reasonable to cut down on your con= sumption of whiskey and=A0ammo.=A0 Stick to basics like fuel, which has gon= e up as both a function of weakening dollar and increased demand.=A0 In the= case of honey, it is partly weakening dollar but largely decreasing SUPPLY= .=A0 Thus, you can expect prices to go up any time the number of hives is g= oing down marketwide, as I stated clearly.=A0 CCD is a marketwide concern.= =A0 All of the honeybee ailments are marketwide because of unscrupulous bre= eders and other importers.=0ABy the way, you counter your arguments:=A0 wit= h the rising prices of fuel and other commodities, that is yet another good= reason to have less bees to be more profitable when honey prices are up:= =A0 you'll use half as much fuel and all of your operating costs are lower = as I stated.=A0 *THINK*=A0 then type.=0A=0A=0A **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jul 2008 12:49:36 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Eric Simms Subject: Re: Beyond the Honeybee Comments: To: deelusbybeekeeper@yahoo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "No it does not! for gasoline prices have more then doubled since honey was= $1.50 even a few years back, but honey has not. On top of that container p= rices are going up, and labor costs are going up for working our bees and e= quipment."=0AGas prices were going to double anyhow, regardless of what hap= pened to the bees.=A0 Right?=A0 Then high honey prices AND CCD reducing the= number of hives that you have make you only that much more profitable than= you would be with high gas prices, low honey prices, and twice as many col= onies to work.=A0 Your argument defeats you.=0A=0A=0A **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 00:05:46 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Brian Fredericksen Subject: DWV not transferred by varroa mites? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/science/article4238250.ece "For years scientists believed that the deformed wing virus (DWV) was spread by varroa destructor mites, which have invaded and spread infections among honeybee colonies in Britain. But researchers from the Rothamsted research institute in Harpenden, Hertfordshire, found out that DWV does not grow within the mite. Instead, the infection has been found only inside the gut of the varroa, suggesting that the mite has merely eaten it from the bodies of bees already infected. Varroa mites cannot regurgitate their gut contents, and so would not be able to transmit the virus. The researchers used an antibody technique to track the viral particles. It does not appear that the virus has invaded the mites’ cells and can reproduce within them." **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 00:32:39 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Brian Fredericksen Subject: Re: Germany and France Ban Pesticides- apistan Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On Mon, 30 Jun 2008 09:37:36 -0400, Bill Truesdell wrote: >For reasons that have been enumerated on this list, organic beekeeping >in the US has drifted over the edge. It is not sustainable unless you > bend the rules. > IMO, in the market place, organic honey is irrelevant. At least in my market place where we have an extremely strong natural food coop presence, local raw honey outsells organic by a huge factor. Most people involved with the food scene have moved passed the little green label to the "Eat Local" concept. Issues of fuel usage, emissions and preserving traditional uses of nearby land drive some of the thinking behind this concept. With the increased cost of fuel and increased incidents of food borne illnesses that come from massive centralized food chains, the eat local idea makes more sense every day. I think the environment for selling your honey locally if you live near large population centers is a growing opportunity. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 08:37:09 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Aaron Morris Subject: Botulism a Possibility, Even if Patient Not Fed Honey MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit This message was originally submitted by editor@MEDIBEE.COM to the BEE-L list at LISTSERV.ALBANY.EDU. Wednesday, July 02, 2008 Botulism a Possibility, Even if Patient Not Fed Honey Global Occurrence of Infant Botulism, 1976-2006 PEDIATRICS, Vol. 122 No. 1 July 2008, pp. e73-e82 Objective. To summarize the worldwide occurrence of reported infant (intestinal toxemia) botulism cases since first recognition of the disease in 1976. Patients And Methods. We collected information on infant botulism cases by active and passive surveillance, by provision of therapeutic Human Botulism Immune Globulin to suspected cases, and by searching the medical literature. We defined a case as laboratory-confirmed botulism that occurred in an infant 12 months of age that was not caused by the ingestion of botulinum toxin in food. Results. Twenty-six countries representing 5 continents reported the occurrence of at least 1 case of infant botulism among their residents. The United States, Argentina, Australia, Canada, Italy, and Japan, in this order, reported the largest number of cases. A history of honey exposure was significantly more common among case subjects hospitalized outside of the United States than among those who were recently hospitalized in California. Conclusions. Most countries have not yet reported cases of infant botulism. This limited reporting of the disease to date contrasts with the known global occurrence of Clostridium botulinum spores in soils and dust and suggests that infant botulism may be underrecognized, underreported, or both. When bulbar palsies, hypotonia, and weakness are present, physicians should consider the possibility of infant botulism even if the patient has not been fed honey. Publication of additional case reports and surveillance summaries will enhance understanding of the occurrence and extent of this underrecognized disease. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 06:52:22 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bill Truesdell Subject: Re: DWV not transferred by varroa mites? In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Brian Fredericksen wrote: > http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/science/article4238250.ece > > "For years scientists believed that the deformed wing virus (DWV) was spread by varroa destructor > mites, which have invaded and spread infections among honeybee colonies in Britain. Long ago, tracheal went through this until it was shown that the mite was not the vector, so this just re-confirms what was already found for tracheal. I think it was Norman Carrick, so they could have checked with him. However, any wound is an entry point for pathogens and mites certainly do that. Just about all the virus now causing problems were found in bee colonies long ago, but were never a problem. They were, as was told to me, a "laboratory curiosity". Times change. Bill Truesdell Bath, Maine **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 08:41:43 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Aaron Morris Subject: Bee Pollen Extract 'Potential Tool to Treat Allergies' MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit This message was originally submitted by editor@MEDIBEE.COM to the BEE-L list at LISTSERV.ALBANY.EDU. Wednesday, July 02, 2008 Study: Bee Pollen Extract 'Potential Tool to Treat Allergies' Anti-allergic Effect of Bee Pollen Phenolic Extract and Myricetin in Ovalbumin-Sensitized Mice J Ethnopharmacol, 2008 Jun 6 The bee pollen is used in folk medicine to alleviate allergic reactions. The bee pollen phenolic extract (BPPE) consists in phenolic compounds (flavonoids) from plants picked by Apis mellifera bee. Aim of This Study: Here we evaluated the anti-allergic property of the BPPE and the flavonoid myricetin (MYR) in murine model of ovalbumin (OVA)-induced allergy. Materials and Methods: The study focused on the BPPE or myricetin treatment of OVA-sensitized BALB/c mice and their effects on the immunoglobulin E (IgE) and immunoglobulin G1 (IgG(1)) production, pulmonary cell migration, eosinophil peroxidase (EPO) activity and anaphylactic shock reaction. Results: The BPPE treatment (200mg/kg) showed inhibition of the paw edema, IgE and IgG(1) OVA-specific production, leukocyte migration to the bronchoalveolar lavage (BAL) and EPO activity in lungs. In addition, BPPE treatment showed partial protection on the anaphylactic shock reaction induced by OVA. Treatment with myricetin (5mg/kg) also inhibited pulmonary cell migration and IgE and IgG(1) OVA-specific production. Conclusions: These results support the hypothesis the myricetin is one of the flavonoids of BPPE responsible for the anti-allergic effect and a potential tool to treat allergies. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 07:05:42 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bill Truesdell Subject: Re: Beyond the Honeybee In-Reply-To: <971707.90775.qm@web36603.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Eric Simms wrote: > By the way, you counter your arguments: with > the rising prices of fuel and other commodities, that is yet > another good reason to have less bees to be more profitable when > honey prices are up: you'll use half as much fuel and all of your > operating costs are lower as I stated. *THINK* then type. Economy of scale comes into any business decision. Small is not necessarily good nor is big. There is a right point where production costs and demand meet. When you get into the commodities arena, small generally does not work unless you can deliver a specialized product. The margins are just too small. Take fuel costs. You have a marginal increase in cost per unit added, compared to an empty rig. So more is actually better. You want to fully load the truck/semi whatever with a full load to get the best return. Same goes for shipping honey or any commodity with a small margin. You want to sell more to get the best return. Especially when demand is high and the margin is great. Companies do not downsize when their product is in demand and margins are greater. They take advantage of the situation and produce more. Since I have completed typing, I will now think. Bill Truesdell Bath, Maine **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 07:14:49 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?UTF-8?Q?Peter_Borst?= Subject: Re: DWV not transferred by varroa mites? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit > But researchers from the Rothamsted research institute in Harpenden, Hertfordshire, found out that DWV does not grow within the mite. This ties in with my previous post regarding Ian Lipkin and the difficulty of understanding cause and effect. The idea that the virus isn't actually spread by the mite is a non-starter. We all know that in severe mite infestations one of the most obvious indicators is deformed wings. Whether the mites transmit the virus is moot. They do something to the colony to ruin it. At the very least it appears that they weaken the bees' ability to ward off infections on their own. > Immunity disturbances - parasites weaken immunity as their presence provokes constant stimulation of the protective system and in the course of time parasites can weaken it greatly. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 07:28:16 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "Peter L. Borst" Subject: How bee mites affect the bee immune system MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Yang and Cox-Foster looked at how bee mites affect the bee immune system. They injected heat-killed E. coli bacteria into virus-infected bees that were either infested with bee mites or mite free. The dead bacteria was used to trigger an immune response in the bees in the same way human vaccines cause our bodies to produce an immune response. They checked the bees for production of chemicals that disinfect the honey and for other immunity related chemicals. They also measured the amount of virus in each bee. Surprisingly, they found that the virus in mite-infested bees rapidly increased to extremely high levels when the bee was exposed to the bacteria. The virus levels in mite-free bees did not change when the bee was injected with bacteria. One chemical, GOX or glucose oxidase, is put into the honey by worker bees and sterilizes the honey and all their food. If bees have mites, their production of GOX decreases. "As mites build up, we suspect that not as much GOX is found in the honey and the honey has more bacteria," says Cox-Foster. "It is likely that the combination of increased mite infestation, virus infection and bacteria is the cause of the two-week death collapse of hives." The mites suppressed other immune responses in the bees, leaving the bees and the colonies more vulnerable to infection. The bee mites transfer from adult bees to late stage larva. The virus can be transferred through many different pathways. "This system is important not only because of what the mites are doing to honey bee populations in the U.S., but because it can be used as a model system for exploring what happens to viruses in animal or human populations," says Cox-Foster. "If we view the colony as a city, then we have a variety of infection modes -- queen to eggs, workers to food supply, bee to bee, and parasite to bee." -- Peter L Borst Danby, NY USA 42.35, -76.50 http://picasaweb.google.com/peterlborst **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 07:59:51 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "Peter L. Borst" Subject: Bees display =?WINDOWS-1252?Q?=93vertebrate-like=94?= cognitive abilities MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline The societies of honey bees and other social insects occupy Wilson's second "pinnacle of social evolution," with complexity that rivals our own. Bees display "vertebrate-like" cognitive abilities, with a brain with only 4X > neurons than Drosophila. They are excellent at associative learning, based on the need to associate a color, shape, scent, or location of a flower with a food reward. Recent studies have shown that A.m. also can learn abstract concepts such as "similar" and "dissimilar," and are able to negotiate complex mazes by using visual stimuli as abstract "signposts" or by recognizing path irregularities. A set of candidate genes for behaviors representing diverse signaling pathways underlying these impressive abilities has recently been identified. Finding these highly conserved molecules suggests that insights from A.m. will play an important part in bridging the chasm between genotype and behavior. -- Upgrading the honey bee genome sequence The Honey Bee Genome Sequencing Consortium J.D. Evans, M. Beye, C. Elsik, R. Maleszka, H.M. Robertson, G.E. Robinson, D.B. Weaver, C.W. Whitfield **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 08:04:59 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Peter_de_Bruyn_Kops?= Subject: Re: DWV not transferred by varroa mites? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit There must be more to the varroa-DWV story than this. In my bees, there is a clear correlation between mite population and incidence of young bees with deformed wings. I use deformed wing bees as the primary indicator that I need to deal with a mite problem pronto. It is not necessary for DWV to be able to reproduce in varroa, or even live in varroa outside the gut. The personal hygiene habits of the mite are probably less than perfect. Do they wash their feet thoroughly after visiting the feces pile and do they disinfect their fangs between meals? **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 10:42:41 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?windows-1252?Q?Steve_Noble?= Subject: Re: DWV not transferred by varroa mites? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit “There must be more to the varroa-DWV story than this. In my bees, there is a clear correlation between mite population and incidence of young bees with deformed wings.” Peter de Bruyn Kops Let’s not forget that Varroa mites actually suck the vital fluids out of bee larvae. Healthy adult honeybees don’t get deformed wings. Only newly emerged bees show the symptoms. The question that lingers in my mind is what symptoms would these heavily parasitized bees show if the virus that is associated with deformed wings was not present? Would they be fat and sassy or weak and snivly? Steve Noble **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 11:01:22 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?UTF-8?Q?Peter_Borst?= Subject: Re: DWV not transferred by varroa mites? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Steve wrote: >The question that lingers in my mind is what symptoms would these heavily parasitized bees show if the virus that is associated with deformed wings was not present? Sacbrood virus is the most widely distributed of all honey bee viruses. Since its first identification in the United States in 1913 (White, 1913), infection of SBV has been found on every continent where A. mellifera honey bees are present. SBV attacks both brood and adult stages of bees, but larvae about 2-day old are most susceptible to SBV infections. SBV affects adult bees without causing obvious signs of disease, but the infected adult bees may have a decreased life span. From: "Honey Bee Viruses" Yan Ping Chen and Reinhold Siede See also: "Virus infection causes specific learning deficits in honeybee foragers" Javaid Iqbal and Uli Mueller **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 15:23:19 GMT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "deknow@netzero.com" Subject: Re: DWV not transferred by varroa mites? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit -- Peter Borst wrote: >SBV affects adult bees without causing obvious signs of disease, but the infected adult bees may have a decreased life span. i'm curious...does this mean that "we don't know if the virus decreases the lifespan of adult bees or not" or "in some cases, the lifespan of adult bees is decreased". these are very different things, and the above quote is ambiguous. deknow **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 13:52:52 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Brian Fredericksen Subject: EPA, clothianidin and honeybees Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >From Doug McRory's email newsletter. EPA Acts to Protect Bees EPA has received a number of inquiries about recent bee deaths in Germany associated with the use of the pesticide clothianidin and whether this incident might be related to Colony Collapse Disorder (CCD). Based on discussions with German authorities, EPA believes this incident is not related to CCD. Although pesticide exposure is one of four theoretical factors associated with CCD that the United States Department of Agriculture is researching, the facts in this case are not consistent with what is known about CCD. CCD is characterized by a relatively rapid decline in the adult bee population of a hive; typically only the queen, a few nurse bees and brood remain in the CCD-affected hive. Reported incidents of CCD have detected few if any dead adult bees. The recent incident in Germany, however, was associated with large numbers of dead adult bees in and around the hives. Additionally, clothianidin residues were detected in the dead bees and their hives. According to German authorities, the May 2008 incident resulted from inadvertent exposure of the bees to clothianidin, an insecticide used for corn seed treatment, resulting from a combination of factors. These factors include the specific formulation of the pesticide used, weather conditions and type of application equipment: --The formulation of the pesticide clothianidin used to protect seed corn from corn root worm did not include a polymer seed coating known as a "sticker." This coating makes the pesticide product stick to the seed. Although the formulation used in the US also does not require a "sticker" on corn seed, it is typical practice to use "stickers" on corn seed in the US. --Normally, corn is planted before canola blooms and attracts bees. Because early, heavy rains delayed the corn planting in Germany, the seeds were sown later than usual when nearby canola crops were in bloom and bees were present. --A particular type of air-driven equipment used to sow the seeds apparently blew clothianidin-laden dust off the seeds and into the air as the seeds were ejected from the machine and into the ground. --Finally, dry and windy conditions at the time of planting blew the dust into the neighboring canola fields that were in bloom and where honey bees were foraging. Together, these factors helped create the circumstances under which this incident occurred. While this incident is not related to CCD, EPA is examining its practices with respect to label requirements for seed treatment pesticides and will revise them as necessary to prevent the types of exposure that led to the bee deaths. Our initial focus will be on seed treatment pesticides that we know are toxic to bees and whether the use of stickers or coatings should be required. In many situations, the use of pesticide-treated seeds results in less human and environmental exposure than would the use of the pesticide later, after the crop is growing. We want to make sure that seed treatment is done according to best practices that minimize human and environmental exposure. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 17:48:23 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Harrison Subject: AHB In-Reply-To: <6999718ED3E19D4AA061F73254EEA34101D37497@UAEXCH.univ.albany.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello All, bees in the local news. Tonight on the local CBS news was a short piece about AHB being found in Oklahoma. Typical piece on a slow news day. In fact the Kansas City Star newspaper called today and did another phone interveiw. Coming out tomorrow for a few pictures. In the Fourth of July edition. In the CBS piece the reporter said that researchers have spent 10 billion dollars researchers the AHB since the Brazil release. Does the list think the figure is accurate? If the figure is correct: What in the heck did we get for 10 billion dollars? Years ago on BEE-L I shared that commercial beeks had the solution to stop AHB dead in its tracks as far as the movement north but researchers declined our solution. I think I know why now. Billions of dollars in research funding which only documented the problem and did nothing to stop the northward movement. bob **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 22:41:51 -0400 Reply-To: bee-quick@bee-quick.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Fischer Subject: Re: AHB MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > In the CBS piece the reporter said that researchers have > spent 10 billion dollars researchers the AHB since the > Brazil release. > Does the list think the figure is accurate? Here's a quick and easy way to do a sanity check - just compare the orders of magnitude of the numbers. 1) The USDA Bee Labs get about $11 million per year combined. 2) Universities spend, in total an amount roughly equal to the USDA total. 3) $10 billion is 909 times $11 million. So, one can conclude $10 billion is waaay to high a number. No one would spend "a thousand years" worth of funding on any one problem. And if you think that you can stop AHB cold, let's hear your idea in detail. And why the cynical assumption of self-interest swaying scientific priorities? Maybe "researchers declined your solution" for just cause rather than out of some ulterior motive. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2008 08:59:09 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter Edwards Subject: Re: DWV not transferred by varroa mites? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Seems certain that they are transferring it - but maybe not by the methods previously assumed. http://www.rothamsted.ac.uk/Posters/VarroaPoster.pdf Best wishes Peter Edwards beekeepers at stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk www.stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk/ **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2008 11:59:40 -0400 Reply-To: bee-quick@bee-quick.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Fischer Subject: Re: DWV not transferred by varroa mites? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > DWV does not grow within the mite. Yes, the mites need not be infected to be carriers. The mites are merely spreading the virus more thoroughly than it would spread unaided. Is that "news" to anyone? Likewise, I don't have high blood pressure, but I am often accused of being a "carrier", and giving it to others. :) > Instead, the infection has been found only inside > the gut of the varroa, suggesting that the mite > has merely eaten it from the bodies of bees already > infected. Again, not "news" at all. It seems that the reporter was charged with doing an update on "CCD", and ran into this work, and neglected even minimal homework on prior art in the area. Breathless prose aside, I don't see where the paper at issue moved the ball down the field even one additional yard. > There must be more to the varroa-DWV story than this. > In my bees, there is a clear correlation between mite > population and incidence of young bees with deformed wings. For sure. Visible DWV is one of the big danger signs that forces one to give bad news to novices about pulling the colony out of production treating ASAP. Worse still, one sees it in the photos taken by those who neither monitor nor treat their bees because they bought magic beans in the form of foundation with smaller cells, or a top-bar hive, or a fogger that goes "whoosh" and looks like a prop out of the "Alien" movie trilogy. And whatever happened to all the people who were so convinced that fogging would save us all that they called us names for daring to want to see some data? Why is it that the current crop of true believers can't learn from even that cautionary tale? a) Is it is because we don't draw the parallels often enough or clearly enough out of politeness? b) Or is it the social constraints of groups like this listserv, bee associations, and "the press", where everyone feels obligated to give a "fair hearing" to BOTH sides of all arguments, not just the one that happens to be supported by the data and facts. (To contrast, funny how my physics discussion group feels no need to be "fair" to the idea that Alchemy has as much to offer as chemistry, and none of my pals in medicine think that the "Stork Theory" is as credible as the "Pregnancy Theory".) Why is it that some of the former fogger users have moved on to the new types of magic beans? Can't they make the connection from personal experience? Maybe the problem is that we aren't being tough ENOUGH on the crackpots. Maybe what is needed is a "burn the hive" protocol for excessive varroa infestations, just as is the rule of thumb for excessive foulbrood infestations. At some point, poorly managed hives are just as much a hazard to unsuspecting nearby beekeepers as pesticide misuse would be. Why is one offense blameless and the other a violation of federal law, given that most of our hives for the most part recover from even serious pesticide kills? But back on track here - Yes, of course the viruses can spread to some extent without varroa - how else would they have existed at all for varroa to spread them around more completely? If there is any doubt in anyone's mind on this point, here are a few classic papers: The Evans/Chen paper "Horizontal and Vertical Transmission of Viruses in he Honey Bee, Apis Mellifera" (Journal of Invertebrate Pathology, July 2006) should have removed all doubt that viruses exist at low levels in bees, and that varroa merely spread the viruses ubiquitous, spreading them from bee to bee. There's also "Prevalence and Seasonal Variations of Six Bee Viruses in Apis mellifera L. and Varroa destructor Mite Populations in France" (Applied and Environmental Microbiology, Dec 2004 by Tentcheva, Gauthier, et al) http://aem.asm.org/cgi/reprint/70/12/7185.pdf Which tends to illustrate that a wide variety of viruses are common at low levels even without significant varroa problems. And for the specific case of DWV, the paper "Localization of deformed wing virus infection in queen and drone Apis mellifera L" (Fievet, Tentcheva, et al in Virology J, March 2006) http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=1475838 shows us that the "vertical" transmission of this virus is quite possible through the "infected egg" scenario. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2008 13:14:08 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Alf Subject: Sugar dusting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit What happens to the bees if a person uses confectioner's sugar with corn starch in it rather than powdered sugar, which is 100% sugar? I cannot find regular powdered sugar in the stores lately. For the past few years the sugar dusting has been my primary treatment for mites, along with screened bottom boards and ventilated covers. This year I've added drone frames for drone trapping, but they are not all drawn out nor have drone larva on them. Now I am stalled. I really avoid chemical treatments and even the soft treatments. I did mite counts recently and found from 1 to 6 on the selected colonies (11 colonies), except on a new colony from an early spring package from Georgia where I counted 16. I want to dust them all now. I haven't gotten to the out apiaries to count mites there due to other circumstances. The honey flow is essentially over. The bees brought no honey into the supers this season. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2008 13:19:30 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Alf Subject: Chalk Brood MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On another note this year what seemed to be just one colony has gradually swept thru my home apiary---Chalk brood. About six or seven out of 15 to 17 colonies have it or have had it. I haven't seen it in any of the out apiaries, except in one other hive originally from the home yard which first went to apple pollination, then into a new yard I just set up in early April. Just noticed this about a week and a half ago. For this colony, I did some heavy duty weed cutting and removed a few more light shade trees (one small black walnut and several staghorn sumacs) so all the colonies in that small apiary (8 or 9 colonies) receive sun for nearly most of the day. Thank you for any comments, Alf Bashore **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2008 08:30:06 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Harrison Subject: Re: AHB In-Reply-To: <000801c8dcb6$59c96ab0$0201000a@j> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jim said: > And if you think that you can stop AHB cold, let's > hear your idea in detail. The idea was not mine but I was consulted as to if the idea was sound. The largest beeks in the U.S. came up with the idea as our researchers and all others had no plan at all other than to document the northward movement of AHB. AHB we were being told would be the end of commercial beekeeping in the Mexico/U.S. and possibly a serious threat to people living in areas colonized by AHB. Also a serious PR problem for beeks and would result in many areas bees are now kept in banning bees. The above was what our researchers were telling us. The plan put forward to stop AHB in its tracks or at least slow movement to a crawl was to place American foulbrood tainted syrup plus AFB comb in traps in several lines at the narrow strip of remote area in Panama through which the AHb had to pass through. its highly unlikely at least a few bees of each swarm would not bring in some of the spores. The bees would slow to a crawl and then die. Other swarms coming through would also rob the dead nests or move into and then die. On the plus side the genius which devised the plan thought that if any swarms made it through they would be resistant to American foulbrood which would please Dr. Rothenbuler and add valuable genetics to our gene pool. I would be careful of criticizing the plan as the sharpest minds in beekeeping agreed at a national meeting the plan was sound and was a *drastic* but workable solution based on the dire problems the arrival of AHB would have on Mexican & U.S. beekeeping ( according to above researchers). I personally think those researchers had watched too many Hollywood movies about AHB looking back. The beekeeper which worked out the plan had made over a dozen trips south to study AHB. bob **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2008 18:29:33 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Peter_de_Bruyn_Kops?= Subject: Re: Chalk Brood Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I had chaulkbrood in most of my colonies last year. This year I have very little. Weather clearly plays a large role, as does old comb, genetics and varroa. I read recently (can't remember where) that chaulkbrood is more likely when mite loads are starting to strain a colony. Marla Spivak wrote an article suggesting using chaulkbrood as a breeding criterion since bees bred to be resistant to chaulkbrood will also be resistant to AFB. (http://www.orsba.org/htdocs/download/spivak.pdf) So you can view this situation as an opportunity instead of a problem! **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2008 18:44:52 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Peter_de_Bruyn_Kops?= Subject: Re: Sugar dusting Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit It is my understanding that here in the USA a small amount of cornstarch is often added to powdered sugar as an anti-caking agent (and the bag still says 100% pure cane sugar on the front). I prefer brands with a little corn starch because the dust spreads more easily and therefore I feel it does a better job in humid weather. I would be cautious about using sugar with cornstarch in cold weather when the bees do not have frequent flight opportunities. Disclaimer: sugar dusting is not a major part of my mite control strategy. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 04:43:01 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: C Hooper Subject: U.S. Firm Combines Healing Properties of Honey, Elderberries Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit U.S. Firm Combines Healing Properties of Honey, Elderberries Pollinate This Bees team up with elderberries to make a drink that cures By Alice Levitt, Seven Days (USA), 6/25/2008 http://apitherapy.blogspot.com/2008/07/us-firm-combines-healing-properties-of.html …Elderberries came into the beekeeper’s life when Greensboro orchardist Lewis Hill encouraged him to make a syrup combining the curative qualities of honey and the fruit… Besides honey, propolis — the natural spackle that bees make from the bark of pine and poplar trees to protect their homes — also has curative mojo. Its resin is rumored to be the source of a Stradivarius’ sweet sound, and recent scientific papers have linked it to antiviral, antifungal and antibacterial effects. Honey Gardens includes propolis in many of its products, including a topical salve, a natural alternative to Neosporin… **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:55:15 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?UTF-8?Q?Peter_Borst?= Subject: Nosema ceranae Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit > Dr. Edward Knipling, the Administrator of the Ag Research Service (ARS), mentioned Nosema ceranae as being not commonly found in beehives I don't where this info comes from. It appears that nosema is extremely common and we are being told it is likely mostly ceranae. Anybody got test results they want to share? pb **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 09:01:32 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Keith Benson Subject: Re: AHB In-Reply-To: <496E1166309F46EA92AE6D70FE35BD83@bobPC> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bob Harrison wrote: > Jim said: >> And if you think that you can stop AHB cold, let's >> hear your idea in detail. > The plan put forward to stop AHB in its tracks or at least slow > movement to a crawl was to place American foulbrood tainted syrup plus > AFB comb in traps in several lines at the narrow strip of remote area > in Panama through which the AHb had to pass through. its highly > unlikely at least a few bees of each swarm would not bring in some of > the spores. I think it would result in a brief pause, and then when the only AHB colonies left in the area were resistant, they would start to move. > The bees would slow to a crawl and then die. Other swarms coming > through would also rob the dead nests or move into and then die. I think they would, as a population, pause for a moment, and then it would be business as usual, or darned close to usual. > On the plus side the genius which devised the plan thought that if any > swarms made it through they would be resistant to American foulbrood > which would please Dr. Rothenbuler and add valuable genetics to our > gene pool. Ahhhh - hardier AHB, is that a good thing? What other genetics would they bring to the party? Perhaps some of the genes you are trying to exclude using this method? > I would be careful of criticizing the plan as the sharpest minds in > beekeeping agreed at a national meeting the plan was sound and was a > *drastic* but workable solution based on the dire problems the arrival > of AHB would have on Mexican & U.S. beekeeping ( according to above > researchers). Careful smareful. Sharp minds are not always right, they may be terribly bright beekeepers and scientists, but that doesn't make them experts when it comes to using biological controls on the scale discussed above. If the idea is sound it will do well whether some genius cooked it up or some patent clerk had some time to think on it. Releasing disease agents rarely works for long as populations usually respond and rebound. Think myxomatosis in rabbits. How populations interact with a pathogen is another ball game altogether from how individuals deal with pathogens. > The beekeeper which worked out the plan had made over a dozen trips > south to study AHB. Studying AHB itself is merely a portion of the puzzle. This is not beekeeping, it is biological warfare. I know some folks advocate shaking an AFB infected colony onto foundation as a method of control, I wonder how that plus the rather higher rate of absconding that has been reported in AHB play into this plan? I am not saying it won't work, there is really only one way to know, but it isn't as rock solid an idea as is suggested, at least similar deployments haven't been. Who knows, maybe this will be an exception. Keith **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 09:13:52 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "Peter L. Borst" Subject: Re: DWV not transferred by varroa mites? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Dean writes >> the infected adult bees may have a decreased life span > I'm curious...does this mean that "we don't know if the virus decreases the lifespan of adult bees or not" or "in some cases, the lifespan of adult bees is decreased". these are very different things, and the above quote is ambiguous. * Depends on what your definition of "may" is -- after Bill Clinton Viruses definitely decrease the life span of the honey bee and may be instrumental in colony collapse. Perhaps no one of these factors alone is sufficient to cause the effect, but in combination a tipping point is reached (which might be different for each colony or occur somewhat simultaneously in an apiary) * * * > Observations from a variety of insect species reveal evidence for the effects of viral infection on developmental processes, locomotor activity, feeding, mating and other behaviours. While DWV infection in early development leads to deformation of wings, paralysis and mortality of the emerging bees, the infection of adult bees does not show such deformation. However, the DWV-infected colonies suffer from weakness, depopulation and sudden collapse. Under natural conditions, haemolymph infection via parasites like Varroa destructor as proposed by Bailey & Ball (1991) is the most probable scenario for DWV transmission. -- Virus infection causes specific learning deficits in honeybee foragers Javaid Iqbal and Uli Mueller **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 12:51:02 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "Peter L. Borst" Subject: colony collapse, viruses and microbes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit As elsewhere around the world, when Varroa mites reached England, so did many cases of colony collapse that could not be explained simply by nutrient drain by parasitic mites. In fact, the article, Varroa and Viruses in the U.K. "Bee Biz, No. 7, February 1998), states that under hygienic conditions, mite feeding only temporarily reduces the protein level of the host bee, with no further consequences to the bee. Thus, the mortality associated with mite feeding appears to be pretty much a mite vectored, viral disease problem. However, as in most biological cases, the story is not simply black and white. Some colonies with high virus levels survive while others don't. This suggests that selection and breeding programs could have real value in this battle to protect bees from mites. But, how do you determine which stock or stocks have the complex of desired traits? Usually when you select for one or two traits, you lose or modify others for the worse. Bees don't go along with being manipulated genetically very well at all. FROM Eric Mussen Apiculture Newsletter January/February 1998 * * * The exoskeleton and its cuticular surface are a pretty formidable barrier against microbes. The outer layer of the exoskeleton is covered with a waxy layer that includes unsaturated fatty acids. Besides preventing loss of water (prevents dehydration) and penetration of water (prevents tissues from becoming "water logged"), the waxy layer makes it difficult for microbes to become attached to the surface. It also resists enzymes (chitinases) secreted by microbes that might other-wise be able to eat their way into the insect. While we think of the exoskeleton as protecting the outside of the bee, it extends well into the tracheal system and lines the fore gut and hind gut of the intestinal tract. It has to be sloughed each time the bee molts. Despite that protection, microbes do make their way into honey bees. In the case of fungi, a number have been listed as being pathogenic. Some are regarded as named "bee diseases" like Ascosphaera apis (chalkbrood); Aspergillus flavus, A. fumigatus, and other Aspergillus species (stonebrood); and Nosema apis and N. ceranae (nosema disease). Other fungi have been recorded as agents of "opportunistic" infections. They include Aureobasidium pullulans, Trichoderma lignorum, Mucor hiemalis, Rhizopus species (black bread mold), and various species of Candida, a yeast. It now seems that Dr. Bailey was very prescient in the 1960's. Lots of honey bees have latent viruses in them. If they don't replicate, the viruses don't appear to cause any physical damage to the bee. But, they are showing up in honey bee eggs, larvae, pupae and adults. The research uncovered one more interesting fact. The WHOLE GENOME of the virus could become incorporated into the bee's genome. Then, under the right circumstances, the instructions for virus replication could be activated right from within the bee cell, itself. FROM Eric Mussen Apiculture Newsletter July/August 2007 * * * Sacbrood virus is the most widely distributed of all honey bee viruses. Since its first identification in the United States in 1913, infection of SBV has been found on every continent where A. mellifera honey bees are present. SBV attacks both brood and adult stages of bees, but larvae about 2-day old are most susceptible to SBV infections. SBV affects adult bees without causing obvious signs of disease, but the infected adult bees may have a *decreased life span*. SBV infection has been associated with varroa mite infestation. SBV was detected in large amount of adult bees from varroa mite–infested colonies. Stressful circumstances can favor outbreaks of viral diseases, thus any efforts that strengthen the colony health are expected to reduce the risk of virus infections. Since the varroa mite has been proven to be an effective vector in transmitting and activating viruses, timely and efficient control of the varroa mite population will reduce the incidence of viral diseases. * Viruses can act in new and unexpected ways and new viruses keep emerging, forming additional challenges in the elucidation of viral infections. FROM Honey Bee Viruses Yan Ping (Judy) Chen, and Reinhold Siede **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 14:50:57 -0400 Reply-To: "Keith B. Forsyth" Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "Keith B. Forsyth" Organization: Keith B. Forsyth Subject: ONTARIO BEEKEEPERS ASSOCIATION Summer Meeting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ONTARIO BEEKEEPERS ASSOCIATION SUMMER MEETING SATURDAY JULY 12, 2008 RAMARA CENTRE, ORILLA 5482 Highway12 East of Orillia AGENDA 8:30 am Registration=20 9:00 am Welcome and President's Report - Dan Walker 9:20 am Huronia Beekeepers' Association - Gord Slemin, President 9:45 am "Advancements on the Cryopreservation of Honeybee = Spermatozoa" - Ernesto Guzman, Professor, University of Guelph 10:30 am Coffee Break 11:00 am "Honey Bee Viruses and Viral Diseases" - Judy Chen PhD, = Research Entomologist, Bee Research Laboratory, Beltsville, Maryland.=20 12:00 pm Lunch 1:15 pm Queen Auction - We will auction off any queens that = beekeepers are really interested in purchasing and the rest we will do = with Jim Smith's "Toonie Auction" so bring lots of Toonies. Doug 1:45 pm Provincial Apiarist Report - Doug McRory, Provincial Apiarist, = OMAFRA 2:00 pm "Status of Nosema in Ontario, Spring 2008" - Alison Skinner, = Tech Transfer Team Specialist, Ontario Beekeepers' Association 2:30 pm Coffee Break 2:45 pm Canadian Honey Council Report 3:00 pm "Nosema Ceranae, A New Threat of European Honey Bees" - Judy = Chen PhD, Research Entomologist, Bee Research Laboratory, Beltsville, = Maryland.=20 3:45 pm AHoney Plants of Ontario@ - Tibor I Szabo, Ontario = Beekeepers' Association Member If you are a Queen and Nuc Producer and you plan to donate Queens for = the auction please be sure your queens get to the meeting. If you = cannot make it please send them with someone else who is going. =20 =20 Doug McRory Provincial Apiarist Foods of Plant Origin Food Inspection Branch 1 Stone Road West Guelph, ON N1G 4Y2 Telephone: 519 826 3595 1 888 466 2372 6-3595 Fax: 519 826 4375 e-mail:doug.mcrory@ontario.ca http://www.omafra.gov.on.ca/english/food/inspection/bees/apicultu.html =20 =20 -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition.=20 Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 270.4.5/1533 - Release Date: 7/3/2008 = 7:19 PM **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 12:28:58 -0700 Reply-To: gfcg7312003@yahoo.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Grant Gillard Subject: Re: Sugar dusting In-Reply-To: <486D08E0.7090200@evenlink.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Quote: "The honey flow is essentially over. The bees brought no honey into= the=20 supers this season." Where are you located?=A0 Our flow is still going strong (usually over by this time of year) and it's going to be a record year for us. Grant Jackson, MO=A0 (along the Mississippi 100 miles south of St. Louis)=0A=0A= =0A **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 21:41:22 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter Edwards Subject: Re: colony collapse, viruses and microbes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Peter Borst quoted Eric Mussen: > Some colonies with high virus levels survive while others > don't. This suggests that selection and breeding programs could have > real value in this battle to protect bees from mites. We know that some colonies are susceptible to certain viruses and others are resistant, e.g. we can requeen a colony with sacbrood and the sacbrood disappears; TSBV wiped out 95% of cerana colonies in S India in the early 1990s, but they bred from the survivors and TSBV is now not a great problem. Same in the human population - some folks seem to have colds permanently, others never. So is it not logical that some colonies will have a natural resistance to viruses spread by varroa, such as DWV? When varroa first arrived in the UK there were considerable losses; but then things seemed to improve - and this was attributed to beekeepers learning how to cope with varroa. But is that correct? Perhaps it was because those colonies that were highly susceptible to DWV had died out. If this is correct then we need to expose colonies to varroa and select breeders from those that show the best survival rates. Best wishes Peter Edwards beekeepers at stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk www.stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk/ **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 17:33:47 -0400 Reply-To: bee-quick@bee-quick.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Fischer Subject: Re: Sugar dusting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > What happens to the bees if a person uses confectioner's > sugar with corn starch in it rather than powdered sugar, > which is 100% sugar? Nothing at all. The corn starch is absolutely harmless, even in the case of getting it in open brood. There is more indgestible "ash" in many types of honey than there is corn starch in powdered sugar. If you search the archives: http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?A0=bee-l&D=0&H=0&O=T&T=0 for both "powdered sugar" and "powered sugar", you will find my old step-by-step instructions from circa 2000/2001, and you will also find a long discussion on the corn starch. Long story short, there was a time when beekeepers mixed antibiotics with powdered sugar, and sprinkled the mix on the top bars for the treatment of low-level AFB. (We were young... inexperienced... scared... easily led.) While this MIX would kill any open brood into which it fell, and in some cases, caused a serious break in the brood cycle with very high open brood mortality (like 85% and up), this was the antibiotic doing the killing, not the corn starch. Note that the reason that it is called powdered sugar DUSTING, is that it works when one DUSTS the bees with a very fine dusting of poofed sugar, as ephemeral as cigarette smoke. The way it works is that particles in the 5 to 15 micron range clog the mite tarsal pads, and they can't keep their grip on anything, and fall. I know that several people have advocated an approach where powdered sugar is dumped onto the top bars in large quantities like a half a cup per hive or more, and then brushed down between the top bars. This approach clearly will not create the fine particles that work, and will clearly never reach all the bees in the hive. None of these approaches have been tested in controlled studies, so the ONLY method that is sure to work is the more labor-intensive approach of "poofing" each side of each brood frame. If someone wants to do a controlled study to prove the efficacy of the "dump and brush" approach, that would be fine, but this alternative methodology should not be assumed to have any value at all in varroa control, as it may not dislodge any more mites than opening the hive and saying "boo!" in an attempt to scare the mites to death. In my view, those who promote these "easier approaches" are doing a great disservice by misrepresenting these methods as "proven" in the absense of any hard data at all. Remember Sucrocide, and heed the cautionary tale! The proverb is so old, they teach it in Latin 1: "Non omne dulce bonum." - "Not everything sweet is good". **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 17:07:18 -0400 Reply-To: bee-quick@bee-quick.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Fischer Subject: Re: Nosema ceranae MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >> Dr. Edward Knipling, the Administrator of the >> Ag Research Service (ARS), mentioned Nosema >> ceranae as being not commonly found in beehives > I don't where this info comes from. It appears that > nosema is extremely common and we are being told it > is likely mostly ceranae. I think that Ed MEANT TO SAY that nosema cerane was not commonly found IN THE PAST. I think what he might have better said was that Nosema ceranae was not commonly DETECTED, as old "archive" samples have proven that everyone dropped the ball for years, and mis-classified widespread Nosema ceranae as Nosmea apis. So, while we know that Nosema ceranae was a lot more common in the USA than anyone thought, we know it was common for a least the past decade. And as an aside, given the experience with: a) What we all were told was "Varroa Jacobsoni" turning out to be "Varroa destructor", and the difference being glaringly obvious when the two are compared side-by-side, b) What we all were told was "Nosema apis" turning out to be "Nosema ceranae", and the difference being at least noticeable enough to prompt questions from our theoretical "astute and alert" beekeeper. Let's all agree that the next nasty exotic invasive pest or pathogen that starts having its way with our hives needs to be CAREFULLY EXAMINED and compared to all known "close" variants. I for one, am getting tired of not having a good answer to the question "how could everyone we trust have screwed up so badly on something so basic TWICE IN A ROW?" **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 16:53:24 -0400 Reply-To: bee-quick@bee-quick.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Fischer Subject: Re: How bee mites affect the bee immune system MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit An overcast and rainy 4th of July, so we are on the roof deck, overlooking a damp Gotham City. One bright note - the Red Sox are beating the tar out of the Yankees, 6-3 in the 8th. Go Sox! Peter, where's the article from which you quote? Are they talking about Deformed Wing Virus or "ILPV" ("Ian Lipkin's Pet Virus")? Regardless of which virus is the subject of the report, something's amiss here. > "The mites suppressed other immune responses in the > bees, leaving the bees and the colonies more vulnerable > to infection." So, Cox-Foster et al claim that a SUPPRESSED immune response is causing the problem, yet their actual data contradicts that claim. Walk through this with me: > They injected heat-killed E. coli bacteria into virus-infected > bees that were either infested with bee mites or mite free. > The dead bacteria was used to trigger an immune response Fair enough, we all know that will work. Even dead bacteria will certainly trigger an immune system reaction. > Surprisingly, they found that the virus in mite-infested > bees rapidly increased to extremely high levels when the > bee was exposed to the bacteria. This implies that the virus is being spread by the immune system reaction itself, just as has been recently found to be the case with the measles: "we've shown that... a virus replicating only in immune cells causes measles in monkeys." http://pda.physorg.com/lofi-news-virus-measles-epithelium_133236273.html And, apparently, this little trick can be harnessed for medical purposes: http://www.mayoclinic.org/news2007-rst/4387.html So, does this mean that one wants a "suppressed immune response", in bees, as the artificially-induced immune response SPREAD THE VIRUS WITHIN THE BEE? But that is not what Cox-Foster et all seem to want to claim: > "The virus levels in mite-free bees did not change when the > bee was injected with bacteria." But did the mite-free bees have the same set of viruses and infection level as the mite-infested bees? > "The mites suppressed other immune responses in the bees, leaving > the bees and the colonies more vulnerable to infection. This would make sense, except for the part where the induced immune reaction over "nothing" directly resulted in a wider-spread virus. So something is very wrong here. Did anyone read any of this differently? My brain hurts. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 17:52:29 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "Peter L. Borst" Subject: Apiacta MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Reprints of Apiacta publications. The web site is in Spanish but the reprints are English see especially: Nº 1, 1966 1. COMMERCIAL HONEY PRODUCTION CH. MRAZ. PDF 70 Kb. Apiacta 1966 Nº 1. 2. FAR REACHING PRESENT DAY PROBLEMS CONCERNING INSECTICIDES AND THE PROTECTION AGAINST THEM. J. SVOBODA. PDF 74 Kb. Apiacta 1966 Nº 1. 3. NECTAR YELD INCREASE IN FLOWERS REPEATEDLY VISITED BY BEES. A. N. MELNITCHENKO. PDF 329 Kb. Apiacta 1966 Nº 1. 4. SELECTION – A BASIC PROBLEM FOR THE PROGRESS OF THE PRESENT DAY APICULTURE. F. RUTTNER. PDF 137 Kb. Apiacta 1966 Nº 1. 5. THE FUTURE OF BEEKEEPING. G. F. TOWNSEND. PDF 86 Kb. Apiacta 1966 Nº 1. 6. THE ROLE AND IMPORTANCE OF APICULTURAL BY PRODUCTS POLLEN, ROYAL JELLY, BEE VENOM, PROPOLIS. A. CAILLAS. PDF 153 Kb. Apiacta 1966 Nº 1. -- Peter L Borst Danby, NY USA 42.35, -76.50 http://picasaweb.google.com/peterlborst **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 17:53:42 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Harrison Subject: Re: AHB In-Reply-To: <486E1F2C.3070700@sc.rr.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >. Who knows, maybe this will be an exception. Too late to find out now. The plan would have had to been set in place many years ago. Albert Einstein when asked about a possible polar shift being a cause of the dinosaurs being frozen with fresh grass in their stomachs said a polar shift could have happened based on physics. After being raised in a time when burning all hives with AFB did not stop the losses. Then at the darkest moment in beekeeping history a drug saved the industry was discovered at a university in Missouri I can attest to the destructive nature of AFB> Although we will never know for sure I (like Einstein felt about the possibility of a polar shift) believe that the plan to place the foulbrood tainted feed in the remote area *could* have stopped the progress and all hives moving through the area would die within months. Swarms (if any) which made it through *would not* carry a new resistant AFB ( as Keith suggests) but the bees would simply be resistant to the AFB which is common the world over. Rothenbular, Tabor , Purvis and others have said bees which can survive AFB could be bred although no one to my knowledge has come up with such a bee. >From my personal experience ( 48 years beekeeping) I see a bee able to function normally with AFB as a pipe dream. I have looked over many attempts by others but never had the interest to keep a hive with AFB around the place. Tabor kept hives around with AFB for decades ( personal conversation with Tabor) trying to find a bee to tolerate AFB but no hive can thrive (in my opinion) with such a loss of workers as even light cases of AFB can cause. bob **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 17:38:50 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Eric Simms Subject: Re: Beyond the Honeybee MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "Economy of scale comes into any business decision. Small is not necessaril= y good nor is big. There is a right point where production costs and demand= meet."=0A=0AAgreed.=A0 My point is that beekeeping isn't over just because= CCD is reducing colony numbers.=A0 Some beekeepers are keen and will make = a big move forward, while others will give up and thus perish.=A0 Darwin kn= ows business as much as he knew biology.=0AEric the sideliner from Howe, TX= =0A=0A=0A **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Jul 2008 00:28:30 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Jerry Bromenshenk Subject: Re: Nosema ceranae MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Peter and others Our data from winter 2006-present show a very high incidence of Nosema ceranae - its virtually in every operation that we've sampled that also reported colony collapse. We did not find it in all colonies, even in CCD cases - but we've recently changed our sampling protocol. Originally, we took one sample of bees from a mix of bee ages. Now we take one sample of very young bees, and one of the oldest bees. This makes a big difference in detection - the Spanish observation that N. ceranae occurs in bees of different ages, depending on the time of year and the stage of infestation (initial, well established, etc.). Lesson learned - if you see dead bees on the ground in front of the hive, don't assume pesticide kill, or that it was some rare virus. We've found that these bees may be loaded with N. ceranae. We look at all samples for Nosema. We send samples to Robb Cramer in Bozeman for PCR. Last summer, fall, winter, Robb did not find any N. apis. But this spring, he found both N. apis and N. ceranae in some of the samples we sent - so N. apis hasn't disappeared. As always, it tends to show up in the spring. We're currently tracking various treatments - will know by end of summer what worked. Jerry **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 21:53:16 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Ramona?= Subject: Re: colony collapse, viruses and microbes Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I wonder if the waxy coating on the bees is deteriorated by acids (formic/oxalic) thus providing a way in for pathogens and/or a way out for moisture, compromising the bees. A way to kill a poison ivy vine is to spray some of the leaves with horticultural vinegar (about 15% acetic acid solution..stronger than "eating" vinegar). The acetic acid in the vinegar strips the leaves of their waxy coating and the vine dehydrates through the leaves and dies. Just a thought... Ramona **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Jul 2008 11:03:49 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?windows-1252?Q?Steve_Noble?= Subject: How bee mites affect the bee immune system Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Jim Fischer writes: “But did the mite-free bees have the same set of viruses and infection level as the mite-infested bees?” “So something is very wrong here. Did anyone read any of this differently? My brain hurts.” At the risk of suffering the same malady and inflicting it on others, my reading is that the experiment measured the CHANGE in virus infection levels. So they must have measured the levels of both Varroa infested and Varroa free colonies before injecting them as well as after, but for the purposes of showing the DIFFERENCE in the amount of CHANGE in virus levels, what these comparative levels were at the beginning would not be so important as long as some viruses were present in both groups at the beginning, which I think we can assume was the case. “This implies that the virus is being spread by the immune system reaction itself, just as has been recently found to be the case with the measles:” Could be but couldn’t it also be that viruses are not being attacked as much in a compromised immune system and therefore are able to reproduce more rapidly? “This would make sense, except for the part where the induced immune reaction over "nothing" directly resulted in a wider-spread virus.” Solid conclusions are hard to come to from what is given, but I could see the possibility that the bacteria may have acted to divert immune system resources away from the virus front in each group, and in the immune compromised group this might have more devastating results in terms of being able to fight off viruses. Steve Noble **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Jul 2008 20:30:08 -0400 Reply-To: bee-quick@bee-quick.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Fischer Subject: Re: How bee mites affect the bee immune system MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >> Yang and Cox-Foster looked at how bee mites >> affect the bee immune system... Steve said: > Could be but couldn't it also be that viruses are not > being attacked as much in a compromised immune system > and therefore are able to reproduce more rapidly? If this were the case, then the extra step of invoking an immune response in the bees would have no value to the experiment. One could simply sample, look at virus levels, wait a bit, and look at virus levels again. Perhaps the messing around with invoking an immune response was a useless extra step included merely in an attempt to make their work look less like a mere repeat and confirmation of Judy Chen's work at Beltsville in the area of mites as vectors for the spread of viruses in bees. Dunno. But I did some searching, and realized that this is not new work at all! This was from 2005! http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2005/05/050517110843.htm "The Penn State researchers report their findings in today's (May 17, 2005) online version of the Proceedings of the National Academy of Science." I'm surprised to learn that Diana Cox-Foster had done any work at all related to bees as early as 2005. This work has clearly not since proven to be of value in any of their subsequent work, and we need not furrow our brows to try to understand it. With all the mite/virus work done since then in regard to CCD, when even the Penn State team itself does not cite their work, they are clearly hoping that everyone just forgets this work. That's the cool thing about citation indexes. The good work rises quickly to the top, and the bad work quickly disappears from view. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Jul 2008 05:10:03 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: C Hooper Subject: Freezing is Best Way to Maintain Quality of Royal Jelly Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Freezing is Best Way to Maintain Quality of Royal Jelly Proteomics Analysis of Major Royal Jelly Protein Changes under Different Storage Conditions Journal of Proteome Research, July 3, 2008 http://apitherapy.blogspot.com/2008/07/study-freezing-is-best-way-to-maintain.html Abstract: Protein changes in fresh royal jelly (RJ) were compared when stored at −20, 4 °C, and room temperature (RT) for 12 months… **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Jul 2008 23:16:35 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: Sugar dusting In-Reply-To: <003c01c8de1d$a5007e70$0201000a@j> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline > I know that several people have advocated an approach where > powdered sugar is dumped onto the top bars in large quantities > like a half a cup per hive or more, and then brushed down > between the top bars. This approach clearly will not create > the fine particles that work, and will clearly never reach > all the bees in the hive. A picture is worth a thousand words (perhaps it is not so clear--I'll leave it up to the viewers). See http://www.scientificbeekeeping.com//index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=31&Itemid=40&limit=1&limitstart=9 > If someone wants to do a controlled study to prove the efficacy > of the "dump and brush" approach, Done, just haven't published data yet. Have been too busy working in the field, and replying to silly criticism. > this alternative methodology should not be assumed to have > any value at all in varroa control, as it may not dislodge > any more mites than opening the hive and saying "boo!" We didn't use "boo" as a control, but did open the lid and smoke as control. There was substantial difference in mite drop at 10 and 30 minutes. As well as at 1, 2, 4,8,12, and 24 hrs. Multiple colonies, singles and doubles. 72 hr natural drops as well as 300-bee wash samples from every colony. In short, our findings were that sugar dusting is more accurate as a determination of mite level in a colony, than either natural mite fall or 300-bee alcohol wash. However, sugar dusting is not effective at reducing mite levels. To us, it is highly useful for quickly screening all colonies in yards for mite levels (2 men can test 400 colonies easily in an afternoon, plus drop a substantial portion of the phoretic mites). However, for hobbyists, sugar dusting along with drone removal appears to be quite effective. The drone removal is likely the major component, with sugar dusting as the drone frame is returned an easy add. I do not yet have data on the combination. >In my view, those > who promote these "easier approaches" are doing a great > disservice by misrepresenting these methods as "proven" > in the absense of any hard data at all. That would certainly be the case. But IMHO doesn't apply in this case. Sorry about not saying "boo" in the controls. Randy Oliver Currently Down Under **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Jul 2008 08:41:53 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?UTF-8?Q?Peter_Borst?= Subject: Re: How bee mites affect the bee immune system Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Jim asks >Peter, where's the article from which you quote? It was from a Penn State news release but the work is reported as "Impact of an ectoparasite on the immunity and pathology of an invertebrate: Evidence for host immunosuppression and viral amplification" by Xiaolong Yang and Diana L. Cox-Foster* Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences May 24, 2005 vol. 102 no. 21 **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Jul 2008 15:42:15 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: Nosema ceranae In-Reply-To: <003b01c8de19$f1b50460$0201000a@j> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline > I for one, am getting tired of not having a good answer > to the question "how could everyone we trust have screwed > up so badly Here's another one, Jim, >From the 1980's. In Calif, yellow star thistle is a devastatingly invasive weed. A search was launched for a biocontrol in it's home country (I believe it was Turkey). They found two flies--the Peacock Fly and the False Peacock Fly. The False also used cornflower as an alternative host, so gov't adamantly did not want it imported. So they set up careful protocols, quarantine, and examination, and imported a few Peacocks--being very careful to exclude the False Peacocks (the two look similar). The Peacocks were released. Several years later the biocontrol proved to be quite effective and had spread widely (yellow star thistle no longer produces a honey flow in my area). When they checked the seedheads to confirm the presence of the biocontrol, they were surprised to find no Peacock Flies, but a thriving population of False Peacocks! Was a bit embarrassing for them. Randy Oliver **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Jul 2008 19:05:57 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Harrison Subject: Re: Beyond the Honeybee In-Reply-To: <957713.89870.qm@web36602.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello Eric & All, > My point is that beekeeping isn't over just because CCD is reducing colony > numbers. Those which are surviving colony losses the best are those which anticipate losses are coming (myself) and are splitting a larger amount. David Mendez ( ABF Pres.)said that splitting in larger numbers has helped him deal with up to 50% losses since the start of the die off. > Some beekeepers are keen and will make a big move forward, while others > will give up and thus perish. Having been in the industry over four decades I do not see many commercial beeks giving up. They usually go down fighting. Borrow till they can not borrow money! You heard what the commercial beek said when he won the lottery and the press asked what he was going to do with the money? "Keep on commercial beekeeping until the money is gone!" Two years of losses in a row is usually enough to force an outfit to close the doors. On strange thing about CCD is that for the most part those which were hit the hardest seem to get a decent year the next but many are reporting troubles already this year. Getting hit in the pocket book is a real wake up call! (first hand experience). Instantly the bees welfare takes priority in the outfit. You can not tell what is going on in the bee yard from your office or easy chair. Cutting corners, guessing at what is going on in the bee yards and simply not taking the time to run bees can be costly in today's beekeeping. A single poor decision can cost dearly. Aside from current beekeeping problems the weather has been working against most beekeepers for the past decade. Too dry or too wet. No middle ground. Even the weathermen are not getting the weather predictions correct (or in some cases even close!). Quote from Jerry Hayes at a National meeting I attended: " I don't believe now is the best time to go into commercial beekeeping" I agree! If beeks with completely paid for operations ( like myself and other old timers) with decades of beekeeping experience are having troubles then if getting into commercial beekeeping was the plan for a new beekeeper I would move in slowly and carefully. Start small and not give up the day job right away> bob ps. One commercial beek said since CCD he has become a "go Getter" Said he got his wife a job in town and now he goes and gets her each day! **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 14:17:05 +1200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Barry Donovan Subject: Re: BEE-L Digest - 4 Jul 2008 to 5 Jul 2008 (#2008-183) In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit CCD, external acarine mites, and prions. Hello All, Here is some speculation. Jerry Bromenshenk said that when hives showing CCD were moved into an apiary, nearby colonies which were previously healthy began showing CCD. Therefore a causative agent apparently spread from the original infected colonies. There are reports of localised, CCD-like collapses from throughout the last 100-odd years in the U.S., under other names such as `spring dwindling', `autumn collapse', and `disappearing disease'. So perhaps the same agent has been around for a long time, much longer than the Israeli virus and/or Nosema ceranae? So what could have transmitted the agent? The external acarine mites, Acarapis dorsalis and A. externus, were known from North America long before the advent of the internal acarine mite and varroa. Both external acarine mites feed on bee blood, the former on the underside and sides of the neck of a bee, and the latter on the thorax, through the intersegmental membranes. So perhaps these mites vectored the infective agent? What infective agent could cause foragers to not return to hives? Prions in mammals infect the brain, causing, scrapie in sheep, kuru in humans in the New Guinea Highlands, and Creutzfeldt-Jacob Disease (CJD, mad cow disease) in humans in Europe and elsewhere. The central nervous system decays with consequent loss of memory etc. Prions are differently-folded proteins which can replicate by causing other proteins to fold in a similar way. Prions are known to occur in some insects. Perhaps the advent of acarine and varroa in North America has greatly increased the distribution and rate of spread of prions infecting the brains of bees, causing memory loss and so failure of foragers to return to hives, and so resulting in the widespread collapse of many more colonies than previously? Is anyone looking for prions in bees? Regards, Barry Donovan, New Zealand. Visit our website at http://www.crop.cri.nz ______________________________________________________ CAUTION: The information contained in this email is privileged and confidential. If you read this message and you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination, distribution or reproduction of all or part of the contents is prohibited. If you receive this message in error, please notify the sender immediately. Any opinions or views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not represent those of their employer. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 03:42:06 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: C Hooper Subject: Honey Helps Prevent Liver Damage Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Honey Helps Prevent Liver Damage Honey Prevents Hepatic Damage Induced by Obstruction of the Common Bile Duct World J Gastroenterol, 2008 June;14(23):3729-3732 http://apitherapy.blogspot.com/2008/07/honey-helps-prevent-liver-damage.html AIM: To examine the possible effects of honey supplementation on hepatic damage due to obstruction of the common bile duct in an experimental rat model… **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 09:02:11 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu Comments: RFC822 error: Invalid RFC822 field - "Thank you very much for the practical and positive outlook, despite =". Rest of header flushed. From: Eric Simms Subject: Re: Beyond the Honeybee Comments: To: Bob Harrison MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Bob:=0AThank you very much for the practical and positive outlook, despite = the general pesimism inherent to the BEE-L.=A0=A0I do realize that=A0most b= eeks are pessimistic and down as a means of discouraging others from discov= ering their pot of gold and becoming competitors.=A0 The same ones that com= plain the most have told me of their tremendous fortunes as beeks, but=A0th= ey will only admit it=A0off-line.=0AI agree with you - now is a dicey time = to dive into commercial beekeeping, though I know a few young individuals w= ho have recently made that decision.=A0 I offer them nothing but encouragem= ent=A0because I know from my own experience that almost all of my successes= were possible by my ignorance of just how difficult they would be to achie= ve.=A0 If I had all the negatives displayed before me at the outset, I woul= d not have embarked, and instead sought more probable successes.=A0 One who= is commited, positive and can-do will overcome the obstacles and succeed.= =0AAs the French say, "Bon Courage." =0ABoth th= e ABF and AHPA have difficulty with some=A0old timers being perpetually neg= ative and discouraging, regardless of how good market conditions really are= .=A0 How do you attract and train a younger generation of beeks when the ve= terans don't want anyone to see or hear anything except "the sky is falling= ."=0A=0AEric-the-optimistic-sidliner-in-Howe, TX=0A=0A=0A **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 12:06:45 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Harrison Subject: Kansas City Star bee article In-Reply-To: <6D98A3AA070D4AAFA416F15EB8A7DB1A@bobPC> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello All, Another article on the vanishing bees. Go to www.kansascity.com and click on "Vanishing bees pose a threat for humans" The author included a small photo gallery you can click on for a few photos of Busy Bee Acres Apiaires. The young author followed us around as daily work goes on and this time of year I do not have time to sit and talk to a reporter. About the time the reporter arrived 10 queens from John & Christy Horton ( Bee-L members ) arrived for me to test by not treating. I checked this morning John and all are alive and laying in the nucs. Typical vanishing bee story. The three largest outfits are all seeing some problems of dwindling starting but only in areas of tasseling corn. Sincerely, Bob Harrison **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 13:22:29 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Jerry Bromenshenk Subject: Clarification MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I was digging post holes this weekend, so I didn't check my e-mail. For clarification: Since Dee has posted a confirmation of sampling of bees to Bee-L - I can say; yes, we did sample Dee's bees. We also did a preliminary test for Nosema and Tracheal mites, and followed that up with PCR for both species of Nosema. We were not able to look for viruses until the IVDS instrument was up and running. That event occurred about 6 weeks ago - we first had to raise the money to buy the instrument, then Dave Wick had to resolve some licence issues. All of that has been accomplished, and Dave is now running samples for virus screening on a daily basis. We have got some very prelimary data and Dee has received some VERY summary comment. We're re-running all of the samples at this time - since we've been fine tuning the instrument and have learned how to get better performance from the system. So, to clarify: Dee has had only a very cursory report from us - since we're not finished with the analyses. I did e-mail her PCR results, but she doesn't have the software needed to read the data file, so we're sending it via snail mail. Dee has been very understanding and very open - until we got the IVDS in place and the required licenses, we couldn't look for viruses. The only results we have completed are for Tracheal Mites and for both species of Nosema, We will have a full set of viruses results shortly. Finally: Jim Fisher has not received a copy of the results Dee's for bees. We still don't have the full set of results. No one outside of our research group in Missoula has seen the results for her bees, not even USDA. Jim Fisher does know that we have sampled her bees, and he has known for some time that we have samples from AZ. Dean's e-mail could be construed to say we aren't doing anything - that we've had the samples for far too long without a report. I'd say that our goal of turning around sample results within 24-48 hrs has not been accomplished here. Dave Wick and I have over 500 samples in the backlog from last fall-spring. But, we're working through them now. And, I don't think an apology is necessary. This whole issue is based on too many people taking a bit of information and then generalizing. However, now that the IVDS instrument is up and running, Dave and I will give priority to any samples from beekeepers who: 1) are experiencing a loss of bees, and 2) who depend on bees for a significant part of their income. We will try to turn results around in a few days - not weeks or months. In other words, we will try our best to help out beekeepers as problems emerge. We can't do anything about the backlog, but we can prioritize new events. And, we will try to help out the hobby beekeeper, but we need to consider the magnitude of the impact. If you've two colonies, its personal. You want your bees to thrive, and we do to, but you can probably survive the loss from an economic standpoint. If you derive your income for bees, have hundreds to thousands of colonies at risk, we might be able to help provide answers that you can use to make management decisions. In the meantime, I hate to see finger pointing, he said, she said. I apologize if anything we've stated added to the confusion. Jerry **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 23:15:49 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: main account Subject: Re: DWV not transferred by varroa mites? In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit 'Instead, the infection has been found only inside > the gut of the varroa, suggesting that the mite > has merely eaten it from the bodies of bees already > infected'. I understand that the research found virus particles were concentrated in the gut of the mite, and could not be passed back to the mouthparts because of a membrane in the throat. That suggests the virus comes out of the mite the other way - in the feces. I understand mites submerge themselves in the residual brood food when entering a cell about to be sealed. Might the mites then defecate into the brood food, so that the larvae eats virus and becomes infected? The daughter mites that are born in the sealed cell would then become infected by feeding on the larvae. And so the infection goes on and on. Perhaps that transmission mechanism explains why bees emerging from cells entered by more than one varroa show shriveled wings - their food was doubly contaminated. But as Jim says, does clarification of the transmission mechanism help at all in the task of finding ways to break the natural cycle of infection? Is it likely we can protect the residual brood food from contamination? Seems a hard one. Robin Dartington **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 19:43:38 -0700 Reply-To: deelusbybeekeeper@yahoo.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Dee Lusby Subject: Re: BEE-L Digest - 4 Jul 2008 to 5 Jul 2008 (#2008-183) In-Reply-To: <48722561.6B14.0080.0@crop.cri.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Barry Donovan: The external acarine mites, Acarapis dorsalis and A. externus, were known from North America long before the advent of the internal acarine mite and varroa. Reply: You left one out of those reports you noted: Acarapis Vagans which are normally found on the wing bases where the first thoraxic spiracle is and since mites back then were identified by point of infestation then the Vagans were outside mites at the wing bases are and only soft hairs that need to toughen up keeping them from going internally fwiw. I show the A dorsalis in what I have to read being usually located in the scutellar groove. And note again back then (and probably still) "Separation of species" was based on point of infestation and "shape of the mite's posterior coxal plate". Nosema back then was like today: Strong/healthy colonies no problem,...weak or queenless colonies were much more problemmatic. Now I am talking 1960 and earlier here with reports of mite seeing all the way back in USA to about 1917. So like Barry Donovan says, and I agree with, the problem has been around a long time with connection to nosema. But Barry also writes: What infective agent could cause foragers to not return to hives? Reply: Well, to me treatments in a hive or pesticides picked up in foraging could do this especially with the number of chemicals found contaminating broodnest when looked at by Maryam Frazier, which I think is very good work done by her. For Fluvalinate is a memory retardant used early on crops for intial spraying prior to more toxic which generally used to be organo phosphates of which coumaphos is and neuro toxic to extreme or at least used to be. But both are now used in beehives. Temik or aldicarb used to be another big field problem for bees way back, especially down in fla in the citrus areas (but we have citrus too in Calif), but don't know if it is still used, though assume it is, but could be wrong. It is a highly toxic immune deficiency breakdown chemical that even in humans at 1/10 part per billion if I remember correctly, induces symptoms similar to AIDS.......so what it does to bees for health problems for immunal distress might be checked relative to CCD. Could they cause bees to not return home? Well, it's said it takes food in a bees gut to be able to forage at all. So they fill up to a certain extent to fly out to find stuff to bring home. But if memory retardants are in hives and neuro toxic contamination also, it might make it hard to fly properly, and remember where home is, and if other chemicals are used to breach immune system, or say pollen or carb food (honey or syrups) compromised some way due to treatments, then makes it hard to work to begin with and then get back home......as basic as I can put it. But Barry, interesting to see you pulled up old mite knowledge from our country dating back to 1917 and still talked about even in the 1960s in our various labs when looking at bee problems. Kinda like history repeating itself though now more complicated due to field management with stuff in hives now as Maryam Frazier now talks about. Might be interesting for her and Jerry to team up and compare works side by side to see what correlations are....... Dee A. Lusby **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * ****************************************************