From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Feb 28 11:04:23 2009 Return-Path: <> X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.8 (2007-02-13) on industrial X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-87.1 required=2.4 tests=ADVANCE_FEE_1,AWL, MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR,SPF_HELO_PASS,USER_IN_WHITELIST autolearn=disabled version=3.1.8 X-Original-To: adamf@IBIBLIO.ORG Delivered-To: adamf@IBIBLIO.ORG Received: from listserv.albany.edu (unknown [169.226.1.24]) by metalab.unc.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1088A4850F for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2009 11:03:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from listserv.albany.edu (listserv.albany.edu [169.226.1.24]) by listserv.albany.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n1SG3Y6c017265 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2009 11:03:36 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 11:03:35 -0500 From: "University at Albany LISTSERV Server (14.5)" Subject: File: "BEE-L LOG0808D" To: adamf@IBIBLIO.ORG Message-ID: Content-Length: 107828 Lines: 2139 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 09:31:18 +0000 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Gavin Ramsay Subject: Re: Foraging flights MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Mornin' All Lloyd: gentleness is most definitely the way forward! Anyway, Jerry's observations show why, usually, the 3 mile limit is a workable guide. The times when a sizeable foraging force goes further are probably not rare, but not the norm either. However you have to be careful with displacement experiments. A colony working a distant spot might recognise the terrain in the channel it uses to reach its distant goal, but if you left bees at the same kind of distance but on another trajectory would they know where they are then? Similarly, when following bees outwards from a colony, the area available (and the likelihood of missing the bees) increases dramatically as the radius increases. Steve: interesting questions on reorientation. You get the feeling that bees on long journeys know the vector and the distance, and even then are reluctant to set off off unless the view is clear and ideally there is a scent trail coming at them to help get there. Perhaps they have a usual home range which is well-known territory, stored like a mental map, plus an ability to go further on special occasions on known routes. I'm a bit like that myself, knowing my home area well and prepared to set off on foot knowing that I'll get back from any point. If setting off on long journeys often on motorways even to new places I'll be happy if I know a few simple rules to get me there and back again. Once I get to that distant spot I'd be reluctant to wander about too far on foot, as I may lose my way back to the car. Also, Steve wrote: > Also I assume a hive that has to go farther than three to five miles > for forage is probably either not going to make it or is not going > to stay put in the long run. For sure the income of such a hive would be reduced but as about 14 km seems to be the upper limit for foraging worker honeybees you would imagine that at around half that distance they would still make a profit. Bear in mind too that all of this is seasonal. The bees of Brother Adam and of Francis Ratnieks could forage locally earlier in the season, but found it worthwhile to go long distances once the heather moors were in flower. Similarly, the bees I mentioned had enjoyed abundant autumn sown oilseed rape earlier in the season and at that time, later in the summer, had some native forage nearby but the best resources were to be found at the very few and often distant spring sown oilseed rape fields in flower at the time. Those late-season foragers may also have benefited from better weather in July and been driven to forage long distances by increased competition from other pollinators. If anyone wants to look at the edges of rich patches of forage to see where the bees are coming from, focus on the bees leaving the patch or field. They are heavier and slower than the ones coming in which often fly at speed and at height. Also helpful is a dark cloud approaching on the horizon! The bees seem to realise the danger, and exit the patch in numbers. best wishes Gavin **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 23:11:45 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: Wavelength and infection In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline > > > Has anyone tried radiating hive infestation of chemicals or parasites with > different wavelengths of sound or light"? Dr Zachary Huang tried microwave wavelengths that would appear to have an effect on the mite. He found them ineffective--likely because the mite is so small that the heat absorbed by the water dissipated quickly. He presented at the American Bee Research Conference in Sacramento this winter. Randy Oliver **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 05:43:07 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: C Hooper Subject: Propolis Flavonoid Has Neuroprotective Effect Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Propolis Flavonoid Has Neuroprotective Effect Pinocembrin Prevents Glutamate-Induced Apoptosis in SH-SY5Y Neuronal Cells Via Decrease of bax/bcl-2 Ratio European Journal of Pharmacology, Volume 591, Issues 1-3, 4 September 2008, Pages 73-79 http://apitherapy.blogspot.com/2008/08/propolis-flavonoid-has-neuroprotective.html Pinocembrin is the most abundant flavonoids in propolis, and has been proven to have antioxidant, antibacterial and anti-inflammatory property. To assess the protective effects of pinocembrin on neurons, SH-SY5Y neuronal cells were pretreated with pinocembrin for 2 h followed by co-treatment with glutamate (2 mM) for 12 h… **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 22:51:26 -0400 Reply-To: bee-quick@bee-quick.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Fischer Subject: Re: Wavelength and infection MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Has anyone tried radiating hive infestation of chemicals or parasites > with different wavelengths of sound or light"? > He argues that most every organism or molecule has a wavelength which > will destroy it. He is perfectly correct about the "light" approach, but "sound" would have very limited applications for tiny things like chemicals and parasites, and would be better suited for larger objects, like bridges and buildings. Now some atomic bonds require a great deal of energy to break, so we can't expect this to work easily for everything, but many modern pesticides are specifically designed to break down in sunlight. I think that most exploit the UV component of sunlight. There is also electron beam ("e-Beam") irradiation, such as the devices that the Post Office bought after the anthrax mailings in 2001. This is nothing more than a stream of electrons at high energy, and it is said to be powerful enough to kill any living thing. Third, there is the "gamma radiation" of the sort used to irradiate food, and which has been used to decontaminate comb and woodenware. So, we have Sunlight (UV photons), e-Beam (electrons), and gamma radiation (also photons). Regardless of the choice of photons or electrons, the process is roughly the same. Understanding all this will allow you to see yet another reason why I am so certain that CCD is a "pathogen problem" rather than a "pesticide problem", if you accept that irradiation makes a tangible difference to new colonies installed on CCD deadout comb. There are two terms to grock - "flux" and "energy": "Flux" is the number of bullets flying through a specific slice of air, and "Energy" is the muzzle velocity of the bullets. Solar UV radiation is much higher flux but much lower energy than the gamma radiation that was used to decontaminate combs in the Penn State attempt to clean up the "Hackenberg CCD Dead-outs. Radiation from e-Beam would also be "high energy, low flux". The energy difference means that a gamma photon will destroy a chemical bond in any atom it hits, while a UV photon has a much smaller probability of destroying a bond (by a factor of thousands), and can only affect certain types of bonds anyway. Any virus is thousands of times larger than any pesticide molecule, but a virus and a pesticide molecule each represent one functional unit. The destruction of almost any single atomic bond in a virus will likely inactivate (kill) the virus. This is true for the pesticide molecule as well, but the virus is much larger and needs many more intact bonds in order to stay functional/operational. A given flux of radiation will destroy a large percentage of the virus particles in a given sample and a much smaller percentage of pesticide molecules because of the size difference. Some pesticide molecules will be "missed" by the "bullets". Its a statistical thing. What all this means is that modern pesticides (but not pathogens) are more likely broken down by simply UV from sunlight, where pathogens and not pesticides) are more likely broken down by irradiation. Lastly, sound. If I had a big enough subwoofer and a powerful enough amplifier, I could simulate an earthquake. The 1970s schlock disaster movie "Earthquake" did exactly that in theaters. They called it "Sensurround". There are also "resonances" that can bring down bridges, which is why solders marching across bridges are always told to break step, and not march in step with each other. But sound waves are very long (low frequency) as compared to the sizes of pesticides and pathogens, so I'm going to guess that the "sound" end of the electromagnetic spectrum is going to not have any impact on tiny things. Resonance works in things that are longer than the wavelength. (Wavelength is the inverse of the frequency, and "sound" we can hear ranges from 10 Hz to 16kHz.) Aren't you so glad you asked? :) **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 07:07:29 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Juanse Barros Subject: Insect Virus Researcher for UC Davis MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline http://entomology.ucdavis.edu/news/michelleflenniken.html -- Juanse Barros J. APIZUR S.A. Carrera 695 Gorbea - CHILE +56-45-271693 08-3613310 http://apiaraucania.blogspot.com/ juanseapi@gmail.com **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 12:05:33 +0000 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Gavin Ramsay Subject: Foraging on the doorstep MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi All I've been wondering about this assumption that bees placed in the middle of a plot will preferentially work that plot before heading out to seek other flowers in the vicinity. Folk often make this assumption, perhaps because it seems so logical and energetically sensible. There is a study on bumble bees that notes that a patch is worked better when the bees are located *away* from the patch. See below for the abstract. Why they should do this is guesswork - maybe they like having a poop in the great outdoors before they settle down to bring in the goodies?! Honeybees are known to like to set up home some distance from the old one (around 800 m according to my Swarm Lure packet). Also, many people have observed that if you site a colony on the edge of a field, they don't necessarily work that one but sometimes fly off in another direction. Anyone know of such studies in honeybees? all the best Gavin W. E. Dramstad, G. L. A. Fryb and M. J. Schafferc. 2002. Bumblebee foraging—is closer really better? Journal of Insect Physiology 42: 1089-1094. Abstract: Bumblebees are important pollinators of crops and wild flowers, and their foraging range has considerable management interest. It is commonly assumed that bumblebees prefer to forage as close to their nest as possible. However, a review of the literature shows that there is little empirical evidence to support this assumption. An experiment aimed at investigating whether bumblebee workers forage close to their nests, and distances between three commercially produced bumblebee nests and an introduced forage patch were manipulated. The results presented here show that bumblebee workers significantly increased their use of a flower resource after their nests had been moved from within the resource to more than 100 m away. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 17:52:59 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Brian Ames Subject: Self Contamination and Ag Pesticide Analysis Program Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit http://maarec.psu.edu/CCDPpt/CostsharingProgram.pdf Cost-sharing Program for Pesticide Analysis of Honey Bee Colony Matrices (honey, wax, pollen, bees, brood, etc.) Based on recent evidence of high pesticide levels in wax, pollen and brood, beekeepers have expressed an interest in having samples from their own colonies/apiaries tested for pesticides. The USDA, National Science Lab in Gastonia NC is capable of screening all hive matrices for up to171 pesticides at or near the ppb level. This lab is part of the USDAs Agriculture Marketing Service (AMS) and conducts a program to collect and analyze pesticide residue levels in agricultural commodities, including honey. These data are confidential and the property of the contractor. Although the AMS cost of analysis is below commercial rates, the analysis of individual samples is costly. The cost of analysis for coumaphos and fluvalinate in wax is $90 per sample. The cost of full pesticide screening (171 pesticides) in any hive matrix is $205 per sample. We have received funding from the Foundation for the Preservation of Honey Bees and Project Apis mellifera (PAm) to establish a program to help reduce the cost of these analyses. This funding allows us to pay half the cost of the analysis per sample. Beekeepers wishing to have samples analyzed will pay $45 for miticides, or $100 per sample for the full screen of 171 pesticides. The information generated from individual samples will become part of a large centralized, and highly confidential data-base maintained at Penn State. In addition to the analytical results of your samples, we will also provide data on all samples analyzed up to that point in time (your levels compared to the average level and range in the entire data base). If you are interested in participating in this program, please contact Maryann Frazier at the address below and we will provide you with information on submitting samples for analysis. We are particularly interested in encouraging the participation of organic and small beekeepers in this program. Maryann Frazier Senior Extension Associate Department of Entomology 501 ASI Building University Park, PA 16802 Phone: (814) 865-4621 Fax: (814) 865-3048 Email: mxt15@psu.edu **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 22:58:27 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Dee Lusby Subject: U.S. District Court Judge Orders Suspension of NAIS (from the John Birch Society Web site) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This just came across the organic list and now posting here for all to be a= ware. =A0 D- =A0 U.S. District Court Judge Orders Suspension of NAIS (from the John Birch So= ciety Web site)=20 Date: 08/23/2008 11:42:15 PM Mountain Daylight Time=20 From: maryjofahey@tds.net=20 To: WAPFchapterleaders@yahoogroups.com=20 Hi, This article was posted on the Health and Healing list (4,254 members).=20 When I looked at the link to the original article, I wondered what "JBS" st= ood for. It's the John Birch Society (about as far to the right as you can = go). Mary Jo Fahey Madison, Wisconsin http://www.jbs.org/index.php/jbs-news-feed/7-jbs-news-feed/2188-farmers-and= -ranchers-fight-nais-and-win Farmers and Ranchers Fight NAIS =96 and Win=20 Written by Ann Shibler=20 Friday, 25 July 2008 12:58=20 Small farmers, big ranchers, home farmers, animal and pet owners, and food = freedom advocates have come together to legally fight implementation of the= U.S. Department of Agriculture=92s National Animal Identification System (= NAIS). The results are encouraging. Farm and ranch organizations, R-CALF USA being one of the leaders, along wi= th the Farm-to-Consumer Foundation, NoNais.org run by farmer Walter Jeffrie= s in Vermont, Farm and Ranch Freedom Alliance, and even a few rural newspap= ers, along with some concerned attorneys, have done yeoman=92s service in t= he fight to oppose the onerous and intrusive NAIS =96 the program initiated= to track and monitor all animals and their movements. R-CALF USA along with several states=92 cattlemen=92s associations has now = accused the USDA of, among other things: improperly acquiring premises regi= strations by =93registering premises without farmer or rancher consent,=94 = by tapping into different states=92 agriculture databases and county fair r= ecords, and using improper tactics directed at 4-H participants; proceeding= without regard to cost, liability and confidentiality concerns for livesto= ck producers; misrepresenting the Privacy Act protections; and of protectin= g and assisting meatpackers in transferring NAIS information to carcasses, = thereby exposing individual producers to liability for problems that occur = or are created after the animal leaves the farm. With this in mind, R-CALF and a host of other concerned associations have f= ormally requested leaders of the Senate Committee on Homeland Security and = Governmental Affairs, and the House Committee on Oversight and Government R= eform, to halt advancement of NAIS and to conduct oversight hearings on the= USDA=92s activities. Also, on June 4, 2008, the U.S. District Court, District of Columbia, order= ed the USDA to suspend its plan to establish by June 9, 2008 a system of re= cords entitled =93National Animal Identification System.=94 The suspension = was immediate and indefinite and was the result of a legal case, Mary-Louis= e Zanoni v. United States Department of Agriculture. Mary-Louise Zanoni is = an upstate New York attorney and leading farm activist in the fight to prot= ect the traditional rights of farmers. The suit was filed in an attempt to = seek access to the NAIS database to determine its accuracy. The USDA=92s proposed NAIS program, incidentally never voted into law by Co= ngress, was supposed to be a three-step =93voluntary=94 program, but in man= y states it is anything but. Wisconsin farmer Jeff Pausma, who runs a relat= ively small dairy operation of about 60 cows, received a letter stating tha= t if he did not comply with the Wisconsin NAIS law, he would lose his milk = producer license. For Pausma, the expense of having to participate in the p= rogram with its mandatory electronic tagging system is quite a bit of a fin= ancial burden as well. As a small farmer, every one of his cows must be ide= ntified, tagged, and tracked, each with separate numbers. Meanwhile, factor= y-style mega-farms need only one federal ID number for the whole farm, an i= njustice clearly in favor of big agribusiness. Another small farm activist group, Farm-to-Consumer Legal Defense Fund, fil= ed suit on July 14, 2008, also in the U.S. District Court, District of Colu= mbia, to stop the USDA and the Michigan Department of Agriculture (MDA) fro= m implementing NAIS as well. The MDA had already implemented the first two = steps, namely property registration and animal identification, and the suit= asks the court for an injunction to stop NAIS at either the state or feder= al levels. Fund President Taaron Meikle, who calls the program one that =93= only a bureaucrat could love,=94 also says that existing programs for disea= ses and state laws on branding along with existing record keeping already p= rovide the mechanisms needed for tracking. This new suit charges the USDA with never having published NAIS rules, a vi= olation of the Federal Administrative Procedures Act; never having performe= d an Environmental Impact Statement or Assessment as required by law; and a= lso violation of religious freedoms guaranteed by the Religious Freedom Res= toration Act. The good news is that the case will be heard by the same judg= e who ruled in favor of suspending NAIS on June 4. Several states have passed legislation to protect citizens from the massive= government-sanctioned program. Nebraska passed a law providing for a proce= dure for withdrawal from the premise registrations. Kentucky=92s law preven= ts the release of confidential information for the purposes of NAIS. Arizon= a prohibits mandated or forced participation, and Missouri passed a similar= law, with the addition of allowing its citizens to withdraw from the progr= am at any time. But these are just band-aid-sized appeasements. John Wallace, a candidate for Congress in New York=92s 20th Congressional D= istrict, says the current NAIS program is not about preventing mad cow or o= ther diseases since most contamination happens in the processing plants aft= er the animals have been sold. It is, he says, =93about helping big corpora= te agribusiness and RFID chip manufacturers make bigger profits at the expe= nse of the small family farmers and ranchers. Protecting America=92s food s= upply and preserving the country=92s livestock=92s resistance to diseases c= an best be protected by the continued decentralization of our nation=92s fo= od production and processing.=94=20 Wallace=92s conclusion is constitutionally spot-on:The current U.S. Departm= ent of Agriculture NAIS program means bigger government, more government in= trusion, more regulations, more paperwork, more fees, more taxes and more f= ederal spending. It will only result in less privacy, less freedom, less li= berty, and less property and 4th Amendment rights for American citizens. It= =92s exactly the kind of unconstitutional federal program every American ci= tizen and their elected federal representatives should oppose. For a time it appeared that the NAIS program was going to be a steamroller = crushing the rights of citizens. But courageous individuals standing up to = the bureaucrats are demonstrating that activism in the name of liberty and = freedom can indeed be effective in putting a stop to the march of big gover= nment. U.S. District Court Judge Orders Suspension of NAIS=20 On June 4, 2008, the U.S. District Court, District of Columbia, ordered the= Department of Agriculture to suspend its plan to identify and document eve= ry animal in the U.S. The National Animal Identification System (NAIS) was = to have been fully implemented by June 9, 2009. It is now on hold indefinit= ely. The ruling came as a result of a lawsuit; Mary-Louise Zanoni v. United= States Department of Agriculture. Ms. Zanoni, an upstate New York attorney= has been a vocal and persistent leader in the fight against the NAIS that = opponents believe would lead to more government regulation and less persona= l freedom. NAIS was never legitimized by Congress. USDA just proceeded to s= hove it down an unwilling public=92s throat, much like President Bush and h= is Canadian and Mexican cohorts are trying to do with the Security and Pros= perity Partnership (North American Union). Several state cattlemen=92s asso= ciations have also accused USDA of =93registering premises without the consent of the owners, helping themselves to states=92 agriculture dat= abases and harassing young 4-H kids. These groups have formally requested l= eaders of the Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Government Affairs = and the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform to stop NAIS and= hold oversight hearings on USDA=92s movements. The Farm-to-Consumer Legal = Defense Fund filed suit July 14, 2008, in the same federal district court (= with the same judge presiding that suspended NAIS in June) to stop USDA and= the Michigan Department of Agriculture to cease and desist any further imp= lementation of NAIS. The suit also charges USDA has never published NAIS ru= les, a violation of the Federal Administrative Procedures Act, has never pe= rformed an Environmental Impact Statement or Assessment and is in violation= of religious freedoms guaranteed by the Religious Freedom Restoration Act.= Increasingly, federal and state bureaucracies are blatantly trying to force unpalatable programs on citizen= s without bothering to follow the laws. This victory should be a reminder t= o the higher-ups that this is a nation of citizens, not subjects. Farmers and Ranchers Fight NAIS =96 and Win =0A=0A=0A **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 09:45:33 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Peter_de_Bruyn_Kops?= Subject: Re: Foraging on the doorstep Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >There is a study on bumble bees that notes that a patch is worked better when the bees are located *away* from the patch... maybe they like having a poop in the great outdoors before they settle down to bring in the goodies?! If bees tend to poop close to the hive, foraging there is more likely to pick up pathogens and that will provide selection pressure in favor of colonies that prefer to forage further away. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 06:52:54 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: C Hooper Subject: New Honey-Based Sports Energy Gel Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit New Honey-Based Sports Energy Gel GloryBee Liquid Gold Honey-Based Gel VeloNews, 8/22/2008 http://apitherapy.blogspot.com/2008/08/new-honey-based-sports-energy-gel.html GloryBee Foods' Liquid Gold is an organic honey-based sports energy gel. The Eugene, Oregon-based company says that honey contains a mix of carbohydrates that help prevent sugar spikes. Liquid Gold also contains potassium from blackstrap molasses and sodium from sun-dried sea salt. The gel comes in five flavors, which are extracted from organic essential oils — citrus, strawberry, mint, chocolate mint and natural… **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 10:02:14 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Dick Marron Subject: Wavelenght, infection MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jim wrote: >>>> What all this means is that modern pesticides (but not pathogens) are more likely broken down by simply UV from sunlight, where pathogens and not pesticides) are more likely broken down by irradiation. >>>>>> Thanks Jim for the information. At first glance the radiation seemed like a great idea. In my neck of the woods radiation went to $10.00 a box, with a minimum of a lot of boxes. Sunlight sounds cheaper. Since the inside of hives don't see a lot of sunlight, I can picture someone with 1000 deadouts (not that unusual) laying 10, to 30,000 frames out in the sun and turning them at least once. This sounds more expensive. I hope someone will test this, before anyone goes to all this trouble. J Ozone is a pretty reactive gas and is (I imagine) cheap to make. What would happen if the target frames were held in an ozone chamber for a bit? Dick Marron **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 10:11:50 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "Peter L. Borst" Subject: Mites increasing, bees declining in Brazil MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit The changing face of mite infestation in the African Bees of Brazil: > One factor in the success of AHBs seems to be higher levels of resistance toward mites and pathogens. Understanding the mechanisms for this resistance is important for the continued health of South American beekeeping and could provide more general insights for bee breeding programs. After many years of low disease presence, honey bee populations in parts of Brazil, and especially the southeast region, have shown declines in the past five years, severely impacting beekeepers. These losses are at least superficially similar to enigmatic colony mortality recently seen in the US (e.g., ''Colony Collapse Disorder" or CCD and Europe. > Mite levels differ across subspecies of Apis mellifera, and the fertility of female mites in AHB worker brood is considered low compared to other subspecies. Nevertheless, recent work suggests that the reproductive ability of Varroa destructor in Brazil is changing. Garrido et al. observed that the fertility rates of female mites have increased in So Paulo and in Santa Catarina state (southeast and southern of Brazil, respectively). While Varroa mite were not a specific focus of the current study; we did find mites in each of the analyzed colonies. > An evaluation of colonies from this region in 2006 found infestation rates of 10.68 mites per 100 adult bees, on average, and that 9% of worker brood cells contained female mites (152/1700; unpublished data). According to Garrido et al., levels of Varroa mites in Brazil have increased since 1998 and are comparable to European levels. Along with host effects, this increased presence of mites is concordant with the dominance of what is believed to be a more virulent haplotype of Varroa destructor. Higher mite levels could certainly affect virus populations in Brazil, through the abilities of these mites to vector these viruses. -- Virus infections in Brazilian honey bees Erica Weinstein Teixeira, Yanping Chen, Dejair Message, Jeff Pettis, Jay D. Evans Journal of Invertebrate Pathology ARTICLE IN PRESS **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 12:53:19 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "=?windows-1252?Q?J._Waggle?=" Subject: Re: Foraging on the doorstep Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit > >There is a study on bumble bees that notes that a patch > is worked better > when the bees are located *away* from the patch... In honeybees, I understand that the bee dance is different for nearby sources. When dancing nearby locations, the bees can communicate that the source is within 50 meters or so from the colony, but, cannot communicate direction OR exact distance of the source. Thereby, making a less precise communication of the exact location of the source, and causing recruits the need to search the area surrounding the colony to individually learn the precise location of the source. When a source located at some distance from a colony, the bees have the ability to use directional coordinates and distance, thereby making a higher degree of accuracy possible. Because of the increased efficiency in communicating coordinates of a slightly more distant food source. It is my opinion that a more distant source is perhaps likely to be exploited more efficiently sooner, because it will initially have gained an advantage in numbers of recruits and dancers caused by more exact communication of the location of the source. An example of this is being played out near my bee yard at this moment. When I set out cappings for beelining, I usually place it at a location of 80 meters from the apiary. By placing the beelining station at 80 meters against the tree line, the bees going to my apiary stay near the ground when returning and the bees going to the north woodland area need to orientate up to 15 meters to clear the trees, this makes the lining these bees much easier distinguish from my bees. To facilitate ease in beelining in another direction, I moved the station from the 80 meter spot to about 50 meters from the apiary. When I made the move, I closed all the bees that were feeding at the station, and moved them all at once to the new location and added more cappings. Later that evening and into the early part of the next day, the majority of bees visiting the new feeding location were going to the woodlands, and a strange gathering of thousands of bees were seen at the old feeding location. No doubt that memory played a role here, but this also suggested to me that the bees the nearby apiary did NOT communicate the exact location of this new source, while the bees from more distant colonys communicated the exact location and therefore were more efficient in exploiting the source than the nearer colonies. Best Wishes, Joe http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/HistoricalHoneybeeArticles **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 13:53:20 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?UTF-8?Q?Peter_L_Borst?= Subject: Re: Foraging on the doorstep Comments: To: "J. Waggle" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit J. Waggle wrote: >In honeybees, I understand that the bee dance is different for nearby sources. REPLY: > Through a series of seminal experiments, Karl von Frisch decoded the dance language of the honey bee. Since then, it has been widely accepted that there are two distinct types of dances: the round dance, for advertising profitable food sources less than 50m away, and the waggle dance, for announcing food sources more than 50m away. These two dances are usually considered separate entities, two “words” in the bees’ language, mainly because of the apparent lack of directional information in the round dance. > However, recent work suggests that round dances may contain directional information, blurring the line between round and waggle dances. We investigated the distinction between the round and waggle dances by training honey bees to feeders at varying distances from the hive and video recording and analyzing the subsequent dances. > For every dance, the following components were measured: (1) waggle phase duration, (2) form and pattern of dancer movement during a circuit, (3) angular orientation of individual waggle phases, and (4) divergence angle (the angle between the directions of sequential waggle phases). > Our data suggest that information about direction is encoded the same way in the round dance as in the waggle dance – the waggle-run direction relative to vertical indicates the food-source direction relative to the sun’s azimuth, although there is more ‘noise’ in the directional component of the round dance than the waggle dance. > This study shows that that the round dance and the waggle dance are parts of a continuum, that there is no abrupt switch between the two, and that it is most meaningful to view the bees as having just one (adjustable) recruitment signal: the waggle dance. Kathryn E. Gardner, et al (2006) "The Round and Waggle Dances of the Honey Bee: One Dance or Two?" **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 14:02:46 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "Peter L. Borst" Subject: Re: Foraging on the doorstep MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Kathyrn's work, which I had the privelege to witness, should have changed our understanding of the bee dance by now. It has been widely published: SEE: Do honeybees have two discrete dances to advertise food sources? KE Gardner, TD Seeley, NW Calderone - Animal Behaviour, - www.sciencedirect.com/science/journal/00033472 Hypotheses on the adaptiveness or non-adaptiveness of the directional imprecision in the Honey Bee's Waggle Dance KE GARDNER, TD SEELEY, NW CALDERONE - Entomologia generalis, 2007 - cat.inist.fr A scientific note on the directional accuracy of the waggle dance over the course of a day KE Gardner - APIDOLOGIE, 2007 - www.apidologie.org The Round and Waggle Dances of the Honey Bee: One Dance or Two? KE Gardner, TD Seeley, N Calderone - 2006 - iussi.confex.com --- Peter L Borst Danby, NY USA 42.35, -76.50 http://picasaweb.google.com/peterlborst **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 07:28:03 +1000 Reply-To: Trevor Weatherhead Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Trevor Weatherhead Subject: Re: Mites increasing, bees declining in Brazil MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Along with host effects, this increased presence of mites is concordant > with the dominance of what is believed to be a more virulent haplotype of > Varroa destructor. Is what they are saying is that they now have the Korean haplotype as dominant as against the Japanese haplotype which was reported as being the only one in Brazil? Trevor Weatherhead AUSTRALIA **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 23:17:59 +0000 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Gavin Ramsay Subject: Re: Foraging on the doorstep MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Thanks Peter and Joe I like the 'local pooping' theory to explain restricted local foraging. When my bees were in the garden, early spring cleansing was usually done from 5-20m from the hive (on washing and cars, both mine and my neighbours!). Don't think that they went much further. It does make sense to have separate pooping and feeding zones around the hive. What about water gathering? Mine were often within the pooping zone, maybe not such a good idea but they do seem to poop on bright or shiny things but drink from dark damp areas. Joe - I like your explanation based on the accuracy of communication, but I'm not convinced. Are dances really that accurate, and, if not, is the communication of food available very locally any less precise? Bumble bees of course do not dance, merely charge about inside the nest stimulating excitement about the latest find. They might have means of communicating that we don't properly understand, such as maybe leading foragers directly, but they certainly don't do a waggle dance. Interesting though that your moved feeders were less immediately attractive to a nearby colony. best wishes Gavin **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 19:58:26 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?UTF-8?Q?Peter_L_Borst?= Subject: Re: U.S. District Court Judge Orders Suspension of NAIS (from the John Birch Society Web site) Comments: To: Dee Lusby Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I don't know why this was posted here, but it certainly seems like a case of the paranoid fringe trying to kill a good idea. > NAIS is voluntary at the Federal level. U.S. animal health is protected by existing Federal and State regulations for disease surveillance, control, eradication, and response. While NAIS is a national system, it does not alter any regulations in the Code of Federal Regulations or any regulations that exist at the State level. Rather, NAIS enhances ongoing animal health protection efforts by offering national standards and increasing the level of participation beyond what is already required in existing disease programs. from "National Animal Identification System (NAIS)— A User Guide and Additional Information Resources" **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 20:59:39 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Harrison Subject: Re: Mites increasing, bees declining in Brazil Comments: To: Trevor Weatherhead In-Reply-To: <003801c90630$4c78ecc0$1597b07c@user96c8c0908f> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello Trevor & All, Trevor asks: > Is what they are saying is that they now have the Korean haplotype as > dominant as against the Japanese haplotype which was reported as being the > only one in Brazil? >From my contacts i believe the above is the situation. Much of the hype about AHB being able to tolerate varroa has been from in many of our minds the fact Brazil had only the J. haplotype. Secondary the constant swarming which is a form of swarm control in itself. bob **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 03:02:45 GMT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "deknow@netzero.net" Subject: Re: Mites increasing, bees declining in Brazil Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit i'd be curios to know what size foundation is being used in brazil...especially in these specific areas. i found the abstract for this article: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18471826 what i found surprising was: "ABPV was detected in 27.1% of colony samples, while BQCV and DWV were found in 37% and 20.3%, respectively. These levels are substantially lower than the frequencies found for these viruses in surveys from other parts of the world." what are the frequencies found in other parts of the world? deknow **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 03:52:18 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: C Hooper Subject: Video: Varroa Mites Found on Hawaiian =?UTF-8?Q?=E2=80=98Big_Island_=E2=80=99?= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Video: Varroa Mites Found on Hawaiian ‘Big Island’ Varroa Bee Mites Spread to Hilo By Brianne Randle, KHON2 (USA), 8/23/2008 http://apitherapy.blogspot.com/2008/08/video-varroa-mites-found-on-hawaiian.html Manoa Beekeeper Michael Kliks first spotted this tiny mite in April of '07. "I called Department of Agriculture within five minutes, and they were at my house within fifteen minutes, we all understood what we had on our hands."… **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 07:26:33 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "Peter L. Borst" Subject: Re: Mites increasing, bees declining in Brazil In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Deknow: > i'd be curios to know what size foundation is being used in brazil...especially in these specific areas. REPLY: > In Brazil, beehives normally contain natural-sized (self-made) combs with relatively small cells or combs with larger, European-sized cells drawn from wax foundation. Many have combs with both types of cells. These comb cell size differences could affect the development of varroa populations; however, this possibility has been little studied. (1) * * * > As old dark brood combs normally have the smallest-size cells, and mite infestations in worker brood increase with comb cell size, we decided to compare mite infestation levels in worker brood reared in old comb with reduced cell size versus that found in new (natural- sized) comb recently built by the bees (without comb foundation). > We had expected that there would be fewer V. destructor in the smaller brood cells in the old combs than in the relatively larger brood cells in the new combs, as previous experiments had indicated a positive correlation between cell size and infestation rate. Indeed, the tendency towards higher infestation in wider cells was maintained for each type of comb. Drone brood, which is reared in large brood cells, is also considerably more infested by V. destructor than is worker brood. Cell size at least partly explains this attraction, as drone brood reared in drone cells is significantly more infested than brood reared in worker-size cells in the same colony. > However the cells in the old combs were much more infested than those in the new (naturally built) combs, even though the former were significantly smaller. The old comb cells were four to over five times as infested as the new brood comb cells, when the same 1/10 mm cell width intervals were compared. It is clear that these mites strongly preferred old worker brood comb cells to new worker brood cells. However, the cues that the mites use to make this discrimination are unknown. (2) (1) Giancarlo A. Piccirillo and D. De Jong (2003) The influence of brood comb cell size on the reproductive behavior of the ectoparasitic mite Varroa destructor in Africanized honey bee colonies (2) Giancarlo A. PICCIRILLO, David De JONG (2004) Old honey bee brood combs are more infested by the mite Varroa destructor than are new brood combs **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 08:05:49 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "Peter L. Borst" Subject: Re: Mites increasing, bees declining in Brazil MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit A recent study suggests that high temperature and low humidity probably account for success of some honey bees against varroa: > Varroa destructor is currently the most important pest of the honeybee Apis mellifera L., causing the death of millions of colonies during the past 50 years. The only genetic line of A. mellifera which has consistently been found to be resistant to V. destructor is the Africanized honeybee. Mite resistance was first observed in Brazil and the low level of mite fertility was considered to be the reason. More recently it was suggested that the less virulent Japanese mite genotype found in Brazil was the main reason for mite resistance of AHB. > Three independent studies carried out in different tropical regions of Mexico showed that AHB colonies were able to survive without the application of any mite control measures, while the mite population cycled between 10008000 mites. In sharp contrast, European honeybee (EHB) colonies kept in the same region, died within a year because of the rapidly increasing mite population. Because the mite genotype (Korean) and mite fertility levels were similar between EHB colonies in the UK and AHB colonies in Mexico, this suggests that other factors, different from those found in Brazil, underlie the resistance of AHB to V. destructor. > Though we are currently unable to explain the link between any factor and offspring mortality, there are three possibilities: (1) Offspring mortality is linked to honeybee genetics; but as this factor is similar in all the colonies studied, it would then be due to a dominant trait of AHB. In previous works on EHB in tropical climate, there were strong differences between AHB and EHB colonies, which strengthens the hypothesis of a dominant trait of AHB. (2) Offspring mortality is linked to mite genetics; this is unlikely as mortality rates change in the various studies of the same mite genotype (Korean). (3) Offspring mortality is linked to environmental factors, e.g. the combined effect of high temperature and low humidity. This hypothesis is the most likely, since the offspring mortality cycles mirror changes in the external environmental conditions. -- Luis MONDRAGN, Stephen MARTIN, Rmy VANDAME (2006) "Mortality of mite offspring: a major component of Varroa destructor resistance in a population of Africanized bees" **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 10:14:35 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bill Truesdell Subject: Re: Mites increasing, bees declining in Brazil- plus heat In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > (3) Offspring mortality is linked to environmental factors, e.g. the > combined effect of high temperature and low humidity. This hypothesis > is the most likely, since the offspring mortality cycles mirror > changes in the external environmental conditions. Way back when there were several posts on using heat to combat Varroa. the technique was used in Russia. I found this in the archives and part is quoted below. The post was titled, "Heating Varroa". > The other device demonstrated at the meeting is meant for treating > swarms in summer or colonies in winter. You move the cluster to a net > cage. The net cage is placed in a vented oven at 49 degrees Celsius > (120.2 deg. F) for 15 min. Then the bees is put back into the hive. The > man that build this system claims that the low relative moisture content in > winter air combined with the heating is responsible for the death of the > varroa mites. Critics say that these bees will die from nosema afterwards. > The method should have been used for many years in Russia, but > literature is scarce -- references would be very much appreciated! So you have another independent source hypothesizing about heat and low humidity as a Varroa control, and may have done so. Bill Truesdell Bath, Maine **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 07:45:19 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: Mites increasing, bees declining in Brazil In-Reply-To: <20080824.230245.27777.0@webmail12.dca.untd.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline > > >what are the frequencies [of viruses] found in other parts of the world? In Austria, "The most prevalent virus was DWV, present in 91% of samples, followed by ABPV, SBV, and BQCV (68%, 49%, and 30%, respectively). CBPV was detected in 10% of colonies, while KBV was not present in any sample." France: "DWV was recorded in 97%, SBV in 86%, BQCV in 86%, ABPV in 58%, CBPV in 28% and KBV in 17% of apiaries (Tencheva et al., 2004)." Viral distribution is reviewed by Nielson in Denmark Apidologie 39 (2008) Interestingly, in South Africa, Dr Mike Allsopp found very few viruses in feral colonies. Randy Oliver **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 15:25:54 GMT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "deknow@netzero.net" Subject: Re: Mites increasing, bees declining in Brazil Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit -- "Peter L. Borst" cited wrote: > ...These comb cell size differences could affect the development of varroa populations; however, this possibility has been little studied. ...but don't stop in the middle of a paragraph! the paper continues: "...In Brazil, as in other countries (Arnst, 1996; Coggshall and Morse, 1984), beekeepers have tried to make bees bigger than they are naturally by inducing them to build large comb cells from foundation wax stamped with cell patterns larger than they would make themselves naturally. The relative benefit of natural versus oversized comb foundation has been a controversial subject for more than 100 years (Birkey, 2000)." and following: "A second frame contained a sheet of commercial wax foundation with Italian bee cell base spacing (cells about 5.4mm wide, inclding one ell wall). This is the type of foundation normally used in Brazil." if we are to believe the paper you cited here, it makes perfect sense. varroa do better on larger comb, and Brazilian beekeepers have been upsizing the smaller sized AHB, and are now experiencing more varroa. of course this isn't proof of anything, but it certainly is something to consider before jumping to the conclusion that the varroa in Brazil are becoming more virulent....in fact, the bees may be becoming a better host as their size is artificially increased. deknow **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 19:13:52 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter L Borst Subject: Re: Mites increasing, bees declining in Brazil Comments: To: Dean Stiglitz Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >if we are to believe the paper you cited here, it makes perfect sense. The other paper I cited refers to further studies by the same authors showing that cells made smaller by successive cycles of brood did NOT inhibit varroa reproduction. Varroa reproduction was less, however, with newer comb which could account for initial effects when changing cell size. pb 2) Giancarlo A. PICCIRILLO, David De JONG (2004) Old honey bee brood combs are more infested by the mite Varroa destructor than are new brood combs **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 19:50:31 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Fischer Subject: Re: Wavelenght, infection MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline > radiation went to $10.00 a box, with a minimum of a lot of boxes. > Sunlight sounds cheaper. Depends on what your problem is... my point was that sunlight won't kill pathogens, but will break down SOME pesticides. > I hope someone will test this, before anyone goes to all this trouble. I wouldn't bother, as the pesticides that could be broken down by sunlight would likely be broken down by sunlight before the bees had a chance to carry back any residue-laden pollen from the plants sprayed with the theoretical pesticide at issue. I think a simple comb-replacement schedule for brood comb would make more sense for most operations. Ever since Dr. David Banner's problems with gamma rays (google his name and the type of radiation for the details) I've never viewed it as a practical large-scale solution. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 02:04:23 GMT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "deknow@netzero.com" Subject: Re: Mites increasing, bees declining in Brazil Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit the 2 studies cited discuss 2 different factors in mite attraction. the larger the cell, the more mites the older the comb the more mites one of the advantages of regressing is that you get new comb that attract less mites. the other is that the cells are smaller, and attract more mites. these studies talk about what comb attracts mites. it could be that the old comb attracts mites because of it's age...but also affects varroa reproduction because of it's size. what really matters is not what attracts varroa from a given population, but what affects the size of the population of varroa. deknow **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 04:58:15 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Chris Slade Subject: Re: Wavelenght, infection MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 26/08/2008 02:43:54 GMT Standard Time, james.fischer@GMAIL.COM writes: I think a simple comb-replacement schedule for brood comb would make more sense for most operations. Especially from what we are learning from the other current thread that Varroa mites prefer old comb. Chris **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 08:19:16 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: James Fischer Subject: Re: Mites increasing, bees declining in Brazil MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Dean ("deknow") said: > the 2 studies cited discuss 2 different factors in mite attraction. > the larger the cell, the more mites As Peter has not repeated several times, No. They later did a better study later which refuted that claim, in "Giancarlo A. Piccirillo, David De Jong (2004) Old honey bee brood combs are more infested by the mite Varroa destructor than are new brood combs" This relentless cherry-picking of statements, studies, and tiny snippets of quotes has, at this point, become nothing more than simple and deliberate intellectual dishonesty. One has no valid "argument" or "point of view" when one must overtly and repeatedly mislead in the process of offering one's views. The traditional "benefit of the doubt" we give of "inexperience" or being "misinformed" can no longer apply. The same sort of "selective hearing" has been applied to the work of Jen Berry of UGA. Even though her final analysis showed that small-cell colonies had more mites per 100 brood cells than colonies with traditional-sized cells, her earlier ("no statistical difference") report is cited more often, and has become part of the standard offerings of a certain small segment of evangelistic beekeepers. > the older the comb the more mites Yes, that much seems consistent. > one of the advantages of regressing is that you get new comb that > attract less mites. Everyone here renews old brood combs. If we didn't, we wouldn't be beekeepers much longer. > the other is that the cells are smaller, and attract more mites. Has to be a typo, as I don't think that attracting MORE mites would be a goal of any beekeeper. But not to worry, this quote will be easy to cherry-pick and use every time any hint of selective reading appears in the future in regard to the discussion of mite control. > these studies talk about what comb attracts mites. it could be that > the old comb attracts mites because of it's age...but also affects > varroa reproduction because of it's size. No, repeating it won't make it true. That's been disproven to the satisfaction of the same researchers who made the statements you want to quote. The use of deliberate misdirection, pointing to one quote, when it does not represent the full dataset of the study (as in "Berry", above) or when it represents speculation later retracted by the author in light of more data (as in "DeJong", above) is yet another example of the persistent and unrepentant Cherry-Picking. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 14:52:07 GMT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "deknow@netzero.net" Subject: Re: Mites increasing, bees declining in Brazil Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit -- James Fischer wrote: >"... No. They later did a better study later which refuted that claim..." really? the first sentence of the abstract to the later better study is: "Abstract - Varroa destructor preferentially invades larger honey bee brood cells." http://www.apidologie.org/index.php?option=article&access=standard&Itemid=129&url=/articles/apido/abs/2004/04/M4012/M4012.html the discussion section of the paper itself starts with: "We had expected that there would be fewer V. destructor in the smaller brood cells in the old combs than in the relatively larger brood cells in the new combs, as previous experiments had indicated a positive correlation between cell size and infestation rate (Message and Goncalves, 1995; Piccirillo and De Jong, 2003). Indeed, the tendancy towards higher infestation in wider cells was maintained for each type of comb" and continues with: "The old comb cells were four to over five times as infected as the new brood comb cells, when the same 1/10mm cell width intervals were compared). http://www.apidologie.org/index.php?option=article&access=standard&Itemid=129&url=/articles/apido/pdf/2004/04/M4012.pdf in fact, if you look at table II in the paper, you will see that old comb in the 4.51-4.6mm range had almost as low an infestation rate as new comb in the 4.81-4.9mm range....and that among each type of comb (old and new), the infestation rate rises sharply with cell size. we have no way to know how this curve looks when extended to 5.4mm without experimenting. >Has to be a typo, yes, my apologies..it was a typo. i submit that the later paper does not contradict the earlier one...that the authors still maintain that larger cells attract more mites, and that the age of brood comb is another, separate factor....and that their published data supports this. i also submit that both of the studies, though interesting, measure the attractiveness of different sizes and ages of comb to mites, but do not deal with the effects in terms of mite population/reproduction dynamics in the real world (ie, how in a similar environment, hives with old, new, big, small comb would fare against the mites)...which is really the important question. but really, it isn't a long read (and the link is above)...everyone should read this study and decide for yourselves what the authors are saying. deknow **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 15:13:00 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Harrison Subject: Re: Wavelenght, infection In-Reply-To: <7b2725290808241650s30fda028g87c5298f5a2720cb@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello James & All, James said: > I think a simple comb-replacement schedule for brood comb would make > more sense for most operations. Ever since Dr. David Banner's problems > with gamma rays > I've never viewed it as a practical large-scale solution. At the ABF convention in Austin (height of the CCD issue) I felt the same way as Jim when Dave Hackenberg asked if I wanted to come in on getting boxes radiated. The price for radiation was very close to the cost of comb replacement . Comb replacement involves other cost but in my opinion ( and was my opinion at the time) that the result of bees on new comb was *in my opinion* a better result than bees on *old* dark comb on which mitacides had been used for years. If you go back and look at my BEE-L posts of the time you will see I felt the Beltsville/Hackenberg project was poorly done. I would have placed a control of the package bees used on new comb for comparison. Those package bees did not come from a major supplier but from a very very small beekeeper. I am not saying a problem existed with the package bees but certainly a possible unknown. Also you would have answered the question if it would have been better to simply replace the comb. A year later in personal conversation with Dave he said in his opinion the irradiated comb hives only did slightly better than the non radiated hives. Please understand that Dave said a obvious difference was seen but not sure the cost was justified. In my opinion an abnormal amount of queen problems happened during the study and the reasons for the queen problems has never been explained. Was the queen problems from the Hackenberg comb? A control on new comb might have provided answers. I am sharing information obtained from personal conversation ( I have Dave's cell number in my pocket) and we both are puzzled why the radiated boxes did not fair better. Again the radiated hives did better but not up to expectations. bob **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 18:30:05 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Brian Ames Subject: EPA lab cuts herbicide, lets meadow bloom Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit http://www.duluthnewstribune.com/articles/index.cfm?id=72711§ion=homepage EPA lab cuts herbicide, lets meadow bloom John Myers Duluth News Tribune - 08/26/2008 Its an effort to add a little more environmental protection to the Environmental Protection Agency water laboratory in Duluth. Staff members at the lab wanted to do more than conduct groundbreaking research into what was causing environmental problems. Perched just feet from the shore of Lake Superior and the Lester River, they wanted to fight back. Starting in 2003, lab employees developed a plan to replace two acres of mowed grass lawn with native flowers and plants. We mostly deal with water here, but we thought it was important to do something about the land were using, said Corlis West, an aquatic biologist who specializes in invasive species in Lake Superior. The sod was removed, the soil was tilled and thousands of seeds were sown. Hundreds of flower starts and native grasses also were planted. As the meadow grew, invasive plants and weeds have been eradicated, mostly by hand, instead of spraying with herbicides. Though the lawn occasionally looked a little rough over the past three summers, it is now a fully blooming upland meadow of native plants. The lab contracted with Cloquet-based Boreal Natives, a division of Prairie Restorations Inc. that specializes in developing native plant communities. The mix of black-eyed susans, daisies, bee balm and several other native species is hardy enough to survive harsh Northland winters, wet springs and even droughtlike late summers like were seeing now. EPA preaches a lot of this stuff and now we have something for people to look at to see we are environmentally responsible, West said. It shows we walk the walk and not just the talk. Staff members at the lab also volunteered their own time to plant native trees like white pine, white spruce and white birch across the property. They added a few maples that eventually will shade the south-facing lab windows. Getting rid of grass has saved taxpayers about $3,000 per year in mowing and maintenance costs, West said. And the once-sterile lawn is attracting wildlife like fox, deer and woodchucks. Its also a magnet for birds, butterflies, dragonflies and bees. The meadow also does a better job of soaking up and filtering water, meaning reduced runoff into nearby Lake Superior. Theres also almost no chemical use and no watering needed. That was a big deal for us, that we dont need to keep applying herbicides and fertilizers, West said. It takes some annual tweaking for the invasives, but its not labor-intensive. The effort can be traced back to a Clinton-era executive order that set a goal for all federal buildings to incorporate a more green operations plan. At the Duluth lab, it also meant reducing water, electrical and energy use. But changes outside the building are more obvious to the public. Some people dont like it. They say it looks unprofessional, like weve closed the lab down. But most people here are pretty proud of it, West said. Carl Richards, director of the Duluth lab, said he hopes transformation of the lab grounds can serve as a model. We hope that our upland meadow landscape and our other green efforts will serve as inspirations and sources of educational tools for the Duluth and Superior areas, Richards said in a statement. The Duluth effort won the EPAs first ever Green Thumb Award for sustainable landscaping for 2007. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 20:11:24 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: John & Christy Horton Subject: 2 queen hives MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Does anybody know anything about tthe effect tthat running a two queen hive (separated by two excluders) will have on swarming.? When they do swarm, will most of the combined population leave? thanks John Horton N Alabama **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 04:10:02 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Chris Slade Subject: Re: 2 queen hives MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 27/08/2008 02:23:57 GMT Standard Time, johnhort@BELLSOUTH.NET writes: Does anybody know anything about tthe effect tthat running a two queen hive (separated by two excluders) will have on swarming.? Generally the 2 queen system is part of swarm control. An artificial swarm is made with Mother underneath, so she won't swarm (probably). Daughter is hatched and matched in the upper stratum and builds up. She is young and won't swarm (probably). The 2 boxes are united in time for the honey flow and (generally) daughter will supersede Mother after a while. Chris **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 12:43:15 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: C Hooper Subject: Propolis Accelerated Healing Following Colon Surgery Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Propolis Accelerated Healing Following Colon Surgery Ultrastructural View of Colon Anastomosis Under Propolis Effect By Transmission Electron Microscopy World J Gastroenterol, 2008 August;14(30):4763-4770 http://apitherapy.blogspot.com/2008/08/propolis-accelerated-healing-following.html AIM: To evaluate the effect of propolis administration on the healing of colon anastomosis with light and transmission electron microscopes... **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 09:14:22 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Darrell Subject: Re: 2 queen hives In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 27-Aug-08, at 4:10 AM, Chris Slade wrote: > > An artificial swarm > is made with Mother underneath, Daughter is > hatched and matched in the upper stratum and builds up. The 2 boxes > are united in time for the honey flow Hi Chris John and all What effect does this double queen system have on the expansion of varroa in the hive. Bob Darrell Caledon Ontario Canada 44N80W **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 15:46:45 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: de roeck ghislain Subject: Re: 2 queen hives In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Chris Slade wrote: >Generally the 2 queen system is part of swarm control. An artificial >swarm is made with Mother underneath, so she won't swarm (probably). >Daughter is hatched and matched in the upper stratum and builds up. She is >young and won't swarm (probably). The 2 boxes are united in time for the >honey flow and (generally) daughter will supersede Mother after a while. In Europe it is also a system to obtain more honey. The two queens have each their 'court' and the worker bees of each colony collect the nectar and put it in the same super(s). It is said that this give more honey then if the colonies are working apart. I never experienced the system. Ghislain. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 10:23:58 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Aaron Morris Subject: Re: 2 queen hives In-Reply-To: <200808270116.m7R0P2xl000565@listserv.albany.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Although Chris' response has been posted and excessively quoted twice now, I don't think anyone has answered John's original question regarding the effect a two queen system will have on swarming. Chris' response that a two queen system is a sort of swarm control is actually off the mark. Yes, separating a hive as described can be used as a swarm control method, allowing the upper to raise a new queen and recombining so the new queen daughter (once hatched and mated) supersedes the queen mum below, so by the time the flow is on you have a single queen colony with a new queen. I don't think this is what John did and it certainly doesn't answer what John asked. I suspect the 2-queen system that John has in mind is a system where two colonies whose queens are likely unrelated are coaxed into coexisting in a single stack in order to produce a prodigious honey crop. This system isn't meant as a swarm control, in actuality it flirts with swarm enticement which I believe is the gist of John's query. A proper answer being, two queen hives push the envelope both in labor, beekeeping skill, and swarm propensity. The beekeeper has to make sure that the queens are young, that they have plenty of room for both of their brood nests, and there has to be plenty of super room for honey and nectar. A typical configuration can be 2 deep brood boxes, queen excluder, two, three or more honey supers, another queen excluder, two more brood boxes for the second queen, yet another queen excluder, and many more supers on top of that! Such a configuration will literally require a step ladder to work and can get quite dangerous working at a height of 10 to 15 feet! But the swarm control aspect (which is the question John asked) is the same; young queens and uncongested brood chambers (which in a 2-queen hive means plenty of honey supers). I've already ranted about quoting, now I'll rant about searching the archives. This topic has been covered extensively before (search the archives for Sky Scraper Hive (or skyscraper) for starters). Or start here: http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind9712E&L=BEE-L&P=R255&I= -3 Aaron Morris - I think, therefore I bee! **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 15:01:14 GMT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "deknow@netzero.net" Subject: Re: 2 queen hives Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit -- Aaron Morris wrote: "...two colonies whose queens are likely unrelated are coaxed into coexisting in a single stack..." fwiw, i've also seen this done with a common set of supers stacked over 2 separate hives butting up against each other. deknow **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 11:35:12 -0400 Reply-To: lloyd@rossrounds.com Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Lloyd Spear Subject: 2 queen hives MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline I do not think that two queen hives will be effective as a means of swarm control. However, they can be extremely effective as a means of harvesting a bumper honey crop, and one need not produce a skyscraper hive as described by Aaron. It is well known that a hive with 30,000 bees will produce as much as double the crop as a hive with 20,000 bees. Some researchers say it is impossible to produce a hive with more than 40,000 bees, and 30,000 is more 'normal'. With a two-queen system one can produce a hive with 50,000-60,000 bees! I know two comb honey producers who modified their boxes so they produce two-queen hives 'side-by-side'. Just a 1/4" divider board down the middle. The brood nest for each hive consists of two deeps and two mediums, so each 'side' effectively has a single deep and a medium, more than enough room for a brood nest. Each side starts with a new queen and a split. When the flow commences, 3-5 comb honey supers are put on top, with a single excluder. So, the field bees intermingle in the supers. Often a total of 7-9 supers (per hive) are eventually filled on a good flow such as sweet clover, but supers are removed when they are capped so the stack never gets that high. A similar two-queen system uses a deep and a medium for each queen, an excluder between the queens and entrances on opposite sides. Again, supers are not added until the flow starts but when supers are added the excluder is removed between the queens and put below the supers. This quickly causes one queen to disappear, but by then all the bees needed for foraging have emerged so the loss does not effect the crop. Again, the foragers intermingle in the supers, without apparent harm. I have tried both systems on numerous occassions. I almost always get swarming with the second system, but almost never get it with the first. Dunno why. The only disadvantage is the equipment modification with the first system. Cut the slots for the boards all at the same time, before the bodies are assembled. The modifications are not hard to do. Lloyd -- Lloyd Spear Owner Ross Rounds, Inc. Manufacture of equipment for round comb honey sections, Sundance Pollen Traps, and producer of Sundance custom labels. Contact your dealer or www.RossRounds.com **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 11:38:21 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Chris Slade Subject: Re: 2 queen hives MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 27/08/2008 15:00:17 GMT Standard Time, bobbee@INTERLOG.COM writes: What effect does this double queen system have on the expansion of varroa in the hive. I don't do it often enough to have a handle on this; however if the first brood that the old, artificially swarmed, queen produces is destroyed as soon as it is sealed and the same is done with that of the daughter (the bees attending the daughter will be flying from a different entrance to Mum's) that should mop up lots of mites, unless the mites make their way from one brood nest to the other. That might be an experiment worth trying next season with a couple of matched hives, using one as a control. Chris **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 13:40:17 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Brian Ames Subject: Tag Teaming Bayer Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Looks like Canada and Germany are also getting on board the train to take on Bayer and the neonictinoids. http://www.ens-newswire.com/ens/aug2008/2008-08-25-01.asp German Coalition Sues Bayer Over Pesticide Honey Bee Deaths FREIBURG, Germany, August 25, 2008 (ENS) - The German organization Coalition against Bayer Dangers today brought legal action against Werner Wenning, chairman of the Bayer AG Board of Management, by filing a charge against him with the public prosecutor in Freiburg. The group accuses Bayer CropScience of "marketing dangerous pesticides and thereby accepting the mass death of bees all over the world." The coalition filed the charge in cooperation with German beekeepers who claim they lost thousands of hives after poisoning by the Bayer pesticide clothianidin in May. Since 1991, Bayer has been producing the insecticide imidacloprid, which is one of the best selling insecticides in the world, often used as seed-dressing for maize, sunflower, and rape. Bayer exports imidacloprid to more than 120 countries and the substance is Bayer's best-selling pesticide. Since patent protection for imidacloprid has expired in most countries, Bayer in 2003 brought a similarly functionning successor product, clothianidin, onto the market, the coalition alleges. Both substances are systemic chemicals that work their way from the seed through the plant. The substances get into the pollen and the nectar and can damage beneficial insects such as bees. The coalition alleges that the start of sales of imidacloprid and clothianidin coincided with the occurrence of large scale bee deaths in many European and American countries. Up to 70 percent of all hives have been affected. In France, approximately 90 billion bees died over the past 10 years, reducing honey production by up to 60 percent. Attorney Harro Schultze, who represents the Coalition against Bayer Dangers said, "The public prosecutor needs to clarify which efforts Bayer undertook to prevent a ban of imidacloprid and clothianidin after sales of both substances were stopped in France. We're suspecting that Bayer submitted flawed studies to play down the risks of pesticide residues in treated plants." In France, imidacloprid has been banned as a seed dressing for sunflowers since 1999 and in 2003 was also banned as a sweet corn treatment. Convened by the French government, in 2003 the Comit Scientifique et Technique declared that the treatment of seeds with imidacloprid leads to significant risks for bees. Bayer's application for approval of clothianidin was also rejected by French authorities. Clothianidin and imidacloprid are two of a relatively new class of insecticides known as neonicotinoids that impact the central nervous system of insects. "Bayer's Board of Management has to be called to account since the risks of neonicotinoids such as imidacloprid and clothianidin have now been known for more than 10 years," says Philipp Mimkes, spokesman for the Coalition Against Bayer-Dangers. The coalition is demanding that Bayer withdraw all neonicotinoids from the market worldwide. "With an annual turnover of nearly 800 million euro, neonicotinoids are among Bayer's most important products," said Mimkes. "This is the reason why Bayer, despite serious environmental damage, is fighting against any application prohibitions." The accusation of flawed studies is echoed by the Canadian Pest Management Regulatory Agency which said of Bayer's clothianidin application, "All of the field/semi-field studies, however, were found to be deficient in design and conduct of the studies and were, therefore, considered as supplemental information only. "Clothianidin may pose a risk to honey bees and other pollinators, if exposure occurs via pollen and nectar of crop plants grown from treated seeds," said the Canadian agency. The agency said, "It should also be noted that clothianidin is very persistent in soil, with high carry-over of residues to the next growing season. clothianidin is also mobile in soil." Germany banned neonicotinoids for seed treatment in May 2008, due to negative affects on bee colonies. Beekeepers in the Baden-Wrttemberg region suffered a severe decline linked to the use of clothianidin. The German Federal Office of Consumer Protection and Food Safety suspended the registration for eight pesticide seed treatment products on maize and rapeseed, including clothianidin and imidacloprid. Bayer says the pesticide entered the environment because farmers failed to apply an adhesive agent that affixes the compound to the seed coats. Without the fixative agent, Bayer says, the compound drifted into the environment from sown rapeseed and sweet corn and then affected the honeybees. "Seed treatments are one of the most targeted and environmentally friendly forms to apply crop protection products. We regret the recent bee losses and the situation they have created for the beekeepers in Baden-Wrttemberg," said Dr. Hans-Josef Diehl, head of development and registration at Bayer CropScience Deutschland GmbH during an expert hearing on bee losses in Karlsruhe, Germany in June. Dr. Richard Schmuck, an ecologist at Bayer CropScience, said in June, "All studies available to us confirm that our product is safe to bees if the recommended dressing quality is maintained. This is also shown by the product safety assessments which we have submitted to the registration authorities." "When used correctly," he said, "this crop protection product is safe for operators, consumers and the environment and fulfills the international criteria with regard to ecological systems." In the United States, the nonprofit Natural Resources Defense Council filed a lawsuit August 15 in federal court in Washington, DC to force the federal government to disclose studies it ordered on the effect of clothianidin on honey bees. Studies on clothianidin were ordered by the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency from Bayer CropScience in 2003 when the EPA granted the company a registration for the chemical. NRDC attorneys believe that the EPA has evidence of connections between pesticides and the mysterious honey bee die-offs reported across the country called colony collapse disorder that it has not made public. Colony collapse disorder has claimed more than one-third of honey bees in the United States since it was first identified in 2006. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 22:28:33 GMT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "deknow@netzero.net" Subject: Re: Tag Teaming Bayer Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit -- Brian Ames wrote: >Looks like Canada and Germany are also getting on board the train to take on Bayer and the neonictinoids. this is misleading to say the least. a private coalition of germans has filed with a public prosecutor. this isn't any different than saying that "americans got onboard with taking on mcdonalds for their dangerously hot coffee" because someone filed a lawsuit. this is not (at this point) government action, and my recollection is that a similar action was taken against dick cheney and don rumsfeld or war crimes...with absolutely no followthrough from the prosecutor. deknow **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 19:50:04 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Michael Palmer Subject: Re: Tag Teaming Bayer In-Reply-To: <20080827.182833.17610.0@webmail13.dca.untd.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed > this is not (at this point) government action, and my recollection > is that a similar action was taken against dick cheney and don > rumsfeld or war crimes...with absolutely no followthrough from the prosecutor. Except in some towns in Vermont, where there is a warrant for the arrest of Cheney and W, passed at town meetings in March. **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 17:15:37 GMT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "waldig@netzero.net" Subject: Re: 2 queen hives Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I have run several 2-queen hives (vertical, not side-by-side). I've tried both single deeps and double deeps for each each separated by a queen excluder with a second excluder under the supers. With this system, the colonies build up much faster and, with the larger combined foraging force, the honey crop will be much larger. Swarming was the primary reason why I discontinued this set-up. No matter how many supers I put on in timely fashion, the 2 broodnests would be very crowded and plug up excessively with honey on good flows. I believe, the excluders get perceived as barriers by the bees and they move the honey up into the supers at a slower rate causing the honey congestion in the broodnest which leads to swarming. Frequent inspections and cutting out swarm cells was the only way to keep to bees from going up into the trees. The extra honey seemed to make up for the extra work. Another plus having extra queens on hand. I have abandoned this system for unlimited broodnests. I get the same or better honey production with a single queen and no excluders. The broodnest stretches into a nice, vertical oval across the 3 deeps and there is no need for an excluder to hinder the bees in the supers. Broodnest congestion is much reduces. Swarming onset is delayed if not prevented and it ends sooner. No huge bee beards at the entrance. Waldemar **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 17:39:31 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Brian Ames Subject: Re: Tag Teaming Bayer Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On Wed, 27 Aug 2008 22:28:33 GMT, deknow@netzero.net wrote: >-- Brian Ames wrote: >>Looks like Canada and Germany are also getting on board the train to take on Bayer and the neonictinoids. > >this is misleading to say the least. a private coalition of germans has filed with a public prosecutor. > Whatever - public or government - the point is that momentum is building for more information and new studies. Some more tidbits http://www.beyondpesticides.org/dailynewsblog/?p=499 "The NRDC lawsuit against EPA prompted a letter from EPAs Director of the Office of Pesticide Programs, Debra Edwards, PhD, stating that EPAs Office of Pesticide Programs sets the bar for its exceptional public participation processes and transparency." and "A 2007 examination of the French debate over imidacloprid in the journal Science of the Total Environment reveals that Bayer used outdated and disproved methods (not meeting state of the art detection limits) for its scientific studies assessing the effects of imidacloprid on honeybees, actions that call into question all of the scientific studies Bayer has produced regarding its products, in which it has a clear, vested economic interest." Uncertainty: Cause or effect of stakeholders' debates? Analysis of a case study: The risk for honeybees of the insecticide Gaucho http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6V78-4N3GWYM- 2&_user=10&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&view=c&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_useri d=10&md5=3eb98231db5ca1df381f67d7fc1c1888 **************************************************** * General Information About BEE-L is available at: * * http://www.honeybeeworld.com/bee-l/default.htm * ****************************************************