From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Feb 28 11:06:20 2009 Return-Path: <> X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.8 (2007-02-13) on industrial X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-86.8 required=2.4 tests=ADVANCE_FEE_1,ALL_NATURAL, AWL,MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR,SPF_HELO_PASS,USER_IN_WHITELIST autolearn=disabled version=3.1.8 X-Original-To: adamf@IBIBLIO.ORG Delivered-To: adamf@IBIBLIO.ORG Received: from listserv.albany.edu (unknown [169.226.1.24]) by metalab.unc.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id C03984887B for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2009 11:03:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from listserv.albany.edu (listserv.albany.edu [169.226.1.24]) by listserv.albany.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n1SG3YWX017258 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2009 11:03:37 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 11:03:36 -0500 From: "University at Albany LISTSERV Server (14.5)" Subject: File: "BEE-L LOG0901C" To: adamf@IBIBLIO.ORG Message-ID: Content-Length: 167612 Lines: 3835 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 06:01:27 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Mike McDonald Subject: Re: Norwegian invention? *Salicyl?* In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Wed, 2009-01-14 at 20:00 -0600, Walter Weller wrote: > When humans take salicylic acid it's usually called "aspirin". Just a minor correction. When humans use salicylic acid, it's called Compound W (the wart remover). When humans take aspirin, it's called acetasalicylic acid. Mike ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 07:36:42 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Walter Zimmermann Subject: Re: Norwegian invention? *Salicyl?* MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Greetings all: wrt the question marks kindly ignore them , I did not put them in perhaps Aaron could answer why they are there what I stated is fact, just for the fun of it,I even went into my old Organic Chemistry book -by Morrison and Boyd it's been along time since my studies but that education in that field really helps as a beekeeper. Walter ________________________________________________________________________ New Music Releases - Free Full CD Listening Parties Every Week. Listen Now. http://music.aol.ca/full-cd-listening-party/?icid=AOLMUS00050000000045 ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 07:46:56 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Walter Zimmermann Subject: Re: Norwegian invention? *Salicyl?* MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Just to correct you Grumpy Salicylic acid is not aspirin Aspirin is Acetylsalycilic aspirin thus ASA It's when they take Salicylic acid as I stated in my first post and use an acetylation process to make the aspirin Walter ________________________________________________________________________ New Music Releases - Free Full CD Listening Parties Every Week. Listen Now. http://music.aol.ca/full-cd-listening-party/?icid=AOLMUS00050000000045 ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 08:01:43 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?UTF-8?Q?Peter_L_Borst?= Subject: Re: Norwegian invention? *Salicyl?* Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Check the archives, salicylic has been tried many times. Also, oil of wintergreen is popular mite "cure" Item #38297 (26 Jan 2002 14:15) - History of AFB In Gleanings, Nov 1876, I found the first mention of the use of salicylic acid for foul brood. "The discoverer of the remedy cured 25 badly affected virus of the disease will have been efficiently destroyed. [they] used the salicylic acid as a preventative against foul brood, having mixed it with the sirup." In the 1913 book many *cures* are described, including honey mixed with salicylic acid, salicylic fumigants, carbolic acid, shaking method, etc. pb ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 08:11:19 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter L Borst Subject: Re: Norwegian invention? *Salicyl?* MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit This one has both (salicylic or acetyl­salicylic acid) Publication Date: 24.11.2005 International Filing Date: 13.05.2005 Inventor: ORBÁN, Gyula; (HU). Agent: KORMOS, Agnes; Váci út 66., H-1132 Budapest (HU). Title: APIARY VETERINARY COMPOSITION Abstract: The invention relates to a veterinary composition for the treatment and/or prevention of the nosema disease (Nosemosis apium) at honey bees comprising 2-hidroxi-benzoic acid (salicylic acid) or 2-acetoxi-benzoic acid (acetyl­salicylic acid ) or their salt(s) as active ingredient. In a preferable variant the composition contains sugar-industry molasses (concentrated watery extract of Beta vulgaris cv altissima) as carrier and if desired any other known auxiliary and carrier substances. -- Peter L Borst Danby, NY USA www.people.cornell.edu/pages/plb6 ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 08:41:21 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Kirk_Jones?= Subject: more feeding tips Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi beeks, I believe the reason to use the "trash water" pumps, for pumping syrup, is the loose tolerance of the impeller. Trash water pumps are designed to pump even small rocks or pebbles that get sucked up and won't build up large pressures if the line is shut off. The 67 bric mentioned by Mr. TNT is a nice viscosity to pump at colder temps. Maple syrup is about that bric. Right now in Florida we even dilute more to stimulate the bees (with 55 blend). We already have enough weight on them. Our goals is brood now. Just keep on slapping on the patties. They looked really nice and are drawing some wax. I found relatively few patties yesterday with Hive Beetle larvae. I just scraped them off and tossed them, as most were only partially left after the bees ate most of them. In the panhandle of Florida, the temps were above average and that may be the reason we are seeing any at all. We just got a big chill down last night and that may help. I did get an off forum question about fall feed with the pumping system. We generally only use internal feeders in Florida to facilitate feeding large yards quickly to boost the bees. In Michigan we generally stick to buckets, 2 gal. for general feeding, spring and fall, with the addition of 3 and a half gallon buckets to plug up the lighter ones. The syrup is still thinned out with an addition of bleach. But not as thin as spring feed. We aim for 10% cut with water, as we still use our pump system with the trash water pump I described a couple days ago. The ebay link is: http://cgi.ebay.com/PowerMax-Portable-Water-Trash-2-Pump-6-5-Hp-Gas-New_W0QQitemZ310112684460QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item310112684460&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205|66%3A2|65%3A12|39%3A1|240%3A1308|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A50 The pump is $200 delivered and we have tested it out. It's so cheap that I'm going to get another one for the shelve and our Michigan operation. Back to pumping syrup. The pumping system as described with quick disconnects is great to use in the beeyard or shop. Ours gets most used at the honeyhouse filling buckets in apple boxes one row at a time to avoid lifting heavy pails. We can quickly pump out of 4000 gallon tank or out of drums(uhhg)and fill a pail in less than 9 seconds if the syrup is a bit warmed or thinned properly. One more tip. Try using plugs in pails or lids for feeding. We use a one and a half inch plug with a taper for the buckets and lids. The same size for all makes lots of sense. They are available at: http://www.caplugs.com/ I think ours is the 16x. I would have to take a peek. One more tip. Drill all holes for the 1 and 1/2 plug with a 1 and 7/16 inch Fostner bit. You can find them on Amazon. That way you will get the right snug fit. Kirk Kirk ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 09:45:47 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Peter_L_Borst?= Subject: More Chemicals and Hives Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit LYSOL Referring to a report from Germany, where a Mr. Fulde has cured foul brood by means of a new disinfectant, lysol, Dr. C. D. Miller asked in Gleanings, page 88. "What's lysol and will it work as well in the English language as in the German?" The editor remarks thereon: "I should be interested, also, in knowing whether the disease stayed away. Perhaps Mr. Gravenhorst will answer the question." Yes, I will answer the question according to the best Information I can get. I have not tried lysol, because I did not know of it before September of last year. The new disinfectant has been manufactured for a few years by Schiilke & Mayr, at Hamburg, Germany. They produced it from coal-tar. It has a brown color, and smells like tar. In Germany it Is to be had In every drugstore, and perhaps In America also. Mr. Pulde purchased a bottle of lysol for 2 1/2 cents, and therewith cured his bees, which were badly infected with foul brood. He took ten pounds of sugar-syrup, boiled and skimmed it, and mixed Hup with 24 drops of lysol and 4 drops of carbolic acid. He gave a colony a soup-plate full of this food. After three days he found the sick larva dry in their cells, and in a lapse of three weeks not a trace of foul brood was to be found In his colonies. They were sound, and did swarm. Later he has fed lysol in the same way, particularly in the spring, to protect his bees against foul brood. He never saw a trace of it again. That's all I know about lysol. By C. J. H. Gravenhorst "Gleanings in Bee Culture" Jan 1, 1895 ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 10:09:21 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Brian Ames Subject: Re: honey laundering in the news Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit THe original article I posted about Honey Laundering turned out to bee the first in a multi part investigation into "funny honey" and the implications to consumers and beekeepers. What a gem this series of articles is for US Honey Producers . Here is the link for the whole series of articles. http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/specials/honey/ ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 10:23:50 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: kurt Subject: propolis sources In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753.1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed I see a lot of research papers on propolis in the Journal of Agricultural and Food Chemistry. You can search for articles here on the website (upper right hand corner of the page). Searching for "propolis" turned up 98 papers. Many of the papers discuss the botanical origins of the propolis, and many concern the chemical constituents and bioactive properties. The chemical profile of the propolis can oftentimes be used to identify the botanical source. If you don't have institutional access, you may be limited to just abstracts for many of the articles. But the page with the abstract will also have the email address of the corresponding author. They will generally gladly email you a pdf reprint. Kurt --**--**--**--**--**--**--**--**--**--**--**--**-- Kurt Allerslev Reynertson, Ph.D. Department of Pharmacology Weill Medical College of Cornell University 1300 York Avenue, Box 70, E-409 New York NY 10021 (212) 746 6262 (212) 746 8835 fax ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 16:26:37 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Brian Ames Subject: revisiting sublethal Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I could not find the whole paper unless you pay a subscription. Abnormal Foraging Behavior Induced by Sublethal Dosage of Imidacloprid in the Honey Bee (Hymenoptera: Apidae) Authors: Yang, E. C.; Chuang, Y. C.; Chen, Y. L.; Chang, L. H. Source: Journal of Economic Entomology, Volume 101, Number 6, December 2008 , pp. 1743- 1748(6) Abstract Although sublethal dosages of insecticide to nontarget insects have never been an important issue, they are attracting more and more attention lately. It has been demonstrated that low dosages of the neonicotinoid insecticide imidacloprid may affect honey bee, Apis mellifera L., behavior. In this article, the foraging behavior of the honey bee workers was investigated to show the effects of imidacloprid. By measuring the time interval between two visits at the same feeding site, we found that the normal foraging interval of honey bee workers was within 300 s. However, these honey bee workers delayed their return visit for >300 s when they were treated orally with sugar water containing imidacloprid. This time delay in their return visit is concentration- dependent, and the lowest effective concentration was found to be 50 &#956;g/liter. When bees were treated with an imidacloprid concentration higher than 1,200 μg/liter, they showed abnormalities in revisiting the feeding site. Some of them went missing, and some were present again at the feeding site the next day. Returning bees also showed delay in their return trips. Our results demonstrated that sublethal dosages of imidacloprid were able to affect foraging behavior of honey bees. ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 23:33:54 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: ALDEN MARSHALL Subject: Re: revisiting sublethal MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=Windows-1252; reply-type=original Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Ames" To: Sent: Friday, January 16, 2009 4:26 PM Subject: [BEE-L] revisiting sublethal >I could not find the whole paper unless you pay a subscription. > > Abnormal Foraging Behavior Induced by Sublethal Dosage of Imidacloprid in > the Honey Bee > (Hymenoptera: Apidae) The publication "spring Without Bees" refers to a similar study done by a French Research Lab describing the same results. Part of the basis, I assume, for banning IMD for certain crop usage. Alden M. ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 11:47:40 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: de roeck ghislain Subject: Use of fumidil B or fumagilline. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In Europe there is no MRL for fumagilline, so it isn't possible to treat the nosema twins at all. May I ask those two questions: - is there a MRL in the USA or Canada (or elsewhere); - I read several times that it is used in Great Britain . Is there someone who knows on which base (since Great Britain, basically has to apply the European rules in this matter)? Kind regards, Ghislain De Roeck, Belgium. ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 06:09:37 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Chris Slade Subject: Re: Use of fumidil B or fumagilline. In-Reply-To: <002201c97891$05507600$0ff16200$@be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Nobody is looking for it and so, until they do, a blind eye is being turned. Chris I read several times that it is used in Great Britain . Is there someone who knows on which base (since Great Britain, basically has to apply the European rules in this matter)? -----Original Message----- From: de roeck ghislain To: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu Sent: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 10:47 Subject: [BEE-L] Use of fumidil B or fumagilline. In Europe there is no MRL for fumagilline, so it isn't possible to treat the nosema twins at all. May I ask those two questions: - is there a MRL in the USA or Canada (or elsewhere); - I read several times that it is used in Great Britain . Is there someone who knows on which base (since Great Britain, basically has to apply the European rules in this matter)? Kind regards, Ghislain De Roeck, Belgium. ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ________________________________________________________________________ AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on the move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today. ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 14:10:12 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Roger White Subject: Fumidil B MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1253" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello, The UK had the good sense to get an exception for Fumidil use. It seems = to break down rapidly and one of the Professors I spoke to said they = had never detected residues of it in any honey sample. =20 The detection limit where no MRL exists is 10PPB - I do not know what = the action limit is. Best regards Roger White Cyprus. ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=3Dbee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 08:25:39 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Walter Zimmermann Subject: Fumidil B Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Greetings all: you can get some of the answers from the manufacturer Mr. Willy Baumgartner Medivet Pharmaceuticals in High River Alberta Canada medivet@telusplanet.net Walter Ontario ________________________________________________________________________ New Music Releases - Free Full CD Listening Parties Every Week. Listen Now. http://music.aol.ca/full-cd-listening-party/?icid=AOLMUS00050000000045 ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 10:05:13 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Peter_L_Borst?= Subject: Re: Use of fumidil B or fumagilline. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >In Europe there is no MRL for fumagilline, so it isn't possible to treat the >nosema twins at all. What about Nozevit? Has anyone tried this product? > Nozevit, is produced from all natural substances according to a decades old traditional European recipe. After many years of university studies and field testing to standardize Nozevit, it was introduced to European beekeepers in 2003. After 5 years of commercial success in Europe, Nozevit is now available in North America. -- from their web site ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 17:02:44 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter L Borst Subject: Beneficial symbionts MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline There is a growing appreciation for the potentially beneficial roles of bacteria in honey bee colonies. Reynaldi et al. recently showed that bacteria isolated from bees in Argentina are inhibitory of the important bee fungal pathogen, Ascosphaera apis [chalkbrood]. Bacterial symbionts likely play roles in individual and colony fitness across the social insects. Sharing of symbiotic bacteria is notoriously important for termite nutrition, and it is increasingly clear that both obligate and facultative symbioses are widespread in social insects. Recent evidence for a socially communicable defense against pathogens in termites might indeed reflect sharing of bacteria among termite colony members, rather than the proposed induction of host-specific physiological changes. Perhaps, as is apparent in the termites and ants, honey bees have evolved behavioral or physiological mechanisms to enhance the transmission of beneficial microbes, while battling those species which are pathogenic. This would indicate a delicate balancing act for bees and other social insects, allowing for the encouragement of beneficial species while maintaining barriers against exploitation by pathogens. Beneficial symbionts can potentially be fed to developing bees as a prophylactic against disease, and can regardless be used to better understand the complexity of interactions between the microbial biota of bees. It will, in this vein, also be important to look more closely at transmission mechanisms of microbes within and between bee colonies. Antagonistic interactions between honey bee bacterial symbionts and implications for disease Jay D Evans and Tamieka-Nicole Armstrong USDA-ARS Bee Research Lab, BARC-East Bldg. 476, Beltsville, MD 20705, USA ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 17:56:45 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter L Borst Subject: Queen pheromones and colony health MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline > Bees tolerant to Varroa were mainly characterized by differences in the expression of genes regulating neuronal development, neuronal sensitivity and olfaction. Differences in olfaction and sensitivity to stimuli are two parameters that could, at least in part, account for bee tolerance to Varroa; differences in olfaction may be related to increased grooming and hygienic behavior, important behaviors known to be involved in Varroa tolerance. These results suggest that differences in behavior, rather than in the immune system, underlie Varroa tolerance in honey bees, and give an indication of the specific physiological changes found in parasitized bees. They provide a first step toward better understanding molecular pathways involved in this important host-parasite relationship. > It has long been known that QMP stimulates the olfactory system of the bee, and the behavioral consequences of its releaser actions are well documented. The tasks of adult worker honeybees change as they age, from in-colony duties, such as nursing larvae, to pollen and nectar processing, followed by outside responsibilities of guarding and foraging. Plasticity of ontogeny in behavioral development allows the colony to cope effectively with changing environments, including internal requirements such as the production of new workers, or external opportunities such as increased nectar flow. This organizational shift and its plasticity are well recognized, but its underlying control has been a mystery, likely involving hormonal and pheromonal components. SEE: Differential gene expression of the honey bee Apis mellifera associated with Varroa destructor infection. M Navajas et al. BMC Genomics. 25 June 2008 Queen pheromone modulates brain dopamine function in worker honey bees. Kyle T. Beggs et al. PNAS. February 13, 2007 PHEROMONE COMMUNICATION IN THE HONEYBEE (Apis mellifera L.). KEITH N. SLESSOR et al. Journal of Chemical Ecology. November 2005 -- Peter L Borst Danby, NY USA www.people.cornell.edu/pages/plb6 ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 20:54:08 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Irwin_Harlton?= Subject: Re honey laundering Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/395172_honey08.html Is this the same Mr Bob Coyle who serves on the U.S National Honey Board? People are always innocent till proven guilty in a court of law ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 23:51:24 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Tim Townsend Organization: TPLR Honey Farms Ltd. Subject: Re: Re honey laundering In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Irwin Harlton wrote: > http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/395172_honey08.html > > Is this the same Mr Bob Coyle who serves on the U.S National Honey Board? > > You may want to read the article again, because neither Bob Coyle or Mike Ingalls were found to have done anything wrong. Tim Townsend ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 12:20:46 -0000 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter Edwards Subject: Re: Nosema and Propolis MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > Chris >> Do you think it likely that your bees obtain their propolis from a = single >> source or multiple sources? This is from a report of the EurBee3 conference published in BBKA News: Propolis Vassya Bankova (Bulgarian Academy of Sciences, Sofia.) It used to be thought that the chemical composition of propolis was = fairly consistent but Prof. Bankova said that it is now clear that it is = extremely variable, even in plants from the same families. The habitat, = ecosystems and the part of the world the plant grows in all have an = influence on the propolis composition. Although I was aware that the = poplar tree was a common producer of propolis, I did not know that it is = the most common source of propolis throughout Europe, where it is a = native, and is even collected where the tree has been introduced, for = example in South America. Bees will travel quite a distance to find = poplars, but when asked whether the bees dance to indicate a source of = poplar, Prof. Bankova said that 'as yet there no evidence for this, = although it seems likely'. Best wishes=20 Peter Edwards beekeepers at stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk www.stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk/=20 ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=3Dbee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 09:23:14 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter L Borst Subject: Re: Nosema and Propolis MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline > Analysis of numerous samples from different geographic regions led to the disclosure that the chemical composition of bee glue is highly variable. It is well documented that in the temperate zone all over the world, the main source of bee glue is the resinous exudate of the buds of poplar trees, mainly the black poplar Populus nigra. The main source of Brazilian bee glue turned out to be the leaf resin of Baccharis dracunculifolia. Recently the chemistry of Cuban propolis caught the attention of scientists. The plant source of this propolis type was detected to be the floral resin of Clusia Rosea. In spite of the great differences in the chemical composition of propolis from different geographic locations, all samples exhibit significant antibacterial and antifungal (and most of them antiviral) activity. -- "Recent trends and important developments in propolis research" by Vassya Bankova ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 18:35:55 -0000 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter Edwards Subject: Re: Nosema and Propolis MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Peter Borst quoted: > ...the main source of bee glue is the resinous exudate of the buds of > poplar trees, mainly the black poplar Populus nigra. I do not understand how the propolis comes from the buds. The poplar flowers in April, but the main collection time for propolis is the autumn. Are these flower buds? Best wishes Peter Edwards beekeepers at stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk www.stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk/ ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 18:45:54 -0000 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter Edwards Subject: Re: Beneficial symbionts MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Peter Borst quoted: > Reynaldi et al. recently showed > that bacteria isolated from bees in Argentina are inhibitory of the > important bee fungal pathogen, Ascosphaera apis [chalkbrood]. Does this suggest that feeding antibiotics is likely to increase chalkbrood? Best wishes Peter Edwards beekeepers at stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk www.stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk/ ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 16:56:46 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter Dillon Subject: Re: Nosema and Propolis In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Peter (Edwards) Have you ever touched the leaf buds of the "Horse Chestnut"just as they are bursting? - they are resinous. Poplar buds exhibit the same sticky touch on the protective covering as the start to be pushed apart from growth that takes place when the leaves grow in spring. Propolis "collection" and use in the fall - bees are seen to seal as many cracks etc. in their colony container - are they just using propolis that has been stored? Peter PEI ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 21:19:25 -0000 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter Edwards Subject: Re: Nosema and Propolis MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Peter Dillon wrote: > Propolis "collection" and use in the fall - bees are seen to seal as many > cracks etc. in their colony container - are they just using propolis that > has been stored? I am sure that they are not. We see many bees returning with propolis in the autumn, so although some may be re-used, there is certainly a large amount being collected. Yes, we see the 'sticky buds' on horsechestnut in the spring - every schoolchild knows about those (OK, schoolchildren used to know about them, before they became urbanised!) - but the sticky buds are long gone when the main propolis gathering season starts. So where do they get it all from? Best wishes Peter Edwards beekeepers at stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk www.stratford-upon-avon.freeserve.co.uk/ ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 16:35:00 EST Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Chris Slade Subject: Re: Nosema and Propolis MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 18/01/2009 21:21:14 GMT Standard Time, peter.edwards@HOMECALL.CO.UK writes: Yes, we see the 'sticky buds' on horsechestnut in the spring - every schoolchild knows about those I cut down a conker tree back in November and there were sticky buds on it then. Chris ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 11:05:49 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Nosema update MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Hi All, I'm back from the national conventions, and have been off line for 5 days. I will be catching up on all your private emails, and hope to update you on the research highlights. Re the Nosema ceranae. I was able to discuss N ceranae with a number of researchers from around the world. It is clearly a different animal than N apis! It's spores are more delicate (sensitive to both heat and cold), we don't know the mode(s) of transmission, nor what treatments are best, or when. The winners at present appear to be fumagillin still the best, Nosevit at new dose rate, HoneyBHealthy helps some, and then promising herbal entries from Europe. Number one is good nutrition, with the Hackenberg-type patty in first place (I have a similar tested formula at my website under Nutrition). Re spores on combs, Dr Eva Forsgren from Sweden gave me an important piece of information: the mean infective dose for N ceranae is 85 spores. Despite posts to this List to the contrary, apparently no researcher has taken swabs of N ceranae infected combs to see how many spores were present. Therefore, any recommendations to disinfect your combs for N ceranae spores are premature. So last week, I enlisted the help of Dave Westerveld and Jerry Bromenshenk to check two colonies that had been infected for over 1-1/2 years--one still alive (running 8M spores at the entrance), and one dead from mites/nosema? (10M spores in the dead bees in the cluster). When we swabbed combs, spores were truly rare--on the comb surface, on the cell walls, in the beebread, in fresh collected pollen, or in the honey or nectar. It looks like it would be hard for a bee to get 85 spores from the combs! I asked researchers if anyone had tried emerging bees onto infected combs to see if they indeed became infected with N ceranae. None that I spoke to had, or had heard of anyone who had. So I plan to run that experiment this week. As far as N ceranae causing colony collapse, very few researchers are seeing this. The vast majority find it to be a rather benign parasite. Dave Hackenberg has had it in his operation since at least 1985, and never found it to be a problem until CCD. Why it explodes to high levels in some operations is unknown--perhaps chemical suppression of the immune system, poor nutrition, or a virus being involved. Findings by Dr Frank Eischen indicate that at spore counts below 2-3M, you are better off feeding protein rather than using fumagillin. Fumagillin sets colonies back, and large commercial beeks are realizing how much money they wasted. Nosevit is currently being rigorously tested in Croatia. My own limited trials indicate some efficacy, despite my use of a lower concentration than the currently recommended dosage. It is far cheaper than fumagillin, and does not have honey contamination issues. Because I'm hoping that it will prove to be effective, I do not want to be biased, and am therefore going out of my way to test it thoroughly before I give it my "seal of approval." Randy Oliver ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 12:23:45 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Almond pollination MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Att almond pollinators, There appear to be enough hives in Calif. May I sugggest that you don't bring in any more unless you have firm contracts. Randy Oliver In California, sinking under the weight of bee hives ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 17:19:05 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Peter_L_Borst?= Subject: Re: Nosema and Propolis Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Peter Edwards wrote: >I do not understand how the propolis comes from the buds. The poplar >flowers in April, but the main collection time for propolis is the autumn. Good point you make. The sticky substance is on the tree most of the time, I would say, in the various parts. In San Diego, where I grew up, the source of most propolis is eucalyptus trees. This exudes from cracks in the bark. It is reddish purple, very sticky and stains badly. I always thought that poplar is the chief source of propolis around here (upstate NY). It tends to be somewhat more brittle than the western type I was used to, but it stains just as badly. pb ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 14:05:28 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bee Haven Subject: propolis in the fall MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Peter, I congecture that fall-collected propolis is available from the scales = that cover vegetative buds and reproductive buds on woody perennials. = These buds are laid down toward the end of the growing season and may be = fairly small. We tend to notice them more in the spring when they are = enlarging prior to the emergence of shoots or flowers. Steve Mitchell =20 Steve and Gail Mitchell Bee Haven Farm 4820 Wilson Road Duncan, BC, V9L 6L6 Phone: 250-746-9916 Fax: 250-746-9233 ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=3Dbee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 17:24:48 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Peter_L_Borst?= Subject: Re: Beneficial symbionts Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Peter Edwards wrote: >Does this suggest that feeding antibiotics is likely to increase chalkbrood? I think we beat this horse to death a few months ago. Dean, the expert on this, no longer appears to be posting. I would say that it is widely known and accepted that the use of antibiotics can have adverse side effects. Just what those effects are in terms of honey bees, is by no means clear to me. Could be -- but that is not the same as IS. (I am pretty clear on what the definition of is is.) pb ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 14:40:47 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: Nosema and Propolis In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline > > >I do not understand how the propolis comes from the buds. Trees use antimicrobial resins to protect new leaf buds, and any wounds in the bark. Bees simply coop the plant defenses. I haven't observed populus trees in the fall when bees are gathering propolis, but would GUESS that it would be at wounds. Randy Oliver ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 18:46:26 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Carolyn Ehle Subject: Re: Nosema and Propolis In-Reply-To: <3dcef4a10901181440r67eb06dctf2e5a4d1604ec8a7@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit randy oliver wrote: > > > Trees use antimicrobial resins to protect new leaf buds, and any wounds in > the bark. Bees simply coop the plant defenses. I haven't observed populus > trees in the fall when bees are gathering propolis, but would GUESS that it > would be at wounds. In fall and winter our South Carolina Piedmont bees are very busy on the leaves of Baccharis halimifolia, called broom tree around here. At first I thought they were collecting pollen fallen from the fall-blooming male plants, but on closer inspection they are usually harvesting the resin gland material. This is the same genus as the source of the green propolis from South America which has gotten so much attention. I saw a video, the plant looks identical. Don't know if some of the same compounds are present. They also love to harvest from empty equipment. I no longer scrape the propolis off except when necessary for a better fit, so that it is available to them. However, I have not used any chemical whatsoever in hives since 2001, and then only formic acid and mineral oil. Carolyn in Plum Branch, SC 29845-0007 ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 16:50:56 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Dave Burrup Subject: Re: Nosema and Propolis MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The leaf buds and terminal buds are resinous ----- Original Message ----- From: "randy oliver" To: Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2009 3:40 PM Subject: Re: [BEE-L] Nosema and Propolis > > >> >I do not understand how the propolis comes from the buds. > > > Trees use antimicrobial resins to protect new leaf buds, and any wounds in > the bark. Bees simply coop the plant defenses. I haven't observed > populus > trees in the fall when bees are gathering propolis, but would GUESS that > it > would be at wounds. > > Randy Oliver > > ******************************************************* > * Search the BEE-L archives at: * > * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * > ******************************************************* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 18:59:34 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Michael Palmer Subject: Bogus Advertising Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Here's one for Jim's "Wall Of Shame." http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/ff61/frenchhill/scan0001-4.jpg They must really think we're gullible. Maybe some are. An expensive hive coating that protects the bees and promotes healthy brood...like the frame of brood in the header?? That hive musta needed another coat, eh? Mike ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 19:01:40 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Michael Palmer Subject: Re: Nosema and Propolis In-Reply-To: <4973BF52.6080906@wctel.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed > >They also love to harvest from empty equipment. I no longer scrape >the propolis off except... Place a ball of propolis on the top cover. The bees will harvest it. Mike ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 18:18:34 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Charles Harper Subject: Re: Bogus Advertising In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit They also sent out Color postcards. Harper's Honey Farm Charles Harper charlie@russianbreeder.org labeeman@russianbreeder.com (337) 298 6261 Michael Palmer wrote: > Here's one for Jim's "Wall Of Shame." ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 00:55:08 GMT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "patrice32@juno.com" Subject: What is the cause for Granulation? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit All my fall crop has crystallized. Instead of getting on the "reliquifying by heating" merry-go-round, I will market as is. What causes granulation? : Temperature Moisture content Pollen? Other particles to be filtered out? Ratio of glucose to fructose in certain nectars , like aster? ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 01:11:01 GMT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "deknow@netzero.net" Subject: Northeast Treatment Free Beekeeping Conference Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit http://BeeUntoOthers.com/Conference.html Golden Rule Honey, LLC Presents: Northeast Treatment Free Beekeeping Conference Friday, July 31 through Sunday, August 2, 2009 Doyle Conservation Center Leominster, Massachusetts "Birthplace of Johnny Appleseed” Confirmed Speakers: * Dee Lusby, Arizona * Erik Osterland, Sweden * Michael Bush, Nebraska * Michael Palmer, Vermont * Sam Comfort, New York/Florida * Dean “deknow” Stiglitz, Massachusetts * Laurie Ramona Herboldsheimer, Massachusetts * ...and more TBA! Topics include all aspects of managing bees without the use of any treatments (synthetic, “natural”, or “organic”). There will be programs for both beginning beekeepers (including those that have never been around bees before) and for those with more experience: * Small Cell Beekeeping * Foundationless Frames * Overwintering Nucs * Queen Rearing * Commercial Beekeeping * Top Bar Hives * Marketing * Microbial Environment in the Hive * Beginning Beekeeping * Working with Landowners * Beekeeping on a shoestring * Cutouts * History of Foundation and Cell Size * Economics of Migratory Beekeeping * Bee Photography * Panel Discussions Healthy, tasty meals will be provided on site as part of the conference cost (no HFCS!). Treatment free hives will be onsite for hands on fieldwork with our speakers! Plenty of opportunity for spontaneous interactions with speakers and attendees. The venue, Doyle Conservation Center, is an ideal location for our conference. State of the art audio and video facilities combined with solar power, composting toilets, geothermal heat/cooling pumps, sustainable and recycled building materials…”Gold Certification” from the U.S. Green Building Council. All of this on 50 acres of conservation land! The Property: http://www.thetrustees.org/pages/300_doyle_reservation.cfm Technical details of the green construction: http://www.masstech.org/Project%20Deliverables/LORI/Trusteesofreservation_Final%20Report.pdf Cost: $150 Paypal information at: http://BeeUntoOthers.com Or, send a check to: Golden Rule Honey, LLC 168 Fourth Street Leominster, MA 01453 We have a lot of interest both locally and from as far away as Maryland..so register early to ensure there is space for you! Conference will begin with lunch on Friday and end around 1 pm on Sunday. Registration includes 6 meals. As we are arranging and preparing the food ourselves, these will be high quality meals. There is a Super 8 motel 1.5 miles from the venue…a healthy walk. Currently, the best rates seem to be from: http://kayak.com …$50/night...this is generally less expensive than booking with the hotel directly. There are other hotel options, some nearby campgrounds, etc...will update as we know more. Leominster is on the Fitchburg commuter train line, and can be reached from Boston or Cambridge without a car. Please email us if you have any questions. info@BeeUntoOthers.com ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 16:40:58 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: revisiting sublethal In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline > > >Abnormal Foraging Behavior Induced by Sublethal Dosage of Imidacloprid in > the Honey Bee > (Hymenoptera: Apidae) Hi Brian, I am on the Pesticide Working Group with Bayer CropScience started by Dr Jerry Bromenshenk and Dr Dave Fischer of Bayer. I am approaching the neonic subject with an open mind. Bayer does not dispute that pesticides kill bees, and that they may cause sublethal effects (as Bob Harrison has pointed out). In fact, Bob, if you still have unanswered questions to Bayer, I will be happy to see if I can get answers to them. All pesticide issues revolve around dosage. Regulations are designed to prevent harm to nontarget organisms (such as bees). With bees, there are questions as to sublethal effects upon individual bees, the colony, and reproductives. Sublethal effects may be rate of growth, resistance to diseases, or behaviour abnormalities. The doses in the cited study were on the high side of what bees in the field would actually be exposed to. One value of seeing the effects of high doses is that it may help you to know what to look for at low doses. But it doesn't mean that low doses have any significant effect. A study presented Friday in Reno by Josephine Johnson found conflicting data regarding abnormal return of foragers at low doses of imidicloprid. She will be expanding the trial. The national beekeeper associations are currently seating members for the Beekeeper Advisory Board to Bayer (and eventually other chemical companies). The members will review all appropriate research, including unpublished proprietary Bayer data, and make recommendations to improve future research so as to better answer our questions as to the effects of current and future pesticides upon bees. I hope that we can get a better sense of the actual effects, or lack thereof, soon. Randy Oliver ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 16:51:17 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: Bogus Advertising In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline >>They must really think we're gullible. The distributor personally painted some hives at my place. I sent one to Jerry Bromenshenk. He confirmed an R value of about 6.5. The hive I sent was improperly painted, so that the paint cracked (cold day, not enough time). Still an impressive figure! I have not yet had the opportunity to test the painted boxes. Randy Oliver ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 20:55:07 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Michael Palmer Subject: Re: Bogus Advertising In-Reply-To: <3dcef4a10901181651r4d48ec16j79ae9e0f3718ab6b@mail.gmail.co m> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed > He confirmed an R value of about 6.5. Still an impressive figure! How is insulation supposed to affect colony health, prevent CCD, and promote healthy brood?? Mike ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 20:30:37 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Lionel Evans Subject: Small Hive Beetles MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I heard a man say that eucalyptus oil will get rid of small hive = beetles. Anyone ever heard of this? Lionel ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=3Dbee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 23:37:28 -0300 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Juanse Barros Subject: Bogus Advertising / R - value MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline He confirmed an R value of about 6.5. Still an impressive figure! Which is the normal R-value of wood without painting? - Juanse Barros J. APIZUR S.A. Carrera 695 Gorbea - CHILE +56-45-271693 08-3613310 http://apiaraucania.blogspot.com/ juanseapi@gmail.com ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 21:45:51 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Darrell Subject: Re: What is the cause for Granulation? In-Reply-To: <20090118.195508.24837.0@webmail12.vgs.untd.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 19-Jan-09, at 12:55 AM, patrice32@juno.com wrote: > All my fall crop has crystallized. Instead of getting on the > "reliquifying by heating" merry-go-round, I will market as is. > > Hi Patrice and all I no longer worry about crystallized honey. I produce only raw honey and do not heat or filter. My summer honey is usually very fine crystals while the fall honey is coarser but still spreadable at room temperature. When I first put crystallized honey on my sales table people asked "what is that white stuff?". Now if I put fresh liquid honey on the table, they come to the door and ask why we don't have any of the white stuff out. My first sentence is a lie as I do worry about it crystallizing in the tank. Bottling 500 lbs of solid honey is a chore I try to avoid. I use an uncapping fork instead of a hot knife so no heat there either. Bob Darrell Caledon Ontario Canada 44N80W ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 19:52:54 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Harrison Subject: Re: Almond pollination In-Reply-To: <3dcef4a10901181223weea8922xca64fc7063c6abd7@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > There appear to be enough hives in Calif. May I suggest that you don't > bring in any more unless you have firm contracts. I do not believe the situation can be linked to a single factor. Can you confirm what we suspect? 1. water issues. 2.mostly good hives (some strong as heck. 3. Because a move started last year to readily accept field run bees due to cost some beeks went to splitting 10 frame hives into two hives to actually make a better profit and in many cases eliminate splitting issues right after almonds. We battle to split hives after almonds to prevent swarming in apples. In other words for those not understanding what I am saying (Randy does) if you take a few thousand strong 10 frames and bust into 6 thousand 5 framers you can produce a glut of bees. Beeks which bring strong hives in and feed feed feed after Dec. 22nd can produce the hives to split in half. Heavy doubles in and singles ready for a second deep out. Not all out of state beeks are doing the above but enough are to help create a glut of bees. 4.almond prices low and with pollination high and water cost high some growers might consider passing this year to rest trees. Am I close Randy or way off base? bob ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 18:33:33 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: Bogus Advertising In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline > >How is insulation supposed to affect colony health, prevent CCD, and > promote healthy brood?? Sorry, thought that you were incredulous about insulative value, which is far greater than the tarpaper that you use. I don't waste much time reading advertising copy. The paint is expensive, so I guess you need to make strong claims to justify ;-) Too bad that he didn't put in on Adee's hives. All his CCD went away this year. That would have made for a very impressive (uncontrolled) demonstration! Randy Oliver ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 19:06:36 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: Bogus Advertising / R - value In-Reply-To: <7eb65cc10901181837i4a37d03bvfe8cee0fc285c357@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline > > >Which is the normal R-value of wood without painting? For pine, R = 1.06 for 3/4" thick. I'm not sure if Jerry's figure was total R value, or in addition. Randy Oliver ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 23:10:35 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Mike Rossander Subject: Re: Bogus Advertising / R - value In-Reply-To: <7eb65cc10901181837i4a37d03bvfe8cee0fc285c357@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Juanse asked about the R-value of unpainted wood.=A0 Most references put it= between 0.7 and 1.4 per inch.=A0 Since most US woodenware is 3/4", the eff= ective R-value is between 0.5 and 1.1.=A0 The difference will be mostly bas= ed on grain, density and moisture content.=A0 (A coat of regular latex pain= t on the box will have a negligible effect.) While insulative paints do exist, they generally do not work by increasing = the R-value of the material (advertising hype notwithstanding).=A0 Certain = paints may have reflective heat properties which can be helpful but reflect= ion is not considered when calculating R-value.=A0 The only reputable estim= ate of an R-value for insulative paint that I could find cited 0.2 to 0.4 f= or two coats.=A0 (I did find a number of claims of R-values of 19-20 for a = "Paint Additive Developed In Conjunction With NASA" but also found a compla= int filed with the FTC for false advertising on those same claims.) For comparison, polystyrene has an R-value of 3.8 to 5.0 per inch.=A0 Given that the walls of the polystyrene hives are thicker than wood hives, = I'd estimate their R-value as up to 6.25 - less if you've got the older ones with the thinner walls. So even if this advertisement is true, it only gets a wood box into the sam= e range that you can already get with polystyrene.=A0 I've not heard that c= olonies in poly hives are any more resistant to CCD than colonies in plain = wood.=A0 If it were true, I'd have thought that something as clear as survi= vors in poly, deadouts in wood would be a fairly obvious and easy to spot d= ifferentiator.=A0 The fact that no one is reporting such a pattern seems to= undermine the claims of this advertiser. As a side note:=A0 From their website, the paint costs about $70 per gallon= which, if I'm reading their coverage estimates right, would cover about 25= deeps.=A0 Add in shipping, handling and some minimal value for labor and I= 'd guess the cost at $3 - 3.50 per deep.=A0 The current price difference be= tween an unassembled wood deep and a poly deep is $3.20. Mike Rossander =0A=0A=0A ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=3Dbee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 06:41:51 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: DAVID ADAMS Subject: Re: Almond pollination In-Reply-To: <877705555.275241232365046959.JavaMail.root@md06.embarq.synacor.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit 4.almond prices low and with pollination high and water cost high some growers might consider passing this year to rest trees. Am I close Randy or way off base? bob >From what I've been told by those with large contracts , I think your number 4 is the main cause for any problems.Face it bees are not the most expensive thing they use,and beekeepers are the only ones which will stupidly cut prices,the water man, fertilizer man or the chemical man ain't gonna budge like we will. But anyway,I've been told the scheme seems to be rent less bees, make a smaller crop on your bee covered rented land and work the numbers on paper with an overall crop loss to make up some of the money. Having learned how some of the watermelon growers here work the USDA crop loss program when you have numerous large fields ,it's not hard to make money and cut your inputs at the same time. It's a learned game to make more , with less and tighten the crop up to firm up the coming years prices for nuts. If only pollination was included as a crop loss for beekeepers. ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 04:45:05 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: C Hooper Subject: Synthetic Wound-Healing Honey Based on Hydrogen Peroxide Release Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Synthetic Wound-Healing Honey Based on Hydrogen Peroxide Release Apitherapy News, 1/19/2009 http://tinyurl.com/79nyxx A patent has been published for a synthetic wound healing product that reportedly mimics honey’s slow release of hydrogen peroxide. As reported December 13, 2008, in Apitherapy News: “Sligo Institute of Technology has just signed a licensing agreement with a leading American company following research it conducted into manuka honey -- believed to have unique healing powers.â€â€¦ NOTE: This information is exclusive to Apitherapy News. ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 07:35:32 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?UTF-8?Q?Peter_L_Borst?= Subject: Re: Bogus Advertising Comments: To: Randy Oliver Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit randy oliver wrote: >Adee's hives. All his CCD went away this year. Would you care to elaborate on this? That is, does he have any idea what caused it and what caused it to "go away"? Or is it "just one of those things"? pb ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 07:40:41 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Michael Palmer Subject: Re: Bogus Advertising / R - value In-Reply-To: <7eb65cc10901181837i4a37d03bvfe8cee0fc285c357@mail.gmail.co m> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed > Which is the normal R-value of wood without painting? I believe the R-value of wood in 1 per inch. Mike ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 07:45:29 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Michael Palmer Subject: Re: Bogus Advertising In-Reply-To: <3dcef4a10901181833p1ce3b949n23f4669c83deeb18@mail.gmail.co m> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed > Sorry, thought that you were incredulous about insulative value, which is >far greater than the tarpaper that you use. Well, that wouldn't be difficult. I figure the R-value of tarpaper is close to zero. Tarpaper isn't used for it's R-value, but for solar gain on cold winter days. Mike ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 21:14:01 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Harrison Subject: Re: revisiting sublethal In-Reply-To: <3dcef4a10901181640x71782a32tcbb84c88a2a73cd0@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In fact, Bob, if you > still have unanswered questions to Bayer, I will be happy to see if I can > get answers to them. Get a copy of a "A Spring Without Bees" and read. Please! Bayer has a serious PR problem with the worlds beeks. David fisher did not answer mine or Stan's questions we asked when he was briefly on BEE-L. I hold no animosity against David Fischer as I realize that if Mr. Fisher did not do what Bayer asks Bayer would hire a person which would. Might even get a person harder to deal with than David Fischer! Imidacloprid has about ruined Orange for beeks in Florida. I see only minor problems for California beeks now but take a look at the 12 pages of crops imidacloprid is used on now at the end of the book. More coming on line everyday. keep an open mind Randy and look at all the research. Cailifornia is only a small part of U.S. beekeeping. > > The national beekeeper associations are currently seating members for the > Beekeeper Advisory Board to Bayer (and eventually other chemical > companies). I volunteer! This type of PR has been tried in France, Germany and other countries but produced little actual results. Beeks will get the neonicotinoids to live with in the U.S.. Beeks in France won against Bayer but the U.S. runs under a different system! bob ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 19:52:56 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: Almond pollination In-Reply-To: <32381DAB69F246E3817013A780357CAA@bobPC> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline You are dead on, Bob! Some growers have decided to forego a crop this year due to water prices. That freed up thousands of colonies that are being offered at fire sale prices. California beekeepers can simply let unrented colonies sit. Out of staters will cut other beekeeper's throats by bidding the price down to pay for hauling costs back home. I can't begin to tell you how appreciative we locals are of that--almost as good as getting fire ants and small hive beetle! The low nut prices will result in some orchards being pulled and replanted to almonds or something else. I took a nice photo of an orchard being pulled a couple of weeks ago. The supply is up because by some miracle beekeepers discovered that if they give their bees good nutrition and keep mite levels low, that their colonies will actually survive and be strong. The high rental prices encouraged many to make increase. CCD may have run its course in most operations, making for more supply. Brett Adee was beaming in Fresno, which means that the competition is back in the game. However, the fat lady hasn't sung yet. I was speaking with Dr Denis Anderson today as he visited a holding yard of 30,000 colonies. He said that in some colonies he inspected, three out of four cells had mites. Denis was amazed at the concentration of that many colonies in one area, and understood why they were being fed continually. I made the analogy that from a disease standpoint, a holding yard of that size is like a tinderbox just waiting for a match. A couple of weeks ago, several semiloads of deadouts/dinks went back to Texas. Out of state beekeepers are currently heading down to the Valley for a reality check on their colony numbers. I wish them the best of luck, but unless some of them crash, I won't be placing all of my colonies : ( My numbers rebounded this year, and I was not foresightful enough to beat the bushes for additional contracts. If anyone needs a few more colonies in North Valley... Randy Oliver ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 23:44:03 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: Norwegian invention? *Salicyl?* In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline > > >Title: APIARY VETERINARY COMPOSITION > Abstract: The invention relates to a veterinary composition for the > treatment and/or prevention of the nosema disease (Nosemosis apium) at > honey bees comprising 2-hidroxi-benzoic acid (salicylic acid) Marketed by Vita Europe as Apilife Gold. Randy Oliver ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 23:48:13 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: Small Hive Beetles In-Reply-To: <7F5AD5AC5C3C453F9199CDB69872E1FE@bige953ca8f8be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline >I heard a man say that eucalyptus oil will get rid of small hive beetles. Certainly one of our Aussie friends should know. Trevor? Peter? ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 09:14:58 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter L Borst Subject: Re: revisiting sublethal MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Bob wrote: >Get a copy of a "A Spring Without Bees" and read. Please! * * * > Michael Schacker's "A Spring without Bees" speculates that pesticides are to blame for these bee losses. But most beekeepers and researchers say that pesticides may just be one of several causes, including multiple suspicious viruses, working together to form a lethal combination that kills off bees. > Agricultural Research Service spokeswoman Kim Kaplan says "Because we don't know what causes it, we have to have experts in all the different facets" she said, "So we don't have any one scientist who is completely devoted to CCD. What we have is a number of researchers who work on CCD projects either in part or in whole." > Secretary of Agriculture Ed Schafer recently told U.S. News & World Report that the USDA doesn't need money for CCD research. "You can always try to overwhelm things with money and hopefully get a better answer. Very, very seldom do you get a better answer; you're just wasting money," he said. source: washingtonindependent.com ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 09:16:50 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Darrell Subject: Re: Nosema and Propolis In-Reply-To: <4973978E.10601@rogers.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v753) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 18-Jan-09, at 3:56 PM, Peter Dillon wrote: > > Propolis "collection" and use in the fall - bees are seen to seal > as many cracks etc. in their colony container - are they just using > propolis that has been stored? > Hi Peter and all Last fall(Sept 16) I put propolis mats on 2 hives to collect some for a customer. I had never used the mats before. When I took them off 2 weeks later, they were full of wax. If there was propolis, there wasn't much. I will try it again this spring. Bob Darrell Caledon Ontario Canada 44N80W ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 09:36:19 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter L Borst Subject: Causes for colony losses not yet found MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit New Year message (excerpt) Beekeepers around the world have met major problems in the last few years with massive losses of colonies and fluctuating honey markets. For many beekeepers, times have been tough. Many have asked themselves whether beekeeping is still a profitable enterprise. The causes for colony losses have not yet been found, but we have established close co-operation among scientists and beekeepers to find solutions. Probably the problems are complex, since there may be more than one reason for these losses. In some instances the losses of colonies are caused by a combination of multiple determinants. Scientists and beekeepers have compiled a list of possible factors to be investigated. The "Coloss" (Colony Losses) network, with the participation of Scientists and Beekeepers from 35 countries, is investigating the problems from many different points of view. At the next Apimondia Congress in Montpellier, France, scheduled to take place on 15 - 20 September 2009, we will all be able to hear about the latest findings as well as discuss with the scientists working on these problems. To solve this predicament with colony losses we need to work closely together among Scientists and Beekeepers to find solutions and we must be willing to look at all possibilities with open minds. International Federation of Beekeepers' Associations Asger Søgaard Jørgensen www.apimodia2009.com ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 01:35:05 +1000 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Trevor Weatherhead Subject: Re: Small Hive Beetles MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > >I heard a man say that eucalyptus oil will get rid of small hive beetles. > > Certainly one of our Aussie friends should know. Trevor? Peter? I haven't heard of this one, except for the mention above. I know that many have tried all sorts of things without any successes. Trevor Weatherhead AUSTRALIA ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 13:04:50 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Jerry Bromenshenk Subject: Re: Bogus Advertising In-Reply-To: <3dcef4a10901181651r4d48ec16j79ae9e0f3718ab6b@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Randy's statement about our findings is incorrect, must be a miscommunication. We saw an increase of about 6 degrees inside a two story hive?on a warm day.? I've made no statements about R values.? I was surprised to see much of any change, but both internal temp probes and an IR imaging camera showed small changes, in the empty hive and in the hive with bees in it.? The distributor thinks we should have seen a greater temperature change -- if the paint had been allowed to dry between coats.? He's promised more hives for testing, this time properly prepared.? If we get some more hives, we will test.?? And yes, the coats of paint hastily slapped on at Randy's did peel off this fall in MT, as soon as the weather started into cold nights, warm days. As per claims of having any effect on colony health and CCD, I've made it clear to them?that no such claim can be made.? Since we don't know what causes CCD, no one can claim to have a cure. So, I've still no idea of the R value of this nanopaint, but it did differ from that of hives with regular paint.? Other than that, I don't see that any claims can be made.? They are talking to an associate of ours who has done extensive testing of temperatures inside hives - want him and his students to more thoroughly test the temperature effects. J.J. Bromenshenk Bee Alert Missoula, Mt -----Original Message----- From: randy oliver To: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu Sent: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 5:51 pm Subject: Re: [BEE-L] Bogus Advertising >>They must really think we're gullible. The distributor personally painted some hives at my place. I sent one to Jerry Bromenshenk. He confirmed an R value of about 6.5. The hive I sent was improperly painted, so that the paint cracked (cold day, not enough time). Still an impressive figure! I have not yet had the opportunity to test the painted boxes. Randy Oliver ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 10:21:30 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: Bogus Advertising In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline > > >Tarpaper isn't used for it's R-value, but for solar gain on cold winter > days. Thanks, Mike! Please allow me to explain something. Since I've made the mistake of becoming a high-profile beekeeper, I draw anyone with something to sell like a magnet. My yard is cluttered with products to test. I have often run tests of products long before they come to the attention of the List. Those pitching the products to me are generally earnest, excited, and often have a financial stake. Unfortunately, I often tell them that I doubt that their product will either be effective, or at least cost effective. That often does not stop them from making a try. So when the product hits the market, I may post to this List information that I have. I do not wish to make decisions for others, but I do think that decisions should be based upon all available data. I gladly share any data that I have. I beg the List not to interpret such statements from me as either endorsement or nonendorsement of any product. Randy Oliver ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 10:38:40 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: revisiting sublethal In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline > > >Get a copy of a "A Spring Without Bees" and read. Please! Have done, will do! > > >keep an open mind Randy and look at all the research. That's exactly what I am doing, Bob. An open mind looks in both directions, starting at neutrality. I'm tying to get to the facts of the matter. Randy Oliver ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 11:05:35 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: Bogus Advertising In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline >does he have any idea what caused [CCD] and what caused it to "go away"? Good question, Pete. I do not wish to speak for others, so let me give a more generic answer. Good nutrition and mite management appear to make a heckuva difference. I don't know where nosema fits in. Also the mutation rates of viruses, and the natural selection for virulence of a parasite at high host densities. There appear to have been virus issues. IAPV appears to be able to cause problems, or at least be associated with problems. Its cousin, KBV, also. Then there are other viruses, including Dr Bromenshenk's unpublished suspect. The point to understand is that there are apparently about 20 viruses in our bees, but researchers other than Bromenshenk/Wick have only had the means to screen for 8 of them. Bees could be dropping like flies from any of the other dozen, and no one would detect the culprit. Some recovering beekeepers bred from survivors. Some simply ordered more queens from the same breeders. In my own small operation, the disease appears to have "gone away," (knock on wood). Perhaps we will eventually call CCD "Disappearing Disease Redux." I am very interested in what we are learning about bee virology, and am keenly following some of the researchers on the cutting edge, such as the Bromenshenk/Wick team, and Nitzan Paldi at Beeologics. I'm also very curious as to how the epigenetic factors in viral resistance and/or activation come into play. These factors include nutrition, weather, and exposure to chemicals, whether agricultural or beekeeper applied. I wish that I could tell you that CCD has been solved. But it hasn't. Randy Oliver ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 14:54:20 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Brian Ames Subject: Re: Nosema update Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Nice update on Nosena Randy wondering if you can clarify this comment " Fumagillin sets colonies back" ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 16:03:53 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Jerry Bromenshenk Subject: When a Talk Goes Wrong MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At ABF, I was asked to talk about pesticides. I decided to try to be thought provoking, point out some of the history of?pesticides and?lessons learned, and provide some cautionary guidance, especially to young researchers.? I also tried to make it humorous, blending the Top Ten List and the You Might be A Redneck format. Part of the audience enjoyed this, told me do; some thought I had points that needed to be said, and also told me so;?but some took it very wrong.? Fortunately, some were good enough friends that they told me that the talk had gone wrong. This response seemed to be mainly directed at two issues: 1) My statements and Top Ten Reasons that Your Pesticide Study Might Have a Problem, and 2) My conclusion and use of the Pogo cartoon that says, "We have met the enemy and he is us" - with reference to the miticides found in comb. So please let me try to explain my?intent for?both: I am most concerned?that any young researcher may have?thought that I was singly them out, criticizing their work OR that any beekeeper or beekeeping association thought that I was talking about specific students or them. My concern, and I did say this to the audience, is that I worry about a lack of professional guidance in terms of how to conduct research on sensitive topics such as?pesticides.? That's not a fault of the student or young researcher, this is?a failure of their thesis committee and advisors.? But that oversight can have far reaching implications to their professional success. I have spent 35 years on EPA Superfund, DoD (military), and DoD (energy dept)?sites, looking at industrial and military emissions (many of which may threaten human health).? I also for the past 17 years have?coordinated Montana's state wide research for the Dept of Energy - usually interacting with as many as 20-30 UG students and 30-35 graduate students, as well as many young faculty. Overall,?I have concluded that our?Universities fail at providing proper guidance in terms of conducting research, especially?where the outcomes may have decided impacts on health, ecosystems,?and economics.? We fall short in terms of training our students in things such as Good Laboratory Practices, establishing Quality Assurance Project Plans, obtaining data that is truly representative of the situation (not just a cursory look), and remembering that the results may have far reaching implications, and that one just might find oneself dragged into litigation. My comments about students were a composite, drawing not only on current students of bee research in the U.S., but others that I have seen in my travels over the past few years in other countries, and on three decades of environmental studies students who have conducted studies of industrial companies, emitting chemicals that at times threaten human health, animals (including bees), and even plants.??Some of these studies?have ended up in court; many have been entered into decision making processes such as environmental impact assessments, siting permits, etc. Please keep in mind, thesis research is expected to meet established standards for conducting experiments, reporting, etc.? We also stress that a scientist should not pick a conclusion, then go shopping for facts to support the conclusion. However, there is a vast difference in terms of the degree of rigor expected and the consequences?of data use, for?different types of research.? Finding a promising new diet supplement, conducting a simple survey, or completing a graduate program that allows one to take courses and conduct a literature survey -- all of these are likely to be a fairly straight forward exercise - be diligent, pass your coursework and thesis defense, get a diploma.? If you are lucky, publish the results; and specialists in your field may actually read the article. Take on an industrial pollutant that may affect human health (e.g., fluoride and fluorosis; arsenic, lead, and cadmium for smelters; radioactive fallout from nuclear reactors or plutonium recovery facilities, arsenic in a community's water supply from past mining and smelting) and the bar is immediately raised; as is also true for human health studies. Similarly, the results of any pesticide study are likely to get more?intensive scrutiny, whether the concern is about environmental risks to humans or risks to non-target organisms such as bees.? Beekeepers and growers?will want?to use the results to make management decisions relevant to the health of their bees and other issues that can have large economic benefits or costs.? The costs of making a wrong decision can be high, especially for large?bee operations, pollinators, and growers.? Similarly, a good decision may save bees, improve crop pollination, reduce risks to native pollinators, all of which have economic and ecological benefits. The bee?industry will?immediately and often eagerly?pay attention to new investigators and their studies, looking for help that will reduce risks to bees, improve their operations, make a profit.??Their expectations are likely to be high.? And, if the study comes up with a finding that runs counter to other data or that could impact sales of a specific pesticide, the chemical companies will immediately take notice.? Although one would hope that all of this will?play out in terms of the?science and through civil discourse, the fact is that nothing is that simple. So, young researchers should be made aware that their?pesticide?data may be called into question.? In the best case, a bit more work, and the problem can be addressed.? Sometimes though, a student is told to go back and re-do everything.? And, I've seen students so demoralized that they pack up and leave, and young faculty who fail to obtain tenure - all because of shortcomings in how they conducted their research.? And never think that outside comments don't enter into decisions such as tenure. My first exposure to all of this was when one of my early faculty?mentors was involved in litigation regarding acid rain, power plants and other industrial companies,?in the context of acid rain?damages to Christmas Trees and subsequent loss of revenue by Xmas Tree?Growers - no one wants trees with brown needles.??He was a?well known and outspoken senior?Environmental Scientist?made statements that he was able to back up with his data.? But the companies did NOT like his findings and his willingness to speak out, and some well-established?researchers felt that he was attacking them.? He ended up signing over his house and possessions to his wife to try to shield himself from threats of lawsuits being filed?against him for his statements.? The companies and researchers sent letters to the Commissioner of Higher Education, to the President of our University, and their lawyers kept his and the University lawyers?busy for a long time.? The University did NOT like the negative press, and I doubt that he would have been able to weather the storm is he hadn't been a full professor with tenure. So, my concern is for the welfare of the young investigator.? One can and should?work on issues that tend to be hot button topics, and if you follow some basic precepts,?the data should be fine.? But, over the years, I continually find enthusiastic students who don't even know what terms such as GLP (Good Laboratory Practices), QAPP (Quality Assurrance Project Plan), representative sampling and others mean, much less follow them.? Twenty plus years of doing EPA Superfund work - and I?know that this can be done.? But it takes time and costs more.??In return?you can sleep better, knowing that you've done everything possible to obtain quality data - and you will have the documentation that shows that it is accurate, precise, well done.? But, all of this costs time, effort, and money.? For example,?EPA expects things like repeating every tenth analysis, using field blanks, blind samples, bound notebooks, internal and external instrumentationand data audits, and other quality control and assurance steps.?? Over the years, I've learned that this level of data quality assurance adds at least 30% to a project's costs.? So, I put at the top of?my Top Ten?list, asking a funding agency?for adequate amounts of money to cover the costs of these.??From my perspective, you can't do this on a shoe string budget.? If you don't have proper funding, take on a different thesis project. As a joke,?and here's where?I?made a big mistake - I thought everyone knew that young students often under-estimate the actual costs of doing a study.? I also thought everyone knew that?most?bee associations tend to have only small amounts to offer students.? And, I've seen more than one instance where a bee association found some more money for a student, knowing that they really needed more.? So, I made a joke?that You Might Have a Problem if a bee association says you should hav asked for more money.?No one laughed, and I should have stopped right there, tried to explain.? Again, I emphasize that my comments were not directed at any individual student or bee association nor do they reflect any specific person, group, or action.? Each item of the Top Ten list had a basis of truth based on many years of being involved with young researchers, bee, and environmental (conservation)?organizations.? All were exaggerated to some extent in my attempt at introducing some comedy into the lessons that I was trying to illustrate.? Some in the audience?understood what I was doing, others interpreted my comments as an attack on students and/or bee associations, for that I apologize. However, if any young researcher did not understand any of the terms or concept covered by this list - then its time to go back to the committee and be sure that there's a committee member who has the expertise to address these issues, provide proper guidance.? Better to address and fix any research shortcoming in the early stages of the research than have it come up after the fact.? If I save even one young researcher from the need to go back and re-do, avoid the embarrassment of making statements that later can't be backed up with rigorous data, or avoid terminating a thesis or a job, then I will have accomplished what I intended. Now, as per the 2) Pogo cartoon.? Unfortunately, the one thing that seems to be coming out of all of the current pesticide studies is how often wax is found to be contaminated by miticides.? You've heard about fluvalinate and cuomaphos, we've added paradichlorobenze, and, the most recent data is about two breakdown products of Amitraz - although I don't think we know what this means.? However we?now know that using Amitraz adds yet another category of miticide contaminates in wax?to the list.? One chemist found that his 'new' foundation had levels that caused him to throw it away, start a search for a supplier of wax free of miticides.? So, the harsh truth is - these products are showing up more frequently and at higher levels than anyone would like to see.? From my perspective, that's a major problem we need to address.? Hopefully, we don't have to go to Turkey to buy wax that is certified by European labs as being free of miticides. When I used the Pogo - the Enemy is Us, I did not mean to point the finger of blame at beekeepers.? I meant?US in the sense that WE all have a share in this problem - and I hold researchers, including myself, to blame as much as anyone.? After all?these decades, we have not found viable alternatives to harsh and potentially bee damaging?chemicals for mite and wax moth control - and we are seeing the consequences of this.? Finally, those of you who are old enough to remember will understand that I started my career looking at pollutants in bees, wax, nectar, pollen, honey, and the air inside beehives.? I've repeatedly warned the beekeeping industry?about potential build ups in wax and honey -?although honey seems to remain relatively clean compared to wax and pollen from most harmful chemicals. I've also frequently?warned that in addition to pesticides,?industrial chemicals?like benzene?in beehives in?urban areas sometimes exceed OSHA safety levels for indoor air in chemical and industrial laboratories.? Breakdown products of gasoline, diesel, dry cleaning solvents, all end up in the hive, many at high levels - and many of these may present hazards to bees equal to those of many pesticides - ranging for acute toxicity to sublethal effects.? How bees stay alive and reasonably well in many of these settings is surprising.? Sometimes they don't, and in some cases, we were able to help a beekeeper collect damages.? But those are hard cases to prove and win. Sorry about the long message, but it was clear that my attempt at providing some lessons learned and guidance didn't go as I intended at ABF. Jerry J.J. Bromenshenk Bee Alert Missoula, Mt ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 21:21:28 +0000 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Andrew Johnston Subject: Nosema and Propolis MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bob Darrell wrote Last fall(Sept 16) I put propolis mats on 2 hives to collect some for a customer. I had never used the mats before. When I took them off 2 weeks later, they were full of wax. If there was propolis, there wasn't much. I will try it again this spring. Might I suggest that Fall(Sept 16) is too late, My bees (middle of UK) start collecting propolis in July and by the end of August all hatches are battened down. They also collect propolis in March and April and where available from Balsam Poplar, they also collect pollen from the catkins. When the brood nest is full they seem to stop collecting! Nothing scientific just 30 years of looking. Regards Andy Johnston ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 19:41:26 EST Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Jerry Bromenshenk Subject: ?? in my messages MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have no idea of why ? are sprinkled through my two messages of today. My usual computer blew out its graphics card, so I've a borrowed PC. Jerry **************Inauguration '09: Get complete coverage from the nation's capital.(http://www.aol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000027) ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 16:56:36 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "J. Waggle" Subject: Re: ?? in my messages In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- On Mon, 1/19/09, Jerry Bromenshenk wrote: > I have no idea of why ? are sprinkled through my two > messages of today. My > usual computer blew out its graphics card, so I've a > borrowed PC. Jerry That answers allot of ? questions. ;) Enjoyed your posts! Joe ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 20:48:38 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: "=?windows-1252?Q?J._Waggle?=" Subject: Can a Cluster of Bees Generate Sufficient Heat During Winter to Overheat Themselves? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Can a Cluster of Bees Generate Sufficient Heat During Winter to Overheat Themselves? An article titled: “On The Temperature of the Bee-Hive in Winter” appeared in Sharpe's London Magazine in 1847, which suggests bees can generate sufficient heat so as to overheat themselves in the winter. I would be interested in hearing opinions on weather you think Mr. Newport was observing an actual overheating of the colony, or some other natural occurrence that would give the impression that the bees were being overheated to the observer. I am pretty sure here of the full identity of the entomologist, but am seeking absolute verification on weather or not the Mr. Newport in reference, is the Entomologist, George Newport Esq. and also any further information on his experiments with bees. The article can be found in its entirety on the Historical Honeybee Articles site, but here, I post the portion of great interest. …It has been already shown, that a surprising amount of heat may be suddenly developed in the hive even in mid-winter, by exciting the bees. In a second straw-hive, which Mr. Newport had exposed to the open air like the common cottage-hives, the internal temperature at 10 o'clock, A. M., of the 2d Feb., was a little over 48 degrees, being only 14 degrees higher than that of the external atmosphere. On disturbing the hive by tapping, the mercury rose to 102 degrees, or 68 degrees above the temperature of the surrounding air. When the heat is thus suddenly increased during the earlier or latter part of winter, it becomes intolerable to the bees, and they immediately endeavor to reduce it by ventilation, provided the outer cold be not too severe to prevent their assembling near the entrance of the hive. At about 40 degrees, the temperature of the hive is quickly modified by the assiduity of the bees; "I have often," says Mr. Newport, "been amused by observing them after the hive has been disturbed for a short time, although but a few minutes before there was not a single bee on the alighting board come hastily to the entrance of the hive, and having arranged themselves within three quarters of an inch of the doorway, begin to fan with their wings most laboriously, to occasion a current of cool air through the interior of the hive."… Best Wishes, Joe Waggle "…Contracto frigore pigrae." -With cold benumbed, inactive they remain. (Virgil, Georgics, Book IV, 29 B.C.E) ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 18:25:51 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: Nosema update In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline > > >wondering if you can clarify this comment " Fumagillin sets colonies back" Colonies with spore counts less than about 2M (I have to get the exact number) in fall were stronger going into almonds if fed protein without fumagillin than protein plus fumagillin. Jeff Pettis says that these results have been corroborated a few times. I picked up hints of this throughout earlier literature, too. But this is hard data, replicated. The point is, that one should not use fumagillin prophylactically unless actual spore counts warrant. This currently only applies to California--I don't know if it can be extrapolated to long northern winters. Don't know if anyone is testing there. Medhat or Adony, you lurking? Randy Oliver ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 08:48:31 +0000 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Andrew Johnston Subject: Nosema and Propolis MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit My main reason for posting yesterday was to ask the question 'where do bees store propolis'. My understanding is that like water it is collected and used when needed, ok some may get re-used but that is not really storing. Regards Andy Johnston ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 18:46:08 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Unusual "pesticide" kill MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Hi All, Last late summer I visited my yards in Nevada irrigated alfalfa. In two yards, a few colonies had about 2 lbs of dead and dying bees on the bottom boards, just beginning to be carried out in the morning. Bees writhing, tongues out. No other dead bees on the ground in the yards. Obviously happened the night before. Took samples. No nosema. Bromenshenk found no unusual virus loads. Sure looked like pesticide, but growers, crop duster, and county agents said no spraying at all that time of year. Sent samples to Maryann Frasier. Just got results--nothing but zeroes--no detectable pesticides whatsoever (I haven't used synthetic miticides in years). I've seen this several times the past few years. Usually one colony in a yard with a pile of fresh dead bees (1-2 lbs). Usually in summer in Nevada, but also saw in almonds last year. Colonies generally recover. I have no clue as to what is causing. Nor why it would happen to several colonies the same night, with no sign of previous deaths. Randy Oliver ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 08:25:44 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bill T Subject: Re: When a Talk Goes Wrong In-Reply-To: <8CB489091ACCCAA-FA4-9EB@webmail-mf02.sysops.aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 4:03 PM, Jerry Bromenshenk wrote: > > Please keep in mind, thesis research is expected to meet established > standards for conducting experiments, reporting, etc.? We also stress that a > scientist should not pick a conclusion, then go shopping for facts to > support the conclusion. One major problem is ethics in science, as well as all society. Truth is dismissed it conflicts with what we want or believe. I appreciated your comments. The problem with humor is that humorless people do exist and will take what you say at face value. Humor always has an element of truth. Because it does, it can puncture the balloon of pomposity and self-righteousness and you will get a reaction. You were kind to try and comfort those whose balloon's popped. But, occasionally, it is enjoyable to watch them splutter. Bill Truesdell (researchers are still looking for additional beekeepers on which to test cocaine - thanks to those who have participated so far. Unfortunately your posts reflect it but you do dance well.) Bath, Maine (where seriousness reigns) ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 10:49:28 EST Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Jerry Bromenshenk Subject: Re: Unusual "pesticide" kill MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Randy At the time that you sent me samples, we could only scan for viruses that IVDS does well. Next time you see an incident like this, let's send to Army for Proteomics - that will considerably expand the search for pathogens, since the Mass Spectrometer picks up virtually all known bee diseases and pests, not just viruses. Jerry **************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps! (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1215855013x1201028747/aol?redir=http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072%26hmpgID=62%26bcd=De cemailfooterNO62) ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 10:57:24 EST Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Jerry Bromenshenk Subject: Re: Nosema update MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This issue of colonies stronger if fed protein without fumagillin, only use if needed - could be explained by one of the first comments to me by Dr. Robert Cramer at MSU. He's a fungal pathologist in the molecular veterinary labs in Bozeman, has been working on alternatives to fumagillin - see Jan Bee Culture. Robb was surprised that beekeepers used fumagillin. He said that in mammals, fumagillin is known to suppress the immune system, not something one wants to see when treating sick animals. He didn't know if this applied to bees - I suggest that he not waste time confirming this, but to immediately focus on alternatives for Nosema control, which he did. Jerry **************Inauguration '09: Get complete coverage from the nation's capital.(http://www.aol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000027) ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 10:01:26 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Wes Miller Subject: Rushford Honey at Inauguration MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I thought you all might be interested in this news story in my local paper: http://www.winonadailynews.com/articles/2009/01/20/news/04honey.txt Monitor locally, Act extra-locally. http://canariesinacoalmine.blogspot.com ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 08:35:34 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: my "pesticide" results In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline > > > 1) non-pesticide poison - plant, industrial, ag chem > 2) non-viral pathogen > 3) unusual stress - heat prostration, etc. > #1 is the only one that makes sense. Feeding at cattle molasses mixture (thanks to Eric Slayton)??? Someone's boric acid ant bait???? But neither of these would be the case in almonds. Randy Oliver ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 17:52:59 EST Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Jerry Bromenshenk Subject: Re: my "pesticide" results MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Randy You said only #1 on my list made sense. So,be sure to remember that the pesticide lab can do multiple pesticides in the same sample, but can't do some others. Any chance of Chemigation?? If I am not mistaken, the pesticide analysis may miss things soluble in water. Drip systems can leak, making chemical laced water available to bees. Jerry **************Inauguration '09: Get complete coverage from the nation's capital.(http://www.aol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000027) ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 21:04:06 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter L Borst Subject: Collapse of hives due to Nosema ceranae MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I just received this press release, which I translated from the Spanish "The collapse of hives due to Nosema ceranae in field conditions has been documented" The scientific journal "Environmental Microbiology" has accepted two new works on the parasite Nosema ceranae and colony collapse in beehives for publication. =E2=80=A8=E2=80=A8The first study ("Colony collapse in professional Apiarie= s") conducted by the Center Ap=C3=ADcola de Castilla-La Mancha, describes two solid cases of= the clinical evolution of colony collapse in hives of professional beekeepers. They detected the presence of the parasite Nosema ceranae appear without other significant pathogens or neonicotinoid pesticides that the collapse could be attributed to. Treatment with fumagillin avoided loss of the remaining surviving hives. This is the first case in the world that documents colony collapse of beehives due to N. ceranae in professionals beekeepers' hives and field conditions. The other study ("South American native Bumblebees infected by Nosema ceranae, an emerging pathogen of honey bees"), described for the first time an infection by N. ceranae of three species of bumble bees (Bombus) native to Argentina. http://www.agrodigital.com/ original: Documentado el despoblamiento de las colmenas debido a Nosema ceranae en condiciones de campo. La revista cient=C3=ADfica Environmental Microbiology ha aceptado para su publicaci=C3=B3n dos nuevos trabajos relacionados con el par=C3=A1sito Nose= ma ceranae y con el despoblamiento de las colmenas. En el primero de los estudios (Colony collapse in professional apiaries), realizado por el Centro Ap=C3=ADcola de Castilla-La Mancha, se describe la evoluci=C3=B3n cl=C3=ADnica del despoblamiento en dos casos concretos de ap= icultores profesionales, en los que se detect=C3=B3 la presencia del par=C3=A1sito No= sema ceranae sin que aparecieran otros pat=C3=B3genos significativos o pesticida= s neonicotinoides que pudieran justificar el despoblamiento. El tratamiento con fumagilina evit=C3=B3 la p=C3=A9rdida de los restos supervivientes de l= as colmenas. Se trata del primer caso en todo el mundo en que se documenta un s=C3=ADndrome de despoblamiento de las colmenas debido a N.ceranae en apicu= ltores profesionales y en condiciones de campo. En el otro estudio (South American native bumblebees infected by Nosema ceranae, an emerging pathogen of honey bees), se describe por primera vez l= a infecci=C3=B3n por N.ceranae en tres especies de abejorros (Bombus) nativas= de Argentina. --=20 Peter L Borst Danby, NY USA www.people.cornell.edu/pages/plb6 ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=3Dbee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 18:52:13 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: my "pesticide" results In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Not chemigation for sure--none done there. But lots of cattle. Randy Oliver ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 07:11:01 +0000 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: joe mc cool Subject: Effect of high voltage overhead power lines In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Please, is there any research out there on the effect, if any, of high voltage overhead power lines on bees ? Does it effect their health or powers of orientation? Just curious. Joe McCool ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 03:40:23 EST Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Chris Slade Subject: Re: Effect of high voltage overhead power lines MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 21/01/2009 07:24:00 GMT Standard Time, joe@BENBURB.DEMON.CO.UK writes: of high voltage overhead power lines on bees ? Does it effect their health or powers of orientation? My former mentor, Roy Page, said that when he kept bees near a large electricity sub station they were always bad tempered compared to those kept elsewhere. Chris ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 19:01:38 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: randy oliver Subject: Re: Collapse of hives due to Nosema ceranae In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > >This is the first case in the world that > documents colony collapse of beehives due to N. ceranae in professionals > beekeepers' hives and field conditions. Peter, have you posted to the List the recent paper about the different strains of nosema? It will be interesting to see if they differ in virulence. Also, could you please tell us if the paper describes the symptoms of collapse? Especially the off feed. Yesterday I processed six samples of bees from colonies that had either died over winter with dead bees on the bottom board, or that were alive but with dead bees out front. Some had N ceranae, most didn't. None had spore counts over 10M. I've been checking any piles of dead bees all year, and seldom find any nosema in them. I am emphatically NOT dismissing N ceranae as a problem. I'm just saying that most of the time that I suspect it, it is not present, or at very low levels. Randy Oliver ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 08:07:02 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Peter L Borst Subject: Re: Collapse of hives due to Nosema ceranae MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Randy writes > Peter, have you posted to the List the recent paper about the different strains of nosema? No, but I will tell you why. About two weeks ago I stumbled upon several studies that seemed to contain some startling revelations. Not wanting to overreact, I sent copies off to various people to stimulate discussion, but nothing much came of it. SO, I'm thinking, maybe I'm the only one interested by this stuff. Also, I can't really distribute these papers, as they are copyrighted. I can only post excerpts. What I am seeing is that nosema is a highly variable organism that can infect multiple hosts. Traditional species distinctions were made on the basis of observable physical, behavioral, geographic, or pathological differences. Later species distinctions have been made on the basis of genetic dissimilarities that are often subsequently called into question. Bottom line is: I am not sure that the new nosema is in fact new, or if it has been here all along, or is another variation of nosema spp. Also, I wonder if the PCR tests are distinguishing characters that may or may not have meaning in terms of the behavior or pathology of the various so-called species or varieties. Finally, I don't know if anybody but you and me even cares about this stuff Excerpts from recent research Both species [N. apis and N. ceranae] infect the ventriculus of adult honey bees and are transmitted horizontally via spore ingestion, for example whilst workers clean combs of infected faeces. Of great concern is the apparently higher mortality we observed that N. ceranae imposes on A. mellifera compared to N. apis. Colony level infection experiments in the field are now required to demonstrate a causal link between N. ceranae infection and colony collapse. N. ceranae and N. apis may have both existed in A. mellifera for quite a long period. The morphological records of N. apis show high variability and N. ceranae has been found in Europe and on Martinique Island (unpublished data). The origin of N. ceranae will have to be elucidated by further research. * * * The full length rRNA genes of N. ceranae has also been examined and found identical to those of N. apis. Comparing the rRNA sequences of the isolates from A. mellifera and A. ceranae, it showed no difference in phylogeny, and it may represent no differentiation between the isolates from different hosts. Moreover, the N. ceranae isolates from different areas of the world were obtained through abroad researchers, and these isolates showed little difference in IGS phylogenetic analyses. Recent researches showed that there may be more than two species causing honeybee nosema disease, and it raised the questions about the accuracy of records that attributed the Nosema species infection of A. mellifera. Therefore, a multiplex PCR diagnosis method that could discriminate N. apis and N. ceranae was established in this study. * * * The authors compared the morphological and ultrastructure characters between N. apis and N. ceranae and found that the SSUrRNA sequences differed between the two species. It is not known whether N. ceranae is a new, emerging honeybee parasite or is a naturally occurring species that had been overlooked due to its morphological similarity to N. apis In Spain, the ratio of N. ceranae infection in colonies infected with nosema disease was reported to be as high as 90% (Higes et al., 2006). In the samples from Taiwan and Martinique, only N. ceranae was recovered. An unidentified microsporidium from France shares 96% identity with N. ceranae and 94% identity with N. apis. Moreover, the ITS region was sequenced and aligned with the other ITS sequences (Fig. 3); there were noticeable differences from both N. apis and N. ceranae. The unique rDNA arrangement of N. ceranae was not found in this species. The unidentified species found in France suggested that in addition to N. ceranae and N. apis, other Nosema species might be infecting A. mellifera. The rDNA sequence (including SSUrRNA and ITS) of the unidentified species is an intermediate between those of N. apis and N. ceranae, generating interesting questions about in nosema disease research * * * Characterisation of microsporidian species and differentiation among genetic variants of the same species has typically relied on ribosomal RNA (rRNA) gene sequences. Our data on within-genome rRNA variability call into question the usefulness of rRNA sequences to characterise intraspecific genetic variants in the Microsporidia. -- Peter L Borst Danby, NY USA www.people.cornell.edu/pages/plb6 ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 09:37:38 EST Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: David MacFawn Subject: Re: Collapse of hives due to Nosema ceranae MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Peter, This is excellent material I am not sure that the new nosema is in fact new, or if it has been here all along, or is another variation of nosema spp. Also, I wonder if the PCR tests are distinguishing characters that may or may not have meaning in terms of the behavior or pathology of the various so-called species or varieties. Finally, I don't know if anybody but you and me even cares about this stuff If there is another variation of nosema spp, this is scary! **************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps! (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1215855013x1201028747/aol?redir=http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072%26hmpgID=62%26bcd=De cemailfooterNO62) ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 16:30:41 +0000 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Lennard Pisa Subject: Re: Collapse of hives due to Nosema ceranae In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks Peter. I hope people are researching the relatedness/fylogeny of the= Nosema strains. Or are at least generating data on multiple infections IF = there are really seperate strains.=20 We might be witnessing a speciation event. The relatedness and competion of= different "strains" for bees and our response (affecting bee diverisity an= d pathogen transmission) will affect the long term virulence of the diseas= e.=20 =20 Too much for this email=2C I am at work but there is some good modeling out= there (look for " dynamics of multiple infection and the evolution of viru= lence" by Van Baalen and Sabelis or related work) that might give a testabl= e case for the Nosema species and maybe we can make some predictions. =20 L=20 =20 _________________________________________________________________ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/= ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=3Dbee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 19:46:43 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Massimiliano Subject: poisoned guttation from tanned seed mais MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Professor A. Tapparo, Scienze departement University of Padova, with a simple test show that the water by guttation of plants of maize born from sedds tanned with neonicotinoides kill bees in two minutes!! Watch the video. http://www.mieliditalia.it/n_rugiada.htm Regards, Massimiliano Gotti Aspromiele Piedmont Italy ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 20:06:24 +0000 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Gavin Ramsay Subject: Re: poisoned guttation from tanned seed mais MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Ciao Massimiliano I wonder - is this valuable new information, or is it just adding more confusion? Guttation is fluid from the xylem, and is mostly water. No sugar to attract bees, but if you offer it in a droplet (as they did in the video) to thirsty bees they will drink. What about in the fields - will bees collect it? Reasons for thinking that normally they will not: - guttation is usually there only at times of high humidity when other surfaces may be damp and usually occurs early in the day. Are bees flying and collecting water then? Will they climb up short maize seedlings to collect water? Would they not prefer other places? - their need for water is low once spring is underway. The spring flowers are out and provide nectar, and the heat of the summer has not yet started. Babelfish brought out this from the article: The Professor To. Tapparo, of the Department of Sciences Chemistries of the University of Padova, has analyzed the produced water drops from plants of it of maize with the guttazione, recovering the presence of neonicotinoidi in reason of a ten of milligrammi for liter (, has understood well! The used measure is expressed in milligrammi/liter that is ppm - parts per million when it is well-known that the lethal dose for the bee measure in little, infinitesimali ones, ppb - parts for trillion) It is *not* the case that it well-known that the lethal dose is below 1 ppb and this just adds to the feeling that this is far from an unbiased piece of work. So is Prof Tapparo just indulging in scare stories, or does he have good evidence that bees might collect guttation? Has anyone out there seen bees collecting water from maize (sorry, corn ...) seedlings? all the best Gavin ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 18:12:17 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Harrison Subject: Re: Unusual "pesticide" kill In-Reply-To: <3dcef4a10901191846t156b1099w9637c679ae410c78@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello Randy & All, All I have to go on is prior experience and testing. 2 lbs is a bunch of bees. 7000 but who's counting. Bees writhing, > tongues out. No other dead bees on the ground in the yards. Obviously > happened the night before. > Took samples. No nosema. Bromenshenk found no unusual virus load Key words: no unusual & no detectable pesticide load No unusual virus load but I suspect BPV was found in samples. Actually turns up in most bee samples. So common many simply ignore the paralysis virus being in samples. When I see what Randy saw I do two quick and dirty tests. I see if the sick bees can fly. If not paralysis virus is suspect. In late stages bees can not hold on to comb. Place bees on comb held horizontal and then slowly turn vertical. If bees fall off I would suspect a paralysis virus as a *possible* cause. Surely pesticide issues can produce the same symptoms but if samples turned up *zero* pesticides I would say you could rule pesticides out. HOWEVER if PPM or even PPB of pesticides are found then you can't totally rule out pesticide these days. If no bee paralysis virus was found in samples then you can rule out virus but if BPV was detected at any level in my opinion you can not completely rule out virus. If the problem is found in a hive with a growing varroa load I would suspect virus. Today if a hive has 5 or more varroa in a roll in my opinion virus can raise its ugly head. Another test I use for virus is to gather some of the apparently healthy bees and cage. If virus then all die within 8 hours. Now I have no PHD by my name and am only a simple beekeeper but I have seen about every problem a bee hive has to offer. Hope the post helps Randy! Keep doing those articles! bob > > Sure looked like pesticide, but growers, crop duster, and county agents > said > no spraying at all that time of year. > > Sent samples to Maryann Frasier. Just got results--nothing but zeroes--no > detectable pesticides whatsoever (I haven't used synthetic miticides in > years). > > I've seen this several times the past few years. Usually one colony in a > yard with a pile of fresh dead bees (1-2 lbs). Usually in summer in > Nevada, > but also saw in almonds last year. Colonies generally recover. > > I have no clue as to what is causing. Nor why it would happen to several > colonies the same night, with no sign of previous deaths. > > Randy Oliver > > ******************************************************* > * Search the BEE-L archives at: * > * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * > ******************************************************* ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 20:31:17 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: Bob Harrison Subject: Re: When a Talk Goes Wrong Comments: cc: randy oliver In-Reply-To: <8CB489091ACCCAA-FA4-9EB@webmail-mf02.sysops.aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello Jerry & All, I am starting to get feedback from the ABF. I was not at the ABFconvention . I was given a brown manila envelope full of non traceable bills from a chemical company to stay away ! (Kidding!) However many (other than beeks) are glad I did not show up. I am surprised you put your talk up for discussion. I will comment if you promise to not kill the messenger. > At ABF, I was asked to talk about pesticides. The beek response: to me Why did you wonder away from the subject which is on their minds? The ABF convention is basically directed at beekeepers. Mainly commercial & sideline. The ABF (of which I have been a longtime loyal member) has lost many commercial beeks to the AHPA (of which I attend at times ) because those beeks feel the AHPA presentations are directed at their issues and not future researchers. > 2) My conclusion and use of the Pogo cartoon that says, "We have met the > enemy and he is us" - with reference to the mitacides found in comb. The above hit a nerve because today the U.S. bees are as strong as the bees have been in decades. Most on the comb you guys say is a problem. My answer: If you look into the archives you will see I thought as you apparently do that comb with high levels of these mitacides was our *main*problem. In fact I spent big bucks to render my comb with those mitacides in wax. I still believe that replacing mitacide contaminated comb is a good thing but I have also learned that mitacide contaminated comb will raise healthy bees when all other factors are under control. I offer the smile Randy talks about on the Adee family faces at the convention as proof bees can thrive on these comb as long as other factors are controlled... Below are excerpts you posted which read like a chemical company warning to young researchers or am I reading it wrong? > Similarly, the results of any pesticide study are likely to get > more?intensive scrutiny, whether the concern is about environmental risks > to humans or risks to non-target organisms such as bees.? > And, if the study comes up with a finding that runs counter to other data > or that could impact sales of a specific pesticide, the chemical companies > will immediately take notice.? > So, young researchers should be made aware that their?pesticide?data may be called into question.? > > He ended up signing over his house and possessions to his wife to try to > shield himself from threats of lawsuits being filed?against him for his > statements.? > > So, my concern is for the welfare of the young investigator.? If I was a young researcher and "the old master"( Jerry B.) said the above I would not want any part of pesticide research! Jerry said: > One chemist found that his 'new' foundation had levels that caused him to > throw it away, start a search for a supplier of wax free of mitacides.? my response: Please do not toss. Many beeks are keeping healthy bees on wax from all the bee supply houses. Maybe Dee would not use but many of my friends will. > Jerry said: .>>So, the harsh truth is - these products are showing up more frequently and at higher levels than anyone would like to see.? From my perspective, that's a major problem we need to address.? Hopefully, we don't have to go to Turkey to buy wax that is certified by European labs as being free of mitacides. The harsh truth is container loads of comb from all the major wax suppliers were put in hives this year and the bees are doing great. Why not run tests on Mann Lake comb to publish? Maybe Jack Thomas would provide funding? Are you not setting a poor example for your young researchers by saying all comb in the U.S. from bee supply houses is contaminated? Could you not be sued by Mann Lake or Dadant as you have provided no proof the amount of mitacides which the mass spec can find in rendered comb is in fact harmful to the bees? The chemical company which beeks are taking issue with because of their products has been saying what you are saying since bee hives started crashing. Many of us would like to see some proof to back up these claims. Commercial beeks this year have installed a staggering amount of the comb you guys question and wow the best bees in years. I am looking forward to hearing your presentation word for recorded word Jerry. bob ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * ******************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 21:35:48 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu From: =?UTF-8?Q?Peter_L_Borst?= Subject: Re: When a Talk Goes Wrong Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Bob writes: > I offer the smile Randy talks about on the Adee family faces at the convention as proof bees can thrive on these comb as long as other factors are controlled. What other factors? What are the Adees doing differently? Do you know? I certainly am interested in hearing what they may be doing differently. Or was it just another case of the disappearing disease... pb ******************************************************* * Search the BEE-L archives at: * * http://listserv.albany.edu:8080/cgi-bin/wa?S1=bee-l * *******************************************************