Date sent: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 09:11:35 -0500 From: "L-Soft list server at ALBNYVM1 (1.8b)" Subject: File: "BEE-L LOG9603" To: Allen Dick ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Mar 1996 00:48:16 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: JOHN ROMANIK Subject: Re: Evaluation of Honeybees; Checklist or Procedure? > Kelly, > > I am new to this list so this is my first posting here. > > I do not now keep bees but I have a strong interest in them. I am a > professional at recording data, and I can tell you from my experience that > the best way I have found is to write the information on a standard form, > on Write In The Rain (TM) paper, and carry it back to the computer for > input. It seems to me that this scoring system is perfectly suited for a > standardized form to score each hive. It would be quick and easy to > simply enter numbers into each form as you do your inspections. Over time > you could track trends such as weather, queen introductions, etc... The > hives would have to be numbered. > > Recording your information on paper (weather proof), I feel, would have > the following advantages: > > 1) Data would not be lost to computer glitch, batteries, etc. > 2) Paper provides a permanent record. > 3) No wear and tear on an expensive piece of equipment. > 4) A convenient, easy to carry way of recording the data > 5) Using a standardized form is faster than entering into a computer in > the field. > 6) If you drop paper it won't break > 7) A big glob of honey on your key board and your done! > 8) If you forget your clip board on top of your truck, it will still work > after you run over it (unless you smash the clip!) > > OK, I'll stop. :-) > > I think a recorder works well for keeping track of management things as > you are doing your inspections, such as "need to repair the bear fence" > etc... > > Well, there's my $0.02. Hope you found something of use. > > Wayne > > On Wed, 28 Feb 1996, Kelley Rosenlund wrote: > > > I have been playing with the idea of using an electronic notebook with a > > database program where I would only have to write the hive number and up > > pops it's history which can then be updated. Has anyone tried this or know > > of any software that would work in this application? Granted these notebooks > > are in the $600-800 US range but it might pay for itself by streamling > > recordkeeping. > > > > Kelley Rosenlund rosenlk@freenet.ufl.edu > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Wayne Clifford | Phone (360) 427-9670 X-581 > Technical Administrator | FAX (360) 427-7798 > Mason County Department of Health Services | PO Box 1666 Shelton, WA 98584 > | USA > wrc@inpho.hs.washington.edu | > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Since this is a sharing of ideas site I wonder if anyone out there has tried my method of record keeping - on the hive body itself using the large lead grade school pencil or a carpender's pencil to write the current information about that hive using as many abbreviations as one can make and remember for data. Before internet came around the good reliable bee magazines (American Bee Journal and Bee Culture) both of which are over one years in publication gave us bee- keepers a site to learn and share ideas on management. About 20 years ago in ABJ someone described the method of information recording that I have been using, modified with my own abbreviations on my hives that are painted white. Even camouflaged hives if the wood is smooth offer writing surfaces which allows the small time beekeeper immediate information on that hive that can last over years and when all space is occupied it is time for repainting. This does not replace the Bee log that one carriers in a plastic zip-lock bag for moisture protection and with an extra ball point pen. Starting in the fall (the beginning of the bee management season) on jots how much honey (8 full frames = 8 fl.fr) the size of the bee cluster etc. Always start with the date e.g. 2-29-96 and if one has the time & wishes the weather conditions and the hour of inspection etc. The back yard apiary can admired on a Sunday without bee clothes and the hive condition can be recalled and any necessary future work can be planned or just appreciated. Transcribe your bee log information that you wish to remember on your home computer as I just did a couple weeks ago. I collected swarm catching data for 23 years and the article will be in ABJ in the May issue - without the detailed 23 year (l. 7-17-95- 5 lbs Maple tree 0 - 20 in" 5422 Jersey Beal Rd. E.C.). I only caught swarms in '95 and the ABJ graph will show the data. DATA, on hive etc accurate, timely, and cumulative can be educational. It was & is to me. ************************************************ John Romanik BBKM #l03 3200 Pine Orchard Lane Ellicott City, Maryland 21042 email jr0002@epfl2.epflbalto.org 15 miles west of Baltimore 39 degrees north of the Equator *************************************************o.org ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 21:53:00 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: LARUET@ULVACS.ULAVERNE.EDU Subject: LOOKING FOR A RESEARCH PROJECT INVOLVING MITES AND BEES I am interested in working on a research project with bees and mites but I do not have a clue about some of the problems that mites pose to bees. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Mar 1996 08:03:51 CST6CDT Reply-To: bwhite@mda-is.mda.state.mn.us Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: BLANE WHITE Organization: Minnesota Dept of Agriculture Subject: mite tolerance Hi all, I have been reading the messages on cooperative breeding for mite tolerance in honey bees with interest. There are a lot of good ideas out there. At the Federation (ABF) meeting in Portland in January, Dr Tom Rinderer asked all beekeepers to look for colonies that have survived varroa for at least one year without treatment and to contact him at the Honey Bee Breeding and Genetics Laboratory. They are starting a breeding program to look at such bees and would like to get 50 queens from around the country to study and start a breeding program for tolerance to varroa mite. The address is: USDA-ARS Honey Bee Breeding and Genetics Laboratory 1157 Ben Hur Rd. Baton Rouge, LA 70820 phone 504-767-9280 Dr John Harbo and Dr Robert Danka were also given as contacts for the project. They only have funding at present to work with 50 queens and that is why they are limiting the number they would like. John Harbo email jharbo@asrr.arsusda.gov I don't have email addresses for any of the others. Hope this is helpful. Let's all keep our eyes open for queens for this project. blane ****************************************** Blane White State Apiary Inspector Minnesota Department of Agriculture 90 W Plato Blvd St Paul, MN 55107 http://www.mda.state.mn.us ph 612-296-0591 fax 612-296-7386 bwhite@mda-is.mda.state.mn.us ******************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Mar 1996 09:28:46 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Diana Sammataro Subject: Grading Queens Here is a synopsis of how to grade queens, breeder queens, that came from a paper by Laidlaw in 1958 (see referenece on end) If anyone needs a copy, send me an SASE and I will be happy to put it in the mail. He also has a chart, which I could not reproduce here. Good luck. Grade the bees, with a letter or number grade for each option, and select the top 5 or more. Here are some characteristics from which to score your colonies so you can choose which ones will make the best queens. 1. Brood =85 pattern compact, lays from end to end, solid =85 viability, rate and arrangement all acceptable; poor, spotty brood indicates larvae was removed because of poor viability or disease, or queen is not agile, or old. 2. Disease/pest tolerance =85 hygienic behavior, uncaps and removed dead/infested larvae <24 hours =85 grooming behavior; some bees remove varroa mites from each other =85 tracheal mite resistance/tolerance; mechanisms if they exist are not known, but some bees may be more tolerant than others. Count mites in the fall and winter. =85 wax moth resistant 3. Overall Population; how strong? 4. Propolizer 5. Temper =85 test without smoke; size of colony not important =85 grade from 1 (bees do nothing) to 5 (bees sting, smoke needed) 6. Composure on comb; how quiet are they, how runny are they? 7. Pollen Arrangement and Hoarding =85 on outside ring of broodnest to inside broodnest =85 amount of pollen stored, in frames, especially in the fall 8. Honey: amount produced/collected =85 depends on number, age and preferences of bees =85 ability to move up into the supers 9. Wax =85 drawing out foundation =85 color of cappings 10. Swarming tendency 11. Robbing Tendency 12. Wintering ability 13. Flight time (how early) and temperature tolerant 14. Color: how even color of workers/drones indicates purity of mating. Remember, these records should be kept on EACH queen so you have some idea of the history of your breeders. It would be helpful if you had similar records for your drone mothers too, as the offspring will be a combination of the two. (For more informatioin on this programs see Laidlaw, H.H., Jr. Organizationand operation of a bee breeding program. Proceedings 10th Internat'l. Congress Entomol. 4: 1067-78. 1956, 1958). Diana Sammataro, Ph.D. The Ohio State University, OARDC/ Dept. Entomology Extension Bee Laboratory, 1680 Madison Avenue Wooster, OH 44691 Phone: (216) 263 3684 Fax: (216) 262 2720 Email: Sammataro.1@osu.edu ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Mar 1996 09:40:34 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Helen Du Mont Subject: Royal Jelly Re the posts about allergies and the post inquiring about the use of royal jelly, the following is excerpted from the February issue of "Worst Pills, Best Pills News" published by Public Citizen/Health Research Group: "Royal jelly,...sold as a general tonic to prevent old age and stop degenerative diseases,...has never been proven beneficial for any medical condition. It has, however, caused serious asthma attacks in susceptible people..." Susceptibility is doubtless quite rare, but it doesn't hurt to know that it is possible and has been documented. H. du Mont Wilmington, Vermont (hdu1@sover.net) ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Mar 1996 13:52:53 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: Re: Evaluation of Honeybees; Checklist or Procedure? In-Reply-To: On Thu, 29 Feb 1996, Wayne Clifford wrote: > the best way I have found is to write the information on a standard form, > on Write In The Rain (TM) paper, and carry it back to the computer for > input. It seems to me that this scoring system is perfectly suited for a We too have found this to be best. For marking hives and for some records we keep on the hive, we use Tevlok tags. They look like the 3X5" tags with wire ties but they are made of waterproof paper. We have some that are 3 yrs old and the writing isn't even faded. The best marker we have found is the paint marker. bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb b b b Vince & Carole Coppola vcoppola@epix.net b b Coppola Apiaries, (716)965-2904 b b 10220 Bradigan Rd. b b Forestville, N.Y. 14062 b b b b Queens bred for tracheal mite resistance b b Honey , Pollination b b Western New York Beekeepers Association b b b bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Mar 1996 12:42:09 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Whitney S. Cranshaw" Subject: Re: Crown Vetch as a Nectar Source Could anyone comment on the potential value of crown vetch as a honey-producing plant source? I was recently asked this by a beekeeper who will be doing some plantings. Yellow and white sweetclover will be included. However he was wondering also about the crown vetch since it is so easily established and flowers rapidly. Essentially he wants to know if it would be of value in the short term (i.e., this year) to incorporate some crown vetch in the planting scheme. Thanks for your thoughts/experiences. Whitney Cranshaw Ft. Collins, CO wcransha@ceres.agsci.colostate.edu ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Mar 1996 15:33:45 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: Evaluation of Honeybees Thu, 29 Feb 1996 Dave Green wrote. > Perhaps 3-4% will be marked at the beginning, while only a handful will >qualify by the following spring. If the bees show ANY trace of meanness, or >chalkbrood, they are instantly eliminated as breeders. While I agree and do the same, I question the validity. Somewhere I read that chalkbrood is a result of dampness. In my tests, increased ventilation appears to cure chalkbrood. Has anybody else found this? I put a question recently. Has anyone used Bee Boost in splits or nucs? I plan to try it this year, and was hoping to hear from someone who has experience with it. **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1.* * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Mar 1996 11:51:21 AST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Tom_Elliott@JHQNOV.DOT.STATE.AK.US Subject: Chalkbrood Here in Anchorage, Alaska I have very rarely had a spring without some Chalkbrood. It is cool and damp in the spring. I have yet to have it amount to anything when the population built up. I am refering almost exclusively to new packages. I usually start about four new packages each spring, and only rarely have had any real success getting any significant colony through until spring. Unless bees showed a problem with Chalkbrood I would not be concerned about it. Tom Elliott Eagle River, Alaska ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Mar 1996 13:59:57 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Stan Umlauft Subject: Interesting Sites to visit? Dear Fellow Beekeepers Wanted: List of good bee sites, URLs, FTPs, IRC groups, etc... I'm rather new to the internet. My main interest on the net is bees and beekeeping info. I've been publishing newsletters for a couple local beekeeper groups for the last 15 years. I'm always looking for fresh informitive material to learn from, and share with other beekeepers. Though I've had an account on the net for about 18 months, during the first 17 my time on line was <5 minutes total, all I did was maintain an E-MAIL address. During the last 2weeks however I've spent probably 10 Hours and plan spend plenty of time in the future on the net. I've only been on this discussion service a couple days now, looks interesting so far, thanks. I used to be a member of the International Bee Research Association, which is mother to this "Bee-L" e-mail list. My membership expired, but my respect for this organization remains strong. I had way too many bee related memberships and subscriptions at the time. I had the privelidge of meeting Eva Crane, a former Director of the IBRA. I believe it was in Corvalis, Oregon USA during the 1992 Western Apicultural Society Conference. She also is the author of the only $140.00 beekeeping book (Bees and Beekeeping) in my library that's really worth its price. So much for my reminiscent babble. Thanks in advance for info on sites. I already dicovered, the following neat site: http://weber.u.washington.edu/~jlks/bee.html/ Beekeeping Home Page. This page has Quite a few interesting links. Kindest wishes, Stan Umlauft Bay Point, CA USA STANU@HONEYBEE.COM ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Mar 1996 14:26:58 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Wayne Clifford Subject: Re: Interesting Sites to visit? In-Reply-To: <199603012159.NAA02818@webe.hooked.net> Stan, There is a wonderful search utility sponsored by AOL at: http://www.webcrawler.com Try it out on your web browser. Just type in a word like apiary, or bees and see what it comes up with. Happy browsing... Wayne On Fri, 1 Mar 1996, Stan Umlauft wrote: > Dear Fellow Beekeepers > > Wanted: List of good bee sites, URLs, FTPs, IRC groups, etc... > I'm rather new to the internet. > My main interest on the net is bees and beekeeping info. > I've been publishing newsletters for a couple local beekeeper groups for > the last 15 years. I'm always looking for fresh informitive material to > learn from, and share with other beekeepers. > > Though I've had an account on the net for about 18 months, during the first > > 17 my time on line was <5 minutes total, all I did was maintain an E-MAIL > address. During the last 2weeks however I've spent probably 10 Hours and > plan spend plenty of time in the future on the net. > > I've only been on this discussion service a couple days now, looks > interesting so far, thanks. > > I used to be a member of the International Bee Research Association, which > is mother to this "Bee-L" e-mail list. My membership expired, but my > respect for this organization remains strong. I had way too many bee > related memberships and subscriptions at the time. > I had the privelidge of meeting Eva Crane, a former Director of the IBRA. I > believe it was in Corvalis, Oregon USA during the 1992 Western Apicultural > Society Conference. She also is the author of the only $140.00 beekeeping > book (Bees and Beekeeping) in my library that's really worth its price. > So much for my reminiscent babble. Thanks in advance for info on sites. > > I already dicovered, the following neat site: > http://weber.u.washington.edu/~jlks/bee.html/ Beekeeping Home Page. > This page has Quite a few interesting links. > > > Kindest wishes, > Stan Umlauft > Bay Point, CA USA > STANU@HONEYBEE.COM > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Wayne Clifford | Phone (360) 427-9670 X-581 Technical Administrator | FAX (360) 427-7798 Mason County Department of Health Services | PO Box 1666 Shelton, WA 98584 | USA wrc@inpho.hs.washington.edu | ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Mar 1996 17:39:04 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "James C. King" Subject: Re: Terramycin Extender Pattie Stability On 27 Feb. Eric Abell Wrote: > >I would be interested in comparing recipies and patty sizes. Unfortunately >my recipe is at the Honey House but i will send it along in the next few >days. Meanwhile, if a few members could provide recipies and doses it would >be most interesting. > Eric, last fall I made my patties with the following recipe: Premix: 10 oz. Oxy 50 Premix (from Walter T. Kelly, = TM 50D) 96 oz. powdered sugar Then: 40 oz. above premix 60 oz. Crisco 116 oz. granulated sugar I used .25 lb. of this per colony in late September. Jim King Rieglesville, PA ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Mar 1996 19:42:17 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Evaluation of Honeybees In-Reply-To: <199603012033.PAA21263@segwun.muskoka.net> On Fri, 1 Mar 1996, David Eyre wrote: > > While I agree and do the same, I question the validity. Somewhere I read > that chalkbrood is a result of dampness. In my tests, increased ventilation > appears to cure chalkbrood. Has anybody else found this? -> Hello, Chalkbrood is a Fungi ( Asophaera apis ) If the larva is chilled to 30 C from 35 C it is the right temp for the A. apis to form fruiting bodies. I would suspect that dampness has an effect on the hives temperature. Damp cold seems to chill more deeply than a dry cold. Honey Bee Pathology by Bailey and Ball has seven pages of info if anyone want to look at chaulkbrood any further. I have had some chalkbrood in the past , but I now leave my lower enterance open 3/8 inch in the winter and spring.Maybe the bees can exchange the air with less effort and more efficiently. We do not get very cold in western Washington and I like tough bees anyway. Bottem line David , the book does not address dampness , but I'm with you. Moisture causes many problems in the hive. I'm trying some different things myself this year. Burlap and 2 inch thick hard styrofoam with vent holes. Bee Happy Roy ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Mar 1996 23:25:08 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Dave Green, Eastern Pollinator Newsletter" Subject: Re: Interesting Sites to visit? In a message dated 96-03-01 17:03:04 EST, stanu@MAILHOST.HOOKED.NET (Stan Umlauft) writes: >Wanted: List of good bee sites, URLs, FTPs, IRC groups, etc... >I'm rather new to the internet. >My main interest on the net is bees and beekeeping info. >I've been publishing newsletters for a couple local beekeeper groups for >the last 15 years. I'm always looking for fresh informitive material to >learn from, and share with other beekeepers. You might enjoy looking at our pollination web site, still in its infancy, but hopefully, growing as we become more computor literate. http://users.aol.com/pollinator/polpage1.html One of our main problems is getting good graphics. I have a lot of B&W, TIFF files, which I wanted to use, but they don't convert well into GIF format, which is necessary on the web. Anyone have any good pollination images (gif), you'd be willing to donate to a good cause? Please, everyone, let us know if what you think, especially what you think it should be. We wouldn't refuse any donations either, if you think this is a worthwhile service. Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green, PO Box 1200, Hemingway, SC 29554 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Mar 1996 23:56:24 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "R. C. Chapin" Subject: blooming good idea Dave Green writes: > As spring moves north, I'd like to see more posts on >what is blooming in your area, and what is going on with the bees. Sometimes >one particular flower is quite important in one area, but not so in others. Great idea! Very helpful to us perpetual novices. ;-) Dick Chapin Montrose, PA ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Mar 1996 11:18:00 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "my name is Dean M. Breaux" Subject: Re: Cause of death./Is there a better way? Comments: To: rosenlk@freenet.ufl.edu >Hello Dean I would like more Information on irradiation. Where in Florida can I get hives >Treated. The only place in Florida is : Vindicator, Inc 502 Prairie Mine Road Mulberry, FL 33860 813-425-0039 When you call ask for Fred. I hope you use it, the more we use the technology the cheaper it will get, and the faster we can get the laws changed. Please keep in mind that you need to tell your local bee inspector. You can only do it on an experimental basis as the law says to burn the equipment. Dean Breaux ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Mar 1996 11:28:59 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "my name is Dean M. Breaux" Subject: Re: blooming good idea In the Tampa bay area of Florida, the Citrus flow is beginning Hoo-ray. We love that orange blossom honey. The maple flow was over around Jan 15 this year. The gallberry should start in about two weeks, if the weater holds. The first of May the palmetto will bloom. Dean Breaux ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 19:59:20 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Gordon Scott Subject: Re: Cause of death./Is there a better way? In-Reply-To: <960228194557_155979133@emout05.mail.aol.com> On Wed, 28 Feb 1996, my name is Dean M. Breaux wrote: > You must first extract all of the honey before you irratiate the hives > because they don't have permission from food and drug to irradiate the honey. Another reason, even if you are allowed to irradiate foodstuffs (unlikely at present in most countries), is that the honey bubbles up and sprays everywhere. A friend left honey in brood combs during a regular preventative treatment and ended up with some very messy equipment. In the UK, irradiation is approved for treatment of AFB, however the last I heard the jury was still out on EFB, where there is a perceived risk of failure to kill and subsequent mutation. Regards, -- Gordon Scott gordon@apis.demon.co.uk gordon@multitone.co.uk (work) The Basingstoke Beekeeper (newsletter) beekeeper@apis.demon.co.uk Embryo Home Page Beekeeper; Kendo 3rd Dan; Sometime sailor. Hampshire, England. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Mar 1996 14:11:17 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Bill Miller Subject: Re: Cause of death./Is there a better way? Once you find yourself the unfortunate owner of foulbrood-contaminated equipment, what you can do with it is largely a function of your local bee laws. So first check with your local bee inspector before doing anything. In Maryland, we have an Ethylene Dioxide fumigation chamber run by the Department of Agriculture. The fees are reasonable, they accept small lots of equipment, and I am presently have in service some hive bodies that came from a hive with foulbrood, and then went through the chamber. No problems have been observed to date. I am glad to see some folks have successfully used irradiation. If the decontamination route is available (and you elect to use it), then be careful to keep contaminated equipment segregated from the good stuff, out of reach of bees, and preferably plastic bagged and tagged. If you are going to burn infected gear, do it promptly. The "shelf life" of foulbrood spores is effectively infinite. Unlabled infected gear will almost invetably get put back into service by accident, thereby re-introducing foulbrood. W. G. Miller Gaithersburg, MD ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Mar 1996 18:18:37 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Eric Abell Subject: Re: Terramycin Extender Pattie Stability >> >There is an article regarding Terramycin use in Extender Patties in the >American Bee Journal, Vol.134, No.4, April 1994, pp259-261. In it is listed >the following: > Thanks for the reply. However, I do not understant the heading of the first column. Can you please expand a little? >No. 6.4 oz Lbs Vegetable Lbs Powdered >Colonies treated >Packets TSP Shortening Sugar 1 lb >patty/colony >____________________________________________________________________________ >__________________ > >1 4.6 9.1 14 > >2 9.1 8.2 28 > >3 13.7 27.4 42 > >4 18.2 36.5 56 > >5 22.8 45.6 70 > > > >They also mention that the original idea of extender patties comes from work >by Dr. Bill Wilson and colleagues entitled "Antibiotic Treatments That Last >Longer," American Bee Journal, September, 1970, pp. 348-351.44 >The recipe in this article thought to be best was: 1/3 ob Crisco(R), 2/3 ob >granulated sugar, two (2) tablespoons of TSP or TM-25, yielding two patties. >Later Dr. Wilson found that a patty half as large was satisfactory and would >last six weeks. > >Hope this info is of some use. > > Eric Abell Gibbons, Alberta Canada (403) 998 3143 eabell@compusmart.ab.ca ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Mar 1996 21:12:30 PST Reply-To: Glyn Davies Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: RFC822 error: CC field duplicated. Last occurrence was retained. From: Glyn Davies Subject: IBRA and Devon BKA Conference Comments: cc: buzz@zynet.co.uk Greetings to Fellow Bee Liners, I would like to draw your attention to a special event in Devon, England this summer. Devon BKA holds its Conference every two years at the Seale Hayne Food and Agriculture Faculty of the University of Plymouth and this year we are co-operating with IBRA to produce something special. The Faculty is only a few miles from Buckfast Abbey and an optional visit to the Bee Department at Buckfast has been arranged for participants. Below is a list of dates, speakers and topics. If you would like further details please contact me or Liz Cunningham, Saddlers Cottage, Morchard Bishop, Crediton, Devon EX17 6NX. UK. (E-mail 100547.1150@compuserve.com ) (More information via IBRA Home Page) DEVON BKA/IBRA CONFERENCE July 12-14 1996 Dr Keith Delaplane, University of Georgia USA Hot and Cold Bees A Beekeeping Research Hall of Flame Taking the Bite Out of the Mite Professor Len Heath, University of Plymouth UK (UK Chalk Brood Expert) Sterilisation and Disinfection An Iconoclastic View of Bee Disease Dr Max Watkins, Sandoz Ltd. Pesticide Resistance Producing Medication Dr Michael Proctor. University of Exeter, UK Flowers, Pollen and Pollination. The Environment's Debt to Pollination. Dr Stephen Martin, National Bee Unit, UK The Life and Death of Varroa Mr Len Davie, South West of England, Regional Bee Inspector. Great Beekeepers I have Known Principal Dinner Guest, Miss Emma Nicholson, MP Optional Saturday Activities: Visit to Buckfast Abbey Bee Department OR Dartmoor Walk OR Laboratory Pollen Identification Get in touch for Details and Registration Form See You There! Glyn Davies, Vice Chairman, Devon Beekeepers Association. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 3 Mar 1996 09:27:24 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Tom Jillette Subject: Re: Terramycin Extender Pattie Stability Comments: cc: eabell@compusmart.ab.ca At 06:18 PM 3/2/96 GMT, you wrote: >>> >>There is an article regarding Terramycin use in Extender Patties in the >>American Bee Journal, Vol.134, No.4, April 1994, pp259-261. In it is listed >>the following: >> > >Thanks for the reply. However, I do not understant the heading of the first >column. Can you please expand a little? > > >> >Sorry about that....looks like the headings got jumbled up........here's how the table should look: ............................................................................ ....(1 Lb. patty/colony) No. of 6.4 oz packets TSP........Lbs Veg. Shortening........Lbs Powdered Sugar....Colonies treated 1 4.6 9.1 14 2 9.1 8.2 28 3 13.7 27.4 42 4 18.2 36.5 56 5 22.8 45.6 70 ............................................................................ ...................... ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 3 Mar 1996 10:46:27 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "my name is Dean M. Breaux" Subject: Breeding Better Bees It would seem that with hygenic bees uncapping cells infested with varroa, that this might be one way we could combat this pest. Along those lines it has been said that hygenic bees are mean or bad tempered if anyone has any information on this I would like to hear it. Do you feel that the hyg. bees are more defensive than non hyg. The only reason for my concern is all of the literature and personal communication from others that Hyg. Bees are mean. What is your opinion? What percentage of bees in a hive need to be Hyg. to show the hyg. behavior in the hive? If can you give me some kind of Idea or experiment to run to determine this? My plan at the present is to use a single inseminated queen that test hyg. to produce virgins. I will then use hyg. Drones in various proportions to determine the ratio needed.??? what do you think? If there is an better way let me know. Our do you even think that it matters? Thank you Dean. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 3 Mar 1996 10:03:28 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Breeding Better Bees In-Reply-To: <960303104626_236474228@emout07.mail.aol.com> On Sun, 3 Mar 1996, my name is Dean M. Breaux wrote: > It would seem that with hygenic bees uncapping cells infested with varroa, > that this might be one way we could combat this pest. Along those lines it > has been said that hygenic bees are mean or bad tempered if anyone has any > information on this I would like to hear it. > > Do you feel that the hyg. bees are more defensive than non hyg. > > The only reason for my concern is all of the literature and personal > communication from others that Hyg. Bees are mean. > > What is your opinion? > > What percentage of bees in a hive need to be Hyg. to show the hyg. behavior > in the hive? > > If can you give me some kind of Idea or experiment to run to determine this? Hello Dean, In januarys 1996 issue of the American bee journal .They did address HYG and defenive behavior . They stated that Rothenbuhler dememonstrated over 30 years ago that HYG and stinging behavior are not linked and depend upon different genetic bases. Then Gilliam and Taber went on to say that theyhave not observed any genetic linkage between HYG and aggressiveness or honey production. They screened over 500 hives in there test in Chile. I have not seen HYG bees stand out with stinging behavior. I only do 80 hives. I will tell you that observations on bees needs the same enviormental conditions or your looking at different genes. Our researchers have to take many things into account , if the data is going to be worth anything. Back in 1970 , I had a hive of bees in 5 deep boxs. It was april and apples were in bloom. This hive was full of bees and brood. Old Charlie ( 80 +) was our state inspecter. 50 years in beekeeping. I told him on the phone where my bees were at the time he would be inspecting them. I knew the bees were aggressive and planned to requeen them, but they were bringing the honey by buckets.Charlie gave me a call after he checked my bees. He said that he has never seen that aggressive of a hive in his life. They chased him 100 yards aways from the hive. I knew they were bad , but I was only putting a box on top ,one at a time.I went out to see if I could find the Queen. The truth is, when I took the to off the lights went out on my vail. It was like getting shot with a shotgun. I had to divide the hive into 5 hives ( one box each ) so I could find the queen.That hive had honey all over the place. I thought at that time the book were all wrong. Mean bees make more honey and I had the proof before me. You add 20 plus years to that and I have seen very mild bees put up even more honey. I know that we have people that just read Bee-L , because they like bees or have a couple of hives. We all have an intrest in bees and every one of us has a different mental processing plant sitting on our shoulders. Everyone learns by doing something with the bees. You don't need to have bees for a long time to be a good beekeeper.Hint : keep a little diary on what you observe and do with the bees. Read and ask questions. There are NO stupid questions. We need everyone understanding how bad Varroa is and that our researchers need $$$ to get us a long term fix to this mite. Chemicals are counter to honey. We have to use them with caution , we do not need honey out in the market place with chemicals in it. 55,000 mile of flight to produce one pound of honey is a lot of work by the bees.Why take a chance to screw up all of that work with chemicals. We do need more research , 30 year old data could be wrong.We have new tools in genetics.We need good phenotype observations so the data means something to us and we will be able to improve our bee stock. Bee Happy Roy ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 3 Mar 1996 14:45:10 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "(Kevin & Shawna Roberts)" Subject: Pregnant Beekeepers Are there any beekeepers out there who have continued working bees while they were pregnant? If so, did you work bees through the 1st trimester, 2nd trimester, 3rd trimester.....? Did you experience any adverse effects when you were stung? Were your reactions to stings more severe when you were pregnant, compared to when you weren't? I am hoping to get pregnant this year, but Dr. Eric Mussen (our U.C. entomologist) cautioned me that pregnant women tended to have heightened allergic reactions to bee stings. If you worked bees while pregnant, or know someone who did, I would love to hear about your (or her) experiences. It would help me make some tentative plans regarding my own "confinement". Thank you, Shawna Roberts Gypsy Bees ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 3 Mar 1996 17:57:32 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: CW Honey Subject: Re: Evaluation of Honeybees; Checklist or Procedure? In a message dated 96-02-27 16:19:02 EST, David wrote: > If you can produce a bee which >doesn't produce vast quantities of the sticky stuff would be an advantage. It is felt here by many beekeepers in So. Arizona that this may be a quality that has been bred out which should not have been. PMS or other viruses are felt to be on the rise because the propolising by the bees to coat the cells and cover and kill these viruses has been reduced by breeding programs by beekeepers who do not like messing with the bee glue. Natural defenses have been removed by well meaning breeders, but many in So. AZ are trying to return these natural traits to our bees. Using small cell size comb is another natural mite defense that we are having some fairly good results with. NO STRIPS! Walt Spears E Mail: CWHONEY@AOL.COM ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 3 Mar 1996 20:46:29 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: krengel lawrence e Subject: Midwest Beekeeping Symposium In-Reply-To: <199603031527.AA28134@access.mbnet.mb.ca> Just a reminder that next Saturday - March 9 - will be the premier beekeeping event in the Midwest. The Northern Illinois Beekeepers' Association will present a day any beekeeper will be sorry to miss. Included will be Dr. Keith Delaplane (from U of Georgia), Kim Flottum (from Bee Culture) and nearly a dozen other presentations to choose from. Get information from Molly Walsh, the symposium coordinator at 815 455 8697. Larry Krengel for the Northern Illinois Beekeepers' Association ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Mar 1996 05:11:59 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Daniel D. Dempsey" Subject: 5 frame hive Is their a standard demntion for a 5 framer? Can you take a 10 frame hive body cut it in half and still have enough bee space? thanks Daniel D. Dempsey ddempsey@ddt.net ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 3 Mar 1996 22:43:24 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Evaluation of Honeybees; Checklist or Procedure? In-Reply-To: <960303175731_437093169@emout10.mail.aol.com> On Sun, 3 Mar 1996, CW Honey wrote: > In a message dated 96-02-27 16:19:02 EST, David wrote: > > > If you can produce a bee which > >doesn't produce vast quantities of the sticky stuff would be an advantage. > > It is felt here by many beekeepers in So. Arizona that this may be a quality > that has been bred out which should not have been. PMS or other viruses are > felt to be on the rise because the propolising by the bees to coat the cells > and cover and kill these viruses has been reduced by breeding programs by > beekeepers who do not like messing with the bee glue. > > Natural defenses have been removed by well meaning breeders, but many in So. > AZ are trying to return these natural traits to our bees. > Hello, I do belive that some traits and genes have been changed by breeding. It is very complex and I think we did not know enough about the genetic make up when we started breeding for a few traits. Nature has a self balancing program. We move something out it moves something in. One gene in a different loci changes the behavior of the bee.This is the reason that we need research on bee genetics going full speed ahead. I personally feel that some of the changes that I have seen in the last 10 years in bee behavior, has to do with genetics. That might not bee the only factor, the enviornment interacts with the genes to produce the behavior.We have to get to some answers about some of the changes that we see. It is not simple and I do know that there are a few researchers doing good work to come up with a few answers. I wish I knew why one of my hives years ago would fly in the rain.They did 360 pounds of surplus when the average was 45 pounds. Education at all levels is needed for beekeepers.WE need to have our researchers get new genetic material to work with.We need caution , but most of all we need faith in our researchers that they can get the job done. This is 1996 and management has changed in the companys that are making money. It takes a team to win and we don't need to point fingers to the past. I came out of a government job after 32 years.Change started slow , then we had a few meetings and changed peoples jobs around.In one year , the people that did not want to change were on there way out. Bottem up management is in and the dictator is out.We can all bring about change if there is a need for it. WE do need to get on board with some very solid genetic research , so we will quit shooting in the dark. Its not that bad , but when we have more information to work with the better the results. Have A Great One Roy ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Mar 1996 11:20:02 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Morten Brixtofte Petersen Subject: Active defence against varroa Hello Beepeople. Excuse me if this message was alredy send fri 1.mar., but my system has been out of order. The current discussion about mite resistant bees made me wonder what happened to some apparently good breeding material: In an article from 1992 in the journal "Apidologie" F. Ruttner et al. describes a strain of Apis mellifera carnica with active defence against varroa. The article is referred by E. Southwick in the American Bee Journal sometime in 1992 (as far as I remember) he included a picture from the original article as well. The bees of this strain apparently mutilate the mites e.g. "bites" off the legs of the mites. According to the article this strains of bees had good owerwintering capability WITHOUT treatment. The bees were selected by an Austrian beekeeper named Alois Wallner. Does anyone out there know what happened to this strain of bees? Is it possible to by breeding material (queens or semen) from this strain? References: Apidologie (1992) 23, 173-187 Active defense against Varroa mites in a Carnolian strain of honeybee (Apis mellifera carnica Pollmann). Thank you Regards Morten Petersen Denmark, Scandinavia E-Mail mp@kvl.dk ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Mar 1996 13:36:29 CST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vladimir Ptacek Subject: Re: Crown Vetch as a Nectar Source On Fri, 1 Mar 1996 12:42:09 -0700, Whitney S. Cranshaw wrote: >Could anyone comment on the potential value of crown vetch as a >honey-producing plant source? Years ago we did some observation with crownwetch as a food source for bees. In our conditions this crop was a splended source of pollen and was visited by numerous honey-, bumble- and solitary bees. Despite the fact that bees inserted their tonques into flowers no measurable amounts of nectar could be obtained by the capillary method. Best regards, Vladimir Ptacek ---------------------------------------------------------------- Fac. Sci., Dpt. Anim. Physiol. E.mail: ptacek@sci.muni.cz Masaryk University phone: .42/5/41129 562 611 37 Brno, Czech Republic fax: .42/5/41211 214 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Mar 1996 09:12:15 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Morten Brixtofte Petersen Subject: Active defence against varroa Hello Beepeople. The current discussion about mite resistant bees made me wonder what happened to some apparently good breeding material: In an article from 1992 in the journal "Apidologie" F. Ruttner et al. describes a strain of Apis mellifera carnica with active defence against varroa. The article is referred by E. Southwick in the American Bee Journal sometime in 1992 (as far as I remember) he included a picture from the original article as well. The bees of this strain apparently mutilate the mites e.g. "bites" off the legs of the mites. According to the article this strains of bees had good owerwintering capability WITHOUT treatment. The bees were selected by an Austrian beekeeper named Alois Wallner. Does anyone out there know what happened to this strain of bees? Is it possible to by breeding material (queens or semen) from this strain? References: Apidologie (1992) 23, 173-187 Active defense against Varroa mites in a Carnolian strain of honeybee (Apis mellifera carnica Pollmann). Thank you Regards Morten Petersen Denmark, Scandinavia E-Mail mp@kvl.dk ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Mar 1996 08:16:26 -0600 Reply-To: Marla Spivak Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Marla Spivak Subject: Re: Pregnant Beekeepers Shawna, I worked bees when I was pregnant, with no problems. However, everyone is different. I would go ahead, but wear protective clothing, and watch yourself after each sting. (When I was 8 months pregnant, I got stung on the stomach, with no problem.) ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Mar 1996 08:51:14 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Active defence against varroa In-Reply-To: On Fri, 1 Mar 1996, Morten Brixtofte Petersen wrote: > Hello Beepeople. > The current discussion about mite resistant bees made me wonder what > happened to some apparently good breeding material: > > In an article from 1992 in the journal "Apidologie" F. Ruttner et al. > describes a strain of > Apis mellifera carnica with active defence against varroa. The article is > referred by E. Southwick in the American Bee Journal sometime in 1992 (as > far as I remember) he included a picture from the original article as well. > The bees of this strain apparently mutilate the mites e.g. "bites" off the legs > of the mites. According to the article this strains of bees had good > owerwintering capability WITHOUT treatment. The bees were selected by > an Austrian beekeeper named Alois Wallner. > > Does anyone out there know what happened to this strain of bees? > Is it possible to by breeding material (queens or semen) from this strain? > > References: Apidologie (1992) 23, 173-187 Active defense against Varroa > mites in a Carnolian strain of honeybee (Apis mellifera carnica Pollmann). > > Morten, Thank you very much for your informative post. You hit the nail on the head. I have been told that they have carniolan bees with the traits that you mentioned. There is a researcher in Austria that will send semen to the US. It seems to be a problem in getting the ok to import the semen. I want us to focus on the problem Varroa.We will need to lobby as a group if need be to get some of the semen over here to work with. Given the nature of our problem with Varroa , we need every tool that is out there to win.We need to have control over what is brought into the US. The USDA has a tough job to control what comes in to the US. FACT: in my state a beekeeper with a 1,000 ++ hive used a drug that was not approoved and the state went out to fine him $ 10,000 . The beekeeper has a lot of money and went out to sue the government for not aggressively working on control of the mite. The state dropped everything.We see now that there is an effoft to get some good breeding stock for them to work with.I belive that we need to voice our feelings on what we want out of our helping hand, the USDA. If there is any way that we can help them , then we should. This is not a small problem.All the tools have to be used. The power we have with this machine alone , makes it an outstanding tool. Thanks again for your post. It is very timely. I hope to read more info on more breeding stock that is on this globe. Roy Nettlebeck ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Mar 1996 11:40:00 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Larry Lindahl of AGF 746-1210 Subject: Queen Cells-shipping and transportation Looking to see if there is anything out there that is new and startling on the shipping and transportation of queen cells. Have looked in the following: The Hive And The Honey Bee, ABC and XYZ, Contempoary Queen Rearing. Any new information would be appreciated - Thanks. Larry Lindahl Phone(604) 722-2825 RR# 3 Hewstone Rd Fax (604) 746-1292 Ladysmith, BC, Canada E-mail LLindahl@galaxy.gov.bc.ca V0R 2E0 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Mar 1996 16:52:19 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: Importance of Bee characteristics-Survey Two years ago Dr. Nasr of Ontario took a survey of the importance of bee chacacteristics to beekeepers. I thought it would be interesting to do the same here on BEE-L. If you are interested in participating just fill out the following and mail it back to me direct, not to the net. I will tally the responses and post the results to BEE-L. Thank you. 1) Enter a number (1-11) after each of the following characteristics, ranking them by their importance to you. Most important, 1 , next most important, 2 , etc. Winterability- Honey Production- Tracheal mite resistance- Varroa resistance- Chalkbrood- Aggressiveness- Colour- Brood viability- Swarming- Comb stability- Pollen- 2)You are (check one) Hobby beekeeper (<10 col.) Side liner (>10<300 col.) Commercial (>300 col.) 3)You are (check all appropriate) Honey producer Pollinator Queen producer 4)You are in (check one) North America Europe Other bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb b b b Vince & Carole Coppola vcoppola@epix.net b b Coppola Apiaries, (716)965-2904 b b 10220 Bradigan Rd. b b Forestville, N.Y. 14062 b b b b Queens bred for tracheal mite resistance b b Honey , Pollination b b Western New York Beekeepers Association b b b bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Mar 1996 18:04:45 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Franklin Humphrey Subject: Re: Active defence against varroa I thought that the yugo strain of carnolins was supposed to exibit the mite biteing behavior. I have read several articals stating this as fact. I am in the process of converting over to yugos and plan to keep them exclusively here in the south. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Mar 1996 19:20:59 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Active defence against varroa In-Reply-To: <960304180444_237489201@emout08.mail.aol.com> On Mon, 4 Mar 1996, Franklin Humphrey wrote: > I thought that the yugo strain of carnolins was supposed to exibit the mite > biteing behavior. I have read several articals stating this as fact. I am > in the process of converting over to yugos and plan to keep them exclusively > here in the south. > Franklin , I have tried 15 yugo queens in 1994. They were average in honey production and I had to put apistan strips on them anyway. Fall of 1995 I treated too late for Varroa and lost 30 out of 60 that were up in the mountains. Varroa took down the yugo bees and my carniolans at the same rate. The yugo is not bullet proof. That is why we should help out our researchers to get the funds that they need to stop Varroa.Varroa is not the only problem. We need to divide up the pie , so we don't have too many working on one part of the problem. We should all be asking some questions about the bees that we are working.Are there any changes in behavior in our bees today as opposed to 5 to 10 years ago.Like Brood patterns, workers not paying attention to the queen and supersedure.The yugo queens helped. They are not the answer but one step in a long road.We need good breeding programs with the help of our researchers every step of the way.You can't breed for 3 or 4 traits for a very long time without loosing some of the natural traits that has been protecting the honeybee for a very long time.We have been speeding up change, without knowing where we would be when we finished.We need more research on the genetic side of the bee.I have Dr. Rinderers book on Bee Genetics and see how complex the problem of breeding that little bee is.We need to know more about what genes do what. The multiples and probabilities may need a cray computer to work them out. Dr Rinderer asked for some help in getting some feral stock that may be resistant to Varroa. We all should help , because this is not one step and your home.We will need a lot of one steps. Yugo is one step. Thank You Roy ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Mar 1996 23:05:33 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jean-Pierre Chapleau Subject: Re: Queen Cells-shipping and transportation Larry Lindahl of AGF 746-1210 wrote: > > Looking to see if there is anything out there that > is new and startling on the shipping and transportation > of queen cells. Have looked in the following: The Hive > And The Honey Bee, ABC and XYZ, Contempoary Queen Rearing. > Any new information would be appreciated - Thanks. > > Larry Lindahl Phone(604) 722-2825 > RR# 3 Hewstone Rd Fax (604) 746-1292 > Ladysmith, BC, Canada E-mail LLindahl@galaxy.gov.bc.ca > V0R 2E0 What I think is the best way to ship queen cells is the following method. The cells a simply buried in a preheated (96F) mix of sand and saw dust filling a small or medium size styrofoam insulated container. This method of packing keeps the cells warm for a long period and protects them from shocks. -- Jean-Pierre Chapleau eleveur de reines / queen breeder 1282, rang 8, Saint-Adrien de Ham, Quebec, Canada, J0A 1C0 tel./phone (819) 828-3396; fax (819) 828-0357 chapleau@login.net ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Mar 1996 00:43:54 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Michael Moroney Subject: Re: Mite resistant swarm queens I mentioned earlier a colony of bees in an abandoned house I'd like to hive somehow, since the simple fact they're alive suggests maybe they have some varroa resistance. I've decided to get a swarm trap with a pherome lure and set it up near the colony in the wall of the abandoned house. I'm hoping they'll swarm into it. I guess unless I happen to see them swarm I'll have no idea what (if anything) I catch. I know of no kept bees in the area but it's a somewhat rural area so there probably are some. Any suggestions (placement, etc.) to maximize the odds I get a swarm from that colony? I'll check for varroa of course, and if I see an infestation I'll treat and just consider them the same as any other infested colony, and nothing special. -Mike ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Mar 1996 03:32:18 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Rudolf E. Bahr" Subject: Re: Active defence against varroa In-Reply-To: Hello Morten, His address is: Alois Wallner Perwarth 7 A-3263 Randegg Austria He just wrote an article in "Deutsches Bienenjournal" 2/96. He selects to varroa resistance and says, that he has a group of colonies, which he didn't treat for 6 years. He calls his bees "killerbees", certainly in another than the common sense. Regards, R.E.B. NISI APES FINIS On Fri, 1 Mar 1996, Morten Brixtofte Petersen wrote: > Hello Beepeople. > The current discussion about mite resistant bees made me wonder what > happened to some apparently good breeding material: > > In an article from 1992 in the journal "Apidologie" F. Ruttner et al. > describes a strain of > Apis mellifera carnica with active defence against varroa. The article is > referred by E. Southwick in the American Bee Journal sometime in 1992 (as > far as I remember) he included a picture from the original article as well. > The bees of this strain apparently mutilate the mites e.g. "bites" off the legs > of the mites. According to the article this strains of bees had good > owerwintering capability WITHOUT treatment. The bees were selected by > an Austrian beekeeper named Alois Wallner. > > Does anyone out there know what happened to this strain of bees? > Is it possible to by breeding material (queens or semen) from this strain? > > References: Apidologie (1992) 23, 173-187 Active defense against Varroa > mites in a Carnolian strain of honeybee (Apis mellifera carnica Pollmann). > > Thank you > Regards > Morten Petersen > Denmark, Scandinavia > E-Mail mp@kvl.dk > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Mar 1996 10:32:53 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "" Subject: Re: Active defence against varroa It was my understanding the the Yugo bee did NOT exhibit the biting behavior, but resistance was based on some other mechanism. Check with Lilia De Guzman or Tom Rinderer at the Baton Rouge bee lab. Larry Connor ljconnor@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Mar 1996 12:51:01 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: Evaluation of Honeybees Roy Nettlebeck Fri, 1 Mar 1996 wrote; > Chalkbrood is a Fungi ( Asophaera apis ) If the larva is chilled to 30 >C from 35 C it is the right temp for the A. apis to form fruiting >bodies. I would suspect that dampness has an effect on the hives >temperature. Damp cold seems to chill more deeply than a dry cold. Honey >Bee Pathology by Bailey and Ball has seven pages of info if anyone want >to look at chaulkbrood any further. I have had some chalkbrood in the >past , but I now leave my lower enterance open 3/8 inch in the winter and >spring.Maybe the bees can exchange the air with less effort and more >efficiently. We do not get very cold in western Washington and I like >tough bees anyway. >Bottem line David , the book does not address dampness , but I'm with> To continue this one step further, if I may. If your statement is correct, and no doubt you're right "Why do we cull the Queen?" That's a bit like killing the messenger if you don't like the news! This practice has gone on for years, if you find chalkbrood, then requeen whereas ventilation will fix the problem! Does anyone want to comment? **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1.* * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Mar 1996 10:33:38 +0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Count Alfred Korzybski Subject: Re: Importance of Bee characteristics-Survey > Winterability-1 > Honey Production-6 > Tracheal mite resistance-2 > Varroa resistance-3 > Chalkbrood-9 > Aggressiveness-8 > Colour-11 > Brood viability-4 > Swarming-7 > Comb stability-10 > Pollen-5 > >2)You are (check one) Hobby beekeeper (<10 col.)check > Side liner (>10<300 col.) > Commercial (>300 col.) > >3)You are (check all appropriate) Honey producer check > Pollinator check > Queen producer > >4)You are in (check one) North America check > Europe > Other > > bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb > b b > b Vince & Carole Coppola vcoppola@epix.net b > b Coppola Apiaries, (716)965-2904 b > b 10220 Bradigan Rd. b > b Forestville, N.Y. 14062 b > b b > b Queens bred for tracheal mite resistance b > b Honey , Pollination b > b Western New York Beekeepers Association b > b b > bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb > > ############################################################################ ####### I hope some animal never bores a hole in my head and lays its eggs in my brain, because later you might think you're having a good idea but it's just eggs hatching.---Jack Handey ############################################################################ ####### ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Mar 1996 20:12:36 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Rudolf E. Bahr" Subject: Bee Breeding Conception Hello gentle beekeepers and breeders, I am rather new to this list. This is my first posting. I'd like to ask for your opinion concerning the following problem, which doesn't seem to be easy to decide. But none the less I am hoping for someone, who has some good ideas. In order to preserve his Buckfast strain Brother Adam practiced a "line mating". This means, virgin queens mated on a secure mating place with drones of colonies the queens of which were sisters of a selected line. He says in his book "Breeding of honey bee", that this way he preserved his strain over years without noticing any decrease of vitality and capacity. (The words he used might have been others, I just translated. Perhaps I should bye the English version of this book to quote from.) Anyway, his words demonstrate well, that he always keeps in mind the danger of inbreeding and as a consequence of it genetic defects. Buckfast breeders in Germany practiced the same basic procedure over the last 12 years. Admittedly, there were exceptions to this basic procedure: Brother Adam incorporated new combinations in his Buckfast strain from time to time, and he gave excellent queens to Germany from time to time, which there were used to produce daughter queens as drone queens in mating places. Both additional measures served to prevent inbreeding. Since Brother Adam no longer can send queens to Germany, we have to stand on our own two feet. The question is now: Do you consider this basic procedure as sufficient -------------------- (without any additional measures) in order to permanently prevent inbreeding or what do you think? Bee scientist Dr. J.P. van Praagh knows our situation and says 'no'. He suggests a second procedure: Mating virgin queens on secure mating places with drones of as plenty as possible selected colonies. Every beebreeder should contribute with at least one of his best colonies to serve as drone colony. The condition of sister queens as drone queens is given up. The differences between procedure one and two seem to be clear: Procedure one gives quicker progress to a certain breeding goal but has the disadvantage of possibly loosing parts of genetic spectrum over the years (how many?). Procedure two gives slower progress but without loosing any genetic diversity. Both procedures could complete each other. Now I ought to have good arguments what to do, because even younger bee keepers often are rather conservative. And one has to do a lot of propaganda work to convince and introduce new measures. We discuss at the moment even a third procedure, based solely on selection. I'd prefere to tell about this another time, because it has less to do with the first two procedures. But it has interesting effects too. Now a word to the background: We are a community of Buckfast bee keepers, named "Gemeinschaft der Buckfastimker e.V.". Circa 700 members belong to it, most of them are in Germany, but there are also members in The Netherlands, Belgium, Luxembourg, France, Switzerland and Austria. In Germany we use two isles as secure mating places, one in the North Sea, the other in the Baltic Sea. In The Netherlands there are additional secure mating places on isles, in Switzerland and Austria in high-mountain regions. Enough for today. I hope, my article hasn't become too long. I would appreciate any comment! Best regards, R.E.Bahr NISI APES FINIS ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Mar 1996 11:24:34 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Active defence against varroa In-Reply-To: <960305103252_238044895@mail02.mail.aol.com> On Tue, 5 Mar 1996, wrote: > It was my understanding the the Yugo bee did NOT exhibit the biting behavior, > but resistance was based on some other mechanism. Check with Lilia De Guzman > or Tom Rinderer at the Baton Rouge bee lab. > Larry, You have brought up a very important point. I would like someone from the USDA to explain to us how research is coming on the biting behavior that seems to control the Varroa mite. This information has been out now for a few years. I know that some researchers have been very interested in testing that stock , by the use of semen that is availible from Austria. There are regulations to control the importation of semen. I would think that Varroa can cause us some very big problems. When chemicals show up in honey and they will after apistan starts to fail. We allready have found some big outfits using chemicals that were not approved. I'm in Washington state I remember atar on the red apples. That still has an negative effect on the red apple market. I would not like to see the almound growers get hit with only half the bees that they need. Right now bees are being shipped in from all over. My point is , you need to ask questions and get good answers. Help in anyway we can in supporting the USDA and researchers.Long term fix without chemicals. Words are cheap and I have never seen anything made with words.I have seen people do some very amazing things when they talk up a plan and then do it. Getting to the moon was not easy. It took a lot of people working together with one goal. Well the way I see Varroa ,it is dead meat.The other choice is a new fad for almound furniture. I'm very much focused on doing everything I can to get rid of Varroa. I sell honey in Seattle and Redmond on the weekends. Redmond is the home of Microsoft. I brought one of my microscopes and some Varroa for the public to look at. Varroa look bad anyway, but I made it even worse. I had a blue background with Varroa RED.Then I would tell the people that mite is killing many thousands of hives.After I would explain the use of chemicals to treat the mite, they did not like that at all. You see I sell my honey for $ 4 for a 8 oz. hex bottle. I do not heat or filter it and collect the honey from high in the Olympic mountains. No pollution.I do know what the people really want.Good clean honey. Two tons in two months is a lot for me. But I got hit with Varroa this year , because I treared too late.So Varroa is at the top of my list.I know that there has been work done on Varroa and more is ongoing.We have some researchers that are doing some very fine work and they have to keep it up. Beekeepers need to voice there opinions on the queens that they are getting and if they are happy with them. We all need to get smarter.You can't leave a hive in your backyard for ten years anymore and not protect it with medication. I think a light should come on in everyones mind. The Best To Everyone Roy Nettlebeck ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Mar 1996 13:56:05 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Re: Evaluation of Honeybees > To continue this one step further, if I may. If your statement is > correct, and no doubt you're right "Why do we cull the Queen?" > That's a bit like killing the messenger if you don't like the news! > This practice has gone on for years, if you find chalkbrood, then > requeen whereas ventilation will fix the problem! Does anyone want > to comment? There are some strains that are more susceptible to CB, and requeening quite often helps. We find that under identical conditions, some hives will, and some not have CB. Rejecting any hives that have CB mummies on the floor from our breeding pool has resulted in a major decrese in CB visible in our outfit -- for whatever reason. Regular requeening is generally a good practice that is becoming even more important as we are encountering more pests and diseases that require that our bees have the ability to reproduce quickly enough to outpace them. Young queens are generally considered to be more prolific. But who knows, maybe some bees just ventilate better?? ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Mar 1996 16:40:34 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: Re: Evaluation of Honeybees In-Reply-To: <199603051751.MAA04224@segwun.muskoka.net> On Tue, 5 Mar 1996, David Eyre wrote: > and no doubt you're right "Why do we cull the Queen?" That's a bit like > killing the messenger if you don't like the news! This practice has gone on > for years, if you find chalkbrood, then requeen whereas ventilation will fix > the problem! Does anyone want to comment? Just some comments on the chalkbrood disccusion. I know of two ways requeening can help with this disease. Requeening a colony causes a break in the production of brood. This can give the bees time to clean up the infection. Also, if the new queen's offspring have hygenic behavior, they will remove dead brood from the hive. For what its worth- we seldom see much chalkbrood since we began requeening with New World Carniolans and more rescently, with our own queens. This has also been observed by others in this area.> bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb b b b Vince & Carole Coppola vcoppola@epix.net b b Coppola Apiaries, (716)965-2904 b b 10220 Bradigan Rd. b b Forestville, N.Y. 14062 b b b b Queens bred for tracheal mite resistance b b Honey , Pollination b b Western New York Beekeepers Association b b b bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 5 Mar 1996 12:53:03 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: Queen Cells-shipping and transportation > Looking to see if there is anything out there that > is new and startling on the shipping and transportation We don't ship queen cells, mainly because they get damaged badly in transit. Plus, if they get held up then all you are likely to get is one!!! One way I heard of, stand then pointed side down in cotton batton, and a jar or similar full of hot water to keep them warm. **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1.* * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 6 Mar 1996 00:22:50 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Dave Green, Eastern Pollinator Newsletter" Subject: Re: Evaluation of Honeybees In a message dated 96-03-05 12:40:22 EST, beeworks@MUSKOKA.NET (David Eyre) writes: >To continue this one step further, if I may. If your statement is correct, >and no doubt you're right "Why do we cull the Queen?" That's a bit like >killing the messenger if you don't like the news! This practice has gone on >for years, if you find chalkbrood, then requeen whereas ventilation will fix >the problem! Does anyone want to comment? I am firmly convinced that some bees are more susceptible to chalkbrood than others. Certainly genetic hygenic behaviour has a very positive influence. There may also be just a general increase in vigor with a young queen, as opposed to an old one. I have been rigidly excluding chalkbrood from all my breeding stock; even just the slightest trace disqualifies a queen. I see a lot less of it now than in previous years, and when I do, it is usually from a boughten queen, which is a good arguement for trying to breed a higher percentage of my own. I used to see quite a few hives in late summer, that were light as a feather, and heavily infested with chalkbrood. I got so that I could predict chalkbrood, just by the weight of the hive as it was loaded out of a pollination crop. Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green, PO Box 1200, Hemingway, SC 29554 Visit the pollination web page at >http://users.aol.com/pollinator/polpage1.html< ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 6 Mar 1996 12:25:14 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jean-Marie Van Dyck Subject: Chalkbrood increasing !? Hello Bee-Liners On Tue, 5 Mar 1996, David Eyre wrote: > and no doubt you're right "Why do we cull the Queen?" That's a bit like > killing the messenger if you don't like the news! This practice has gone on > for years, if you find chalkbrood, then requeen whereas ventilation will fix > the problem! Does anyone want to comment? On Tue, 5 Mar 1996 Vince Coppola > I know of two ways requeening can help with this disease. Requeening > a colony causes a break in the production of brood. IMO, only one or 2 days if you are introducing an 1 year old established queen laying eggs > This can give the bees time to clean up the infection. IMO, it is not enough to clean a 21 days brood and *clean* is a human term : the spores are everywhere ! > Also, if the new queen's offspring have hygienic behavior, they will > remove dead brood from the hive. The new offspring will come and clean after at least 21 days... When the requeening is effective, the good results are very rapid : seems it is a chalkbrood resistance we introduced in the colony And effectively here in Belgium and France and seems in other local area we observed an real ***increase of chalkbrood*** since the '60 !! In the '50 and before, it really worked as described by Vince but now: > For what its worth- we seldom see much chalkbrood since we began > requeening with New World Carniolans and more rescently, with our own > queens. This has also been observed by others in this area. Yes it was !!! I have *no evidence* of the relation !! But it seems close related with the obtaining of our resistant to T-Mite bee ! I repeat : I had no evidence but an *hypothesis*: the only one is the point at which we saw the increasing the chalkbrood disease. A really important contradicting argument to this hypothesis is that the Buckfast bee created by Brother ADAM is quite resistant to both T-Mite and chalbrood disease. But the positive work of Br Adam don't exclude the natural evolution to the T-Mite resistance to a chalkbrood (no lethal character) more sensible bee. It is not impossible because we find the same relation between the productivity and agressivity : the natural high productive bees for our old brown bee is, in our area, generally close related to the agressivity. It is now well known that these characters could be quite separated and the Buckfast bee, she yet, is a high productive bee with a sweet? (not mean) character. > requeen whereas ventilation will fix the problem! Does anyone want > to comment? Ventilation reducing wet atmosphere the illness is diminishing but don't disappear ! However, here we have more and more beebeekers who are using quite open bottom (with even a 30x30cm grid) all the year to increase drastically ventilation and diminish wetting : no problem with the bees, even in the winter (wet but not very cold - this year -10C). Allen Dick wrote > There are some strains that are more susceptible to CB, and > requeening quite often helps. We find that under identical > conditions, some hives will, and some not have CB. [cut] > Young queens are generally considered to be more prolific. But who > knows, maybe some bees just ventilate better?? I quite agree : young queens (1 year old) natural mated and physically adult in your colonies is the best you can do to avoid a lot of problems and have good results "Dave Green, Eastern Pollinator Newsletter" wrote the same ... > I am firmly convinced that some bees are more susceptible to > chalkbrood than others. Certainly genetic hygenic behaviour has a very > positive influence. There may also be just a general increase in > vigor with a young queen, as opposed to an old one. > I have been rigidly excluding chalkbrood from all my breeding stock; > even just the slightest trace disqualifies a queen. I see a lot less > of it now than in previous years, and when I do, it is usually from a > boughten queen, which is a good arguement for trying to breed a higher > percentage of my ow Pay attention that there is a reverse at the medal (in french it means the worst side) : if you get bees really resistant to chalkbrood you'll get bees really sensible to AFB : we saw this with our Buckfast bees which got AFB in an area quite without AFB (one case for 2-3 years)...! We find the evidence of this in the 1993 papers of the group of Dr Shimanuki (Apidologie, 24 (1993) p89-99, 2 articles) Regards Jean-Marie ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 6 Mar 1996 14:58:09 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: - Ed Levi Subject: Re: Importance of Bee characteristics-Survey RESPONSE 1) Enter a number (1-11) after each of the following characteristics, ranking them by their importance to you. Most important, 1 , next most important, 2 , etc. Winterability-7 Honey Production-3 Tracheal mite resistance-1 Varroa resistance-1 Chalkbrood-5 Aggressiveness-4 Colour-10 Brood viability-2 Swarming-3 Comb stability-5 Pollen-8 2)You are (check one) Hobby beekeeper (<10 col.) Side liner (>10<300 col.) X Commercial (>300 col.) 3)You are (check all appropriate) Honey producer X Pollinator Queen producer 4)You are in (check one) North America X Europe Other ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 6 Mar 1996 12:18:58 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Adony Melathopoulos Subject: Re: PVC Strip formulation In-Reply-To: <960306145809_239134411@emout05.mail.aol.com> BEE-Lers I'm a graduate student in Canada running bioassays on a potentially bioactive botanical acaracide to use against Varroa. At this stage in my tests I am trying to develop a number of different release devices to bioassay. I was wondering if anyone knew anything about the PVC plastisizer used in Apistan strips? I checked the two patents on Apistan, and could only find the reference to one (#4411912), and it only covers the active ingredient. Anyone know if the specific stip used in Apistan is used in other agricultural practices (e.g. like on cow ear-tags), and if it is readily available ? Any leads would be greatly appreciated, Adony Melathopoulos Center for Pest Management Simon Fraser University Burnaby, British Columbia CANADA melathop@sfu.ca ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 6 Mar 1996 14:50:50 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Harold Greeny Subject: Anthophorid action To whom it may concern: I recently visited Puerto Lobos in Northern Sonora Mexico. While on the dunes near the ocean I observed a bee building a tunnel in the sand. I believe it is Hemesia (=Centris?) sp. If anyone is interested in knowing about the behavior I observed or has any suggestions as to how to locate detailed info on this nest?/tunnel building behavior please let me know. Harold Greeney Dept. of Entomology University of Arizona ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 6 Mar 1996 16:13:55 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Doug Yanega Subject: Re: Anthophorid action >To whom it may concern: > >I recently visited Puerto Lobos in Northern Sonora Mexico. While on the >dunes near the ocean I observed a bee building a tunnel in the sand. I >believe it is Hemesia (=Centris?) sp. If anyone is interested in knowing >about the behavior I observed or has any suggestions as to how to locate >detailed info on this nest?/tunnel building behavior please let me know. Gordon Frankie and Brad Vinson have examined nesting behavior of such Centris, and Dave Roubik and I studied a species nesting on an island in the Panama Canal; the former work is published, though I can't seem to locate my reference in a quick scan here (I think two pertinent refs are in J. Kansas Ent. Soc. 53: 837 and 60: 249), and as far as I know the latter study is not. The behavior itself, then, is clearly known, but not necessarily for the species you encountered (which is more in Roy Snelling's neck of the woods, and he might be a person to contact). Cheers, Doug Yanega Illinois Natural History Survey, 607 E. Peabody Dr. Champaign, IL 61820 USA phone (217) 244-6817, fax (217) 333-4949 affiliate, Univ. of Illinois Urbana-Champaign, Dept. of Entomology "There are some enterprises in which a careful disorderliness is the true method" - Herman Melville, Moby Dick, Chap. 82 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 4 Mar 1996 15:33:34 EST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: director@DJSA.COM Organization: Online Service Subject: DJSA's Who's Who Guide Just a message to let you know that DJSA's Who's Who Guide is located at http://www.djsa.com/whoswho1.htm The guide is packed with listings and links of WWW Sites and is accessible from any browser. The guide is written in html and also links each site to the Home Page(s) that have been prepared by each company, educational facility, government or information provider. It is a great way to "surf the net". If you prefer, you can download the guide from our location. Just telnet to djsa.com and download djswww02.exe. If you would like to add a FREE listing to this Guide, you can do so by sending five lines (see below) by reply to this message. Line 1...................Name of Company Line 2...................E-Mail Addresses (two max) Line 3...................WWW Address Line 4...................Modem Number and/or Telnet Address Line 5...................Description of Service (70 char max) We can activate your WWW Site so that it can be accessed directly >from the Who's Who Guide. You can also receive E-mail from the Guide. The is a small charge for activation but the listing is free for all. Thanks! DJSA Bulletin Board, Inc. http://www.djsa.com telnet://djsa.com ftp://djsa.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 09:21:14 +1000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Constable Subject: Re: Hello Vince Hello Jean Pierre been away for a while.just replying to your message from last January,all the best to you for the new year. I hope it is the way you want it. regards Vince b >Hello Vince > >Nice to meet you in the bee line. > >Wish you a hapy new year. > >Regards > > > >Jean-Pierre Chapleau >eleveur de reines / queen breeder >vice-president du Conseil canadien du miel / Vice-president of the Canadian >Honey Council >1282, rang 8, Saint-Adrien de Ham, Quebec, Canada, J0A 1C0 >tel./phone (819) 828-3396; fax (819) 828-0357 >chapleau@praline.net > > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 6 Mar 1996 18:27:23 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Dave Green, Eastern Pollinator Newsletter" Subject: Re: Importance of Bee characteristics-Survey In a message dated 96-03-04 17:49:22 EST, you write: >1) Enter a number (1-11) after each of the following characteristics, >ranking them by their importance to you. Most important, 1 , next most >important, 2 , etc. > > Winterability- 8 > Honey Production- 3 > Tracheal mite resistance- 5 > Varroa resistance- 9 (Just theoretical so far) > Chalkbrood- 6 (Resistance - CB is more serious than most b-keepers think) > Aggressiveness- 7 > Colour- 11 (Mostly irrelevant. Yellow queens easier to find) > Brood viability- 1 (=High hive populations) > Swarming- 10 (Any good beekeeper should be able to control. I want bees that are strong enough to swarm) > Comb stability- 4 (Runny bees hard to work) > Pollen- 2 (Gathering signifies good genetics and health) > >2)You are (check one) Hobby beekeeper (<10 col.) > Side liner (>10<300 col.) > Commercial (>300 col.) x > >3)You are (check all appropriate) Honey producer x > Pollinator x > Queen producer x > >4)You are in (check one) North America x > Europe > Other ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 6 Mar 1996 18:40:38 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kevin & Ann Christensen Subject: Chalkbrood Discusson There has been a lot of debate lately between requeening vs. hive ventilation etc., for chalkbrood control. In addition to these procedures, we've been doing something else that I would like to share. For chalkbrood and nosema control, and to promote general good health in our hives, we have been getting more diligent in our brood comb replacement. We've been replacing 2-4 frames per brood nest every year with the hope of maintaining a 6 year rotation of comb in the brood chambers. We feel that old frames harbor the spores which cause these unhealthy colonies. When your doing this to 2000+ hives, it requires lots of effort. Because of this, I'd like to know if there is any scientific validity to my argument. Are we wasting our time? Is anybody else doing this? I'd appreciate your comments. Note: We have not treated for nosema in 20 years. Have not noticed a problem. Maybe I should take out the microscope! Thanks, Kevin Christensen ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 6 Mar 1996 21:24:06 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jean-Pierre Chapleau Subject: chalkbrood > > Allen Dick wrote: > > > > There are some strains that are more susceptible to CB (chalkbrood), > > and requeening quite often helps. We find that under identical > > conditions, some hives will, and some not have CB. > > > > Rejecting any hives that have CB mummies on the floor from our > > breeding pool has resulted in a major decrese in CB visible in our > > outfit -- for whatever reason. > > Yes you are right Allen. This is the best attitude to have towards > chalkbrood. Breeding is so simple. Just eliminate the bad ones and > multiply the the good ones (provided you prevent inbreeding). > Chalkbrood suceptibility is one of the simplest trait to control > trough selection. Results come within only a few generation and > anybody can do it. One single easy observation is the only thing you > need to rate a colony. > > Vince Coppola wrote: > >Just some comments on the chalkbrood disccusion. I know of two ways > >requeening can help with this disease. Requeening a colony causes a > >break in the production of brood. This can give the bees time to > >clean up the infection. > I do not think that the mere fact of requeening has anything to do with getting rid of CB. My experience telle me that the thing is essentially a matter of genetic suceptibility. You refer to hygienic behaviour. I am not totally convinced that HYG is the trait that controls the chalkbrood. Colonies with no CB do not have mummies on their bottom board and not even in the drawer of their pollen traps. But as Kerry Clark suggested to me HYG may be involved in the way that HYG colonies do not even tolerate spores in their environment. They may also remove the sick larvae very quicly, before they mummify. I am glad to see that many others have observed the importance of the genetic component of chalkbrood. Nobody seemed to believe there was such a relation a couple years ago. -- Jean-Pierre Chapleau eleveur de reines / queen breeder 1282, rang 8, Saint-Adrien de Ham, Quebec, Canada, J0A 1C0 tel./phone (819) 828-3396; fax (819) 828-0357 chapleau@login.net ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 6 Mar 1996 21:29:24 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Doug Yanega Subject: important info re: "DJSA's Who's Who Guide" In case any of you were bothered at receiving the preceding mass commercial e-mailing on BEE-L: >Just a message to let you know that DJSA's Who's Who Guide >is located at http://www.djsa.com/whoswho1.htm [snip] I've acquired a little relevant information about the individual responsible; I have no reason to suspect the following information is not true, though I cannot of course guarantee it: >From: lofstrom@lava.net (Karen Lofstrom) >To: dyanega@denr1.igis.uiuc.edu >Subject: Re: DJSA.COM - mailing list Spam?? >Newsgroups: news.admin.net-abuse.misc >Date: 7 Mar 1996 02:25:56 GMT > >Doug Yanega (dyanega@denr1.igis.uiuc.edu) wrote: > >: Out of curiosity, have other mailing lists been hit by this one? Looks >: like a pretty generic Spam to me. If so, I wouldn't mind knowing who lies >: above djsa.com in the hierarchy so complaints can be filed appropriately. > >Auwe! It's David J. Smith again. This guy spammed from various >addresses for years; he's been dropped by every national online >service, often several times from one site. He used to get his feed >from Holonet; looks like he's getting his feed from Netcom now. > >Complain LOUDLY to abuse@netcom.com. > >Whois shows his phone number to be 305-749-8642. Record was updated >in Feb 96. Is this number a good way to contact him? Someone who >lives out that way might want to try. >-- >Karen Lofstrom lofstrom@lava.net In other words, this would appear to be an individual who has committed extensive net-abuse in the past, and a number of complaints from BEE-L subscribers directed to abuse@netcom.com might be a useful thing (since Mr. Smith is himself the postmaster at DJSA.com, his own private site). Complaints should cite the original posting, not this follow-up. Sincerely, Doug Yanega Illinois Natural History Survey, 607 E. Peabody Dr. Champaign, IL 61820 USA phone (217) 244-6817, fax (217) 333-4949 affiliate, Univ. of Illinois Urbana-Champaign, Dept. of Entomology "There are some enterprises in which a careful disorderliness is the true method" - Herman Melville, Moby Dick, Chap. 82 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 17:44:03 +1259 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Robert Rice Subject: Recycle your Brood Combs? If everyone adopted the habit of recycling brood combs on a 5 or 6 year basis then there would be a lot less disease in our hives and consequently a lot less chemical control. For all diseases there is a minimal infective dose which must be reached before a disease will establish itself. If you can stay below this thresh hold then a disease outbreak is highly unlikely. There are two important issues here, the first of course is disease load or the amount of infectious material trapped in the multiple layers of cocoon in any brood comb. Think about the last time you melted down a brood comb to recover the wax; what was left, a mass of old "disease containing" cocoon. Bees deliberately entrap the faeces of developing brood between these layers of cocoon, if the layers are disturbed then the infectious material is exposed and so the cycle of infection cycle continues. After all, why do we burn beehives and combs after they become contaminated with AFB spores, to destroy the source of infection. Also, ask anyone who has had equipment and combs gamma radiated to kill AFB spores, after repopulation of the hives, the bees do extremely well. The equipment is the same, the only difference is that it is sterile. And for those who have expanded a beekeeping business from a few to hundreds or thousands of hives, disease wasn't really a big problem until your business stop expanding (assuming the expansion was from dividing hives into new equipment and by not buying existing equipment). Why ? Because you continually diluted the disease load in your hives by placing new foundation in them. The second point worth considering is, on average how long do feral colonies inhabit a site ? Usually only a few years and why because diseases destroys the colony. Swarming (by which feral colonies spread and we breed to suppress) is a wonderful disease control mechanism, most of the disease load is left behind, only that which exist on or in the bees is carried to the new colony. The new colony is then required to build new comb from scratch, new brood comb not containing disease harbouring cocoon. If you haven't read between the lines by now, I am a fervent (highly biased) believer in comb recycling. It wont cure all your disease problems but it sure well substantially reduce the impact of disease on your hives. And as for the cost of comb replacement. As hard as beekeepers try to keep brood combs out of honey supers it inevitably happens, and without all the connotations associated with this in terms of the risk of disease spread, a dark brood comb will send light honey darker than anything else I know of except heat. Generally the darker the honey the lower the price and so by comb replacement you offset this business loss which means more $/kg or $/lb for your product. Finally, for those who say that antibiotics are cheaper and easier. Antibiotics like most chemicals an interim measure until the bugs "figure" out a new strategy and become resistant to the chemicals. This problem exists right through all forms of monoculture be it crops, livestock or bees. We really aren't protecting our bees from disease we are really genetically selecting for chemical resistance in the enemy. We should adopt the strategy of the disease causing bugs and select for resistance in our queen breeding programs to restore the balance. Unfortunately, it's a fact of life that simply organisms like bacteria usually develop chemical resistance faster then complex organisms like bees. For those who might disagree with my logic, my beliefs are based on 22 years of beekeeping in which 10 were spent managing 2000 colonies and 7,000 mating nucs. Robert Rice. Apiculture Service Manager (South Island) Ministry of Agriculture Lincoln, New Zealand. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 6 Mar 1996 20:56:14 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Gordon Scott Subject: Re: Evaluation of Honeybees In-Reply-To: Hi all, FWIW, I remember a few years ago one of our researchers here asserting that there was a strong correlation between ChalkBrood and protein deficiency. Her view is that one way to reduce the likelihood of a serious level of the disease is to ensure a source of pollen at times of dearth. Many of us here feed a spring pollen supplement, with that assertion in mind, although the early oilseed crop also encourages that. Regards, -- Gordon Scott gordon@apis.demon.co.uk gordon@multitone.co.uk (work) The Basingstoke Beekeeper (newsletter) beekeeper@apis.demon.co.uk Embryo Home Page Beekeeper; Kendo 3rd Dan; Sometime sailor. Hampshire, England. ^^^ Wish me luck on the 31st. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 03:17:00 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Andy Nachbaur Organization: WILD BEE'S BBS (209) 826-8107 LOS BANOS, CA Subject: Chalkbrood Discusson K>From: Kevin & Ann Christensen >Date: Wed, 6 Mar 1996 18:40:38 -0700 >Subject: Chalkbrood Discusson K> For chalkbrood and nosema control, and to promote general good health >in our hives, we have been getting more diligent in our brood comb >replacement. We've been replacing 2-4 frames per brood nest every year with >the hope of maintaining a 6 year rotation of comb in the brood chambers. We >feel that old frames harbor the spores which cause these unhealthy colonies. K> When your doing this to 2000+ hives, it requires lots of effort. >Because of this, I'd like to know if there is any scientific validity to my >argument. Are we wasting our time? Is anybody else doing this? I'd >appreciate your comments. Hello Kevin & Ann, I suspect that this is a very worthwhile thing to do, if you have a program to get rid, (sell, render) the old combs. From my own experience I believe that those who keep drawing foundation and sell old combs, such as in 4 frame nucs or singles have a edge on all disease control and this could be because of the high percentage of new combs. One observation I have made in investigations large so called mysterious losses in bee operations pre and post mite invasions here in central California is that all these operations had one thing in common. They were in well established and successful beekeeping business that over the years had acclimated much bee equipment that included mostly aged dark brood combs. This is not to say that the beekeeper with all new combs is not having the same problems, it just what I have seen in the commercial operations, and my own. K> Note: We have not treated for nosema in 20 years. Have not noticed > a problem. Maybe I should take out the microscope! If you don't have a problem don't treat...Nosema spores can bee identified using a child's microscope, and here the symptoms are colonies in the spring that brood and build up but do not expand past a certain level of population less then one would expect judging by other bees in the area or your own experience. The yards that seem to be effected the most are normally those in a cool, damp, or shady areas. These hives may show some symptoms of spotting from "yellow rain", not the norm here because we normally have fair or good flight conditions. Another symptom may be hives that are 100% young bees because the older ones died earlier then normal. They tend to stay that way for weeks at a time. The control is to find a better bee yard or treat early before brood rearing really gets going if possible. The spores are just about everywhere and could be passed from contaminated bee watering areas. Like keeping new combs, it would be nice to place your bees on different sites each year, but not to practicable in most cases. Our bee's are not potty trained and except for my new white truck have no particular area that they relieve themselves on, and I am sure over the years many problems develop for the bees because of this poor hygienic beehaviour and the build up of many deleterious materials such as spores of one thing or another. If I had never treated for nosema, with today's honey price it may be a good year to try it on half of your bees if you already have a bee feeding program. The greatest increase in Honey Production demonstrated in the original drug tests was in bees I would have expected not to be effected by nosema, and I am sure the beekeeper in the arid desert of Arizona was also pleasantly surprised, first at having nosema, and 2nd at the increased honey crop he produced when he treated for it. Chalkbrood is another story, that since there is no control I will leave it for another post. ttul OLd.Drone@beenet.com (c) Permission is granted to freely copy this document in electronic form, or to print for personal use. (w)Opinions are not necessarily facts. Use at own risk. --- ~ QMPro 1.53 ~ ... Which a bee would choose to dream in. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 03:22:24 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Re: Applying fumigillan & honey price > K> Note: We have not treated for nosema in 20 years. Have not noticed a problem. Maybe I should take out the microscope! > > If you don't have a problem don't treat...Nosema spores can bee > identified using a child's microscope, and here the symptoms are > colonies in the spring that brood and build up but do not expand > past a certain level of population less then one would expect > judging by other bees in the area or your own experience. At a recent course, several participants mentioned the use of fumigillan by drenching, rather than using in feeders. The drenching method uses 1/2 a large bottle of Fumidil in a barrel of syrup, applied by a watering can onto each cluster. A cup or so of syrup is used per treatment per hive, and the idea is that the bees receive only as much syrup as the bees can hold. The idea is that they suck it right up -- having no choice -- because they are covered with the stuff, and all bees get a dose. This way the active ingredient is distributed to all bees at once, and much less is used because none is stored until after all bees are full. This application is repeated several times over a few weeks, if I recall correctly. I wonder if anyone has tried this and checked for effectiveness, and also wonder if any of the scientists and extension workers have any comments to make -- either directly to me or publicly to the list. I'd appreciate any info that anyone has, particularly hard facts. If effective, this concept would seem to reduce the cost of treatment for nosema drastically. BTW the latest honey price is apparently $0.94 US in drums in truckload lots!!! ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 03:35:05 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Microscopes Did you phone me last night? I was out. I'm going to look into ordering microscopes shortly. Also did you e-mail earlier about an Alberta list? I think I lost about 30 email messages and don't know where they were from. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 09:24:49 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: Re: Applying fumigillan & honey price Comments: To: Allen Dick In-Reply-To: <199603062305.AA01693@internode.net> In Dr. Morse's book "Honey Bee Pests, Predators, and Diseases" there is a section on nosema by Dr. B. Furgala. He says that winter loss is only one and not necesarily the most significant damage caused by nosema. Early queen supercedure and shorter adult life are documented. Read the book and do some calculating - I'll bet you will try to control nosema even if honey is $.50/lb. And check out the graph, I was amazed to see when spore counts peak. bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb b b b Vince & Carole Coppola vcoppola@epix.net b b Coppola Apiaries, (716)965-2904 b b 10220 Bradigan Rd. b b Forestville, N.Y. 14062 b b b b Queens bred for tracheal mite resistance b b Honey , Pollination b b Western New York Beekeepers Association b b b bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 14:36:23 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: PHILIP EARLE Subject: RAPDs Hi.. Does anyone have a method they can send me for preparing bee nucleic acid for use in RAPDs ? Phil bcg0311@v2.qub.ac.uk ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 10:58:56 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jean-Pierre Chapleau Subject: Comb recycling Kevin & Ann Christensen wrote: > > > For chalkbrood and nosema control, and to promote general good health > in our hives, we have been getting more diligent in our brood comb > replacement. We've been replacing 2-4 frames per brood nest every year with > the hope of maintaining a 6 year rotation of comb in the brood chambers. We > feel that old frames harbor the spores which cause these unhealthy colonies. > > When your doing this to 2000+ hives, it requires lots of effort. > Because of this, I'd like to know if there is any scientific validity to my > argument. Are we wasting our time? Is anybody else doing this? I'd > appreciate your comments. > I believe comb recycling is a very important health control measure. This measure is part of my personal disease prevention program together with regular brood inspection and selection for hygienic behaviour. So far I have not used drugs for AFB control in my standard colonies (+-600). I cannot say that AFB is non existant but so far it is kept under control easily. One additionnal remark on comb recycling. I am in the process of converting my business to whole plastics frames. Plastic frames make comb recycling a lot cheaper and easier. The old comb is scraped off. It is much easier to melt bulk wax that it is to melt whole frames. The scraped frame can be put back in the hive with no preparation and no extra cost (no foundation to buy). All this should encourage more frequent replacement of the brood combs. Plastic frames can be easily desinfected with chlorine ("eau de javel") if one want. This way frames of diseased colonies are not lost. -- Jean-Pierre Chapleau eleveur de reines / queen breeder 1282, rang 8, Saint-Adrien de Ham, Quebec, Canada, J0A 1C0 tel./phone (819) 828-3396; fax (819) 828-0357 chapleau@login.net ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 11:03:15 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jean-Pierre Chapleau Subject: Price of jumagillin I heard that the price of fumagillin was supposed to increase. Would anybody know what the price is right now in North America ? -- Jean-Pierre Chapleau eleveur de reines / queen breeder 1282, rang 8, Saint-Adrien de Ham, Quebec, Canada, J0A 1C0 tel./phone (819) 828-3396; fax (819) 828-0357 chapleau@login.net ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 11:38:48 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Susan W. Cobey" Subject: Bee L subscribe Please add me to the Bee-L ist. Susan Cobey Ohio State University Dept. of Entomology 1735 Neil Ave. Columbus, OH 43210 Tel.(614) 292-7928 Fax (614) 292 2180 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 11:38:42 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Susan W. Cobey" Subject: subscribe Please add me to the Bee-L list Susan Cobey Ohio State University Dept. of Entomology 1735 Neil Ave. Columbus, OH 43210 Tel.(614) 292-7928 Fax (614) 292 2180 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 18:57:16 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Rudolf E. Bahr" Subject: Re: Chalkbrood increasing !? In-Reply-To: <96030612251356@quick.cc.fundp.ac.be> On Wed, 6 Mar 1996, Jean-Marie Van Dyck wrote: > ... > Pay attention that there is a reverse at the medal (in french it means > the worst side) : if you get bees really resistant to chalkbrood > you'll get bees really sensible to AFB : we saw this with our Buckfast > bees which got AFB in an area quite without AFB (one case for 2-3 > years)...! > ... Hallo Jean-Marie, how often do you practice renewal of combs? Brother Adam emphasizes in his book "Breeding of Honeybee" the necessity of regular renewal at least all 4 years as supporting measure against all diseases, especially against AFB. In his book on bee management he describes two ways of doing it according to the yield of the region in which one lives. I have made good experience with it. Every year at the end of yield in July I put a quarter of my 50+ Buckfast colonies completely on new wax walls (?). Until now I never lost more than 10% of my colonies during winter, mostly less, for instance because of Nosema. And this I am regarding as natural selection. Up to now there hasn't been any AFB though there were infected hives in the environment. (Admittedly, when we claim such important things we say always "toi", "toi", "toi" and knock on wood thrice). Regards, R.E.Bahr NISI APES FINIS ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 20:10:09 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: sbiblio@ITECS5.TELECOM-CO.NET Subject: Re: BORIS DIAZGRANADOS NECESITO INFORMACION SOBRE TRANQUILIZANTES PARA EL MANEJO DE COLMENAS CON ABEJAS AGRESIVAS O CATALOGOS SOBRE EQUIPOS PARA EL MANEJO DE ABEJAS. FAVOR ENVIAR INFORMACION A ADOLFO DIAZ GRANADOS DIRECCION: CALLE 84A #39C-67 TELEFONO 3592819 BARRANQUILLA-COLOMBIA. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 20:13:04 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Gordon Scott Subject: Re: Recycle your Brood Combs? In-Reply-To: On Thu, 7 Mar 1996, Robert Rice wrote: > For all diseases there is a minimal infective dose which must > be reached before a disease will establish itself. If you > can stay below this thresh hold then a disease outbreak is > highly unlikely. Something that many beekeepers in my area do is sterilise our out-of-use equipment, usually using acetic acid but sometimes by irradiation. We build our empty boxes into stacks, sealed top and bottom, with a pad soaked with a few tens of millilitres of 80% glacial acetic acid about every foot (30cm) of height. Leave to 'stew' for a few days then ventilate for a few more. It kills most things pretty dead! NOTE: 80% glacial acetic acid isn't very nice stuff, so if you do this be careful. Wear the mandatory "big rubber gloves" (tm) and a respirator mask (carbon filters). You *can* work without, carfully and upwind, but I _don't_ recommend it. It also corrodes many metals so watch the frame wiring and support runners. Regards, -- Gordon Scott gordon@apis.demon.co.uk gordon@multitone.co.uk (work) The Basingstoke Beekeeper (newsletter) beekeeper@apis.demon.co.uk Embryo Home Page Beekeeper; Kendo 3rd Dan; Sometime sailor. Hampshire, England. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 22:17:51 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Paul Cronshaw, D.C." Subject: When to requeen Bee listers, One of the better bee supply catalogs I have seen is from Bushy Mountain Bee Farm (800-233-7929). It has some good general information about beekeeping, so I fired up my scanner and OCR to post this list two articles that might interest some of the members of this list. SECRETS OF A MASTER Many people consider themselves Master Beekeepers and we met someone this year that epitomizes "Master Beekeeper". George W. Imirie, Jr. started keeping bees in 1933 under the tutelage of Dr. Jim Hambleton the top USDA scientist at the time. George has worked with bees for 63 years applying scientific methods he has learned as an Atomic Physicist and he tells it like it is! He and his partner Ann Harmon produce a yearly average of 132 pounds per colony in Maryland, a state with an average of 28.5 pounds per year. George is eager to share his knowledge with those interested in improving their beekeeping skills. By following his management techniques you will make much more honey. His methods are really very simple and this is an abbreviation of what he does. He requeens every colony each fall. He does not do it in the Spring. When you requeen in the fall your bees should not swarm the next year given plenty of room, also they will winter much better. His "Almost Foolproof Requeening" methods are described below. Practice good fall management, making sure required disease and mite treatments are applied. Producing honey requires a large field force to collect it . To get that field force you must stimulate the queen to lay by feeding: 1:1 sugar syrup (Ipound of sugar with I pint of water). The gestation period for a worker is 21 days and she spends the first 19 days of her life doing hive duties. Only after 40 days is a worker ready to collect nectar. Let's say your honey flow starts May 1..ON THAT DAY YOU WILL NEED A FIELD FORCE OF AT LEAST 42,000 BEES. A young queen (REQUEEN IN THE EARLY FALL) can lay 1500 eggs per day, so in one brood cycle (21 days) she can lay about 31,000 eggs. Understanding that it takes a bee 40 days to be ready for field work; you know you need to feed for two months (40 days plus 28 days) prior to the honey flow. Fortunately you may need to feed for only 6 weeks because the last two weeks there should be naturally available nectar. Do not let those feeders run out! When your honey flow starts you should add your drawn extracting supers immediately to the colonies. At least 3 per colony. Colonies swarm due to congestion and George eliminates this by adding an Imirie Shim between each super. The additional entrance reduces congestion, thwarts swarming, and allows the bees to reduce the moisture from 50~7c to 80% to the required 16% to 18% much easier. As soon as your crop is capped remove the supers and shims. Don't worry about burr comb using the Imirie Shim because the bees will prefer the drawn supers and will store their crop there. ************* Almost FoolProof Requeening By George W. Imirie, Jr. When your new marked queen arrives, water her and store her in a cool dark place until needed. Gather up a double screen board, an empty hive body, 10 drawn combs and some 1:1 sugar syrup, and a feeder. Find the old queen in the colony you want to requeen. Set her aside and select 3 frames of brood from her hive; I capped and 2 of larvae and eggs, with the covering nurse bees. Place these in the center of the empty hive body. Now add 6 more frames, as follows; 2 err.pty drawn comb, (one on each side of the brood frames), 2 frames of honey and pollen, (one on each side of the drawn comb), then 2 more empty drawn comb, (one on each side of the honey-pollen frames). This makes 9 frames leaving space for the queen cage. Now take several frames of brood....remaining in the old colony....and shake some of the bees into the new 9 frame nuc. Cover the nuc and set aside for a while. Return the frame with the old queen to her home hive and fill with drawn comb. This colony will stay where it was originally. Put the double screen board on top of the old colony opening the back entrance of the double screen board. Put the 9 frame nuc on top and install the new queen (make sure you remove cork from end with candy). Start feeding the split immediately. In 3 days check the queen cage very quickly with little or no smoke to see if she has been released. If she has not been, release her from the cage. Do not disturb for another 5 to 7 days then check again with as little disturbance as you can and look for eggs. Add the 10th frame and remove the queen cage. During the next few weeks check the brood pattern of the new queen. If all is well you can kill the old queen and remove the double screen board. This method has a couple of advantages: 1) if something is wrong with the new queen, the colony has a backup with the old queen and 2) for a time 2 queens wil] be laying eggs increasing the number of bees which will make the hive stronger and help reduce the stress of Winter. Source: Bushy Mountain Bee Farm Catalog. Standard disclaimer, a happy customer *********** After reading these articles, I have two questions: 1. When do most beekeepers requeen- Fall or Spring? 2. HOw effective are "Imirie Shims"? Paul Cronshaw DC Hobby Beekeeper ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Mar 1996 02:25:17 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Michael L. Wallace" Subject: Apitherapy with a JOLT! Hello, All, I recently became interested in apitherapy for M.S., because a co-worker, of mine, was diagnosed with it a few days ago. I know that there is a lot of research, all over the world, that has been done on bee-sting therapy and I have read some of the articles in ABJ. However, I have a unique question for anyone who deals with apitherapy from a scientific standpoint. I'm not looking for mere opinions, here, from people on the list. I need to know specific scientific data, if there exists any on the question that I have. I may be barking up the wrong tree by asking this question here, but here goes. First, I need to give a little bit of background: I am aware of research that is going on, right now, that involves the use of electrical shock, in conjunction with various types of venoms. I know that, to date, the research has shown that all bee, wasp, spider and snake venoms consist of a complex, "energy seeking" protein and that the basics of that protein exist in all known venoms. This protein, when it enters the body, seeks energy to unlock and actually be beneficial to the human body, rather than detrimental. It can not find the energy that it seeks and as a result loops back on itself in a never ending, energy seeking loop and that is what causes it to be "poisonous" to the human body. They, preliminarily, have already, substantially proven that by introducing a high-volt, momentary shock, using a taser (stun gun), 3 to 5 times around the sting/bite site, the energy is provided, necessary to unlock the protein. I believe the University of Oklahoma has been leading the research in this area and it has been used several times on bite/sting victims with great success. So much so, that Wycliffe Bible Translators are requiring that all of their missionaries carry tasers to the different countries that they go to. I heard one story of a missionaries' wife, in India, who was bitten by a crate (sp?) snake. The husband went for his taser, but the batteries were dead. He had been working on his motorcycle, so he took his wife to it and shocked the site with the spark plug wire. I understand she became person number 4, in all of recorded history, to live through the bite of this particular snake. Anyway, that's straying from the question. The question is this: Has anyone done any research using the combination of bee venom and high-volt electrical shock to treat any ailments or is this information so new that it has not been considered? If not, could this not be something that someone might need to look into? If you have any info., I would like to know and it would make for a very interesting discussion on the list. If you do, or you know the direction that I could head to find out what I want to know, please post to the list. Well, I've stayed up long enough. Regards, Mike Wallace Bkeeper1@why.net McKinney, Texas USA ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Mar 1996 07:02:28 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: JeanLouis Adant Organization: Le Relais BBS Subject: Translation Poster:sbiblio@ITECS5.TELECOM-CO.NET Sujet: BORIS DIAZGRANADOS ----------------------------------------------------------------- >NECESITO INFORMACION SOBRE TRANQUILIZANTES PARA EL MANEJO DE >COLMENAS CON ABEJAS AGRESIVAS O CATALOGOS SOBRE EQUIPOS PARA EL >MANEJO DE ABEJAS. FAVOR ENVIAR INFORMACION A ADOLFO DIAZ GRANADOS >DIRECCION: CALLE 84A #39C-67 >TELEFONO 3592819 BARRANQUILLA-COLOMBIA. The english translation is: I need information about tranquilizers to take care of beehives with agressive bees and beekeeping supplies catalogs. Write to ADOLFO DIAZ GRANADOS DIRECCION: CALLE 84A #39C-67 BARRANQUILLA COLOMBIA. Jean-Louis Adant, Montreal, Qc ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Mar 1996 07:30:06 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Dave Green, Eastern Pollinator Newsletter" Subject: Re: BORIS DIAZGRANADOS In a message dated 96-03-07 21:08:04 EST, Sr. ADOLFO DIAZ GRANADOS writes: >NECESITO INFORMACION SOBRE TRANQUILIZANTES PARA EL MANEJO DE COLMENAS CON >ABEJAS AGRESIVAS O CATALOGOS SOBRE EQUIPOS PARA EL MANEJO DE ABEJAS. No sabemos mejor manera de manejar colmenas agresivas que un umo. El umo puede paceficar las abejas que quieren picar. Se venden umos (smokers) a Dadant & Sons, Hamilton, IL 62341, USA o Walter T. Kelley Co., Inc., PO Box 240, Clarkson, KY 42726 USA Buena swerte. Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green, PO Box 1200, Hemingway, SC 29554 USA ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Mar 1996 07:59:47 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Dave Green, Eastern Pollinator Newsletter" Subject: Re: Apitherapy with a JOLT! In a message dated 96-03-08 03:35:52 EST, Bkeeper1@WHY.NET (Michael L. Wallace) writes: >I am aware of research that is going on, right now, that involves the use of >electrical shock, in conjunction with various types of venoms. I know that, >to date, the research has shown that all bee, wasp, spider and snake venoms >consist of a complex, "energy seeking" protein and that the basics of that >protein exist in all known venoms. This protein, when it enters the body, >seeks energy to unlock and actually be beneficial to the human body, rather >than detrimental. It can not find the energy that it seeks and as a result >loops back on itself in a never ending, energy seeking loop and that is what >causes it to be "poisonous" to the human body. > >They, preliminarily, have already, substantially proven that by introducing >a high-volt, momentary shock, using a taser (stun gun), 3 to 5 times around >the sting/bite site, the energy is provided, necessary to unlock the >protein. I believe the University of Oklahoma has been leading the research >in this area and it has been used several times on bite/sting victims with >great success. So much so, that Wycliffe Bible Translators are requiring >that all of their missionaries carry tasers to the different countries that >they go to. > >I heard one story of a missionaries' wife, in India, who was bitten by a >crate (sp?) snake. The husband went for his taser, but the batteries were >dead. He had been working on his motorcycle, so he took his wife to it and >shocked the site with the spark plug wire. I understand she became person >number 4, in all of recorded history, to live through the bite of this >particular snake. Anyway, that's straying from the question. > >The question is this: Has anyone done any research using the combination of >bee venom and high-volt electrical shock to treat any ailments or is this >information so new that it has not been considered? If not, could this not >be something that someone might need to look into? As it was told me, the electric shock breaks down the venemous proteins to render them harmless. The premise seems far-fetched, so I am naturally skeptical. The device that Wycliffe missionaries use is manufactured at Jungle Aviation and Radio Service (JAARS), PO Box 248, Waxhaw, NC 29173-0248 USA. They are a group associated with Wycliffe that provides services to Christian misionaries. (I've seen one of their planes, which can land or take off in about 4 plane lengths. They are also big into computors, which they provide for missionaries in the remotest areas, along with radio contact, similar to internet connections) I understand they do sell the shocker device to the public, for somewhere in the $20 range. I had considered getting one to experiment with. The shock is provided by a pizzoelectric crystal. I believe they rework the igniter setups used to light propane heaters. I will contact them for more info, and see if I can release their e-mail address. They are convinced that the device has been a life-saver in snake-bite situations. Missionaries in some situations are now required to carry them. JAARS is a reputable organization, and they are not trying to scam anyone. They are not out trying to "sell" this device, and they might not be willing to provide large quantities. I am acquainted with a retired man who is working with them as a volunteer. Does anyone have more info on the scientific end of this? Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green, PO Box 1200, Hemingway, SC 29554 USA ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Mar 1996 08:30:45 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Ray Lackey Subject: plastic frames I have had a problem cleaning off the plastic frames. I have best success in the cold of winter. Scraping old brood comb when cold will pull much of it away from the plastic, leaving it bare. But, there is always some stubborn portion that just cuts off at the tops of the plastic cells, leaving a smooth area. The bees often then draw this out as drone or bridge across to the next frame. Has anyone found a way around this? Withthe talk of irradiation to sterilize equipment, Can it be used on the plastic frames? Scraping and packing them in alternating positions as they are shipped reduces the volume by about ?30%? so this would reduce sterilization costs, based upon volume (I have heard). ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ + Raymond J. Lackey, EAS Master Beekeeper, VP LIBA + + Twelve years exper with 25 colonies on Long Island, NY+ + INTERNET: lackeyr@hazeltine.com + + Mail: 1260 Walnut Avenue, Bohemia NY 11617-2176 + + Home Phone: 516-567-1936 FAX: 516-262-8053 + ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Mar 1996 11:36:59 PST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Tim Townsend Subject: Re: plastic frames ---------------Original Message--------------- >I have had a problem cleaning off the plastic frames. I have best >success in the cold of winter. Scraping old brood comb when cold >will pull much of it away from the plastic, leaving it bare. But, >there is always some stubborn portion that just cuts off at the tops >of the plastic cells, leaving a smooth area. The bees often then draw >this out as drone or bridge across to the next frame. Has anyone >found a way around this? You can try twisting the comb in the cold, that may loosen the wax cake enough to remove it. I have also heard of some people imersing the frame in hat water for no more than 5 seconds, to loosen the wax. Generally we find these heavy waxed areas to be quite small, so we haven't worried about them. >equipment, Can it be used on the plastic frames? Scraping and packing >them in alternating positions as they are shipped reduces the volume by >about ?30%? so this would reduce sterilization costs, based upon volume >(I have heard). ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ + Raymond J. Lackey, EAS Master Beekeeper, VP LIBA + + Twelve years exper with 25 colonies on Long Island, NY+ + INTERNET: lackeyr@hazeltine.com + + Mail: 1260 Walnut Avenue, Bohemia NY 11617-2176 + + Home Phone: 516-567-1936 FAX: 516-262-8053 + ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ TPLR HONEY FARMS Tim Townsend RR 1 Stony Plain Alberta TTOWNSE@IBM.NET ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Mar 1996 20:03:05 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Rudolf E. Bahr" Subject: Re: When to requeen In-Reply-To: On Thu, 7 Mar 1996, Paul Cronshaw, D.C. wrote: > ... > After reading these articles, I have two questions: > > 1. When do most beekeepers requeen- Fall or Spring? > > 2. HOw effective are "Imirie Shims"? 1.) The decision, at what time to requeen, could depend on the yield. In regions with early yields it should normally be an advantage to requeen in the fall before. Brother Adam, in a region with rather late yields, requeens mostly in spring. Simultaneously he "equals" his colonies, in order to be able to treat them all in nearly the same manner. But he also exchanges single queens whenever necessary. 2.) I am afraid, all but me know what "Imirie Shims" are. Could you send a private e-mail and tell me? regards, R.E.Bahr NISI APES FINIS ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Mar 1996 13:08:02 -600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Dan Buchsbaum Subject: Re: Apitherapy with a JOLT! In-Reply-To: <960308075947_240716324@mail02.mail.aol.com> The correct zip is 28173. My parents are stationed there, so I notice these little things. :-) Cynthia Buchsbaum > > The device that Wycliffe missionaries use is manufactured at Jungle > Aviation and Radio Service (JAARS), PO Box 248, Waxhaw, NC 29173-0248 USA. > They are a group associated with Wycliffe that provides services to Christian > misionaries. (I've seen one of their planes, which can land or take off in > about 4 plane lengths. They are also big into computors, which they provide > for missionaries in the remotest areas, along with radio contact, similar to > internet connections) > ^ > Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green, PO Box 1200, Hemingway, SC 29554 USA ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Mar 1996 15:27:14 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: Re: plastic frames In-Reply-To: <199603081330.AA021391845@hazeltine.com> On Fri, 8 Mar 1996, Ray Lackey wrote: > I have had a problem cleaning off the plastic frames. I have best > success in the cold of winter. Scraping old brood comb when cold > will pull much of it away from the plastic, leaving it bare. But, > there is always some stubborn portion that just cuts off at the tops > of the plastic cells, leaving a smooth area. The bees often then draw > this out as drone or bridge across to the next frame. Has anyone > found a way around this? > Hi Ray- This is second hand, I havn't tried it myself but a friend of mine uses this method. He places the frames in a freezer overnight. Next day the comb can be separated from the plastic by twisting the frame. He says the frame is just like new. Let me know how it works.> bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb b b b Vince & Carole Coppola vcoppola@epix.net b b Coppola Apiaries, (716)965-2904 b b 10220 Bradigan Rd. b b Forestville, N.Y. 14062 b b b b Queens bred for tracheal mite resistance b b Honey , Pollination b b Western New York Beekeepers Association b b b bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Mar 1996 16:05:00 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Essential Oils. Regarding the following, I make no claims! I have been asked to post this to the list. It came to me from Simpson's Bee Supplies in Danville, Ohio. Essential Oil Treatments for Varroa. Spearmint Oil, added to sugar syrup at the rate of 15 drops per quart. To be fed to the bees at Spring and Fall. Wintergreen Oil, added to sugar syrup at the rate of 80 drops per quart. The cluster to be sprayed with a fine nozzle spray and to wet thoroughly. Teatree Oil, placed on a tray beneath the cluster 8-10 drops. The evaporation through the hive repeated as necessary. These treatments were brought to my attention recently. I know there has been work done on essential oil treatments. Does anybody wish to comment? **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Mar 1996 16:05:11 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: Recycle your Brood Combs? Robert Rice wrote >If everyone adopted the habit of recycling brood combs on a 5 or 6 year >basis then there would be a lot less disease in our hives and >consequently a lot less chemical control. For all diseases there is a >minimal infective dose which must be reached before a disease will >establish itself. If you can stay below this thresh hold then a disease >outbreak is highly unlikely. What a rush! I was really pleased to see this post!! The view has always been,' the queen prefers to lay in dark comb' and through the years I have seen some disgustingly black stuff. We try to change one third every year. Last year we had a speaker from Denmark who is on the Buckfast breeding program, and they change all frames every year. Mind you they also have a steam cleaning process where they send all their boxes and frames for de-waxing and cleaning. The wax is then recycled into foundation. **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Mar 1996 15:09:21 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Cammie Hughes Subject: Fumidil B Hello, Does anyone know of a company that sells Fumidil B in bulk? If so, e-mail me the name, address and phone number to cammie@wave.net. Thank you. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Mar 1996 19:44:31 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Eric & Pattie Robinson Subject: Re: When to requeen Rudolf E. Bahr wrote: >. HOw effective are "Imirie Shims"? > I am afraid, all but me know what "Imirie Shims" are. Could you send > a private e-mail and tell me? > > regards, > R.E.Bahr > > NISI APES FINIS You're not alone. I don't know either. How about posting to the list for I'm sure there are others like us that don't know about the Shims are. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Mar 1996 20:40:13 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "my name is Dean M. Breaux" Subject: Re: plastic frames Yes you can Irraidiate your plastic frames and you can pack them in as tight as you can. You are also correct in that the more space the more it cost. Also most places charge a min. Dean M. Breaux Breeding Better Bees ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Mar 1996 07:22:43 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Rudolf E. Bahr" Subject: Re: Recycle your Brood Combs? In-Reply-To: <199603082113.QAA28065@segwun.muskoka.net> On Fri, 8 Mar 1996, David Eyre wrote: > Robert Rice wrote > >If everyone adopted the habit of recycling brood combs on a 5 or 6 year > >basis then there would be a lot less disease in our hives and > >consequently a lot less chemical control. For all diseases there is a > >minimal infective dose which must be reached before a disease will > >establish itself. If you can stay below this thresh hold then a disease > >outbreak is highly unlikely. > > What a rush! I was really pleased to see this post!! The view has always > been,' the queen prefers to lay in dark comb' and through the years I have > seen some disgustingly black stuff. We try to change one third every year. > Last year we had a speaker from Denmark who is on the Buckfast > breeding program, and they change all frames every year. Mind you they also > have a steam cleaning process where they send all their boxes and frames for > de-waxing and cleaning. The wax is then recycled into foundation. > **************************************************** > Yes, I am very pleased too! Though the bees seem to be attracted by dark combs, I think, it's very important to recycle them regularly. Until now I never heard about changing all frames every year, but that's doubtlessly good. That means putting the bees on new frames at oince and supporting this action by feeding liquidly. Also pollen should be available in nature. The old brood combs as a whole are given to another colony, at the bottom. It's nice to observe, the queen just begins to lay eggs, when the cells did'nt have got yet their final length. One thing seems to be important: Not to recycle completely too late in the year, the new frames should be breeded oince. They then seem to be warmer to the bees in winter. Yes, for dewaxing and cleaning frames we use a steempot. Those pots are available to hobby beekeepers too. In a size to contain the frames of one hive they will cost circa 800 US $. We make candles out of the wax or change it for new wax walls (expression ?, surely you know what I mean). Regards, R.E.Bahr NISI APES FINIS ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Mar 1996 03:41:42 -0800 Reply-To: uc779@freenet.victoria.bc.ca Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Conrad A. Berube" Subject: Re: BORIS DIAZGRANADOS >>NECESITO INFORMACION SOBRE TRANQUILIZANTES PARA EL MANEJO DE COLMENAS CON >>ABEJAS AGRESIVAS O CATALOGOS SOBRE EQUIPOS PARA EL MANEJO DE ABEJAS. >No sabemos mejor manera de manejar colmenas agresivas que un umo. El >umo puede paceficar las abejas que quieren picar. Supuestemente (no he experimentado el fenemeno, yo mismo) se han realizado exitos con humo quemando plumas de gallinas o lana de obeja-- me imagino que el humo tan fuerte les incapicita, temporarariamente, las abejas. Tambien, una cantidad peqe~a de "nitrous oxide" emitado con el humo puede tranquilizar a las abejas-- pero no me recuerdo la manera de empleo. Yo mismo he encontrado el uso de agua en un atomizadora (o un jarabe debil, cuando el pillage ne sera problematico) es util. Se usa un roceo liviano sobre las abejas igual con (y _en combinacion_-- no como remplazo) el humo. Mas suerte, - Conrad Berube " ` ISLAND CROP MANAGEMENT " ` 1326 Franklin Terrace _- -_`-_|'\ /` Victoria, B.C. _/ / / -' `~()() V8S 1C7 \_\ _ /\-._/\/ (604)480-0223; fax (604)656-8922 / | | email: uc779@freenet.victoria.bc.ca '` ^ ^ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Mar 1996 06:11:05 +0000 Reply-To: James.Peterson.2@m.k12.ut.us Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: James Peterson Organization: UtahLink Subject: plastic frames Thank you all for help on "mite screen". I have some and am building the board today. Today I am also wondering what " Plastic frames "are. I am using Permadent on wood frames both for honey and brood boxes. As you all know, Permadent is a sheet of indented plastic with a bees' wax coating on the outside. My bees build Permadent foundation into very nice drawn combs. I tried a full California made plastic frame ( I can not remember the name of the manufacturer ) during my first beekeeper life about 15 years ago and the bees would not build them up evenly. Have The plastic frames been improved so that this will not happen again? Is there an introduction procedure that enhances sucess? Please advise as I don't enjoy nailing frames together. Thanks again for all the good advise on Bee-L. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Mar 1996 07:18:14 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Re: Recycle your Brood Combs? Just so that some of the newer beekeepers don't get the idea that this (replacing all your combs as fast as you can) is unanamously accepted, I want to say that I think it can be a dangerous idea. It is hard to argue with cleanliness -- after all it's next to godliness -- and I'm sure many are attracted to the easy arguements to be made for it. HOWEVER, in my own experience, I found that as I *reduced* the amount of comb that each colony was required to build, my wintering success and overall colony health *increased*. Comb building beyond a point is hard on bees most times of the year and has a cost in honey production. In some years, a lot of comb can be built. In other years, little can be accomplished. If you have committed the bees to a lot of work in a bad year, the wintering will suffer greatly -- here in the north. I can't speak for the south. For me, 10% (average) is a safe amount of brood comb to replace any year. Some hives will do more, some cannot even do that. Swarms are quite happy to do a lot more. Additional foundation can be placed in the supers, and used later in the brood chamber if drawn, however, if wax foundation is not drawn the first time it is put out, it tends to get ruined -- warped and broken -- so we restrict ourselves to what we know the bees will do for sure. Plastic frames and foundation allow for putting more sheets in the supers, because it can come and go from the field several times without damage and loss of attractiveness. (It isn't attractive in the first place :) In my area, an agressive brood comb building program undertaken without great care and understanding can be beekeeping suicide. FWIW ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Mar 1996 14:06:53 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Eric Abell Subject: Re: Price of jumagillin At 11:03 AM 3/7/96 -0500, you wrote: >I heard that the price of fumagillin was supposed to increase. Would >anybody know what the price is right now in North America ? > > On February 28 I purchased some at the Alberta Honey Producers Co-op: 9.5g Fumigilin -B $84.50 + tax Eric Eric Abell Gibbons, Alberta Canada (403) 998 3143 eabell@compusmart.ab.ca ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Mar 1996 08:39:44 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Periodic Posting - Previous discussion archives, etc. Contents: 1.) Web access to BEE-l 2.) Email access to historical BEE-L discussions 3.) Dave Clayton's Booklist now on website There are two ways now to read back issues of BEE-L. ~~~~~~~~ 1. ) BEE-l can presently be read on the Worldwide Web by pointing your brouser at http://www.internode.net:80/~allend/index.html. A list of pointers to other beekeeping sites is there as well. The National (USA) Honey Board Database is also there to brouse or download. The logs are actually now located on Sunsite courtesy Adam F. If you have web access, either by PPP and a graphical brouser or by lynx (a UNIX brouser available on many UNIX shell accounts by typing the command 'lynx'), this is the fast, simple way to go. 2.) For those with no web access, logs are also available quite conveniently by email from LISTSERV@CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU However they only go back to 1994. Due to the increasing size of recent logs and limited space on the LISTSERV, the older logs have been displaced. To have a BEE-L log emailed to you: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Just send a message with no subject (subject lines are ignored) to LISTSERV@uacsc2.albany.edu with the message GET BEE-L LOGMMYY Where MM is the month (ie. 05 for May) and YY is the year (ie. 95 for 1995). Additional logs requested can be added on up to four more lines in your message. Be aware of the spacing of the words (No space in LOG9505, for example). Leave out any other text -- such as .signatures. Additional text - other than lines with additional commands -- will trigger harmless error messages from the LISTSERV. The log will arrive some time later in your mailbox. Warning: logs can be as much 650 K in size! 3. Dave Clayton and friends have compiled a new beekeeping book list which is now at my www site: http://www.internode.net/~allend/booklist.html We expect this list will grow and add features in the future. Please contribute your ideas and comments to: Dave Clayton Note: To ensure more compact future logs, please edit the quotes in your contributions to BEE-L - and leave off vanity signatures - thanks. Regards ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Mar 1996 10:50:43 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Bill Miller Subject: Re: plastic frames No thoughts on how to get plastic frames and foundation clean, but as to the second question, I would be very careful about irradiating plastic frames. While you won't end up with radioactive frames, some plastics change with irradiation. You could end up with frames too brittle to use. Suggest you try a few frames as a test and see what happens (and also contact your frame supplied to find out exactly what plastic they are made from). W. G. Miller Gaithersburg, MD ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Mar 1996 12:02:06 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: Re: (Fwd) Re: Recycle your Brood Combs? In-Reply-To: <199603090414.AA08070@internode.net> > > Just thought I'd put my two cents in regarding the replacement of > combs. > Basicly , I love the idea of reducing disease by such a simple, > chemical free method. I also like the looks of nice light new combs. > But I just haven't seen significant difference between hives with > ancient combs and hives with all new combs. They winter about the same, > produce about the same, and I don't see that the new ones have a lower incidence of disease. I don't understand it but this has been my experience. > We have always started new colonies with four frame nucs from our > overwintered colonies. Could it be that I am always infecting my > increase with the frames in the nuc so the benifit is lost? > > bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb b > b b > Vince & Carole Coppola vcoppola@epix.net b b > Coppola Apiaries, (716)965-2904 b > b 10220 Bradigan Rd. b b > Forestville, N.Y. 14062 b b > b b > Queens bred for tracheal mite resistance b b > Honey , Pollination b b > Western New York Beekeepers Association b b > b > bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb > > bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb b b b Vince & Carole Coppola vcoppola@epix.net b b Coppola Apiaries, (716)965-2904 b b 10220 Bradigan Rd. b b Forestville, N.Y. 14062 b b b b Queens bred for tracheal mite resistance b b Honey , Pollination b b Western New York Beekeepers Association b b b bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Mar 1996 14:00:16 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: JOHN ROMANIK Subject: Re: plastic frames > No thoughts on how to get plastic frames and foundation clean, but as to the > second question, I would be very careful about irradiating plastic frames. > While you won't end up with radioactive frames, some plastics change with > irradiation. You could end up with frames too brittle to use. > > Suggest you try a few frames as a test and see what happens (and also contact > your frame supplied to find out exactly what plastic they are made from). > > W. G. Miller > Gaithersburg, MD > In getting my Perico plastic frames cleaned after freezing them and scraping all I can of the dark comb, I soak the frames in a solution of NaOH(lye) (drayno) and get out the remainder of the pieces. If a few are left, I had good acceptance by the bees in building new comb during the honey flow. JR. ************************************************ John Romanik BBKM #l03 3200 Pine Orchard Lane Ellicott City, Maryland 21042 email jr0002@epfl2.epflbalto.org 15 miles west of Baltimore 39 degrees north of the Equator *************************************************o.org ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Mar 1996 12:35:08 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kevin & Ann Christensen Subject: Re: Recycle your Brood Combs? ---------- From: Allen Dick[SMTP:allend@INTERNODE.NET] Sent: Saturday, March 09, 1996 6:18 AM To: Multiple recipients of list BEE-L Subject: Re: Recycle your Brood Combs? Comb building beyond a point is hard on bees most times of the year and has a cost in honey production. In some years, a lot of comb can be built. In other years, little can be accomplished. For me, 10% (average) is a safe amount of brood comb to replace any year. Some hives will do more, some cannot even do that. Swarms are quite happy to do a lot more In my area, an agressive brood comb building program undertaken without great care and understanding can be beekeeping suicide. I agree that one must be careful when replacing brood comb, especially = if this involves adding foundation to the brood chambers. We do put in = foundation, but only in the spring, if and when the willows and = dandelions are there to support comb building. This might not happen = every year. For example, on a spring when the willows freeze. We usually introduce foundation twice: during the first and second = reversal of the brood chambers. (sounds like lots of work, doesn't it?) Depending on the strenght of = the hive, we will introduce 0, 1 or 2 frames into the box placed on top = after reversal. It is important to place the foundation in the 2nd = position from the edge so that you don't separate the brood nest. We = have found success doing it this way. When we go around to reverse the = second time, we will add foundation to the other box *if conditions are = right for it." Kevin Christensen ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Mar 1996 19:27:31 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Dave Green, Eastern Pollinator Newsletter" Subject: Re: Apitherapy with a JOLT! In a message dated 96-03-08 14:24:32 EST, you write: >From: danb@BLKBOX.COM: >The correct zip is 28173. My parents are stationed there, so I notice >these little things. :-) >Cynthia Buchsbaum > Thank you Cynthia for correcting my typo, and my apologies to the rest. My wife talked with them by telephone; she's going to get one to try They are willing to take orders from the public by regular mail only. The cost is $15 plus shipping. (I'd send $20.) This is not their regular thing, and they are not out to make a profit. Their job is to make things a little easier for Christian missionaries working in the remotest parts of the world. If they take a while, I'd be understanding. They have one person who makes these devices. He does not have an e-mail address. The contact and mailing address are: Jungle Aviation and Radio Service (JAARS), c/o Paul Bartholomew 5707 Davis Rd. Waxhaw, NC 28173-0248 USA. I requested comments from the scientific community. Aside from Cynthia's address correction, the silence is deafening. My curiosity is growing. Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green, PO Box 1200, Hemingway, SC 29554 ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Mar 1996 20:38:26 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Bill Miller Subject: Imirie Shim Imirie Shims (invented by George Imirie) are wood frames with the outside dimensions of a hive body, and about 3/4 inch tall. A 3/8" by 2" notch is cut into one of the narrow sides. Imirie Shims are used to provide an additional hive entrance during the honeyflow, and during requeening by the "nuc" method. A more detailed description of how the Imirie Shim is used is in this year's Brushy Mountain catalog, and I believe somebody posted a copy of the description on BEE-L last night. George does not have a computer, but I will be glad to take any comments to him if you wish, and will post his replies. W. G. Miller Gaithersburg, MD ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Mar 1996 20:08:27 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Doug Yanega Subject: an important question for other list members Comments: cc: polpal-l@listserv.uoguelph.ca Apologies for this, I'll try to keep it as brief as possible, given its potential importance - and others here may well benefit from some info... I received two direct e-mail Spams (mass-mailings) today, both from "multi-level marketing" (MLM) entrepreneurs. These folks engage in marginally legal, and plainly unethical Pyramid-type activities which typically involve buying lists of names (nowadays mostly e-mail lists, when it used to be mailing addresses) and then trying to recruit people on that list to join the Pyramid. The fact that I received two in one day suggests that someone has obtained a list with my e-mail address, and as their preferred targets are listserv lists, THIS LIST may have been "tapped" by MLMers. Most of you may not be aware, but a few days ago, there was a rash of false listserv subscriptions, all across the Internet. There is a chance (yes, this is speculation, but there's a good reason for it) that these false subscriptions were simply so MLMers could subscribe, send a REVIEW command to the listservs, and get complete lists of subscribers. I'm not saying this *did* happen, only that it might have. Now, if I were to ask everyone on this list who has suddenly started to receive MLM Spam in their personal mail to write back to me, and I'm *right*, my mailbox will get flooded. Likewise if I asked you to write back to the list (DO NOT!). Instead I'll make the following requests: (1) if you have received such messages (see below), and your last name begins with "B", then send me an e-mail. Maybe we can figure out if any of these listservs have been tapped, and this will help coordinate anti-spam measures. (2) Never simply delete such messages - consider what happens if these "marketing" techniques proliferate. Today you receive two 2-page Spams. Next it's up to a dozen a week, then 3 dozen, then 100, and ultimately it could well reach the point where simply *having* an e-mail account guarantees that you will receive several thousand advertisements a week. Bearing in mind the Internet *is* international, the odds are virtually zero that legislation will ever exist to prevent this. Only concerted pressure from Internet *users* can ever preserve the Internet for our use, so we MUST complain, and prevent direct e-mail marketing from *ever* being profitable. The problem is knowing *where* to complain, since many Spammers use forged addresses and mail paths (and some intentionally alter them so as to point blame at innocent third parties), or run their OWN sites. The only effective complaints are those directed to whomever *supplies* the Spammers with their Internet connections. Those of you with access to Usenet newsgroups should, if you EVER receive mass mailings, chain letters, etc., refer to the newsgroup news.admin.net-abuse.misc to see if others have already complained about that particular mailing. By posting a message there (with the forwarded headers of the Spam attached) and asking where complaints should be directed, you can find out an appropriate course of action. If you do not have Usenet access, then complaints about a Spammer such as nobody@direct.com should go to root@direct.com, for example - but be polite, since it could be forged and you wouldn't know (see below). A few providers such as aol.com and netcom.com have an "abuse@" address you can complain to. (3) Inform other people (but not by mass-mailing, of course) to take similar actions - spread the word. The Net is self-policing, so we can only maintain control if we ALL do our part. It's that simple. Here's one that I got: >Comments: Authenticated sender is >From: D.G.@server.iadfw.net >To: succes49@server.iadfw.net >Date: Sat, 9 Mar 1996 11:24:54 +0000 >Subject: You may find this interesting >Reply-to: succes49@airmail.net >Priority: normal In this case, the sender has been authenticated, so complaints to root@airmail.net would be best, while "iadfw.net" might not work. I haven't checked yet - this could be a site run by MLMers - but I have a standing message posted to see if anyone can confirm the place to complain. The other I got was: >Date: Sat, 9 Mar 96 13:51:17 UT >From: "Sam Meltzer" >To: dyanega@denr1.igis.uiuc.edu >Subject: Amazing!! And I have confirmed already (others have complained about this one) that root@msn.com is where to complain. Sorry to waste more space on this...but I've been on the Net too long to sit quietly while others work to render it useless for its original purpose. I think I'm turning into Howard Beal... ;-) Sincerely, Doug Yanega Illinois Natural History Survey, 607 E. Peabody Dr. Champaign, IL 61820 USA phone (217) 244-6817, fax (217) 333-4949 affiliate, Univ. of Illinois Urbana-Champaign, Dept. of Entomology http://www.inhs.uiuc.edu:80/~dyanega/my_home.html "There are some enterprises in which a careful disorderliness is the true method" - Herman Melville, Moby Dick, Chap. 82 ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Mar 1996 18:20:08 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Essential Oils. In-Reply-To: <199603082113.QAA28059@segwun.muskoka.net> On Fri, 8 Mar 1996, David Eyre wrote: > Regarding the following, I make no claims! > I have been asked to post this to the list. It came to me from Simpson's Bee > Supplies in Danville, Ohio. > Essential Oil Treatments for Varroa. > Spearmint Oil, added to sugar syrup at the rate of 15 drops per > quart. To be fed to the bees at Spring and Fall. > Wintergreen Oil, added to sugar syrup at the rate of 80 drops per > quart. The cluster to be sprayed with a fine nozzle spray and to wet thoroughly. > Teatree Oil, placed on a tray beneath the cluster 8-10 drops. The > evaporation through the hive repeated as necessary. > > These treatments were brought to my attention recently. I know there > has been work done on essential oil treatments. Does anybody wish to comment? > David, We have a beekeeper here in Washington state that sprays his bees in the fall with a few drops of peppermint extract in light sugar water.HIs claim is, no problem with the tracheae mite. No mention of helping out with Varroa Word to the wise.Some of the mint can get into plastic and it will not come out.I learned that first hand. I was backpacking way up in the Olympic mountains years ago and a lady that liked to live off of the land in the summer. Gave my wife and myself some alfalfa mint tea to have after a trout dinner. I had my plastic cup for ten years after that and never did get rid of the mint smell and now and than you could get a faint taste of the mint in clean mountain water. I think I have stated before that we need to support our researchers and keep them out in front. They can keep us out of trouble.You are doing the right thing to help beekeepers. Breeding bees that can handle the mite.We need to push and get as many people as we can to help get funds for the USDA and researchers. I don't think that the Almound growers want to start to make furniture in a few years. Enough said. Clean Honey and a Happy World Roy ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Mar 1996 19:34:04 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Gunnar Thygesen Organization: Micro Computer User Group Subject: Re: Recycle your Brood Combs? In-Reply-To: Pine.LNX.3.91.960309063157.3770A-100000@apis.rhein.de In a message to Gunnar Thygesen, bahr@APIS.RHEIN.DE (2:11015/1001.0) wrote: B> B> B> B> B> B> Apparently-to: gunnar@MCUG.PING.DK B> From: "Rudolf E. Bahr" Subject: Re: Recycle B> your Brood Combs? B> On Fri, 8 Mar 1996, David Eyre wrote: >> Robert Rice wrote >>>If everyone adopted the habit of recycling brood combs on a 5 or 6 >>>year basis then there would be a lot less disease in our hives and >>>consequently a lot less chemical control. For all diseases there is >>>a minimal infective dose which must be reached before a disease >>>will establish itself. If you can stay below this thresh hold then >>>a disease outbreak is highly unlikely. >> >> What a rush! I was really pleased to see this post!! The view has >> always been,' the queen prefers to lay in dark comb' and through >> the years I have seen some disgustingly black stuff. We try to >> change one third every year. >> Last year we had a speaker from Denmark who is on the >> Buckfast breeding program, and they change all frames every year. >> Mind you they also have a steam cleaning process where they send >> all their boxes and frames for de-waxing and cleaning. The wax is >> then recycled into foundation. >> **************************************************** >> B> Yes, I am very pleased too! Though the bees seem to be attracted B> by dark combs, I think, it's very important to recycle them B> regularly. Until now I never heard about changing all frames every B> year, but that's doubtlessly good. That means putting the bees on B> new frames at oince and supporting this action by feeding B> liquidly. Also pollen should be available in nature. The old brood B> combs as a whole are given to another colony, at the bottom. B> It's nice to observe, the queen just begins to lay eggs, when the B> cells did'nt have got yet their final length. One thing seems to B> be important: Not to recycle completely too late in the year, the B> new frames should be breeded oince. They then seem to be warmer to B> the bees in winter. B> Yes, for dewaxing and cleaning frames we use a steempot. Those B> pots are available to hobby beekeepers too. In a size to contain B> the frames of one hive they will cost circa 800 US $. We make B> candles out of the wax or change it for new wax walls (expression B> ?, surely you know what I mean). B> Regards, B> R.E.Bahr B> NISI APES FINIS B> --- One word more from Denmark but not from the speaker who is on the Buckfast breeding program. I am sure he also told taht it has been forbidden for many years to use medications of bees in Denamrk. So no use of Terramycin and Fumidil and foulbrood is rather rare in Denmark. All because an hygienic management of beekeeping. Remember that old brood combs are dunghills. Not everybody change their brood combs every year but for sure a brood comb removed from a hive does not go back into any hive even if it has been used by the queen only once. -- | Internet: gunnar@mcug.ping.dk (Fidonet: Gunnar Thygesen 2:235/15.32) | Micro Computer User Group (MCUG) ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Mar 1996 04:14:31 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Robert Aboumitri Subject: Literature on beekeeping. Hello everybody: I suscribed to BEE-L a week ago due to my increasing interest in beekeeping. My father was a beekeeper for almost 30 years. He passed away 2 years ago and my mother sold all the hives. I'm very interested in keeping my own bees since I have a lot of equipment that used to belong to my dad. My request to everybody out there is to give me as much information about ***====literature on beekeeping and where it could be found====*** I need to educate myself as much as possible on the subject before I start my new venture, my Masters degree in Anglophone Translation did not teach me anything about beekeeing. Any additional information other than literature would be most welcomed. I thank you in advance. ROBERT. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Mar 1996 22:48:59 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Keith G. Benson" Subject: mini, baby, and micro nucs Hello Bee-Liners, I called Apicon today to inquire about some polystyrene and/or wood mini, baby, and micro nucs that they were carrying for the last couple of years and was told that they didn't find there to be enough demand to continue stocking them. I was hoping someone here might know where I might find a commercially produced nuc that uses 1/2 to 1/3 length frames. Thank you for any help Keith Benson ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Mar 1996 02:30:07 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kay Clay-Dewey Subject: Re: Importance of Bee characteristics-Survey 1) Enter a number (1-11) after each of the following characteristics, ranking them by their importance to you. Most important, 1 , next most important, 2 , etc. Winterability- 11 Honey Production- 5 Tracheal mite resistance- 2 Varroa resistance- 1 Chalkbrood- 6 Aggressiveness- 7 Colour- 10 Brood viability- 3 Swarming- 9 Comb stability- 4 Pollen- 8 2)You are (check one) Hobby beekeeper (<10 col.) Side liner (>10<300 col.) |x| Commercial (>300 col.) 3)You are (check all appropriate) Honey producer |x| Pollinator Queen producer 4)You are in (check one) North America|x| Europe Other ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Mar 1996 09:34:51 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "my name is Dean M. Breaux" Subject: Re: mini, baby, and micro nucs Comments: To: kgbenson@facstaff.wisc.edu >I was hoping someone here might know where I might find a >commercially produced nuc that uses 1/2 to 1/3 length frames. >Thank you for any help >Keith Benson Hello Bee Liners I have some used baby nucs here that I would be happy to get rid of cheap. I used the nucs that you spoke of and while they worked fine they were High priced. If you needed a large qty. Bob with apicom will order them for you I am sure. Back to the nuc issue $2 each you arange for shipping. I have about Two Hundred Duplex baby nucs. I can not tell you where to find a baby nuc made in the states. We raise a lot of queens here at Hybri-Bees and St. Ambrose Apiary's and do not find that small mini nucs are cost effective in the long run. You would be better off to use the equipment that you have at your disposal and go with that. you can use deep brood boxes and split them four ways or two frames to a box we run three frame 6 5/8 nucs here almost year round and have very little maintance. When we are done with them we just combine them and make hives out of them. Just about two frames of bees will run anywhere to produce quees in. While the baby nucs and mini nucs are cheep in bees they are expensive in the long run. If you still are of a mind to use Mini's You can go to a garden store and buy styrofoam flower pots about 4 inches in dia. make a lid for them out of light wood. put bees and queen cage candy in box with virgin or cell and Bang you got one custom made baby nuc. They work fine, we ran 100 of them one season here. A plus is that you get a lot of wax. The only draw back is that you dont have movable frames. You could make them as well if you wished to have small frames in them. I also have a pattern here that you can use to make Mini and micro mini nuc's yourself. You would think that with the large queen industry we have in the states we would have standard nucs made by someone, but alas we are still horse and buggy along those lines I hope this helps, if I can help in any other way with Queen rearing or nucs just let me know. Dean Breaux Hybri-Bees ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Mar 1996 11:36:09 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Michael L. Wallace" Subject: Re: Apitherapy with a JOLT! At 07:27 3/9/96 -0500, you wrote: >---------------------- Information from the mail header ----------------------- >Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology >Poster: "Dave Green, Eastern Pollinator Newsletter" >Subject: Re: Apitherapy with a JOLT! >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > I requested comments from the scientific community. Aside from Cynthia's >address correction, the silence is deafening. My curiosity is growing. > >Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green, PO Box 1200, Hemingway, SC 29554 > Hello, Everybody, Dave, I appreciate your interest in this subject and your posts on it. It appears that my assumption that it is such a new subject of research, that no one knows anything (on this list anyway), is true. And, it may be that some of our entomoligist friends are, even now, trying to find out some information on this subject and will report back to all of us, soon (hint, hint). We found out about this research, about two years ago, from the head scientist and currator of the Creation Evidences Museum in Granbury, Texas. I can't remember, off-hand, what his name was, but for several years he has been working very closely with the University of Oklahoma on this particular issue, as well as experimenting with the effect on snake venom in a hyperbaric chamber with increased magnetic field. I may need to try to contact him, personally, to get more information. When, and if, I am able to get in contact with him, I will post the information here. Their experimentation, in these areas, is based upon the premise that, in earth's past, the earth's magnetic field was 10 times stronger and that as a result, the earth's atmosphere was denser (higher atmospheric pressure). They believe that under these conditions that not only were the various venoms not harmful to humans, but that they very well could have been beneficial. They're trying to prove their theories. If this is true and they are able to successfully, artificially recreate the conditions under which these processes occur, it could and would, forever, change the face of medicine and scientific theories related to the earth's past. I haven't talked to anyone on these issues in a while and am interested to find out their progress. They, also, postulate that the earth's magnetic field is, and has been for thousands of years, collapsing and this is causing a thinning of the earth's atmosphere. We can, certainly, see evidences with all the talk of a thinning ozone layer (and even a small hole in it, over the artic circle) and the increased instances of skin cancer. It's also based upon the fact that the fossilized remains of dinosaurs show a much smaller lung capacity, to body weight, than we have in the animals of today, which would suggest that there had to be an increased atmospheric pressure, in order to obtain enough oxygen, from the atmosphere, to live. They say that the dinosaurs would not be able to exist in the atmosphere of today. I find the subject fascinating, as you can tell by my rambling. I know that all of that is not related to beekeeping and entomology, but it was such knowledge that led me to my original question. I'm anxious to see if there may be a correlation, here, that can be beneficial to people being treated with apitherapy. I know that bee venom is being used in conjunction with electrophoresis and ultrasonophoresis. So, if any of you scientists, entomologists, chemists or whatever, have any knowledge, please share it with us. Or, if you have contacts, in the scientific community, that we might be able to talk to about this issue, let us know. Well, I guess I'm finished babbling for now. Regards, Mike Wallace Bkeeper1@why.net McKinney, Texas USA ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Mar 1996 13:47:38 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Bernard Subject: Imirie Shim Just to help clarify: An Imirie shim is essentially the wooden frame portion of a queen excluder (ie a wooden queen excluder with the metal mesh removed) with an dado cut for an entrance notch . The rest is as Bill Miller stated. George Imirie is a long time beekeeper in Maryland. >Date: Sat, 9 Mar 1996 20:38:26 -0500 >From: Bill Miller >Subject: Imirie Shim > >Imirie Shims (invented by George Imirie) are wood frames with the outside >dimensions of a hive body, and about 3/4 inch tall. A 3/8" by 2" notch is >cut into one of the narrow sides. > >Imirie Shims are used to provide an additional hive entrance during the >honeyflow, and during requeening by the "nuc" method. A more detailed >description of how the Imirie Shim is used is in this year's Brushy Mountain >catalog, and I believe somebody posted a copy of the description on BEE-L >last night. > >George does not have a computer, but I will be glad to take any comments to >him if you wish, and will post his replies. > >W. G. Miller >Gaithersburg, MD David Bernard Vice President, Maryland State Beekeepers EAS Master Beekeeper Damascus,MD USA ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Mar 1996 11:53:27 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Stan Umlauft Subject: Re: Imirie Shim You Wrote: Imirie Shims (invented by George Imirie) are wood frames with the outside dimensions of a hive body, and about 3/4 inch tall. A 3/8" by 2" notch is cut into one of the narrow sides. Imirie Shims are used to provide an additional hive entrance during the honeyflow, and during requeening by the "nuc" method. A more detailed description of how the Imirie Shim is used is in this year's Brushy Mountain catalog, and I believe somebody posted a copy of the description on BEE-L last night. My Reply: Having a second enterance between the bottom and second supers seems like a good idea. However, by providing an extra 3/4 inch of space between supers you will create a mess with comb built between the frames above and below. Why not just make your 3/8 X 2 notch in the bottom of the super its self. Then you could just plug it against robbing, or when it's not in use. The concept is good though as it provides extra ventilation, and allows field bees to bypass brood area. -- Best Wishes, Stan Umlauft Bay Point, CA USA stanu@honeybee.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Mar 1996 11:52:32 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Bruce Hamilton Subject: Bee Literature In his book,"Beekeeping, The Gentle Craft", the author, John F. Adams, refers to a poem titled, "Telling the Bees" by Emily Dickinson. I have searched everywhere for it, and have not been able to find it; so I am beginning to think that the author might be wrong. I have searched the bee quotations, on the Beekeepers Home page, with no luck, and a search of the title, on the internet only lead me to another poet,John Greenleaf Whittier, but no poem. If anyone knows the poem, I would love to clear up this mystery. Bruce Hamilton (Cererbral Bee-Keeper) Vancouver, BC, Canada Bruce_Hamilton@mindlink.bc.ca ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Mar 1996 12:00:03 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: LARUET@ULVACS.ULAVERNE.EDU Subject: NOSEMA DISEASE I am trying to locate pertinent information about Nosema disease in bees I would greatly appreciate it if someone could give me a clue as to some possible resources. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 10:52:23 +1200 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Mark Goodwin Organization: HortResearch,Ruakura,NZ Subject: Sugar syrup and pollination Sugar syrup has been used in tree different ways to attempt to enhance pollination. 1) Feeding scented syrup to direct bees ( ex K. v. Frisch 1930s - 1950s) 2) Spraying sugar syrup on trees to attract bees (ex Minderhound and Roberts (1948 - 1950ish) 3) Feeding syrup inside hives to convert nectar collectors to pollen gathers (ex J. B Free 1965 - ) I am interested in any information on, if and where any of the above methods are currently used. I am also looking for any early (< 1948) (popular or otherwise) references to spraying crops with sugar syrup. Any help would be greatly appreciated Regards Mark Mark Goodwin Hort Research Ruakura Research centre Private Bag 3123 Hamilton New Zealand EMAIL MGoodwin@HORT.CRI.NZ Phone 64 07 838 5049 Fax 64 07 838 5085 ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Mar 1996 16:58:48 +0000 Reply-To: James.Peterson.2@m.k12.ut.us Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: James Peterson Organization: UtahLink Subject: New Queen Help! I have 5 booming Hives and one without a queen. (no eggs!) can any one out there ship me a queen? Are Buckfast queens ready? If not, I will take any thing else. The hive has a goodly amount of bees . Could I take some brood from one of the other hives and let them make a queen. I fear if it worked it would take to long to make, find a drone etc. James Peterson 801-756-3826 when I am not on Internet. call collect if you can ship a queen. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Mar 1996 17:20:17 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Stan Umlauft Subject: New Queen Hi All: To: James.Peterson.2@m.k12.ut.us {Q}: Could I take some brood from one of the other hives and let them make a queen? {A}: Yes, with 16 days from egg to queen, this seems like your best bet. It's a little early to get good queens on short notice. Make shure you have ample young bees, pollen, and honey next to the young introduced brood. If you shake in extra young bees ( the ones from the brood area) make shure you don't get the queen. Also smoke both colonies heavy (cool & heavy, not hot), before and after shaking to aviod fighting. The older workers will go right back home so bee generous. {Q}: I fear if it worked it would take to long to make, find a drone etc. {A}: No fear, and since the Queen mates in flight out away from the hive, and you say there are other bees around, if you've had nice weather, and decent bloom there in Utah, you should have plenty of drones. -- Best Wishes, Stan Umlauft Bay Point, CA USA stanu@honeybee.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Mar 1996 18:19:38 +0000 Reply-To: James.Peterson.2@m.k12.ut.us Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: James Peterson Organization: UtahLink Subject: queen needed got help and now I get to experiment! happy days ! Also, In my stuper I gave my son"s phone number rather than mine. (801 7560648) and now I"m in the "dog house" with my bees in his book. Thanks for the great help, Dean. James Peterson ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 00:59:20 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "(Kevin & Shawna Roberts)" Subject: Re: mini, baby, and micro nucs Hi Dean- I'm interested to hear that you have found that mini-nucs are not cost effective for you in the long run. Why is that? Where I live, queen breeders often use baby nucs in the early, cool spring to produce queens for the peak market. They then gradually incorporate five-frame nucs as hot weather approaches and market demand decreases. Some breeders here compromise by using intermediate size nucs (duplex or four-way, medium depth) during the entire breeding season. Is this what works best for you? Kevin Roberts Hollister, California ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 11:05:49 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jean-Marie Van Dyck Subject: Replacing frames Hello Bee-Liners ! On Sat Mar 9, 1996 Allen Dick[SMTP:allend@INTERNODE.NET] > For me, 10% (average) is a safe amount of brood comb to replace any > year. Some hives will do more, some cannot even do that. Swarms are > quite happy to do a lot more Kevin & Ann Christensen wrote as they do I quite agree, in beekeeping it's nothing automatically applied to the whole apiary. But IMO, each year, one *must change* some brood chamber combs. In our area (50D North) we do this in the spring when the day time is really increasing (Apr 15-June 15). After that combs building become more difficult and honey consuming. A good idea is to use an honey crop: at this time, with my buckfast bees, it costs no honey - on the contrary, it's a harvesting stimulus : importance to comprehend the bee cluster ecology ! As I use honey supers with different frames (Dadant) I'm usually putting 2 or 3 new centered foundations each time I add a new super. I try to run with frames no more than 5 years old : the super frames becomes also darker after some years ... and clear (robinia) honey becomes darker in this combs. Regards Jean-Marie Local blooming informations ... Lat.Long. : N:50.30' E:04.56' - Alt. : 200 m - North sea : 200 km Two days of cold but sunny time (max 11DC) : all the colonies are flying One was queenless (more dead and sound different) but I introduced without problem one of my reserved queen: she was on a 10 cm open brood. First yellow crocus and hazel pollen. Amazing. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Jean-Marie Van Dyck Fax +32 81 72 42 72 B.P. 102 email : jmvandyck@quick.cc.fundp.ac.be B-5000 NAMUR(Belgium) Medical school - Biochemistry dept Sorry for my poor english : Je parle francais ! ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 08:46:45 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: Re: Importance of Bee characteristics-Survey In-Reply-To: Response to this was not as good as I hoped so I am posting for a second and last time. Pse do not re-submitt. If anything needs to be clarified drop me a note. > > > Two years ago Dr. Nasr of Ontario took a survey of the importance of bee > > chacacteristics to beekeepers. I thought it would be interesting to do > > the same here on BEE-L. If you are interested in participating just fill > > out the following and mail it back to me direct, not to the net. I will > > tally the responses and post the results to BEE-L. Thank you. > > > > 1) Enter a number (1-11) after each of the following characteristics, > > ranking them by their importance to you. Most important, 1 , next most > > important, 2 , etc. > > > > Winterability- > > Honey Production- > > Tracheal mite resistance- > > Varroa resistance- > > Chalkbrood- > > Aggressiveness > > Colour- > > Brood viability- > > Swarming- > > Comb stability- > > Pollen- > > > > 2)You are (check one) Hobby beekeeper (<10 col.) > > Side liner (>10<300 col.) > > Commercial (>300 col.) > > > > 3)You are (check all appropriate) Honey producer > > Pollinator > > Queen producer > > > > 4)You are in (check one) North America > > Europe > > Other ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 07:24:41 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Re: Replacing frames > But IMO, each year, one *must change* some brood > chamber combs. In our area (50D North) we do this in the spring > when the day time is really increasing (Apr 15-June 15). After that > combs building become more difficult and honey consuming. A good > idea is to use an honey crop: at this time, with my buckfast bees, > it costs no honey - on the contrary, it's a harvesting stimulus : > importance to comprehend the bee cluster ecology ! This is a good point. There is a time for everything, and spring is the time for foundation. Not only does it cost nothing at this time, but a few frames of foundation near or in the brood chamber may delay or prevent swarming. In June in our area, the young bees are many and they want to cluster and build comb. They have wax and want to use it. They build beauitiful combs. Only a few weeks later, many hives will lose interest in foundation. Anyone who has run baby nucs will be amazed at the amount of comb small colonies can build. Nucs will make perfect combs if they are handled right and kept supplied with feed. Regards Allen W. Allen Dick, Beekeeper VE6CFK RR#1, Swalwell, Alberta Canada T0M 1Y0 Internet:dicka@cuug.ab.ca & allend@internode.net Honey. Bees, & Art ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 12:26:08 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Diana Sammataro Subject: Re: RAPDs If you have any questions, let me know. good luck DNA EXTRACTION Bees & Mites H. Ferguson, Nov. 1994 D. Sammataro NOT FOR PUBLICATION, INFORMATION ONLY Feb. 1996. 1. Freeze sample with little or no liquid. Grind insect in glass or plastic grinder with Longmire's lysis buffer. If using bees, use one thorax. If mites, 1-100 mites will give good results. Final Vol =89 400ul. Note: You can also microwave sample, dry or in 10ul Longmire's for 1-4 min, grind in lysis buffer. 2. Pipet 1:100 dilution of Proteinase K (10 mg/ml), approximately 4ul into each sample and shake the tubes. 3. Incubate at 65C for 1-2 hours. 4. Add 56 ul 8M KoAc and put on ice for 30m to bring the cellular debris dow= n. 5. Centrifuge, making sure that the tubes are balanced, and spin them down for 10 m. 6. Using disposable plastic transfer pipette, remove TOP (clear) portion and squirt it into a newly labeled tube. 7. Add 0.5/ vol isopropanol and let stand at RT for 8 min (apprx. 250=B5l). 8. Shake, then centrifuge again for 8 m. 9. Decant and wash precipitate with 70% cold ethanol (-20C); centrifuge 10 min. Dry overnight or with vacuum dryer. 10. Resuspend in 50-100ul TE O/N. Heat for 5 min at 65C to kill DNAase. Note: Procedure produces lots of RNA, so treat with RNAase if this is a problem. Longmire's lysis buffer: RT storage of DNA material (Blood, mites, bees etc= .) =46inal [Conc]: Use to make: 100 mM Tris pH 8.0 50ml 2M Tris pH8.0 100 mM EDTA 200ml 0.5M EDTA 10 mM NaCl 2ml 5M NaCl 0.5% SDS 50ml 10% SDS 0.2g Na Azide. 0.2g Na Azide 698ml dH20 Synergel (1.6%): 0.5x TBE Synergel Agarose 100 ml 0.55g 0.7g 200ml 1.1g 1.4g 250 1.38g 1.75g NOT FOR PUBLICATION Date: Tue, 6 Jun 1995 18:09:33 -0500 (CDT) To: Diana Sammataro cc: Clay Comstock Clay Comstock Dickinson State University Dickinson, ND 58601 Subject: Re: RAPDs 1. Grind spiders in a 1.5 tube using disposible transfer pipets. 2. Add 500ul SDS Extraction Buffer 3. Add 20ul Protinase K (20mg/ml) 4. Incubate at 55-60C for 2-5hrs 5. Add 500ul of PC(25:25) 6. Centrifuge 3min 7. Extract top layer and add to new tube containing 500ul of chloroform 8. Centrifuge 3min 9. Extract top layer and add to new tube containing 1000ul of 95% EtOH. Estimate the volume of EtOH and DNA and add 1/10 NaOac 10. Place tubes in freezer overnight 11. Centrifuge at 4C for 15min 12. Decant 95% EtOH and NaOac 13. Add 500ul of 70% EtOH and resuspend pellet 14. Centrifuge at 4C for 15min 15. Decant 70% EtOH 16. Air dry pellet 17. Resuspend pellet in 500ul of TE Buffer Diana Sammataro, Ph.D. The Ohio State University, OARDC/ Dept. Entomology Extension Bee Laboratory, 1680 Madison Avenue Wooster, OH 44691 Phone: (216) 263 3684 Fax: (216) 262 2720 Email: Sammataro.1@osu.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 11:03:35 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: James Graham Subject: STINGLESS BEES Hi, Everyone! I am just beginning as a hobbyist beekeeper. I'm just finishing up some hives, and have an order for packaged bees in the mail. When I was reading about Africanized bees, I came across some information about the stingless bees in Central America, i.e. MELIPONA and TRIGONA. Perhaps someone would be able and willing to answer a few questions for me? a) Do either of these species have potential as honey producers in the United States? I read that at least one of these species produces only a very small amount of honey. I was wondering if they could be developed into an alternative for A. melifera, since they couldn't be "Africanized." Since I live in San Diego, I'm worried about an early end to my new hobby! Hopefully the neighbors won't burn me out. b) If these bees do have such potential, could they be kept in conventional hives, or would new technology have to be developed for them? c) Would amateurs and non-entomologists (I'm a graduate student in Classics) be allowed to breed them and otherwise experiment with them? d) Even if they aren't commercially viable, I think this would be a fun project. Is it possible to get some of the critters to play around with? Excuse me if this issue has already been dealt with on your list--I've only just subscribed. Many thanks in advance! Jim Graham 3515 Fortuna Ranch Road Olivenhain, CA 92024-7214 (619) 756-0051 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 14:35:09 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: Recycle your Brood Combs? >One word more from Denmark but not from the speaker who is on the Buckfast >breeding program. I am sure he also told taht it has been forbidden for many >years to use medications of bees in Denamrk. So no use of Terramycin and >Fumidil and foulbrood is rather rare in Denmark. All because an hygienic >management of beekeeping. Remember that old brood combs are dunghills. Not >everybody change their brood combs every year but for sure a brood comb removed >from a hive does not go back into any hive even if it has been used by the >queen only once. Perhaps it is time we adopted some of these points here in Nth America. I have been saying for some years that we could do more in the selection of bees with natural immunity to the common diseases. But I suppose Varroa and T-mite have overshadowed the other problems!!! **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 14:35:37 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: Literature on beekeeping. >teach me anything about beekeeing. Any additional information other than >literature would be most welcomed. Hi Robert, Here is some info you might like to look at. We do supply other equipment if you should need it. The D.E.Hive by DAVID EYRE My beekeeping experience spans 40 years and 2 Continents. When I came to take up beekeeping here in Canada I was horrified to discover only one hive in production. My beekeeping has been based on a number of hives, some I 've loved and some I've hated. The Langstroth is regretfully not one of the ones I've loved. So I decided if I can't buy one, I'll make my own. With all this in mind I set to and designed a hive with the following parameters. >From the ground up I needed a system which would, and does, improve matters for both the bees and beekeeper. A new hive stand, low on the ground, for both security and weatherproofing, to provide dead air space under the hive floor. A new hive floor, which had to be lighter. Square boxes for better wintering, a round cluster will be a better fit in a square than a rectangle. Lighter frames and standard size foundation to fit regular extractors. A better Queen excluder, easier to clean. Shallow honey supers as standard. A better inner cover and finally a controllable ventilation system, this being the main feature. We have succeeded beyond all our dreams. The D.E. Hive is now in it's fifth season and the results are truly amazing. The hive produces far more brood and from that quite incredible amounts of honey. Far in excess of Provincial and local averages. The first year it produced 193 lbs. Bear in mind a brand new hive, 3 deeps and 3 shallows to be drawn out. The Provincial average was 61 lbs. They wintered well, came out in Spring, no dysentery, a good dry hive. That year,`93 we took 612 lbs from 2 D.E's an average of 306 lbs. Provincial average was 115 lbs. This year `94 was another good year, we took 120 lbs of buckwheat honey in early July, plus 3 nuc's for Queen rearing and gave them 33 frames of foundation to draw and we still took a total of 190lbs per hive. We should have taken more, but late July-Aug was strange, a dearth of nectar, in fact we had robbing problems in Aug, which is very unusual at that time of year. The amount of produce from these hives is just amazing and the work load for the keeper is not excessive. The deep box or brood box is square 18 x 18. It holds 11 frames, to provide more brood space as I strongly disagree with reducing the amount of frames(from 10 to 9) to make it easier for the keeper. We need more brood space not less, less frames, less bees, less honey. We run our hives on 3 brood boxes, that's 33 frames in total. In early Spring we find a good Queen will be laying in all 3 boxes. Our frames are different, they're thinner wood, longer end lugs for you to hold onto. With the separators it makes for a cleaner hive. You don't need to pry up each frame to get it out as there is virtually no propolis. We use a diagonal one piece wire foundation and with our ventilation there is no need to horizontally wire these frames. The Queen excluder is flat, either zinc or plastic, very easy to clean and without the build up of wax and propolis that you're accustomed to seeing. The Shallow Super is made to the same specs. as the Deep Box, but uses 6" foundation and therefore is much lighter and more manageable for lady apiarists. With the extra large hand holds these are easier on the fingers and back muscles. The Inner Cover is plywood rather than masonite. We have found that the shiny surface of masonite will sweat and the water beads up, this is as true in Winter as in Summer. In Winter the condensation freezes and in the Spring melts and eventually this condensation will drip back into the cluster. Its cleated to provide bee space on both sides and mesh covered holes provide ventilation. We have also provided a Winter top opening, which can be opened and closed as needed. Next is the Ventilation Box. The same as the honey super but with slanted screened holes to provide through ventilation. This works on the same principle as the soffit vents in our houses. The ventilation is controllable, as in the Summer we need maximum ventilation and in the winter it is drastically reduced. The roof has 3 ventilation holes on the front, it's cleated on the inside to make it ride on top of the ventilation box. One to provide a large open area, the same as our attics, two to provide space for feeder pails etc. So much for the mechanics, now to explain our thinking regarding ventilating bee hives. The laws of physics are legion. The two we are interested in are "Hot air rises" and "Hot air takes up moisture". The hot air in the hive rises, takes up the moisture from the air that the bees are busy extracting from the nectar they are bringing in. In your hives because they are sealed in the hot wet air has nowhere to go. Now the bees spend hours fanning trying to get it out of the hive. In our hives it gets out through the top of the hive easily and without obstruction. Which now explains our large crops, the hive assists the bees in their efforts. Another point to ponder. If one of the primary causes for swarming, is, amongst other reasons, too much heat. It stands to reason that with a ventilated hive there should be less swarming tendencies. That is what we have found. In four years we haven't had a hive swarm on us. When we examined other hives in our area we noticed a high incidence of chalk brood. Our information states that chalk brood is a fungus caused by damp conditions within the hive. In practice we have proved this to be true! When we added ventilation to a hive with a high proportion of chalk brood, it was only a short time before the chalk brood disappeared and normal healthy brood prevailed. We live in an area where the temp. can go from -30c to +40c, our hives are made to withstand these variances of temperature. They are out in a field with no shade or wind breaks and they're doing just fine. So another of those beekeeping falacies is not true! You do not have to keep bees behind a wind break or with lots of shade. In fact my view is they are better off, if kept in open conditions, the hives will certainly be drier. In conclusion I would like to say. This has to be the Rolls Royce of the hives. If you're a beekeeper rather than a box keeper, you'll like to work these hives. They're easy to open, and much cleaner, you need very little smoke (less disturbance) the bees are healthier and must be happier as they work so hard. So join the revolution and order the latest hive, and enjoy your beekeeping!!! PRICE LIST The D.E.Hive designed and manufactured in Canada from the finest materials, select quality only. All products supplied flat, with assembly instructions in each package. We will assemble for collection customers only, price for assembly on request. COMPLETE STARTER HIVE Select pine outers, Bass wood frames, Roof, Vent box, Inner cover, 1 Shallow super, 1 Deep box, 22 Frames & spacers, Bottom board, Entrance reducer, Hive stand, Queen excluder, Foundation. OUR TOTAL REGULAR PRICE $147.76 F.O.B. ORILLIA. Special Introductory PRICE $100.50 F.O.B. ORILLIA SUPPLIED SINGLY Roof $10.80 Bottom Board $6.40 Vent Box 8.80 Entrance Reducer 1.60 Inner Cover 6.40 Hive Stand 7.20 Shallow Super 12.00 Queen Excluder 13.60 Deep Box 12.80 Foundation 6" per sht .88 Frame Spacers 2.80 Foundation 8" per sht 1.20 (per 22) Quantity Discounts available on request. SHIPPING NOT INCLUDED VIDEO AVAILABLE FOR LOAN ALL PRICES QUOTED IN US FUNDS +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ GENERAL PRICE LIST D.E. Hive starter kit (See individual parts list) $100.50 Langstroth Modification Kit $ 56.00 Cover Clothes (Per Pair) $ 10.00 Hive Top Feeders (D.E. or Lang) $ 18.45 Queen Marking Cages $ 6.50 Varroa Quick Test Kit $ 18.75 Varroa Trap $ 28.50 The New Canadian Beekeeper Videos Volume 1 Parts 1&2 (Summer to Winter) $ 39.95 Volume 2 Parts 1&2 (Spring to Summer) $ 39.95 Volume 3 (Queen Rearing) ready in '96 $ 39.95 Tracheal Mite Resistant Queens (See individual price list) All PRICES quoted in US FUNDS F.O.B. Orillia. Technical information sheets available on all of the above. **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 14:36:06 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: New Queen >To: James.Peterson.2@m.k12.ut.us >From: Stan Umlauft stanu@honeybee.com >{Q}: Could I take some brood from one of the other hives and let >them make a queen? > >{A}: Yes, with 16 days from egg to queen, this seems like your best bet. It's a little early to get good queens on short notice. Make shure you have ample young bees, pollen, and honey next to the young introduced brood. If you shake in extra Once again we have forgotten a most important step. Removal of the emergency cells. At the fourth day, after adding eggs any sealed queen cells must be removed, if not a scrub queen will result, and not be up to standard. Any queen cell sealed before 9 days is from larvae or eggs which are to old, which might account for a number of complaints about queen quality!!! **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 16:13:32 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: Teatree Oil. Since I posted the essential oil information I have a nuber of requests for info. Teatree oil is available from good, health food stores. Our local one sells 10ml for $6.57 and 50ml for $10.75US. They have it in stock, so it is reasonably accesible. There has been little comment!! Hey! you lurkers, get involved, what is your view? You might not think you view is valuable, but this is sharing information, it's how we learn! So come on, if your'e not sure how to e-mail, just ask!!! **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 16:13:41 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: Apology Sorry everyone, my comments to Robert regarding hives was inadvertantly sent to the whole list! This is not my way of doing things! Sorry, once again!! **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 17:43:11 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Stan Sandler Subject: Re: Emily Dickinson poem Perhaps this is the Emily Dickinson poem you are looking for: The pedigree of Honey Does not concern the Bee, Nor lineage of Ecstasy Delay the Butterfly On spangled journeys to the peak Of some perceiveless thing-- The right of way to Tripoli A more essential thing. (Version 2) The Pedigree of Honey Does not concern the Bee-- A Clover, any time, to him, Is Aristocracy-- I'm not much for poetry, and these poems did not exactly thrill me. In fact, I thought this doesn't look so hard, and so: The Breeder's Success Bend close to this one hive my friend And listen what you hear. The sound of mandibles crunching mites Is a music o so dear. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 17:19:57 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kim Flottum Subject: Literature on beekeeping. Hi, I would be happy to send you a sample copy of Bee Culture magazine if you're interested, if you send me your snail mail address. Have fun! Kim Flottum Editor ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 17:34:24 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kim Flottum Subject: Sample magazine copy Hi, I just sent a message to a person regarding a sample copy of our magazine, and sent it to the whole list by mistake. Not something I normally do. So, please disregard the message from Bee Culture (unless you are interested in a sample copy). Kim Flottum Editor, Bee Culture magazine ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 16:43:47 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: RICHARD BARNES Subject: Beekeeping for beginners! The University of California Davis has an ftp site that contains many of the 4-H emtomology project books. The beekeeping section is pretty good for beginners. You will need to download the files and use your word processor to read/print the files. The files are in Wordperfect format (.exe) that are self extracting files and in post script (.ps) format. The files strart with beginner and work up to a project year 8. I have found these to be of great help. Also if you back up one directory (leave off the beekeeping/) you will find other extension information. Read the readme file first to get all the particulars. Beekeeping: ftp://ftp.ucdavis.edu/pub/extension/4h-youth/beekeeping/ Other extension information can be obtained at: ftp://ftp.ucdavis.edu/pub/extension/ Give these locations a try for basic beekeeping information. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 15:46:19 -0700 Reply-To: peaknut@wic.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Sarah Laidlaw Organization: Peak Nutrition Consultants Subject: Re: Literature on beekeeping. Kim - Yes!!!!!! I sent a message to BCULTURE@aol.com or is it bculture? about a month ago. I was particularly interested in getting a subsription AND a copy of the issue that discussed HERBS. It was either the Feb. or Mar. issue. I am in Glade Park, CO, a neighbor of Jim Tipton,s; he also taught our class. This will be my first year. In fact, I was just ourside oiling my hive bodies ad supers with linseed oil. Thanks. Sarah Laidlaw Box 89 Glade Park, CO 81523 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 15:57:57 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Microscopes Tha Alberta Beekeepers Association is co-ordinating purchases (at a discount) of microscopes for mite and nosema detection. Canadian beekeepers interested in participating in this bulk purchase can reply direct to me (NOT the list) for details. Others are welcome, too, but I don't know about duty, shipping, etc. outside Canada. Regards Allen W. Allen Dick, Beekeeper VE6CFK RR#1, Swalwell, Alberta Canada T0M 1Y0 Internet:dicka@cuug.ab.ca & allend@internode.net Honey. Bees, & Art ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 18:46:00 EST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: di5 Subject: Pollination workshop for undergraduate faculty Comments: To: bee-l%albnyvm1.BITNET@cunyvm.cuny.edu Workshop in Plant-Animal Interactions: Flowers and Pollinators The National Science Foundation has funded, through its Undergraduate Faculty Enhancement Program, a workshop designed for faculty in the United States who teach undergraduate students and who are interested in learning research techniques that they can then incorporate in classes and laboratory exercises at their home institutions. This workshop will use flowers and pollinators to investigate a variety of perspectives on plant- animal interactions. The workshop will be taught 9 - 23 August at the Rocky Mountain Biological Laboratory in Gothic, Colorado, by Drs. David Inouye, Carol Kearns, James Thomson, and Nick Waser, with assistance from other researchers in pollination biology who work at the Laboratory. All workshop expenses except travel will be paid for participants by the NSF grant. For more information, please contact Dr. David Inouye, Department of Zoology, University of Maryland, College Park, MD 20742. 301-405- 6946, e-mail: di5@umail.umd.edu. Women, minorities, and persons with disabilities that are not incompatible with field research are encouraged to apply. Applications due 25 April. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 16:03:56 PST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jane Beckman Subject: Re: Emily Dickinson poem Since "Telling the Bees" is an old folk custom of informing the bees of a death in the family, lest they take offense at not being regarded as members of the family, and move elsewhere, there might be a clue to the poem in the title. Whether it's Emily Dickinson, I couldn't say. Jane B. [jane@swdc.stratus.com] ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Mar 1996 01:31:49 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "pats@usa.pipeline.com" Subject: Bee Question Need some info on Suppers I am A new Beekeeper W/four Hives two with double brood chambers, and two with single chambers. What I need to know is what is the correct way to add suppers to your hive? One at a time as some books say or Three AS Mr Imirie . Or is their no correct way. Also I have One of my double Hives Upper Brood Box has Ten full frames of capped Honey, Is that Normal? Can I take Three Of the frames and put them in the freezer and use them in my package Bees when I get them next Month? The Hive is strong. Thanks for any help I can get Ed. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 19:09:15 +0000 Reply-To: James.Peterson.2@m.k12.ut.us Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: James Peterson Organization: UtahLink Subject: Coveralls and veils My 10 year old veil let a bee get in and go for the juglar. Where can I get the "best for the money " veil and coveralls. I read an article by O.B. Wiser in "Gleanings In Bee Culture" July 1992, pp.386-387. He suggests a "cotton mix, complete with the zipper veil" He also liked large plastic Zippers with velcro at both of the ends for a tight fit. This is a feature that appeals to me as I recuperate. The article make a strong claim for round veils. Has anyone bought cotton coveralls from "Brushy Mountain " and been happy? I am going to have to special orde because I am 6"4" and 275 pounds. Please tell me if I have crossed any line of bee-L etticate with my request. Email privately if you thing it would be best. Yours, james.peterson.2@m.k12.ut.us ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 21:37:38 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: John Hempstead Subject: Re: Bee L subscribe At 11:38 AM 3/7/96 -0500, you wrote: >Please add me to the Bee-L ist. > >Susan Cobey >Ohio State University >Dept. of Entomology >1735 Neil Ave. >Columbus, OH 43210 >Tel.(614) 292-7928 >Fax (614) 292 2180 > >Susan, I saw your two messages to BEE-L dated 7 March 1996. I was able to find the "address" and body of the letter requirements for forum. If your message was not acknowledged, it may be useful to do the following: Send an e.mail message to the listserver computer (listserv@uacsc2.albany.edu) . To subscribe, the body of your message must contain the line: SUBSCRIBE BEE-L The "How do I subscribe to ..." message goes on to indicate "Be sure to substitute your real name for the placeholder". I think I put my name into the E-mail subject spot. Just enter those three items. What I did not know was that I would receive a conformation from the computer. The confirmation message required a response within 48 hours so look for this. I hope that I have not cluttered your E-mail in-basket. I wanted to help if possible. I appreciate your work with the carniolans and have enjoyed your talks at the Ohio Beekeepers Association and at the EAS last summer. Best wishes ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 21:33:24 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: BusyKnight Subject: Re: Bee Question > What I need to know is what is the correct way to add suppers >to your hive? One at a time as some books say or Three AS >Mr Imirie . Or is their no correct way. If it's supers of foundation, I'd say just one or two. But if the comb is already drawn out then three is not too many. You mainly want the hive strong enough to combat any wax moths that might try to get a foot hold. > Also I have One of my double Hives Upper Brood Box has Ten >full frames of capped Honey, Is that Normal? In a mild winter (like we've had in Tejas) this is not unusual. > Can I take Three Of the frames and put them in the freezer and >use them in my package Bees when I get them next Month? Yep! BusyKnight Dallas, TX BusyKnight busykngt@airmail.net ICBM INcode:N:32.45'W:96.45' Republic of Texas Space Station - $11 Billion and counting.... And not the FIRST piece of hardware in orbit! ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 19:49:44 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Why do we need a poll on beekeepers wants? Hello Beekeepers, I have been looking through some of nov.95 posts. We were talking about maybe a breeding problem in the USA. There was even a shot or two at some breeders by name.( we really don't need that ) Now we are in march of 96 and Vince Coppola put in a poll for us to show , what was important to us as beekeepers ,with our bees. I wanted to see if Varroa was on top of the list for the group. If you don't mind spending the time and money for chemicals to treat the mite , you don't have a problem with Varroa.We know that apistan will fail in time and we will use something else. My point here is , we Have a problem and we need to get all the attention possible. Vince has given all of us a chance to sign on with what is important to each one of us. Please use this tool. We have researchers that need our help in getting support for there work for us. The squeaky wheel gets the grease. If we get some good high numbers here on Bee-l , then do a poll in each state. Beekeepers do not poll well. I know that for a fact.If they like to keep bees they better take a good look at what will happen when we keep using chemicals. We will have some honey that will have some unwanted chemical in it. Then school is out.I'm in Washington State ,the apple growers are still having problems with Red apples. They had to cut down a lot of there red apple trees and plant green apples , so they could sell them. The chemical atar that was put on the apples to make them red , was the wrong thing to do in the publics eyes.We can really get together now and save ourselves a lot of pain down the road. We have the power , we need just a little help from everyone. Thanks to Vince we have one step in the right direction. To Everyone a Great Year and thank you for your time. Roy Nettlebeck ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 23:08:02 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "R. C. Chapin" Subject: Poem >In his book,"Beekeeping, The Gentle Craft", the author, John F. Adams, refers >to a poem titled, "Telling the Bees" by Emily Dickinson. I have searched >everywhere for it, and have not been able to find it; so I am beginning to >think that the author might be wrong. I have searched the bee quotations, on >the Beekeepers Home page, with no luck, and a search of the title, on the >internet only lead me to another poet,John Greenleaf Whittier, but no poem. > >If anyone knows the poem, I would love to clear up this mystery. > > >Bruce Hamilton (Cererbral Bee-Keeper) See North Carolina Beekeepers' Assn "Yellow Book", 1992-93, p. 25. ENN CEE BEE BUZZ, 1403 VARSITY DR., RALEIGH, NC 27606 Poem (Whittier) is published in full. Dick Chapin Montrose, PA ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Mar 1996 06:54:08 PST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: yad_mord@NETVISION.NET.IL Subject: Help subsceibe Bee-L Can anybody help me with subscribing Bee-L. The method described in the site does not operate, since the listserver "listserv@uacsc2.albany.edu" does not respond to messages. Thanks------------------------------------- Name: Weil Dan E-mail: yad_mord@netvision.net.il Date: 03/12/96 Time: 06:54:08 This message was sent by Chameleon ------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Mar 1996 21:18:16 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Cammie Hughes Subject: Re: Help subsceibe Bee-L >Can anybody help me with subscribing Bee-L. The method described in the site >does not operate, since the listserver "listserv@uacsc2.albany.edu" does not >respond to messages. >Thanks------------------------------------- >Name: Weil Dan >E-mail: yad_mord@netvision.net.il >Date: 03/12/96 >Time: 06:54:08 > >This message was sent by Chameleon >------------------------------------- >Hello, I don't know if this will help but I had the same problem when I tried to subscribe last week. Try sending it to listserv@cnsibm.albany.edu instead of listserv@uacsc2.albany.edu. Type in "ok " That's all. That's what worked for me. Hopefully, it will for you. If not, I'm sorry. Maybe someone else will know what to do. Cammie > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Mar 1996 00:24:24 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Martin Subject: Re: Bee Literature In a message dated 96-03-11 00:03:16 EST, Bruce Hamilton wrote: >In his book,"Beekeeping, The Gentle Craft", the author, John F. Adams, refers >to a poem titled, "Telling the Bees" by Emily Dickinson. I have searched >everywhere for it, and have not been able to find it; so I am beginning to >think that the author might be wrong. I have searched the bee quotations, on >the Beekeepers Home page, with no luck, and a search of the title, on the >internet only lead me to another poet,John Greenleaf Whittier, but no poem. John Greenleaf Whittier (1807-1892) is the author of "Telling the Bees". It refers to the once common belief that if the bees were not told of the beekeeper's death, they would fly away from the hive. (Source: The Enn Cee Bee Buzz, the newsletter of the North Carolina State Beekeepers Association, Dec. 1992.) David Martin (DMartin199@aol.com) Raleigh, NC ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Mar 1996 16:04:08 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jean-Marie Van Dyck Subject: "What's he doing now?" => Nassanof pheromones lure. Subject: "What's he doing NOW?" => Nassanof pheromones lures. (Thanks a lot, Gordon, for your English lesson :-) Hello All ! I prepared my annual provision of tubes containing a Nassanof like compound. It's important to prepare this just at the moment you'll need it because it's volatile and instable. I used a part of the recipe that John B. Free described in his book Social Bee Pheromones, Chapman and Hall, eds, London More details about the discoveries in 2 articles from Boch R and Shearer DA both in Nature(London) : Identification of Geraniol as the active component in Nassanof Pheromone of the Honey Bee Nature 194 (1962) p704-706 Identification of Nerolic and Geranic Acid in the Nassanof Pheromone of the Honey Bee Nature 202 (1964) p320-321 The recipe for 10 tubes: * 1 ml n-hexane * 100 ug (= about 0.1 ml) Citral, mixed isomers (E + Z) * 100 ug (= about 0.1 ml) Geraniol * 100 ug mixed isomers (E+Z) Geranic acid and Nerolic acid As I don't find the last 2 acids, I'm obliged to work without them. Free said it works but not so well that its full formula. Put 0.1 ml of the mixture in a small plastic tube (polyethylene or polypropylene) and close it. I'm using Eppendorf 1.5 ml tubes. A slight lemon like smell! Put the unused tubes in a 'small', 'well closed', 'glas' vessel and put it in the refrigerator or freezer to wait for their use time. Each closed tube is a Nassanof pheromone lure. Geraniol and Citral can be supplied both at the "Sigma Chemical Co" St Louis or at the "Aldrich Co" or at the "ICN" Costa Mesa CA. BTW Does anyone know where it's possible to buy the 2 acids I don't find in my catalogs ? It's important because seems this compounds really increase the efficience of the mixture. TIA Soon ... Jean-Marie ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Mar 1996 07:24:35 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Adony Melathopoulos Subject: RE : Re: STINGLESS BEES Comments: To: James Graham In-Reply-To: James : On Mon, 11 Mar 1996, James Graham wrote: > When I was reading about Africanized bees, I came across some > information about the stingless bees in Central America, i.e. MELIPONA > and TRIGONA. Perhaps someone would be able and willing to answer a > few questions for me? > > a) Do either of these species have potential as honey producers in the > United States? I read that at least one of these species > produces only a very small amount of honey. I was wondering if they > could be developed into an alternative for A. melifera, since they > couldn't be "Africanized." Since I live in San Diego, I'm worried > about an early end to my new hobby! Hopefully the neighbors won't > burn me out. There are stingless bee species in Mexico, but I'm fairly sure there are none in any of the southern states. As Doug Yanega replied about a month ago, pre-European (and thus pre A. melifera) people of the American tropics may have taken the honey from some these species. Even today people raid there nests for honey, and you can buy honey made from Meliponinae bees. The postdoc in our lab came back with some when he was at a meeting in January. The stuff was runny and fermented, so I guess people water it down. I would imagine they do this because either not enough honey can be taken from a nest, or the nests are found too infrequently to get enough (or just poor quality control). > > b) If these bees do have such potential, could they be kept in > conventional hives, or would new technology have to be developed > for them? I don't think this has been done. I have heard they are a bitch to handle. Dr. Mark Winston once told me that when he his worst experience with bees was when he was messing around with a stingless bee colony in French Guiana. They can't sting, but they can bite, and some species are so small that they crawl though any cracks in your gear. > d) Even if they aren't commercially viable, I think this would be a > fun project. Is it possible to get some of the critters to play > around with? I agree, an observation nest would be fun, but I think impossible since they are not endemic to the U.S. I wonder if any of the natural history museums in the states carry displays of uninhabited nests? They are quite a sight, and I may be interested in one for a bee exhibit we are trying to get beefed-up in Vancouver. Any leads ? **************************************** *** Adony Melathopoulos **************** ***** Center for Pest Management ******* ******** Simon Fraser University ******* *********** Burnaby, British Coumbia *** ************** CANADA ****************** **************************************** 'All bees are looking for bargins in nature's supermarket' - Bernd Heinrich e-mail : melathop@sfu.ca tel : (604) 291 4163 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Mar 1996 07:52:25 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Adony Melathopoulos Subject: Re: Essential Oils In-Reply-To: <199603112122.QAA28012@segwun.muskoka.net> David : > There has been little comment!! Hey! you lurkers, get involved, > what is your view? You might not think you view is valuable, but this is > sharing information, it's how we learn! So come on, if your'e not sure how > to e-mail, just ask!!! There has been essential oil research done, most of it in Europe. The most promising work in North America has been done by Nicholas Calderone, who I think has moved on from the Bee Research Laboratory in Beltsville, to Cornell. He has found some promising results using essential oils against honey bee pathogens and mites. His latest work with a thymol, eucalyptus, camphor, menthol blend has looked to be quite effective against Varroa. However, caution must be exercised when putting any essential oils into colonies at this stage in the game. Plants produce these chemicals for a reason, and I suspect a big reason is as insecticides to kill insects trying to eat them. Many of the chemicals may be potentially toxic to honey bees. I am working on a plant extract that contains chemicals that screw-up the hormones of invertebrates. Hopefully these will kill mites, but until I complete my work, I will not know if they also kill workers, reduce the fecundity of the queen, mess-up division of labour, or hurt the larave. In my opinion, unless you know the stuff won't hurt your bees, and really does have a proven, documented effect on mites (and there are some herbal products being sold that I have heard don't do a thing), think twice about using it. About tea tree oil, I haven't come across any reaserch on it. Does any body know anything. There is some evidence that oil of wintergreen can kill mites, but I haven't seen any work on the other compounds on your earlier list. I would like any references any one has. Also, if any one has any information on the Italian (or Swiss ?) product Apilife/VAR, i'd like to hear about it. There are no essential oil products (apart from menthol for T.M. - if that's considered essential oil) registered for use as a pesticide or antibiotic currently in North America. **************************************** *** Adony Melathopoulos **************** ***** Center for Pest Management ******* ******** Simon Fraser University ******* *********** Burnaby, British Coumbia *** ************** CANADA ****************** **************************************** 'All bees are looking for bargins in nature's supermarket' - Bernd Heinrich e-mail : melathop@sfu.ca tel : (604) 291-4163 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Mar 1996 10:01:25 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Monarch Watch Subject: Re: "What's he doing now?" => Nassanof pheromones lure. To all: If you are within the US and wish to obtain experimental Nasanov lures or Nasanov/petroleum jelly preparations, you can contact me through one of the means indicated below. Chip >Subject: "What's he doing NOW?" => Nassanof pheromones lures. >(Thanks a lot, Gordon, for your English lesson :-) > >Hello All ! > >I prepared my annual provision of tubes containing a Nassanof like >compound. It's important to prepare this just at the moment you'll >need it because it's volatile and instable. > >I used a part of the recipe that John B. Free described in his book >Social Bee Pheromones, Chapman and Hall, eds, London > >More details about the discoveries in 2 articles from Boch R and >Shearer DA both in Nature(London) : > > Identification of Geraniol as the active component in Nassanof > Pheromone of the Honey Bee Nature 194 (1962) p704-706 > > Identification of Nerolic and Geranic Acid in the Nassanof > Pheromone of the Honey Bee Nature 202 (1964) p320-321 > >The recipe for 10 tubes: > > * 1 ml n-hexane > * 100 ug (= about 0.1 ml) Citral, mixed isomers (E + Z) > * 100 ug (= about 0.1 ml) Geraniol > * 100 ug mixed isomers (E+Z) Geranic acid and Nerolic acid > >As I don't find the last 2 acids, I'm obliged to work without them. >Free said it works but not so well that its full formula. > >Put 0.1 ml of the mixture in a small plastic tube (polyethylene or >polypropylene) and close it. I'm using Eppendorf 1.5 ml tubes. A slight >lemon like smell! Put the unused tubes in a 'small', 'well closed', 'glas' >vessel and put it in the refrigerator or freezer to wait for their use >time. Each closed tube is a Nassanof pheromone lure. > >Geraniol and Citral can be supplied both at the "Sigma Chemical Co" >St Louis or at the "Aldrich Co" or at the "ICN" Costa Mesa CA. > >BTW Does anyone know where it's possible to buy the 2 acids I don't >find in my catalogs ? It's important because seems this compounds >really increase the efficience of the mixture. TIA > > >Soon ... > >Jean-Marie Monarch Watch EMAIL: monarch@falcon.cc.ukans.edu URL: http://monarch.bio.ukans.edu DPLEX-L: send message "info DPLEX-L" to listserv@ukanaix.cc.ukans.edu PHONE: (913) 864 4051 FAX: (913) 864 5321 SNAIL: c/o O.R. Taylor, Dept. of Entomology, Univ. of KS, Lawrence KS 66045 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Mar 1996 17:00:07 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jean-Marie Van Dyck Subject: "What's he doing now?" => Watering place ! Subject: What's he doing NOW? Watering place. Hi beelovers ! I described elsewhere the Nassanof pheromone lures. I use this closed tubes (the smell pass slowly through the plastic) to mark my bees watering place (they need a lot water to dissolve the remaining food in March and April). This can avoid the bees to be searching and finding water in the neightbour and get some problems (for me of course) with them. To increase the attractivity of this place, it's a sunny South-East directed place, water covered with natural moss (the one trying always to invade your green) and locally heated with an aquarium thermostatized heater. Soon Jean-Marie Lat.Long. : N:50.30' E:04.56' - Alt. : 200 m - North sea : 200 km ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Jean-Marie Van Dyck Fax +32 81 72 42 72 B.P. 102 email : jmvandyck@quick.cc.fundp.ac.be B-5000 NAMUR(Belgium) Medical school - Biochemistry dept Sorry for my poor english : je parle francais ! ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Mar 1996 11:11:35 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Doug Yanega Subject: RE : Re: STINGLESS BEES Adony Melathopoulos wrote: > >On Mon, 11 Mar 1996, James Graham wrote: > >There are stingless bee species in Mexico, but I'm fairly sure there are >none in any of the southern states. Right - in the eastern part of Mexico, they reach almost to Monterrey, and in the west, they come up the mountains to Yecora. > The postdoc in our lab came back with some when he was >at a meeting in January. The stuff was runny and fermented, so I guess >people water it down. I would imagine they do this because either not >enough honey can be taken from a nest, or the nests are found too >infrequently to get enough (or just poor quality control). Actually, that's the natural state of their honey, at least the stuff I've seen when breaking open their nests in Panama. I don't think it keeps well at all - why should it? It doesn't have to last them all winter... >> b) If these bees do have such potential, could they be kept in >> conventional hives, or would new technology have to be developed >> for them? > >I don't think this has been done. I have heard they are a bitch to >handle. Dr. Mark Winston once told me that when he his worst experience >with bees was when he was messing around with a stingless bee colony in >French Guiana. They can't sting, but they can bite, and some species are >so small that they crawl though any cracks in your gear. Their nest architecture is pretty much incompatible with any sort of hive design one can imagine, and varies from species to species. The yield per nest is pretty small, and it's hard to extract without damaging (if not destroying) much of the nest, even if you keep them in styrofoam coolers as Dave Roubik does in Panama. >> d) Even if they aren't commercially viable, I think this would be a >> fun project. Is it possible to get some of the critters to play >> around with? > >I agree, an observation nest would be fun, but I think impossible since >they are not endemic to the U.S. Probably not impossible, under controlled conditions, but I don't know it's exactly desirable, since they MIGHT carry pathogens. A slim risk, but why take it for something not commercially viable? Sincerely, Doug Yanega Illinois Natural History Survey, 607 E. Peabody Dr. Champaign, IL 61820 USA phone (217) 244-6817, fax (217) 333-4949 affiliate, Univ. of Illinois Urbana-Champaign, Dept. of Entomology http://www.inhs.uiuc.edu:80/~dyanega/my_home.html "There are some enterprises in which a careful disorderliness is the true method" - Herman Melville, Moby Dick, Chap. 82 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Mar 1996 15:42:11 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: Garbled messages. It has been brought to my notice that the 'Net' has a problem. Yesterday I sent (by error) a long message to Robert on some info I thought he might be interested in. Only part of the message was delivered, and 3 hours later the remainder, minus headings etc. was finally delivered. This has never happened to us before! Do we have a tech problem, has anyone experienced this? Should we all go back to snail mail, for accuracy!! **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Mar 1996 14:01:38 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Wayne Clifford Subject: Re: Garbled messages. In-Reply-To: <199603122051.PAA17594@segwun.muskoka.net> David, Some e-mail servers can only handle a limited amount of data per e-mail package. These systems often cut the message into sizes they can manage. It is possible that this is what happened to your e-mail. Best wishes, Wayne On Tue, 12 Mar 1996, David Eyre wrote: > It has been brought to my notice that the 'Net' has a problem. Yesterday I > sent (by error) a long message to Robert on some info I thought he might be > interested in. Only part of the message was delivered, and 3 hours later the > remainder, minus headings etc. was finally delivered. > This has never happened to us before! Do we have a tech problem, has > anyone experienced this? Should we all go back to snail mail, for accuracy!! > **************************************************** > * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * > * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * > * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * > * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * > * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * > **************************************************** > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Wayne Clifford | Phone (360) 427-9670 X-581 Technical Administrator | FAX (360) 427-7798 Mason County Department of Health Services | PO Box 1666 Shelton, WA 98584 | USA wrc@inpho.hs.washington.edu | ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ "Commitment is good, as long as it's not your relatives who are committing you!" Anonymous ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Mar 1996 21:34:36 -0500 Reply-To: aa2363@freenet.lorain.oberlin.edu Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Kevin R. Palm" Subject: Letter to Gareth T. John (Sorry!!) Sorry to post this to the list, but I have been trying to send this message to Gareth T. John, and I can't seem to be able to send it to the email address in his letter. Again, my apologies!! Dear Gareth, I got the documentation you sent me on Saturday. Very interesting reading. Thanks a lot!! It's kind of ironic that I got it Saturday because that morning I went to a big beekeeping workshop put on at the Ohio Agri- cultural Research and Development Center, which is part of The Ohio State University. They have a Bee Research Laboratory on premises, and in the Lab there is a Beekeeping Museum. Guess what they have in the museum? TWO W.B.C. Hives!! So I got to see a couple of them up close. Very elegant, but I can see how they would be best used by stationary beekeepers (like me)!! Again, thanks a lot for sending me the information!! Take care! Sincerely, Kevin -- Kevin R. Palm | Beekeeper (1 hive, 2nd year) Grafton, Ohio | Red Dwarf/Babylon 5/NYPD Blue/ER fan (25 miles SW of Cleveland) | Visitor to the 100 Aker Wood aa2363@freenet.lorain.oberlin.edu | Member FNCF/IECC/IECG/NOST ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Mar 1996 21:59:00 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Franklin Humphrey Subject: Re: Essential Oils. I have been experimenting with peppermint oil to combat t mites. There have been several letters to the editor stories ABJ attesting to the success of this treatment. Menthol, the normal treatment for T mites, is derived from peppermint. The problem with it is that irritates the bees and sometimes they propolize the holes in the bag thus negating its effectiveness. I use a mixture of 2 ML peppermint oil diluted in 1 quart of 1:1 syrup. I spray this directly on the bees while I m doing a hive inspections in early spring. I discontinue treatment during the honey flow and begin again after the flow. The mixture irritates the bees but they must eat it off themselves and the hive parts to clean it up. Consequently, the fumes stay in the hive for about a week Last spring when I started using this treatment, I had had heavy spring losses even though I had menthol on all hives. When I discovered this it was mid April because I was recovering from bypass surgery and hadn t been able to adequately tend the bees. My options were limited given my physical condition at the time. I started the treatment on one hive of yellow Italians that was by this time in very bad condition. Within 3 weeks I the condition of the bees improved dramatically. For the rest of the year I used this colony as a brood donor in order to get new colonies started. Over the course of the summer, I removed approximately 20 frames of brood and they still managed to make 1 super of surplus honey. Starting in august of last year, I treated five colonies with the peppermint oil treatment, with Apistan for Varoa mites. None of the five were lost during winter. These hives are well into spring buildup and are some of the healthiest I ve had in years. I ve been told that the University of Maryland is researching the use of essential oil for control of mites but I ve not seen any results of their findings. Frank Humphrey ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Mar 1996 19:24:45 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Adony Melathopoulos Subject: Re: Essential Oils. Comments: To: Franklin Humphrey In-Reply-To: <960312215858_167199401@emout04.mail.aol.com> On Tue, 12 Mar 1996, Franklin Humphrey wrote: > > I ve been told that the University of Maryland is researching the use of > essential oil for control of mites but I ve not seen any results of their > findings. > Check the ABJ from last August for an update. **************************************** *** Adony Melathopoulos **************** ***** Center for Pest Management ******* ******** Simon Fraser University ******* *********** Burnaby, British Coumbia *** ************** CANADA ****************** **************************************** 'All bees are looking for bargins in nature's supermarket' - Bernd Heinrich e-mail : melathop@sfu.ca tel : (604) 29 14 16 3 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Mar 1996 10:04:51 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Susan W. Cobey" Subject: New World Carniolans Several Beekeepers have asked me where to get NWC Queens. Those of you using these- please let me know how you like them. I love to hear the compliments and learn from the complaints. New World Carniolan Program The New World Carniolan is a highly productive, gentle and winter hardy stock selected for traditional Carniolan characteristics. Our program includes selection for reduced susceptibility to disease and tracheal mites. Initially established in 1982 in California, the breeding program is currently maintained in a cooperative effort with Ohio State University and several members of the California Bee Breeders Association. The breeding program is designed to provide a continuous source of proven, high quality stock to benefit the beekeeping industry. It is also designed to provide a working model of the Page-Laidlaw Closed Population Breeding Program. In this effort, classes on the technique of instrumental insemination are conducted every summer at Ohio State University. Contact the following Cooperating Queen Breeders for breeders and production queens. Valeri Severson Strachan Apiaries, Inc. 2522 Tierra Buena Rd. Yuba City, Ca 95991 Tel. (916) 674-3881 Pat Heitkam Heitkams' Honey Bees Rt 2, Box 2542 Orland, Ca. 95963 Tel. (916) 865-9562 Leonard Pankrast CAN-AM Apiaries Rt 2 Box 2514 Orland, Ca. 95963 Tel. 1-800-228-2516 Rick Schubert Bee Happy Apiaries 8307 Quail Canyon Rd. Vacaville, Ca 95688 Tel. (916) 795-2124 Ken Friesen Friesen Honey Farms 8099 Rd. 29 Glenn, Ca. 95943 Tel. (916) 934-4944 Susan Cobey Ohio State University Dept. of Entomology 1735 Neil Ave. Columbus, OH 43210 Tel.(614) 292-7928 Fax (614) 292 2180 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Mar 1996 14:14:35 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Diana Sammataro Subject: Re: New World Carniolans Sounds good. I'll be out tomorrow to see my disasters. Thanks, and let me know when you have cells. D Diana Sammataro, Ph.D. The Ohio State University, OARDC/ Dept. Entomology Extension Bee Laboratory, 1680 Madison Avenue Wooster, OH 44691 Phone: (216) 263 3684 Fax: (216) 262 2720 Email: Sammataro.1@osu.edu ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Mar 1996 15:20:10 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: Essential Oils. Frank Humphrey wrote. >Starting in august of last year, I treated five colonies with the peppermint >oil treatment, with Apistan for Varoa mites. None of the five were lost >during winter. These hives are well into spring buildup and are some of the >healthiest I ve had in years. It would appear that there is some truth in the stories. So, from the above, is the peppermint used against T-mites or Varroa? There is probably no objection [in this case] with double treatment, but, it would be nice to have more information. If I might make so bold, perhaps Frank, you might keep us posted on what you are trying. **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Mar 1996 16:57:29 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Franklin Humphrey Subject: Re: Essential Oils. What I am trying to do is to find out if the peppermint is effective against T mites. I have been using the roll test about twice a year to check for varoa and always treat in the fall just to be safe. If I can be satisfied that the peppermint is effective for T mites, I plan to try to find one that will be effective on voroa mites. I have been told that camphor and eulyptus have shown some promise but I have not tried either. Frank Humphrey ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Mar 1996 14:46:18 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: New World Carniolans In-Reply-To: On Wed, 13 Mar 1996, Susan W. Cobey wrote: > Several Beekeepers have asked me where to get NWC Queens. Those of you > using these- please let me know how you like them. I love to hear the > compliments and learn from the complaints. > > > New World Carniolan Program > > The New World Carniolan is a highly productive, gentle and winter hardy > stock selected for traditional Carniolan characteristics. Our program > includes selection for reduced susceptibility to disease and tracheal > mites Hi Sue , I'm glad you made it on the list.There were positive comments about the New World Carniolans back in Nov. We were talking about Queen problems.This queen problem is more complex than the genetics. I have looked over some of my notes , after you told me about the meeting ing Portland Or.ABF. If we would only use the cells that the workers seem to cluster on ,when they are finishing them. Would that give us stronger queens? Roy ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Mar 1996 15:37:00 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Verville Subject: Programed Queens? Comments: To: att!BEE-L@UACSC2.ALBANY.EDU >Queens are programmed to swarm in the second year, and it's very difficult >to stop them. >Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green >Dave's Pollination Service Eastern Pollinator Newsletter >PO Box 1200, Hemingway, SC 29554 Would you mind explaining the above statement in a little more detail? I was under the impression that queen breeders used non-swarming behavior as a criteria when selecting breeders. I have also heard that swarming is probable one of the easiest traits to "breed" out of bees. Southern queen/package dealers need millions and millions of bee each spring to meet orders. Therefore they breed queens that build up extremely fast in the spring. Although these queens build up rapidly, they are also carrying the swarming trait, and when congested, swarm. Ever have a hive just busting at the seams and not swarm? While others 1/10th the size cast off swarms all summer long? My opinion. Dave Verville att!mvcss!mvdfv ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Mar 1996 16:12:29 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: jschmidt@CCIT.ARIZONA.EDU Subject: Nasonov recipe John Free did some very good work with Nasonov pheromone that, among other things, attracts honey bee swarms. We have since modified his procedures to make them simplier and more efficient. The lures we now use are extremely efficient at attracting swarms (see J. Chem. Ecology 20:1053-56 (1994)). Below is my "one page" instructions on how to make the lures. Specific questions are also answered in the copied section of Jean-Marie original comments. If you have any questions, please send to me directly as I am not on the bee-l (yet). Justin Schmidt SWARM TRAP PHEROMONE LURES Background: Since about 1986 we have been testing various honey bee swarm attracting pheromone lures and formulations. The current system we have been using for several years works very well and appears ideal for maximizing catch and reducing hassle. Formulation: 1 part citral 1 part geraniol 1 part nerolic + geranic acids Procedure: Mix equal volumes of the three pheromone components in a small vial and withdraw 100 ul with a pipette or microsyringe and place in a 400 ul polyethylene microcentrifuge tube (do not use polypropylene as is made of high density polymer that is too hard to allow diffusion of the pheromone through the tube wall). Close the cap of the tube. A complete lure consists of two tubes enclosed in a small porous black paper packet. Two tubes are used because they provide twice the pheromone release rate and protect against possible failure of one tube (cap pops off from heating-cooling changes in pressure, or a tube cracks). The porous packet protects the tubes from accidental opening and serves as a convenient means to thumb tack or place the lure inside a swarm trap. Sources of materials: (for informational purposes, not an endorsement) citral and geraniol -- can be obtained from any of a variety of chemical companies. We typically use Aldrich Chem. Co. (C8,300-7 at $13.05 for 100 ml citral; 16,333-3 at $12.90 for 25 g geraniol; Tel. 1-800-558-9160, 414-273-3850). One disadvantage is that this company will only sell to institutions or companies, not individuals. nerolic + geranic acid -- we typically obtain it from Bedoukian (#520 at $210 for 1000 g [smaller quantities available at higher prices]; Tel 203-792-8153). It appears that the ICN product is also the same, though we have not yet confirmed that (#203711 at $52.90 for 100 g "geranic" acid; Tel. 1-800-854-0530). polyethylene microtubes -- can be obtained from several companies. We typically use Bio-Rad (#223-9502 at $29.90 for 1000 of 400 ul PE tubes; Tel. 1-800-854-0530. Comments: 1. Store pheromone lures in dark in refrigerator (tightly sealed jar prevents odors) until use. Light and heat shorten field life. 2. Be sure to seal the microtube, or all pheromone will evaporate in a few weeks. The slow release system acts on the same principle as helium diffusing through the rubber of a balloon. 3. After a variety of trials we have found that 100 ul pheromone per tube is best. Ten microliters only lasts 5-10 weeks, whereas 100 ul lasts 6 - 12 months. Greater quantities seem unnecessary. References: 1. Schmidt, J. O. and S. C. Thoenes. 1992. Criteria for nest site selection in honey bees: preferences between pheromone attractants and cavity shapes. Environ. Entomol. 21: 1130-33. 2. . 1990. Honey bee preferences among artificial nest cavities. Ann. Entomol. Soc. Amer. 83: 271-74. 3. Schmidt, J. O. et al. 1989. Swarm traps. Amer. Bee J. 129: 468-71. 4. Schmidt, J. O. and S. C. Thoenes. 1987. Swarm traps for survey and control of Africanized honey bees. Bull. Entomol. Soc. Amer. 33: 155-58. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Justin O. Schmidt USDA-ARS Carl Hayden Bee Research Center 2000 East Allen Rd., Tucson, Arizona 85719, U.S.A. Office: 520 670-6380, extension 109 voicemail) FAX: 520 670-6493 E-mail: jschmidt@ccit.arizona.edu For Bee & Pollination information on the World Wide Web Please visit us at http://gears.tucson.ars.ag.gov/ <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > Date: Tue, 12 Mar 1996 16:04:08 > Jean-Marie Van Dyck wrote: > "What's he doing NOW?" = Nassanof pheromones lures. > > Hello All ! > > I prepared my annual provision of tubes containing a Nassanof like > compound. It's important to prepare this just at the moment you'll > need it because it's volatile and instable. > I used a part of the recipe that John B. Free described in his book > Social Bee Pheromones, Chapman and Hall, eds, London > > The recipe for 10 tubes: > * 1 ml n-hexane > * 100 ug (= about 0.1 ml) Citral, mixed isomers (E + Z) > * 100 ug (= about 0.1 ml) Geraniol > * 100 ug mixed isomers (E+Z) Geranic acid and Nerolic acid Comment: I don't recommend the hexane. Often the terpenes are not soluble in the hexane and it just adds an unnecessary component that might promote leaking > As I don't find the last 2 acids, I'm obliged to work without them. > Free said it works but not so well that its full formula. > Comment: The lures will work without the acids, but less well: 2 swarms for the citral+geraniol vs 25 in the citral+geraniol+acids in direct choice tests. This does not necessarily mean that the two alone are all that bad (if the acid choice were missing), it just means that I have not done the crossover design experiment to determine the true difference in attractancy. See Environ. Entomol. 21:1130-33 (1992) > Put 0.1 ml of the mixture in a small plastic tube (polyethylene or > polypropylene) and close it. I'm using Eppendorf 1.5 ml tubes. A slight > lemon like smell! Put the unused tubes in a 'small', 'well closed', 'glas' > vessel and put it in the refrigerator or freezer to wait for their use > time. Each closed tube is a Nassanof pheromone lure. > Comment: Beware of 1.5 ml Eppendorf tubes as most are polypropylene or high density (white) polyethylene and the pheromone cannot diffuse out of these (unless the cap leaks). > Geraniol and Citral can be supplied both at the "Sigma Chemical Co" > St Louis or at the "Aldrich Co" or at the "ICN" Costa Mesa CA. > > BTW Does anyone know where it's possible to buy the 2 acids I don't > find in my catalogs ? It's important because seems this compounds > really increase the efficience of the mixture. TIA Comment: See above -- Bedoukian > Jean-Marie ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Mar 1996 16:46:57 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Programed Queens? In-Reply-To: <9603132302.AA13954@ig4.att.att.com> On Wed, 13 Mar 1996, David Verville wrote: > >Queens are programmed to swarm in the second year, and it's very difficult > >to stop them. > > >Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green > >Dave's Pollination Service Eastern Pollinator New> > I was under the impression that queen breeders used non-swarming behavior > as a criteria when selecting breeders. > I have also heard that swarming is probable one of the easiest traits > to "breed" out of bees. Southern queen/package dealers need millions and > millions of bee each spring to meet orders. Therefore they breed queens > that build up extremely fast in the spring. Although these queens > build up rapidly, they are also carrying the swarming trait, and when > congested, swarm. > Ever have a hive just busting at the seams and not swarm? > While others 1/10th the size cast off swarms all summer long? Hello , I have seen the two questions above happen more than once. I use to run 3 deeps as brood chamber. I would rotate them and have 3 deeps full of brood.I would requeen every year and did get a large crop every year. Twenty hives was the max that I ran.It was a lot of work and I did learn some of the behavior of the bees ,when the flow would slow down,egg laying would slow also. Once the hive would slow down its expansion , it would never get back to its original brood production rate. I like carniolans and have been using them for 25 years. They build up very fast and winter well. The New World carni should not give a problem with swarming. The reason I said should not ,is because I have had some one year that did seem to want to swarm. That was a breeder problem , not a breed problem. Anyone who has raised there own queens , knows that it is not as easy as just following along in a book.The starter hive has to be full of young bees and in very good condition. Plenty of good fresh pollen. The cell builder needs good attention also. We need good breeding stock and good queen Breeders. I belive we have some very good queen breeders. We need to tell them if we have a problem , so they can fix it if it is there problem. I will say , that some beekeepers are bringing on some problems by themselves.Everybody starts at the begining , so we should help each other as we can. Swarming is complex ,its not just too many bees in a box. Have a great one Roy ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Mar 1996 21:03:29 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: Austrian Carnies Does anyone have any info on the Carniolans in Austria that are reported to have grooming ability and chew the legs of varroas? I think the breeders name is Wallner. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Mar 1996 19:14:18 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Adony Melathopoulos Subject: Re: Essential Oils (long). In-Reply-To: <199603132029.PAA06133@segwun.muskoka.net> On Wed, 13 Mar 1996, David Eyre wrote: > Hi Adony, > Some time ago I put a posting to the list about this with a > request. We live in a back water, do not have access to a library, or past > issues of ABJ. Would it not be nicer and more constuctive to spend a few > moments to give us a precis of that article? Provided we ensure that the > authors name is quoted, then I would consider it a service to the list. > Regards Dave..... Sorry. I have no problems spending a few moments describing this work, but it is not my work, and I have to be cautious not to misrepresent someone else. I'd rather people read the articles and make up there minds. I will summarize what I know of this stuff, but please, please, please, this is only my interpretation, and if you really are interested obtain the quoted ABJ articles and get it first hand. There are three real good papers, all of which have Dr. Nicholas Calderone as the first author. One paper looked at the effects of different essential oils on agar cultures of Bacillus larvae (AFB), Ascophaera apis (Chalkbrood), and Bacillus alvei (a secondary bacterial invader that is associated with EFB infections). Cinnamon oil consistantly inhibited the growth of these cultures or killed them (vegitative stages) at lower concentraitions than any of the other compounds. Thymol looked pretty good against chalkbrood, and camphor and citronella against AFB. Now this may mean very little, because the toxicity of these compounds to bees was not tested in this paper. Although in the next two papers bee mortality was looked at for a couple of compounds, as far as I know, no one knows how toxic cinnamon oil is to bees. It does look like a promising candidit for both chalkbrood and AFB, but a lot more work needs to be done (unless it has been done and I just haven't found it yet). The next paper (ABJ September 1991) looked at different essential oils and tracheal mites. This work was done on caged honey bees, in order to rapidly screen all the oils considered in the study. Clove and citronella looked better than menthol at killing t. mites, but since they were not directly compared, the authors cautioned that this comparision may not be valid (although it might). There was some mortality to bees treated with these oils, and it was statistically more than bees treated with a placebo, but it didn't look like a big difference. Again, this study looked at caged bees, not full-sized colonies, and bold conclusions about how these chemicals might fare in colonies can't be made. Finally, Dr. Calderone, and Marla Spivak, put a paper out this year describing experiments that looked at a the ability of a thymol, eucalyptus oil, menthol, and camphor blend to control Varroa (a very quick summary of what they did is in an ABJ article from last August). The blend led to 95% mortality of the Varroa (compared to only 4% in colonies treated with a placebo). Although they did not observe many dead bees in the colonies treated with the blend, they did not actively measure bee mortality. As the authors point out in there discussion, thymol has been shown to be toxic to bees in other studies. I'm not sure how much more of this work has been done, but it sure looks promising. There has been some good European work, but I don't know it well enough to write anything about it. It would be great if Dr. Calderone wrote a review paper to bring all the essential oil research he and others did at the USDA into one piece. It would be interesting to get his slant on where all this may be going next. Again, sorry to be a nag, but be very careful if you attempt to use these compounds in your colonies. First they are not registered, so you may be breaking the law by using them. Second they may be toxic to the bees in your colonies. Finally, it may not work, and you may only find that out too late to do anything about it. It would be safer to use registered products for the time being, and support the ongoing work being done at places like the USDA labs. From what I read, it looks like they got a couple of real hot leads. **************************************** *** Adony Melathopoulos **************** ***** Center for Pest Management ******* ******** Simon Fraser University ******* *********** Burnaby, British Coumbia *** ************** CANADA ****************** **************************************** 'All bees are looking for bargins in nature's supermarket' - Bernd Heinrich e-mail : melathop@sfu.ca tel : (604) 29 14 16 3 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Mar 1996 20:50:07 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Essential Oils (long). In-Reply-To: On Wed, 13 Mar 1996, Adony Melathopoulos wrote: > On Wed, 13 Mar 1996, David Eyre wrote: > > > Hi Adony, > > Some time ago I put a posting to the list about this with a > > request. We live in a back water, do not have access to a library, or past > > issues of ABJ. Would it not be nicer and more constuctive to spend a few > > moments to give us a precis of that article? Provided we ensure that the > > authors name is quoted, then I would consider it a service to the list. > > Regards Dave.. Again, sorry to be a nag, but be very careful if you attempt to use these > compounds in your colonies. First they are not registered, so you may be > breaking the law by using them. Second they may be toxic to the bees in your > colonies. Hi Adony, You did a very good job on your post. The part that I cut out is very important. We have researchers that are working on ways to stop Varroa.The problems that you can have with mixing compounds , can get out of hand very fast.You might kill the mite and mask the larva feeding Pheromone at the same time. When we know that there are over 200 pheromones in the hive , that control the hive to some degree. I think saying that is safe.We really need to watch and study all of the affects of the chemical on the bees and even the plastic frames. I remember when we used penta on our wood boxs all the time.They had studies that showed no problem for the test peroid.More tests and time then it went to no penta in the hive. I would not be so set against chemicals in the hive , if I though that they would not have a negative impact on the honeybee. See we use the honeybee here in the Puget Sound area of washington state to check our enviornment for pollution.They have been effective in picking up very small trace amounts of hazardous material from the air and water. The talk about replacing old comb was very good. It works and keeps down the amount of pathogens you have in your hive.Think about the wood also.We get something in the wood that slows down any part of bee development or life span then we have a problem. I have a little background in chemistry and my oldest son is a SR. Chem major at U of Wash. We talk about how beekeepers can get into trouble doing there own fixs. We are all in the same bind.I don't want to loose one hive to Varroa. I lost over 30 because of the stress and treating to late in the fall. I want to see that Carni Bee from Austria that bits Varroas legs off.Now thats the kind of killer bee we need. No chemicals , they just don't put up with Varroa.Think about the time and money that we would all save , not to mention the important part the BEE. Bee Happy Roy ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 11:08:56 CST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vladimir Ptacek Subject: Re: Austrian Carnies On Wed, 13 Mar 1996 21:03:29 -0500, Vince Coppola wrote: >Does anyone have any info on the Carniolans in Austria that are reported >to have grooming ability and chew the legs of varroas? I think the >breeders name is Wallner. Friends, In Czech Republic similar breeding program has been conducted at Bee Res. Inst. at Doll near Prague ( 252 66 Libcice n.Vlt., CZ). As I am informed the results obtained are promising but still not at the level enabling the formation of genetically stable lines. In my hobby Carniolan apiary I found 4 fold less Varroa mites in the progeny colonies of one queen in comparison to the rest of the apiary in 1994 (the mother colony had less than 10 individuals, the daughters' colonies less than 100 with one exception, and the rest colonies more than 400 mites), but in 1995 there was no significant relation in the above shown tendency. So you can imagine how I was disappointed in my expectations. I am mentioning this observation just to show (the known fact) that making lines with fixed behavior may not be so easy. But anyway it is good to know the amount of mites which developed in individual colonies during the season. This can be done by the fumigative treatment methods with tar paper plates inserted in the higher bottom boards where dead mites can accumulate during the night following the fumigation. Wishing you prosperous building up season, Vladimir Ptacek P.s.: Yesterday about 15 cm of fresh snow felt down having raised the total level to 40 cm in my apiary (1 - 2 m layer in mountains) Bess didn't fly from mid November. Hard winter in the heart of Europe. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Fac. Sci., Dpt. Anim. Physiol. E.mail: ptacek@sci.muni.cz Masaryk University phone: .42/5/41129 562 611 37 Brno, Czech Republic fax: .42/5/41211 214 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 12:43:54 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jean-Marie Van Dyck Subject: Re: Nasonov recipe Comments: To: jschmidt@ccit.arizona.edu Hi all ! Sunny but cold today here ! On Wed, 13 Mar 1996 16:12 -0700 Justin O. Schmidt wrote ... > ... We typically use Aldrich Chem. Co. > (C8,300-7 at $13.05 for 100 ml citral; 16,333-3 at $12.90 for 25 g > geraniol; Tel. 1-800-558-9160, 414-273-3850). One disadvantage is > that this company will only sell to institutions or companies, not > individuals. > nerolic + geranic acid -- we typically obtain it from Bedoukian > (#520 at $210 for 1000 g [smaller quantities available at higher > prices]; Tel 203-792-8153). ...[cut] > Comment: The lures will work without the acids, but less well: 2 swarms > for the citral+geraniol vs 25 in the citral+geraniol+acids in direct > choice tests. This does not necessarily mean that the two alone are all > that bad ... I found today the acids (mixed Z-E isomers geranic & nerolic) in the '95 supplement of the Aldrich price list: item # 42,776-4 supplied as 25 ml or 100 ml (BEF 1209 and 3360)(about $34 and USD96 but this may vary a lot from a price list to another) Thanking you, Justin, for all your great interest comments : I'll use them all ... *** No hexane - PE plastic - 2 smaller tubes - black paper *** I should add that I'm also using these lures when ... * I'm shacking bees in nucs or any hive boxes to increase the direction wave. * There are some lost bees after a work (in my car or each room I worked), joined together a small piece of comb. Regards Jean-Marie Van_Dyck Lat.Long. : N:50.30' E:04.56' - Alt. : 200 m - North sea : 200 km ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 10:16:48 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David De Jong Subject: Ibero Latin American Beekeeping Congress V Congeso Ibero Latinoamericano de Apicultura - II Foro Expo-Comercial Fifth Ibero-Latin American Beekeeping Congress and Second Commercial Exposition and Forum (Apiculture) This congress will include speakers and participants from much of Latin America, as well as from Spain. It will be held May 30 - June 2, 1996 in Mercedes, Uruguay, at the Club Remeros. The official languages will be Spanish and Portuguese. There will be simultaneous translations of the talks given in other languages. For additional information and to send abstracts of papers, all communication should be with the Congress secretary: Secretaria Geral do V Congresso Latinoiberoamericano Florida 1408 Escritorio 704 Montevideo, URUGUAY Telephone 5982-916658 Fax 5982-916662 Internet: Uy38745@antel.com.uy For instructions on how to prepare abstracts, and/or full papers send a request via reply, or to: David De Jong - iussi@fmrp.usp.br I can also send information concerning hotels. Abstracts and papers need to be sent via fax, with the original via airmail to the Congress secretary by April 15, 1996 Registration is US$ 70 until March 30, 1996 and $85 until April 30. After this date the cost is US$ 100 Accompanying persons pay US$ 50 (all dates) Checks should be written out to Central Apicola Cooperativa Definitely do not send money. In fact the mail service to and from Uruguay is slow, so it is probably safer for those outside Uruguay and Brazil to pay at the congress, (suggestion of one of the organizers) though it would be a good idea to make reservations for rooms before - let me know if you would like more information about room and meals. Registered participants can attend all conferences and participate in the Commerical Forum They also will get a copy of the Proceedings and can attend the Closing ceremonies luncheon For those living in Brazil, information and registration can be done through Ademilson E.E. Soares, Departamento de Genetica, Faculdade de Medicina de Ribeirao Preto - USP, 14.049-900 Ribeirao Preto, SP Tel. 016-633 3035 ramal 395 Fax 016 633 0069 e-mail aeesoare@fmrp.usp.br Papers will be in the following categories: 1- Biology and Genetics 2- Tecnology, Equipment and Management 3- Bee Pathology 4- Bee Forage and Pollination 5- Apitherapy and products of the hive 6- Preparation and sale of bee products A three member comission for each category will determine the papers that will be presented orally vs. as posters. Speakers include: Tom Sanford - U. of Florida Peter Rosenkranz - U. of Hohenheim, Germany (others from Germany to confirm) Gaetano Paltinieri - FAO (Food and Agriculture Organization of the United Nations) Luis Cornejo - Argentina - expert in pollen and honey processing plants Antonio Carlos Stort - Brazil Regina Helena Nogueira Couto - Brazil Warwick E. Kerr - Brazil Lionel S. Goncalves - Brazil Ademilson E.E. Soares - Brazil David De Jong - Brazil A representative of Apimondia A representative of IBRA Brenda Ball (invited) Enrique Bedascarrasbure - University of Central Buenos Aires Walter Fierro - Uruguay, doctor, expert in Apitherapy Homero Toscano - Uruguay is Academic Coordenator. Adolfo Molina Pardo, University of Colombia, Medillin For those who would like to learn about beekeeping in Latin America, this is the best way to get to know the people involved, techniques, research that is being done, how the different countries work with africanized bees, how hive products such as propolis and royal jelly are harvested, processed and marketed (on a much larger scale than in countries such as the USA), and many other interesting topics. If you dont speak any Spanish or Portuguese, things will be harder to follow, but there are lots of people who speak English, including Professors, grad students and even some of the beekeepers. These Congresses have both a scientific and a practical component. translation and comments prepared March 14, 1996, by David De Jong ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 09:26:56 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Dave Green, Eastern Pollinator Newsletter" Subject: Re: Programed Queens? In a message dated 96-03-13 18:15:04 EST, you respond to my comment: >>Queens are programmed to swarm in the second year, and it's very difficult >>to stop them. > > >Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green > >Would you mind explaining the above statement in a little more detail? > >I was under the impression that queen breeders used non-swarming behavior >as a criteria when selecting breeders. >I have also heard that swarming is probable one of the easiest traits >to "breed" out of bees. Southern queen/package dealers need millions and >millions of bee each spring to meet orders. Therefore they breed queens >that build up extremely fast in the spring. Although these queens >build up rapidly, they are also carrying the swarming trait, and when >congested, swarm. >Ever have a hive just busting at the seams and not swarm? >While others 1/10th the size cast off swarms all summer long? >My opinion. It's been my experience (and my management is adapted accordingly), that queens less than 12 months (young queens) can just be supered, with no more disturbance to the brood nest than a quick check for foulbrood., then early supering. They tend to build big populations, and rarely swarm, especially last fall's queens. Queens over 16 months old (old queens) will almost certainly swarm by the second week of April, if I do not reduce them to three frames of brood by about the first of April. Sometimes they will build back up, and swarm anyway, but it will be later. So it seems a fuitile gesture to super old queens. We use them to make increase. Often, we'll give them a second body of comb or foundation in early March. The extra brood is used about the first week of April. If the old queen is saved at all, it is after close evaluation. If there is any problem related to the queen being not up to par, or genetic related, such as chalkbrood, meanness, or just a poor looking bee, the queen will be replaced with a cell or a mated queen. Once they get the habit of swarming, it is usually repeated a couple times, and we can't afford to lose that many bees. So, as much as we possibly can, we do not allow swarming. Most of our swarms occur, simply because we can't keep up in the spring. We try to keep some bees in locations where they have an early buildup, and others where they tend to be late. Some years they all come at once! We do requeen some batches of hives during the late summer and fall. These are usually really nice in the following spring, and they will rarely swarm, unless we are grossly negligent in allowing space for them. (I've seen one-month-old queens from five frame nucs swarm out, because no space was given them. That's a pretty poor excuse for beekeeping.) Those six or seven month old queens can have supers slapped on them, with little more concern, if they are supered early. An eighteen month-old queen with an undisturbed brood nest, even with plenty of supers will usually go anyway. Of course there is a genetic componet to swarming, as well as queen age. I think it is possible to breed out swarming, but do we really want to? There are trade-off's when we change behavior that has served the bees well for thousands of years. One such trade-off is poor queen rearing. I have used a number of different stocks over the years. I very much like Homer Park's for certain purposes, such as for making package bees. He has knocked out a lot of the swarm instinct. They will build humungous colonies that will spill over, whenever you open them, yet are very slow to swarm. (---just the opposite of your example.) On the other hand, I once made the mistake of using his stock in my cell builder colonies (to draw out grafted queen cells). They did a really poor job, and I was trying to figure out what I was doing wrong. When I changed to another, darker bee, they went right to work, and made beautiful cells. Non-swarmy stock, more often that others, will just dwindle and die, when the queen is failing, while others will catch on to the imminant danger, and begin supercedure, or at least emergency cells. A non-swarmy stock is so reluctant to raise queens, that they often will not make a queen cell until there are nothing but drones. I see no problem, if we are aware of the trade-offs, and adjust our usage accordingly, but I sure wouldn't want to remove swarminess from all stocks. In my own queen rearing, I no longer try to stop swarminess. Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green PO Box 1200, Hemingway, SC 29554 Pollination Home Page http://users.aol.com/pollinator/polpage1.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 09:25:47 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Dave Green, Eastern Pollinator Newsletter" Subject: Consumer Survey We've run out of "official" feeders (pails with holes that you fill with syrup, and invert over a hole in the cover). So we have gone back to improvised feeders. We have a lot of 2 1/2 feeder rims that we used earlier for dry sugar feeding. Right now we are using them for syrup. First an excluder is laid on the brood nest, then the rim. Then newspapers are opened and laid over the rims so there is a paper dam that will hold the syrup. We use a minimum of five sheets, taking care that there are no holes in any of the sheets. The bees will chew through the paper after awhile and the syrup will pour through and be wasted. We want the syrup to seep through slowly. We've been doing a consumer survey to see which section the bees prefer. We find that: 1. They are totally indifferent to sports. 2. They only occasionally read the front page news, the business section and the classifieds. 3. They always check immediately the market reports, and the food page. 4. If you want to see them smile, give them the comics page. Pollinator@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 11:18:24 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Susan W. Cobey" Subject: Re: Austrian Carnies >Does anyone have any info on the Carniolans in Austria that are reported >to have grooming ability and chew the legs of varroas? I think the >breeders name is Wallner. Alois Wallner's work is very impressive. In 92 I had the opportunity to go to Austria and the Czech Republic to see Wallner program and various Carnica stocks. There is a lot of potential here. Dr. Ruttner (1995, personal communication) states that A.m. carnica colonies demonstrated the rare ability to recognize and destroy Varroa mites. on the average of 10 out of a 1000 colonies. Ruttner and Hanel (1992) found that of the stock selected by Alois Wallner in Austria, 12 of 700 colonies showed a slower Varroa population growth rate. It was determined that 30% to 50 % of mites had been physically damaged by worker bee mandibles. In a letter Ruttner (1995, personal communication) writes, "You will be interested to hear that Alois Wallner is still happy with his selection success. He now has colonies surviving for 5 years without treatment! The number of colonies which are allegedly resistant is constantly increasing." Dr. Vesley, director of the Vyzkumny ustav vcelarsky v Dole in the Czech Republic (1995, personal communication) writes that, "Varroa resistant bee breeding program continues on a broad scale. The work is long term, but already now we have found bees with high ability to harm active mites. Results from here as well as from Austria show that Carniolan bees may be very useful for this breeding type." I've been trying to import semen from Wallner's Carnica stock for about 10 yrs. Despite the help of Dr. Ruttner and Dr. Laidlaw- this has been very frustrating. My first attempt was as a commercial queen breeder in Ca. in 87 - Permit was never approved or denied- just bogged down in bureaucratic red tape. Recenty I tried again with the backing of OSU. - permit was denied in Feb. 95. Ironically, a commercial Calif interest successfully imported semen from Wallner's stock in 94 on what was claimed to be an approved permit. Upon my inquiry, the officials stated they were unaware a permit was issued and were unaware semen had been imported. They claimed to be unable to find any records concerning this and had to request a copy from the importer. The paperwork was apparently signed during a transition of personnel. The importation is now considered illegal, the permit revoked. Importation of semen is a safe and effective means to import stock. To accomplish this, we need a level playing field and pressure coming from the beekeeping industry for a revision of the 1922 law. Susan Cobey Ohio State University Dept. of Entomology 1735 Neil Ave. Columbus, OH 43210 Tel.(614) 292-7928 Fax (614) 292 2180 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 12:26:11 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Susan W. Cobey" Subject: Austrian Carnica Alois Wallner's work is very impressive. In 92 I had the opportunity to go to Austria and the Czech Republic to see Wallner's program and various Carnica stocks. There is a lot of potential here. Dr. Ruttner (1995, personal communication) states that A.m. carnica colonies demonstrated the rare ability to recognize and destroy Varroa mites. on the average of 10 out of a 1000 colonies. Ruttner and Hanel (1992) found that of the stock selected by Alois Wallner in Austria, 12 of 700 colonies showed a slower Varroa population growth rate. It was determined that 30% to 50 % of mites had been physically damaged by worker bee mandibles. In a letter Ruttner (1995, personal communication) writes, "You will be interested to hear that Alois Wallner is still happy with his selection success. He now has colonies surviving for 5 years without treatment! The number of colonies which are allegedly resistant is constantly increasing." Dr. Vesley, director of the Vyzkumny ustav vcelarsky v Dole in the Czech Republic (1995, personal communication) writes that, "Varroa resistant bee breeding program continues on a broad scale. The work is long term, but already now we have found bees with high ability to harm active mites. Results from here as well as from Austria show that Carniolan bees may be very useful for this breeding type." I've been trying to import semen from Wallner's Carnica stock for about 10 yrs. Despite the help of Dr. Ruttner and Dr. Laidlaw- this has been very frustrating. My first attempt was as a commercial queen breeder in 87 - Permit was never approved or denied- just bogged down in bureaucratic red tape. Recenty I tried again with the backing of OSU. - permit was denied in Feb. 95. Ironically, a commercial interest successfully imported semen from Wallner's stock in 94 on what was claimed to be an approved permit. Upon my inquiry, the officials stated they were unaware a permit was issued and were unaware semen had been imported. They claimed to be unable to find any records concerning this and had to request a copy from the importer. The paperwork was apparently signed during a transition of personnel. The importation is now considered illegal, the permit revoked. Importation of semen is a safe and effective means to import stock. To accomplish this, we need a level playing field and pressure coming from the beekeeping industry for a revision of the 1922 law. Susan Cobey Ohio State University Dept. of Entomology 1735 Neil Ave. Columbus, OH 43210 Tel.(614) 292-7928 Fax (614) 292 2180 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 18:48:03 GMT+1 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: GILLOOLY D Subject: bee venom Would you agree with the theory that bee venom could have a limited medicinal use in the treatment of inflammation of joints (conditions such as arthritis). Is there any cases of credible use and success? ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 11:12:18 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Austrian Carnies In-Reply-To: <40146.ptacek@elanor.sci.muni.cz> On Thu, 14 Mar 1996, Vladimir Ptacek wrote: > On Wed, 13 Mar 1996 21:03:29 -0500, Vince Coppola wrote: > > >Does anyone have any info on the Carniolans in Austria that are reported > >to have grooming ability and chew the legs of varroas? I think the > >breeders name is Wallner. > > Friends, > In Czech Republic similar breeding program has been conducted at Bee Res. > Inst. at Doll near Prague ( 252 66 Libcice n.Vlt., CZ). As I am informed > the results obtained are promising but still not at the level enabling > the formation of genetically stable lines. > > In my hobby Carniolan apiary I found 4 fold less Varroa mites in the > progeny colonies of one queen in comparison to the rest of the apiary in > 1994 (the mother colony had less than 10 individuals, the daughters' > colonies less than 100 with one exception, and the rest colonies more > than 400 mites), but in 1995 there was no significant relation in the > above shown tendency. So you can imagine how I was disappointed in > my expectations. I am mentioning this observation just to show (the > known fact) that making lines with fixed behavior may not be so easy. > But anyway it is good to know the amount of mites which developed in > individual colonies during the season. This can be done by t Vladimir , The point that you made on making lines with fixed behavior may not be so easy. Is at the heart of the problem. We need many different lines being worked with at the same time.Then when we do the breeding for the fixed behavior, we have a good chance to come out positive most of the time. We need our best researchers on top and working together. Good things don't come easy.I hope that beekeepers can see the light at the end of the tunnel.You have seen for yourself that the bees can control the mite.That is the long term fix. Beekeepers will save a lot of money when they don't have to use chemicals.I hope that the gene or genes that kept down the mite population , shows up again in your bees. I wish that we can get more information on other bees that control the Varroa mite by themselves. I have one hive that is standing up to the mites without chemicals. The hive has had NO medication at all.It came from the yugo stock and (open mated ) with some carni stock the came from Glenn Apiaries in California. This is one out of over 100 that I raised from that yugo stock.I never wanted to raise a lot of queens , just some very good stock that will fly in the rain.I'm in western Washington USA and we get plenty of rain. Best Regards Roy ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 17:00:34 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: John Justin Spaulding III Subject: question... (fwd) Bee People- I recieved this request via the WWW. If any one can help me help I'd appreciate it. John Spaulding Associate Curator, Wildlife Center juggler@nesc.org New England Science Center ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 07 Mar 1996 15:58:32 -0600 (CST) From: HALLBERGE@uni.edu To: juggler@nesc.ORG Subject: question... My question refers to a certain item of bee keeping equipment. Can you give me advice on this, or refer me to another person, company or organisation who would know more about it: The object I'm looking for is a "smoker": it looks like a regular smoking pipe, with a cylinder-shaped container made of brass or copper, with a wooden mantle (with slits for the smoke to escape) around it so that the bee keeper can hold it when it gets hot; it has a long thin neck or stem, almost like a tobacco pipe. This item is used when the bee keeper goes to the bee hive in order to collect the honey, so that the bees get drowsy from the smoke and don't bug him. I don't know whether my attempt of a description makes very clear what I'm looking for. In any case, I'd happy to hear from you. I'd be glad if I could find out whether such things exist in the States at all or not. I'm only here until April 2, 1996, and had meant to purchase the item before I go back to Germany. Until then you can always reach me at this e-mail address. The mailing address would be (if you have a catalog): Edith Hallberg c/o University of Northern Iowa Dept. of Modern Languages 232 Baker Hall Cedar Falls, Iowa 50614-0504 After April 2, you can reach me at: E. Hallberg Schelldorfer Str. 18 85139 Wettstetten / Germany e-mail: hallberg@rcs.urz.tu-dresden.de Looking forward to hearing from you soon, even if the response is in the negative. Sincerely, Edith Hallberg ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 23:52:53 PST Reply-To: Glyn Davies Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Glyn Davies Subject: 1 Essential Oils, 2 Bitten Varroa Dear Bee Liners, Essential Oils and Varroa There is in Devon UK a group of mainly beekeeping scientists, engineers and teachers. Devon Apicultural Research Group (DARG). Their aim is to apply their professional training to their hobby and have established a well respected reputation nationwide. Trials for the control of Varroa with essential oils are being carried out. I will be attending a seminar in two weeks time when an interim report will be made. If anything worthwhile turns up I shall make a report to the Bee list. Bitten Varroa There is a report and photograph in our Devon Association magazine "Beekeeping" March 1996 showing an allegedly bee-chewed V.mite. These photographs were originally in an illustrated article by members of the Veterinary Faculty of the University of Cordoba, Spain, and printed in "Vida Apicola" for Nov/Dec 1995. It appears that most frequently the two front legs are bitten off - perhaps because they protrude beyond the shell - and the suckers at the ends of other legs are amputated so that the mite is prevented from clinging to the body of the bee I wonder if there are any Bee-line Spanish beekeepers who can confirm and expand this information? Glyn Davies, Devon BKA, UK ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 21:40:55 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "my name is Dean M. Breaux" Subject: Re: mini, baby, and micro nucs >Hi Dean- > >I'm interested to hear that you have found that mini-nucs are not cost >effective for you in the long run. Why is that? > >Where I live, queen breeders often use baby nucs in the early, cool spring to >produce queens for the peak market. They then gradually incorporate >five-frame nucs as hot weather approaches and market demand decreases. > > The reason's that we chose not to use mini-nucs are because: 1. The weather here in Dade City, Florida is variable as far as temperature is concerned in the spring. It will range anywhere from 32 deg. F to 90 deg. F. when the temperature gets hot the bees tend to abscound with the the virgins. With this in mind we only get to use the small nucs one or two cycles. Then it becomes to hot for the small nucs. 2. Small nucs can not take care of themselves with out the addition of bees and feed therefore you spend a lot of time shaking bees and feeding them. for the most part you can figure that you will have to re-make 40% to 60% of the small nucs every time you pick queens depending on the time of year and the weather. 3. mini nucs and such need special equipment, frames, boxes,nucs etc. This equipment is specialized and therefore can't be used for anything but queen rearing. 4. It is very hard to check what kind of pattern the queen has or how well she is laying in such a small unit. About all you can really say is that she is laying. I have not found that there is any diffrence in the quality of the queen that is produced from a small nuc so long as it is well feed and has ample bees. I have however, found that queens from large nucs both Instrumentally Inseminated and naturally mated seem to be easier to introduce to a full size colony. We use three, four,or five frame 6 5/8 inch deep frames and standard suppers that are divided. We also run about 400 five frame 6 5/8 inch nuc boxes. This size nuc allows for ample brood rearing and colony population to take care of themselves. We run the nucs on a two to three week cycle and we often have to take brood from the nucs to keep them from becoming to strong, and to be able to find the queens quickly. The extra brood can be used by giving it to a hive that is short of bees due to virgin loss on mating flight etc. Another advantage we have found is that we tend to have higher mating success from the larger units. The nucs are used after July for the production of Instrumentally Inseminated queens for Hybri-Bees. The nucs are large enough to keeb an I.I. queen in and evaluate her brood pattern and temper prior to shipping them to breeders in February or March the following year. Also the suppers and frames can be used to produce honey etc. and are standard size. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 13:13:56 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jean-Marie Van Dyck Subject: Re: bee venom On Thu, 14 Mar 1996 D Gillooly asked: Would you agree with the theory that bee venom could have a limited medicinal use in the treatment of inflammation of joints (conditions such as arthritis). Is there any cases of credible use and success? Hello all, I don't know if you must agree or not but I found this description and reference in the BACHEM feinchemikalien AG 1995 catalog: > Item H-7885 Mast Cell Degranulating Peptide (22 AA peptide). > The highly basic MCD peptide is present in small amounts in the venom > of the european honeybee, Apis mellifera. At low doses, it causes > mast cell degranulation and subsequent (subject) histamine release. > At higher doses, it produces an anti-inflammatory effect, which may be > beneficial in rheumatic and allergic diseases. > Ref: > Buku A et al. Int. J. Peptide Protein Res. 33 (1989) 86 > Werkman TR et al. Neuroscience 50 (1992) 935 Hope this helps Jean-Marie Van_Dyck Lat.Long. : N:50.30' E:04.56' - Alt. : 200 m - North sea : 200 km ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 14:44:04 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Kris A Burton by way of dyanega@denr1.igis.uiuc.edu Doug Yanega" Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories, Columbus Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder [This has been forwarded from sci.bio.entomology.misc, as it certainly strikes *me* as a novel honeybee behavior - replies should be directed to Kris Burton] In article <31489D26.4EEF@deskmedia.com>, John Blackmer wrote: >Kris A Burton wrote: >> >> Hi all! >> [deleted stuff] >> >> Now, to the request for help. We have three bird feeders (seed) around >> our house and have recently had some kind of bees or wasps swarming around >> the feeders when it's warm out and cleaning out the feeders. Usually, >> the bird feeders will have seed in them for most of a week, but these bees >> have cleaned out a full feeder in one day's time. I haven't been home >> when the bees have been active, so I don't know what kind they are. >> Anybody know what kind of bee/wasp will raid bird feeders? I don't know >> if they bees are eating the seed or not. I suppose they could be using >> the seed to build their nest. Also, what can I do to keep the bees away? >> The birds stay away as long as there are a number of bees around. >> > >Seed eating bees? That has me baffled. Are you sure they are a bee species >and not some sort of fly? (It's a little work, but if you can examine one, >bees have two pairs of wings, flys have only one pair). Such identification >may be useful and often various species resemble each other. > [Info on how to prevent bees from nesting on your eaves deleted] > >Any holes? can they get into the feeder post and are trying to nest there? >How about a nearby tree? Some wasps and hornets like to gnaw the soft wood >from cedar, redwood, or other boards to then chew and regurgitate for nest >making. They usually gnaw at the wide, lighter spring growth "rings" >inbetween the narrow, darker, summer rings. See what you can spot. > >If you get any more info, let us know. > >John I was finally able to get home before the bees left for the day and was able to identify them -- they're honeybees. I observed a few of them for a few minutes. A bee would would around in the bird seed looking for some seed to take with it. Once it found the seed, it put it's head down and tried to push it back into its middle and/or rear legs. However, it had great difficulty doing so (because the seeds were slippery?) and resembled a dog digging a hole. After it was able to grab the seed, it flew off, but I couldn't track it very far into the woods. Any ideas on how to deter or distract them from the bird food so I can feed the birds again? Kris Burton kris.burton@att.com Lucent Technologies Inc (formerly AT&T) Columbus, OH Opinions expressed herein are mine and not AT&T's or Lucent Technologies' "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose" Jim Elliot ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 10:09:15 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Christopher Carrigan Subject: Re: Nasonov recipe Hello Justin, found your message very informative. Thankyou. I don't have access to a hard copy version of the J. Chem. Ecology. I did find a site that listed all the articles published by the journal, for some reason though It missed listing quite a few pages including the one with the article. Do you have access to an electronic version, or an email address of any of the authors? I would really like to read the article. >The lures we now >use are extremely efficient at attracting swarms (see J. Chem. Ecology >20:1053-56 (1994)). > >Formulation: 1 part citral > 1 part geraniol > 1 part nerolic + geranic acids > I understand this. 1 part cit by vol, 1 part ger by vol. I don't understand this 1 part ner+geran acids. Does this mean 4 equal parts of the 4 ingredients or does it mean a half and half ner/ger mix constitutes one part of a 3 part mix. >Procedure: Mix equal volumes of the three pheromone components in a >small vial This tells me that it should be a three part mix with the two acids making up one of the three parts. Please clarify though. thanks, Christopher ________________________________________________________ Christopher Carrigan carrigan@cyberstore.ca Arras, B.C. V0C 1B0 Canada (604) 843-7205 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 12:13:54 EST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Lucy Cronin Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder I have seen honeybees at bird feeders in the early spring but on observing them, noticed that they seemed to be taking sugar from the corn seeds that were cracked open. Lucy Cronin Ldcronin@venus.cambrianc.on.ca Sudbury, Ont. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 12:11:54 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Joel Govostes Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder Comments: cc: kab@CBEBL1.CB.ATT.COM The bees are collecting dust from the seed as if it were pollen. Their pollen stores are pretty much depleted at this time of year, and they need it as a protein source for rearing young. I've heard of bees collecting sawdust in a similar way -- to them it's the closest thing they can find to what they're really after. As soon as the willows and maples begin supplying the first pollen (soon), the bees will disregard the bird feeder. You must have a colony nearby if they are present in large numbers. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 13:24:41 -0500 Reply-To: Mason Harris Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Mason Harris Subject: Crystalized Honey Hello Bee Folks! I have a problem with crystalized honey in the comb. How does one get it out?? I have about 20 frames that are totally crrstalized. Can you heat the frames somehow to remove it? The honey flow is almost always on here south of San Francisco so the bees are not real interested in removeing the crystalized honey themselves. (This is my opinion and could be somewhat wrong). This honey is from frames they did not touch over the winter as they were gathering what they needed to survive. Someone told me that I might try putting the supers of crystalized honey under the brood chamber. The bees will not like it there and move it up into the honey supers. Has anyone had any luck doing this? The comb is on plastic foundation so I thought, as a last resort, I could scrape off the comb and melt it down in a solar wax melter. I would really like to try to save the drawn out comb if I could. Anyone with knowledge on how to procede with this problem please contact me personally or, If you think this is a worthy topic, post to the list. Thanks! Mason D. Harris Department of Audiology San Mateo County Office of Education smharris@ed.co.sanmateo.ca.us ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 19:33:09 -0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: KN Bokhorst Subject: Re: "What's he doing now?" => Nassanof pheromones lure. At 16:04 12-03-96 +0100, you wrote: >Subject: "What's he doing NOW?" => Nassanof pheromones lures. > > * 1 ml n-hexane > * 100 ug (= about 0.1 ml) Citral, mixed isomers (E + Z) > * 100 ug (= about 0.1 ml) Geraniol > * 100 ug mixed isomers (E+Z) Geranic acid and Nerolic acid > >As I don't find the last 2 acids, I'm obliged to work without them. >Free said it works but not so well that its full formula. > >Geraniol and Citral can be supplied both at the "Sigma Chemical Co" >St Louis or at the "Aldrich Co" or at the "ICN" Costa Mesa CA. > >BTW Does anyone know where it's possible to buy the 2 acids I don't >find in my catalogs ? It's important because seems this compounds >really increase the efficience of the mixture. TIA > > >Soon ... > >Jean-Marie > >Hi Jean-Marie The acids you asked for can be bought in the US Bedoukian Research Inc 21 Finance Drive Danbury, CT 06810 tel (203) 792 8153 fax (203) 792 0145 In your recipe you mention 100 ug =0.0 ml I think that 0.1 mug is meant, wich is thousend times less. in the recipe is the greek m mentioned. A 10% solution of these chemicals gives a very stong odour, which is not likely if you are dealing with pheromones. Success Karel.Bokhorst@tip.nl Karel N. Bokhorst E-mail: karel.bokhorst@.tip.nl ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 20:29:10 -0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: KN Bokhorst Subject: Re: bee venom Hello Jean Marie I Have some answers concerning your missed acids I tried it before but I think I made a mess out of it. (It's my first internet message you know. The acids you asked for are sold by Bedoukian Research Inc. 21 Finance Drive Danbury CT 06810 tel +1 (203) 792 8153 fax +1 (203) 792 0145 In your recipe you mention 100 ug = 0.1 ml I think that 100 mug is meant which is 1000 times less The greek letter m looks like an u The chemicals you mention (in a 10% solution) have a very strong odour which is not likely when you are dealing with pheromones Bee (and stay) happy karel.bokhorst@tip.nl Karel N. Bokhorst E-mail: karel.bokhorst@.tip.nl ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 13:29:51 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: jschmidt@CCIT.ARIZONA.EDU Subject: Re: Nasonov recipe In-Reply-To: Christopher, Thanks for the questions -- I know it sounds a bit confusing about the Nasonov pheromone. The problem is in terminology. Actually citral is two components, a cis double bond isomer and a trans double bond isomer. Both are called citral, hence the terms citrals is sometimes used. With the acids, the exact same situation applies -- there are two isomers which differ only in whether the double bond is cis or trans. Unfortunately these have different names! (one called nerolic acid and one called geranic acid). Thus the final pheromone has 1/3 nerolic + geranic acids (and the other two-thirds consist of equal quantities of geraniol and of the citrals (the mix of cis and trans). Hope that helps. Happy bee hunting! Justin <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Justin O. Schmidt USDA-ARS Carl Hayden Bee Research Center 2000 East Allen Rd., Tucson, Arizona 85719, U.S.A. Office: 520 670-6380, extension 109 voicemail) FAX: 520 670-6493 E-mail: jschmidt@ccit.arizona.edu For Bee & Pollination information on the World Wide Web Please visit us at http://gears.tucson.ars.ag.gov/ <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 13:34:40 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Re: Magazine and other articles. > found your message very informative. Thank you. I don't have access > to a hard copy version of the I've had good luck scanning articles -- even those with pictures --, converting the bitmaps (huge) to JPEGs (60-200K) and sending them as attachments to e-mail or putting them very temporarily on a non publicised web page. I am NOT recommending posting ANY binaries to the list, and one should think about copyrights before going hog wild, but sending copies to one or two people on request stikes me a simple solution to the above quoted post as well as several requests by DE for access to articles cited. This scanning and converting is a fairly simple process, and if any are interested, I could explain more. (I does require access to a scanner (or fax machine) and software to make the file conversion). Regards Allen W. Allen Dick, Beekeeper VE6CFK RR#1, Swalwell, Alberta Canada T0M 1Y0 Internet:dicka@cuug.ab.ca & allend@internode.net Honey. Bees, & Art ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 15:44:24 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Ted Fischer Subject: Supplemental hive entrances REGARDING Supplemental hive entrances I was rather surprised upon reading the responses about the Imirie Shims some days ago, that no mention was made of the simple matter of drilling a 3/4 or 7/8 inch hole in the front of each deep hive body. I do this as a standard practice, and find the extra openings always well used. When they are not wanted it is a simple matter to put a plug of duct tape, or whatever is at hand, into the opening to close it up. These openings have the advantage over the shims in that no extra open space is added between hive bodies or supers. Entering bees can get directly to where they need to be in the hives, and extra ventilation holes are provided in hot weather. (I often put holes both in front and back, for extra ventilation.) A word of caution, however - when storing these hive bodies, remember to plug the holes, since mice love to enter by doors just their size! ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 20:23:32 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Eunice Wonnacott Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder >[This has been forwarded from sci.bio.entomology.misc, as it certainly >strikes *me* as a novel honeybee behavior - replies should be directed to >Kris Burton] > >In article <31489D26.4EEF@deskmedia.com>, >John Blackmer wrote: >>Kris A Burton wrote: >>> >>> Hi all! >>> >[deleted stuff] >>> >>> Now, to the request for help. We have three bird feeders (seed) around >>> our house and have recently had some kind of bees or wasps swarming around >>> the feeders when it's warm out and cleaning out the feeders. Usually, >>> the bird feeders will have seed in them for most of a week, but these bees >>> have cleaned out a full feeder in one day's time. I haven't been home >>> when the bees have been active, so I don't know what kind they are. >>> Anybody know what kind of bee/wasp will raid bird feeders? I don't know >>> if they bees are eating the seed or not. I suppose they could be using >>> the seed to build their nest. Also, what can I do to keep the bees away? >>> The birds stay away as long as there are a number of bees around. >>> >> >>Seed eating bees? That has me baffled. Are you sure they are a bee species >>and not some sort of fly? (It's a little work, but if you can examine one, >>bees have two pairs of wings, flys have only one pair). Such identification >>may be useful and often various species resemble each other. >> >[Info on how to prevent bees from nesting on your eaves deleted] >> >>Any holes? can they get into the feeder post and are trying to nest there? >>How about a nearby tree? Some wasps and hornets like to gnaw the soft wood >>from cedar, redwood, or other boards to then chew and regurgitate for nest >>making. They usually gnaw at the wide, lighter spring growth "rings" >>inbetween the narrow, darker, summer rings. See what you can spot. >> >>If you get any more info, let us know. >> >>John > > I was finally able to get home before the bees left for the day and was >able to identify them -- they're honeybees. I observed a few of them for >a few minutes. A bee would would around in the bird seed looking for >some seed to take with it. Once it found the seed, it put it's head down >and tried to push it back into its middle and/or rear legs. However, it >had great difficulty doing so (because the seeds were slippery?) and >resembled a dog digging a hole. After it was able to grab the seed, it >flew off, but I couldn't track it very far into the woods. > >Any ideas on how to deter or distract them from the bird food so I can >feed the birds again? > Here is my guess: Maybe there has been sugar , syrup, or some sweetener added (spilled on?) to the bird seed. What would it taste like to you? If so, maybe you will need to rinse it off. Not to let the seed stay wet long enough to germinate. Eunice W >Kris Burton >kris.burton@att.com >Lucent Technologies Inc (formerly AT&T) >Columbus, OH > >Opinions expressed herein are mine and not AT&T's or Lucent Technologies' > >"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose" > Jim Elliot > > ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 19:09:29 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Monarch Watch Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder If you look closely you will see that the bees are collecting dust from the crushed seeds just as they collect pollen. This behavior is very common in the early spring when pollen sources are scarce. Honeybees have been observed to collect coal dust and chick pea flour and in the tropics I've seen them collect yucca flour which very high in starch and low in protein. >>[This has been forwarded from sci.bio.entomology.misc, as it certainly >>strikes *me* as a novel honeybee behavior - replies should be directed to >>Kris Burton] >> >>In article <31489D26.4EEF@deskmedia.com>, >>John Blackmer wrote: >>>Kris A Burton wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi all! >>>> >>[deleted stuff] >>>> >>>> Now, to the request for help. We have three bird feeders (seed) around >>>> our house and have recently had some kind of bees or wasps swarming around >>>> the feeders when it's warm out and cleaning out the feeders. Usually, >>>> the bird feeders will have seed in them for most of a week, but these bees >>>> have cleaned out a full feeder in one day's time. I haven't been home >>>> when the bees have been active, so I don't know what kind they are. >>>> Anybody know what kind of bee/wasp will raid bird feeders? I don't know >>>> if they bees are eating the seed or not. I suppose they could be using >>>> the seed to build their nest. Also, what can I do to keep the bees away? >>>> The birds stay away as long as there are a number of bees around. >>>> There is a simple solution - remove all dust from the seeds before you place them in the feeder. This problem will end as soon as pollen becomes available. >>> >>> >>>John >> >> I was finally able to get home before the bees left for the day and was >>able to identify them -- they're honeybees. I observed a few of them for >>a few minutes. A bee would would around in the bird seed looking for >>some seed to take with it. Once it found the seed, it put it's head down >>and tried to push it back into its middle and/or rear legs. However, it >>had great difficulty doing so (because the seeds were slippery?) and >>resembled a dog digging a hole. After it was able to grab the seed, it >>flew off, but I couldn't track it very far into the woods. Please look again. Bees are not adapted to carrying objects such as seeds. The digging behavior is "pollen" collecting. Monarch Watch EMAIL: monarch@falcon.cc.ukans.edu URL: http://monarch.bio.ukans.edu DPLEX-L: send message "info DPLEX-L" to listserv@ukanaix.cc.ukans.edu PHONE: (913) 864 4051 FAX: (913) 864 5321 SNAIL: c/o O.R. Taylor, Dept. of Entomology, Univ. of KS, Lawrence KS 66045 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 20:32:38 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: stoddard jones Subject: Subscribe How do I subscribe? Stoddard ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 20:52:30 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: DizzyBeezz@AOL.COM Subject: Ouch! I'm looking for suggestions. I was stung yesterday on my ankle. Today the bee sting started swelling. I believe my shoe top was aggrivating it. My ankle is quite swollen by now. What can I do to reduce the swelling when the bee stung me over 24 hours ago? Also, I am looking for suggestions on the best beekeepers suit available for working bees in a hot climate. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 21:58:28 EST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Deb & Greg Kalicin Subject: Re: Subscribe At 08:32 PM 3/15/96 -0500, you wrote: >How do I subscribe? > Stoddard > > Stoddard If you do not start receiveing mail from the BEE-L try sending a message with no subject and just with the word subscribe in the body. Greg Kalicin |==============================================================================| | HARMONY FARM | | Greg & Deb Kalicin "With an eye made quiet by the power | | Lisbon, NY 13658 Of HARMONY, and the deep power of joy, | | Tel# (315) 322-4208 We see into the life of things." | | Fax #(315)393-4452 William Wordsworth | | E- Mail Address: HARMONY@northnet.org | |==============================================================================| ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 20:15:06 +0000 Reply-To: James.Peterson.2@m.k12.ut.us Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: James Peterson Organization: UtahLink Subject: Re: Ouch! Try rubbing a sliced onion on the welt. It worked for me today on a recent sting and I don't know if it will work on a n older wound. James Peterson. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 20:30:42 +0000 Reply-To: James.Peterson.2@m.k12.ut.us Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: James Peterson Organization: UtahLink Subject: Re: "What's he doing now?" => Nassanof pheromones lure. please let me know where to buy swarm lures in the USA. james.peterson.2@m.k12.ut.us ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 23:00:08 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Scott Holisky Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder >>>>> Hi all! >>>>> >>>[deleted stuff] I saw several hives last spring bring home a load of seeds, as quickly they passed em' off, others trotted the seeds out on the stoop and lined them up. Good fun to watch, gave them something to do for a few days...I'd give the birds a diet change ( bigger seeds perhaps ) Whatever you do, with warm weather the problem will soon be gone either way. Regards - Scott ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Mar 1996 08:14:33 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Kim;Kim D Board;" Subject: Re: Subscribe I subscribed just today. I sent the following message one line only: SUBSCRIBE BEE-L my name;my full name; to this address: listserve@uacsc2.albany.edu (I'm on internet) It worked well for me, maybe you should try again. KDB ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Mar 1996 15:34:27 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: G C Allison Subject: Re: Bee Literature In-Reply-To: <31433300.3B31@mindlink.bc.ca> Bruce Hamilton said: >".... a poem titled, "Telling the Bees" by Emily Dickinson. I have searc= hed > everywhere for it, and have not been able to find it; so I am beginning= to > think that the author might be wrong. If anyone knows the poem, I woul= d love to clear up this mystery." > > I have not seen the poem to which you refer but I have kept an interest = in "telling the bees" since my first contact with bees over 40 years ago. I was all= owed to watch and occasionally help a cousin with a handfull of hives which he = kept in his home orchard; he also ran several hundred hives scattered across the loca= l heather moors. My cousin's mother was a typical country farming matriarc= h and she set great store in "telling it to the bees". Most significant family= happenings were told to the bees on the day it happened or at the latest before they= flew the next morn, lest they didn't return. Ordinary happenings [births,marriage= s, deaths, illness, injury, re-locations etc] were told in plain language but the = death of the bees master required the bees to be told in verse and the hives to be dra= ped in black until after the master was buried. I do not remember being told = the masters verse but I saw the following verse in the February 1996 edition = of the Scottish Beekeeper [I believe it is anonymous]: Honey bees, honey bees, hear what I say! Your master [NAME] has passed away. But his wife/son/etc now begs you will freely stay, And still gather honey for many a day. Bonny bees, bonny bees, hear what I say! The best attributed poem that I have seen is Kipling's Bee-boy's song: Bees! Bees! Hark to your Bees! Hide from your neighbours as much as you please, But all that has happened, to us you must tell, Or else we will give you no honey to sell! A maiden in her glory, upon her wedding-day, Must tell her bees the story, or else they'll fly away. Fly away - die away - dwindle down and leave you! But if you don't deceive your bees, your bees will not deceive you. Note: I believe in part of England "telling it to the bees" consists of = reciting the following verse as part of Wassailing ceremonies held around Twelfth nigh= t [early January]: "Gentle bees, we wish you no harm. We'm just come a Wassailing" I'm new to EDT and this is my first posting to any list - excuse me if = I have repeated on a subject which has been well aired in the past - I would be = interested to know of any more good "telling it to the bees" poems out = there:-) Geoff Allison Dalbeattie, Scotland geoff.allison@dial.pipex.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Mar 1996 08:50:03 +0000 Reply-To: James.Peterson.2@m.k12.ut.us Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: James Peterson Organization: UtahLink Subject: Re: Bee Literature Wonderful ! Wonderful ! Now , if you can tell me what "Roan Inish" means ? (not in the poem) I think it is in in old (forgive me if I'm wrong) scottish or Irish diallec. It is from the excellent film "The Secret of Roan Inish" james.peterson.2@m.k12.ut.us ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Mar 1996 10:57:16 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: Help required Received today from the Web a request from an educator in Eastern Kentucky for help with bees for a school project. E-mail address >jhall@plaza3.kde.state.ky.us...... hope somebody is prepared to offer assistance...... possible beekeepers in the making!! **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Mar 1996 12:51:04 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Laura A. Downey" Subject: Diazinon I have root maggots in my vegetable garden which I will be treating with something that is safe to my honeybees. At the garden store today, they recommended Diazinon. I told them that I had honey bees and was given the answer "Diazinon is put in the soil, you shouldn't have any problems." I have a feeling that I shouldn't use it. My bee hives are very close to the garden. I want to get rid of these pests without harming my bees and without using chemicals. I'd much prefer to use something natural. I would like to know if Diazinon is safe to use around honey bees. I can use nematodes, which is natural, and safe for the bees. But, in order to appease my husband who is just about willing to use anything to get rid of the pests, I'd like to get some strong information against using the Diazinon. Thank you in advance. Laura corvi29@smart.net ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Mar 1996 12:13:55 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: James Graham Subject: "BEE-"GINNER'S IGNOMINY! Hi, Everyone! As a beginning beekeeper, I am just finishing up with assembly of my first three hives. I meticulously glued, nailed and painted them. Then, while speaking to an oldtimer who was going to put "nuc's" in them for me--I was to leave them somewhere for him to pick up, then pick them up there later, filled with barbed passengers to load into my Wrangler-- I expressed concern that the bumpy ride might dislodge the bottom boards; he said I should nail them on. Taking him at his word, I did. Not only that; in my perfectionistic enthusiasm, I GLUED them on as well! Can anyone answer the following? a) Have I rendered the hives useless by nailing AND GLUING on the bottom boards? b) If so, can I un-nail and un-glue them without destroying the soft wood? (I used weatherproof TITEBOND II Premium Wood Glue). Many thanks in advance! Jim ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Mar 1996 15:56:00 -1000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Andrew Zartmann Subject: Re: Diazinon Forget the bees, I don't want chemicals near anything ^I^ am going to eat! I had a problem with cutworms in my garden two years ago. I went out in the evening to squish as many of the bastards as I could, and I mixed nematodes into my soil. These microscopic worms are supposed to prey on cutworms. You might check with your garden supply people about the nematoes' taste for root maggots. I had no problem witht the buggers last year. I would also suggest rotating where you plant root crops every year so the pests don't have a chance to establish themselves. I know a lot of people who use Diazinon. it probably won't hurt you or your bees, but why risk it if there is another way around the worms? >I have root maggots in my vegetable garden which I will be treating with >something that is safe to my honeybees. At the garden store today, they >recommended Diazinon. I told them that I had honey bees and was given the >answer "Diazinon is put in the soil, you shouldn't have any problems." I >have a feeling that I shouldn't use it. My bee hives are very close to the >garden. > >I want to get rid of these pests without harming my bees and without using >chemicals. I'd much prefer to use something natural. I would like to know >if Diazinon is safe to use around honey bees. I can use nematodes, which is >natural, and safe for the bees. But, in order to appease my husband who is >just about willing to use anything to get rid of the pests, I'd like to get >some strong information against using the Diazinon. > >Thank you in advance. > >Laura >corvi29@smart.net ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Mar 1996 20:32:57 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "my name is Dean M. Breaux" Subject: Re: "BEE-"GINNER'S IGNOMINY! Everything will be ok. Worst case is that if you want to do any swaping of the brood boxes you will have to do it a frame at a time. In the future just use hive staples. But no matter what don't worry, in time you will need new boxes and you will get another chance. One other thing the bees don't care at all if its nailed,or glued or what. So Bee Happy and welcome to the greatest hobby in the world. Dean M. Breaux Hybri-Bees Inc Breeding Better Bees ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Mar 1996 02:27:14 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Daniel D. Dempsey" Subject: Re: mini, baby, and micro nucs > > I also have a pattern here that you can use to make Mini and micro mini >nuc's yourself. You would think that with the large queen industry we have in >the states we would have standard nucs made by someone, but alas we are still >horse and buggy along those lines > >I hope this helps, if I can help in any other way with Queen rearing or nucs >just let me know. > >Dean Breaux >Hybri-Bees Would you please e-mail the pattern for the nuc boxes. thanks Daniel D. Dempsey ddempsey@ddt.net ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Mar 1996 07:29:31 +0000 Reply-To: James.Peterson.2@m.k12.ut.us Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: James Peterson Organization: UtahLink Subject: Re: "BEE-"GINNER'S IGNOMINY! I have tryed screwing the bottom board to the broad chamber, stapling it, and leaving it alone. Like Dean says, the bees don't care. I do remember once wanting to clean the bottom board like my class manual says. It was necessary to transfer all the frames out into new digs to be able to unscrew the bottom board. Now I leave it alone. My bee equipment supplier screws them on and he reuns 1400 hives. I only have 6. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Mar 1996 11:33:02 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Bill Miller Subject: Re: Supplemental hive entrances On the subject of holes in supers for upper entrances: Yes, they work, but you have to remember they're there when you are working the hive (otherwise you will get a hand full of stings). Also, you have to remember to cover them when boxes are in storage, or you will get wax moths, mice, and possibly other non-bee things. Imirie Shims avoid these problems, but they do represent another piece of equipment to fabricate and store. If you like holes in hive bodies, then use them. ps. Another great way to make a supplemental hive entrance is to cut a notch in the inner cover. This upper entrance becomes a permanent part of the hive, and the bees love them all year long. Improves ventilation too. All my inner covers are so notched. W. G. Miller Gaithersburg, MD ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Mar 1996 10:10:26 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Adony Melathopoulos Subject: Re: Diazinon In-Reply-To: <199603161751.MAA08526@smarty.smart.net> On Sat, 16 Mar 1996, Laura A. Downey wrote: > I have root maggots in my vegetable garden which I will be treating with > something that is safe to my honeybees. At the garden store today, they > recommended Diazinon. As far as organophorphorous insecticides go, diazinon is one of the more harmful compounds to honey bees. The reason is not so much that it is extremely toxic to bees (which it is, but so are a number of other safer compounds), but that it remains hazardous for weeks after application (while other insecticides loose a considerable amount of their toxicity overnight). > I told them that I had honey bees and was given the > answer "Diazinon is put in the soil, you shouldn't have any problems." I > have a feeling that I shouldn't use it. My bee hives are very close to the > garden. It all depends how and when it is applied. Pesticides are not toxic to honey bees when they are sprayed on areas that do not contain attractive blooms. Diazinon is commonly used to treat root maggots, I think you can buy both an emulsifiable concentrate (EC) and granular (G) formulations for this purpose, and is either applied using soil drench or furrow treatments. I think furrow treatments (where you apply granules of Diazinon with the seed at the time of seeding) will pose no threat to your bees. I'm not sure about soil drench applications, but I suspect they are safe too, but i'm not as sure. > I want to get rid of these pests without harming my bees and without using > chemicals. I'd much prefer to use something natural. I would like to know > if Diazinon is safe to use around honey bees. I can use nematodes, which is > natural, and safe for the bees. But, in order to appease my husband who is > just about willing to use anything to get rid of the pests, I'd like to get > some strong information against using the Diazinon. Sorry I didn't gave you a mixed bag of advice. I'm sure there are plenty of organic ways to deal with root pests, especially on a small scale such as a garden. I don't know too much about controls available for such pests, but i'm sure there are safer ways to deal with your problem. Nematodes sound like they would work. Check into diatomaceous earth, neem (Margosan-O or Align), or alternative tillage practices with a good gardening club, or shop. Good luck, Adony **************************************** *** Adony Melathopoulos **************** ***** Center for Pest Management ******* ******** Simon Fraser University ******* *********** Burnaby, British Coumbia *** ************** CANADA ****************** **************************************** 'All bees are looking for bargins in nature's supermarket' - Bernd Heinrich e-mail : melathop@sfu.ca tel : (604) 29 14 16 3 ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 17 Mar 1996 10:57:29 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Beginners observations Hi, I enjoy reading some of the things that happen to us when we start Beekeeping.All of us start on page one.As we observe our bees, we start out with a problem.We try to relate what we see to our human perception of reality.We read books and watch the bees.After awhile we come to realize that the honeybee knows what to do and when. We then are getting into there world when we open up the hive. I was told by someone , that I should not open the hive very much , because you would upset the bees. How can you learn without looking? Let me tell you I did a lot of looking. I learned to handle the frames with care and move slowly.Now and then I would squash a bee and notice that other bees would react to the squashed bee. The sting pheromone would be released from the squashed bee and that would set off the alarm. My observations of how much smoke to use , is as little as possible. Now when I go to one of my bee yards with 30 to 60 hives , I may smoke one pretty good now and then if they need it or I need to change a queen.When your calm yourself it helps. They know if your tense. My first big discovery with my bees.There was a nursery with a lot of heather 2 miles away from my home.I lived right on the water on Hood Canel , so the bees had to go up or down the beach to get pollen or nectar. I love to garden so I was always stopping at the nursrey and the lady that run the nursrey knew my Mother from high school.One day I saw honey bees all over the heather and I thought they may be my honeybees. I went home and got some wheat flower and headed back to the nursery. Margret thought I was crazy when I started to sprinkle flower on the bees. I drove home and sat by my hives to see if any would have flower on them. You would think that I found the Mother Load when I started to see my bees with the flower on them returning to my hives. Margret is 83 now and she still remembers that day that I found my bees at the nursery. Beekeeping is wonderful. Full of Wonder. There is no end , but there is a begining. Ask questions and always be open to change.I have a beekeeper friend who has 100 hives and a son. He wanted me to take his Son through the bees and see how I do it. I can give his son all that he needs with a long walk out in nature. The book will give you some information , but your understanding of nature will give you wisdom.Honeybees are very complex to say the least.You don't need to study genetics to enjoy and learn about your bees.Our researchers are very dedicated into learning more about the honeybee.We all need there help and they need beekeepers to get support for there work. We need positive press. Giving talks on bees and giving a little honey out helps.Enjoy and try to understand what you see in the hive and tell others. Best Regards Roy ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Mar 1996 22:06:06 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Gordon Scott Subject: Re: Supplemental hive entrances In-Reply-To: On Fri, 15 Mar 1996, Ted Fischer wrote: > REGARDING Supplemental hive entrances > > I was rather surprised upon reading the responses about the Imirie Shims some > days ago, that no mention was made of the simple matter of drilling a 3/4 or > 7/8 inch hole in the front of each deep hive body. This is something like the standard entrance in some parts of Europe. We also have available a disc with a closed section, a matching opening, a QX opening and a bee-proof ventilator opening that makes the system very conveniently flexible. It seems a good system to me, I really must try it! Regards, -- Gordon Scott gordon@apis.demon.co.uk gordon@multitone.co.uk (work) The Basingstoke Beekeeper (newsletter) beekeeper@apis.demon.co.uk Embryo Home Page Beekeeper; Kendo 3rd Dan; Sometime sailor. Hampshire, England. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Mar 1996 08:26:33 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Alden Leatherman Subject: Requeening in the cold ... ? Opening my only remaining hive (of two alive in the fall) this weekend, I found absolutely no brood or eggs but a good amount of bees. The forecast is for some possible snow in the next few days here in central Michigan, so I am wondering what to do about requeening. 1. Is it safe to assume the queen is gone or dead or do I need to do a thorough search for a possible non-functioning queen? 2. How warm should it be before I introduce the new queen? 3. If it's too cold when she comes how long can I keep her just giving her water (and/or syrup...?) through her cage screen? 4. Does it make any sense at all to wait for generally warmer weather to order a new queen? No laying workers .... yet. 5. Why and how did this happen? Any ideas? Any other suggestions or thoughts of course would be welcome. I just don't want to lose this good bunch of bees that have made it this far into spring. I am leaning toward trying a New World Carniolan from California for this requeening. Any reason not to? Too far to ship? Possible better acceptance of another strain? Thanks for any help offered, Alden Leatherman alden_leatherman@state.mi.us ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Mar 1996 08:55:14 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jean-Francois Lariviere Subject: Bee-autiful Screen Saver :) >|< Comments: To: chinamed@well.com, beehaven@well.com, Fastsigns@aol.com, a.l.@ix.netcom.com, 74022.1134@compuserve.com, 74431.2303@compuserve.com, BEEMAN1033@aol.com, DomQuixotq@aol.com, Honebergs@aol.com, SteveDud@aol.com, BIGBLUE77@aol.com, RoyBee@aol.com, Natalie172@aol.com, BeeMike@aol.com, Bee1234@aol.com, DANIELBEE@aol.com, FrGrTomata@aol.com, RoseBuzzzz@aol.com --PART.BOUNDARY.0.18617.mail02.mail.aol.com.827157313 Content-ID: <0_18617_827157314@mail02.mail.aol.com.10162> Content-type: text/plain Dear Friends of Apis Mellifera >|<, Attached is a Windows 3.1 screen saver file called SWARM.SCR. Let me know if it doesn't transfer correctly. (Apis Mellifera is Latin for honey bee) All you need to do is: 1) Detach it into your Windows directory. 2) Next, you'll want to go to your MAIN program group, open CONTROL PANEL and launch the DESKTOP feature/utility. 3) From there, you'll select the screen saver called SWARM. That's it. Have fun with it and give it to your friends. It was created by a friend of mine and I was the Technical Consultant (bee behavior towards wasps). Bee Well, Jean-Francois --PART.BOUNDARY.0.18617.mail02.mail.aol.com.827157313 Content-ID: <0_18617_827157314@mail02.mail.aol.com.10163> Content-type: application/octet-stream; name="SWARM.SCR" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 TVrUAQEAAAAEAAAA//8AALgAAAAAAAAAQAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAgAAAAA4fug4AtAnNIbgBTM0hVGhpcyBwcm9ncmFtIHJlcXVpcmVzIE1pY3Jvc29m dCBXaW5kb3dzLg0KJAAAAAAAAABORQU89AAtAAAAAAAKAwIAoA+IExAhAQAAAAIAAgADALcA QABQANQA3QDjAKEBAAAHAAQAAAACCCgARAMAAAoDKgBuJ1AdbifYAjYHUQw2BwQADoABAAAA AABsAwIAMBxkgAAAAAAFgAQAAAAAAG4DJAAwHNOHAAAAAJIDEQAwHNCHAAAAAKMDEwAwHNGH AAAAALYDCwAwHNKHAAAAAAaAAgAAAAAATgMRAHAcP4AAAAAAYAMJAHAcQIAAAAAAA4ABAAAA AADBAy8AMBwBgAAAAAAAAAVTV0FSTQAAAAEACAAMAAAGS0VSTkVMA0dESQRVU0VSB/8BzT8B EAABzT8BHgIBzT8ByhMBzT8BPBkBzT8BTB4BzT8BWCABzT8BhBEAF1NDUk5TQVZFIDpTd2Fy bSBvZiBCZWVzAAASRExHSU5WQUxJRFBBU1NXT1JEBgAPU0NSRUVOU0FWRVJQUk9DAQAQQVJS T1dDT05UUk9MUFJPQwMADkRMR0dFVFBBU1NXT1JEBQAaU0NSRUVOU0FWRVJDT05GSUdVUkVE 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AAAAAAAAAAD//////9//////////////////////////r////////////////////3f///// /////////f3////////v/3A/f//AH///wA///4AH//+AB///AAP//wAD//8AA///AAP//wAD //+AB///gAf//8AP///gH///8D///////////wAAAAAAAAAA --PART.BOUNDARY.0.18617.mail02.mail.aol.com.827157313-- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Mar 1996 14:14:07 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Eric Abell Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder A >>> >>> Now, to the request for help. We have three bird feeders (seed) around >>> our house and have recently had some kind of bees or wasps swarming around >>> the feeders when it's warm out and cleaning out the feeders. Usually, >>> the bird feeders will have seed in them for most of a week, but these bees >>> have cleaned out a full feeder in one day's time. I haven't been home >>> when the bees have been active, so I don't know what kind they are. >>> Anybody know what kind of bee/wasp will raid bird feeders? I don't know >>> if they bees are eating the seed or not. I suppose they could be using >>> the seed to build their nest. Also, what can I do to keep the bees away? >>> The birds stay away as long as there are a number of bees around. >>> > I was finally able to get home before the bees left for the day and was >able to identify them -- they're honeybees. I observed a few of them for >a few minutes. A bee would would around in the bird seed looking for >some seed to take with it. Once it found the seed, it put it's head down >and tried to push it back into its middle and/or rear legs. However, it >had great difficulty doing so (because the seeds were slippery?) and >resembled a dog digging a hole. After it was able to grab the seed, it >flew off, but I couldn't track it very far into the woods. > >Any ideas on how to deter or distract them from the bird food so I can >feed the birds again? A farmer phoned me last week. I have bees on his land. While the bees posed no problem he informed me that the bees were into his bird feeder. It seams he had placed some oatmeal in the feeder and this attracted the bees. It is not unusual in our area to find bees collecting chop and grain dust or even sawdust. This only happens early in the spring before there is any natural pollen. Eric Eric Abell Gibbons, Alberta Canada (403) 998 3143 eabell@compusmart.ab.ca ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Mar 1996 12:09:00 -0600 Reply-To: RICHARD J ALBERT Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: UNITE Project N.B. Education N.-B. From: richard albert Subject: Spring Feeding I need some advice, please. 1) I live in Southern New Brunswick. Presently, night time temperatures approx. -10 to -5 C. Day time temperatures approx. -3 to +6 C. 2) My 10 hives are wrapped up in black tar paper. They all have upper ventilation holes cut out of the inner cover rim. I have access to the inner cover through a "bonnet" of straw insulation covering it. The straw, I noticed, is fairly wet and mouldy. 3) I am concerned that their honey stores will be insufficient to carry them through to Spring. 4) Is it feasible at this time, given the low temperatures, to place a gallon jar of sugar water (1:1) over the hole in the inner cover to feed them. Thanks for any advice. Richard Albert alberrij@nbed.nb.ca ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Mar 1996 08:41:21 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Requeening in the cold ... ? In-Reply-To: On Mon, 18 Mar 1996, Alden Leatherman wrote: > Opening my only remaining hive (of two alive in the fall) this weekend, I > found absolutely no brood or eggs but a good amount of bees. The > forecast is for some possible snow in the next few days here in > central Michigan, so I am wondering what to do about requeening. > > 1. Is it safe to assume the queen is gone or dead or do I need to do a > thorough search for a possible non-functioning queen? > > 2. How warm should it be before I introduce the new queen? > > 3. If it's too cold when she comes how long can I keep her just > giving her water (and/or syrup...?) through her cage screen? > > 4. Does it make any sense at all to wait for generally warmer weather to > order a new queen? No laying workers .... yet. > > 5. Why and how did this happen? Any ideas? > > Any other suggestions or thoughts of course would be welcome. I just > don't want to lose this good bunch of bees that have made it this far into > spring. I am leaning toward trying a New World Carniolan from California > for this requeening. Any reason not to? Too far to ship? Possible better > acceptance of another strain Hi , I have a couple of thoughts. #1 I have 25 hive at the house. Wesrern Wash USA. I looked at my bees yesterday. 60 F. I have hives from a ten inch cluster in one box with a 3 inch dia.brood and larva to 3 deep boxs full of bees and brood.In the slow hive they have one deep on top FULL of honey and did not move up into it. I think that the hive did get some Varroa damage in the fall. I would lean toward the New World Carni and Sue Cobey put in a post with the Address's of the breeders that have them in California.They build up fast. This year I took 3 hives and started to feed pollen in January so I can get some early drones. I have drones and a load of bees. I myself would not count her out with the weather that you still have. One more little look before I would grab the phone for California. I would replace her but be careful of the temperature that the new queen has to sustain before she gets into the hive. I have done queens with ice on the ground. I would put a couple in a pocketof my shirt under my coveralls and go out and do a few at a time. Rot ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Mar 1996 12:07:03 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Ted Fischer Subject: Re: Diazinon REGARDING RE> Diazinon I realize that diazinon is a dangerous pesticide to use around beehives, but sometimes there seems to be no alternative. In southern Michigan, we have a medium sized ant species (black and brown) that builds large hills, about 18-20 inches high and up to four feet in diameter. These ants are marauders, and collect anything they can find in the vicinity. They have gotten into some of my hives, weakening and eventually killing them. I see long lines of ants going towards the hives and leaving with bees, larvae and stored pollen pellets. The only thing I have found that works is to dig a hole into the center of the anthill and put a tablespoon of diazinon directly inside, then cover it up again. The ants are dead within a week, and I hope the burial of the pesticide will keep it safe from the bees. Nevertheless, I do hate to use it, because of concern that the eventual leaching of the chemical might enter neighboring streams. I only can hope that it will be denatured by then. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Mar 1996 11:57:49 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: MKH Subject: Beekeeping in the Tropics Dear BEE-Lers, I'm in the process of cataloging TROPICAL honey-beekeeping experiences and am looking for various antedotal or professional accounts. PLEASE RESPOND DIRECTLY TO ME. Some of you already have been individually contacted, and may respond again if you have new info. I am particularly interested in the following types of information: * LOCAL CONDITIONS: Location, topography, climate, seasonal variations, etc. * ECONOMIC IMPACT: Importance in local economy, value of products (price/kg/lb) v. monthly income of average person * BEE POPULATIONS: Honeybees and Wild Bees (scientific names) and their interaction * FLORA & FAUNA: Best flora for honey production - types of plants considered best for producing honey, domesticated and wild. [use local and scientific name whereever possible) * MANAGEMENT PRACTICES: hive management, honey production/extraction, handling of bees, feeding, moving of bees, etc. (traditional and modern practices) * NATURAL HAZARDS: Pests, diseases, weather, etc. * HUMAN HAZARDS: Pesticides, insecticides, vandalism, theft, etc. * EQUIPMENT & GEAR: Types of hives used/construction, fuel for smoking, gloves, veils, feeders, etc. * LOCAL CONCERNS: Government regulation/unregulation, climate, weather, dearth of research, chemicals, etc. * COPING STRATEGIES: Diseases, pests, hazards, aggressive bees, swarming/absconding, humans, etc. * OTHER: Any personal experiences that you believe would be of interest to other apicurists Again, please respond by email DIRECTLY TO ME so as to eliminate hundreds (hopefully) of individual responses to the list. I will summarize the thread and publish at a later date for the entire list. Thanks in advance for your assistance. Regards, M. K. Hendrix Location: Boston, Massachusetts USA email: eximweb@us1.channel1.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Mar 1996 12:49:08 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Mace Vaughan Subject: Bee-keeping volunteer work outside the US. Hello Bee-liners, I was wondering whether or not anyone knew of opportunities to do volunteer work setting up, or working with, bee-keeping cooperatives in developing countries and, if so, who to contact about getting more information. I appreciate the help. Mace Mace Vaughan Research Assistant 901 Bradfield Hall Cornell University Ithaca, New York 14853 607-255-4747 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Mar 1996 16:39:01 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: Re: Requeening in the cold ... ? In-Reply-To: On Mon, 18 Mar 1996, Alden Leatherman wrote: > 1. Is it safe to assume the queen is gone or dead or do I need to do a > thorough search for a possible non-functioning queen? I would not assume the old queen is gone. In this situation it is often difficult to locate her. She may not be much larger than a worker, but if she is present the new queen will likely be rejected. > > 2. How warm should it be before I introduce the new queen? Mid April is OK in the north.> > 3. If it's too cold when she comes how long can I keep her just > giving her water (and/or syrup...?) through her cage screen? At least a week , but its best to use her right away. > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Mar 1996 17:43:16 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Joel Govostes Subject: Re: Bee-keeping volunteer work outside the US. Hi. The Peace Corps has a program for beekeeping as do many other groups. I'll see if I can dig up some info for you. -- Joel ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Mar 1996 23:49:23 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: James Maus Subject: Re: Requeening in the cold ... ? Hi Alden, Don't be to hasty to judge your hive queenless. Alot of strains of bees are just now starting to brood and will be more so when pollen and a little nectar start. It has been a long tough winter for them. If you were to order a queen you could put her in the hive pretty much any day cool or not, however her acceptance by the bees will be better if you feed or have something coming in. Bees are very adaptable and as long as you move along you can requeen in the cold being sure to keep the queen warm in your pocket all the while. Its early your hives have plenty of time to build. Also if they are relatively quiet when you open them they are likely ok. Regards Jim Maus ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 01:19:13 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "(Kevin & Shawna Roberts)" Subject: Re: bee venom Yes, bee venom is effective against arthritis, as well as other types of joint pain. (In my opinion, probably as much as any other medicine....remember that arthritis is a chronic disease for which standard medicine has no cure. They can only alleviate your pain.) The most recent edition of The Hive and the Honey Bee (chapter 22, "Other Products of the Hive", the section on Bee Venom) contains information about clinical tests conducted to verify the efficacy of bee venom. Among arthritic patients, something like 60% reported moderate to excellent results when they used bee venom for their arthritis pain. When tests where done on arthritic dogs, the dogs had measurably more freedom of movement when they received bee venom. The bee venom section is fascinating. If you have any sort of chronic joint pain, or you know someone who does, it is recommended reading. I use bee venom for repetitive motion pain in my hands (I have carpal-tunnel-like symptoms, but have never gotten a diagnosis). When I take a sting or two on the wrist, my pain is alleviated. I no longer wear the wrist braces that I used to wear when I worked at the keyboard. And I don't wake up in the middle of the night from the pain in my hands, either. I have a friend with an inflamed knee joint. He has recently started experimenting with bee venom therapy, and has had some positive results (as he puts it, "Mostly I notice that I don't have trouble falling asleep"). Some people are concerned about the possibility of allergic reactions. Obviously, you need to watch for any allergic reaction, but only about 1% of the population has a bee sting allergy. I suspect that that is a smaller percentage than the people who are allergic to the drugs doctors prescribe for inflammation. And even without an allergic reaction, there are still serious side effects to the anti-arthritic medicines, including liver damage. The American Apitherapy Association has all sorts of information about bee venom therapy, and what people are using it for. I don't have their number with me, but if anyone wants it, you can e-mail me at gypsybees@aol.com. Shawna Roberts ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 01:19:16 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "(Kevin & Shawna Roberts)" Subject: Re: Ouch! Try taking an antihistamine. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 17:41:18 +1000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Mauricio Montes-castillo Subject: Re: bee venom In-Reply-To: <960319011912_171832821@mail02.mail.aol.com> On Tue, 19 Mar 1996, (Kevin & Shawna Roberts) wrote: > ...they used bee venom for their arthritis pain. When tests where done on > arthritic dogs, the dogs had measurably more freedom of movement when they > received bee venom... A few years ago I had a siamese male cat, ( the laziest bum you could ever imagine!!), well, he got stung on his rear end... and was running like crazy...and didn't suffer arthritis... Greetings from OZ!! Mauricio ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 07:09:59 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jeremy Burbidge Subject: Request for address 19th March 96 I wish to obtain the e-mail address or phone number of David DeJong in Brazil. Please can anyone or David supply Jeremy Burbidge ruxbury@delphi.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 15:15:49 +0300 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: nokrian rivka Subject: Temperatures Hello Bee-Liners, I need some info regarding maximum temperatures that bees still fly and perform pollination. Can any of you please direct me to some ref.? I read at Dandant's book that at 43 C bees don't tend to fly but any other info would be appreciated. Also, if any of you have any data or ref's about relative humidity and it's affect on bees. Please forward directly to me: rebeca@post.tau.ac.il or by mail to: Rivka Nokrian Dept. Botany, Tel Aviv University Ramat Aviv, Tel Aviv 69978 ISRAEL Thanx in advance, Rivka ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 09:41:34 EDT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Celso F. Martins" Organization: Universidade Federal da Paraiba-JP/BRASIL Subject: David De Jong's e-mail The e-mail of David De Jong in Brazil is: ddjong@uhura.fmrp.usp.br Celso F. Martins Dep. Sistematica e Ecologia / CCEN Universidade Federal da Paraiba Joao Pessoa PB Brasil 58059-900 E-mail: CENDSE05@BRUFPB.BITNET ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 07:52:26 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: John Justin Spaulding III Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder In-Reply-To: <4ibvnk$hem@nntpa.cb.att.com> On Fri, 15 Mar 1996, Kris A Burton by way of dyanega@denr1.igis.uiuc.edu Doug Yanega wrote: > >> Now, to the request for help. We have three bird feeders (seed) around > >> our house and have recently had some kind of bees or wasps swarming around > >> the feeders when it's warm out and cleaning out the feeders. Usually, > >> the bird feeders will have seed in them for most of a week, but these bees > >> have cleaned out a full feeder in one day's time. I've seen this also and I've been told that the bees are collecting it as an early pollen substitute. I've opened my hives to see if millet is in storage where you would see pollen normally. There was a light colored dust there but I couldn't tell if it was millet. Does anyone one now if they can actually use millet or birdseed as a protein source. John Spaulding Associate Curator, Wildlife Center juggler@nesc.org New England Science Center ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 08:00:57 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: John Iannuzzi Subject: Honeywanted fr MD-DC-VA-PA area 1. My message is in the subject line. 2. Sorry to inconvenience all others (the outsiders) since I don't know how to delimit this request. 3. In 60s, plastic pails, one to five, depending upon price and floral source. 4. Please respond personally to (w/o the brackets) and NOT to List since there R certain people out there who always--justifiably?--take offense. Muchas gracias, merci beacoup, hvala mnogom, arigatoo kudasai, mille grazie, ko"so"no"m szepen und danke scho"n. 5. C U Sat (23rd) at Md Ag Day, Dpt of Ag, Annapolis or will it be MSBA meeting in Hughesville? Jack the B-man, Pollen Trapper since 1982 ellicott city md usa (near balto) PS On Sat collected 16oz med green pollen (maple) from three of seven Stauffer Pollen Traps--the best available, for my money (I own 11 different config- urations). Just bot four more to take to Cairo next week. Did U C his current display ad in March ABJ? This Pennsylvanian runs it only once yearly. PPS He has NO telephone and drives a horse and buggy. TTFN ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 15:51:00 +0200 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Yaacov Lensky Subject: Re: Temperatures >Hello Bee-Liners, > > I need some info regarding maximum temperatures that bees still >fly and perform pollination. Can any of you please direct me to some >ref.? I read at Dandant's book that at 43 C bees don't tend to fly but >any other info would be appreciated. > Also, if any of you have any data or ref's about relative >humidity and it's affect on bees. > > Please forward directly to me: > rebeca@post.tau.ac.il > >or by mail to: Rivka Nokrian > Dept. Botany, > Tel Aviv University > Ramat Aviv, Tel Aviv 69978 > ISRAEL >Thanx in advance, Rivka Dear Rivka, You may find more info in the reports by Y. Lensky: 1. Comportement d'une colonie d'abeill....... Journal of Insect Physiology, 10, 1-12 (1964) 2. Resistance des abeilles...... Insectes Sociaux, 11, 293-300 (1964) 3. L'economie des liquides....... Insectes Sociaux, 11, 207-222. Best regards, Yaacov > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 09:32:46 EST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Ana Maria Quiniones Subject: Bee pollination for sexual seed production!! Hello to all of you!! My name is Ana Maria Quiniones, I am from Quito-Ecuador. I will do my best with my english, since spanish is my first language. I am working on a project for sexual seed production in Oxalis tuberosa Mol. (an andean tuber like potatoe.) The main objective of my project is to develop a methodology for the abundant production of sexual seed for its storage on the germplasm bank CIP-Quito. Manual pollination is too laborious, so that is why I thought on using honey bees and bumble bees for this purpose. Since I need the seed to come from specific crosses, I built a greenhouse divided in four small confinements. Each cross was put inside each compartment with a hive of bees, so that I could assure that the seed obtained belonged specifically to that cross, avoiding any type of pollen contamination. I had no problem with bumble bee pollination (Bombus funebris), I obtained a high amount of seed. I collected these bees from the outside because I do not know a method for rearing them. If you know a method I will be glad if you could help me. I did have problems working with Apis mellifera, because they were submissed to stress conditions. They were confined into a small space (1.5 meters width, 2 meters length and 2 meters high), with no way for getting out. I fed them only with sugar solution, so they were forced to search for pollen, encouraging them to pollinate my Oxalis flowers. At first I reached excellent results, obtaining a high amount of sexual seed, but then my bees stoped pollinating and died. I think the main problem I have is weather, we have an average temperature of 13 xC and we are at 3050 meters high. I will be glad to receive advice related to these type of work. Believe it or not, this is the first work made on controlled sexual seed production in Ecuador, and the first done on Oxalis tuberosa on the whole world. So I hope you understand the scarcity of bibliography and few help I have here in South America. I will be glad if some of you could help me. THANKING YOU IN ADVANCE, Ana Maria -- Ana Maria Quinones Centro Internacional de la Papa Casilla 17-16-129-CEQ Quito, Ecuador Telf. +593-2-690990, Internet: QUINONES@cip.org.ec ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 11:12:45 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Doug Yanega Subject: Oxalis and Apis (Re: Bee pollination for sexual seed production!!) Ana Maria Quinones wrote: >I did have problems working with Apis mellifera, because they were >submissed to stress conditions. They were confined into a small >space (1.5 meters width, 2 meters length and 2 meters high), with no >way for getting out. I fed them only with sugar solution, so they >were forced to search for pollen, encouraging them to pollinate my >Oxalis flowers. At first I reached excellent results, obtaining a >high amount of sexual seed, but then my bees stoped pollinating >and died. I think the main problem I have is weather, .... Maybe other folks on the list can correct me, but aren't Apis intolerant of oxalic acid? I recall that larvae die when fed pollen containing things like calcium oxalate (such as _Heliconia_ pollen). Seems like Oxalis is fairly likely to have some nasty oxalates in either its pollen or nectar, no? If so, maybe this is a case where knowledge of the native pollinators of the plant may be essential for success. Doug Yanega Illinois Natural History Survey, 607 E. Peabody Dr. Champaign, IL 61820 USA phone (217) 244-6817, fax (217) 333-4949 affiliate, Univ. of Illinois Urbana-Champaign, Dept. of Entomology http://www.inhs.uiuc.edu:80/~dyanega/my_home.html "There are some enterprises in which a careful disorderliness is the true method" - Herman Melville, Moby Dick, Chap. 82 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 18 Mar 1996 18:17:38 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Gordon Scott Subject: Re: Diazinon In-Reply-To: On Sun, 17 Mar 1996, Adony Melathopoulos wrote: > On Sat, 16 Mar 1996, Laura A. Downey wrote: > > > I have root maggots in my vegetable garden which I will be treating with > > something that is safe to my honeybees. At the garden store today, they > > recommended Diazinon. > > As far as organophorphorous insecticides go, diazinon is one of the more > harmful compounds to honey bees. > I'm not sure about soil drench applications, but I suspect > they are safe too, but i'm not as sure. I'm always cautious about pesticides in water near bees. Bees regularly collect water from damp ground and take it to the colony for cooling and to thin honey for consumption, so this could even be the *worst* way to apply a pesticide. I guess, if the areas are small, you could cover the ground with plastic sheeting after application. That may not be feasible if it's hundreds of Aquare miles :-) Regards, -- Gordon Scott gordon@apis.demon.co.uk gordon@multitone.co.uk (work) The Basingstoke Beekeeper (newsletter) beekeeper@apis.demon.co.uk Embryo Home Page Beekeeper; Kendo 3rd Dan; Sometime sailor. Hampshire, England. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 14:38:56 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Stan Sandler Subject: Re: Diazinon >I realize that diazinon is a dangerous pesticide to use around beehives, but >sometimes there seems to be no alternative. In southern Michigan, we have a >medium sized ant species (black and brown) that builds large hills.... I have also resorted to using diazinon in desperation in my overwintering areas as an ant control. These areas are ant heaven due to large amounts of dead bees in the spring, occasional sugar syrup spills, and they are cut right into the southern edge of thick coniferous forest. I usually wait until I have moved the majority of the hives out. We have a very small red ant here that lives in sandy soil and does not seem to have a concentrated nest site. That is, there are numerous small entrances in the ground all through the whole area. Fortuneately this ant is not a deadly pest. It can enter the hive through very small cracks, but its only interest seems to be in seeking sweets. The carpenter ants will go right into the bottom boards and supers of any hive that is weak. In Kenya I noticed that all the hives are suspended with greased ropes as ant/termite control. I used to have some hive stands on legs that I put in cans of oil. But once I started keeping larger numbers and moving them this was impractical. I wish someone would suggest some alternatives. I can suggest one fairly mild ant killer, but in my experience it is only useful against smaller ant colonies. I use it in blueberry fields (which are acidic and often highly ant infested). If you buy a box of powdered borax laundry powder (this is about 99% pure borax in the popular brand) you can mix it into a heavy sugar syrup but do not exceed 5% or the ants might not take the bait back into their nest. I usually place the bait under old boards, but I have often worried that the bees might find some. Could anyone comment on the toxicity of borax to honeybees. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 13:50:17 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Diana Sammataro Subject: scales Hey, do you have an extra scale to weight out sugar, etc. I can't find one here big enough. Didn't you have two at the bee lab? or am I haluncinating again. I hate rain... Diana Sammataro, Ph.D. The Ohio State University, OARDC/ Dept. Entomology Extension Bee Laboratory, 1680 Madison Avenue Wooster, OH 44691 Phone: (216) 263 3684 Fax: (216) 262 2720 Email: Sammataro.1@osu.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 13:52:18 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Diana Sammataro Subject: Re: Austrian Carnies Sorry, I sent the message to all of you, it was going to someone else. I look more carefully at the return next time, D Diana Sammataro, Ph.D. The Ohio State University, OARDC/ Dept. Entomology Extension Bee Laboratory, 1680 Madison Avenue Wooster, OH 44691 Phone: (216) 263 3684 Fax: (216) 262 2720 Email: Sammataro.1@osu.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 15:42:00 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder John Spaulding >I've opened my hives to see if millet is in storage where you would see >pollen normally. >There was a light colored dust there but I couldn't tell if it was millet. >Does anyone one now if they can actually use millet or birdseed as a I don't know if they could use it as a protien source. I did notice last year that one hive had the bottom board covered in millet seed, very shiny as if it had been polished. These were bees I observed on my bird feeder rolling around. **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 16:44:29 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder In-Reply-To: <199603192052.PAA08150@segwun.muskoka.net> On Tue, 19 Mar 1996, David Eyre wrote: > I don't know if they could use it as a protien source. I did notice last > year that one hive had the bottom board covered in millet seed, very shiny I've often seen seeds of all sorts on the bottom board. Iv'e always assumed they were brought in by mammals. Last year I examined alot of sticky boards for varroa counting. Not only did I find seeds but also hair and droppings I thought were from mice or shrews. These boards were were in during May, June, July, and part of Aug. Each bord was in for about 10 days. bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb b b b Vince & Carole Coppola vcoppola@epix.net b b Coppola Apiaries, (716)965-2904 b b 10220 Bradigan Rd. b b Forestville, N.Y. 14062 b b b b Queens bred for tracheal mite resistance b b Honey , Pollination b b Western New York Beekeepers Association b b b bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 14:41:20 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder In-Reply-To: On Tue, 19 Mar 1996, Vince Coppola wrote: > On Tue, 19 Mar 1996, David Eyre wrote: > > > I don't know if they could use it as a protien source. I did notice last > > year that one hive had the bottom board covered in millet seed, very shiny > > I've often seen seeds of all sorts on the bottom board. Iv'e always > assumed they were brought in by mammals. Last year I examined alot of > sticky boards for varroa counting. Not only did I find seeds but also > hair and droppings I thought were from mice or shrews. These boards were > were in during May, June, July, and part of Aug. Each bord was in for > about 10 days. >> b > Hi , I read an article form Steve Taber once about the things that the bees would bring back to the hive instead of pollen. Most of it was very poor proten. Some times they try to feed it to the larva with bad results. I think its a good idea to watch for what they are brining in to the hive. I feed pollen in the early spring to some hives , but I do like to see them bringing in there own fresh pollen. I was checking a bottem board yesterday and found hair plus some small seeds , but no mites. Roy ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 19:42:50 PST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Gerard Philip Worrell Subject: Re: Bee-autiful Screen Saver :) >|< This is more like the drones chasing the virgin Queen. It's pretty good. Try it!! ------------------------------------- Name: Gerard Philip Worrell, Beekeeper with 25 colonies E-mail: worrell@pop.radix.net (Gerard Philip Worrell) Pres. Assoc. of So.MD. Beekeepers, Life member MSBA Dunkirk MD 20754 (410)257-3267 This message was sent by Chameleon ------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 19:52:21 EST Reply-To: Midnight Networks' Support Team Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Glen B. Glater" Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder >>>> Now, to the request for help. We have three bird feeders (seed) around >>>> our house and have recently had some kind of bees or wasps swarming around >>>> the feeders when it's warm out and cleaning out the feeders. Usually, I saw bird seed at the entrance to and a bit inside our hive last week. I worried that mice may have brought the seed in, but this message says that it was probably the bees! Perhaps the seed is covered in pollen? This is a weird one... Who ever heard of "seed eating" bees? --glen ************************************************************** Midnight Networks Inc. * 200 Fifth Avenue * Waltham, MA 02154 Glen B. Glater Principal, Strategic Networking Group Phone: (617) 890-1001 Fax: (617) 890-0028 Internet: glen@midnight.com http://www.midnight.com/~glen Midnight Networks Inc. WWW page http://www.midnight.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 18:57:33 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: BusyKnight Subject: Re: scales >extra scale....Didn't you have two at the bee lab? >or am I haluncinating again. "AGAIN" ???? I think this bares a little explaination.... to the whole list! BusyKnight busykngt@airmail.net ICBM INcode:N:32.45'W:96.45' Republic of Texas GE - We bring good things to life, And a leading manufacturer of Thermonuclear bombs. Life, we make it glow in the dark! ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 21:30:14 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "prof. osmar malaspina" Subject: Re: Request for address In-Reply-To: <01I2IIUXF7J69AQ0TL@delphi.com> On Tue, 19 Mar 1996, Jeremy Burbidge wrote: > 19th March 96 > > I wish to obtain the e-mail address or phone number of David DeJong in Brazil. > Please can anyone or David supply > > Jeremy Burbidge > > ruxbury@delphi.com > The e-mail address is iussi@fmrp.usp.br. osmar malaspina CEIS/IBRC/UNESP Sao Paulo/Brasil malaspin@rcb000.uesp.ansp.br ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 19:57:14 EST Reply-To: "Glen B. Glater" Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Glen B. Glater" Subject: sugar concentration question I've been "discussing" this with the co-keeper of our hives: should we bee feeding 1:1 or 2:1 sugar:water at this time? I think that 1:1 will encourage egg production, but he says that if the queens not laying by now we're in trouble anyway, and that we should be giving them lots o'food. Opinions? --glen ************************************************************** Midnight Networks Inc. * 200 Fifth Avenue * Waltham, MA 02154 Glen B. Glater Principal, Strategic Networking Group Phone: (617) 890-1001 Fax: (617) 890-0028 Internet: glen@midnight.com http://www.midnight.com/~glen Midnight Networks Inc. WWW page http://www.midnight.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 19:29:16 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Monarch Watch Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder/seeds and bees There have been a number of posting concerning bees and seeds and it seems that because several people have found seeds on bottom boards or at hive entrances, it seems logical to conclude that bees carry seeds. In any earlier note I claimed that bees were not structurally adapted to carry seeds but this is just an assertion based the morphology of the legs and 35 years of observing bees. It could be I've missed something. What we need is evidence - real observations of bees carrying seeds or even indirect evidence, say from pollen traps. If bees carry seeds, we should be able to get this on video, and even if we can't catch them in the act, the seeds should be scrapped off into the collection box on a good pollen trap - one which is sound enough to exclude mice. Can't say I've found seeds in pollen traps (N=50) I've run in the spring myself. Has anyone else? Monarch Watch EMAIL: monarch@falcon.cc.ukans.edu URL: http://monarch.bio.ukans.edu DPLEX-L: send message "info DPLEX-L" to listserv@ukanaix.cc.ukans.edu PHONE: (913) 864 4051 FAX: (913) 864 5321 SNAIL: c/o O.R. Taylor, Dept. of Entomology, Univ. of KS, Lawrence KS 66045 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 00:23:33 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "my name is Dean M. Breaux" Subject: Importation of Bee Semen into the USA (What do you think?) Comments: cc: BCULTURE@aol.com One of many concerns that I have as a breeder of bees in the USA is the fact that we in this country do not have access to the work that is being done in other parts of the globe with regards to the bee stocks themselves. Due to this limitation we in the USA may be suffering economically due to losses of colonies due to tracheal mites and varroa etc. I have received requests from many parts of the world in regards to stock. While other parts of the globe have access to the improvements in stock we have made here, we do not have the same rights. This is due as I understand it to a law against the import of foreign races of bees that dates back to 1922. I understand that the importation of bees has many hazards i.e. Mites and other things that we do not have here in the United States. While I agree that importation of the bees is dangerous, I can not for the life of me understand why in 1996 after half a century of Instrumental Insemination that we are not allowed to at least import seamen from areas of selected desirable stocks.( i.e. from Italy , France, Austria or from some place where they have bees eating mites making honey) It would seem to me that we should at least be able to import semen from the gene pools of the bee stocks that we now have. I know all of the reasons for not allowing us to do this, if you would like a complete list try to bring bee semen into the USA. My main point is this, practical bee research is a precious commodity and it is extremely expensive. Why should we limit ourselves to the resources that we have here in the USA. We need not be so arrogant to think that if some one else develops a bee resistant to mites or a better honey producer that we can do the same. Even if we can, at what cost in time and resources. Please do not misunderstand my motives, this is not a slight to anyone in the United States Government or the research community. It is however an issue that needs to be addressed by the American beekeepers. This is in fact a law, and I for one would like to see it modified at the very least to allow the importation of semen. I think it would be, for the good of the United States Beekeeping community. It would even allow for the creation of joint research projects between countries working with same stocks. The benefits would be many and the draw backs few. I would be very interested to hear any and all comments on this issue as it is something that needs to be addressed by the United States beekeeping fraternity. If any one wishes to contact me directly please feel free, however, I am interested to hear how others feel on this subject. I in fact would welcome the open disscussion of this topic. Waiting for your comments Dean ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 19 Mar 1996 23:14:32 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Bruce Hamilton Subject: Telling The Bees I would like to thank list members for all the help. I finally have found the poem, 'Telling the Bees'. It was not written by Emily Dickinson, as was indicated by Adams in, "Beekeeping: The Gentle Craft". (Or at the very least, I have not yet found any such work, by Dickinson, but I have yet to ask any Dickinson scholars. She does have many bee references in her works.) The work with the title, 'Telling the Bees' was written by:John Greenleaf Whittier. As thanks, I will now include the text of telling the bees. Many thanks to Doug Angerman, who sent me the work, and to the many others who offered to send it to me. It is from from the collection of bee poetry A Murmur of Bees by Amoret Scott - Oxford Illustrated Press LTD. It looks like a wonderful collection! Bruce Hamilton (Cerebral Beekeeper) Vancouver, BC. Canada ------------------------------------------------- Telling the Bees Here is the place; right over the hill Runs the path I took; You can see the gap in the old wall still, And the stepping-stones in the shallow brook. There is the house, with the gate red-barred, And the poplars tall; And the barn's brown length, and the cattle yard, And the white horns tossing above the wall. There are the beehives ranged in the sun; And down by the Brink Of the brook are her poor flowers, weed-o'errun, Pansy and daffodil, rose and pink. A year has gone, as the tortoise goes, Heavy and slow; And the same rose blows, and the same sun glows, And the same brook sings of a year ago. There's the same sweet clover-smell in the breeze; And the June sun warm Tangles his wings of fire in the trees, Setting as then, over Fernside farm. I mind me how with a lover's care From my Sunday Coat I brushed of the burrs, and smoothed my hair, And cooled at the brookside my brow and throat. Since we parted, a month had passed,- To love, a year; Down through the beeches I looked at last On the little red gate and the well-seep near. I can see it all now,- the slantwise rain Of light through the leaves, The sundown's blaze on her window-pane, The bloom of her roses under the eves. Just the same as a month before,- The house and the trees, The barn's brown gable, the vine by the door,- Nothing changed but the hives of bees. Before them, under the garden wall, Forward and back, Went drearily singing the chore-girl small, Draping each hive with a shred of black. Trembling, I listened: the summer sun Had the chill of snow; For I knew she was telling the bees of one Gone on the journey we all must go! Then I said to myself, 'My Mary weeps For the dead to-day: Haply her blind old grandsire sleeps The fret and pain of his age away.' But her dog whined low; on the doorway sill, With his cane to his chin, The old man sat; and the chore-girl still Sang to the bees stealing out and in. And the song she was singing ever since In my ear sounds on:- 'Stay at home, pretty bees, fly not hence! Mistress Mary is dead and gone! John Greenleaf Whittier 1807-1892 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 08:48:44 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Dave D. Cawley, a De Leon Socialist" Subject: Re: Diazinon Comments: To: "Laura A. Downey" In-Reply-To: <199603161751.MAA08526@smarty.smart.net> I vote for the nematodes. Diazanon smell like someone puked all over the place. I used it for ants in my foundation about 5 years ago and after 5 minutes of spraying I has to get out the garden hose to try to dilute the stench! Have your husband smell it at teh garden store before deciding... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Dave D. Cawley | Where a social revolution is pending and, University Of Scranton | for whatever reason, is not accomplished, ddc1@jaguar.uofs.edu | reaction is the alternative. ddc1@SCRANTON | -Daniel De Leon ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 09:06:05 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Dave D. Cawley, a De Leon Socialist" Subject: Re: Importation of Bee Semen into the USA (What do you think?) In-Reply-To: <960320002332_172650759@emout04.mail.aol.com> Has anyone come up with an alternative bill? Has anyone contacted a member of Congress about it? Does anyone have a copy of that law handy, I'd like to see it. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Dave D. Cawley | Where a social revolution is pending and, University Of Scranton | for whatever reason, is not accomplished, ddc1@jaguar.uofs.edu | reaction is the alternative. ddc1@SCRANTON | -Daniel De Leon ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 15:15:11 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Vydra, Vitezslav" Organization: Faculty of Civil Engineering Subject: Re: Spring Feeding On 18 Mar 96 at 12:09, richard albert wrote: > 1) I live in Southern New Brunswick. Presently, night time temperatures > approx. -10 to -5 C. Day time temperatures approx. -3 to +6 C. > > 2) My 10 hives are wrapped up in black tar paper. They all have upper > ventilation holes cut out of the inner cover rim. I have access to the > inner cover through a "bonnet" of straw insulation covering it. The straw, > I noticed, is fairly wet and mouldy. > > 3) I am concerned that their honey stores will be insufficient to carry > them through to Spring. > > 4) Is it feasible at this time, given the low temperatures, to place a > gallon jar of sugar water (1:1) over the hole in the inner cover to feed > them. Yes, I do this sometimes with aim to supply bees with water, which is scarce in the early spring, when temperatures are too low for bees to collect enough water outside. It works well on condition that the jar (instead of jars you may use 2l PET returnable bottles making 2mm hole in a screw cap.) is kept warm (i.e. in dry straw). In case that the jar is not warm enough the bees will not take the syrup, so I guess you can't make any harm anyway. Vita * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Vitezslav Vydra * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Department of Physics * Katedra fyziky * * Faculty of Civil Engineering * Stavebni fakulta * * Czech Technical University * Ceske vysoke uceni technicke* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Thakurova 7, CZ-166 29 Praha 6, Czech Republic * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 10:40:17 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Susan W. Cobey" Subject: Re: Importation of Bee Semen Concerning Importation: Dean made some valid points. Research into mite resistance is expensive and labor intensive. Resources available for this are increasingly limited. The U.S. beekeeping industry can benefit from the work accomplished abroad as well as future collaborations in this effort. The more who are working toward this goal, the better we will be able to build on each others progress. For this reason, I believe private research institutions as well as commercial queen breeders should have access to genetically improved stock. It will take the cooperative effort of researchers to develop the methodology for selection for mite resistance, combined with efforts by the industry to maintain and propagate this. At present importation is restricted to USDA. The law, in part this states: Animal Health Inspection Service , USDA Part 322 - Honey bees and Honey Bee semen No persons may import honey bees or honey bee semen, except as otherwise provided in this part. The criteria for determining which countries may be listed in this part as countries from which honey bees or honey bee semen may be imported into the U,.S are set forth in 7 USC 281. a.) In order to prevent the introduction and spreadof disease and parasites harmful to honey bees, and the introduction of genetically undesirable germ plasm of honey bees, the importation of honey bees into the U.S of all honey bees is prohibited, except that honey bees may be imported into the U.S 1. By USDA for experimental or scientific purposes. 2. From countries determined by the Sec. of Agriculture. b.) Honey bees or honey bee semen from Canada may be imported. c.) Honey bee semen from any country listed below is designated as a restricted article and may be imported only in accordance with the provisions in this part. (imported under conditions specified on the departmental permit and approved by the Deputy Administrator) Australia, Bermuda, France, Great Britian, New Zealand, Sweden You can get a copy of the 1922 law from the Library of Congress. Better yet, ask your Congressman for help. Susan Cobey Ohio State University Dept. of Entomology 1735 Neil Ave. Columbus, OH 43210 Tel.(614) 292-7928 Fax (614) 292 2180 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 11:04:26 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: Re: Importation of Bee Semen into the USA (What do you think?) In-Reply-To: <960320002332_172650759@emout04.mail.aol.com> On Wed, 20 Mar 1996, my name is Dean M. Breaux wrote: > practical bee research is a precious commodity and it is extremely expensive. > Why should we limit ourselves to the resources that we have here in the USA. > We need not be so arrogant to think that if some one else develops a bee > resistant to mites or a better honey producer that we can do the same. Even > if we can, at what cost in time and resources. I'm not opposed to the importation of semen but I am not sure we are ready for it. If we had the semen from a truly resistant line, we would still have to do all the very expensive selection and assay work that it took in the the first place, or the traits will be lost. Sure this is the best approach to our problem but I doubt the industrys desire or ability to support such work. This may sound negative but just look at all the unused research we have now. Most beekeepers are not willing or able to incorporate new techniques into their management. Even re-queening isn't practiced enough. How many beekeepers will adopt a system of disease control that requires real queen management ? How many will simply look for cheaper chemicals ? How did beekeepers choose to deal with AFB ? T-mites ? ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 08:08:37 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Importation of Bee Semen into the USA (What do you think?) In-Reply-To: <960320002332_172650759@emout04.mail.aol.com> On Wed, 20 Mar 1996, my name is Dean M. Breaux wrote: > One of many concerns that I have as a breeder of bees in the USA is the fact > that we in this country do not have access to the work that is being done in > other parts of the globe with regards to the bee stocks themselves. Due to > this limitation we in the USA may be suffering economically due to losses of > colonies due to tracheal mites and varroa etc. > > I have received requests from many parts of the world in regards to stock. > While other parts of the globe have access to the improvements in stock we > have made here, we do not have the same rights. This is due as I understand > it to a law against the import of foreign races of bees that dates back to > 1922. > > I understand that the importation of bees has many hazards i.e. Mites and > other things that we do not have here in the United States. While I agree > that importation of the bees is dangerous, I can not for the life of me > understand why in 1996 after half a century of Instrumental Insemination that > we are not allowed to at least import seamen from areas of selected desirable > stocks.( i.e. from Italy , France, Austria or from some place where they have > bees eating mites making honey) It would seem to me that we should at least > be able to import semen from the gene pools of the bee stocks that we now > have. > > I know all of the reasons for not allowing us to do this, if you would like a > complete list try to bring bee semen into the USA. My main point is this, > practical bee research is a precious commodity and it is extremely expensive. > Why should we limit ourselves to the resources that we have here in the USA. > We need not be so arrogant to think that if some one else develops a bee > resistant to mites or a better honey producer that we can do the same. Even > if we can, at what cost in time and resources. > > Please do not misunderstand my motives, this is not a slight to anyone in > the United States Government or the research community. It is however an > issue that needs to be addressed by the American beekeepers. This is in fact > a law, and I for one would like to see it modified at the very least to allow > the importation of semen. I think it would be, for the good of the United > States Beekeeping community. It would even allow for the creation of joint > research projects between countries working with same stocks. The benefits > would be many and the draw backs few. Hello , Dean, you did a beautiful job on your post. As we speak there is some work a foot to get the law changed and semen into the US.It will not happen with just a couple of people working onit. Your right it takes the whole beekeeping group. I was cheating a little,I'm after the almound growers ,they have a lot of money to loose if we keep loosing bees. I have sent a letter to Dr. Rinderer about 2 weeks ago about this subject. The truth of the matter is simple. Old law needs change. Who does not want change? This is not pointed at any person. Its how you get change in the government.You stated the case for change very well. Now comes the hard part , getting enough beekeepers to stand up and be counted. When Vince put the poll on the list for us to take , he did not get many replys. Thats normal for beekeepers in the USA. If people who love bees would stand together the problem would be solved soon. The problem will be solved because we all need to help each other in the research and we can't do it the way things are now. This Varroa mite problem is more complex than just the mite itself.Viruses are spread by the mite.Thats a fact and only one virus has an antiserum. We need to see how many beekeepers want to save money and there bees.You put a large team of researchers working on a problem and it will be solved much sooner. As we all know a genetic fix will take time , but it is the only way to have a lasting fix . Everyone have a great day and remember that a little from each one of us will be alot. We are not talking money , we need names. Roy ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 12:13:46 EST Reply-To: "Glen B. Glater" Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Glen B. Glater" Subject: Re: Importation of Bee Semen >The law, in part this states: [deleted by glen] >You can get a copy of the 1922 law from the Library of Congress. Better >yet, ask your Congressman for help. Hey, this is the Internet!! Check out http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/7/ch11.html. Specifically, Section 281 states: 281. Importation of honeybees and honeybee semen restricted (a) Honeybees In order to prevent the introduction and spread of diseases and parasites harmful to honeybees, and the introduction of genetically undesirable germ plasm of honeybees, the importation into the United States of all honeybees is prohibited, except that honeybees may be imported into the United States - (1) by the United States Department of Agriculture for experimental or scientific purposes; (2) from countries determined by the Secretary of Agriculture - (A) to be free of diseases or parasites harmful to honeybees, and undesirable species or subspecies of honeybees; and (B) to have in operation precautions adequate to prevent the importation of honeybees from other countries where harmful diseases or parasites, or undesirable species or subspecies, of honeybees exist; or (3) from Canada or Mexico, subject to such terms and conditions as the Secretary of Agriculture determines appropriate, if the Secretary determines that the region of Canada or Mexico from which the honeybees originated is, and is likely to remain, free of diseases or parasites harmful to honeybees, and undesirable species or subspecies of honeybees. (b) Honeybee semen Honeybee semen may be imported into the United States only from (1) countries determined by the Secretary of Agriculture to be free of undesirable species or subspecies of honeybees, and which have in operation precautions adequate to prevent the importation of such undesirable honeybees and their semen, or (2) Canada or Mexico, if the Secretary of Agriculture determines that the region of Canada or Mexico from which the imports originate is, and is likely to remain, free of undesirable species or subspecies of honeybees. (c) Rules and regulations Honeybees and honeybee semen imported pursuant to subsections (a) and (b) of this section shall be imported under such rules and regulations as the Secretary of Agriculture and the Secretary of the Treasury shall prescribe. (d) Destruction or immediate exportation of nonexcepted honeybees or honeybee semen offered for import or intercepted Except with respect to honeybees and honeybee semen imported pursuant to subsections (a) and (b) of this section, all honeybees or honeybee semen offered for import or intercepted entering the United States shall be destroyed or immediately exported. (e) ''Honeybee'' defined As used in this chapter, the term ''honeybee'' means all life stages and the germ plasm of honeybees of the genus Apis, except honeybee semen. ************************************************************** Midnight Networks Inc. * 200 Fifth Avenue * Waltham, MA 02154 Glen B. Glater Principal, Strategic Networking Group Phone: (617) 890-1001 Fax: (617) 890-0028 Internet: glen@midnight.com http://www.midnight.com/~glen Midnight Networks Inc. WWW page http://www.midnight.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 09:27:15 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: John Day Subject: bee flowers hi everyone, some time back a few folks were trying to figure out what were the best types of flowering plants to buy for their bees. i was at a market where a vendor had lots of plants for sale, and i asked him what he thought would be good for bees. here's what he told me: "well, those over there usually have the most on them when i go to the nursery to buy my stock" what a terrific observation! so, if you want to determine what's good, go to one of those commercial nurseries, where they have hundreds of 1 gallon pots out in rows for the landscapers to select, and check which ones have the most bees. you'll have your answer. i won't tell you which ones are good, because everyone has different plants for their climate / state / country. hope this is useful information to you all. John ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 15:20:15 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Stan Sandler Subject: salt A science show on our canadian radio network called "Quirks and Quarks" had an interview on Saturday with an entomologist studying a tropical moth that can drink (while simultaneously excreting) 60 times its body weight in water in an hour. It does this to extract a small quantity of valuable salt. I have often noticed the bees flying to spots where my cows salt licks WERE (they seem to prefer this to the higher salt content of the blocks themselves) and also to puddles of runoff from the manure pile. I assume the bees are collecting salt because they have clean sources of water available at closer distances. The salt licks are also frequently visited by swallowtail butterflies. I have one lobster fisherman living close to a beeyard who complains that he has to search through his oilclothes before he puts them on in the morning because the bees swarm all over them when he hangs them up when he gets home. We often assume, incorrectly IMHO, that honey and pollen and water and propolis are the only things that bees collect. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 15:20:12 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Stan Sandler Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder/seeds and bees >There have been a number of posting concerning bees and seeds and it seems >that because several people have found seeds on bottom boards or at hive >entrances, it seems logical to conclude that bees carry seeds. In any >earlier note I claimed that bees were not structurally adapted to carry >seeds but this is just an assertion based the morphology of the legs and 35 >years of observing bees. It could be I've missed something. What we need is >evidence - real observations of bees carrying seeds or even indirect >evidence, say from pollen traps. If bees carry seeds, we should be able to >get this on video, and even if we can't catch them in the act, the seeds >should be scrapped off into the collection box on a good pollen trap - one >which is sound enough to exclude mice. Can't say I've found seeds in pollen >traps (N=50) I've run in the spring myself. Has anyone else? I do not know whether the bees can carry seeds, however, I would note that most of the people posting to this thread have noted that this is a depraved behaviour only seen when pollen sources are not available and the bees are craving pollen. I think it is unlikely that you have pollen traps in place before pollen is available (correct me if I am wrong) and this might explain the absence of seeds. I will note that I feed pollen substitute as a powder outside before I make up the pollen substitute candy that I feed on the top bars. Sometimes there are small lumps of soy flour or granules of milk powder that escaped being powdered or pollen pellets if I have added them. The bees are quite comical trying to deal with these. They cannot use normal combing behaviour but they do seem to be rolling around working them with their legs and trying to stuff them into their pollen baskets. I cannot actually say that I have seen them being successful in this, and the granules left over when the powder is gone would lead one to believe that not too many are successful, but they do seem to be attempting a behaviour which could conceivably lead to stuffing something the right size in their corbiculae. It would be a good observation project for one of your entomology students. Milk powder granules are highly attractive in early spring, and have sufficient roughness for the bees to handle them easily. Stan ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 13:04:04 PST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Adrian Wenner Subject: Re: salt Stan Sandler wrote: >I have often noticed the bees flying to spots where my cows salt licks WERE >(they seem to prefer this to the higher salt content of the blocks >themselves) and also to puddles of runoff from the manure pile. I assume >the bees are collecting salt because they have clean sources of water >available at closer distances. The salt licks are also frequently visited >by swallowtail butterflies. >We often assume, incorrectly IMHO, that honey and pollen and water and >propolis are the only things that bees collect. ******* I have often noticed bees collecting liquid from outdoor toilets, also. My uncle Leo, a large scale beekeeper in northern California at the time, regularly salted some of the seeps visited by bees near his yards. The bees preferentially visited those spots on the seeps. Adrian *************************************************************** * Adrian Wenner E-Mail wenner@lifesci.lscf.ucsb.edu * * Dept.Ecol.,Evol.,& Mar.Biol. Office Phone (805) 893-2838 * * University of California Lab Phone (805) 893-2675 * * Santa Barbara, CA 93106 FAX (805) 893-8062 * * * * "Once a structurally complete and closed system of opinions * *consisting of many details and relations has been formed, it * *offers enduring resistance to anything that contradicts it." * * Ludwik Fleck, 1935 [1979] * *************************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 17:41:25 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Malcolm (Tom) Sanford, Florida Extension Apiculturist" Subject: March issue of APIS Distributed to: USR:[MTS]INTERNET.DIS;85, mts FILENAME: MARAPIS.96 Florida Extension Beekeeping Newsletter Apis--Apicultural Information and Issues (ISSN 0889-3764) Volume 14, Number 3, March 1996 Copyright (c) 1996 M.T. Sanford "All Rights Reserved" A POLLINATION CRISIS? There is another APIS newsletter in the world. Hopefully, this fact will not confuse those reading this publication. Anyway, it's pretty removed from the U.S. audience, down under in Australia. The full title is Apis Melbourne. The editor, Mr. Frank Hosemans, has reprinted information from this newsletter on occasion. An article in his publication brings up an ages-old debate: the ecological consequences of introducing Apis mellifera around the world. The following was published in the January 1996 issue of Apis Melbourne. It quotes an article from the Melbourne Sun, published January 22, 1996: "The humble honeybee is one of Australia's most environmentally damaging creatures, according to a scientist. Dr. Graham Pike said the honeybee was responsible for driving out several native species of fauna as well as having a bad effect on Australian flora. While the theory is not new, Dr. Pike said evidence was mounting to support the idea that the honeybee was having a long-term impact on the environment. "Introduced to Australia from Europe in 1822, the honeybee was an established feral predator competing with the 3000 Australian native species of bees for territory, Dr. Pike said. It stole pollen and nectar from under the noses of native bees, moths, butterflies and birds such as the honeyeater, forcing native species out of the environment. It also competed with native fauna for tree hollows and was a poor pollinator of Australian flora -- thereby retarding natural ecological development. Dr. Pike said while there were imperfections in some of the research done on the bees, there was overwhelming evidence pointing to honeybees having a damaging effect on the Australian environment. "When you look at all these facts pointing to honeybees having a negative impact on flora and fauna you have a strong prima facie case," Dr. Pike, an expert in pollination ecology, said. Field studies have shown heavy impact on native fauna and flora in areas where high concentrations of honeybees were found. "Most bees you see are honeybees, they use most of the Australian flora and this results in poor pollination because they haven't adapted to Australian flora," he said. But Dr. Pike's contentions have been met with opposition from the beekeeping industry. Honeybees are a huge industry in Australia worth tens of millions of dollars a year. "Let's say we don't see eye to eye," said Dr. Pike. Dr. Pike said studies were being done into possible poison control methods to reduce the numbers of feral bees. A program of no new licences for beekeepers under New South Wales State Government legislation would also see the eventful phasing out of licences," he said. [Mr. Hosemans added an editor's note: "Recent scientific findings are contrary to the theme of this article, and should be highlighted to counter this continuous push to drive out the beekeeper from native forests."] Mr. Hosemans' remarks notwithstanding, many of Dr. Pike's arguments seem pertinent to a number of world regions where honey bees have been introduced. They have also been reiterated on occasion in Florida, which has many unique ecosystems that exotic species might affect. This is the reason those in charge of state preserves and other "natural" areas have considered actively eliminating beekeepers. In the past, the argument that feral honey bees would simply fill the void left by beekeepers existed. And there is the pollination value of honey bees in both wild and agricultural areas. Honey bees, however, are not necessarily the best pollinators in all situations (see June 1992 APIS). No efforts to reduce honey bee populations by poisoning feral colonies have been proposed in the Sunshine State to my knowledge. However, at least one recent event may have in fact created results that might be expected from such a program. Introduction of Varroa into Florida appears to have eliminated many feral honey bee colonies, setting the stage for a possible native pollinator comeback of some proportions. Unfortunately, unmanaged pollinators are also in danger from many of the same phenomena that have affected honey bees in the past. These organisms, however, have no beekeepers to intervene when threatened with adversity. The risk exists, therefore, that an as-yet-unnoticed crisis in pollination in both agricultural and so-called "natural" areas might be brewing. This potential lack of pollinators has also been a concern outside Florida, according to the February 7, 1996 edition of PANUPS, Pesticide Action Network North America Updates Service: http://www.panna.org/panna/ on the world wide web. "Agricultural production could be threatened if populations of bees and other pollinators continue to decline, according to the Forgotten Pollinators Campaign, a recently launched effort to educate the public about pollinators' critical economic and agricultural importance. The Campaign emphasizes North American agriculture and ecology, but advocates greater awareness and protection of pollinators worldwide. Most fruits and vegetables consumed globally grow as a result of pollination, the process by which pollen is carried from one flower to another, thereby increasing the chances for fertilization and fruit production. According to the campaign's literature, a recent survey of wild plants documented that over 60% of the plant species studied may suffer reduced seed set due to pollinator scarcity. "The Campaign, initiated by the Arizona-Sonora Desert Museum (ASDM) in Tucson, Arizona, aims to create common cause among farmers, pesticide reform activists, beekeepers, plant and animal conservationists and green belt proponents, all of whom may be concerned about declining pollinators -- especially honey bees -- and the lack of policies aimed at protecting them. According to Gary Paul Nabhan, a crop ecologist and Director of Science for the Campaign, pesticide use, disease, habitat fragmentation, and the arrival of Africanized bees in North America have dramatically reduced honey bee populations in the U.S., by as much as 25% since 1990. "Honey bees and the 4,000-5,000 species of wild bees native to North America pollinate 60 major crops in the U.S., including potatoes, melons, cotton, onions and almonds. According to the Forgotten Pollinators Campaign, the pollination services provided by wild and domestic bees are 40-50 times more valuable than the market price of all honey produced in the U.S. Steve Buchmann, a specialist with the U.S. Department of Agriculture (USDA) bee laboratory in Tucson, Arizona and a research associate at the Campaign, recently stated that the hidden value to crop pollination by bees could be as high as US $10 billion. Other significant pollinators include flies, butterflies, moths, beetles, hummingbirds and bats. "To illustrate the impacts of declining pollinator populations on agricultural production, Nabhan points to cranberry bogs, where as many as 20 million flowers bloom on each acre, but less than a third of the flowers develop into ripened fruit in years when pollinators are scarce. In 1970 widespread organophosphate spraying (mostly fenitrothion) for spruce budworms decimated native bee populations, causing cranberry yields to plummet from 5.5 million pounds in 1969 to 1.5 million pounds in 1970. More recently, the California almond industry has begun borrowing bee hives from other states to compensate for pollinator scarcity, and the 1995 New York pumpkin crop suffered from a paucity of native bees. "Wild pollinators are often more vulnerable to pesticides than domestic honey bees, and the Campaign calls for more stringent controls of toxic chemical applications near their nesting and foraging sites and for better training of pesticide applicators in monitoring for pollinators. Pollinators receive only piecemeal attention at university agricultural programs and government agencies. "The Campaign calls for placing greater emphasis on pollinator diversity and ecology at agricultural schools. It also urges USDA, the U.S. National Biological Service and similar agencies in other countries to take comprehensive inventories of crop pollinators and pollinators of keystone plant species in wildlands. Such inventories would allow for more accurate appraisals of the costs to agriculture due to pollinator loss inflicted by pesticide use and habitat destruction. Presently, the economic value of pollination services are generally not taken into account when government agencies assess the value of protecting wild species or the costs of maintaining agricultural yields." For further information on the effort to protect pollinators, contact: Arizona-Sonora Desert Museum, 2021 N. Kinney Road, Tucson, AZ 85743; phone (520) 883-3006; fax (520) 883-2500; email: fpollen@azstarnet.com. The Forgotten Pollinators Campaign takes into consideration both the agricultural and natural landscapes, and considers all organisms important in the pollination process. This focused approach to ensure adequate pollinating of all plants so important to human welfare should be embraced by the beekeeper (see July 1995 APIS). In the long run, this will be a much more effective strategy to strengthen the apicultural industry's image and credibility than by promoting the honey bee as the pollinating agent of choice in all circumstances. BEYOND BEE INSPECTION In this era of government bashing, it is important to reflect on the many services provided by such agencies that often get dismissed as the rhetoric heats up. Good examples are those of the Florida Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services. Most are familiar with the Apiary Inspection Program. It is one of the most comprehensive in the nation with a dozen full-time inspectors, as well as others working on a part-time basis. But how many know what else the Department does to help the industry? At a recent meeting, Ms. Betsy Woodward, chief of the Food Residues Laboratory, ph 904/488-0670, FAX 904/487-6573, provided a "Summary of Honey Analytical Laboratory Support" available to Florida beekeepers: "The Bureau of Food and Residue Laboratories provides comprehensive support to Florida's honey industry and consumers who buy honey. Included in this program are certification of the tupelo honey crop, authenticity analyses, label reviews (see October 1994 APIS), pesticide residue analysis and analytical methods to meet export testing requirements. The following summarizes the analytical work to date: Fiscal Year No. Samples Analyzed Approximate Cost (No. Adulterated) 1992/93 105 (11) $11,550 1993/94 106 (18) 11,660 1994/95 (to date) 117 (15) 12,870 Total $36,080 "These costs do not reflect additional analyses required by adulterated (fraudulent) products. The results of these laboratory analyses have been provided to the criminal investigations unit of the U.S. Food and Drug Administration and we continue to cooperate with them. "Finally, this program has championed the need to address adulteration and misbranding of honey with federal agencies, especially as it relates to out-of-state firms selling product in Florida and our program is recognized for these efforts. We are also the only regulatory authority looking at foods prominently claiming honey on their label to verify that honey is the major saccharide ingredient." 1995 HONEY CROP The Florida Agricultural Statistics Service, 1222 Woodward St., Orlando, FL 32803, ph 407/648-6013, released its 1995 honey crop analysis on February 27, 1996. According to this report, honey production was 19,780,000 pounds, a two percent increase over 1994 production. Florida ranked fourth nationally behind North Dakota, South Dakota and California. Average yield per colony was 86 pounds, up two pounds over 1994. The colony count remained at 230,000, the same as last year. The U.S. honey crop was 210 million pounds in 1995, down 3 percent from last year. There were 2.65 million colonies in production, compared with 2.77 in 1994. Yield was up 1.1 pounds per colony over last year to 79.5. Prices in 1995 averaged 64.4 cents per pound, up 22 percent over 1994. Sincerely, Malcolm T. Sanford Bldg 970, Box 110620 University of Florida Gainesville, FL 32611-0620 Phone (352) 392-1801, Ext. 143 FAX: (352) 392-0190 INTERNET Address: MTS@GNV.IFAS.UFL.EDU APIS on the World Wide Web-- http://www.ifas.ufl.edu/~entweb/apis/apis.htm Copyright (c) M.T. Sanford 1996 "All Rights Reserved" ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 18:14:59 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: BusyKnight Subject: Import Ban/Bee Semen Lets Keep It! >Roy wrote: >there is some work a foot to get the law changed... And some work a foot to keep the law just as it is or even expand it! >Now comes the hard part , getting enough beekeepers to >stand up and be counted. Well, a lot of beekeepers and queen breaders ARE being counted. And they want the importation ban kept in place. Take for instance, the American Beekeeping Federation. I got a mailing from them (I'm NOT a member & sure won't bee now) that outlined their basic "planks" and I'm sure most people already know this but they (as an 'official' stance of their organization) are strongly against allowing the importation of queens and/or bee semen. Needless to say, I was taken back a little. And I can't fully understand this position taken by such a national organization. Can anyone explain this to me? (I did note that several of their leaders were queen breeders, is there a tie here?) BusyKnight Dallas, TX BusyKnight Dallas, TX busykngt@airmail.net ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 17:42:23 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Wayne Clifford Subject: Poisonous Nectar! Wow! Was I surprised to read in the Western Garden Book that a plant that my wife and I were considering buying for landscaping was listed with "poisonous nectar!" Have any of you heard of such a thing? The plant is called Pieris (Genus) and is in the Ericacea family. It is an evergreen shrub and has flowers that look similar to Vaccinium. I'll be interrested to hear what you all think about this. Wayne ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Wayne Clifford | Phone (360) 427-9670 X-581 Technical Administrator | FAX (360) 427-7798 Mason County Department of Health Services | PO Box 1666 Shelton, WA 98584 | USA wrc@inpho.hs.washington.edu | ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ""Nurture your mind with great thoughts, for you will never go any higher than you think." Benjamin Disraeli ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 19:50:11 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Monarch Watch Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder/seeds and bees Taylor Can't say I've found seeds in pollen >traps (N=50) I've run in the spring myself. Has anyone else? Sandler I think it is unlikely that you have pollen traps in place before pollen is available (correct me if I am wrong) and this might explain the absence of seeds. Taylor Actuallly, for several years we placed traps on colonies very early (early-mid Feb) to determine when pollen first became available and to assess the importance of early pollen on spring built-up. The variance in pollen availability among years from mid Feb to late March was extraordinary. When the elms were blooming and the weather was ideal, strong colonies collected up to 1.4 lbs of harvestable pollen per day. In less favorable years, many colonies collected less than this for the entire 5 weeks. But we never saw seeds. Monarch Watch EMAIL: monarch@falcon.cc.ukans.edu URL: http://monarch.bio.ukans.edu DPLEX-L: send message "info DPLEX-L" to listserv@ukanaix.cc.ukans.edu PHONE: (913) 864 4051 FAX: (913) 864 5321 SNAIL: c/o O.R. Taylor, Dept. of Entomology, Univ. of KS, Lawrence KS 66045 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 18:43:29 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Importation of Bee Semen into the USA (What do you think?) In-Reply-To: On Wed, 20 Mar 1996, Vince Coppola wrote: > > > I'm not opposed to the importation of semen but I am not sure we > are ready for it. If we had the semen from a truly resistant line, we > would still have to do all the very expensive selection and assay work > that it took in the the first place, or the traits will be lost. Sure > this is the best approach to our problem but I doubt the industrys desire > or ability to support such work. This may sound negative but just look at > all the unused research we have now. Most beekeepers are not willing or > able to incorporate new techniques into their management. Even > re-queening isn't practiced enough. How many beekeepers will adopt a > system of disease control that requires real queen management ? How many > will simply look for cheaper chemicals ? How did beekeepers choose to > deal with AFB ? T-mites ? > Vince has brought up the biggest problem with beekeepers. We do not change very fast if at all. How many beekeeper would not use apistan and lost there bees and will not keep bees anymore. We know good queens and we see the results of bad ones.Requeening solves some problems , if of course your new queen is better than your old one.I have a friend in Eastern Washington who has 3400 hives. He told me that 1/2 of his new queens were no good. The bees did not pay any attention to her.We all need to talk about our queen problems with the breeders and each other if the breeders don't take it as help. I like the statement real Queen management. There is one thing that leads the productivity of your hive.You can use all the gimmicks in the world , but if you have a poor queen , you will have poor results.We all need to pay close attention to our queens brood pattern.I have a couple hives that are very slow this spring. I'm about to add the bees and the honey to a hive that has a great queen. She will turn that honey into more bees at a faster rate than the slow queen. I will split the hive in a couple of weeks when I get my new queens. Steve Taber told me something one time that I never foregot. It was about clipping the wings on the Queen.He Said, I have no scientific proof to back it up, but I think the workers sence that they have a weak or deformed queen and may suppersede the queen sooner , if she is clipped. That is trying to look at it from a workers standpoint. I don't clip but I do mark the queen in most cases. Our researchers need there hands untied. They have to be held respossible for there work. I did hear about a couple bad mistakes that were made in the past.That is behind us and we just need control at all times. We will overcome Varroa , but it will not happen if we sit back and wait for someone else to do it for us.Every one of us should take a good look at our queens. Demand the best , but we have to help the breeders. They need honest information.I will be picking up bees and queens in two weeks from a breeder in California that I bought from last year for the first time. When I told a couple of my beekeeper friends who I was getting them from , they said that the queens were no good. I asked them if they thought my bees bees were ok. They said that they did great for the first year. It was one yard that I had.I told them the bees and queens and bees came from the same breeder.Now here is the punch line,Last year the breeder changed where they were getting there breeder queens. I knew that and I did my home work about the breeder queen breeder .also. We have some queens that have fallen down and we have some people like Sue Cobey that is fighting a uphill battle to improve some carni stock with a co-op. Vinnce is working hard to improve his bees against the mite , plus many others. Beekeepers need to try them and evaluate them and give the breeders feedback.I'm trying about 15 queens from a different breeder , just to see and learn. I look at my bees on a frame and talk to them sometimes. Its good for the neighbors, they think your crazy , then you have unlimited behavior and not many problems. Bee Happy and Help your Neighbor Roy ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 23:03:51 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "my name is Dean M. Breaux" Subject: Re: Importation of Bee Semen into the USA (What do you think?) In a message dated 96-03-20 11:02:54 EST, you write: >This may sound negative but just look at >all the unused research we have now. Most beekeepers are not willing or >able to incorporate new techniques into their management. Even >re-queening isn't practiced enough. How many beekeepers will adopt a >system of disease control that requires real queen management ? How many >will simply look for cheaper chemicals ? How did beekeepers choose to >deal with AFB ? T-mites ? > > I to feel that there is a large group of beekeepers that no matter what comes along will still do what they have been all of their lives. What about the rest of us that do care and that can use the stock and maintain it. I can tell you first hand if I had access to better stocks we at Hybri-Bees would maintain and use the stock. What that means in real terms is some 100,000 hives of bees. If it was only for ten it would be fine with me. What we are talking about is the use of semen, how can it hurt. I can tell you that there are alot of people that would be helped by it. As far as the issue of AFB in most states like the one I live in the goverment has a hand in what people do. What incentive is there to use a bee that can cope with AFB when they are going to burn your hive if they find one AFB scale. In regards to T mites I still sell a lot of Yugo Breeder Queens and open mated queens as well, people do care. Thanks for you views I think that this issue still needs to aired out and discussed. That way we will know how to approach the change in the law. Dean Breaux ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 06:47:40 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Sid Pullinger Subject: Spring Feeding There appears to be some confusion amongst many beekeepers about feeding at this time of the year, March and April. This letter is, of course, aimed at the novice and amateur. Commercial beekeepers do not need suggestions from a hobbyist. We feed in spring for various reasons. Stocks have been steadily eating stores since last autumn. Consumption is low in mid-winter but is now increasing as the stock expands. March and April are the months when stores can be running low and starvation threatens. This rests with the beekeeper and should not happen if stores were adequately supplied last autumn. A check should always be made by now and if in doubt feed a large quantity of dense syrup. 2:1. If stores approach zero the stock will go downhill just when we want the queen at her best. A good colony at this time will be eating around a pound a day, normal consumption and increasing larval food. A fortnight of wet or cold, nothing coming in, could put them on the breadline. We feed weak syrup, 1:1, for other reasons. It is too weak to store so is fed in small amounts at frequent intervals. I find some bees with ample stores will take it avidly, others are less keen. It is in a way a make-believe nectar flow. Not all beekeepers agree that it stimulates the bees to greater activity but I think it is worth doing if you have the time and just a few hives. Here our best month for nectar is May so I need my queens laying well in March and April. Bees need water in the spring to dilute dense stores and will fly at dangerously low temperatures to get it, one reason why a supply should be very close to the hives. This weak syrup supplies some of their water requirements and may be as important as the sugar content. Nosema, an invisible killer, is present in most hives. Weak syrup acts as a carrier for Fumidil. I am, of course, writing of bees kept in temperate climes and it may not be applicable to those operating in near tropical or near arctic conditions. Extra work for uncertain returns. You take your choice. S H P _________________________________________________________________ Sid Pullinger Email : sidpul@aladdin.co.uk 36, Grange Rd Compuserve: 100343.1216@compuserve.com Alresford Hants SO24 9HF England ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 23:49:26 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Stan Umlauft Subject: Re: Imirie Shim Dear Bee_Liners First E-MAIL >Imirie Shims (invented by George Imirie) are wood frames with the outside >dimensions of a hive body, and about 3/4 inch tall. A 3/8" by 2" notch is >cut into one of the narrow sides. > >Imirie Shims are used to provide an additional hive entrance during the >honey flow, and during requeening by the "nuc" method. A more detailed >description of how the Imirie Shim is used is in this year's Brushy Mountain >catalog, and I believe somebody posted a copy of the description on BEE-L >last night. My First Reply: Having a second entrance between the bottom and second supers seems like a good idea. However, by providing an extra 3/4 inch of space between supers you will create a mess with comb built between the frames above and below. Why not just make your 3/8 X 2 notch in the bottom of the super its self. Then you could just plug it against robbing, or when it's not in use. The concept is good though as it provides extra ventilation, and allows field bees to bypass brood area. Then: Gordon Scott I was rather surprised upon reading the responses about the Imirie Shims some > days ago, that no mention was made of the simple matter of drilling a 3/4 or > 7/8 inch hole in the front of each deep hive body. > >This is something like the standard entrance in some parts of >Europe. We also have available a disc with a closed section, >a matching opening, a QX opening and a bee-proof ventilator >opening that makes the system very conveniently flexible. It >seems a good system to me, I really must try it! My Second reply: A simple matter of drilling a hole in hive bodies. Sounds OK, but nothings perfect. Those holes are in use in several operations, but they too have drawbacks. The end bars are so close they can block the hole, thus reducing the air flow , and impeding traffic. With the 3/8 X 2 notch in the bottom of the super idea it places an easily defended horizontal slit in direct alignment with the 3/8" of space between the frames of the two supers. -- Best Wishes, Stan Umlauft Bay Point, CA USA stanu@honeybee.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 07:56:59 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jerry J Bromenshenk Subject: Re: Bee Alert! Web Page In-Reply-To: <199603201727.JAA19153@phoenix.svri.com> from "John Day" at Mar 20, 96 09:27:15 am To Bee-L Members: We are pleased to announce the official launch of our Honey Bee Research Home Page. Our work focuses on using honey bees as a form of miner's canary for environmental pollutants ranging from trace elements to heavy metals and radionuclides as well as complex mixtures of organic chemicals. In addition, we study the cumulative effects of mites, food resource availability, weather, and other stressors on bee colony structure and performance. Finally, we have unique facilities for studying the effects of exotic and genetically engieered microbial pesticides (MPCAs) on whole colonies of bees. We hope that you find these pages interesting and helpful. We plan on developing pages for kids and in support of the bee industry in the very near future. Any comments would be greatly appreciated. You can find us at The University of Montana-Missoula (http://www.umt.edu) listed under Institutes, Centers, etc. The full address for Bee Alert! is: http://www.umt.edu/biology/bees Enjoy! Jerry J. Bromenshenk The University of Montana-Missoula Tel: 406-243-5648 Fax: 406-243-4184 E-mail: jjbmail@selway.umt.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 11:13:41 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Susan W. Cobey" Subject: Re: Importation of Bee Semen into the USA Vince wrote; I'm not opposed to the importation of semen but I am not sure we are ready for it. If we had the semen from a truly resistant line, we would still have to do all the very expensive selection and assay work that it took in the the first place, or the traits will be lost. Sure this is the best approach to our problem but I doubt the industrys desire or ability to support such work. My response; Sure, semen importation is only the first step. You will need an established gene pool to introduce this to, a selection program to maintain heavy selection pressure on this to keep the desirable traits plus ensure the stock is commercially viable (productive, gentle, winter hardy, etc.) Yes, this is labor intensive and expensive and will require a long term commitment. But, I do believe this type of support must come from the industry, we can not rely solely upon the USDA to do this for us. Beekeepers need to demand this from their queen producers and support them in this effort. I think the majority of beekeepers are willing to pay a little extra for queens, if these are of high quality and reduce chemical usage. We need to start somewhere. There are a few interests in taking on this challenge. Hybri-Bee, Inc is willing to make this investment. The New World Carniolan Program is also willing. As queen breeders see the potential here - they will need to "get on the bandwagon" to stay competitive. I'm not suggesting that importation is the answer all. We still need to select among our own stocks first. But, why not see if we can speed up and enhance these programs with importation of semen from proven stock. This will then need to be tested to determine if it is compatible with domestic stocks we are crossing this with, and tested to determine if it is commercially viable under U.S. beekeeping practices, etc. The beekeeping industry needs this level of sophistication and this can provide the encouragement of the first baby step in that direction. Susan Cobey Ohio State University Dept. of Entomology 1735 Neil Ave. Columbus, OH 43210 Tel.(614) 292-7928 Fax (614) 292 2180 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 11:13:55 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Susan W. Cobey" Subject: Re: ABF supports importation >>BusyKnight wrote; >Take for instance, the American Beekeeping Federation. >I got a mailing from them (I'm NOT a member & sure won't >bee now) that outlined their basic "planks" and I'm sure >most people already know this but they (as an 'official' >stance of their organization) are strongly against allowing >the importation of queens and/or bee semen. > The American Beekeeping Federation does support a revision in the 1922 Importation law. This resolution was passed at their Jan. Meeting in Portland; 31. Importation of honey bee stock WHEREAS, the development and maintenance of improved honey bee breeding stock is viewed as the best long term solution to the problems of AHB and parasitic mites; and WHEREAS, genetic diversity is know to be beneficial in livestock, and high quality honey bee genetic stock is know to exist in other parts of the world; WHEREAS, the current law of 1922 is cumbersome and unduly restrictive and invites illegal importation; and WHEREAS, importation of honey bee semen can be a safe and effective means of improving honey bee stock in the U.S, now THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED, that the American Beekeeping Federation urge the USDA to revise the law to permit qualified queen breeders to import semen of known origin subject to appropriate standards and qualifications with such standards and qualifications to be set by the USDA after consultation with the Stock Release Panel. I strongly believe we need to support our beekeeping organizations. These groups provide a voice for our industry and lobby for our interests in Washington. Look at the increase in honey prices we are enjoying. This is a direct result of the what beekeeping organizations have accomplished with the Antidumping campaign. Susan Cobey Ohio State University Dept. of Entomology 1735 Neil Ave. Columbus, OH 43210 Tel.(614) 292-7928 Fax (614) 292 2180 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 11:15:42 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kelley Rosenlund Subject: q-cell incubators What temperature should q-cell incubators be? God Bless, Kelley Rosenlund rosenlk@freenet.ufl.edu Gainesville, Florida, U.S.A., 137 hives, less than 1 year in beekeeping. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 08:51:01 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Importation of Bee Semen into the USA In-Reply-To: On Thu, 21 Mar 1996, Susan W. Cobey wrote: > Vince wrote; > > I'm not opposed to the importation of semen but I am not sure we > are ready for it. If we had the semen from a truly resistant line, we > would still have to do all the very expensive selection and assay work > that it took in the the first place, or the traits will be lost. Roy write; We have plenty of examples or what happens if you don't improve your product.There is a training movie about paradigm changes. The Swiss use to make most of the world watches.At a science expo the quartz watch was shown. The Swiss did not change , but Japan got on board and the rest is history. 17,000 watch makes were out of work and the swiss droped to a very small market share. What Sue Cobey said about a small step is just what it is.We need that step to keep going ahead. In the big picture , getting the semen in to the USA is just a spot that is needed. We have some very good Queen breeders and they need the best stock that they can get. The beekeepers will buy good stock. This is a win - win deal for breeders.The better the product the more sales in the long run. We need some very strong support for co-op breeding programs. Spread out the work. This is not a cake walk , it is a very complex genetic problem. Thanks for your time Roy ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 10:52:05 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Re: q-cell incubators > What temperature should q-cell incubators be? The general consensus is 92 degrees F. Bee keep their brood nest at 95.5 degrees F., according to my measurements. They regulate within one degree in most weather. I think that the reason the recommended temp is 92 is that it is *much* more harmful to overheat a cell by a degree or two, than to cool it by the same amount. Most man-made devices vary by several degrees (at least) per cycle of the elements and there may be errors in the thermostat and themometers used, so the 3 degree difference gives a safety margin. The best incubator is still the beehive itself, but used correctly, an incubator can bee areal asset. Some humidity in the form of a damp sponge may be a good idea as long as it is not in contact with the cells. Regards Allen W. Allen Dick, Beekeeper VE6CFK RR#1, Swalwell, Alberta Canada T0M 1Y0 Internet:dicka@cuug.ab.ca & allend@internode.net Honey. Bees, & Art ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 11:12:33 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jerry J Bromenshenk Subject: Re: Bee Alert! text and background colors In-Reply-To: from "Roy Nettlebeck" at Mar 21, 96 08:51:01 am Sorry to bother everyone, but some folks have indicated that they can't read our page - the text appears on a dark background. We are not using those colors, it is your browser/graphics setup that is the probable problem. We designed these pages for a recent version of Netscape, and it has been checked on several PCs, Macs, Unix boxes, etc. The background is a very light yellow bee comb, the text is in black, except for blue on the links. We do not warrant that the oldest versions of Netscape, and we know the older Mosaic browsers don't support all of our HTML coding. By far, the biggest problem is setting up colors on your computer. Windows default uses a 16 color graphics driver. It doesn't even load the other drivers, but they are on the installation disk. Don't know what Windows 95 does, but the older Windows don't think you need more than 16 colors. At 16 colors, our background tends to come up muddy grey. At 256 it is much better. More colors, even better. Also, check the resolution settings, they can also affect appearance. Bottom line, web images and home pages are affected by your machine's setup - and no one tells you that all many www pictures will be really ugly at 16 colors. So, if you are using a recent version of Netscape, have properly setup your colors and resolution, and still can't read our pages, let me know and we will try to figure out what's wrong. Thanks Jerry Bromenshenk jjbmail@selway.umt.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 10:22:53 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: q-cell incubators In-Reply-To: <199603211615.LAA88489@freenet3.freenet.ufl.edu> On Thu, 21 Mar 1996, Kelley Rosenlund wrote: > What temperature should q-cell incubato> Hi I run 92 F in two of them. The hive is the best place for the cells.I use 2 incubators side by side , one as a back up and some times for an overflow of cells that come out into cages. That is very tricky and you need bees to feed them or they will not last long. You need moisture in the incubator, I have a place for water. Put the inubator some place the the temperature stays pretty steady. Its a lot easier on the incubator to maintain the 92 F. Regards Roy ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 17:08:39 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Dirk Howard Subject: Re: Bee Alert! Jerry, I have looked at a good portion of your web page. Looks great! It was nice to see what you look like. Sounds like you got your bee counter problems worked out that you were having earlier last year. Keep up the good work. Dirk Howard Hobbyist Beekeeper in Utah ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 19:43:35 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Robert Stevens Subject: Re: Importation of Bee Semen into the USA Why can't we have a two pronged approach, let the scientists, what few are left with funds, do the testing and assaying. But, at the same time, let the commerical beekeepers and the queen breeders bring the semen from wherever and get the queens out there. The marketplace will validate the results just as they did with Hasting's queens and Brother Adam's queens, both of which were developed with importations of semen. I have suspected for five years that the place to look for resistance was Primorskikrai in Western Siberia. Now, the U.S. bee scientists after truly herculean efforts to wrest some money from foundations and governments have started an expensive demonstration project over there to evaluate varroa resistance. Of course, the whole experiment is being run by the local beekeepers who are tightly controlled by the local mafia. The science that comes out of this truly admirable effort may be somewhat suspect. If I could have gone there five years ago and brought home some semen the way I wanted to, I would have given some to some real good beekeepers like Vince Coppola, Dave Miksa, Reggie Wilbanks and 100 others. I would suggest that if there was some valid resistance in those bees, it would be spread to every bee in America by now. Given the choice of losing their hives or using a "new Queen" those "backward, unchanging" American beekeepers might prove to be quite forward thinking. Poor Sue Cobey would be going blind from all the A.I. she would be doing. I can't imagine why the ABF is opposed to importation of semen. Open it up, and if there is resistance out there it will be found - overnight! Leave it in the hands of a few overworked bee scientists, exhausted from their ten year battle with the ubiquitous African bee, and nothing will be accomplished. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 19:29:02 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kevin & Ann Christensen Subject: Bee-Pro We have been feeding our bees Bee-Pro in the spring for a few years. = Bee-Pro is supposed to be a high protein pollen substitute. It is made = by Mann Lakes bee supplies. They claim that it promotes brood rearing = prior to the availablilty of natural pollen. I know that it keeps the = bees out of the farmers' cattle and pig feed. We don't get anymore = calls from farmers, upset about the bees in the spring. I'd like to know if anyong using this product has seen a noticable = increase in brood rearing that can be atributed to Bee-Pro. Has anyone = studied the contents of the product to see how the proteins compair to = real pollens. Any comments would be appreciated. Kevin Christensen ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 21:36:37 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: PCbee POP Can any one tell me where I can go to download a copy of PCBEE POP ? ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 22:56:47 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: Very Sorry Please ignore the last post- I screwed up trying to forward to someone else ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 21:37:39 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jerry J Bromenshenk Subject: Re: PCbee POP In-Reply-To: from "Vince Coppola" at Mar 21, 96 09:36:37 pm Hi: PC BEEPOP as originally distributed is out-of-date and no longer supported by us. Any copies that you might find on the web or on someone's desk are the old Fortran version that had to be compiled for specific graphic cards. We have spent 2 1/2 yrs preparing a complete re-write. We are finally near completion of the updated code, that now contains a tracheal mite module and which stands at over 5,000 lines. We will distribute a beta version for testing before the summer. If you wish to be considered as a beta test site, please let us know. Jerry Bromenshenk The University of Montana-Missoula jjbmail@selway.umt.edu ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 22 Mar 1996 07:55:38 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kim Flottum Subject: Re: PCbee POP Jerry, Hello again. Congrats on the web page. They are a lot of work. I would like to get a beta of your new program when ready. Keep me in mind. Good to see you will be at EAS this summer. A long way from home! Keep in touch. Kim Flottum ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 22 Mar 1996 15:09:14 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Darlene Scribilo Subject: bee venom therapy In response to Gypsybees@aol.com. (Kevin & Shawna Roberts) It is a great pleasure to see postings on bee venom and bee venom therapy. >The most recent edition of The Hive and the Honey Bee (chapter 22, "Other Products of the >Hive", the section on Bee Venom) contains information about clinical tests conducted to verify >the efficacy of bee venom. Among arthritic patients, something like 60% reported moderate to >excellent results when they used bee venom for their arthritis pain. When tests where done on >arthritic dogs, the dogs had measurably more freedom of movement when they received bee >venom. The bee venom section is fascinating. If you have any sort of chronic joint pain, or you >know someone who does, it is recommended reading. . One of the best studies was conducted by Dr. Kim (USA) who treated 108 patients with arthritis (RA and OA). Patients had a minimum of five years of a chronic history of arthritis, treated by two physicians and had failed to respond to conventional medical treatment. They received almost 34 thousand bee venom injections collectively. Results: Patients with a minimum five years of RA or OA shown 89.8% improvement (moderate to exellent results). Dr. Forestier (France) demonstrated similar results when treating 1,600 patiens with bee venom injection. >Some people are concerned about the possibility of allergic reactions. Obviously, you need to >watch for any allergic reaction, but only about 1% of the population has a bee sting allergy. I >suspect that that is a smaller percentage than the people who are allergic to the drugs doctors >prescribe for inflammation. Definetly there is a certain risk involved using bee venom therapy. In practice, arthritic patiens are rarely sensitive to bee venom, but for safety reasons an Anakit, Epipen or Benadryl should be kept handy. It is suggested to follow the guidelines of apitherapy and consult with a physician. >The American Apitherapy Association has all sorts of information about bee venom therapy, and >what people are using it for. I don't have their number with me, but if anyone wants it, you can >e-mail me at gypsybees@aol.com. The American Apitherapy Society, Inc address is: P.O.Box 54, Hartland Four Corners, VT 05049, Ph (802) 436-2708, Fax (802) 436-2827 References Kim, C. (1989) Bee Venom Therapy for Arthritis, Rhumatologie, 41, 3, pp. 67-72 Forestier, F. (1984) Bee Venom in Rheumatology - An Experiment Performed with 1,600 Cases, Apiacta, 19:19-22 Simics, M. (1995) First Aid for Bee and Wasp Stings, Apitronic Publishing, Calgary, ISBN 9697654-1-X, $8.95 U.S. Simics, M. (1994) Bee Venom: Exploring The Healing Power, Apitronic Publishing, Calgary, ISBN 0-9697654-0-1, $9.95 U.S. Michael Simics Apitronic Services 4640 Pendlebury Rd. Richmond, BC Canada, V7E 1E7 Ph./Fax (604) 271-9414 E-mail: dags@wimsey.com P.S. My books are available for purchase. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 22 Mar 1996 07:46:14 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Bee-Pro In-Reply-To: <01BB175C.CFBB2880@spr8.ccinet.ab.ca> On Thu, 21 Mar 1996, Kevin & Ann Christensen wrote: > We have been feeding our bees Bee-Pro in the spring for a few years. Bee-Pro is supposed to be a high protein pollen substitute. It is made by Mann Lakes bee supplies. They claim that it promotes brood rearing prior to the availablilty of natural pol len. I know that it keeps the bees out of the farmers' cattle and pig feed. We don't get anymore calls from farmers, upset about the bees in the spring. > > I'd like to know if anyong using this product has seen a noticable increase in brood rearing that can be atributed to Bee-Pro. Has anyone studied the contents of the product to see how the proteins compair to real pollens. Any comments would be apprec iated. > Hi Kevin , I use bee-Pro in the spring as part of a mixture of pollen and brewers yeast. I have not had the Bee- Pro checked to see if it had soy flower in it as a protein source. I have been told by Steve Taber that soy flower was harder for the bees to digest than pollen. I run my mixture 50% pollen ,25 % Bee-Pro and 25 % brewers yeast thru a blender. I put 1 pound of podered sugar in 10 pounds of mix. I will put it out when we have a good flying day in Feb. I put it out at about 3 pounds a day unless they are taking it in very fast. I put out this year 5 pound a day for 3 days in a row. That was for 30 hives. The 30 hives did take in 30 pounds of the mix in feb. I do freeze fresh pollen and use that on some special hives for drone production.I do that in Jan and put in a little at a time two or three table spoons at a time. I belive that fresh pollen is the best. Not all pollens are alike. That is a complete subject by itself. I have some hives in 3 deeps right now , with brood in all three boxs. It helps out in the apiary when you can get a frame of brood and add it to a hive that need a little boost. If the small hive has a disease treat the disease before you waist a frame of brood on them. I don't know how well Bee Pro will do by itself. Good Luck Roy ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 22 Mar 1996 11:12:33 EST Reply-To: "Glen B. Glater" Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Glen B. Glater" Subject: more info from the Internet requested This is a followup to the US Code info I posted on honeybees the other day, and the ensuing discussion about lobbying Congress and getting laws changed. I've been asked to post to this list the names and addresses of all Members of Congress. This information, including the members who are accessible via email, is available on the WWW sites for the 2 houses (http://www.house.gov and http://www.senate.gov). I don't want to do this without more demand, because while some members of congress may bee beekeepers, and some probably eat honey, and a few may have had reactions to bee stings, I don't see the relevancy to this mailing group. So, if your ISP is brain-dead enough to not allow you web access (by the way, many have a program called "lynx" that you can use after you log in to your account) and you want me to get this info for you, I will. Here's how: Email me (don't waste this groups bandwidth with this discussion) and I'll save your email address. In a week or so, I'll email the info to all requestors. If there is a large outcry from folks that this info *should* be posted here (again, via email please) then I'll post it. Given that there are ~500 people on this list, the outcry would need to be larger than the 1% that normally voices opinions on things like this. --glen ************************************************************** Midnight Networks Inc. * 200 Fifth Avenue * Waltham, MA 02154 Glen B. Glater Principal, Strategic Networking Group Phone: (617) 890-1001 Fax: (617) 890-0028 Internet: glen@midnight.com http://www.midnight.com/~glen Midnight Networks Inc. WWW page http://www.midnight.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 22 Mar 1996 09:33:51 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Doug McCulloch Subject: buckfast queens Does anyone have any experience with the buckfast queen? Are they as good as they are claimed to be? I would be interested in trying out a few, but am not even sure if its allowed to bring them to Alberta from Ontario. Who is a good supplier? Any input greatly appreciated. Best regards - Doug McCulloch ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 22 Mar 1996 13:07:19 EST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Frederick L. Hollen" Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder In-Reply-To: ; from "Roy Nettlebeck" at Mar 19, 96 2:41 pm Hello all I've recently seen honeybees packing up dried coffee grounds which I had thrown onto my compost pile. I don't know about their protein content, but maybe it will get them to stay awake and work late.;-) Fred Augusta County, Virginia ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 22 Mar 1996 11:23:05 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Wayne Clifford Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder In-Reply-To: <199603221807.NAA38177@pen2.pen.k12.va.us> Recently, my cat ate a coffee bean, went in the garage and took a nap!? ;-> On Fri, 22 Mar 1996, Frederick L. Hollen wrote: > Hello all > > I've recently seen honeybees packing up dried coffee grounds > which I had thrown onto my compost pile. I don't know about > their protein content, but maybe it will get them to stay awake > and work late.;-) ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 22 Mar 1996 14:23:57 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Re: more info from the Internet requested > I've been asked to post to this list the names and addresses of all > Members of Congress. Thanks for not posting that info. Just a reminder to memebers... this is an international list and want it to stay that way. Member lists of the British House of Lords, etc. would be equally inappropriate. Also, I notice we have recently had our first binary posted here, and although one once in a long time may not hurt, it is definitely a no-no. The suggestion of using a web brouser was most appropriate. The best way of distributing such information is direct e-mail to those who request it , or by uploading it to a web or FTP server and making its presence there known with a brief post here. With that, I'll mention to all that the bee cursor scheme for Win 95 is still available on the site listed below -- along with links to many more bee sites. Thanks. Regards Allen W. Allen Dick, Beekeeper VE6CFK RR#1, Swalwell, Alberta Canada T0M 1Y0 Internet:dicka@cuug.ab.ca & allend@internode.net Honey. Bees, & Art ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 22 Mar 1996 17:56:05 +0000 Reply-To: James.Peterson.2@m.k12.ut.us Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: James Peterson Organization: UtahLink Subject: Re: bee venom therapy I experienced the onion treatment on a sting on my ample stomach and it reduced the already apparent swelling to nothing in about 2 hours. Can any one tell me what is in the onion to give such good results? James Peterson ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 22 Mar 1996 03:02:00 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Andy Nachbaur Organization: WILD BEE'S BBS (209) 826-8107 LOS BANOS, CA Subject: NEW BEES FROM JAPAN ---------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------- * The OLd Drone found this road kill on the internet highway using a text search engine. I do believe that something was lost in the translation as it is just a little hard to believe, skept'ic I must bee....But since it is so close to April Fool's day I pass this gas to my many beekeeping friends who are smart enough not to be fooled by BS ..or sometime the facts... ttul Andy- Information Bulletin No.72 STINGLESS BEES DEVELOPED FOR POLLINATING FRUIT TREES _________________________________________________________________ February 13, 1996 Honeybees are often used in the pollination of such fruit-bearing trees as apples and pears, but they pose a hazard to the fruit grower, who risk being stung. To eliminate this annoyance, researchers at the National Institute of Animal Industry of the Ministry of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries, has succeeded in producing bees that cannot sting, and it is hoped that they will resolve a longstanding sore point for fruit growers. Pollen Carrier Pollination is an important part of a fruit-grower's task, and many farmers still perform the task manually, climbing ladders and crouching to pollinate each flower. To lighten this load, some have begun harnessing honeybees as pollinators. As the bees fly around in search of nectar, they carry pollen from one flower to another. Those who are not used to handling the bees, though, are frequently stung, and experienced beekeepers must be enlisted to release and recapture the bees. At the National Institute of Animal Industry, an attempt was made to produce honeybees that would not sting by exposing them to gamma waves. It was found in that if bee larvae were exposed to 30 grays of radiation just before becoming pupae, 97% of the bees born had deformed stingers. The typical stinger consists of two narrow needles encased in a sheath, but in the mutant variety, the two needles were separated from the sheath, destroying their ability to sting. Of the 18 queen larvae that were exposed to radiation in the same way, 16 were born as no stingers. Controlling Reproduction The new varieties of both queen and worker bee showed no difference other than in the stinger, and they otherwise appeared to behave normally. This led researchers to believe that the exposure to radiation had caused a genetic mutation in the bees. Researchers are now working to determine how many larvae of stinger-less queens will have the same trait and to establish a process by which the trait can be genetically transmitted. One concern is the impact the stinger-less bees will have on the ecosystem if they breed with naturally occurring varieties. The mixing of genetic strains can be prevented, researchers, believe, by simply utilizing worker bees for pollination purposes, since they have no reproductive capabilities and thus pose no threat that they will breed with bees in the wild. (The above article, edited by Japan Echo Inc., is based on domestic Japanese news sources. It is offered for reference purposes and does not necessarily represent the policy or views of the Japanese Government.) _________________________________________________________________ --- ~ QMPro 1.53 ~ ... Which a bee would choose to dream in. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 23 Mar 1996 08:06:44 EST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Frederick L. Hollen" Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder In-Reply-To: ; from "Wayne Clifford" at Mar 22, 96 11:23 am Took a catnap?? :-) According to Wayne Clifford: > > Recently, my cat ate a coffee bean, went in the garage and took a nap!? > > ;-> > > On Fri, 22 Mar 1996, Frederick L. Hollen wrote: > > > Hello all > > > > I've recently seen honeybees packing up dried coffee grounds > > which I had thrown onto my compost pile. I don't know about > > their protein content, but maybe it will get them to stay awake > > and work late.;-) > ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 23 Mar 1996 13:29:17 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Wayne Clifford Subject: Re: OH: honeybees at bird feeder In-Reply-To: <199603231306.IAA137174@pen2.pen.k12.va.us> Must have been de-caf. On Sat, 23 Mar 1996, Frederick L. Hollen wrote: > Took a catnap?? :-) > > According to Wayne Clifford: > > > > Recently, my cat ate a coffee bean, went in the garage and took a nap!? > > > > ;-> > > > > On Fri, 22 Mar 1996, Frederick L. Hollen wrote: > > > > > Hello all > > > > > > I've recently seen honeybees packing up dried coffee grounds > > > which I had thrown onto my compost pile. I don't know about > > > their protein content, but maybe it will get them to stay awake > > > and work late.;-) > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Wayne Clifford | Phone (360) 427-9670 X-581 Technical Administrator | FAX (360) 427-7798 Mason County Department of Health Services | PO Box 1666 Shelton, WA 98584 | USA wrc@inpho.hs.washington.edu | ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ""Nurture your mind with great thoughts, for you will never go any higher than you think." Benjamin Disraeli ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 23 Mar 1996 19:04:26 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kirk Jones Subject: Re: Bee-Pro > >I'd like to know if anyong using this product has seen a noticable >increase in brood rearing that can be atributed to Bee-Pro. Has anyone >studied the contents of the product to see how the proteins compair to >real pollens. Any comments would be appreciated. > >Kevin Christensen Kevin, We know some beekeepers who use that specific product for building up large populations early to make up splits to take north from Texas. They mix it with corn syrup to a somewhat loose consistancy, as it will set up harder, like cookie dough. They apply it once a month. In our operation in Northern Michigan, we start putting on pollen "sub"(substitute) in March with snow still on the ground. We open 'em up, put on a slab of pollen sub with a hive tool on top of the brood nest. We also will put on a bucket of feed if necessary. We just feed yards in locations that are not near early pollen sources, but may feed them all next year. Our recipe: one part expeller process soy flour (you can use 2 parts soy to 1 part yeast) one part brewers yeast add as much natural *pollen as you can afford (we trap our own) mix it up with a commercial bread mixer while adding corn syrup mix it to a somewhat drippy consistancy, as it will set firmer overnight The bees love it! (it actually taste rather good) *clean out the chalkbrood mummies from the pollen Sleeping Bear Apiaries Kirk Jones b-man@aliens.com when you get lemons, make lemonade.... ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 23 Mar 1996 18:49:21 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Paul Cronshaw, D.C." Subject: Catching Swarms at great heights Bee-listers, Today I had my first call on a swarm. ( I have my name on the local Ag and fire department lists). Arriving at the scene I noted a nice size swarm about 15 feet hanging on a pine branch. Too high for a ladder. WHat devices are there for capturing swarms from high locations? I remember reading in Bee Culture about a swarm capture technique using some long poles and a plastic garbage bag. Any other ideas? Paul Cronshaw DC Hobby beekeeper Santa Barbara, CA ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 23 Mar 1996 20:56:36 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Doug Yanega Subject: Re: Catching Swarms at great heights >WHat devices are there for capturing swarms from high locations? > >I remember reading in Bee Culture about a swarm capture technique using >some long poles and a plastic garbage bag. > >Any other ideas? I'd been led to understand that with enough Nasonov baits and a good Swarm Box (placed upwind), you could attract them away from a roost...maybe a little time-consuming, but supposedly practical. Maybe someone with experience using swarm bait can confirm or deny this. Doug Yanega Illinois Natural History Survey, 607 E. Peabody Dr. Champaign, IL 61820 USA phone (217) 244-6817, fax (217) 333-4949 affiliate, Univ. of Illinois Urbana-Champaign, Dept. of Entomology http://www.inhs.uiuc.edu:80/~dyanega/my_home.html "There are some enterprises in which a careful disorderliness is the true method" - Herman Melville, Moby Dick, Chap. 82 ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 23 Mar 1996 22:00:57 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "" Subject: Chalk Brood in Pollen A note of warning about feeding pollen in protein mixtures-- I have found that some colonies chew chalkbrood mummies into small, pollen-pellet like pieces which end up in the beekeeper-collected pollen. It is advisable to examine pollen under a low grade magnification to check for mummy pieces. The BEST way I have found to infect a colony, especially in the spring, is to feed pollen mixtures with chalk brood mummies or pieces incorporated in the mixture. To mimimize chalk brood hazard, collect pollen from your own colonies when bees are not producing chalk brood, usually the summer. Avoid spring collection. Larry Connor Wicwas Press LJCONNOR@AOL.COM ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Mar 1996 16:16:01 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Rudolf E. Bahr" Subject: Re: Poisonous Nectar! In-Reply-To: Hello Wayne, Asia Minor seems to be known because of poisonous honey since antiquity. Especially "Rhododendron ponticum" and "Rhododendron luteum" are said to cause nausea, dizziness, headache, visual defects and short blindness. Both are members of the family ericaceae. They grow wild in big quantities near the turkish Black sea coast in the East of the town Samsun. Regards, R.E.Bahr NISI APES FINIS On Wed, 20 Mar 1996, Wayne Clifford wrote: > Wow! Was I surprised to read in the Western Garden Book that a plant that > my wife and I were considering buying for landscaping was listed with > "poisonous nectar!" Have any of you heard of such a thing? The plant is > called Pieris (Genus) and is in the Ericacea family. It is an evergreen > shrub and has flowers that look similar to Vaccinium. > > I'll be interrested to hear what you all think about this. > > Wayne > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Wayne Clifford | Phone (360) 427-9670 X-581 > Technical Administrator | FAX (360) 427-7798 > Mason County Department of Health Services | PO Box 1666 Shelton, WA 98584 > | USA > wrc@inpho.hs.washington.edu | > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ""Nurture your mind with great thoughts, for you will never go any higher > than you think." Benjamin Disraeli > ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Mar 1996 15:39:52 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Eric Abell Subject: Re: Catching Swarms at great heights >WHat devices are there for capturing swarms from high locations? > >I remember reading in Bee Culture about a swarm capture technique using >some long poles and a plastic garbage bag. I have not tried this but...... I purchased a bunch of miscellaneous equipment from a beekeeper who had shut down and in the purchase I received a swarm catcher. The dissadvantage is that it runs on electricity but I will try to explain it anyway. It is a small vacuum cleaner attached to a box that is just large enough for a super and on which the lid seals well. On one end of this box there is a hole onto which is attached a long vacuum hose. The hole has a piece of leather covering it on the inside as a one-way-trap. The air comes in the hose, through the sealed box and into the vaccuum, leaving the bees in the box. If power was available I suspect that the end of the hose could be carried up a ladder or simply fastened to a long pole and raised to the swarm to simply vacuum the bees into the containment box. Most of the swarms I come upon are a long way from electricity but once in awhile there are some problem bees near a house so I look forward to trying this device. Eric Eric Abell Gibbons, Alberta Canada (403) 998 3143 eabell@compusmart.ab.ca ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Mar 1996 10:28:18 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Re: Catching Swarms at great heights > >WHat devices are there for capturing swarms from high locations? > I have not tried this but...... I purchased a bunch of miscellaneous > equipment from a beekeeper who had shut down and in the purchase I > received a swarm catcher. The dissadvantage is that it runs on > electricity but I will try to explain it anyway. It is a small > vacuum cleaner attached to a box that is just large enough for a > super and on which the lid seals well. On one end of this box there > is a hole onto which is attached a long vacuum hose. The hole has a > piece of leather covering it on the inside as a one-way-trap. The > air comes in the hose, through the sealed box and into the vaccuum, > leaving the bees in the box. I wrote an article about twenty yeras ago for the now defunct Canadian Bee Journal describing the aparatus. So if you happen to have a copy on hand... The system I used at that time was a honey super with a screened hole and a non screened hole in a tight fitting lid. The vacuum attached to the screened hole and the capturing hose to the other. A piece of plywood was nailed on the other side. The screen area must be sufficient to not get clogged with bees and also not in line with the stream of incoming bees. As for the incoming bees, controlling speed is a problem. Too fast and the bees all get damaged. Too slow and the thing won't work. A pad of sponge or cloth in line with the inlet provides a cushion for them. Small intake hoses give higher velocities. Rough hoses can damage bees if they bend too sharply. Having said all that, I do use a 5 gallon pail with two holes in the lid and a vacuum for cleaning bees off the honey house windows, but never for swarms. For swarms, I always use a carboard box with flaps that close-- as described in previous discusssions of swarms and the handling thereof. BTW a 'Dust Buster' works well for removing a few bees from a window without damaging them. Regards Allen W. Allen Dick, Beekeeper VE6CFK RR#1, Swalwell, Alberta Canada T0M 1Y0 Internet:dicka@cuug.ab.ca & allend@internode.net Honey. Bees, & Art ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Mar 1996 10:33:06 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Doing a Post Mortem I'm wondering if varroa mites are easily detached when found on/with dead bees and if they will have stayed with their host to the end in a dead overwintered hive. Specifically, I am wondering if an alcohol wash of a sample of bees in a dead wintered hive will yield useful data??? Regards Allen W. Allen Dick, Beekeeper VE6CFK RR#1, Swalwell, Alberta Canada T0M 1Y0 Internet:dicka@cuug.ab.ca & allend@internode.net Honey. Bees, & Art ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Mar 1996 18:52:35 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Rudolf E. Bahr" Subject: Re: buckfast queens In-Reply-To: <199603221633.JAA27419@cherokee.vvw.teq.net> Hello Doug, there is the "Community of Buckfast Beekeepers" (Gemeinschaft der Buckfastimker e.V., Germany) consisting of 700 members in Central Europe. There are extra groups in Denmark, Sweden, Norway and Switzerland too. Among the members there are many professional beekeepers, because the ratio "bee work to own work" seems rather good to them. The buckfast colonies are big throughout the whole year, they even brood (and of course consume honey) in yield gaps. They are normally kept in 10 or 12 frame Dadant hives. If you are really interested, I'd like to highly recommend to read Brother Adam's books on management works and on breeding the honeybee. Sorry, until now I don't know the exact English titles. His books might be a little bit hard to read for beginners, because written in a rather compact way, but these two and a third one on his trips to look for best honey bees are deep sources of bee knowledge. In the third one, for instance, I found the hint on poisonous honey in Minor Asia. Very important are his hints to deal with diseases and practical queen breeding and rearing. Of course, I can tell you only about the "European" Buckfast bee. In the last days I read much on your 1922 law, which prohibits importation of queens and semen (eggs too?). How do you manage it in USA to breed genuine buckfast bees? Best regards, R.E.Bahr NISI APES FINIS On Fri, 22 Mar 1996, Doug McCulloch wrote: > Does anyone have any experience with the buckfast queen? Are they as good > as they are claimed to be? I would be interested in trying out a few, but > am not even sure if its allowed to bring them to Alberta from Ontario. Who > is a good supplier? > Any input greatly appreciated. > > Best regards - Doug McCulloch > ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Mar 1996 15:54:22 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Carl Lyon Subject: Info on honey Could someone please write me some info on the process bees use to make honey? Or, could someone point me to a homepage that contains this information? I need this information for a biology paper. Anu help is greatly appreciated. thank you, Carl Lyon bclyon@neca.com --- Bruce Lyon Willington, CT bclyon@neca.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Mar 1996 20:26:52 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "pats@usa.pipeline.com" Subject: swarms Hi folks, This weekend I captured a large swarm of honeybees in my yard. I've been told that it is too early for bees to swarm in this area. Is this unusual? I live near Augusta,Ga. Thanks Ed -- pats@usa.pipeline.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 24 Mar 1996 19:57:10 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: buckfast queens In-Reply-To: On Sun, 24 Mar 1996, Rudolf E. Bahr wrote: > Hello Doug, > > there is the "Community of Buckfast Beekeepers" (Gemeinschaft > der Buckfastimker e.V., Germany) consisting of 700 members in Central > Europe. There are extra groups in Denmark, Sweden, Norway and Switzerland too. > > Among the members there are many professional beekeepers, because the > ratio "bee work to own work" seems rather good to them. The buckfast colonies > are big throughout the whole year, they even brood (and of course consume > honey) in yield gaps. They are normally kept in 10 or 12 frame Dadant hives. > > If you are really interested, I'd like to highly recommend to read Brother > Adam's books on management works and on breeding the honeybee. Sorry, > until now I don't know the exact English titles. His books might be a little > bit hard to read for beginners, because written in a rather compact way, but > these two and a third one on his trips to look for best honey bees > are deep sources of bee knowledge. In the third one, for instance, I found > the hint on poisonous honey in Minor Asia. Very important are his hints > to deal with diseases and practical queen breeding and rearing. > > Of course, I can tell you only about the "European" Buckfast bee. In the > last days I read much on your 1922 law, which prohibits importation of > queens and semen (eggs too?). How do you manage it in USA to breed > genuine buckfast bees? > > Best regards, > R.E.Bahr > > NISI APES FINIS > > On Fri, 22 Mar 1996, Doug McCulloch wrote: > > > Does anyone have any experience with the buckfast queen? Are they as good > > as they are claimed to be? I would be interested in trying out a few, but > > am not even sure if its allowed to bring them to Alberta from Ontario. Who > > is a good supplier? > > Any input greatly appreciated. > > > Hello Some 15 to 20 years ago I did have some buckfast bees. They were very productive and calm. They worked very well in western Wash USA. I would start out new hobby beekeepers with them , because I thought they were bullet proof. They did not need much attention and wintered very well. The only negetive thing that I found for me was the use of burr and brace comb. When they were ready for the winter , they had everything glued and waxed very well.The problem was in spring to get in and check the bees. It would take 30 minutes to an hour to clean things up so I could remove the frames. For a couple of hives , no problem. For 40 hives it was too much work and then I had some carni's that were doing very well , so I stayed with the carni's , but did tell the beginners to use the buckfast.Brother Adam is a great man and beekeeper. The work that went into the buckfast bee must be more than I can imagine. I have not seen any buckfast bees in 10 years , you must have some good ones in Canada. One thing that I did notice about them in the fall. They did an outstanding job gathering good pollen. They seem to store more pollen than the other bees that I had at the time. Fall pollen is a big plus if you want strong hives in the spring. Good Luck Roy ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 02:25:21 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Dave Green, Eastern Pollinator Newsletter" Subject: Re: Doing a Post Mortem Comments: To: allend@internode.net In a message dated 96-03-24 12:35:37 EST, allend@internode.net (Allen Dick) wrote: >I'm wondering if varroa mites are easily detached when found on/with >dead bees and if they will have stayed with their host to the end in >a dead overwintered hive. I have occasionally seen dead adult bees with mites still attatched. More often, I check capped brood, and find them, sometimes three or more per pupa. >Specifically, I am wondering if an alcohol wash of a sample of bees in a dead wintered hive will yield useful data??? I suspect that the majority of mites fall off the bees, or leave them, when they die, so I wouldn't think that would be very useful. However, I haven't tried it. Mites in capped brood cells are pretty much trapped, so it would seem they would tell a more accurate story. We had extremely wet fields last fall, and were unable to get all the bees out in a timely fashion. I still have eight hives on one farm, which has a boggy road to them. I suspect we'll be doing post mortems, when we get them out. Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green PO Box 1200, Hemingway, SC 29554 http://users.aol.com/pollinator/polpage1.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 02:25:31 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Dave Green, Eastern Pollinator Newsletter" Subject: Orange Flow Beekeepers working in citrus groves in South Florida report fair to good flows. But the larger belt of citrus along the "Ridge" of central Florida has been so cold that bees have not worked much, and trees are not yielding. If the weather does not warm soon, the bloom will be over without a significant orange crop in much of the citrus areas - a real disappointment to beekeepers in view of record prices in the honey market. There were scattered frosts extending well into the citrus belt Thursday and Friday nights. I saw oranges in full bloom with no bees working, though they were foraging blackberries at the grove margins. There has been some frost damage to vegetable crops, and slow growth, even where there was no damage, simply because it has been so cold this past week. Some melons have been lost and will have to be replanted.. Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green PO Box 1200 Hemingway, SC 29554 Pollination Home Page http://users.aol.com/pollinator/polpage1.html ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 02:25:28 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Dave Green, Eastern Pollinator Newsletter" Subject: Re: swarms Comments: cc: pats@usa.pipeline.com In a message dated 96-03-24 20:52:36 EST, you write: pats@USA.PIPELINE.COM (pats@usa.pipeline.com) reports: > >Hi folks, This weekend I captured a large swarm of honeybees in my yard. >I've been told that it is too early for bees to swarm in this area. Is this >unusual? I live near Augusta,Ga. >Thanks There have been a few swarms around already, mostly with bees that have been heavily fed syrup. Do you have a beekeeper nearby? I've just been through a bunch of hives just across the border in SC from you. There were a couple hives that were hanging out the entrance. One yard where I fed dry sugar all winter, and never got around to them with syrup, is not near so strong. At the SC bee meeting there was a report of a February swarm on the piedmont. Again, I suspect it was a hive that had been fed. We have had three spells of weather reaching into the 80's, then hard freezes following, so a lot of buds have been damaged. Today I saw the first serious nectar flow, since the 19 degree freeze three weeks ago. Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green, PO Box 1200, Hemingway, SC 29554 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 07:59:31 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Joel Govostes Subject: queen excluders pro/con What's your opinion? Last year on the advice of a friend with many years of experience, I supered over my double-deep brood nests without excluders. I was concerned that the queen would just "chimney," bringing the brood nest right up into the supers. Well, some did, into the first super anyway. By the time the second super went on the honey had started to accumulate in the top of the first super (6 5/8") so the queen went no higher. Then later in the season the brood was "pushed" back down all the way by the main honey flows. The occasional colony was slow in achieving this. Interestingly, construction of swarm cells was very low while following this method. (Don't know whether to attribute it to this.) I have found that by and large, British authorities tend to consider the excluder under the supers essential, while some German writers expound the benefits of letting the brood go up into the third story and letting the honey-pressure force the brood back down later. They seem to hold to the idea that the excluder causes unnecessary congestion, and that the bees work much more efficiently without it ("Einsamwirkung" I think is how they refer to it.) These German apiarists then harvest the 3rd chamber formerly used for brood when it becomes full of honey, also removing full honey frames from the sides of the 2nd brood box. They don't appear to be concerned with harvesting honey from the darkened combs, while most British authors I've read prefer to keep extracting combs clean and light colored exclusively. I guess a practical concern is that with prolific (very Italianized) stocks the brooding is so heavy throughout the season that the brood might not get "pushed down" out of the first supers before harvest. It is distressing to find capped brood in frames you're about to uncap and extract. Do readers consider the excluder as an unnecessary barrier or standard equipment, and where do you position it (above one or two brood chambers)? Ideas or comments greatly appreciated -- Joel Govostes; Freeville, NY, where we still get buckwheat! ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 11:12:12 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Susan W. Cobey" Subject: Re: queen excluders pro/con The use of excluders depends upon the stock. For example, Carniolans keep a tight brood nest and these are not necessary vs. some Italian stock which will tunnel the brood into the honey supers. If you do use ecluders- give the queen 2 deep brood chambers. Susan Cobey Ohio State University Dept. of Entomology 1735 Neil Ave. Columbus, OH 43210 Tel.(614) 292-7928 Fax (614) 292 2180 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 13:08:22 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Stan Sandler Subject: Re: queen excluders pro/con >What's your opinion? Last year on the advice of a friend with many years >of experience, I supered over my double-deep brood nests without excluders. >.... Hello Joel: In my opinion the use of queen excluders is a matter of beekeepers choice and whatever fits into your management system. You say that you have a buckwheat honey flow. Unless you are rigorously separating it from your other honey it is going to darken your honey. We had a letter to the list not too long ago from New Zealand, I believe, saying that extracting honey from combs that had brood in them at some time would darken the honey. It probably wouldn't make much difference if your honey had some buckwheat in it, and it doesn't seem to make any difference to my market (we also have some buckwheat grown here). I use the OAC bee escape board for clearing bees from my honey supers. I find that if there is brood in the third box (or a queen!!), it is quite obvious because the bees will not clear. I just switch the brood frames with some outside honey frames from below and put the escape board back on. But I only have a couple hundred hives and a big commercial beekeeper might find the extra labour unacceptable. I know people who overwinter in one deep box, and I think that must be impossible without using an excluder. Have a nice day Stan ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 13:08:25 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Stan Sandler Subject: Re: Bee-Pro Kirk Jones writes: >Our recipe: >one part expeller process soy flour (you can use 2 parts soy to 1 part yeast) >one part brewers yeast >add as much natural *pollen as you can afford (we trap our own) >mix it up with a commercial bread mixer while adding corn syrup >mix it to a somewhat drippy consistancy, as it will set firmer overnight I have been using what was called "Haydak's mix" in my very dated copy of Hive and Honeybee, i.e. 3 parts soy flour, one part brewers yeast, one part skim milk powder. Has there been work since that indicates that less soy flour is better? I note that Roy Nettlebank feels that way. Is skim milk powder still thought to be a good ingredient (as a dairy farmer I hope so!)? And please if anyone can tell me whether non fat soy flour is as good nutritionally as whole fat soy flour(for bees without a cholesterol problem :)> ), I would really like to know. I posted that question about a month ago and got no response. I am feeding the powder outside today and the bees are really going for it (even though it's only +5 degrees C and sunny). Thankyou Stan ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 18:43:24 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jean-Marie Van Dyck Subject: Re: queen excluders pro/con Hello Bee-Lers ! I quit agree with Stan : If your brood box(es) are big enough to keep the queen egg laying IMO it's better to use a queen excluder : clear wax, no queen thus no problem to remove the bees with excluder (2-3 hours and then blowing). IMO it's important, mostly since the use of Apistan, to not mix the frames = brood frames (contaminated with fluvalinate) and honey super frames (IMO: as clear as possible : the mine are never more than 5 y old) Sorry for my very poor english ! I had very little time ! Jean0-Marie ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 10:49:31 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Bee-Pro Comments: To: Stan Sandler In-Reply-To: <199603251708.NAA02106@bud.peinet.pe.ca> On Mon, 25 Mar 1996, Stan Sandler wrote: > Kirk Jones writes: > >Our recipe: > >one part expeller process soy flour (you can use 2 parts soy to 1 part yeast) > >one part brewers yeast > >add as much natural *pollen as you can afford (we trap our own) > >mix it up with a commercial bread mixer while adding corn syrup > >mix it to a somewhat drippy consistancy, as it will set firmer overnight > > I have been using what was called "Haydak's mix" in my very dated copy of > Hive and Honeybee, i.e. 3 parts soy flour, one part brewers yeast, one part > skim milk powder. Has there been work since that indicates that less soy > flour is better? I note that Roy Nettlebank feels that way. Is skim milk > powder still thought to be a good ingredient (as a dairy farmer I hope so!)? > And please if anyone can tell me whether non fat soy flour is as good > nutritionally as whole fat soy flour(for bees without a cholesterol problem > :)> ), I would really like to know. I posted that question about a month > ago and got no response. I am feeding the powder outside today and the bees > are really going for it (even though it's only +5 degrees C and sunny). Hi Stan , I will let one of the scientist explain the expeller process to make soy flower. They press it is all that I know and it leaves 4 to 6 % oil on the flower. The 1992 revision of The Hive and the Honey bee pp. 215 to 221 has some information on work that has been done on pollen substitutes. I think something was published in the ABJ about soy flower as a protien source. The info that I recieved was direct from Steve Taber. He was very strong about using good pollen to feed the bees. In Steves book Breeding Super Bees , which is available from the Root Co. He talks about pollen that will not support larva for spring build up. I know that different mixtures will work, but which is the best for the bees is the question. Just raising brood , is like us living on peanut butter and jelly and bread. We would be missing some of our body needs. Your only getting them started and the hive will not be living on your mixture for very long.If you were going to feed them for a month I would have some real concern , but we do want to do the best that we can do for the bees , we are beekeepers.You have brought up something that will help others. I will say that putting pollen in the mix will make them put it in the hive faster. I have put out a mix with pollen and one without pollen. The one with thee pollen was black with bees on it while the other one had a few bees on it. Best Regards Roy ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 20:21:21 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: P-O Gustafsson Subject: Re: buckfast queens Roy Nettlebeck wrote: > The only negetive thing that I found for me was the use of > burr and brace comb. When they were ready for the winter , they had > everything glued and waxed very well.The problem was in spring to get in > and check the bees. It would take 30 minutes to an hour to clean things > up so I could remove the frames. For a couple of hives , no problem. Hi Roy, I'm using Buckfasts in Sweden. We have many lines to choose from, some of them produce more propolis than others. There are big differenses between the different lines, you can not judge from the few lines you probably?? have acces to in the US. And there is a continous progress in the breeding programs going on in different countries. Buckfast to me is not a specific race, more of an ongoing projekt to produce better bees. I have had Buckfasts that hardly used propolis or burrcomb at all. Didn't need a hive tool when working them. And then there are others that really like to glue it up. It's all up to the queen producers to make the right selection. regards P-O Gustafsson beeman@kuai.se ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 12:37:33 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Wayne Clifford Subject: Re: Catching Swarms at great heights In-Reply-To: What would you think about using a long piece of PVC pipe about 8 - 10" in diameter with a large funnell at the top. At the bottom would be an empty hive with a few honey combs in it. Place the funnell end under the swarm and give them a shake. The theory is that they would all come sliding down the shute into the ready hive. ?? I have shaken bees into hives before at low levels and there seem to accept it rather well. Wayne On Sat, 23 Mar 1996, Paul Cronshaw, D.C. wrote: > Bee-listers, > > Today I had my first call on a swarm. ( I have my name on the local Ag and > fire department lists). > > Arriving at the scene I noted a nice size swarm about 15 feet hanging on a > pine branch. Too high for a ladder. > > WHat devices are there for capturing swarms from high locations? > > I remember reading in Bee Culture about a swarm capture technique using > some long poles and a plastic garbage bag. > > Any other ideas? > > Paul Cronshaw DC > Hobby beekeeper > Santa Barbara, CA > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Wayne Clifford | Phone (360) 427-9670 X-581 Technical Administrator | FAX (360) 427-7798 Mason County Department of Health Services | PO Box 1666 Shelton, WA 98584 | USA wrc@inpho.hs.washington.edu | ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ""Nurture your mind with great thoughts, for you will never go any higher than you think." Benjamin Disraeli ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 12:47:13 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Wayne Clifford Subject: Re: Poisonous Nectar! In-Reply-To: Thanks for the verification on that. I guess I'll exclude that plant from MY landscape. I have seen it in wide use in many urban settings. My wife and I saw it in Seattle, WA and liked the way it looked. Well, I guess it is something to be aware of. Wayne On Sun, 24 Mar 1996, Rudolf E. Bahr wrote: > Hello Wayne, > > Asia Minor seems to be known because of poisonous honey since > antiquity. Especially "Rhododendron ponticum" and "Rhododendron luteum" > are said to cause nausea, dizziness, headache, visual defects and short > blindness. Both are members of the family ericaceae. They grow wild in > big quantities near the turkish Black sea coast in the East of the town > Samsun. > > Regards, > R.E.Bahr > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 16:31:38 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Rick Grubbs Organization: The Digital Line Subject: Queen Needed I recently did a split on two hives, and introduced a queen in a cage into the split. I examined the hive today and found the queen dead in the cage. Anyone know where I can get a replacement queen quickly? -- *************************** * Charles (Rick) Grubbs * * digital@avana.net * * Douglasville, Ga SE USA * *************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 17:32:28 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: Re: Doing a Post Mortem Comments: To: Allen Dick In-Reply-To: <199603241735.AA03767@internode.net> On Sun, 24 Mar 1996, Allen Dick wrote: > I'm wondering if varroa mites are easily detached when found on/with > dead bees and if they will have stayed with their host to the end in > a dead overwintered hive. > > Specifically, I am wondering if an alcohol wash of a sample of bees > in a dead wintered hive will yield useful data??? > Yes - this is easy to do. Alcohol wash is OK if they are too dry. If the dead bees are moist, you can just roll them in a jar, like an ether roll but without the either. If the bees are very dry, the mites also dry, the mites may appear very light or even clear in color. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 17:53:40 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: Re: Importation of Bee Semen into the USA In-Reply-To: <01I2M1RH27LE95QKMU@delphi.com> On Thu, 21 Mar 1996, Robert Stevens wrote: > Why can't we have a two pronged approach, let the scientists, what > few are left with funds, do the testing and assaying. But, at the > same time, let the commerical beekeepers and the queen breeders bring > the semen from wherever and get the queens out there. A good start. I think we need a few more prongs to prepare the industry. I'm sure there will be more but heres a start: 1) Genetic education aimed at the average beekeeper. I don't mean average in colony count, but average ability and knowledge. These are the guys we need to support the effort. 2) Research of improved, simple assay techniques for the characteristics involved with varroa resistance. I've heard some of this is being done, it probably needs support. 3) Goverment money is getting scarce. If we really want this to happen, we will have to pay. How do we get this concept across to the industry? Who will organize the effort? Maybe national organizations? Should we look to the grower organizations (almonds, apples, ect.)?How? 4) Reasearch to determine how "precision" the breeding and production matings must be to effectively control varroa, and if that degree of precision is practical. 5) Education of the queen production industry regarding the knowledge and techniques they may need in the future. I,m thinking of things like I.I, isolated mating, and all the other stuff that can lead to reliable disease control though genetics. 6) Maybe the most important- someone or some organization to coordinate all this stuff, I think we need it all. How about some ideas from the industry leaders and scientists out there. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 18:28:52 EST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jim Moore DTN276-9448 ogo1/e17 508-496-9448 Subject: Question: Drone shortages do to varroa mites? I'm wondering wether the varroa mite has or will reduce the feral colonies and the manged colonies to such a level that there will be insuffucient drones avaiable for natural mating of queens? If so, will intentional drone cells be proposed to ensure sufficient numbers of drones? Has anyone done any studies concerning reduced drone population? ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 18:37:15 EST Reply-To: "Glen B. Glater" Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Glen B. Glater" Subject: Will swarm trap baits near hives *cause* a swarm? I've just bought a box swarm trap developed by Dr. Schwartz, and I'm wondering whether placing it "near" (within 300 feet) of my hives will CAUSE them to swarm. Does anyone have experience with swarm traps and the pheremone baits and this issue? Thanks. --glen ************************************************************** Midnight Networks Inc. * 200 Fifth Avenue * Waltham, MA 02154 Glen B. Glater Principal, Strategic Networking Group Phone: (617) 890-1001 Fax: (617) 890-0028 Internet: glen@midnight.com http://www.midnight.com/~glen Midnight Networks Inc. WWW page http://www.midnight.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 20:31:23 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: Re: Survey results In-Reply-To: <199603242054.PAA21294@orion.neca.com> Heres the results of the "Importance of honeybee characteristics", ranking the listed characteristics in descending order of importance. Rank was determined by the number of times the characteristic was a "1" or a "2" in the returned forms. I had planned to do more with the results but the response was not adequate. Number of responses - 38 Number of useable responses - 29 Who responded: Hobby beekeepers , <10 col. - 12 Sideliners , >10<300 col. _ 15 Commercial , >300 col. _ 2 Honey producers - 27 Pollinators - 6 Queen producers - 4 from: North America - 23 Europe - 6 U.S.A. - 19 Canada - 4 U.K. - 3 Germany - 2 other - 1 Characteristic Rank score Honey production 1 13 Varroa resistance 1 13 Tracheal Mite resistance 2 11 Winterability 2 11 Brood viability 3 6 Aggressiveness 4 3 Swarming (lack of) 5 1 Pollen 5 1 Chalkbrood 5 1 Comb Stability 6 0 Color 6 0 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 21:16:25 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: Re: Importation of Bee Semen into the USA (What do you think?) In-Reply-To: <960320230350_357398570@emout04.mail.aol.com> On Wed, 20 Mar 1996, my name is Dean M. Breaux wrote: > In a message dated 96-03-20 11:02:54 EST, you write: > > What we are talking about is the use of semen, how can it hurt. I don't know. Can a disease be trasmitted ? A virus ? Is there a technical reason to prevent importation ? Is there a regulator or scientist who can answer ? ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 08:17:59 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: WILLIAM G LORD Subject: Re: queen excluders pro/con In-Reply-To: from "Joel Govostes" at Mar 25, 96 07:59:31 am Excluders have other uses other than excluding the queen from honey supers. Where I keep bees the honey flow is over by June 1 and often we get little appreciable honey until the fall, and then not always. In my case I put an excluder over the (single) brood chamber immediately after the honey flow, usually when I am removing honey with fume boards and driving down the queen. If you don't exclude the queen from the honey super there will be no honey left come fall. I run some hives in 2 deeps and some in a deep plus a six and five eights super, either way I put in an excluder after the flow. A second good reason to split the brood chamber from honey supers is ease of finding queens during requeening. It is a whole lot easier to find a queen restricted to 9 frames in single brood chamber than to look for one over two or three deeps. When its real hot and the queen does not show herself after two looks over the brood combs I use an excluder to "sift" the bees through to almost always find the queen. When it comes to use during honey flows I admit to being ambivalent about excluders. Sometimes I use them and sometimes not, usually not. Bill Lord Louisburg, NC -- WILLIAM G LORD E-Mail : wglord@franklin Internet: wglord@franklin.ces.ncsu.edu Phone : 9194963344 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 08:43:48 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kay Clay-Dewey Subject: Re: Ouch! In a hot climate?, query, where do you live? I live in Phoenix, AZ, and do quite well in a Dadant (size 48) w/zip on net. Believe me at 100+ degrees for 2.5-3 months of the year it really was quite comfortable, though I do wear a bandana in my hat to keep the sweat out of my eyes and off my glasses. Kay ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 08:04:14 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Joel Govostes Subject: Re: queen excluders pro/con >The use of excluders depends upon the stock. For example, Carniolans keep a >tight brood nest and these are not necessary vs. some Italian stock which >will tunnel the brood into the honey supers. > >If you do use ecluders- give the queen 2 deep brood chambers. > >Susan Cobey >Ohio State University >Dept. of Entomology >1735 Neil Ave. >Columbus, OH 43210 >Tel.(614) 292-7928 >Fax (614) 292 2180 Yes, Susan, I found this to be the case with the half dozen New World Carniolans I tried. I gave them two deeps, and they made a nice honey-barrier above the brood, and no "towering" brood nest resulted. Unfortunately, they were the worst hit by varroa of all the colonies as well. (began buildup of second year well, great wintering, but began dying off in droves with lots of deformed bees, before end of May. The local mongrels kept on building up, tho I found Varroa in them too.) Any idea why? ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 09:35:16 EDT Reply-To: mnasr@evbhort.uoguelph.ca Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Medhat Nasr Organization: Environ. Biology & Horticulture Subject: Re: buckfast queens Comments: To: Doug McCulloch Hi Doug: In Ontario registered Buckfast Breeders are: 1. Barry Davies RR #1 Seeley Bay, Ontario. KOH 2NO, Canada. Tel: (613) 387-3171. 2. Rick Neilson RR #1 Stratton, Ontario. POW 1NO, Canada tel: (807) 487-2387 3. Paul Montoux RR #1 Hagersville, Ontario, NOA 1HO, Canada Tel (905) 768-5530. These breeders are registered with the Buckfast Abby, England. They recieve their genetic materials from England and Denmark. They follow the same selection and breeding system which were established by Br. Adam. For the experiences, you can question these breeders. For, the inter- provincial movment of bees and queens regulation, you can contact: Ken Tuckey Alberta Provincial Apiculturist Tel: (403) 422-1789 Good Luck, Medhat Nasr, Ph.D. Ontario Beekeepers' Association Doug Wrote: > Does anyone have any experience with the buckfast queen? Are they as good > as they are claimed to be? I would be interested in trying out a few, but > am not even sure if its allowed to bring them to Alberta from Ontario. Who > is a good supplier? > Best regards - Doug McCulloch > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 10:13:00 EST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Browning, Robert" Subject: Swarm Catching Twice when I had high swarms to catch I had an aluminum extension ladder near at hand. Taking the lighter section, I tied a 5-gallon plastic bucket to the top rung and, with guidance from an accomplice, positioned the ladder a-straddle the branch with the bucket directly under and around the swarm. A few sharp, upward bumps with the ladder put the bees in the bucket which I quickly lowered and dumped on my sheet in front of the awaiting hive body. I wish all swarms were so easy to catch, but BEE SURE THE BUCKET IS IN THE RIGHT PLACE!!! To be struck by a falling swarm could be dangerous. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 10:49:45 EST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Aaron Morris Subject: Less filling! Tastes great! Less Filling! Tastes great! Queen excluders or no queen excluders, that is the question. Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer the stings and errors of outrageous queen wandering or to use a simple piece of equipment to assure that the queen stays where you want her. The controversy will never end as the answer depends on where you are located and the beekeeper's own personal preference. Some have already posted pros and cons that hinge on where they are located and the size of their operation, some being comfortable with the extra work involved to drive the queen back to the brood chamber while others willingly sacrifice some of the harvest for the convenience of being certain that the queen is in the brood chamber and that honey supers are exclusively for honey production. Personally I'd rather use a queen excluder because I run two brood chambers per colony (standard in northern climes) which provides plenty of brood rearing and queen hiding space and I want to make certain that I don't have to bother with brood mixed in with the honey supers. If I am sacrificing honey for this convenience, so be it. Incidently, the original question came from Cornell University. Dr. Roger Morse (recently retired from Cornell) considers queen excluders a must for beekeeping operations in the central and upstate New York area (see _A_Year_in_the_Beeyard_), although he readily admits that results may vary based on location and personal preference. Aaron Morris - I think, therefore I bee! ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 11:20:18 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Susan W. Cobey" Subject: Re: NWC & Varroa Joel,Interesting observations in NWC. Just started looking at hygienic behavior as a defense against V. Though this will probably take several mech. of defense to knock, as well as some time. Please be patient. We've been concentrating efforts on Tracheal mites up to this point. Counts are almost undetectable in the breeders coming out of winter this year with no treatment. Susan Cobey Ohio State University Dept. of Entomology 1735 Neil Ave. Columbus, OH 43210 Tel.(614) 292-7928 Fax (614) 292 2180 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 08:38:27 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: John Day Subject: Re: Importation of Bee Semen into the USA (What do you think?) vince coppola wrote to a reply: >> >> What we are talking about is the use of semen, how can it hurt. >I don't know. Can a disease be trasmitted ? A virus ? ever heard of aids? any disease can be transmitted thru body fluids, and not just ours. john ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 12:10:12 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: WILLIAM G LORD Subject: bee suits I read the traffic on bee suits but did not have time to respond. I really like the rip-stop nylon suits. They are light weight and have no surprise openings like most cotton suits (pocket openings). I wear a tee shirt underneath and even though the thin nylon suit sticks to your skin it is extremely rare to be stung through the suit. The only problem is veils tend to slide up over the slick collar and expose your neck. This can be fixed by sewing a stip of cotton cloth to the back side of the collar for the veil to get a purchase on. Walter Kelley and Brushy Mnt. both sell nylon coveralls. I move a lot of bees to cucumber pollination in all sorts of weather and get exposed to a lot of angry bees. Nylon suits are the best in my book. Bill Lord Louisburg, NC -- WILLIAM G LORD E-Mail : wglord@franklin Internet: wglord@franklin.ces.ncsu.edu Phone : 9194963344 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 11:24:41 CST6CDT Reply-To: bwhite@mda-is.mda.state.mn.us Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: BLANE WHITE Organization: Minnesota Dept of Agriculture Subject: Re: Importation of Bee Semen into the USA (What do you thin Vince Coppola wrote: I don't know. Can a disease be trasmitted ? A virus ? Is there a technical reason to prevent importation ? Is there a regulator or scientist who can answer ? Hi Vince, I don't know if it is possible to spread disease via semen but undesireable traits are an important issue. That is the stock being imported. Does it have undesireable traits? Are we sure it has the desired traits? How do we know? Whenever stock is imported there is some risk of bringing in something undesireable. For example look at the problems in South Africa with the cape bee. I think that the stock to be imported would need to have documented desireable traits to be worth the risk. Some of these risks are hard to define but we need to have a way to evaluate the proposed importation in terms of the risk involved. Importing semen seems to me to have lower risk that bringing in queens but there is still some risk involved. If the traits can be found here why take the risk of importing stock? Other livestock breeding groups have addressed these issues and developed mechanisms to allow limited importation maybe we need to look at what they have done. blane ****************************************** Blane White State Apiary Inspector Minnesota Department of Agriculture 90 W Plato Blvd St Paul, MN 55107 http://www.mda.state.mn.us ph 612-296-0591 fax 612-296-7386 bwhite@mda-is.mda.state.mn.us ******************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 18:18:20 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Steve Pearce Subject: importation of bee semen There seems to be a notion that the rules against the importation of bee sperm into USA is unfair and understandable and that it is totally safe. This is what I think The importation of germplasm, although probably at low risk of carrying viruses and bacteria, (although not totally) has it's biggest problem in the genetic material which it contains. This germplasm has the potential to produce offspring which may behave in strange and unpredicatable ways. In the case of the honey bee this is very important, and in many ways this issue needs tougher legislation for the honeybee than for other agricultural species. Once introduced, alien germplasm will be very difficult to remove from a population of honeybees, where it is impossible to contain or totally control the matings with the native/feral population. This is not so important for instance in cattle semen importation, as the offspring are not going to range around the countryside uncontrollably, or hide up trees etc. There are probably many other points also relevant to your question of which I have no knowledge. But I hope this goes some way to explaining why people are concerned with this matter, and why control is so very important. Steve Pearce University of Dundee Scotland ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 15:42:35 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: Queen Needed > Charles (Rick) Grubbs wrote >I recently did a split on two hives, and introduced a queen in a cage >into the split. I examined the hive today and found the queen dead in >the cage My first question would be to ask why was the Queen dead? It is possible she was killed by an unknown virgin or workers who were installing a new Queen of their own. My advice would be to examine that hive very carefully before trying to install another queen. Or better still add a frame of eggs from hive one and watch to see what happens. **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 15:42:39 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: Survey results Vince Coppola wrote: >Rank was determined by the number of times the characteristic was a "1" >or a "2" in the returned forms. I had planned to do more with the results >but the response was not adequate. > >Number of responses - 38 >Number of useable responses - 29 I think, Vince, this explains why beekeeping is in the state it is in, there are people out there with good ideas and total dedication. Unfortunately as this response shows there is a sad lack of committment to follow through. There are approximately 600 members of BEE-L and only 6.5% responded, a pathetically low number. We can probably make the excuse that those not in North America didn't think you expected them to reply, but is is still a very low number. Roy Nettlebeck is pleading for us to work together, and yet we haven't got the time to fill out a questionaire, when we are sitting at the computer anyway!!!!! **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 16:09:51 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Tom Ross Subject: Re: Apitherapy with a JOLT! There was a recent artcle in NEW ZEALAND BEEKEEPER mag containing accounts of snake bite and sting cures from electric shock, similar to what was described in a previous post. I will try to find the article again. I doubt that this will get the attention of the US medical/scientific community, probably because in many parts of this country it is hard to find a snake bite to treat. Most people simply ignore stings. However, $15 is quite a low cost if it works for bees or snakes. I have not bought a sting kit from a pharmacy, but have heard they cost $30 - $40. I am in NE Ohio, and like snakes to hold down the mice, but I have talked to Western beekeepers who have had close calls when moving hives, and might appreciate such a device. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 16:20:41 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: importation of bee semen >>Steve Pearce wrote. >Once introduced, alien germplasm will be very difficult to remove from a >population of honeybees, where it is impossible to contain or totally >control the matings with the native/feral population. This is not so >important for instance in cattle semen importation, as the offspring are >not going to range around the countryside uncontrollably, or hide up >trees etc. I am suprised that no-one has remembered the fiasco of unrestrained importation. Firstly, the bees imported into Brazil. Secondly, somebody, somewhere brought in both T-mite and Varroa, both of which needed a host to get across the pond. Even now some are stupid enough to import bees even while there are quarantines in operation. Only recently a guy was fined over $500 CDN, he was found to have queens in his pocket, brought into British Columbia from California. Some never seem to learn!!! **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 22:09:54 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Gordon Scott Subject: Re: Less filling! Tastes great! Less Filling! Tastes great! In-Reply-To: <960326.105137.EST.SYSAM@cnsibm.albany.edu> On Tue, 26 Mar 1996, Aaron Morris wrote: > ... others willingly sacrifice some of the harvest for > the convenience of being certain that the queen is in the brood chamber > and that honey supers are exclusively for honey production. Hmmm, I think I would substitute the word confident for the word certain -- been there, done that, bought the T-shirt :-) Best regards, -- Gordon Scott gordon@apis.demon.co.uk gordon@multitone.co.uk (work) The Basingstoke Beekeeper (newsletter) beekeeper@apis.demon.co.uk Embryo Home Page Beekeeper; Kendo 3rd Dan; Sometime sailor. Hampshire, England. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 05:50:18 GMT Reply-To: Tim_Sterrett@westtown.edu Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Tim Sterrett Organization: Westtown School Subject: Swarms up high Another way to capture a swarm that is too high for a ladder is to raise a frame of brood to the swarm. The bees should move onto the frame, covering the brood, and the frame can be lowered to the beekeeper. The instinct that drives bees to care for brood is, apparently, stronger than the swarming instinct. Tim Sterrett Westtown, (Southeastern) Pennsylvania, USA tim_sterrett@westtown.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 06:02:02 GMT Reply-To: Tim_Sterrett@westtown.edu Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Tim Sterrett Organization: Westtown School Subject: decoy hives for swarms I do not know whether a decoy hive near an apiary will cause a swarm. I do try to keep a decoy hive in the vicinity of my bees in case they do swarm. I have not found that the pheromone has any effect on decoy hive success. (I have tried it during two different years.) I have for years put out decoy hives to try to catch swarms from feral colonies in trees or buildings. The best decoy often is the stack of supers in the shed. Decoy hives: How big? full hive body shallow super How far from possible parent colony? How high off ground? Hanging by rope from limb of tree? Against trunk of tree? On shed roof? On ground? Bait? an old comb? pheromone? Tim Sterrett Westtown, (Southeastern) Pennsylvania, USA tim_sterrett@westtown.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 18:01:20 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Timothy Cote Subject: Re: Anaphylaxis happens As a physician/beekeeper of 15 and 4 years, respectively, I was surprised to learn how few beekeepers have sting kits (specifically, kits containing injectable epinephrine, the only real emergency therapy for anaphylaxis). Certainly there exists a definite, albeit small, risk that a visitor the the apiary is one of those 0.1 - 0.5% of the population that is allergic to bee stings. I decided the main reason is probably that it requires a physician's prescription and getting that can be a bit of a hassle. While I am licensed to do general practice, my area of specialty is public health and preventive medicine. Therefore, I've decided to purchase the kits in bulk for prescriptive resale to beekeepers who want them ($25 ea). They are in no way a substitute for regular care by an allergist should hypersensitivity be suspected in the beekeeper or his/her family (and patients/recepients/purchasers must sign acknowledging this), but rather are a "first aid" emergency device used for stung persons previously unknown to be allergic. Sound practice requires that administration of emergency epinephrine to allergic individuals be immediatly followed by rapid transport to medical care. To steal a phrase from the gun lobby, better to have one and not need it than the reverse. Statistically, the chances of dying from a beesting are much smaller than getting hit by a car on the way to the beeyard. Still, as a physician-beekeeper, I'd be foolish not to have treatment on-hand, and some of you may be concerned about your liablility also. Aunt Millie lying on the ground in a white suit is just too frightening an image for my tastes. I'm doing this as a service to the beekeeping community, and so I'd be interested in that community's reaction (prepare cudos or flames now). Apparently, no physician has offered this before. I've put an ad in -Bee Culture-. We'll see what you have to say. Tim Cote MD MPH 512 Boston Ave Takoma Park, MD 20912 tel 301-587-2425 fax 301-587-9261 beesbuzz@mail.erols.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 20:07:11 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kirk Jones Subject: heavy winter losses Here in Michigan, in the Great Lakes area of the US, our bees are getting their butts spanked,i.e. heavy winterkill. We're scratching our heads, as we tried every technique to our knowledge. We used menthol in the late spring and early summer, up to the flow(too cold in the fall up here). We put on Crisco patties. We used Apistan strips. We are trying darker leather colored Italians(mite resistant?). We even wrapped them. Our losses may be 30% or higher. Most reports in Michigan are 50% to 90% loss. The package bee producers are totally booked for the most part. We will be replacing over a 1000 hives. I've read reports on virus infection. How about a post from some of you reseachers, etc. on this matter. The blown out hives still have some honey. The cluster is blown apart, with bees spread all over the hive. Many bees on the ground outside. I have a feeling it is a mite related problem, but cannot pinpoint exactly what. I am willing to send samples to anyone with the time and interest to examine some bees. Kirk Sleeping Bear Apiaries Kirk Jones b-man@aliens.com when you get lemons, make lemonade.... ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 20:25:20 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Dave Green, Eastern Pollinator Newsletter" Subject: Re: heavy winter losses b-man@ALIENS.COM (Kirk Jones) reported: >Our losses may be 30% or higher. Most reports in Michigan are 50% to 90% >loss. The package bee producers are totally booked for the most part. We >will be replacing over a 1000 hives. You could bring them south for the winter. This is the worst winter here that I can remember; losses have been greater than we'd like. But now we are starting to find swarm cells in hives. We made a bunch of splits today. We were using some of our poorest bees; the last to come back in from the fields, (and be treated with Apistan), mostly 2 year-old queens in single story hives (almost guaranteed to swarm in a week or two). Despite a couple drone layers, and one queenless one, we still averaged two and a half nucs per hive. I gave them each two frames of brood, a frame of bees/pollen, a frame of honey, a frame of foundation, and some syrup. We'll have perhaps 10 - 15% not take, but I predict the rest will have 6-8 frames of brood by May 10. I suspect that non-migratory, commercial beekeeping may be increasingly rare. Many of the current group of migratories here, have come of necessity, because they cannot stand the winter losses in the north, even if it is every other winter, or every third winter, that they get hit badly. Some immediately dismiss the idea of migrating, because it involves too much time away from home. Then it would seem that another alternative I've often proposed, but never been able to get anyone to try, is to send down brood comb in nuc boxes. I would put them (in deep boxes) on strong hives in February, feed the heck out of them, and you get the brood that is laid in them. Brood would be ready for nucs by about the first or second week of April, depending on weather. Queens or cells are also available in this area, if arranged for in advance. It would involve a few days here, at the most beautiful time of the year, to make up nucs, then they could be shipped or picked up about May 1-10. The doubles I made up this way are averaging 3-4 frames in the top story, and many of them had to draw foundation first. By April 8-10, I expect them to have at least 7 frames average, and many will have brood on all ten frames. The severe freeze here three weeks ago killed a lot of buds, and set the bees back some. For two weeks we fed syrup to robby, mean bees. Today, for the first time, we had a real flow on. It was almost a roar in the bee yard late this morning. I love it! Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green, PO Box 1200, Hemingway, SC 29554 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 20:25:25 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Dave Green, Eastern Pollinator Newsletter" Subject: Re: queen excluders pro/con In a message dated 96-03-26 08:41:08 EST, wglord@FRANKLIN.CES.NCSU.EDU (WILLIAM G LORD) writes: > Where I keep bees the honey flow is over by June 1 and often we >get little appreciable honey until the fall, and then not always. In my >case I put an excluder over the (single) brood chamber immediately after >the honey flow, usually when I am removing honey with fume boards and >driving down the queen. If you don't exclude the queen from the honey >super there will be no honey left come fall. This is true here also, and I expect throughout much of the southeast. Summer and fall flows are spotty and totally undependable. Many times, a good vigorous queen will fill the hive from top to bottom with brood, supers included. The hive will be roaring strong at the end of September, with not a drop of capped honey in the whole thing. I figure I MUST have the queen into one story with an excluder by mid-June at the latest. I almost always regret it, if I don't. Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green, PO Box 1200, Hemingway, SC 29554 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 18:39:45 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Survey results In-Reply-To: <199603262054.PAA08721@segwun.muskoka.net> On Tue, 26 Mar 1996, David Eyre wrote: > Vince Coppola wrote: > >Rank was determined by the number of times the characteristic was a "1" > >or a "2" in the returned forms. I had planned to do more with the results > >but the response was not adequate. > > > >Number of responses - 38 > >Number of useable responses - 29 > > I think, Vince, this explains why beekeeping is in the state it is in, there > are people out there with good ideas and total dedication. Unfortunately as > this response shows there is a sad lack of committment to follow through. > There are approximately 600 members of BEE-L and only 6.5% responded, a > pathetically low number. We can probably make the excuse that those not in > North America didn't think you expected them to reply, but is is still a > very low number. > Roy Nettlebeck is pleading for us to work together, and yet we > haven't got the time to fill out a questionaire, when we are sitting at the > computer anyway!!!!! > **************************************************** > * David Eyre Hi David and everyone.The poll was taken and the responses poor from our standpoint. I thought it would be better , like 100 + would have been great for beekeepers. This list is not all beekeepers.Beekeepers are passive as a rule.We have lost a lot of hobby beekeepers and there wasn't many screams from them. They just put the gear in the shed or burned it.I hope we try to talk some of them back into beekeeping. I was giving out apistan strips to hobby beekeepers in my area and talked to them about the mite. Some still have the bees and they wintered well. I do want to take something posiyive out of the poll. Those that care , made a statement on Varroa.We want honey ,but we want Varroa under control just as bad.I wrote something this morning 4 pages. When I was done I would not post it. I feel that the people that are real beekeepers will see the light and want to help. What we will have is a bunch of winners , because we are not going to give up. That mite will not stop us , it is just one problem that needs to be cured. Beekeeping has been around a long time and the bees and the beekeepers have had to ajust to change. The power in people can do almost anything. Yes, it takes hard work by people dedicated to there cause. Vince just asked people to raise there hands and be counted for what they thought was important. Enough said. Now we have to work on a plan.ABJ March 96 page 203 Honet-bee Improvement Program bym Jack Griffes. It is outstanding.They call it HIP.I see that they had 10 beekeepers together now.Jack wrote, As I said before,We are all in the same boat being sunk by Varroa mites (and other problems ), so why don't we band together to work out a long term solution?" They already have a plan and it is working.They want more on board , not the sinking ship. We all live there.One small step, and I think we can all remmember that step on the moon. It took a lot of work to get there and we have recieved many benifits from the research. We need many , many people doing there bit and the mite will not be a problem for the long haul. All of us keep a keen eye on nature, I would bet that during the process of taking care of the mite we will come up with at least a few other positive results.We will learn a lot more about the bee and its genetics. Lets all take a dep breath and think about ways we can help each other.The world is one and we have people all around the globe that love bees and have kind hearts. God Bless Roy ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 22:11:01 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "my name is Dean M. Breaux" Subject: Re: Importation of Bee Semen into the USA (What do you think?) Vince, I myself have asked the same question. To the reaserch community as well as to the regulators, many times and to date all answers have been No. Which makes sense to me. If there was a bee sexually transmited disease, it would be hard to transmit given that drones only mate once. Also it would be rampant in the population given the promiscuous nature of the Queen. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 17:38:15 -1000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Walter Patton Subject: bee disease spread, we better think NOW >To: scobey@MAGNUS.ACS.OHIO-STATE.EDU >From: hihoney@ilhawaii.net (Walter Patton) >Subject: bee disease spread > >Hello Susan Cobey < bee-l readers & bee lovers > V copper suggested that I write you and ask which honeybee disease and pest might bee transmitted with seman and pollen? Here in Hawaii the most isolated place on earth we are concerned about protecting the only U S honeybee stocks certified to bee free of V & T mites and without Afracanized genes. Since 1985 Hawaii has prohibited the entery of honeybees and bee equipment to prevent the introduction and or spread of bee disease.Hawaii should bee declared a honeybee site sensitive location for the future security of U S honeybee s. We lost a battle to stop N Z bees from entering our state on the way to Canada.Thanks to free trading leaders of America and the Gatt treaty we have to let them sit on the tar mac at Honolulu Int. Airport and hope that no accidents occur. Accidents do occur and N Z bees are acknowledged to bee loaded with honeybee viruses. 14 viruses/pests to bee exact.We recently got reports that some Hawaii bee's sent to Beltsville were found to bee free of Kashmir, cloudy wing and black queen viruses. Other bee research people have admitted that mites and viruses are deadly and unable to control. The USDA has been VERY VERY slow to show concerns for the bee viruses which only recently have been found in the mainland US. I think the viruses have come to the North American Continent via N Z bees to Canada and Canadian bees to the U S ,which if true will bee an example of the complete failure by USDA to protect U S honeybee stocks from the "Introduction and or spread of honeybee disease and pest " as per the original intent of the Honey bee Act of 1922. > Regarding the HB Act 1922 .The act was gutted of it's original intent by the last round of the Uraguy Treaty to ratify the Gatt agreement . This all became effective 1-5-95.The original Act had a strict prohibition against the import of Bees to the U S. That strict prohibition does not exist any more. Now the Honeybee issue is left to the discretion of the Secretary of Agriculture and all of these changes were done without notice or imput from anyone.Troy Fore did sit on "the sweetners advisory board" that was supposed to advise on the effects of the changes and HE says the panel only addressed the issues of Honey as a sweetner and never talked about the potential impact on honeybees. Yet another example of industry and government officials without any true bee sensitive feelings. I believe that this issue is real and will get worse. A German bee person was brought to our Big Island Beekeepers Association meeting several years ago by some of the local USDA people and he talked of famines being a possibility in Europe with their more advanced problems and his comments made a BIG impression on me . We must give our collective energies to the honeybee which we are dependent on for our own survival.Man with his better ideas and bigger ,faster means of transportation have already spread honeybee problems around the world and we may bee too late and let's hope for the best. > Thank you for your time and your comments will bee appreciated >Sincerly Walter Patton > Walter Patton- Beekeeper "BEE HEALTHY EAT YOUR HONEY DAILY" 27-703 A Kaieie Rd. "The Beehive the Fountain of Youth and Health " Papaikou,HI. 96781 " You are never too old for a little honey " Ph.fax 808-964-5401 " Honey Eaters Stick Together Longer " hihoney@ilhawaii.net http://www.alohamall.com/hamakua/hihoney.htm http://www.alohamall.com/hamakua/beeware.htm http://www.alohamall.com/hamakua/lamalani.htm ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 23:26:02 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: QueenBJan@AOL.COM Subject: A Prayer for the Bees Out of concern for the decline in the number of bees due to parasites, disease, and pesticide misuse, I offer this prayer for the bees. I invite you to make it your prayer as well. Our Heavenly Father, Thank you for creating us and our glorious earth. We especially want to thank you for the bees that so fascinate us in their unique ways. We grieve, as you most surely grieve as well, over the decline in the number of bees. Help us as caretakers of your creation to be diligent in protecting them. Those of us who care for bees ask that you give us wisdom in the way we manage them. May we be diligent in our study of the bees that we may be knowledgeable and alert to their needs, and recognize the treatments they may need. Help us to find ways to educate the public about the importance of our bees and about the seriousness of the threat to our food supply should they die out. Help them to overcome their fears of bee stings with a sincere appreciation of their importance and an awareness of how gentle bees are under normal circimstances. Impress upon the farmers and the crop dusters the seriousness of pesticide misuse to the existance of our bees. May they see the need for bees to assure us a variety of foods as well as better tasting foods. May they recognize our loss if the bees die out. Expand their concern for the total welfare of mankind and may they not let personal greed get in the way of good stewardship. Be with our lawmakers and law enforcers and give them the desire to be knowledgeable and protective of our bees. And, Lord, when our efforts and energy have maxed out and we realize we can't do it all, please watch over our bees. Protect them from what we cannot. Give them the care that we, through neglect or lack of time and energy, cannot give. Hold them in your hands when calamities occur in the weather. Intervene when man in his ignorance and/or greed would do them harm. May the unique and wondrous bees that you created continue to bless this earth with their services in pollinating our plants and providing us with their golden sunshine -- honey. Amen QueenB Jan (Janice Green) and Pollinator (Dave Green) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 23:32:44 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: James Maus Subject: Re: buckfast queens In response to Roy's observation about buckfast bee's regarding brace and burr comb; I think that the occurance of it to that degree may at that time have been from weavers having a great amount of caucasian in the stock (their's) at this time I this generally isnt a problem with buckfast's and if you study Br. Adams writings you will note that he was very diligent about breeding these traits out of "his" strain, therefore I feel safe in saying this trait existed for the most part in the "americanized" version of buckfast. I am sure if you compare the canadian buckfast with american buckfast you will readily note differences. I say this after using weavers buckfast several years and after reading all Br. Adam wrote about the buckfast anf than comparing. Jim Maus ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Mar 1996 03:14:00 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Andy Nachbaur Organization: WILD BEE'S BBS (209) 826-8107 LOS BANOS, CA Subject: Re: Importation of Bee Semen into the USA (What do you thin BW>From: BLANE WHITE >Date: Tue, 26 Mar 1996 11:24:41 CST6CDT >Subject: Re: Importation of Bee Semen into the USA (What do you thin >Organization: Minnesota Dept of Agriculture >Other livestock breeding groups have addressed these issues and >developed mechanisms to allow limited importation maybe we need to >look at what they have done. Hi Blane & Bee Friends, Yes, there are risks to allowing the restricted or unrestricted importation of honeybees or honey bee semen into the US. I would suggest they are less today then in the past and in fact there are more reasons why off shore beekeepers should not want to import US bees then reasons for US beekeepers not being able to look for solutions to today's bee problems, today, from off shore sources. US beekeepers have had a "developed mechanism", under both current US Law and US Agriculture Regulation as amended to bring in honey bees for stock improvement, and it has not worked or better stated kept up with the needs of the industry. It is also reinforced by many state restrictions on bee imports. It is because this door is only open to the few, good people they may all be, and the world's best scientist's to, and the best skilled queen breeders, but the reality is this system has failed and continues to fail to serve the needs of the industry because so few can use it for what ever reason. And if it could be measured the numerous imports of stock and semen has not resulted in anything that can be called increased honey production, increased pollination efficiency, increased longevity of adult bees, or disease resistance or mite resistance in our honeybees. It has had value in increased knowledge, and that is good but hard to place a dollar value on. The exception to this is honest hard working but few beebreeders who have found some value in marketing the daughters of these few government imports at increased prices of course. Nothing wrong with that, but not one of these queen breeders can supply any one beekeeper with stock in numbers that is any more superior then the stock any experienced beekeeper could rear his/her self or purchase from another reliable bee breeder. The few can say with convention that their stock is the best, from government imported stock, can run big ads in the bee trade papers and sell lots of queens, but in the end the stock is no different then what someone else has without the benefit of the hype of government controlled imports. The real question is will this change beekeeping for the better if the bee importation laws are relaxed or even dumped. If history repeats itself, and I am one of those who believes that it does, it could. The bee industry in the United States was once before threatened with great and complete loss, (before my time). Bee's were disappearing because of a disease that could not be controlled in the US stock at the time. Beekeeping in America was going down the drain, beekeepers few as there was then were leaving hives, skepts, and bee gums empty. The feral hives, bee trees, were reduced or disappeared. The import door was then open and direct imports were made from the old world, yellow bees, the Italian bees won the day and in a few years everything was back to more or less normal. For sure other bees other then yellow or Italian, and bees with undesirable characteristics were also imported, some direct from Africa. This was not a problem that some will surely point out for today, or at least no record of a problem exists today from this open door to imports. Maybe it is because of the beekeepers themselves who weeded out the bad and increased the good strains, or more likely what we got from all that importations were survivors. Bee's that survived the trip, not easy in those days, and bee's that survived in the US bee yards, not so easy today....this day! Do I believe that we need to open the door to save the bee's in the US? No, I don't, but I believe and know that if something does not change fast there will be less beekeepers and if opening that bee importation door will help then it should be opened. And of grater concern is that there may be no or few feral honeybee populations, based on increasing reports, (though I am really not convinced that this is a new problem in the feral populations as it is something I have noted over the last forty years and may have no relationship to pests or disease), but it does remain a concern since so many are now reporting a reduction, to a complete collapse of feral honeybee populations. Most of these reports are not based on history, and are only valid observations at the time made. But for sure if this reduction continues then there will be no wild honeybees, but then there were none in California just a 100+ years ago when a swarm would sell for $100 gold. And it can be expected that when there are no honeybees in our hives there will be few in the bush, unless you wish to believe that the TexMex bees are going to replace the feral populations, but then there are laws and regulations preventing this, in fact the same one's that have prevented you and I from importing bee's. ttul Andy- Los Banos, Ca (c) Permission is granted to freely copy this document in any form, or to print for any use. (w)Opinions are not necessarily facts. Use at own risk. --- ~ QMPro 1.53 ~ What is not good for the swarm is not good for the bee ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Mar 1996 22:44:23 +0000 Reply-To: nickw@wave.co.nz Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Nick Wallingford Organization: Nat Beekeepers Assn of NZ Subject: Kashmir bee virus... While I have no wish to initiate another "flame session" on BEE-L, as a New Zealand subscriber to the list I would like to make clear the following in relation to Mr. Patton's comment that "I think the viruses have come to the North American Continent via N Z bees to Canada and Canadian bees to the U S": - all viruses which have been found in NZ honey bees have also been found in honey bees in a variety of other places in the world. - because a particular bee virus is not listed as occurring in any geographic location does not mean that the virus is in fact absent; it is just as possible that the area has not been investigated thoroughly for the presence of the virus by a scientist with the skills and funding necessary to find the virus, especially when the virus does not cause observable symptoms (the claim that Kashmir bee virus was absent from the continental US until a detailed study was carried out is a good case in point). Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. - Kashmir bee virus was identified in New Zealand by Dr. Denis Anderson, an Australian bee virologist who worked in New Zealand for several years as a bee pathologist. Dr. Anderson did his Ph.D on Kashmir bee virus and is now regarded as the preeminent scientist capable of finding the virus. I understand that that is why Dr. Anderson was asked to assist in identification work on that virus for samples from the continental US. Dr. Anderson has been instrumental in providing evidence that the virus is more widespread in the world population of honey bees than was first postulated by Drs. Bailey and Woods in 1977. - Dr. Anderson has found that the Canadian isolate of Kashmir bee virus is a distinct serological strain from the Australian strain, which in turn, is serologically distinct from the isolates from New Zealand. The US isolates have also been found to be serologically distinct from the Australian strain. - Like the Americas, neither Australia or New Zealand have any native populations of Apis mellifera. The populations of Apis mellifera found in New Zealand came from Europe, the US (originally from Europe) and Australia (originally from the US and Europe). New Zealand also does not have any other native species of social bee. According to Dr. Anderson, it is therefore likely that either the virus exists in other insect species found in a many countries, or that the virus originated in Apis mellifera in an area in Europe which provided stocks of Apis mellifera which were taken the countries where it has now been identified. For further factual information on the subject of Kashmir bee virus, its occurrence and likely origins, I would recommend the following: Anderson, D (1991) Kashmir bee virus - a relatively harmless virus of honey bee colonies. American Bee Journal 131: 767-770. Bruce, W, Anderson, D, Calderone, N and Shimanuki, H (1995) A survey for Kashmir bee virus in honey bee colonies in the United States. American Bee Journal 135: 352-355. ------------------------------------------ Nick Wallingford President - National Beekeepers Assn of NZ home nickw@wave.co.nz work nw1@boppoly.ac.nz ------------------------------------------ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Mar 1996 06:15:09 -0500 Reply-To: aa2363@freenet.lorain.oberlin.edu Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Kevin R. Palm" Subject: Help with BEE-L DIgest - 24 March 1996 to 25 March 1996 Hello all, Can one of you fine folks do me a BIG favor? I'm on a Freenet account, and our system had a hard drive crash yesterday. Consequently, I missed yesterday's BEE-L Digest (24 Mar 1996 to 25 Mar 1996). I tried to get the archive for this month from the listserv, but it's over 600K, and I can't download it in time with my pitiful 2400 baud modem!! Can one of you kind souls email me a copy of the digest?? If you can, email it to my work address: krp4359@llp.reltec.sprint.com Thanks very, very much!! Kevin Palm -- Kevin R. Palm | Beekeeper (1 hive, 2nd year) Grafton, Ohio | Red Dwarf/Babylon 5/NYPD Blue/ER fan (25 miles SW of Cleveland) | Visitor to the 100 Aker Wood aa2363@freenet.lorain.oberlin.edu | Member FNCF/IECC/IECG/NOST -- Kevin R. Palm | Beekeeper (1 hive, 2nd year) Grafton, Ohio | Red Dwarf/Babylon 5/NYPD Blue/ER fan (25 miles SW of Cleveland) | Visitor to the 100 Aker Wood aa2363@freenet.lorain.oberlin.edu | Member FNCF/IECC/IECG/NOST ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Mar 1996 13:58:27 +0200 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Max Watkins Subject: Re: Doing a Post Mortem Comments: To: owner-bee-l@CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU Varroa will leave a dead bee as soon as it can and transfer to the nearest live host but if the whole colony is dead and there is no opportunity to jump onto healthy robbing bees, the mites die too eventually and usually fall off. However, they can live without food for some time so it depends on how long your wintered hive has been dead as to whether washing in alcohol shows mite infestation. Alcohol washing of recently dead bees certainly can give a good indication of infestation levels. But it's too late! Hope this helps Max ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Doing a Post Mortem Author: owner-bee-l@CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU at INTERNET1 Date: 24/03/96 19:37 I'm wondering if varroa mites are easily detached when found on/with dead bees and if they will have stayed with their host to the end in a dead overwintered hive. Specifically, I am wondering if an alcohol wash of a sample of bees in a dead wintered hive will yield useful data??? Regards Allen W. Allen Dick, Beekeeper VE6CFK RR#1, Swalwell, Alberta Canada T0M 1Y0 Internet:dicka@cuug.ab.ca & allend@internode.net Honey. Bees, & Art ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Mar 1996 08:03:05 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kelley Rosenlund Subject: Re: Orange Flow > Beekeepers working in citrus groves in South Florida report fair to good >flows. But the larger belt of citrus along the "Ridge" of central Florida >has been so cold that bees have not worked much, and trees are not yielding. > > If the weather does not warm soon, the bloom will be over without a >significant orange crop in much of the citrus areas - a real disappointment >to beekeepers in view of record prices in the honey market. I'll say disappointment. I have hives in groves near Daytona Beach and just west of Orlando, Florida. A few hives are doing well but most aren't making honey. At least they are making more bees for pollination. Hives in the grove further south in Tampa are doing much better. God Bless, Kelley Rosenlund rosenlk@freenet.ufl.edu Gainesville, Florida, U.S.A., 137 hives, 1 year in beekeeping. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Mar 1996 10:06:35 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kelley Rosenlund Subject: Swarm Catching I understand putting a frame of brood or honey in the hive will encourage the swarm to stay, true? God Bless, Kelley Rosenlund rosenlk@freenet.ufl.edu Gainesville, Florida, U.S.A., 137 hives, 1 year in beekeeping. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Mar 1996 08:24:26 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Doug McCulloch Subject: Re: A Prayer for the Bees Amen to that >Out of concern for the decline in the number of bees due to parasites, >disease, and pesticide misuse, I offer this prayer for the bees. I invite >you to make it your prayer as well. > >Our Heavenly Father, > >Thank you for creating us and our glorious earth. We especially want to >thank you for the bees that so fascinate us in their unique ways. We grieve, >as you most surely grieve as well, over the decline in the number of bees. > >Help us as caretakers of your creation to be diligent in protecting them. > Those of us who care for bees ask that you give us wisdom in the way we >manage them. May we be diligent in our study of the bees that we may be >knowledgeable and alert to their needs, and recognize the treatments they may >need. > >Help us to find ways to educate the public about the importance of our bees >and about the seriousness of the threat to our food supply should they die >out. Help them to overcome their fears of bee stings with a sincere >appreciation of their importance and an awareness of how gentle bees are >under normal circimstances. > >Impress upon the farmers and the crop dusters the seriousness of pesticide >misuse to the existance of our bees. May they see the need for bees to >assure us a variety of foods as well as better tasting foods. May they >recognize our loss if the bees die out. Expand their concern for the total >welfare of mankind and may they not let personal greed get in the way of good >stewardship. Be with our lawmakers and law enforcers and give them the >desire to be knowledgeable and protective of our bees. > >And, Lord, when our efforts and energy have maxed out and we realize we can't >do it all, please watch over our bees. Protect them from what we cannot. > Give them the care that we, through neglect or lack of time and energy, >cannot give. Hold them in your hands when calamities occur in the weather. > Intervene when man in his ignorance and/or greed would do them harm. > >May the unique and wondrous bees that you created continue to bless this >earth with their services in pollinating our plants and providing us with >their golden sunshine -- honey. > >Amen > >QueenB Jan (Janice Green) and Pollinator (Dave Green) > > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Mar 1996 11:00:07 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Susan W. Cobey" Subject: Re: Importation Concerning importation, some good points are being brought up. Andy, I think we need a higher level of sophistication in bee breeding in this industry and am hoping the ability to import stock will stimulate this, and develop more competition to push queen producers in this direction. I agree, we need to get beyond the value of this solely in marketing. As mentioned, there are lots of failures in maintaining imported stock and in breeding programs in general. This is expensive, labor intensive and takes a degree of expertise and a major long term commitment- which few are prepared to give. But, let's have a level playing field. I'm not advocating an open door policy. We need a mechanism here to discourage the uncontrolled, illegal importation of stock - Isn't this why we have parasitic mites. (The grass always looks greener!) The law is too restrictive and pocket importation too easy. A protocol need to be established to make this safe and effective, plus restrict it to those who can maintain and propagate it for the industry. Susan Cobey Ohio State University Dept. of Entomology 1735 Neil Ave. Columbus, OH 43210 Tel.(614) 292-7928 Fax (614) 292 2180 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Mar 1996 10:32:12 PST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Adrian Wenner Subject: swarm hives Glen Glater wrote: I've just bought a box swarm trap developed by Dr. Schwartz, and I'm wondering whether placing it "near" (within 300 feet) of my hives will CAUSE them to swarm. Does anyone have experience with swarm traps and the pheremone baits and this issue? **** A direct answer to the first query --- NO. Emitting of swarms is an internal hive matter. If one uses swarm hives swarms emitting from the hives will more likely end up in a known location. ***** For a comprehensive coverage of swarm hives, see: Schmidt, J.O., S.C. Thoenes, & R. Hurley. 1989 (July issue). Swarm traps. AMERICAN BEE JOURNAL, pp. 468-471. For a review of swarms and their movements, see: Wenner, A.M. 1992 (January issue). Swarm movement: A mystery explained. AMERICAN BEE JOURNAL, pp. 27-31. **** Have a good swarm season (or, luckily, lack thereof). Adrian *************************************************************** * Adrian Wenner E-Mail wenner@lifesci.lscf.ucsb.edu * * Dept.Ecol.,Evol.,& Mar.Biol. Office Phone (805) 893-2838 * * University of California Lab Phone (805) 893-2675 * * Santa Barbara, CA 93106 FAX (805) 893-8062 * * * * "Once a structurally complete and closed system of opinions * *consisting of many details and relations has been formed, it * *offers enduring resistance to anything that contradicts it." * * Ludwik Fleck, 1935 [1979] * *************************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Mar 1996 14:04:09 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: rdanka@ASRR.ARSUSDA.GOV Subject: Varroa Resistant Stock The USDA, ARS Honey Bee Breeding, Genetics and Physiology Laboratory in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, is seeking the help of beekeepers in a project aimed at combatting Varroa jacobsoni. We at the laboratory are searching U.S. honey bee germplasm for traits which contribute to resistance to, or tolerance of, varroa. Beekeepers are urged to contact us if they are aware of infested colonies that have survived for more than a year without treatment to control varroa. Many people have commented to us about colonies that they think may be resistant. Now is the time to critically evaluate these genetic resources from across the nation, as resistance may indeed have had a chance to be expressed. We ask the nation's beekeepers to check for possible "survivor" colonies as beekeeping activities are stepped up in the weeks ahead. This project can accommodate up to 50 queens. The queens will be evaluated in 1996, and the best will be used for further stock research and development during the next two to three years. Each contributing beekeeper will be sent the results of the initial queen evaluation and a complimentary queen from the first generation of propagated material. The chief goal of this project is to deliver an improved stock back to U.S. beekeepers. Thus, this is a unique opportunity for concerned beekeepers to contribute to the wellbeing of their industry. Anyone wishing to contribute potentially useful queens should contact one of the principal investigators (listed below); queens will be needed in Baton Rouge by the end of April. We ask that no queens be sent before arrangements are made with us. Robert Danka (tel. 504/767-9294, email RDANKA@ASRR.ARSUSDA.GOV) John Harbo (504/767-9288, JHARBO@ASRR.ARSUSDA.GOV) Thomas Rinderer (504/767-9281, TRINDERE@ASRR.ARSUSDA.GOV) USDA, ARS Honey Bee Breeding, Genetics and Physiology Laboratory 1157 Ben Hur Road Baton Rouge, LA 70820-5502 tel. 504/767-9280, fax 504/766-9212 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Mar 1996 14:36:38 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "" Subject: Re: swarms Hi all! I just had a strange experience. The day before yesterday I captured a huge swarm from one of my own hives. I checked afterwards and there were still a large number of bees left in the hive. Today I took another look and the bees are removing bees from the hive. I saw some flying out carrying others and I saw lots of dead bees on the front porch. Does anyone have any idea what is going on? Mary ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Mar 1996 16:21:33 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Joel Govostes Subject: First Pollen of Season, central NY Well the other day (Monday) was quite warm and the bees in the backyard were active. They've been snooping around my stacks of sticky supers on sunny days. I took a closer look at the hive entrances and lo and behold - big lumps of pollen on their legs - a wonderful sight after a long winter. Looked very pale yellow - perhaps willow. Interestingly, one hive was collecting it very heavy, the bees coming home with the stuff all over them. In fact, they looked like bumblebees! Virtually every forager had it all over her. The other colonies were collecting moderate amounts, visible only on the "pollen baskets" on their legs, as usual. (BTW, They ignored the pollen substitute I gave them, but I'm sure happy to see the "real thing." Of course, now the temperature is back in the 20's... No losses found yet out of 3 dozen colonies, but signs of dysentery were bad past couple of months, and some clusters are small. Hopefully they can hold out til more even temperatures arrive. That's my report, back in a moment with sports and the latest business news ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Mar 1996 18:42:49 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Gordon Scott Subject: Re: Kashmir bee virus... In-Reply-To: <199603271042.WAA15533@Axil.wave.co.nz> Nice to hear from you Nick -- I've missed your postings. The first person to find Varroa clearly "brought it to the area". The same with EFB. The same with AFB. The same with T-Mites. The same with Viruses. So often we blame the messenger for bad news. Generally, it's the concerned and observant who find and report the problem. In the case of a virus it also takes special skills and facilities. Regards, -- Gordon Scott gordon@apis.demon.co.uk gordon@multitone.co.uk (work) The Basingstoke Beekeeper (newsletter) beekeeper@apis.demon.co.uk Embryo Home Page Beekeeper; Kendo 3rd Dan; Sometime sailor. Hampshire, England. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Mar 1996 19:07:27 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "pats@usa.pipeline.com" Subject: Creamed honey Does anyone have the directions for making* creamed* honey or *spun* honey? We have been buying it for a long time, and I would like to make it at home. I have an article on it from Brushy Mountain Bee Farm, but the directions are not clear. Any info would be appreciated. Thanks Ed -- pats@usa.pipeline.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Mar 1996 20:46:21 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: Re: Varroa Resistant Stock In-Reply-To: On Wed, 27 Mar 1996 rdanka@ASRR.ARSUSDA.GOV wrote: > The USDA, ARS Honey Bee Breeding, Genetics and Physiology > Laboratory in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, is seeking the help of > beekeepers in a project aimed at combatting Varroa jacobsoni. We BRAVO - This is the news many of us have been waiting for. Personaly , I prefer this approach to roaming the globe in search of the perfect bee. If a project like this is supported, we should soon have a population of bees to work with that will be as good as those anywhere. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 27 Mar 1996 22:20:40 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Luis Belendez Subject: Producers/exporters of bee Honey. I'm building a worldwide producer/exporters database. Can you help me? If you know about any, please send the following data: Exporter/producer name, contact, telephone and fax number, country, email (if available) to: belendez@infosel.net.mx Thank you for your time and cooperation. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 00:27:30 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kirk Jones Subject: Re: queen excluders pro/con Re: Queen Excluders > >>What's your opinion? Last year on the advice of a friend with many years >>of experience, I supered over my double-deep brood nests without excluders. >>.... We keep bees in Northern Michigan in the US, in a region with a strong main flow. We generally equalize our hives through some minor flows in June, and super with about two medium(6 5/8) supers per hive. Some have a nice cap of honey over the broodnest(natural excluder), and some of the hives have brood visible between the top bars. Due to our numbers of hives to work, they all get at least two supers as the main flow begins. When we come back to visit the hives on the next visit, we check the supers to be sure they are filling up with honey. If there is some brood, we will let them force the queen down, before we give them any more supers. We run all of our supers with 8 combs and believe it helps to prevent the queens from laying them up. If we were to run singles for honey, I would use queen excluders and keep the brood nest from getting too congested with honey. This could be more work intensive, and leaves the beekeeper with a potential problem of preparing to winter. Kirk ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 00:59:09 -0500 Reply-To: Mason Harris Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Mason Harris Subject: honey mustard Can someone please point me toward or tell me their recipe for some good honey mustard? I buy it all the time and would like to make some. Thanks Mason smharris@ed.co.sanmateo.ca.us Burlingame, California ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 01:17:00 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Andy Nachbaur Organization: WILD BEE'S BBS (209) 826-8107 LOS BANOS, CA Subject: Re: Kashmir bee virus... *FYI* Last Official USDA Word on Kashmir bee virus in the US, (that I could find), minus any data from Hawaii as it may not have been included in this round of tests...in 1993. Have no idea if this is the same as the INDIAN BEE Virus that is claimed to be the cause of horrendous losses of hive and native bees in large parts of India. But it matters not because most of these virus have the ability to change and become very virulent without any help from man or bees'tees. And for sure except for trying to determine if they are abundant in US bees they have received little study here, and I fear will not receive a great deal of attention in the near future because of the cost considerations. Beekeepers may have to treat virus tainted bees or beekeeping operations with a history of unexplained loss, the same as we treat AID's patents. Give them the best care for the symptoms that are treatable. If the beehive itself is the unit of husbandry then that beehive may need to have a secondary unit, a nuc, available each season to maintain itself even with the best diet, chemical treatment, and TLC by the keeper of the bees. At least those beekeeper's who are doing this now appear to be maintaining productive hives. ttul Andy- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- 09/19/94 Agricultural Research Service Page 8 2 Technology Transfer Automated Retrieval System (ARS TEKTRAN) Title:SURVEY FOR KASHMIR BEE VIRUS IN HONEY BEE COLONIES IN THE UNITED STATES BRUCE WILLIAM A ANDERSON D CALDERONE N W SHIMANUKI H Technical Abstract: A survey for Kashmir Bee Virus (KBV) in honey bee (Apis mellifera L) colonies in the United States is reported. Samples consisting of 300 worker bees were collected from one hived colony in each of 10 different apiaries in California, Flordia, Maine, Minnesota, New York, Texas, and Washington. Extracts were obtained from each and injected into groups of normal healthy white-eyed honey bee pupae to increase to detectable concentrations any viruses that may have been present in the extracts in small concentrations. Extracts were subsequently obtained from each injected pupa and tested for the presence of KBV and other virus particles in serological tests. KBV was found to be present in each of the seven States sampled. Submitted to: (approved 08/04/93) AMERICAN BEE JOURNAL (APICULTURAL RESEARCH SECTION) WILLIAM A BRUCE 301 504-8821 FTS BEE RESEARCH LABORATORY BLDG. 476, BARC-EAST FAX Number: BELTSVILLE MD 20705 . --- ~ QMPro 1.53 ~ ... Where bee-hives range on a gray bench in the garden, ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 11:20:27 CST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vladimir Ptacek Subject: Re: Swarm Catching On Wed, 27 Mar 1996 10:06:35 -0500, Kelley Rosenlund wrote: >I understand putting a frame of brood or honey in the hive will encourage >the swarm to stay, true? > >God Bless, >Kelley Rosenlund rosenlk@freenet.ufl.edu >Gainesville, Florida, U.S.A., 137 hives, 1 year in beekeeping. The frame of brood yes, but the frame of honey may even be the cause for the swarm to abscond the hive. This depends on circumstances. Sunny days, Vladimir Ptacek ---------------------------------------------------------------- Fac. Sci., Dept. Anim. Physiol. E.mail: ptacek@sci.muni.cz Masaryk University phone: .42/5/41129 562 611 37 Brno, Czech Republic fax: .42/5/41211 214 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 12:39:56 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Ted Fischer Subject: High swarms REGARDING High swarms Regarding the continuing conversation about retrieval of high swarms: The simplest answer is, to my mind, the best: Just let them sit there- they'll eventually go away. I doubt if retrieving an occasional high swarm is worth investing in extra equipment or risking a fall and injury. If you are a beginning hobbiest looking for some "cheap" bees, just tell your inquirer that you don't do high swarms. There will be plenty of other available ones to get if you put your name in with the local police or sheriff's department. If the swarm is your own, I must admit it certainly is frustrating to look at money flying away like that, but that's just part of beekeeping. Some you lose. I, personally, would never attempt a high swarm. Ted Fischer ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 07:41:02 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Varroa Resistant Stock In-Reply-To: On Wed, 27 Mar 1996 rdanka@ASRR.ARSUSDA.GOV wrote: > The USDA, ARS Honey Bee Breeding, Genetics and Physiology > Laboratory in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, is seeking the help of > beekeepers in a project aimed at combatting Varroa jacobsoni. We > at the laboratory are searching U.S. honey bee germplasm for > traits which contribute to resistance to, or tolerance of, > varroa. Beekeepers are urged to contact us if they are aware of > infested colonies that have survived for more than a year without > treatment to control varroa. Many people have commented to us > about colonies that they think may be resistant. Now is the time > to critically evaluate these genetic resources from across the > nation, as resistance may indeed have had a chance to be > expressed. We ask the nation's beekeepers to check for possible > "survivor" colonies as beekeeping activities are stepped up in > the weeks ahead. > > This project can accommodate up to 50 queens. The queens will be > evaluated in 1996, and the best will be used for further stock > research and development during the next two to three years. Thank you very much to Dr. Rinderer and his staff at the USDA Genetics Lab. Beekeepers has to be awhare of funding problems in the USDA. Congress is cutting money not adding to the pot.Do more with less. If beekeepers are really thankful for the help of the USDA. Each one should write just one little E-mail to there congressman telling them how much we apreciate the help of the USDA of our big problem with the Varroa mite.There is no free lunch.We need a positive image for beekeeping.Its like a hand shake and thank you.This step is positive and we will need more steps.We will take one at a time.We do have other pathogens working on our bees right now. So we really do need to help each other and change the idea that beekeepers just set back and don't participate. My hat is off to Dr. Rinderers group and the people who have been writting to get something going. I think the Prayer helped to. Roy ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 08:06:57 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Kashmir bee virus... In-Reply-To: <960327221936790@beenet.com> On Thu, 28 Mar 1996, Andy Nachbaur wrote: > *FYI* > > Last Official USDA Word on Kashmir bee virus in the US, (that I > could find), minus any data from Hawaii as it may not have been included > in this round of tests...in 1993. Have no idea if this is the same as > the INDIAN BEE Virus that is claimed to be the cause of horrendous > losses of hive and native bees in large parts of India. But it matters > not because most of these virus have the ability to change and become > very virulent without any help from man or bees'tees. And for sure > except for trying to determine if they are abundant in US bees they have > received little study here, and I fear will not receive a great deal of > attention in the near future because of the cost considerations. > > Beekeepers may have to treat virus tainted bees or beekeeping > operations with a history of unexplained loss, the same as we treat AID's > patents. Give them the best care for the symptoms that are treatable. If > the beehive itself is the unit of husbandry then that beehive may need > to have a secondary unit, a nuc, available each season to maintain > itself even with the best diet, chemical treatment, and TLC by the > keeper of the bees. At least those beekeeper's who are doing this now > appear to be maintaining productive hives. > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > 09/19/94 Agricultural Research Service > Page 8 2 > Technology Transfer Automated Retrieval System > (ARS TEKTRAN) > Title:SURVEY FOR KASHMIR BEE VIRUS IN HONEY BEE COLONIES IN THE UNITED > STATES > > BRUCE WILLIAM A > ANDERSON D > CALDERONE N W > SHIMANUKI H > Technical Abstract: > > A survey for Kashmir Bee Virus (KBV) in honey bee (Apis mellifera L) > colonies in the United States is reported. Samples consisting of 300 > worker bees were collected from one hived colony in each of 10 different > apiaries in California, Flordia, Maine, Minnesota, New York, Texas, and > Washington. Extracts were obtained from each and injected into groups of > normal healthy white-eyed honey bee pupae to increase to detectable > concentrations any viruses that may have been present in the extracts in > small concentrations. Extracts were subsequently obtained from each > injected pupa and tested for the presence of KBV and other virus particles > in serological tests. KBV was found to be present in each of the seven > States sampled. > Submitted to: (approved 08/04/93) > Hello , Part of my learning curve over the last few months has been seeing behavior change in the way bees die out do to Varroa. Some you treat with still a big population of bees and they act normal for a weeh or so and then they die off in 3 to 5 days.By using E-mail after I read what I could out of Honey Bee Patholigy. It looked like a Virus problem. I have contacted the people who have the greatest amount of knowledge on bee viruses. Some of my bees will be checked.It cost a lot of money to work on viruses. Even the testing itself.One of the reasons I was showing a great deal of concern with Varroa. Was the fact that Varroa has been found to spread 3 viruses.You can see by the info above that the word if we have has been lost. We have some and as stated above we have to watch our bees very close and keep them as heathy as we can.Healthy bees without Varroa will have a much better chance of staying safe. I wish we could get one of the experts to post more info for us on Viruses. Thank You Roy ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 08:35:15 PST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Adrian Wenner Subject: Re: High swarms Ted Fischer wrote: > REGARDING High swarms > >Regarding the continuing conversation about retrieval of high swarms: The >simplest answer is, to my mind, the best: Just let them sit there- they'll >eventually go away. I suggest placing a couple of swarm hives with lures about 200-300m generally upwind (prevailing wind, that is) from the swarm location. Yes, they will eventually go away, but why not provide a place near the ground that they can occupy? That will help keep them out of the wall of someone's house, too. I always have 2-3 swarm hives in my yard and end up with a swarm or two each season, even though no one keeps bees near my neighborhood (near downtown Santa Barbara). Just yesterday the swarm hive up in my cherimoya tree became occupied by a swarm from who knows where. Adrian *************************************************************** * Adrian Wenner E-Mail wenner@lifesci.lscf.ucsb.edu * * Dept.Ecol.,Evol.,& Mar.Biol. Office Phone (805) 893-2838 * * University of California Lab Phone (805) 893-2675 * * Santa Barbara, CA 93106 FAX (805) 893-8062 * * * * "Once a structurally complete and closed system of opinions * *consisting of many details and relations has been formed, it * *offers enduring resistance to anything that contradicts it." * * Ludwik Fleck, 1935 [1979] * *************************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 13:03:46 EST Reply-To: rgendrea@foxboro.com Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roland Gendreau Subject: Swarm Capture I had a challenge last summer when one of my hives swarmed and alighted on a tree branch about 25 ft high, and a good 6-7' out from the trunk of the (Hemlock) tree. As a new-bee, this was my first experience capturing a swarm so my adrenalin was flowing! I was able to get my extension ladder up to the level of the branch, after cutting some branches away. I attached the handle of a 5 gallon plastic bucket to an aluminum pole. Standing on the ladder, I and was able to position the bucket below the swarm; when I lifted it up into the swarm, I caught about 50% of the swarm. The ones I missed returned to cluster on the same branch. I must have gotten the queen on the first try, as they basically stayed in the bucket as I climbed down the ladder with it. It took four of these operations until I had gotten 90% of the swarm. About one week later, I noticed there was still an apple sized ball of bees on that same branch. I went back up and got them too! All in all, it was quite an experience for a first timer! Roland ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 19:59:55 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Sid Pullinger Subject: East-West---Home's Best >BRAVO - This is the news many of us have been waiting for. Personaly , I >prefer this approach to roaming the globe in search of the perfect bee. >If a project like this is supported, we should soon have a population of >bees to work with that will be as good as those anywhere.> > How right you are. The search for the better bee has been going on for a long time. L L Langstroth, who died 101 years ago, was a great believer in Italians, which he considered far superior to the native American. In 1882 a respected Ontario breeder imported queens from Cyprus. The bees turned out to be vicious, stinging everyone in sight, an early taste of AHB. There have been many such failures, where bees have failed to adapt. For fifty years researchers have tried, by instrumental insemination, to increase life expectancy, disease resistance, more vigour, longer tongues and so on. We are still waiting for that super bee to come into existence. Human intelligence has not changed in thousands of years. Increased knowledge but that is all. Bees are reckoned to have existed multi-millions of years, with very little change from the original, however that came into being. Fixed development in any direction will not come overnight. Many of us on our little island consider that we have all the material we need for a decent working bee. You in the States and Canada, with your broad acres and extremes of climate, must already have as varied a collection of bee material as anywhere in the world. When Langstroth revolutionized beekeeping in the middle of the last century there were true Italian, Carniolan, Caucasion and European breeds and so on. Since then there has been so much criss-crossing of frontiers that I doubt there is a true bred bee left. I.I. queens, because of the work involved, will always be expensive and once they have left the laboratory their offspring will be subject to random matings. It is said that a queen mates with six to a dozen drones. What a rag-bag of mixed genes must appear in the offspring. Every breeder knows that sister queens bred from a selected mother do not perform equally well, this in part presumably from fathers' genes. The average beekeeper is not a scientist. True research is best left to them. What we can do, commercial man and hobbyist alike, is breed continuously from our best stocks, raising more queens than we need and scrapping the worst performers. Choosing a queen from a thousand miles away is a gamble. Selecting from bees that are accustomed to your particular brand of climate is a far better bet. If and when something outstanding is found then is the time to hand it over for development. _________________________________________________________________ Sid Pullinger Email : sidpul@aladdin.co.uk 36, Grange Rd Compuserve: 100343.1216@compuserve.com Alresford Hants SO24 9HF England ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 15:41:17 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: John Justin Spaulding III Subject: APRIL meeting (Central Mass. usa) In-Reply-To: <31363148.997@agr.gouv.qc.ca> FREE FREE FREE We're having a special April Meeting which is open free of charge to non-members. (As are all our meetings) If you have any additional question email me at juggler@nesc.org off list. Worcester County Beekeepers Association Special April Meeting Date: Saturday, April 13, 1996 Place: UMASS Medical School (Amphitheater 2) Plantation St., Worcester, MA Program Schedule : 8:30 - 9:15 AM Coffee and Danish 9:15 - 10:30 AM Honeybee Viruses and Mites [and their interrelationship] 10:30 - 10:45 AM Coffee Break 10:45 - 12:00 PM Beekeeping in Canada - Industry and Research Dr. Cynthia Scott-Dupree, of the University of Guelph in Ontario, will speak to Worcester County beekeepers on honeybee viruses and their relationship to mites. Dr. Dupree will examine the impact of mites on honeybee colonies and their effect on colony development. This is a problem that has plagued Worcester County and all of the northeast for the past two years. In fact, the 1994-1995 beekeeping season saw colony losses of 45% in Worcester County. We are all searching for answers to our bee losses and solutions to keep our bees alive. Dr. Dupree will look at these questions in her presentation and offer answers and insight. It is essential for us all to be informed beekeepers in order to keep our colonies alive, says Ken Warchol, Worcester County Bee Inspector. It is for this reason that the Worcester County Beekeepers are presenting this speaker and topic. I would strongly urge all beekeepers to attend this presentation. The second of our two presentations, entitled Beekeeping in Canada: Industry and Research will take a general look at the health of the Canadian beekeeping industry. Dr. Dupree will focus on some of the research going on in Canada that deals with mites, viruses and other problems. She will also shed some light on what lies ahead for the beekeeping industry. This will be a fantastic opportunity for beekeepers to hear one of Canada's top honeybee experts and one of the key speakers at the Eastern Apicultural Society's convention last summer without leaving Worcester. Bee informed.......for the good health and survival of your bees! This special presentation will replace the normal monthly meeting and is free for all to attend. Reduced parking rates apply. John Spaulding Associate Curator, Wildlife Center juggler@nesc.org New England Science Center ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 16:17:33 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: Creamed honey >Does anyone have the directions for making* creamed* honey or *spun* honey? >We have been buying it for a long time, and I would like to make it at Creamed honey, ie honey which looks granulated but stays soft and spreadable, is realatively easy to produce. You need warm honey, plus a seed of a small amount of granulated honey. Make a paddle or stir stick that will reach the bottom of your container, raise and lower the paddle, being careful disperse the crystals. Leave for a few hours, repeat as necessary over the next 48 hours. It should creame and will stay in this state until it is re-heated. **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 16:18:34 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: swarms >Hi all! >I just had a strange experience. The day before yesterday I captured a huge >swarm from one of my own hives. I checked afterwards and there were still a I would suggest two possible reasons for this behaviour. Robbing. If a hive has lost it's queen (swarmed) the remaining bees appear to be demoralized and don't fly well till the new queen emerges.Suggest to test this, watch for agitated guard bees on the entrance, also watch for bees running up the face of the hive before taking off. With their pockets full of stolen honey they can't take off easily and as cleanly as usual. To cure robbing, close the entrance down to about 3/4" or so, the remaining bees should be able to establish guarding again. House cleaning. In early spring there will be lots of dead bees on the bottom board. If you haven't cleaned the bottom board (as you should have done) the bees will be dragging out the deceased and flying off with them. Hope these will help. If it is robbing, then move quickly, I've seen a small hive cleaned and killed in a few days, without the interference of the keeper. **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 11:28:04 -1000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Walter Patton Subject: In Response Bee Friends Re;Nick Wallingford President. N.Z. Beekeepers Comments The suggestion that viruses maybe present in all bees is not a reason for US beekeepers to not be concerned about the introduction and spread of more viruses from imports. {Note currently the only bees being imported to the US come from Canada and Canada imports from N.Z. and N.Z. reports 12 to 14 honeybee disease and pests present on their bees. ... ABOUT D Anderson being THE preeminent scientist on bee viruses . Does the rest of the honeybee scientific world agree wuth this ? I would expect the N.Z. beekeepers to think so as they pay him a lot of money to disspell the concern about bee viruses as the N.Z. bees seem to have all the viruses known about in the bee world and the N.Z beekeepers have lots of end of season bees they want to sell each year before going into their winter.N.Z. beekeepers are advanced and skilled markeeters "BUYER BEEWARE" D. Anderson was asked to be involved with the USDA survey because why ? I don't know probably because the USDA has been without a bee sensitive person in Washington ever since Dr. Shimanuke spent his vacation (6wks) in N.Z.How shameful that the United States of America could get so far behind in protecting the US honeybees. Sure Gov.money is getting scarce and when has the USDA made any pleas to the bee industry for help in getting more money for bee research. When has the US bee keeping industry been alerted about the eminent dangers to honeybee populations with mites and viruses by USDA or industry associations or publications. D.Anderson finds different serological strains in N.Z ., Canadian and US bees .Well that what he was looking for. Research without an oversight committee to keep objectivity has been proven to often have tunnel vision. Finally for the readers to be directed to the writtings of D. Anderson titled "Kashmir Bee Virus a relativly harmless virus of honeybees" should tell it all. Why doesn't Mr. Wallingford also suggest reading the writtings of others who feel quite strongly that Kashmir Bee virus is FAR form being a "Harmless virus to honeybees" i.e. B. Ball, England & T. Liu, Canada . When will the USDA sound the alarm that honeybees with mites and viruses have NO chance to survive. Instead we get a decertation about P.M.S.and our US honeybee headaches from the US preeminent honeybee scientist Dr. Shimanuke. According to the N.Z. beekeepers home page the average hive production of honey in N.Z. in 1995 was about 40 lbs per hive . With the majority if the beekeeping happening on the North Island in NZ with a similar climate as places in the US with better averages per hive Colorado 60lbs, N.Dakota 108lbs, S.Dakota 85lbs.,Kansas67lbs.,Ohio 62lbs. Michagan 92lbsWashington 60lbs., Oregon 52lbs. WHY maybe we should ponder these facts regarding the health effects of bee viruses. Concerned and curious Walter & Elisabeth Patton, 27-703 A Ka' ie'ie Rd., Papaikou HI.,96781 Ph./Fax. 808-964-5401 E-Mail hihoney@ilhawaii Beekeeper and Bed & Breakfast Owner in Hawaii http://www.alohamall.com/hamakua/hihoney.htm http://www.alohamall.com/hamakua/beeware.htm http://www.alohamall.com/hamakua/lamalani.htm ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 14:00:49 PST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Adrian Wenner Subject: Re: Diazinon Now that the series on the insecticide diazinon has wound down, some further comments may prove helpful. Diazinon is quite toxic but legal for use against ants in the U.S. and against yellow jacket wasps in some states. However, the following comment was very appropriate: > I vote for the nematodes. Diazanon smells like someone puked >all over the place. I used it for ants in my foundation about 5 years ago >and after 5 minutes of spraying I has to get out the garden hose to try >to dilute the stench! Have your husband smell it at the garden store >before deciding... If one mixes diazinon with some sort of bait, bees, wasps, and ants will not feed on that bait --- you can be sure of that, and one need not worry about bees becoming poisoned. However, if one wants to use that insecticide successfully in a bait, the problem of its abnoxious odor can be circumvented by buying diazinon in a micro-encapsulated form --- in the U.S. one such compound is known as KNOX-OUT. It has the texture of thick cream. Even bait laced with diazinon does not work too well unless one builds the ants, wasps, or bees into a feeding frenzy first with unlaced bait. In short, the stuff is toxic, has a very bad odor, and will not be fed upon by bees if used on plants, etc. On the other hand, a small amount slipped into an ant colony in or near the beeyard can save a lot of grief. Don't ask me, though, about the recipe for such application --- I am against putting large amounts of pesticides into the environment. Adrian *************************************************************** * Adrian Wenner E-Mail wenner@lifesci.lscf.ucsb.edu * * Dept.Ecol.,Evol.,& Mar.Biol. Office Phone (805) 893-2838 * * University of California Lab Phone (805) 893-2675 * * Santa Barbara, CA 93106 FAX (805) 893-8062 * * * * "Once a structurally complete and closed system of opinions * *consisting of many details and relations has been formed, it * *offers enduring resistance to anything that contradicts it." * * Ludwik Fleck, 1935 [1979] * *************************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 12:12:40 -1000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Walter Patton Subject: More response 3-28-96 About Dr. Rinderer Congratulations and good luck . What is the bottom line about bees with mites and viruses? Andy Nachbaur Hawaii was not included in the virus survey . Why Not we do have mite free bees and it seems that Hawaii would have been included and we would have insisted on more diversity with the researchers . Why in the world was the USDA unable to do it's own testing without the help of the NZ advocate D Anderson having to take the samples downunder to do the testing. Re; R Nettlebeck request for praise of the USDA via E Mail. My messages have called for the USDA to be abolished or put under the supervision of a congressional oversight committee for failing to "Protect American Agriculture".... Beekeepers do seem to sit back and not participate and that is too bad and now we beekeepers must unite to solve the huge problems facing mainland beekeepers. ....And where are the US bee experts and why don't they comment. From my experiences they all have opinions and they dare not express them as the honeybee scientific world is very politically inspired. ..... Where can bees be virus tested and how much is the cost? I heard Canada was trying to develope a simpler method of testing. Any work being done by USDA for quick field testing? Who will pay for the testing and the correction of the desimated honeybee losses being reported by US beekeepers? Worchester county reporting 45 % losses. How long can this go on? When does this become a national disaster? Will food shortages occur when hiney bees are GONE? Concerned and curious Walter & Elisabeth Patton, 27-703 A Ka' ie'ie Rd., Papaikou HI.,96781 Ph./Fax. 808-964-5401 E-Mail hihoney@ilhawaii Beekeeper and Bed & Breakfast Owner in Hawaii http://www.alohamall.com/hamakua/hihoney.htm http://www.alohamall.com/hamakua/beeware.htm http://www.alohamall.com/hamakua/lamalani.htm ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 18:37:52 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Bill Miller Subject: Re: Anaphylaxis happens As a beekeeper who does keep a (probably out of date) Epi-pen in my bee tool pail, I am curious as to just what the shelf life and storage conditions are for the things. Fortuantely, I have never had the need to use the one in my pail, but as one who had been declared sensitized to stings from assorted insects (including honeybees), I still consider an Epi-pen in the bee tool pail desirable. W. G. Miller Gaithersburg, MD ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 20:37:11 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "W. H. Phillips" Subject: VARROA TREATMENT DEVICE A BREAKTHROUGH INVENTION THAT WILL AFFECT THE HONEY PRODUCTION AND THE IMMEDIATE AND LONG TERM HEALTH OF THE BEES... Johann Popodi is a passionate beekeeper who recognized the VARROA problem very early. He was not happy with available means of treating the mites (using strips), due to the toxic nature of the chemicals and the side effects that it had on both the bees and the honey. Consequently, Mr. Popodi continued to devote his time and attention to research using formic acid, which is a naturally occurring substance and has long been known to many beekeepers for its beneficial characteristics. The great advantage of formic acid is that there are no poisonous or harmful affects on the honey bee. In addition, it does not produce sediments in the honey, leaving the liquid natural. VARROA TREATMENT DEVICE or "VTD". It is simple and safe to use and operates efficiently measuring out accurate and precise dosag of medication. The VTD(TM)assures a continuous and prolonged treatment at a very modest price. A very high level of success is assured through the whole treatment cycle, particularly during the time when the brood is covered. Due to the evaporation of the formic acid (which does not affect the bees) the mites (black) are destroyed. The most important advantage of this method is that the vapor can penetrate into the honey comb of the young bees and the young Varroa mites (white) are killed at an early stage. Placing a mite grill on the bottom of the hive for continuous observation would be advisable. The VTD(TM) has also had positive success in the treatment of the tracheal mite and lime brood. POSITIVE ASPECTS: simple and easy to use - safe - guaranteed to work - tested internationally - non-toxic - no dangerous side effects - naturally derived material - inexpensive. CANADIAN AND US PATENT PENDING MADE IN CANADA UNIVERSITY TESTED IN USA Information: POPODI DEVELOPMENT R.R. 1, S.11, C55, Naramata, BC. Canada, VOH 1N0 Tel/Fax: (604) 496-4087 E-mail: popodi@silk.net **FORMIC ACID IS NOT APPROVED FOR USE IN SOME JURISDICTIONS, THEREFORE ARE INSTRUCTIONS FOR USE ARE VOID WHERE PROHIBITED.** ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 19:43:28 -1000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Walter Patton "REVIEW" Walter & Elisabeth Patton, 27-703 A Ka' ie'ie Rd., Papaikou HI.,96781 Ph./Fax. 808-964-5401 E-Mail hihoney@ilhawaii Beekeeper and Bed & Breakfast Owner in Hawaii http://www.alohamall.com/hamakua/hihoney.htm http://www.alohamall.com/hamakua/beeware.htm http://www.alohamall.com/hamakua/lamalani.htm ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 00:47:44 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "" Subject: Virus Emotions Dear All -- I would hope that we would be able to deal with the facts of all issues and not emotion, speculation and overactive imagination. While I have tried to read objectively about the Virus issue, I become very concerned when individuals tie a few facts with offhand observations and reach strong conclusions. This is a scientific forum, not a legal battle. Let's try to agree that there is far more to learn about bee viruses than we currently know, that there are too few people researching bee viruses, and that we need more bee virus research, not less. Larry Connor ljconnor@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 21:09:41 +0000 Reply-To: nickw@wave.co.nz Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Nick Wallingford Organization: Nat Beekeepers Assn of NZ Subject: Re: Kashmir bee virus... New Zealand has undertaken a scientifically sound survey (funded by our industry) to determine what pests/diseases of bees are present. We can speak with assurance of our relative freedom from the pests/diseases that are causing problems in other countries. I urge Mr Patton to have the same sort of survey done in Hawaii. I repeat, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. NZ beekeepers do not 'pay him (Dr D Anderson) a lot of money to disspell the concern about bee viruses'. We do not pay him anything - he works for CSIRO, I believe. We *did* pay him as a bee pathologist some years back - and while in that role he found Kashmir bee virus in NZ bees! You don't pay scientists to tell you just what you want to hear... NZ recognised that with the way the world markets were going, it was sensible to *seriously* survey our bee populations to find what was out there. Again, I urge Hawaii and other countries to do likewise, so these discussions can consist of facts, rather than emotive slurs. (Figures in next paragraph reported in pounds - sorry, most of the world!) Mr Paton provides figures on honey production and suggests we should 'ponder these facts regarding the health effects of bee viruses.' The figure he quoted for NZ honey production for 1995 did not come from the NZ Beekeeping Home Page. Rather than 'about 40 lb' per hive, the average for NZ in 1995 was 61 lb. The year before the national average was 90 lb! The average of the previous five years (a better method of determining crop, as it avoids over/under reporting due to especially good/bad seasons) for NZ is 64 lb. How does this affect Mr Patton's ponderings that NZ production is affected by the health effects of bee viruses? If you want to learn more about the NZ beekeeping industry, the WWW pages Mr Patton refers to are a good starting point. Check out the NZ Beekeeping Profile document! http://www.internode.net/~allend/nz/nzbkpg.htm Finally (sorry for the length of the post) I would like to thank Mr Patton for his comments that NZ beekeepers are 'advanced and skilled marketeers'. We are also highly professional, consistent, organised and honest. ------------------------------------------ Nick Wallingford President - National Beekeepers Assn of NZ home nickw@wave.co.nz work nw1@boppoly.ac.nz ------------------------------------------ ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 07:57:44 EST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Mark D. Egloff" Comments: To: ohbee-l@sun1.oardc.ohio-state.edu In my recent readings, I have come across some references to using tobacco in the smoker with the implication that the tobacco smoke kills varroa. Is there any validity to this? What benefits are derived from using tobacco? What drawbacks? Opinions? Mark Egloff MEGLOFF@CSC.COM ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 06:38:56 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Applying Formic > A BREAKTHROUGH INVENTION THAT WILL AFFECT THE HONEY PRODUCTION AND > THE IMMEDIATE AND LONG TERM HEALTH OF THE BEES... My understanding is that slow release of formic has negative effects on honey production compared to quick release. Of course, YMMV, and perhaps sufficient tests have not been run to establish this without a doubt. I also thought I understood that mature varroa are a reddish brown, not black. At any rate, any device which is proven to provide successful control of varroa *economically* without diminishing honey production and requiring repeat visits to apiaries is likely to be a boon. Such a device would have to be very inexpensive to be of commercial use. The current fashion in formic treatment in Canada has moved towards using 'Mite Wipes' which are apparenty just the soaker pads used in the bottom of retail meat trays in supermarkets. The pads are enclosed in plastic which is perforated slightly on the one side (which is placed on the top bars). Overall size is about 7" X 4" and the pad itself is about 6" X 3". Thickness is about 1/8". A suitable number of pads are arranged in a pail and an appropriate, measured amount of formic added. The pail is lidded, and left overnight. In the morning, the formic has distributed itself through the pads and they can be applied with tongs or gloves to the hives. Cost? about 2 cents each plus the cost of formic. Danger of spills and fumes etc. is greatly reduced, as the liquid is not handled directly. Release is quite quick, and there is no problem with acid getting on the bees or running out the door, assuming some care is used to smoke the bees down a bit, and that there is room over the top bars for such a pad. Application can be repeated as many times as necessary, but less than four seems inadequate for varroa. The spacing of the treatments can vary form 5 to 10 days, apparently without much impact on results, and recent news is that the formic can be applied with good effect any time of day, as long as the bees are not clustered. Recent results in Canada (unpublished) indicate that formic is noticably less effective than even one stip of Apistan in controlling varroa, particularly in cases where infestations exceed 10% by alcohol wash measurement. We have not used formic or Apistan, so this is not first hand info. I am of the school of thought that one must monitor closely and not use controls until tests indicate a need. The cure can be worse than an (unproven) affliction. We have the acid, we have the pads, we just don't (yet) see the levels of mites to justify application. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 08:43:32 EST Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Aaron Morris Subject: Formic Acid Apologies in advance for going to the list before going to the books, but the list is here and my books are home, so here is my question. I seem to recall that there were problems with formic acid prompting queen rejection and/or supercedure if used in uncontrolled or high concentration, which is why it was not a favorable means of varroa control. Comments anyone? Regards, Aaron Morris ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 09:16:58 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Mike Griggs While in Tunisia N. Africa, Where Varroa had been established for some time we used several Smokem type of home remedies for Varroa control. Each was used in conjuction with a screen and a sheet of sticky paper or plastic on the bottom board. I used plastic with cooking oil. Tobacco seemed to anesthetize the mite which would drop off and stick. The plastic was removed and mites counted to determine relative numbers in that hive and then the process repeated in the next hive. It worked both as a crude sampling procedure and helped reduce the numbers. It did not get any mites under the cappings and so needed to be repeated to really help a hive. It worked ok where time was plentiful but in the US even hobbiests might find it too time consuming and certainly not as effective as Fluvalinate. Another concoction that we used, that was even more effective, was to use the same sticky trap set up using thymol, menthol and Eucalyptus leaves (Camphor) homogenized in the smoker with normal cow dung. It was quite effective at knocking down the mites. Unfortunately it was difficult to get all the ingredients (except the leaves) and if you inhaled the smoke or got it in your eyes it was very caustic. Dr. Calderone has done some preliminary work with this latter mixture but in a patty form. I hope he persues it because it is apparently quite effective. I do not know about potential contamination of hive products however. Mike > In my recent readings, I have come across some references to using > tobacco > in the smoker with the implication that the tobacco smoke kills > varroa. > Is there any validity to this? > What benefits are derived from using tobacco? > What drawbacks? > Opinions? > Mark Egloff > MEGLOFF@CSC.COM ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 07:25:56 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Re: Formic Acid > I seem to recall that there were problems with formic acid prompting > queen rejection and/or supercedure if used in uncontrolled or high > concentration, which is why it was not a favorable means of varroa > control. There are reports of apparent queen rejection. Especially on first-ever application. However, my understanding is that this is a phenomenon that is not reproducible or well documented or frequent. There is some suspicion that queens that are infested with acarine are affected. Perhaps Kerry will add something to this. Of course any chemical control measure can/will cause problems if used "uncontrolled or high concentration". Using any chemical requires education and careful attention to details, as well as keen observation of the results. One of the major objections to formic acid is its corrosive nature and the matter of spills and fumes -- particularly when being transported in a concentrated form. Apparently it is no worse than Muriatic acid which is used routinely in masonary work, however when anything is is being used in conjunction with food, additional caution is necessary. Formic acid occurs naturally in many foods, including honey, and is not toxic (who knows, it might be beneficial) in small doses. It is fairly closely related chemically to vinegar. The major reason that it is not permitted in the USA, I believe is that there is a great deal of cost in getting approval, and there is no profit for anyone in getting it approved, seeing as there is no patent, and it is a commodity easily obtained anywhere. In the case of Apistan, I understand there is only a few pennies worth of the (proprietary) good stuff in the strip. Most of the rest is (gross) profit, and the promise of this was sufficient to provide incentive for the manufacturer to spend the many dollars necessary to go thru the regulatory approval process. Regards Allen W. Allen Dick, Beekeeper VE6CFK RR#1, Swalwell, Alberta Canada T0M 1Y0 Internet:dicka@cuug.ab.ca & allend@internode.net Honey. Bees, & Art ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 09:48:11 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Franklin Humphrey Subject: Re: Catching Swarms at great heights I use the following method for catching high swarms: Get a pole that will reach the swarm. I use a telescoping paint roller handle that extends about 20 feet. To this attach a 5 gallon bucket or similar size basket. Place a frame of unsealed brood and raise it to make contact with the swarm. Brood is like a magnet to bees and they will quickly move into the bucket to cover the brood. In an hour or less you will have captured virtually all the bees, both those clustering and the returning scouts. Lower the bucket and place the frame of brood in a hive. The bees will enter the hive and set up housekeeping immediately. Farnk Humphrey ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 09:47:49 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Franklin Humphrey Subject: Re: queen excluders pro/con Here in the South we usually use only one brood chamber. In this case we have to use a queen excluder. However a few beekeepers use two brood chambers and don't use an excluder. Frank Humphrey ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 09:47:51 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Franklin Humphrey Subject: Re: Swarm Catching I started giving swarms a frame of brood about 4 years ago. To date, none have left. Frank Humphrey ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 09:48:28 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Franklin Humphrey Subject: Hygienic Behavior In late January on a warm day, I observed a considerable amount of debris I in front of my Yugo colonies. There was none in front of my Italian colonies. In mid February an a warm day I checked the hives for stores and noticed that the Yugos had cleaned the bottom boards down to bare paint while the Italians had a very large amount of debris on the floor. Frank Humphrey ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 17:12:56 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "THONE HUGO SE14 (240)9452" Subject: Re: Formic Acid In-Reply-To: <199603291429.AA17424@internode.net> >Apparently it is no worse than Muriatic acid which is used routinely >in masonary work, however when anything is is being used in >conjunction with food, additional caution is necessary.> >From reports that I've found on the net, i learned that formic acid is an extremely dangerous chemical to deal with. Cheers, Hugo +++++ Hugo Thone (SE144) ALCATEL TELECOM (\ email : thoneh@btmaa.bel.alcatel.be F.Wellesplein 1 {|||8- phone : (32) 3 240 94 52 B-2018 Antwerp (/ fax : (32) 3 240 99 50 do bee do bee do .... ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 12:43:09 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre > In my recent readings, I have come across some references to using > tobacco > in the smoker with the implication that the tobacco smoke kills > varroa. > Is there any validity to this? > What benefits are derived from using tobacco? > What drawbacks? > Opinions? We have used it in the past as a general smoker fuel. It seems to have a more calming effect, but to my knowledge it won't kill Varroa. At least not in the strength you use for the bees!! Not much point in killing the host to eradicate the pest!!! Bees are air breathers as we are, too much tobacco smoke will knock them down, from which they might not recover.(Lung Cancer in Bees? ;-) ) Varroa is narcotized by tobacco smoke and then falls off the bees. We do offer a Varroa Quick Test based on tobacco for those who might need it. **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 09:37:08 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Paul van Westendorp of AGF 576-5600 Fax: 576-5652" Subject: Re: BEE-L Digest - 27 Mar 1996 to 28 Mar 1996 In-Reply-To: <01I2VWM43W5UQYRXHO@saturn.gov.bc.ca> Re. VTD (Varroa Treatment Device) - Popodi Developments. For some time now, we have read various promotional articles about this plastic device. In every case, it claims highly effective against Varroa, safe to use, and University tested. Well, I have not seen any independent scientific information confirming these claims. Let the unnamed US university publish its findings so that beekeepers can make up their own minds about the VTD. Also, I remain concerned about a device described as 'safe', whose operation depends on the use of 85% formic acid. It is on the fringe of mis-information because handling formic acid carries some potential hazard to the applicator and bees. It doesn't mean formic acid should or could not be used in beehives, but beekeepers must be fully aware that formic acid (even at the standard 65% concentration used in Canada) is hazardous and must be handled with care. I sincerely hope the VTD is as effective as it claims to be but instead of having a promotional ad on the Bee-L, why not distribute and publish the field trials of this mysterious US university substantiating the efficacy of the product? Paul van Westendorp pvanwesten@galaxy.gov.bc.ca Provincial Apiarist British Columbia ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 10:59:51 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Virus Emotions In-Reply-To: <960329004743_500795644@emout09.mail.aol.com> On Fri, 29 Mar 1996, wrote: > Dear All -- > I would hope that we would be able to deal with the facts of all issues and > not emotion, speculation and overactive imagination. While I have tried to > read objectively about the Virus issue, I become very concerned when > individuals tie a few facts with offhand observations and reach strong > conclusions. This is a scientific forum, not a legal battle. > Let's try to agree that there is far more to learn about bee viruses than we > currently know, that there are too few people researching bee viruses, and > that we need more bee virus research, not less. To Larry and All , I agree that emotions have to be under control and facts have to be used to get the answers thru scientific reseach. What I have found thru about 8 PhD's is, we do have some knowlege of bee viruses and an antiserum for one virus. Why I started the hunt to get an answer about a new behavior in my bees. I had Varroa and I treated with apistan strips. Some of the hives , I was just too late. But about 60 had good populations in them and were getting ready for winter. I keep a running log on my hives , so I know when I looked them last and how manys frames of bees that I had at that time of the inspection. After 2 weeks , I did some checks on the hives for Varroa with an either roll.The 30 hives that had Varroa the most to start with , were all checked. I had a couple that I found 2 or 3 mites in 50 + bees. I thought that it looked pretty good for the 60 hives that I had left. Some of them started to go down hill slow. So I was watching this very closely. Then I saw something that caught me by suprise , I had a hive with a 12 inch cluster of bees die out in 3 to 4 days.They droped to the bottem of the hive and some were still on the frame. Why did one go down so fast. I did not see any indication of poison , because I had no new losses with the other hives with bees dead out in front. I E-mailed Dr Mike Burgett at Oregon State U. He has been doing studies on our losses up in the NW for the last 5 + years.He sent me a E-mail from Thialand where he was at the time. He told me to get in touch with Dr Peng at UC Davis , who Mike thought was working with Viruses. Dr Peng is waiting for a grant to study the viruses that have come up.Rememmber in 1993 all 10 states checked for virus came up positive. Dr. Peng told me to contact Dr. Welsh in Ontario canada , which I did. She is the one that came up with the antiserum for one virus. She told me how difficult it was to run test for viruses. But wanted me to send her a sample of my bees.She will do part of the work in Canada and then send the material over to Dr. Ball in the Uk. I was given information that some viruses will drop a hive down in 3 days. In the book Honey Bee Pathology by Bailey and Ball there is some info on how some viruses affect the bees.In the book also it states that Varroa has spred 3 viruses that the reseachers knew of in 1991. Dr Welsh told me to add another virus to the list since the book was published. This sudden death of the hive did point to another pathogen besides Varroa. Varroa can bring down a hive very fast under stress. In my case I did not stress the hive myself any more than the rest of them. The problem with two pathogens is who is doing the most damage. No answer. That needs to be answered.We do need more research on Viruses. Not to get overly emotional here, but viruses change and sitting back too long could be a rerun of what we did in the USA with Aids. Nothing until some of the people that we knew were getting it and the research started.Fact , we have Bee Viruses in the US and Canada.We need to keep our eyes open to behavior change in our bees. We don't need to get overly emotional , but we do need to help get good info to our researchers and get them what they need to help the bee and us. The beekeepers on this list are here to learn and teach. We have to use this machine to find out facts and you can send people E-mail to get help.We do have a wonderful research community all around the world.They have dedicated there lives to learning more about are bees and ways to help them.As beekeepers we need to work with them to help ourselves. I have been very up lifted over the last couple of days , with the USDA. I would like to have them give us some information on what they are doing. Belive me , we can do a lot more for each other if we work together. I just put a bunch of words down. The bottem line is not words , its work. I see my bees flying by my window so I better get up and check the temperature and see what hives are flying now. Thank You Very much for your time Roy ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 10:31:14 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Paul van Westendorp of AGF 576-5600 Fax: 576-5652" Subject: Re: BEE-L Digest - 27 Mar 1996 to 28 Mar 1996 In-Reply-To: <01I2VWM43W5UQYRXHO@saturn.gov.bc.ca> Re. Kashmir Bee Virus - Walter Patton Walter, I do not understand that when the discussion about Kashmir Bee Virus is presented by others in a reasoned and well-articulated manner but not to your liking, you chose to respond by criticizing and questioning the integrity of others. Wallingford stated (perhaps with some justifiable pride) the accomplishments and expertise of Dr. Anderson in the field of bee viruses. It doesn't mean that everyone has to agree with Anderson on his scientific findings and conclusions, but there is no basis to question the integrity of his arguments. The same applies to Dr. Shimanuki. Indeed, he did visit New Zealand and Australia some years ago to get a better understanding about the bee health control mechanisms they have in place out there. What basis do you have to be so cynical in brushing off his visit as a 6-week paid holiday? You probably would have been as accusatory if USDA would not have send a bee researcher on a fact-finding mission, and let US beekeepers in the dark about the situation in the southern hemisphere. I know Walter, that you have been bitterly opposed to the decision(s) of your government on its bee import policy, as it unfolded in the fall of 1994. (Your correspondence in several ABJ issues of that time attest to that). Some of your arguments have been valid. I also remain concerned about the potential impact KBV (and other viral agents) might have in the future where Varroa acts as principal vector. But so far, KBV has not proven to be the disasterous agent some have claimed it to be. Although here in Canada we have done surveys (indeed we have KBV which had been reported as far back as 1985) and further research, it remains a highly specialized field of research that requires very expensive equipment to carry out. Without anyone claiming that KBV and others are harmless, the findings have so far failed to indicate that KBV is of comparable significance to other pests such as HBTM, AFB, Chalkbrood or Varroa. You may not agree with it but that is what our experience and literature tell us. In regards to posting our utterances, lets not stand on our soapboxes and become accusatory; keep the discussion focused on the issue(s). Paul van Westendorp pvanwesten@galaxy.gov.bc.ca Provincial Apiarist British Columbia ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 14:39:27 EDT Reply-To: mnasr@evbhort.uoguelph.ca Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Medhat Nasr Organization: Environ. Biology & Horticulture Subject: Re: Formic Acid AAron wrote: I seem to recall that there were problems with formic acid prompting > queen rejection and/or supercedure if used in uncontrolled or high > concentration, which is why it was not a favorable means of varroa > control. Hi Aaron and beekeepers: I have been doing research on Formic acid use to control tracheal mites for the last 3 years. Liu and Nasr (Amer. Bee J. , 132: 666- 668, 1992) found that three applications of 20 ml 65% formic acid / hive box at 5-7 days intervals are effective against tracheal mites. Use of 85% formic acid resulted in bees killing their queens. In canada, Beekeepers used spray guns to deliver the recommended dose on absorbing paper towles or on the bottom board. Our beekeepers in Ontario had bad experience using spray guns. Because of the acid effects on the plastic material of the gun, the guns had mechanical breakdown during spray, spillage of the acid on the applicators' hands, and appplying over dosages of formic acid. In addition, application of acid on the bottom board did give bees a chance to get out when it gets hot. Bees walked through the acid and burn their feet. We had one beekeepers lost 1-2 Lbs/hive from this type of application. These difficulties prompted us to develop a safe method to apply an effective dose of formic acid to bee colonies. We developed the Mite Wipe Pads which were easy to prepare, and delivered accurate effective doses to bee colonies. Overall, Mite Wipe reduced the beekeepers' risk of using formic acid in their hives. Also, we stayed away from applying the acid on the bottom board to avoid any catastrophic damage to the bees when it gets hot. These data are reported in the 94 Annual report to the Ontario Beekeepers' association " Tracheal mite resistance technology transfer by M. Nasr". The description given by Allen Dick is our research results which were conducted in Guelph, Ontario and published in Hive Lights. Clark, 1994 (AM. Bee J.134: 829) and Szabo, 1994 (Am. Bee J. 134:837- 838) found that 6-7 applications of formic acid were effective against varroa mites. formic acid safety: Formic acid is cytotoxic, corrosive, and can damage the skin and eyes on contact. Remember that bees are animals too. The issue of safe application should consider both the applicator and the bees. Use of high concentraion can disturb the phormone system in the hives and make bees leave the hives. From my observations, I found dehydrated eggs, dead young larvae, and dead queens when I used 85% formic acid. My advice is: Always read and follow label instuctions when using any product near your hives. For the New Device, I would like to get a copy of the data which show the efficacy against mites and side effects on bees??? Medhat Nasr, Ph. D. Ontario Beekeepers' Association 401-40 Vanier Dr. Guelph, Ontario. N1G 2X7 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 14:47:06 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Rick Grubbs Organization: The Digital Line Subject: A beginners question I recently did a split on two hives to make a new one, but the queen that I introduced into the split died. This hive will be queenless for about one week untill I can get a new queen. I have heard that queenless hives will develope laying workers, if queenless for more than a few days. Will this cause any problems when my new queen arrives and I try to introduce her into the split? Also after the new queen is accepted by the hive will the laying workers stop laying? -- *************************** * Charles (Rick) Grubbs * * digital@avana.net * * Douglasville, Ga SE USA * *************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 17:29:11 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Lars Lutton (614)593-2669" Subject: Re: queen excluders pro/con In-Reply-To: <960329094749_365140996@mail06> On a not completely unrelated bent an aquaintance who ran 100 hives in So. Ohio, USA swore by a 7/11 cut comb foundation offered by Kelleys. His father referred to QE's as honey excluders :-). I notice it is only offered as cut comb in their catalogue, however. Regards, Lars/OH/USA ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 18:06:59 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Franklin Humphrey Subject: Re: A beginners question Check the hive to see if there are any eggs. If there are any, you have laying workers. If not, you don t have laying workers yet. Give them a frame containing eggs and unsealed brood to deter laying workers. The danger here is that they will raise a queen from freshly hatched larva. You may wish to let them do that if they will. If you do have laying workers you have a real problem. The following works most of the time for me: Make up a 2 or 3 nuc form another hive, using the new queen, and put it on top of the queenless one above a double screen. When the queen is accepted, set the nuc off to the side and carry the old hive some distance away . Take all the frames out of the old hive and lean them up against something . Shake all bees off the hive body and bottom board and return these to the original location. Next. Shake all bees off the frames ant put the frames back in the hive. Then, put the nuc back on top without the double screen. Most of the laying workers have never been out of the hive and will get lost in the grass. When the new queen is accepted reverse the hive bodies so that the queen is in the bottom brood chamber. She should already be laying at this point and will build up quickly Frank Humphrey ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 18:28:56 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Rick Grubbs Organization: The Digital Line Subject: Re: A beginners question Franklin Humphrey wrote: > > Check the hive to see if there are any eggs. If there are any, you have > laying workers. If not, you don t have laying workers yet. Give them a > frame containing eggs and unsealed brood to deter laying workers. The danger > here is that they will raise a queen from freshly hatched larva. You may > wish to let them do that if they will. > > If you do have laying workers you have a real problem. The following works > most of the time for me: > Make up a 2 or 3 nuc form another hive, using the new queen, and put it on > top of the queenless one above a double screen. When the queen is accepted, > set the nuc off to the side and carry the old hive some distance away . Take > all the frames out of the old hive and lean them up against something . > Shake all bees off the hive body and bottom board and return these to the > original location. Next. Shake all bees off the frames ant put the frames > back in the hive. Then, put the nuc back on top without the double screen. > Most of the laying workers have never been out of the hive and will get > lost in the grass. > When the new queen is accepted reverse the hive bodies so that the queen is > in the bottom brood chamber. She should already be laying at this point and > will build up quickly > > Frank Humphrey I do have brood in all stages in the split, I took 2 frames of brood from 2 different hives and put in the new hive. I will have a new queen Monday, but that will mean that they have been queenless for at least 8 days. -- *************************** * Charles (Rick) Grubbs * * digital@avana.net * * Douglasville, Ga SE USA * *************************** ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 21:30:03 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "my name is Dean M. Breaux" Subject: Re: Virus Emotions Thanks for the refreshments Larry, I feel your comments are on target and to the point. Dean ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 19:17:47 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "W. H. Phillips" Subject: P. van Westendorp re Varroa Treatment Device In his post of March 29 Paul van Westendorp writes as if he knew little about the Popodi Varroa Treatment Device. The truth is that he has had one in his office in Cloverdale, B.C. since March 12. It was hand delivered to his office. The manufacturer made sample units available to interested apiculturists in B.C. and Eastern Canada. Kerry Clark and John Gates - both British Columbia apiculturists - also have sample VTDs. Certainly these are busy people who may not have time to go through their "In" baskets personally each and every day, but Van Westendorp's comments are provocative when one knows he is familiar with the device and has for some time had the opportunity to use it. It is true that formic acid is potentially hazardous. It is a common industrial chemical and all devices for handling it - including the Popodi VTD - come with instructions for safe use. It is also true that, used as directed, it is 100% effective. No one who has worked with the VTD knows of any instance when Varroa mites have survived exposure to formic acid fumes in the controlled concentration the VTD provides. Nor are the bees affected, so long as the evaporation rate is correctly controlled. All of this will be substantiated in the near future to the satisfaction of both the beekeeping community and the technoscientific establishment. The university conducting the test program remains unnamed because of a confidentiality agreement. The distinguished scientist in charge doesn't want anxious beekeepers prowling all over his hive yards. When the reports become available we look forward to the comments of Paul van Westendorp, Dr. Nasser and all who are interested in controlling Varroa jacobsoni. We don't have long to wait. Meanwhile we urge Paul van Westendorp and others have have received complimentary VTDs to try them out - being careful to follow the directions. POPODI DEVELOPMENT W.H. Phillips ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 23:44:14 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "for Michael Kielty." Subject: Re: A beginners question Hello Rick: FYI the following are signs of a hive with a laying worker: 1. Several eggs laid per cell. The eggs are usually located on the sides of the cell because the laying workers abdomen does cannot reach the bottom of the cell. 2. Only drone cells, denoted by domed cappings, will be formed in the brood chamber because the laying worker can only lay unfertilized (male) eggs. If a laying workers hasn't already developed and there are eggs three days old or younger then the workers will prepare several queen cells from the eggs. The queen cells that are used to replace a queen will be located toward the center of the comb. The disadvantage of letting the hive "naturally" replace a queen is a diminished hive population. You would lose 20+ days of a queen laying approx. 1500 eggs per day. Good luck, Mike ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 30 Mar 1996 16:18:06 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "David. E. Goble" Subject: An vinvitation to vist Home Page David Goble Ecology Research Centre Lot 170 Hog Bay Road American Beach via Penneshaw Kangaroo Island South Australia, 5222 4th October 1995 To whom it my concern ( Ligurian Bee Research ) Dear Sir/Madam; This is to inform you the above organisations past and present research is avaliable on the internet. The internet details are as follows; Title : Kangaroo Island Beekeeping URL : http://www.eastend.com.au/~goble Category : Nature & Wildlife Keywords : Bees Beekeeping Apiarist Entomology Kangaroo Island Ligurian Honey Organisation : Brian Goble Associates Ecology Research Centre D & B Goble Apiarists City : American Beach State/Provience : South Australia Kangaroo Island Country : Australia Contact : David Goble E-Mail : goble@eastend.com.au Thanks from : goble@eastend.com.au http://www.eastend.com.au/~goble degob1@mugc.cc.monash.ed.au ( David Goble ) American Beach Kangaroo Island South Australia ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 23:17:00 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Re: P. van Westendorp re Varroa Treatment Device > In his post of March 29 Paul van Westendorp writes as if he knew > little about the Popodi Varroa Treatment Device. > > The truth is that he has had one in his office in Cloverdale, B.C. > since March 12. It was hand delivered to his office. The > manufacturer made sample units available to interested apiculturists > in B.C. and Eastern Canada. Kerry Clark and John Gates - both > British Columbia apiculturists - also have sample VTDs. The mere fact that these men have been given the devices is in no way proof that they feel they know enough about the device to comment favourably on it, or that the devices work as claimed or have any legitimacy whatsoever. Besides, conclusive field tests are hard to administer in just 17 days. *At least* one season and a number of *independent* tests of some size will be required to prove that the device *might* work as claimed. I hope you don't expect anyone to endorse the product merely on the strength of having held one and having read the instructions. We all remember cold fusion, so I think most of us require high quality proof -- and lots of it. In treatment of mites, numerous 'cures' have had some short term success in limited circumstances, but we find ourselves with only a few approaches that have stood the test of time and proven effective *most of the time* with acceptable collateral damage *most of the time*. I know of no reputable scientist that would claim 100% success at anything so difficult to measure as mite suppression, unless perhaps the 'cure' was cyanide administered liberally . Marketers can get 100% kills any time. > Certainly these are busy people who may not have time to go through > their "In" baskets personally each and every day, but Van > Westendorp's comments are provocative when one knows he is familiar > with the device and has for some time had the opportunity to use it. I find it it curious that the writer feels free to reveal that PVW has received a VTD (I am assuming he did not ask PVW's consent) when the writer does not reveal the name of the one researcher at the one (anonymous) university that apparently has consented to test the device in scientific circumstances. I think PVW may have had a VTD long enough to feel genuine skepticism. I know the press releases alone were sufficient in my case. From what I know about mites, and formic acid, and bees and people, I really have my doubts. Of course, I'd love to be proven wrong. The problem is THERE IS NO PROOF. > It is true that formic acid is potentially hazardous. It is a > common industrial chemical and all devices for handling it - > including the Popodi VTD - come with instructions for safe use. I am not sure, but it seems to me that in Canada only 65% formic is approved for use in bees. I could be wrong. But that would make a device requiring 85% of dubious legality. > When the reports become available we look forward to the comments of > Paul van Westendorp, Dr. Nasser and all who are interested in > controlling Varroa jacobsoni. I'm sure we will all enjoy that. And I'm sure we'd feel a lot more comfortable if the marketing were held off until there was some credible proof that it works. Regards Allen W. Allen Dick, Beekeeper VE6CFK RR#1, Swalwell, Alberta Canada T0M 1Y0 Internet:dicka@cuug.ab.ca & allend@internode.net Honey. Bees, & Art ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 30 Mar 1996 07:49:26 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Sid Pullinger Subject: Formic acid treatment I am intrigued by the letter sent to Bee-list 28-3-96. There was a thread on the list some time ago which showed that formic acid could be very nasty stuff, fumes causing damage to the sinuses and lung tissues and splashes causing blindness. It was necessary to wear protective clothing, goggles and a respirator. If this was so then no doubt Mr Popodi's system must have overcome all these dangers. I have no personal experience of it but would prefer it to Apistan. I do know that a local beekeeper used this treatment on his 200 stocks at the end of last summer. Every one of them perished during the winter. I am definitely not blaming formic acid for this failure as it is being used successfully in many countries. Clearly the beekeeper was at fault in some way. Some of my acquaintances who used chemical strips last autumn also lost all their bees. These treatments require care, knowledge and timing and are not to be entered upon lightly. Could Mr Propodi please tell us more as he has apparently achieved a much needed breadthrough. As an aside may I enter the high swarm contest. I use a shrimp net tied firmly to a drain rod. I can get up to twenty feet of so after which it becomes unwieldy. I may have to "fish" three or four times but I get the queen down in the end. Sid P. _________________________________________________________________ Sid Pullinger Email : sidpul@aladdin.co.uk 36, Grange Rd Compuserve: 100343.1216@compuserve.com Alresford Hants SO24 9HF England ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 30 Mar 1996 06:48:35 -1000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Walter Patton Subject: Responding To Bee Friends Well first of all I can see I must be faithful to quick responding lest I get so far behind I give up, and the people who share my concerns and perspective would be dis-appointed. Some others would be happy . To the people who responded with support directly to me and not the list I understand that the bee world is a small world and thats OK in some ways at least there are fewer places to hide. Thanks to you secret admirers who did send some encouraging word and some words of caution. Can I reall be DROPPED from the bee-l list for my opinions ? Who pulls the plug ? Do you really think the powers that be would actually "GET" me if my ideas hit to close to home. Well I know my feelings are pure and without motives except to ignite the fire that maybe required to get some action going on the honeybee problems facing Americas food producers with decling honeybees as pollinator.I don't have anything to sell or anything to gain and I am convinced I am on an important mission. TO L Conner Excuse my emotions and after all the smoke and mirrors I have encountered during the last several years that I have had my mission I do sometimes resort to emotions and I totally agree that facts are what we need in the future dealings with the honeybee problems facing the citizens of the United States of America. I also agree that much more research and a lot more researchers are needed to solve the virus and mite situation. One reader suggested that bee-l is not apolitical forum and that my slurs about about some people will turn away some who might otherwise support me. Well folks now is not the time to worry too much about political correctness as this as been part of the problem too long. We have had very few facts and little research and LOTS of polittical correctness. Hell everybody seems afraid to speak out and be heard. Plenty of examples will follow . Roy your right we would ALL like to hear from the USDA about what they are doing and I doubt if we will hear very much. AND I know that there are a lot of truly dedicated researchers working at the USDA and they are for the most part like most of us afraid to speak out. Good jobs are hard to come by . The leadership of bee work in the USDA must be credited with this situation where everyone is afraid to speak put and after working with the ruthless leadership I Know why they are afraid to speak out. Mr van Westendorp I have spent hours and tons of long distance calls finding out what I could about the issues that I speak and my findings are very disturbing. I know the NZ beekeepers have lots & lots of end of season bees for sale and they work hard at selling them . Too many trails I have traveled leave too much to be desired in the issue of increased movement of bees around the world . Re; D Anderson work the facts exists that without peer review research can be done and documented without total objectivity and with too much senstivity to the clients needs. Honey bee issues are too crtical for comments like "Kashmir being a relativly harmless bee virus" are far too simple for such a thorny problem. Dr M Winston wrote a super article regarding the need for peer review.About Dr . Shimanuke holiday (6wks) several years ago regarding bee research it was a holiday. I have had several conversations with the Shimanuke and he did zero research on NZ bees save and except "OBSERVING" some "Nice .gentle , little bees..." Give me a break . He has left the American Beekeeper uninformed about NZ bees . He did not one test on the NZ bees by his own account. I have asked him for results of his research in NZ and he has none.. I will some times have to crawl up on my soapbox in hopes that some one will notice. The feelings of impotence and hoplessness felt by most when dealing with GOVERENMENTS is hard to overcome ,and I will work hard to keep the focus on the issues. I must sign off for now as it is 6;45 am here in paradise and the sun is shining and about 70 degrees. I will respond to the reportin errors corrected by Wallingford in my next posting . Hoping some will be moved to action. Sincerly Walter & Elisabeth Patton, 27-703 A Ka' ie'ie Rd., Papaikou HI.,96781 Ph./Fax. 808-964-5401 E-Mail hihoney@ilhawaii Beekeeper and Bed & Breakfast Owner in Hawaii http://www.alohamall.com/hamakua/hihoney.htm http://www.alohamall.com/hamakua/beeware.htm http://www.alohamall.com/hamakua/lamalani.htm ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 30 Mar 1996 13:18:07 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "(Kevin & Shawna Roberts)" Subject: Re: A beginners question If they've only been queenless for 8 days, and there is brood in the box, you shouldn't have to worry about laying workers. In my experience, laying workers begin to develop only after there is no more brood. At the minimum, it takes 2 weeks for a worker's ovaries to develop (according to _ABC and XYZ of Bee Culture_ ). You should check for queen cells before you install the new queen, and destroy them. You don't want an emergency queen to emerge and possibly kill your nice new queen. Emergency queens (once again, in my experience) are usually puny and less productive. They may be acceptable in a pinch, but I don't let them live long. Good luck! Shawna ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 30 Mar 1996 11:06:35 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: For the Beginner Hello , Spring is a wonderful time of the year for a beginning beekeeper. For some of you ,what ever you see in the hive will be new to you. You can read a book , but the true learning comes from what you see in your bees. To start off right , you should keep a record of what you see in the hive. But remember that the weather has an effect on the bees. So always note the temp , wind and sun ect. By writting it down and keeping good records you will learn about your bee behavior in your location. Books are good guides.When you start to find out what your bees are getting necter from and pollen.You put down the date and now your keeping a good history to look back on in the future.We had a 500 acer clear cut about 500 yards form by bees a couple of years ago. That has changed my early flow data.Beekeepers need to keep there eyes open to nature all the time.You will find yourself looking for buds on trees and plants all the time. You don't need to have a bunch of hives to be a good beekeeper. You should have at least 2 so you have something to compare to and use to start another queen if needed. If your in the USA use the legal treatment for Varroa.Don't let some one talk you into using something else that they say will work. I don't care who they are , do it right.New beekeepers need to pay attention to there hive more than in the past. I'm affraid that some people thought that they can just put a hive in there back yard and let them go on there own. Thats not a beekeeper.Boy do they miss something wonderful. You have a place to get support on the net. Don't foreget your State Apiarist.Beside giving you help , they learn more about the problems in there state. I talked to my State Apiarist yesterday for about 45 minutes. We have Jim Bach in Wash. state and is super great to work with on anything. They all want to help you , or they should. I still go out on good days and sit down beside a hive and watch the bees come and go.When you have a good flow going , you can tell that the bees are full of nectar when they drop on the landing board like little rocks. Write down what you see. You will learn more in the long run and have a greater understanding of the bees. The Best in Beekeeping Roy ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 30 Mar 1996 14:31:55 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Tom Ross Subject: Re: mini, baby, and micro nucs Keith, Bill Maxant in Ayer MA at one time made a small styrofoam nuc; give them a call at 617-772-0576. Most European supply catalogs list small nucs. Tom Ross ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 30 Mar 1996 19:15:37 EDT Reply-To: mnasr@evbhort.uoguelph.ca Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Medhat Nasr Organization: Environ. Biology & Horticulture Subject: Re: Varroa Treatment Device Again to you all: 1. In canada only 65% formic acid is approved for use in bee colonies. As a result, using this device will require an approval of using 85% either for research purposes or treatment by beekeepers. 2. Mr. Popodi wrote in ABJ (March, 1996, p.162) that The Varroa Treatment Device dispenses formic acid vapor at a controlled rate which beekeepers can vary to compensate for temperature. Then, he continued to say If warm weather evaporation of formic acid gets too fast, the bees' ERATIC behaviour at the hive entrance alerts the beekeepers to slow down the rate. When temperature falls, the rate can be increased until the catch pan is again covered with varroa carcasses. My questions are: 1. Why do bees show ERATIC behaviour if this application is safe. 2. Do we have to baby sit the colonies during the period of application and run around to adjust the rate of evaporation? 3. What is the number of killed queens as a result of this eratic behaviour? 4. What are the side effects on eggs and young larvae? 5. where can we get legally 85% formic acid to use in this device? I agree with Allen's comments " we'd feel a lot more comfortable about this device if the marketing were held off until there was some credible proof that it works. I add also until we have answers to the above questions we should not rush. Regards, Medhat Nasr Ph.D. Ontario Beekeepers' Association Guelph, Ontario ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 30 Mar 1996 21:58:55 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Keith G. Benson DVM" Subject: Re: mini, baby, and micro nucs At 02:31 PM 3/30/96 -0500, you wrote: >Keith, > >Bill Maxant in Ayer MA at one time made a small styrofoam nuc; give them a >call at 617-772-0576. Most European supply catalogs list small nucs. > >Tom Ross > Tom, Thanks for the tip! Keith Keith G. Benson, DVM Dept. of Medical Sciences School of Veterinary Medicine University of Wisconsin 608/263-7600 kgbenson@facstaff.wisc.edu bensonk@svm.vetmed.wisc.edu ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 30 Mar 1996 22:09:06 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Keith G. Benson DVM" Subject: sorry for posting to the whole list I apologize for posting the last message to the entire list - hit the wrong "button" Keith Keith G. Benson, DVM Dept. of Medical Sciences School of Veterinary Medicine University of Wisconsin 608/263-7600 kgbenson@facstaff.wisc.edu bensonk@svm.vetmed.wisc.edu ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 30 Mar 1996 20:43:12 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Hugh Mawby Subject: Re: your mail In-Reply-To: <199603291738.MAA29289@segwun.muskoka.net> David.... I went to school with a boy of your name. I often see your name and as my father kept bees at the time I knew a David Eyre I have been wondering if our paths have crossed again. The David Eyre I knew left England for Canada in about 1948 or 1949. Anyway rather than go into a long story please let me knoe in you is he. Thanks. H. Mawby ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 31 Mar 1996 14:48:27 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "David. E. Goble" Subject: Re: Orange Flow >> Beekeepers working in citrus groves in South Florida report fair to good >>flows. But the larger belt of citrus along the "Ridge" of central Florida >>has been so cold that bees have not worked much, and trees are not yielding. >> >> If the weather does not warm soon, the bloom will be over without a >>significant orange crop in much of the citrus areas - a real disappointment >>to beekeepers in view of record prices in the honey market. > >I'll say disappointment. I have hives in groves near Daytona Beach and just >west of Orlando, Florida. A few hives are doing well but most aren't making >honey. At least they are making more bees for pollination. Hives in the >grove further south in Tampa are doing much better. > >God Bless, >Kelley Rosenlund rosenlk@freenet.ufl.edu >Gainesville, Florida, U.S.A., 137 hives, 1 year in beekeeping. > Hi Kelley, Your problem is your bees have not been coaxed to only work the orange grove blossom, this is to prepare your bees to a orange flavour mixture, just before the trees are to bloom.If your do this a few time before each bloom period the bees will only work the citrus orchard, and to assist in the brood development with a supply of pollen, your need to supplement or have pollen plants growing near by, in Australia, clover plants are planted in between each row of trees and watered regularly, either by spray or flood irrigation. Thanks from : goble@eastend.com.au http://www.eastend.com.au/~goble degob1@mugc.cc.monash.ed.au ( David Goble ) American Beach Kangaroo Island South Australia ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 31 Mar 1996 14:48:32 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "David. E. Goble" Subject: Re: swarms >Hi all! >I just had a strange experience. The day before yesterday I captured a huge >swarm from one of my own hives. I checked afterwards and there were still a >large number of bees left in the hive. Today I took another look and the >bees are removing bees from the hive. I saw some flying out carrying others >and I saw lots of dead bees on the front porch. Does anyone have any idea >what is going on? >Mary > Hi Mary, You have seen the orginal hive over taken by either a swarm or robber bees, the stronger of these to swarms are removing the other bees owing to the different smell of their queen to the other queen. This is not to say their is two queen in this hive but could be a strong worker female,only laying drones. Thanks from : goble@eastend.com.au http://www.eastend.com.au/~goble degob1@mugc.cc.monash.ed.au ( David Goble ) American Beach Kangaroo Island South Australia ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 31 Mar 1996 14:48:39 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "David. E. Goble" Subject: Re: Producers/exporters of bee Honey. >I'm building a worldwide producer/exporters database. Can you help me? > >If you know about any, please send the following data: > >Exporter/producer name, contact, telephone and fax number, country, email (if available) to: > >belendez@infosel.net.mx > >Thank you for your time and cooperation. > Hi; My Kangaroo Island Beekeeping home Page, has material on the types of Eucalyptus ( Gum ) Honey available on Kangaroo Island. The URL is below in my signature. The following persons may be able to help Mr D. Clifford +61 (0848)23210 PO Box 279, Kingscote, Kangaroo Island South Australia, 5223 or Mr P. Davis +61 (0848)37269. RSD 78 via Kingscote Kangaroo Island South Australia, 5223 or Mrs B. McAdam +61 (0848) 31237 South Tce, Penneshaw Kangaroo Island South Australia, 5222 Thanks from : goble@eastend.com.au http://www.eastend.com.au/~goble degob1@mugc.cc.monash.ed.au ( David Goble ) American Beach Kangaroo Island South Australia ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 31 Mar 1996 14:48:43 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "David. E. Goble" Subject: Re: A beginners question >I recently did a split on two hives to make a new one, but the queen that I introduced into the split died. >This hive will be queenless for about one week untill I can get a new queen. I have heard that queenless hives >will develope laying workers, if queenless for more than a few days. Will this cause any problems when my new >queen arrives and I try to introduce her into the split? Also after the new queen is accepted by the hive will >the laying workers stop laying? >-- >*************************** >* Charles (Rick) Grubbs * >* digital@avana.net * >* Douglasville, Ga SE USA * >*************************** > Dear Rick, If your new queen arrives with in the next week, use quite a bit of smoke , before you introduce the new queen in to the hive with the escorts in the cage, but make sure that the opening outside of the queen candy is uncovered. Your new queen will gradually be acceptable to the bees in the hive , and she will be released in the next few days. It is importance to leave the hive alone for the next week, and it is quite possable tht when your next examine the hive the queen will have layed. The drone layer will be over ruled or killed. > Thanks from : goble@eastend.com.au http://www.eastend.com.au/~goble degob1@mugc.cc.monash.ed.au ( David Goble ) American Beach Kangaroo Island South Australia ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 31 Mar 1996 14:48:35 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "David. E. Goble" Subject: Re: Varroa Resistant Stock >On Wed, 27 Mar 1996 rdanka@ASRR.ARSUSDA.GOV wrote: > >> The USDA, ARS Honey Bee Breeding, Genetics and Physiology >> Laboratory in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, is seeking the help of >> beekeepers in a project aimed at combatting Varroa jacobsoni. We > >BRAVO - This is the news many of us have been waiting for. Personaly , I >prefer this approach to roaming the globe in search of the perfect bee. >If a project like this is supported, we should soon have a population of >bees to work with that will be as good as those anywhere. > In response to these postings, You do not have to breed a resistant strain,All you need a clean hive and foundation, hatching brrod and a new queen from a Varroa free supplier and exclude all the older field bees from these hive , by placing it on a new isolated site, thi can be successful in at least 90% of any attempt. Mite infection can not be controlled by immuniological or toxicological genetic controll. Thanks from : goble@eastend.com.au http://www.eastend.com.au/~goble degob1@mugc.cc.monash.ed.au ( David Goble ) American Beach Kangaroo Island South Australia ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 31 Mar 1996 14:48:47 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "David. E. Goble" Subject: Re: Swarm Catching >I understand putting a frame of brood or honey in the hive will encourage >the swarm to stay, true? > >God Bless, >Kelley Rosenlund rosenlk@freenet.ufl.edu >Gainesville, Florida, U.S.A., 137 hives, 1 year in beekeeping. > Hi Kelley; Not quite, its a frame of honey, old stickies or new foundation. A frame of brood will encourage the hive to swarm, by increasing the population. The idea is to allow the hive to expand their store of honey. The exception is when their is more than one queen in the hive, in this case there will be a swarming, if the other queens are not removed. Thanks from : goble@eastend.com.au http://www.eastend.com.au/~goble degob1@mugc.cc.monash.ed.au ( David Goble ) American Beach Kangaroo Island South Australia ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 22:22:16 PST Reply-To: TTOWNSE@ibm.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: T.TOWNSEND@IBM.NET Subject: Re: queen excluders pro/con ---------------Original Message--------------- Here in the South we usually use only one brood chamber. In this case we have to use a queen excluder. However a few beekeepers use two brood chambers and don't use an excluder. Frank Humphrey I have been watching this discussion on queen excluders, since it started and I thought I might add my two-bits to it, it may make some southern beekeepers shake there heads :).We use a three brood nest system, year round, and of cource queen excluders are not a required piece of equipment. Now this is northern beekeeping, with little movement, and with three broods, no feeding ( of course with honey prices as they are, we will probably change that), not complaining, just means another change in management, but isn't that part of this job? Just another view on an old problem, (to use or not to use queen excluders). TPLR HONEY FARMS Tim Townsend RR 1 Stony Plain Alberta TTOWNSE@IBM.NET ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 31 Mar 1996 08:16:15 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: JLariviere@AOL.COM Subject: Fwd: Virus Alert --------------------- Forwarded message: Subj: Fwd: Virus Alert Date: 96-03-26 15:30:07 EST From: Oishda To: A Vocalist >From the Desk of: Oishda --------------------------------------------------- Tuesday, Mar 26, 1996 Hi Folks, Please note the following information that I recieved this week... I contacted TOS in regards to this post before sending it out to my mailing list ... the TOS response follows the post originally recieved . Hugs and Love *-=Oishda=-* In a message dated 96-03-24 22:19:22 EST, KAZ48 writes: << A new Trojan horse virus has emerged on the internet with the name PKZIP300.ZIP, so named as to give the impression that this file is a new version of the PKZIP software used to ZIP (compress) files. Do not download this file under any circumstances! If you install or expand this file, the virus will wipe your hard disk and affect modems at 14.4 and higher. This is an extremely destructive virus and there is not yet a way of cleaning up this one. Repeat: Do not download any file with the name PKZIP300 -- regardless of the extension. >> In a message dated 96-03-24 22:46:37 EST,Oishda wrote: << can you verify if a file called PKZIP300.zip or .exe is valid or a virus ..I recievec a warning in regards to the file and want to verify if the warning is true before passing the word along ..Thanks >> Dear Member, The file in question has been forwarded to the appropriate TOS department. Until proven otherwise I would definitely assume that it is indeed a virus. If you have any further questions or comments, please fell free to write. Regards, Mike Terms of Service Staff America Online, Inc --------------------- Forwarded message: Subj: Fwd: Virus Alert Date: 96-03-24 22:19:22 EST From: KAZ48 To: Oishda --------------------- Forwarded message: From: Craftman@ix.netcom.com (Bob Zager) To: DianeP@usa.pipeline.com CC: shec@ux.accesscom.net, KAZ48@aol.com Date: 96-03-22 19:57:43 EST A new Trojan horse virus has emerged on the internet with the name PKZIP300.ZIP, so named as to give the impression that this file is a new version of the PKZIP software used to ZIP (compress) files. Do not download this file under any circumstances! If you install or expand this file, the virus will wipe your hard disk and affect modems at 14.4 and higher. This is an extremely destructive virus and there is not yet a way of cleaning up this one. Repeat: Do not download any file with the name PKZIP300 -- regardless of the extension. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 31 Mar 1996 09:23:28 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Dave Green, Eastern Pollinator Newsletter" Subject: Re: Orange Flow In a message dated 96-03-31 00:21:26 EST, goble@EASTEND.COM.AU writes: >Your problem is your bees have not been coaxed to only work the >orange grove blossom, this is to prepare your bees to a orange flavour >mixture, just before the trees are to bloom. Ho, ho, ho! Bees needing coaxing to work oranges?!! That was a good one; it made April Fool's Day complete, even before it arrived. Just talk to any Florida vegetable grower who is trying to get his crop pollinated while his neighbor's citrus is blooming......... Just in case you are serious, bees will happily work citrus bloom, in preference to almost anything else, but the citrus has to yield nectar. That takes sunshine and warmth, which have been notably absent in Florida this season. >...in Australia, clover plants are planted in between each row of trees and watered regularly, either by spray or flood irrigation. That's a perfect set up for a pesticide kill. If the clover is blooming, when insecticides are sprayed, somebody is not going to follow directions (not to spray when bees are foraging in the application area). Clover should not be allowed to grow within fruit groves or orchards. Outside the pesticide application areas, it's a good idea. This keeps the bees busy, away from spraying. Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green PO Box 1200, Hemingway, SC 29554 USA Practical Pollination Home Page http://users.aol.com/pollinator/polpage1.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 31 Mar 1996 12:02:19 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Ian Clowes Subject: Re: Virus Alert Please also note another virus, noted on AOL USA. A file called AOLGOLD, supposed to be upgrade software....it isn't, beware. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 31 Mar 1996 09:05:58 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Roy Nettlebeck Subject: Re: Formic Acid In-Reply-To: <960329.084947.EST.SYSAM@cnsibm.albany.edu> On Fri, 29 Mar 1996, Aaron Morris wrote: > Apologies in advance for going to the list before going to the books, > but the list is here and my books are home, so here is my question. > > I seem to recall that there were problems with formic acid prompting > queen rejection and/or supercedure if used in uncontrolled or high > concentration, which is why it was not a favorable means of varroa > control. > Hi. I have seen some good posts on formic acid.Mostly negative and I have learned a little more about the problems of its use with bees and humans.The people that want the wait and see what the researchers come up with are thinking.Chemicals and delivery are very critical.We don't need another amatraz type problem. It was published as a good mite killer that was safe for the bees if used as instructed. I'm very glad to see people challange the chemical % and delivery system.For now we will have to use some chemicals in the hives. When Vince said BRAVO for the USDA working with USA stock that shows a resistance to Varroa, he was right.That is the real fix. In the mean time we have to go slow on the chemicals.The honeybee pheromone system is very complex.We do not have all the answers in regards to the pheromones in the hive. Therefore we will not know for shure what changes will be taking place do to the addition of a chemical to a hive. Time and tests will give us an idea to what affect it has on a hive.Just because Formic acid has been used in different places for some time now , does-n't qualify it for use , when we read of some of the problems that people have had with its use.When its blessed in the US a few times by our researchers , I will then get some for back up. I hate Varroa because if I don't put a chemical in my hives I will loose them to that mite.I'm trying to learn more about some of the behavior changes we have seen in our bees in the last 5 + years.Chemicals added to the hive fogs the picture. Free H ions in an atmosphere of carbon dioxide and organic acids , which are many , will have some bonding.Which pheromones will be affected I don't know.The researchers up at SFU in BC Canada have done a lot of work on Pheromones and may be able to shed some light on the issue. Best Regards Roy ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 31 Mar 1996 16:16:21 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kevin & Ann Christensen Subject: Bulk Bees in Mating Nucs Could any of the queen breeders out there suggest a fast and simple = method of trasferring bulk bees into mating baby nucs without injury to = the bees? I understand that most people simply spray the bees down with = syrup so that they are easier to handle. Is there another way? Kevin Christensen ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 31 Mar 1996 21:10:25 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "BRENT A. HURSEY" Subject: High swarms -Reply In my opinion the honey bomb is the best way to draw down a high swarm. It is well worth the investment of the M-80's and the small amount of honey required. Be careful handling the M-80's though because my father lowwed his little finger using this method several years ago. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 31 Mar 1996 22:10:02 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: James Hi all! I've been following the recent debate on formic acid and just wanted to add to it (for whatever it's worth) A friend of mine who has kept bees commercially in western Canada for 20 plus years has had great success using formic in the spring and apistan in the fall to control mites. Granted, it's a moot point at best because formic is illegal in the U.S. for use with bees. He seems to think that the use of the two makes it more difficult for the mites to gain a resistance to either. Have other Canadian beekeepers had the same experience? I would like to stay away from chemicals as much as possible though. Does anyone have any ideas for organic substitutes for chemicals. I have used Tansy and Pennyroyal for fleas on my dogs with great results. I'd like to see some research on herbs and such on mites. Someone a week or two ago posed the question "what plants should be planted to help the bees?" There are lots of plants (and trees!) that the bees love! Borage has an abundance of small, light blue flowers that bloom profusely from mid-summer to the first frost. The young leaves are also quite tasty in salads (tastes alittle like cucumber!) Many of the herbs are also good. Bee balm, Anise Hyssops, lavender, the mints... these will all have the bees jumping for joy. However, you should remember that unless you plan to plant a large plot with these plants ( say an acre or more per hive!) the plants you use for your garden won't make much of a dent in your honey supers. If you DO want to plant a large area, Buckwheat of course is a great one as is Vetch and clover. In the tree category, there is a beautiful tree that was written about in a recent Bee Culture Mag. (I forget which issue but within the last six months) called the Chinese Evodia tree aka the Bee-Bee tree as well as Basswood, Locust, and any other trees that you normally get a flow from. Happy planting! James Jacobs Hobbyist beekeeper Organic gardener ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 31 Mar 1996 23:00:16 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Vince Coppola Subject: Re: Varroa Resistant Stock In-Reply-To: <199603310517.OAA07732@eastend.com.au> On Sun, 31 Mar 1996, David. E. Goble wrote: > >prefer this approach to roaming the globe in search of the perfect bee. > >If a project like this is supported, we should soon have a population of > >bees to work with that will be as good as those anywhere. > > > In response to these postings, > > You do not have to breed a resistant strain,All you need a clean > hive and foundation, hatching brrod and a new queen from a Varroa free > supplier and exclude all the older field bees from these hive , by placing > it on a new isolated site, thi can be successful in at least 90% of any attempt. > Mite infection can not be controlled by immuniological or toxicological > genetic controll. I hope this an April fool prank and not realy advice. Vince