Received: from [169.226.1.21] by relay.internode.net (SMTPD32-3.02) id AEE5163A0052; Tue, 12 Nov 1996 23:47:01 -0700 Received: from CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU by CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 1775; Wed, 13 Nov 96 01:50:23 EST Received: from CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU (NJE origin LISTSERV@ALBNYVM1) by CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU (LMail V1.2c/1.8c) with BSMTP id 9680; Wed, 13 Nov 1996 01:47:01 -0500 Date: Wed, 13 Nov 1996 01:46:58 -0500 From: "L-Soft list server at ALBNYVM1 (1.8b)" Subject: File: "BEE-L LOG9609E" To: "W. Allen Dick" X-UIDL: 478 Status: U ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 00:48:26 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Tom Allen Subject: Allergy control and bee products some weeks ago we has a thing going about honey and allergy reaction minimization Thought that recent experience might be of interest to participants. I am one of those who have been pleasantly surprised at the near cesssation of asthma and hay fever while tending bees and consuming unusal amounts of honey.For three years I have haad no asthma after 60 odd years of sheer misery. Recently we had an unusally high ragweed pollen count. For two days my asthmas and coughing of phlegm probably allergic was frightening. Was it all starting again? Out came the inhalers. Two days passed and low and behold no more wheeze , no more cough. My non-honey consuming friends are still complaining. I think that my overall small reaction is part of the larger issue of allergy minimization. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 17:16:31 +1300 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jonathan Marshall Subject: Re: Bees knowing you,or your watch Tom Allen wrote: > > In the past three years I have been stung many times,the most common is bees > crawling down between my jacket sleeve and by glove gaunlet.The crawl right > up to my LCD watach and hit me right under the band next tothe watch face.I > wonder if the bees are annoyed by a sound frequency that we do not hear. > > Comments anyone. Yes I know I have to do something about the jacket matching > the gauntlet,Velcro in a complete loop is my approach for 1997 season The best way to stop the bees from sting you arround the watch area is to not wear any gloves. This will stop you being "mainly" stung in the region of the watch. You might instead find that you are stung if at all on the fingers. In alot of bee keepers don't wear glove, I know that alot still do. In saying so I don't wear any gloves and find that by doing so I am aware of the temperment of the hive and also what might annoy them about my activities. I work 250 hives and on a good day will get through 100 of them in hive maintenance with a little over 20 stings on a bad day. I must admit though that weather and time of day also play a part. Hope this helps, but not wearing gloves will stop you worrying about bee stinging you "mainly" arround the watch. Jonathan ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 27 Sep 1996 22:35:40 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Tom & Carol Elliott Organization: Home Subject: Re: Bees knowing you,or your watch Jonathan Marshall wrote: > > In alot of bee keepers don't wear glove, I know that alot still do. I agree 100 percent. In working with other beekeepers I have very rarely seen wearing gloves and sensitive (to the bees) manipulations. Gloves almost always seem to go with bad tempered bees. I can work the same hive without gloves and rerely ever get stung. The stings I do get are almost exclusively my fault. -- "Test everything. Hold on to the good." (1 Thessalonians 5:21) Tom Elliott Eagle River, Alaska beeman@alaska.net ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 03:55:27 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Re: Bees knowing you,or your watch > but not wearing gloves will stop you worrying about > bee stinging you "mainly" arround the watch. Hmmm. I usually don't wear gloves, and I haven't worn a watch for years, but i do recall that when i did, the area around the watch band was a favourite target if the bees were getting at all cranky. My fingers mainly get stung only because of pressing bees or general clumsiness, but if the bees got stirred up at all, the watch band area got it worst, whether the band was made of leather, or steel. this was my personal experience. Perhaps different people have different results due to differences in sweat odor or movement habits. And perhaps the bees make a difference, too. we had some NZ bees several years ago that would not take the time to distinguish between a watch band and anything else. They stung *anything* that was convenient -- indiscriminately. they were the most vicious bees i ever worked -- bar none. (The NZ bees we got this year were much more normal in temperament). Interestingly enough, this is not something I am particularly conscious about -- and I have to stop to think about it -- but it seems to me that the bees do not attack my fingers much at all compared to the backs of my hands and arms. (This is assuming I am wearing a bee suit and veil. Otherwise, the first hint of annoyance is around the head and (naked) upper body). Before they start stinging, they will often start by biting on the wrists and arms. If I ignore that, then they start to sting very lightly. If I ignore that, then they start to drive their points home a bit more forcefully. After that, things really get unpleasant. Regards Allen W. Allen Dick, Beekeeper VE6CFK RR#1, Swalwell, Alberta Canada T0M 1Y0 Internet:dicka@cuug.ab.ca & allend@internode.net Honey. Bees, & Art ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 08:32:48 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Joel Govostes Subject: stinging the watch/ GLOVES Gloves - use them or don't? I must admit that I do, regularly. Shame on me. About the only situations when I don't are when I am working on weak colonies or nuc's. I'm not sure when I started using them again on a regular basis. I do know that I still get stung. Often the bees "go" for the elastic end of the gauntlets, my elbows, or find one of the many holes in the glove-seams which eventually develop. It's always a surprise! As a matter of fact, this summer I can't remember how many times a bee quickly and effortlessly went right into one of the small holes! I mean I ended up ripping the glove off to get away from the bee that got IN! Also, I get a few stings throught the "ventilation" panel in the wrist area. A couple of things, tho'. When you are restricted to working bees only at certain times, and you can't control the weather, gloves can make otherwise unmanageable manipulations "do-able." And you don't end up with propolis all over your fingers. You can often work a little faster as well. Beyond that, gloves will hang on to the venom-scent and I'm convinced this can get otherwise-agreeable bees riled. At one point I was using gloves with the finger tips cut off and this was a pretty good compromise. What is really annoying is to get stung hard on an gloveless finger or hand, and then drop a nice heavy comb on the ground. I have, unfortunately, had this happen. It would have been better to crush an obstructing bee-body with a gloved finger than to drop a bee-covered brood comb! Admittedly, there is a certain satisfaction to be had from remaining constantly receptive to a colony's mood, and being able to successfully handle them without resorting to the clumsiness of gloves. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 08:35:07 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Joel Govostes Subject: Re: Bees knowing you,or your watch Well, what kind of watch WAS it? Maybe they didn't care for the style. -or- Maybe they'd prefer to be salaried employees? ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 06:55:54 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Betty B Subject: Re: Chiggers (was Ticks) Slightly off-topic At 03:24 PM 9/27/96 GMT, John Taylor wrote: >After posting treatment for ticks and offering to do the same for >chiggers I received several requests for the information on chiggers. >As we are all outdoors and prone to these pests (in addition to many >others) I thought it might be worth sharing with the LIST. > >The information that follows is excerpted from: CHIGGERS!, Nina >Bicknese, THE MISSOURI CONSERVATIONIST, August, 1990, Volume 51, >Number 8, pages 2 - 5. > >Chigger facts: > Thanks for posting all this information. Knowing what we are dealing with is a big help when trying to counteract these tiny menaces. Personal experience also counts for a lot, and my experience with chiggers has shown me that Vick's Salve or Mentholatum Rub are both effective in immediately stopping the itch and making the redness go away. Perhaps they have some kind of pain reliever as one of the ingredients? Betty B ---- been there ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ We are like kids' art on God's refrigerator. - ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 11:40:49 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re; Queen Quality There has been a lot of postings this season regarding poor queen quality, with that in mind I feel I should share my experience with one hive this year, it might be some help. Early season I decided to make some increase in our production yard, we had a very serious winter and had lost some hives. So I made up a series of 4 frame nucs in our breeding yard, placed a queen cell in each as usual. I waited the necessary time till egg laying. The nucs were moved to our out yard and this is where the fun starts. On checking 3 days later,one hive, no eggs, no queen. So without thinking I added a mated queen in a cage in the usual way, thinking that perhaps she was lost on the move, 24 hrs later queen was released. I then checked 7 days later, no eggs, no queen and here is the serious point, the previous queen was a drone layer! Now I have a quandary, what to do? I elected to unite another nuc using the newspaper method! A few days later no queen, and they had taken the incoming queen's eggs and were making cells. By now I'm totally fed up with it, said "to hell with them, get on with it"! The cell emerged and it was a good sized queen but of unknown pedigree, but on examination the queen was damaged, but was laying a good pattern. For wings all she had were the stiff leading edges, all the trailing edge was gone, at the time I said to my wife I wonder if they will kill her? Sure enough a few days later, no queen, no eggs. Now we are waiting to see if another queen has been accepted and is laying. What is to be learned from this? Well, in the first place I should have noted the drone layer, and given them a virgin. That would be the natural thing, they were waiting for a virgin to emerge from a cell they had made. Or a lure of Bee Boost which would have convinced them they had a good queen. (That's another story) Or as a third, a frame of eggs from a viable queen which would have produced a queen but of unknown pedigree, which is where we almost ended up!!! So here we are some 3 moths later still undecided as to where this hive is, doubtful if we can get it through the winter, all because of a poorly mated queen. All I can say is I'm glad I got it and not a customer!!! **************************************************** * David Eyre 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, * * The Beeworks, Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1. * * beeworks@muskoka.net 705-326-7171 * * http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks * * Agents for: E H Thorne & B J Sherriff UK. * **************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 11:26:22 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Julie Puckett Subject: Looking for James Amrine? Comments: To: bee-l@uacsc2.albany.edu. If trying to contact James Amrine about some information he has on natural oils with mite control. Please let me know at my address. Thanks. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 20:59:37 -0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kevin & Ann Christensen Subject: Re: stinging the watch/ GLOVES I've made it a habit of wearing gloves after hearing that one occupational hazzard of long time beekeepers is dermititis caused by skin being exposed to propolis too often. Call it preventitive medicine. Besides, I don't like a sticky steering wheel. Kevin Christensen ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 23:28:12 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Tom Allen Subject: bee invasion of workshop, how to save them from death. This morning I left home quickly and failed to close my bee shop door. On return I found 1,000's of bees gorging themselves on my empptied super , work dishes etc that were honey laden.I thought they would go home when darkness fell. I find thsat they are clumping together in small bands, with heaps below the glass window while they haad not far to go to pass through the still open door. Many are hanging on the floursescent tubes, extinguished. It will be cold tonight and I fear than many will die. I plan to move them into a container tomorrow and take to my apiary.Closing the door to be sure! I am going to put a little heat on to keep them alive until dawn. Anyone have good suggestions for saving them please respond quickly ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 21:42:25 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Re: stinging the watch/ GLOVES > Besides, I don't like a sticky steering wheel. neither do I, but some of muy guys who wear gloves get *everything* sticky -- including the steering wheel. I carry a pail of water that I open in each yard to keep things clean (and to put out fires in emergencies). When i do use gloves, i wash my hands with them on periodically to keep them clen, otherwise they tend to get pretty disgusting. Regards Allen W. Allen Dick, Beekeeper VE6CFK RR#1, Swalwell, Alberta Canada T0M 1Y0 Internet:dicka@cuug.ab.ca & allend@internode.net Honey. Bees, & Art ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 10:04:41 -0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kevin & Ann Christensen Subject: Re: Allergy control and bee products > I am one of those who have been pleasantly surprised at the near cesssation > of asthma and hay fever while tending bees and consuming unusal amounts of > honey.For three years I have haad no asthma after 60 odd years of sheer > misery. > Recently we had an unusally high ragweed pollen count. For two days my > asthmas and coughing of phlegm probably allergic was frightening. Was it all > starting again? I used to suffer from hay fever all season long. For the last 2 1/2 years I've made sure to eat some honey every day. For the last two seasons, my allergy symptoms have been nonexistant until about the last week in August when I've had about 4 bad days. I think it must be the goldenrod and it only makes sense because I haven't been eating goldenrod honey. We only fill small containers for private and local sales during mid-season when the best floural sorces like clover and alfalfa are producing. As a concequence, I've made myself immune to those pollens . Next year, I'll have to make sure to bottle some late season honey ; eat that and see what happens the following late season. Kevin Christensen ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 11:06:11 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jerry J Bromenshenk Subject: Re: Bees knowing you,or your watch In-Reply-To: <960927232801_112873639@emout05.mail.aol.com> from "Tom Allen" at Sep 27, 96 11:28:01 pm I doubt that the LCD or ticking has anything to do with it. Bet your watch is dark with a dark band. Bet the same thing would happen if you sinply wore a similar colored band on your wrist. Took my watch off years ago. Glad when the black mustache turned grey. Still get hit around the edges of my glasses - they automatically turn dark and the bees go for them. Fortunately, as mentioned before, I have near total immunity - but I don't suggest that others not wear a veil. Jerry Bromenshenk jjbmail@selway.umt.edu ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 12:31:27 -0500 Reply-To: bbirkey@interaccess.com Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Barry Birkey Organization: Birkey.Com Subject: Re: Allergy control and bee products Kevin & Ann Christensen wrote: > I used to suffer from hay fever all season long. For the last 2 1/2 years > I've made sure to eat some honey every day. For the last two seasons, my > allergy symptoms have been nonexistant until about the last week in August > when I've had about 4 bad days. > > I think it must be the goldenrod and it only makes sense because I haven't > been eating goldenrod honey. We only fill small containers for private and Kevin - While I don't doubt the resistance of allergies to pollens from consuming local honey, everything that I've read would say that goldenrod is not an allergy producing plant as far as pollen is concerned. I stand to be corrected but the size and consistency of goldenrod pollen is of such that it will not become air born. Perhaps others have more info on this. -Barry -- Barry Birkey West Chicago, Illinois USA bbirkey@interaccess.com http://www.birkey.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 14:42:06 -0300 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Eunice D. Wonnacott" Subject: Re: Bees knowing you,or your watch Years ago, when I first began to keep bees, an old beekeeper warned me not to wear my wrist watch, or any other watch, as the bees were antagonized by it. I found they were always much calmer when the watch was left in the car. This was before battery watches, but the same appears true for them. I have always made it a habit to leave the watch in the car. I am allergic to bee venom, and had a bad experience with a yellow jacket this summer, so have reluctantly decided to stop the hobby. I have passed on my equipment, for donation to beginning beekeepers, and a friend will extract for me. It has been a wonderful hobby, the best of it being knowing so m any wonderful people. I will stay subscribed just for interest, for a while. By the way, I'm not sure if its imagination or not, but I have begun to wonder if I may also react to the "odors" from the hive. Just a deep breath over the super when the cover has just been removed, seemed to bring something like a mild allergic reaction, with thickening tongue and closing throat, for a short while. (Psychological or real??? I don't know). Thanks everyone Eunice "From the Cradle of Confederation" >In the past three years I have been stung many times,the most common is bees >crawling down between my jacket sleeve and by glove gaunlet.The crawl right >up to my LCD watach and hit me right under the band next tothe watch face.I >wonder if the bees are annoyed by a sound frequency that we do not hear. > >Comments anyone. Yes I know I have to do something about the jacket matching >the gauntlet,Velcro in a complete loop is my approach for 1997 season > > ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 14:45:58 -0300 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Eunice D. Wonnacott" Subject: Re: Bees knowing you,or your watch My watch would have been under several layers of clothing, and colour, I expect, had nothing to do with it. Eunice >I doubt that the LCD or ticking has anything to do with it. Bet your >watch is dark with a dark band. Bet the same thing would happen if you >sinply wore a similar colored band on your wrist. > >Took my watch off years ago. Glad when the black mustache turned grey. >Still get hit around the edges of my glasses - they automatically turn >dark and the bees go for them. Fortunately, as mentioned before, I have >near total immunity - but I don't suggest that others not wear a veil. > >Jerry Bromenshenk >jjbmail@selway.umt.edu > > ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 17:35:04 GMT Reply-To: Tim_Sterrett@westtown.edu Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Tim Sterrett Organization: Westtown School Subject: Allergy control and bee products I've been keeping bees for twenty-five years and have not noticed any change in my hay fever and asthma that I could connect with bees or honey. Allergies change with age, changes in hormone balance, and changes in medication, I think. And no two summers have the same weather. The plants I know I am allergic to are wind-pollinated, not insect-pollinated. Goldenrod has sticky pollen; bees and wasps collect it. I do not think many people come into contact with goldenrod pollen. Tim Tim Sterrett Westtown, (Southeastern) Pennsylvania, USA tim_sterrett@westtown.edu 39*55'N 75*33'W ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 17:46:47 GMT Reply-To: Tim_Sterrett@westtown.edu Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Tim Sterrett Organization: Westtown School Subject: gloves New beekeepers should remember that many of the old-timers on this newslist used gloves when they began keeping bees. And many of us will use gloves if gloves will keep us from getting a lot of stings. If I had to hive a swarm that I knew had been hanging up for several days, I would get out the gloves. If I had to take apart a hive at night in the rain, I would get out the gloves. Many of us are able to work the bees on sunny days when the bees are busy working. At these times, gloves may not be necessary and working without gloves is easier (and cooler in hot weather). Tim Tim Sterrett Westtown, (Southeastern) Pennsylvania, USA tim_sterrett@westtown.edu 39*55'N 75*33'W ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 20:05:59 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Darlene Scribilo Subject: reactions to bee stings and FORAPIN In respect of the posting entitled "Immune Reactions to Stings" by Nik Mohamed Abdulmajid FORAPIN has been on the market since 1934 and is manufactured by the Heinrich Mack Nachf., in Illertissen, Germany. It contains honey bee venom and is available in cream, liniment and injection forms. It is distributed in eight countries. The manufacturer recommends it for arthritis, Sudeck-syndrome, myositis, tendonitis, bursitis, polyarthritis, spondylitis, sport injuries, etc. (Schluter, et al., 1981). There is only one case when the administration of FORAPIN (cream or liniment) was recommended by the manufacturer for treatment of allergic symptoms. It is documented by Laurentiu, B. et al., 1976. The paper describes the patient experiencing a strong local reaction after his/her first injection of bee venom. The manufacturer recommended continuing the treatment with bee venom cream or liniment and discontinuing the administration by injection. The patient's sensitivity to bee venom will decrease within a couple weeks and the treatment by injection can be resumed. On those days when the patient does not receive injections, it is recommended to use bee venom cream or liniment on the affected area. The use of Forapin for allergy test purposes before the commencement of bee sting therapy may not be the best means of testing. It is known that the administration of bee venom in cream or liniment forms does result in the absorption of minute amounts of venom into the body. This amount can be as small as the quantity used to determine allergic reactions to venom. Some of the other ingredients in the cream may cause symptoms similar to bee venom (redness, warm sensation and itchiness). This may confuse an inexperienced individual starting with bee venom therapy. A cream or liniment may not be the best way to determine the sensitivity to bee venom, but it can lessen the local symptoms during the treatment. References Laurentiu, B. et al. (1976) "Apitherapy Products and Their Use" (in Apitherapy Today), Apimondia Publishing House, Bucharest, Romania (in English, French, Spanish, German and Hungarian) Schluter, H., Mucke, H.W. and Pietrzik, E. Dr. (1981) Heilkraft aus der Biene fur die Medizin, Heinrich Mack Nachf. publ., pp. 32 (in German) Michael Simics Apitronic Services dags@wimsey.com P.S. FORAPIN cream and other apitherapy aids are available through Apitronic Services (604)-271-9414. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 17:11:04 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Joel Govostes Subject: Re: Re; Queen Quality The word locally (central NY) is that supersedure was remarkably common this year, for some strange reason. I had a few colonies which were doing great, building up with first-season queens (some reared, some bought), only to find the queen GONE after filling the hive with a beautiful brood pattern. Supersedure/emergency queen cells would be scattered through nice solid patches of sealed brood. However, no eggs or young larvae. No swarming involved, either. I mentioned this to a friend running abt 200 colonies up north of here and he mentioned that he and others had been seeing much the same thing. Could this be more than coincidence? Possibly related to the Apistan...? Hmm. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 17:15:17 -0500 Reply-To: bbirkey@interaccess.com Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Barry Birkey Organization: Birkey.Com Subject: Re: gloves Tim Sterrett wrote: > > New beekeepers should remember that many of the old-timers on this > newslist used gloves when they began keeping bees. And many of us will use > gloves if gloves will keep us from getting a lot of stings. If I had to hive > a swarm that I knew had been hanging up for several days, I would get out the > gloves. If I had to take apart a hive at night in the rain, I would get out > the gloves. > Many of us are able to work the bees on sunny days when the bees are busy > working. At these times, gloves may not be necessary and working without > gloves is easier (and cooler in hot weather). > Tim > Tim Sterrett > Westtown, (Southeastern) Pennsylvania, USA > tim_sterrett@westtown.edu > 39*55'N 75*33'W Tim - I agree whole heartedly. Some of us (myself) do beekeeping as a hobby and cannot afford some stings on the hand as it greatly affects my day-to-day business. I too will use gloves most of the time but will do with out when I know the risk is low. Most times you just get a feel for the bees as to how their temperment will be. I do residential remodeling five days a week and getting stung on the finger tips and then having to use the hand the next day can be quite unpleasant. A sting on the back of the hand is no problem though. I recall a situation this last summer when I was out with a friend at one of his yards to check on the condition of his hives. I suited up and had my veil on but decided to leave my gloves off as I was just going to observe while he did the manipulations. As soon as he cracked the inner cover of the first hive, the bees shot out the top with a very strong buzz. I immediately stepped back away from the hive. As soon as I did, I had several bees pounding on my veil. I had my hands in my pocket but yet that is the first place they went for. The first sting was right through the pocket on my hand. When I made the mistake of taking my hand out of my pocket to get the gloves in my back pocket, new flesh was attacked. As I was still walking away from the hives, I managed to get the gloves on but the gauntlets were still bunched around my wrists. I finally got in the pick-up truck and one by one killed off the bees. I ended up with at least a dozen stings around my wrists and lower arm. Things tend to happen very fast when you least expect it. I tend to be better prepared for the unexpected these days. Beekeeping is not my livelihood so I don't spend near the amount of time handling bees as those whose livelihood it is. I do agree with those who say that by not wearing gloves forces them to be more "in tune" with the bees and tend to work "with" the bees not just work the bees. That's my experience. -Barry -- Barry Birkey West Chicago, Illinois USA bbirkey@interaccess.com http://www.birkey.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 17:47:29 -0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kevin & Ann Christensen Subject: Re: Allergy control and bee products Comments: To: Tim_Sterrett@westtown.edu > The plants I know I am allergic to are wind-pollinated, not > insect-pollinated. Goldenrod has sticky pollen; bees and wasps collect it. > I do not think many people come into contact with goldenrod pollen. > Tim > Tim Sterrett The allergy symptoms that I experience and attribute to goldenrod occur while working the bees (pulling honey). I also notice it while extracting and filling barrels with this late honey. Is it possible that this pollen could become airborn during these times even though its a sticky pollen? If I stay away from the bees and the honey house during these times, I don't experience the symptoms. Kevin Christensen ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 16:20:55 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jerry Fries Subject: Re: bee invasion of workshop, how to save them from death. >This morning I left home quickly and failed to close my bee shop door. On >return I found 1,000's of bees gorging themselves on my empptied super , work >dishes etc that were honey laden.I thought they would go home when darkness >fell. I find thsat they are clumping together in small bands, with heaps >below the glass window while they haad not far to go to pass through the >still open door. Many are hanging on the floursescent tubes, extinguished. It >will be cold tonight and I fear than many will die. >I plan to move them into a container tomorrow and take to my apiary.Closing >the door to be sure! I am going to put a little heat on to keep them alive >until dawn. > >Anyone have good suggestions for saving them please respond quickly I cant see what youve got but they should be ok as long as they have some food in their belly.I have gone out And brushed them into a container and give them WARM food , Keep them in the dark so they wont fly when they warm up. When they warm up they will fly to any light like windows or cracks in doors. In the morning when the temp is above 45 degrees take them outside so they can decide what to do. the ones who will not go home try marrying to some other hive. It seems as though every year when I sell packages novices will not follow instructions and wind up with bees too cold to reach food and often even appear dead.In that case I also spray them with thin warm syrup. Hope I helped, If Im on the right track for you you can call again for more cold weather tid bits. Nothing works every time but are pretty good odds. Jerry Fries ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 19:39:19 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Victor M. Kroenke" Subject: Re: bee invasion of workshop, how to save them from death. Tom Allen wrote: > > This morning I left home quickly and failed to close my bee shop door. On > return I found 1,000's of bees gorging themselves on my empptied super , work > dishes etc that were honey laden.I thought they would go home when darkness > fell. I find thsat they are clumping together in small bands, with heaps > below the glass window while they haad not far to go to pass through the > still open door. Many are hanging on the floursescent tubes, extinguished. It > will be cold tonight and I fear than many will die. > I plan to move them into a container tomorrow and take to my apiary.Closing > the door to be sure! I am going to put a little heat on to keep them alive > until dawn. > > Anyone have good suggestions for saving them please respond quickly Cover all windows with cardboard on the outside so no light comes through. Open the door to the daylight and stand back. Most of the bees should be gone in a very few minutes provided the temperature is warm enough. This worked for me one time when I pulled a similar trick. Good Luck, Vic Kroenke ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 16:31:50 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jerry Fries Subject: Re: Re; Queen Quality I am not a big time bee supplier but I have several customers.When I gaet a abd queen or other situation I really dont feel too bad but If one of my customers(friends) gets a bad queen I feel terrible.Because I feel so bad it makes me study to find out what happened so next time It will be better. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 16:41:29 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jerry Fries Subject: Re: bee invasion of workshop, how to save them from death. >This morning I left home quickly and failed to close my bee shop door. On >return I found 1,000's of bees gorging themselves on my empptied super , work >dishes etc that were honey laden.I thought they would go home when darkness >fell. I find thsat they are clumping together in small bands, with heaps >below the glass window while they haad not far to go to pass through the >still open door. Many are hanging on the floursescent tubes, extinguished. It >will be cold tonight and I fear than many will die. >I plan to move them into a container tomorrow and take to my apiary.Closing >the door to be sure! I am going to put a little heat on to keep them alive >until dawn. > >Anyone have good suggestions for saving them please respond quickly They should be ok if they have some food in thie r belly but you may want to brush them into a conatiner and spray them with WARM thin syrup,Keep them in total dark and the when the outside temp is above 45 take them outside and see what they do. I sent a previous message but my computer did not wrok right I have lots ofways to work with cold bees . I this message works Ill send another Jerry Fries ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 11:05:47 +1100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Chris Allen Subject: Re: Bees knowing you,or your watch At 11:28 PM 27/09/96 -0400, you wrote: > ... up to my LCD watach and hit me right under the band next tothe watch face.I >wonder if the bees are annoyed by a sound frequency that we do not hear. I used to be stung in a similar fasion when I wore an oridiary mecanical wtach. I thaught the smell of perspration was more significant. I used to make a point of taking my watch off. Regards Chris Allen ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 00:59:42 GMT Reply-To: Tim_Sterrett@westtown.edu Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Tim Sterrett Organization: Westtown School Subject: Re: gloves > I finally got in the pick-up truck and one by one killed off the bees. What happened to the other person? (the one who was holding the hive cover?) Tim Tim Sterrett Westtown, (Southeastern) Pennsylvania, USA tim_sterrett@westtown.edu 39*55'N 75*33'W ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 22:13:10 -0300 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Stan Sandler Subject: Re: Yellow jackets >The non-reproductives (workers) and old queen perish soon after frost. I find it curious that with their colony cycle nearing its end the yellow jackets are working furiously. They are robbing from any weak colonies or late nucs that don't have entrances well reduced, and there are masses of them around the honey house or any supers on the truck. They vastly outnumber the bald faced hornets now, and they also seem to be considerably smaller than they were earlier in the season. I wish the bees had their ability to work in poor weather. They fly in the rain, and they are flying from first light to late dusk. Unlike bumblebees they are roughly the same size as honeybees, so I wonder how they manage to tolerate the cool temperatures. Of course snow fleas are pretty small and put all of them to shame! Have a nice day, Stan ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 20:17:13 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Maynard R. Thompson" Subject: Re: stinging the watch Comments: To: Allen Dick In-Reply-To: It would be possible that a reason for bees to sting at the watch could be because of a combination of perspiration collecting under the band and in the band (leather "or" metal) as well as the polished reflective surface of the crystal attracting the bees to the site, like a point of intrest sign. Just add in a little bee claustrophobia and and your about,--- 70% (by my scientific estimate) "margin for error 30%--- certain that you will have a sudden awareness of at least one publicly disturbed bee! All in good humor, but I think it likely.... Best to you all, Maynard mthompso@MAIL.coin.missouri.edu ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 17:09:17 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jerry Fries Subject: Re: bee invasion of workshop, how to save them from death. I think my last message went through.Tom you Know a lot more about bees than I do but because of our area I may have some info that would be of interest.First as you know when cold bees cluster to stay warm,they need a large enough cluster to circulate and food in the area they can cover. They will not separate from the cluster to get food unless the temp is approx 43 degrees so help them make as large a ball as possable and make sure they are on top of food. Next bees will not fly in RED light so if you need heat or if you want to work bees in the dark use dim red light.Enginuity and effort will help you use these Ideas. Also When bees get really cold they get very suggish They may even look dead but dont give up.Gently brush them into something,take them inside and spray them with WARM thin syrup.and keep them in the dark.most will revive. But remmember they need food that they can reach.A box with three frames gives them the ability to cluster naturally. th food needs to be above the cluster because heat rises. You can work with these bees in a totally dark room under a red christmas tree light bulb. Best wishes Jerrry Fries ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 17:14:52 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jerry Fries Subject: Re: Bees knowing you,or your watch Bees respond to magnetic north,they also respond to electromagnetic frequencies and high pitched sound.I think it is an intreging idea that they may respond to frequencies emited by a crystal watch or an electric watch useing a cyrstal display. why dont we do some work and find out? Jerry Fries ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 11:30:44 +1100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Chris Allen Subject: Re: stinging the watch At 08:17 PM 29/09/96 -0500, you wrote: > ... perspiration collecting under the band (leather "or" metal) it was rubber (a diver's watch) Regards Chris Allen ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 21:37:36 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Dave Green, Eastern Pollinator Newsletter" Subject: Re: Allergy control and bee products In a message dated 96-09-29 12:40:34 EDT, kchristensen@ccinet.ab.ca (Kevin Christensen) writes: << I used to suffer from hay fever all season long. For the last 2 1/2 years I've made sure to eat some honey every day. For the last two seasons, my allergy symptoms have been nonexistant until about the last week in August when I've had about 4 bad days. I think it must be the goldenrod and it only makes sense because I haven't been eating goldenrod honey. (snip)>> I doubt that it is possible to have a respiratory allergy to goldenrod, rather to ragweed, which blooms at the same time. Ragweed pollen is light and fluffy, and can travel by air for many miles. Goldenrod is the showy flower in bloom at that time, so it is blamed. But goldenrod pollen is heavy and sticky. It cannot become airborne. The only way to get it on your nasal passages is to stick a flower up your nose. I am personally convinced that honey, and particularly raw honey does help in a general way to support the immune system. Like Kevin, hundreds of others also report it to be true, in their experience. It is not a miracle cure, but just a mild benefit. Allergies are false or excessive reactions of our immune system (likewise arthritis and a number of other diseases). The pollens in raw honey may be a factor, but specifics are hard to pin down. Would it be necessary to eat the exact same pollen that is causing your problem? I don't think so. What about allergies to molds? I do have trouble with these (like in cleaning up a deadout). I notice that I have fewer respiratory problems and illnesses when I eat honey every day. It doesn't always work, but it seems to help reduce the number of times I'm affected, and the severity of the effect. I also used to have pretty strong reactions to poison ivy. Now, as a beekeeper, I'm often wading through the vines, but haven't had a reaction in years. It's sad that we can't get much serious study on these effects. If one could get exclusive rights to the sale of honey as a medicine, and charge 22.95 for an ounce of it, I'm sure there would be research. -A flaw in our system, perhaps. There are many things in our environment that are attacking our immune system, many of them quite unnatural. I like to think I am supporting and strengthening mine wherever I can. Honey is part of a total picture of my attempt to be healthier. When I was a young child, we couldn't afford meat; we ate from the garden and the hedgerows. Then, when we prospered, we ate beef....and more beef. I am trying to get away from the beef, and go back. I definitely feel better when I do. I try to eat plenty of fruits, nuts, veggies, and grains, while cutting back on red meats, don't smoke.......and eat plenty of honey. That's not lunatic fringe; it's just common sense. I may be hit by a truck, but I'm trying to be responsible. Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green, PO Box 1200, Hemingway, SC 29554 (Dave & Jan's Pollination Service, Pot o'Gold Honey Co.) Practical Pollination Home Page Dave & Janice Green http://users.aol.com/pollinator/polpage1.html *They say it is an adult's right to choose. They give lip-service to protecting the children. If it's Democrats, they're probably talking about pornography. If it's Republicans, tobacco. I guess I can choose the lesser of two evils. But I wish I could find a leader to admire! Please God, give us a leader who will really protect our children, born and unborn, and protect the environment too, one who has not sold him or her self to powerful interests that work for profit to the detriment of our society.* ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 22:11:16 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Bill Miller Subject: Stinging insect allergies Eunice D. Wonnacott writes of giving up beekeepiung due to a bad experience with a yellowjacket (sting?). While I was being desenitized to assorted insect venoms (including honeybees and yellow hornets). I pumped my allergist about cross allergies. Her reply was that the venoms from the different stinging insects were all different, and that how a person reacted to one venom was not a good predictor of how one would respond to any other venom. The venoms used for testing/desensitization were specific to each stinging insect of interest. Summary: Being allergic to one stinging insect does not mean you are allergic to any other stinging insect. W. G. Miller Gaithersburg, MD ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 22:11:22 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Bill Miller Subject: On gloves As long as we are on the subject of beekeeping gloves, here is my own two cents. I generally don't use gloves, but I keep a set in my bee tool pail, and there are times when using them makes the difference between being able to get a necessary job done and getting chased away by a hyper-defensive colony. I have one such colony just now, and I don't think I could have split it into more workable sections without gloves. True, beekeeping gloves are clumsy, but I don't try anything delicate with them. Also, gloves should be worn when working with Apistan strips. However, if a colony' behavior forces me to use gloves, that colony is marked for requeening. Beekeeping is supposed to be fun, and hyper-defensive colonies are definitely not fun. W. G. Miller Gaithersburg, MD ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 22:20:56 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Ronald E Baker Subject: Flipping Bees Today I witnessed a behavior in my honey bees which I had never seen before. The weather at noon was sunny, approx 70 degrees. The hive was in full sun. The bees were coming back to the hive heavy with pollen. The unusual behavior I observed involved bees departing to the field for more nectar/pollen. As I was watching the hive, a departing bee would appear at the entrance, immediately flip over on her back, wiggle her legs fiercely for about one second, then flip back over on to her feet and take off for the field. I estimate 10% of the departing bees performed this "flip", and continued to behave in this way for at least the 20 minutes I watched. Could this behavior be a form of communication? Ronald E Baker baker@mail.multiverse.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 20:09:15 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Christopher Carrigan Subject: Honey Pallets (Request for info) We are using wooden honey pallets when we bring the honey into the heat room. I have always thought that a pallet made in one piece out of nylon or plastic (similar to those white cutting boards), would be the ideal. No leaking, easy to clean, durable etc. Is something like this available out there? Christopher ________________________________________________________ Christopher Carrigan carrigan@cyberstore.ca Arras, B.C. V0C 1B0 Canada (604) 843-7205 ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 22:31:22 -0500 Reply-To: bbirkey@interaccess.com Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Barry Birkey Organization: Birkey.Com Subject: Re: gloves Tim Sterrett wrote: > > > I finally got in the pick-up truck and one by one killed off the bees. > > What happened to the other person? (the one who was holding the hive cover?) > Tim Well, of course 'he' came away without one sting. He had his gloves on from the start. After I got in the truck he kindly started the smoker and handed it to me in the truck. He closed the hive back up and we took off. We cleared the remaining bees out with the windows down going 40 mph. Oddly enough, a week later I talked to him and he said he had to move the hives as the owner of the farm had gotten stung several times from the same hive (he keeps all his hives on trailers and moves them around as needed). A few weeks ago he told me finally requeened that hive. -Barry -- Barry Birkey West Chicago, Illinois USA bbirkey@interaccess.com http://www.birkey.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 21:54:00 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Andy Nachbaur Organization: WILD BEE'S BBS (209) 826-8107 LOS BANOS, CA Subject: Re: Bees knowing you,or your watch JJB>I doubt that the LCD or ticking has anything to do with it. Bet your >watch is dark with a dark band. Bet the same thing would happen if you >sinply wore a similar colored band on your wrist. Hello Jerry, IMHO..It's the moisture and salt that attracts the bees to a wrist watch, or any other area of the body that is moist and salty including some private parts if the bees can get to them. The bees normally are not intent on stinging these areas, but in our normal movements they become injured and attack as a last effort setting the area up with the sting and alarm odors that others are attracted and attack also. I have watched the bees bite down on these wet areas and cause enough pain that you would sware you had been stung, and if the bee is left alone she will continue to bore in attempting to do what I don't know what. Maybe hunk off a bit of salty flesh. In any case 2nd only to someone getting stung on his privates the show beekeepers put on when a bee crawls up a pant leg into the trespass territory that has never been caught on film, if it had I am sure that film would win a acme award for natural humor. A good test of the wrist watch observation is in those helpers in the past who have had fancy leather covers, the bees would seldom sting the leather that one would think would make an inviting target but they normally go for the area of exposed skin between the band and skin. Over the years I have been stung and bitten enough by my bees and others to know the difference and when I should stop everything and drop my BVD's to remove a stinger or just keep working until a better time. JJB>Took my watch off years ago. Glad when the black mustache turned >Still get hit around the edges of my glasses - they automatically turn >dark and the bees go for them. Fortunately, as mentioned before, I have >near total immunity - but I don't suggest that others not wear a veil. It is always a wise idea for anyone who works in agriculture to leave the watch at home or in the truck for farm safety reasons and grater enjoyment of a un rushed work place. I went through a 100 dollar pocket watches before I learned that there was never going to be enough bee time in this life to get it all done by the clock anyway. ttul, OLd Drone (c) Permission is granted to freely copy this document in any form, or to print for any use. (w)Opinions are not necessarily facts. Use at own risk. --- ~ QMPro 1.53 ~ http://www/kusi.se/~beeman/ ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 21:54:00 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Andy Nachbaur Organization: WILD BEE'S BBS (209) 826-8107 LOS BANOS, CA Subject: gloves TS> New beekeepers should remember that many of the old-timers on this >newslist used gloves when they began keeping bees. Hi Tim, Not all old-times started with gloves, I never used gloves as a newbee, and I got my first job in the commercial bees because like a crazy high school kid I was when I spotted a beekeeper working in his bees I had the school bus stop and went over to see what he was doing with out any thought of showing any fear of the bees or the punishment I was going to get. I took a little punishment that day because I had low top shoes on and the bees liked my dirty socks for sure. But I did get my first opportunity to work in the bee's for a large family of commercial beekeepers and stayed with it until I had enough bees of my own to support myself and keep me off the streets. Even at $35.00 a week it only took about 8 years. I also got my first pair of work boots shortly after starting in the bees. >And many of us will use gloves if gloves will keep us from getting >a lot of stings. If I had to hive > Many of us are able to work the bees on sunny days when the bees are bus >working. At these times, gloves may not be necessary and working without >gloves is easier (and cooler in hot weather). I use a good smoker and hive tool and normally only have a baseball cap covering the skin on my head. BUT I always take my bee hat and veil out of the truck when I light the smoker and have it ready if needed. I also keep a pair of dill gloves in each truck and some time use special bee gauntlets that protect the arms, wrists, and the back of the hands. I gave up on the fancy leather gloves after finding out that the mice love to eat on them in the winter and the holes they leave offer little protection from the bees. Believe it or not a few years ago I needed a veil real bad and was I surprised to find after carrying it around for years the screen had rotted away. I guess I had spilled my water jug on it one too many times or something. I also keep a spare veil, hive tool, and smoker in each truck as nothing spoils a good bee day like when you forget one or the other in the last bee yard twenty miles back down the road. I can assure all that there are several areas of the US that not to have a veil on and a good smoker that works invites a real hot time in the bees. The south west desert rat and northern Mexico beekeepers actually pride themselves on the temper of their bees and will tell you that it keeps down the bee thefts, and this was 50 years ago as true as it is today with the advent of the so called "Tex-Mex" bee, you know the one's from Egypt but not Africa. ttul, OLd Drone (c) Permission is granted to freely copy this document in any form, or to print for any use. (w)Opinions are not necessarily facts. Use at own risk. --- ~ QMPro 1.53 ~ "Where there are fruits & nuts, there are beekeepers" ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 04:54:09 GMT Reply-To: johntrn@ldd.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: John Taylor Subject: Re: Bees knowing you,or your watch In-Reply-To: <960929213904634@beenet.com> On Sun, 29 Sep 1996 21:54:00 GMT, you wrote: IMHO..It's the moisture and salt that attracts the bees to a wrist watch, >or any other area of the body that is moist and salty including some >private parts if the bees can get to them. The bees normally are not >intent on stinging these areas, but in our normal movements they become >injured and attack as a last effort setting the area up with the sting >and alarm odors that others are attracted and attack also. Hi Andy, I had the experience this summer of checking elevations for excavation of the walk-out basement for my new house. The temperatures were in the 90's and I was sweating. My bees, the hive was almost 200 yards to the West, kept coming to visit me. At any one time I would have somewhere between two to four bees on my hands, arms or legs. The girls on my hands would very actively seek something with there tongues, especially in cracks, ie, between fingernail and skin. I wondered if it wasn't sweat/salt they were after. John Taylor Southeast Missouri Wild Rose Creek Apiary ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 09:25:01 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Morten Brixtofte Petersen Subject: Re: Yellow jackets Hi all! Stan Sandler wrote:"I find it curious that with their colony cycle nearing its end the yellow jackets are working furiously. They are robbing from any weak colonies or...." I heard this explanation of Yellow jackets quest for sweets: They feed their larvaes with meat (carcasses, larvaes of other insects etc.). In return the Yellow jacket larvae is producing a sweet substance (honeydew?). This sweet substance is the only thing that makes the yellow jackets care for their larvae. When brood rearing slows down/ends in autumn they seek for sweet experiences elsewhere. Regards Morten ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 07:28:06 EDT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Kevin D. Parsons" <102372.624@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Re: Flipping Bees > Today I witnessed a behavior in my honey bees which I had never seen before. > The weather at noon was sunny, approx 70 degrees. The hive was in full sun. > The bees were coming back to the hive heavy with pollen. > > The unusual behavior I observed involved bees departing to the field for > more nectar/pollen. As I was watching the hive, a departing bee would > appear at the entrance, immediately flip over on her back, wiggle her legs > fiercely for about one second, then flip back over on to her feet and take > off for the field. I estimate 10% of the departing bees performed this > "flip", and continued to behave in this way for at least the 20 minutes I > watched. > > Could this behavior be a form of communication? I think that what the bee is trying to communicate is that the landing board is wet. The passage through the hive entrance seems to involve a certain amount of twisting and turning. You hardly notice it, unless the surface is wet, a wing touches the board and the bee gets stuck for a bit. Kevin D. Parsons ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 14:15:23 GMT+2 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: MIKE ALLSOPP Organization: N.I.P.B VREDENBURG Subject: bee asso. addresses Greetings all I have had a request from our local (South African) beekeepers association for the addresses of equivalent bodies in a number of countries. I don't have this info; can anybody(ies) in the various countries represented on BEE-L help me with the information, please. What I am looking for is the postal address of the national beekeeping association in each of the following countries: USA, Canada, Mexico, Brazil, Argentina, Chile, UK, Netherlands, France, Germany, Italy, Turkey, Australia, New Zealand Many thanks Mike Allsopp Mike Allsopp tel (27)(21) 887-4690 Honeybee Research Section fax (27)(21) 883-3285 Plant Protection Research Institute pmail plant3/vredma Agricultural Research Council email vredma@plant3.agric.za P/Bag X5017 Stellenbosch 7599 South Africa ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 10:20:06 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Robin Wells Subject: Re: Bees knowing you,or your watch > I agree 100 percent. In working with other beekeepers I have very > rarely seen wearing gloves and sensitive (to the bees) manipulations. > Gloves almost always seem to go with bad tempered bees. I can work the > same hive without gloves and rerely ever get stung. I agree, although I have often wondered if it is our sensitivity to the temperament of the bees, or are we simply more gentle and cautious in our tampering? As we ourselves are at higher risk is it not possible we consciously or unconsciously are more gently with the colony? If so is it not also possible that this directly affects their reactions? Having said that, weather and time of day also has a big impact as we all know. I have noticed that gloves do make an impact, I always attributed it to the above though. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 15:54:57 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Adrian Wenner Subject: Re: Gloves, watches, and stings Joel Govostes wrote: >Gloves - use them or don't? I must admit that I do, regularly. Shame on >me. About the only situations when I don't are when I am working on weak >colonies or nuc's. > >I'm not sure when I started using them again on a regular basis. I do know >that I still get stung. ..... When you are restricted to working bees only at >certain times, and you can't control the weather, gloves can make otherwise >unmanageable manipulations "do-able." And you don't end up with propolis >all over your fingers. You can often work a little faster as well. > >Beyond that, gloves will hang on to the venom-scent and I'm convinced this >can get otherwise-agreeable bees riled. ...... ****** I virtually never use gloves. If one does not have much hair on the hands, attacking bees almost always alight but do not grip hard. Also, I feel Joel is correct, "...gloves will hang on to the venom-scent..." For instance, a beekeeper helped me once on my research project, at which time we found the bees especially testy. Then I asked him about the strong odor on his gloves, to which he responded that he used them when applying BEE-GO. Benzaldehyde in small doses certainly does not placate bees! One way around odor retention on gloves is to use disposable surgical gloves for fine work (as I have posted on this net before). They cost only a couple of cents apiece. The bees don't seem to be able to get a good enough grip on the latex to push their stingers through and into the skin. ****** I ALWAYS remove my watch (and any shiny objects) before working bees. If one looks at a Casio watch from a bee's perspective, for instance, one may recognize a little black head with two shiny bright eyes --- a likely predator. No wonder so many people get stung in the area near the watch! And, of course, watch bands concentrate sweat odor. Adrian Adrian M. Wenner (805) 893-2838 (UCSB office) Ecol., Evol., & Marine Biology (805) 893-8062 (UCSB FAX) Univ. of Calif., Santa Barbara (805) 963-8508 (home office & FAX) Santa Barbara, CA 93106 ************************************************************************* * "The difference between real and unreal things is that unreal things * * usually last much longer." Pot-Shots #6728 * * Copyright, Ashleigh Brilliant --- used with permission * ************************************************************************* ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 09:34:55 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: James Amrine Subject: Re: bee invasion of workshop, how to save them from death. At 11:28 PM 9/28/96 -0400, you wrote: >This morning I left home quickly and failed to close my bee shop door. On >return I found 1,000's of bees gorging themselves on my empptied super , work >dishes etc that were honey laden.I thought they would go home when darkness >fell. I find thsat they are clumping together in small bands, with heaps >below the glass window while they haad not far to go to pass through the >still open door. Many are hanging on the floursescent tubes, extinguished. It >will be cold tonight and I fear than many will die. >I plan to move them into a container tomorrow and take to my apiary.Closing >the door to be sure! I am going to put a little heat on to keep them alive >until dawn. > >Anyone have good suggestions for saving them please respond quickly > Modify a shop-vac or other vacuum device to suck up the bees. Make sure the inside is screened so bees are not harmed. Then take them to a bee yard. Sincerely, Jim Amrine Division of Plant & Soil Sciences P. O. Box 6108, West Virginia University Morgantown, WV 26506-6108 <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> <> Telephone: 304-293-6023 <> <> Fax: 304-293-2960 <> <> web: http://www.wvu.edu/~agexten/varroa.htm <> <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> ------------------END OF FILE------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 09:36:32 EDT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jim Moore Subject: Re: Gloves I'm a first year beekeeper and have switched to disposable latex gloves. I buy a box of a hundred at the local pharmacy. They offer much better feel and the bees don't seem to sting the latex as fast as bare skin. The bees were all over the leather gloves it used, more so as the gloves got dirtier. The latex also avoids sticky hands from the propolis on hot days. I use then once and throw them away which provides excellent hygiene. I also used them when I extracted and it was great. I think the best feature though is that removing the occational stinger is quick and easy. You just pull the latex away from the skin and out comes the stinger. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 09:03:24 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: RICHARD BARNES Subject: Coincidence????????? >The word locally (central NY) is that supersedure was remarkably common >this year, for some strange reason. I had a few colonies which were doing >great, building up with first-season queens (some reared, some bought), >only to find the queen GONE after filling the hive with a beautiful brood >pattern. Supersedure/emergency queen cells would be scattered through nice >solid patches of sealed brood. However, no eggs or young larvae. No >swarming involved, either. >I mentioned this to a friend running abt 200 colonies up north of here and >he mentioned that he and others had been seeing much the same thing. Could >this be more than coincidence? Possibly related to the Apistan...? Hmm. > > I know it is very possibly a coincidence, I treated with apistan strips from June 23 through August 3 this year (between spring and fall honey flows) and with in three weeks, four out of ten hives had no queen or eggs. I caught all but one before the moths got there. Of the new queens I ordered to place in these hives, two took and one killed the queen. I put the queens in the hives and 72 hours released the ones that the bees had not already released. Of the queens I lost this year, counting early losses for a total of 6, all either obsconded after laying 2-3 frames of brood or were killed by the bees. Five were new queens this year and one was a swarm I caught about 1 and one half mile from my bee yard. One of the interesting points is I had no queen cells in the hives. It is like they became queenless some where past the point of taking eggs and making a new queen themselves. I am begining to wonder if there is a new chemical on the pesticide market that the bees more readily bring into the hive. When I open a hive and find only capped brood and no other phases ( ie. no eggs or young brood) I wonder if the pesticide only kills where vapor can get on the young larvae and adults and if the hive stays looking busy as the brood hatches then falls off real quick. Where I lost 2 out of the 4 recent losses, I lost the bees flying south and the bees flying north are OK. I know the bees will go where they want but on most days that is the direction I saw them flying. Richard Barnes rbarnes@halnet.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 11:05:27 EDT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Ted Wout <102336.711@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Need an e-mail address David Eyre wrote: >> Send a message to the listserv address you used to sign on to bee-L >> with >> >> REVIEW BEE-L >> >> as the only message. >> >> You'll get a list of all subscribers, other than those who have >> requested that their names not be listed. > >Sorry, this info is incorret. I recently asked for review Bee-L and was told >by Eric (Listserv) that I was not authorised. It seems that the command was >rescinded as the junk mail people were abusing it. I just sent a REVIEW BEE-L to the listserver and got the list back so it does work. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 09:58:03 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Whitney S. Cranshaw" Subject: Benefits of fall feeding? A beekeeping neighbor of mine asked about the benefits of fall feeding. He wants his hives to go into the winter in as good shape as possible. Yet he has heard that feeding at this time might stimulate brood production in an untimely manner. The hives are located in Colorado, USA which has fairly harsh winters. Any comments? Whitney Cranshaw wcransha@ceres.agsci.colostate.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 12:12:26 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Markus Huurman Subject: Re: bee asso. addresses Comments: To: MIKE ALLSOPP Dear Bee-l readers, The address for the Dutch beekeeping association is as follows: Vereniging tot Bevordering van de Bijenteelt (=Association for the Promotion of Beekeeping) Visitor's address: Mail address: Grintweg 273 P.O. Box 90 6704 AP Wageningen 6720 AB Bennekom The Netherlands The Netherlands phone +31-317-422422 fax +31-317424180 They also sell beekeeping supplies, phone +31-317-422733. Addresses of other asso. might perhaps be obtained via the International Bee Research Association (IBRA@CARDIFF.AC.UK) if no other replies will follow. I don't know if there are sites on the web where a list is given, maybe other readers know? I would be interesed as well to receive the address of the South African association. Kind regards, Markus Huurman purchasing manager m.huurman@koppert.nl | ___ _ _ _ _ _ ___ KOPPERT B.V. |/__/ / \ |_) |_) |_ |_) | Berkel en Rodenrijs |\__\ \_/ | | |_ | \ | The Netherlands (EU) Telephone: +31-10-5140444 B I O L O G I C A L S Y S T E M S Telefax: +31-10-5117947 ==========END OF FILE============================================ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 17:40:30 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Joe Hemmens Subject: The sounds bees make Dear Bee-Liners As a newcomer to BEE-L I apologise in advance if this subject has been recently covered. When I first became interested in bees and read about the subject, I was interested to find references describing how experienced beekeepers can detect whether a colony is queenless or queenright by tapping the hive and listening to the response. I also wondered whether sound might yield other information about the state of the colony. Several years later I was lucky to come across an article by an UK beekeeper called Rex Boys. It described the work of a beekeeper and BBC sound engineer called Eddie Woods from the late thirties to the late fifties. Rex (who was a colleague of Eddie Woods and who still lectures about his work) very kindly sent me some articles about Eddie Woods' work. Eddie discovered that a colonies state, particularly in relation to swarming condition, could be ascertained by measuring the sound frequencies within a hive after tapping on the hive sufficient to disturb its occupants. He described two sounds in particular that he called 'hiss' and 'warble'. He described 'warble' as a bubbling noise with a pitch round about middle C, always present in a healthy colony but sometimes almost inaudible. He found that the warble is produced by young bees and that the volume of 'warble' increases during the period of 10-15 days before the appearance of queen cells. About 7 days before the issue of a swarm the volume of warble becomes relatively very loud. The 'hiss' he described as a much higher frequency, the noise we can most readily hear if we rap the side of a hive. He found that as swarming approaches 'warble' increases and 'hiss' diminishes. Eddie was obviously very clever as well as having a finely tuned ear, for he produced 3 devices which he called 'Apidictors'. The idea was that you could rap your hive and measure the relative 'warble/hiss components from the sounds and predict (amongst other things) whether the colony was likely to swarm. He found that an apiary of 30 colonies could be 'measured' in about 3 minutes Most of the development of the Apidictors was carried out in the late forties and early fifties and although I know little about electronics I reckon this was pretty clever stuff. The Apidictor was produced in small numbers on a commercial basis, but the price and the attitude of beekeepers prevented it from becoming a success. My guess is that today an improved Apidictor could be produced in quantity for little more than a couple of jars of honey. I have copies of the technical descriptions of the Apidictor if anyone is interested. Surely there must be a subscriber to Bee-Line who knows about electronics! Eddie also had an article published in New Scientist in the fifties describing the frequency of the worker's wingbeat. As he describes it, previous measurements had been made by measuring the wingbeat of a fanning worker or by mechanically restraining the bee (pinnning?!). These give a figure of about 180 beats per second. Because Eddie had such a fine ear he could tell when playing keys on the piano and comparing the sound with the buzz of a bee flying in his room that this was incorrect. He explained that the centre of motion of a bee in flight changes and hence the frequency is about 250 beats per second. He later confirmed this with an oscilloscope. IBRA have copies of Eddie's work and the BBKA have put together a tape made from rather aged recordings of 'Sounds from the Beehive' including one called something like 'Murder in the Apiary' which is a recording of the emergence and battle of young queens and their piping. I would be happy to forward any information that I have available about the work of Eddie Woods to who anyone shares my rather esoteric interest in the noises made by bees! Best wishes Joe Hemmens ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 18:57:11 +0100 Reply-To: beeman@kuai.se Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: P-O Gustafsson Subject: Re: Coincidence????????? > >The word locally (central NY) is that supersedure was remarkably common > >this year, for some strange reason. I had a few colonies which were doing > >great, building up with first-season queens (some reared, some bought), > >only to find the queen GONE after filling the hive with a beautiful brood > >pattern. RICHARD BARNES wrote: > I know it is very possibly a coincidence, I treated with apistan strips from > June 23 through August 3 this year (between spring and fall honey flows) and > with in three weeks, four out of ten hives had no queen or eggs. > > Of the queens I lost this year, counting early losses for a total of 6, all > either obsconded after laying 2-3 frames of brood or were killed by the > bees. Five were new queens this year and one was a swarm I caught about 1 > and one half mile from my bee yard. One of the interesting points is I had > no queen cells in the hives. It is like they became queenless some where > past the point of taking eggs and making a new queen themselves. Similar things happened to me this season. I also found hives with no queen and no emergency cells in the spring. About 10% of my queens were lost later in the season without any reason I could see. They were mostly newly mated queens that had been laying for some weeks that suddenly were gone. In at least one hive the bees had started making emergency cells before the queen stopped laying. I don't have varroa yet, so no medication has been done. There is very little spraying going on, and the farmers are well aware of the risk of killing bees. There were good weather with a good honey flow and plenty of pollen available. I have never seen anything like it before, don't belive it's bad mating or poorly reared queens. But something is affecting the bees. Anyone else with similar experience? -- Regards P-O Gustafsson, Sweden beeman@kuai.se http://www.kuai.se/~beeman/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 11:24:52 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jerry Fries Subject: Re: Bees knowing you,or your watch Thank you for ther reply We dont sweat very much in alaska when working bees.there are warm days but there are also fish in the streams.I wouldnt have thought of it,it is too simple I Guess. Jerry Fries ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 11:33:54 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jerry Fries Subject: Re: Bees knowing you,or your watch I rarely wear gloves unless it is in ythe fall and I am trying to get a lot of work done.the reason is because of something I read. That is Once a bee stings your glove then more and more emergency pheremone builds up on the gloves causing more and more stinging.The advice is to very thouroughly wash your gloves after each use. I am not that festideous so I just dont use them. Jerry Fries ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 11:42:31 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jerry Fries Subject: Re: Coincidence????????? We had an unusual amount of superceure also this year,that and non laying quees or queens that disappeared.We live in an area with little or no pesticide in by far the majority of the beekeeping area. That is why our honey can be sold for so much money.For making jam 2.00 a pound in jars 4.00 to 8.00 per pound. The health food people really get into it. I dont think chemicals is the cause. But Ill be listening for possible answers. Jerry Fries ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 15:55:33 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jim Wood <101725.2361@compuserve.com> Subject: The sounds bees make I have only been keeping bees for a season and as a mechanical engineering lecturer responsible for the teaching of design, I am always on the lookout for suitable student projects. I would certainly be interested in looking at the information that you have on my namesakes audio device, so that I can assess its suitability as the basis for a project. Regards Jim Wood ( Scotland ) ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 13:05:35 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Paul Cauthorn Subject: Re: The sounds bees make Hi Joe, I would be interested in receiving information concerning this subject. My electronics knowledge is a little limited, but would like to see the description(schematic?) of the apidictor. This is a very exciting idea. Paul Joe Hemmens wrote: > Several years later I was lucky to come across an article by an UK > beekeeper called Rex Boys. It described the work of a beekeeper and > BBC sound engineer called Eddie Woods from the late thirties to the > late fifties. Rex (who was a colleague of Eddie Woods and who still lectures > about his work) very kindly sent me some articles about Eddie Woods' > work. > He found that an apiary of 30 colonies could be 'measured' in about 3 > minutes > > Most of the development of the Apidictors was carried out in the late > forties and early fifties and although I know little about > electronics I reckon this was pretty clever stuff. The Apidictor was > produced in small numbers on a commercial basis, but the price and > the attitude of beekeepers prevented it from becoming a success. > > My guess is that today an improved Apidictor could be produced in > quantity for little more than a couple of jars of honey. I have > copies of the technical descriptions of the Apidictor if anyone is > interested. Surely there must be a subscriber to Bee-Line who knows > about electronics! > > Eddie also had an article published in New Scientist in the fifties > describing the frequency of the worker's wingbeat. As he describes > it, previous measurements had been made by measuring the wingbeat of a > fanning worker or by mechanically restraining the bee (pinnning?!). > These give a figure of about 180 beats per second. Because Eddie had > such a fine ear he could tell when playing keys on the piano and > comparing the sound with the buzz of a bee flying in his room that > this was incorrect. He explained that the centre of motion of a bee > in flight changes and hence the frequency is about 250 beats per > second. He later confirmed this with an oscilloscope. > > IBRA have copies of Eddie's work and the BBKA have put together a > tape made from rather aged recordings of 'Sounds from the Beehive' > including one called something like 'Murder in the Apiary' which is > a recording of the emergence and battle of young queens and their > piping. > > I would be happy to forward any information that I have > available about the work of Eddie Woods to who anyone shares my rather > esoteric interest in the noises made by bees! > > Best wishes > > Joe Hemmens ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 11:51:35 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jerry Fries Subject: Re: Benefits of fall feeding? I keep useing that worn out phrase "in our area" but it si true areas differ. In Alaska we need to have as much feed as possible generally 125 pounds in the box to make it through the winter. Nectar is generally (round numbers dont gig me for a percent or two) 15 to 50 percent sugar when I want to calm my bees or if I want to stimulate brood rearing I feed sugar which is like nectar,less than 50 percent sugar. But to Feed for winter the bees to get as much sugar in the hive as fast as possible and (this is very important) dry it! Therefore I feed a solution which is at least 2 parts sugar and 1 part water even more sugar tothe bees this is not nectar. Good Luck Jerry Fries ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 14:14:17 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Caroline Stoddart of AGF 487-9353 Subject: Re: Looking for James Amrine? In-Reply-To: Yes, looking for more information on use of natural oils for mite control. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 17:22:39 EDT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jim Moore Subject: Re: Coincidence????????? I had a hive that was queenless and attempted to help them make one by supplying frames of egss and larvae. It took two tries to succeed. The first batch of queens hatched but no mated queen made it back to the hive. I also had my strongest hive loose the queen. Maybe my fault. They also produced supercedure cells that hatched and again no queen resulted. I'm wondering of some what is being noticed is a combination of normal queen mortality in conjunction failed matings as a result of diminished/nonexistent feral colonies. Maybe fewer drones make the queen an easier target for predation? Maybe the drone congregation areas are not all teeming with drones and the queen doesn't get fertilized. In many areas the overall population dynamics are totally different from previous years as a result of the population crash caused by varroa. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 18:12:14 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Joel Govostes Subject: Re: Honey Pallets (Request for info) Comments: cc: carrigan@cyberstore.ca >We are using wooden honey pallets when we bring the honey into the heat >room. I have always thought that a pallet made in one piece out of nylon or >plastic (similar to those white cutting boards), would be the ideal. No >leaking, easy to clean, durable etc. Is something like this available out >there? > >Christopher > >________________________________________________________ >Christopher Carrigan carrigan@cyberstore.ca >Arras, B.C. V0C 1B0 >Canada (604) 843-7205 Walter T. Kelley Co. used to sell one-piece molded plastic units like this. They looked like a telescoping lid but had the same lenth and width as a hive body. I'm not sure if they still have them, or if they would be strong enough to hold a stack of full supers. You might check a recent catalog. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 19:15:54 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Robert Stevens Subject: Re: Honey Pallets (Request for info) you could make them out of Kelly's plastic telescoping covers - just screw on a couple of cleats for you hand truck. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 20:17:30 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Jim G. Shoemaker" Subject: Yellow Jackets We have also had lots of yellow jackets in SW Missouri. I was concerned that some of my weaker colonies might be attacked so I made a few traps. I used buckets with tight lids or jars or whatever and by T & E (trial and error) discovered that a 16D sinker nail would allow the YW's to enter buy not the bees. I baited with some old honey that I diluted. The bees somehow get too much of the mixture on them and very few make it out of the trap. I assume that almost anyting sweet would work. I assume a wetting agent mixed with the dilute honey would made it even better. Try it. You'll like it. Jim Shoemaker Brookline, MO (near Springfield and Bass Pro Shop) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Oct 1996 14:07:41 +1200 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Bryan Clements Subject: BEE BLOWER / tipping Your discussions on tipping and bee blowers is interesting. After trying fume boards, bee go etc, we have for the last 12 years used Hitachi portable blowers to remove bees from honey box's. Its Hitachi code is PB-20. It draws 335 watts supplied by a small 240 volt petrol generator. We cover the intake with a wire mesh so the bees are not sucked in to the turbo that spins at 13000 rpm. Its weight is 2 kg and is simple to use. Honey box's are put on a 3 legged stand in front of each hive and prior to blowing a broad check for AFB is done. If no disease the bees are blown in front of the hive, in which the queen, if she is in the honey box, ends up on the ground and runs into the hive with the bees. If our crop is light we have some broad in our honey boxes ( queen excluders not used) and the blower can work in all conditions. The blowers get dropped in cow dung and are a real tool that can hack the pace. We have blown from the top and the bottom of the super and now only blow from the top. We find that with 8 frame honey box's, that it works well for us. Each blower has a life to blow 200 ton + of honey and its main advantage is that it works every day with no smell!! Regards Bryan Bryan Clements Waikato Honey Products Ltd 8 Short Street New Zealand Fax 64 7 8718885 bryan@honeynz.co.nz ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 23:22:21 -0300 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Eunice D. Wonnacott" Subject: Re: Stinging insect allergies >Eunice D. Wonnacott writes of giving up beekeepiung due to a bad experience >with a yellowjacket (sting?). > >While I was being desenitized to assorted insect venoms (including honeybees >and yellow hornets). I pumped my allergist about cross allergies. Her reply >was that the venoms from the different stinging insects were all different, >and that how a person reacted to one venom was not a good predictor of how >one would respond to any other venom. The venoms used for >testing/desensitization were specific to each stinging insect of interest. > >Summary: Being allergic to one stinging insect does not mean you are >allergic to any other stinging insect. > >W. G. Miller >Gaithersburg, MD > > Thanks for this response. My first move, after being stung by the yellowjacket, was to contact the Poison Control people in Halifaz. Their information was to the effect that hymenoptera were all classifiec alike, as to allergic responses to the stings. I have known for years that I am allergic to the stings of the honeybee. I have reasoned that I plan my actions, and clothing, when tending bees, to be SURE I do not get stung. That has wo;rked pretty well most of the time. This was my first episode, ever, of being stung by these others. The reaction was almost as bad as with the honeybee. I have accepted Mother Nature's warning, before anything worse happens, knowing that accidental stingings can happen anywhere, anytime. This summer I have a new planting of Sedum (Sp?). The blooms are covered with bumblebees, as many as a dozen bees to a flower cluster, over almost two weeks. The little individual flowers are not all ready at the same time, hence their constant return, I suppose. It is a late blooming plant, grown in gardens because it produces bright colour late in the season, and stays colorful until the first snow, or later. I wonder if it would be a valllluable nectar source. It is perennial, very hardy, and easy to grow. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 18:22:24 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Tom & Carol Elliott Organization: Home Subject: Re: Coincidence????????? Jim Moore wrote: > I'm wondering of some what is being noticed is > a combination of normal queen mortality in conjunction > failed matings as a result of diminished/nonexistent > feral colonies. In Alaska there are no feral colonies, so this explanation would not apply to us. Thus Occam suggests that it does not apply elsewhere since Alaska also noticed an abnormal level of supercedures. -- "Test everything. Hold on to the good." (1 Thessalonians 5:21) Tom Elliott Eagle River, Alaska beeman@alaska.net ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 18:27:23 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Tom & Carol Elliott Organization: Home Subject: Re: Benefits of fall feeding? Jerry Fries wrote: > Jerry, My experience is that 2:1 or over tends to granulate in the comb far more quickly than a concentration of slightly less than 2:1. The big bendfit of heavy syrup is that you can get 100 lbs into the hive in just a few days. So it doesn't matter much if the bees see it as nectar or not it is not a long term source. -- "Test everything. Hold on to the good." (1 Thessalonians 5:21) Tom Elliott Eagle River, Alaska beeman@alaska.net ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 16:45:44 -1000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Bob St. John" Subject: Re: gloves In-Reply-To: <960929213904635@beenet.com> I will follow the words of the old drone with coments from and even older drone. While in California I never put on a veil unless I hit a bad hive or the honey flow stopped. That is, the bees became vicious. I usually wore a straw hat with the veil tied above the brim. I never owned a pair of bee gloves or a bee suit. Levis and a tee shirt worked just fine. When I came to Hawaii I learned to put on a veil and a bee suit right away. Oh, once in a while I would open a hive while still wearing shorts and no veil and if I move very slowly and use adequate smoke it may be safe. I am sure that it is the climate here that makes the difference. Apparently the honey only comes in in the morning and I don't even think about going into the bees in the afternoon. It is too disruptive of their lives and my comfort. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 22:55:11 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Dave from Scranton Subject: Re: Bees knowing you -Reply In-Reply-To: On Wed, 25 Sep 1996, Gerry Visel wrote: > As far as the chasing you after you got stung, that was the alarm pheramome (sp?) that > comes with stings. One sting begets more... That's what I figured, even though I'd taken off my bee clothes, except for my jeans. > What's "AfterBite?" The main ingredient was somehting along the lines of aluminum hydroxide. > For your sake, I hope it's not the "either you get more tolerant to them or you get more > sensitive to them" working the wrong way! Either way, I'm not giving up easily. Besides after all the money I've spent I'd rather die by the hands of the bees than my wife!!! 8-} ****************************************************************************** Dave D. Cawley, Maitre d' | ***ALERT shameless plug ALERT*** The Internet Cafe | Scranton, Pennsylvania | ASK ME FOR A COPY OF WEBPHONE!!! (717) 344-1969 | (or try www.scranton.com/webphone) ddc1@lydian.scranton.com | ****************************************************************************** URL => http://www.scranton.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 19:35:22 -0800 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jerry Fries Subject: Re: Benefits of fall feeding? No comment ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 23:57:37 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Dave from Scranton Subject: Re: Statistical significance of ibuprofen/bee sting reactions In-Reply-To: <960927.114844.EDT.SYSAM@cnsibm.albany.edu> On Fri, 27 Sep 1996, Aaron Morris wrote: > > Yes, but one of the first things one learns and the last thing one > should forget in a first level statistics class is that there are lies, > damned lies, maps and statistics! I had a sociology professor who once said: "statistics are like bikinis. They show a lot, but not the important stuff." ****************************************************************************** Dave D. Cawley, Maitre d' | ***ALERT shameless plug ALERT*** The Internet Cafe | Scranton, Pennsylvania | ASK ME FOR A COPY OF WEBPHONE!!! (717) 344-1969 | (or try www.scranton.com/webphone) ddc1@lydian.scranton.com | ****************************************************************************** URL => http://www.scranton.com -- End --