========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 17:20:11 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: yves steinmetz Subject: Keen replacement Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hola! Hi, all! I'm reading with great interest all discussion and comments of differents subjetcs. Thank for all who spends time and knowledge in those answers. I read ( 2-3 years ago) in a french publication (Abeille de France), an original method to replace old keen and introduce a neuw one ( in cell by preference or virgin in a keen box?) without finding and killing the old. The method: - introduce the new keen (cell) in a back corner of the hive, or - let the virgin walk slowly in a corner of the entrance... With this method, we are able to replace the old queen by natural selection. That is, if the new virgin keen are not considered better than the old, bees kill her. But if the young keen is accepted, he kill the older. Who know something about this easy method? Yves Yves Steinmetz Fax 56-71-241089 P.O. Box 1014 - Talca, CHILE ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 14:49:22 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: ANDREAS SCHCK Subject: Re: ants MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit John Day wrote: > hi there, > > anybody got a good way to keep little black ants out > of the colonies? i have 6 colonies on a long board about > 1.5 feet off the ground. the ants have a nice little highway > trekked out for themselves to the various hives. i'm sure the > buggers are eating like crazy. > > thanks, > john Hi John,the ants were a big problem for me to. But don't worry about any more: Just dust Diazinon around the "legs" from your hive stands or around the bottom of the long board. Dust the diazinon dry, don't prepare it with water, so your bees will be protected from ants a long time. Of course be carefull while dusting: Put the Diazinon into a can ,drill holes of about 2 mm into the lid and clench the lid well. With the holes downward strike softly against the lower part of the board till you surrounded them. I use to fight ants this way over ten years: Bees never got poissoned but ants had to look for an other food sourse. Thank's everybody who answered my question about high tension and bees! (july). Andreas Schuck anscsche@entelchile.net Paine-Chile "I'm beekeeper because I'm paying for mi sinfull live!" ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 7 Aug 1997 14:39:53 -0500 Reply-To: rick444@hpnc.com Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: rick444 Organization: Lazy A's Bees Subject: Re: EAS 97 Comments: To: beeworks@muskoka.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit David Eyre wrote: > > Is anyone going to EAS 97 next week? So far there has been nothing > on the Bee-L about it, so we are wondering if we will alone in > Newport, Delaware. > > ******************************************* > The Bee Works, 9 Progress Dr, Unit 2, > Orillia, Ontario, L3V 6H1 > Phone/fax 705-326-7171 > David Eyre, Owner. > http://www.muskoka.net/~beeworks > ******************************************** What is EAS 97??? ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 20:41:08 -0400 Reply-To: deveaupj@cnwl.igs.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Liz & Paul Deveau Subject: Re: Sci.ag.beekeeping address MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Eunice Wonnacott wrote: > > If you get this address, please send it to my personal inbox too > . Thanks > > Eunice Wonnacott wonnacot@cycor.ca > > ---------- > > From: William G Lord > > To: BEE-L@CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU > > Subject: Sci.ag.beekeeping address > > Date: Friday, August 08, 1997 12:08 PM > > > > Could someone supply the address for the sci.ag beekeeping list. I would > like > > to subscribe. > > > > Thanks > > > > Bill Lord > > -- > > William G Lord > > E-Mail : wglord@franklin > > Internet: wglord@franklin.ces.ncsu.edu > > Phone : 9194963344 This is not a mailing list, but a newsgroup. Activate your newsreader (Netscape, Free Agent, or whatever), then either scroll through the 18,000 or so newsgroups or click on 'file', then on 'add newsgroup', then type in sci.agriculture.beekeeping. After that, just check the subscribe option, then every you open the newsgroup, it will be there. Paul -- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Elizabeth & Paul Deveau Alexandria, Ontario, Canada Mailto:deveaupj@cnwl.igs.net http://www.cnwl.igs.net/~deveaupj ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 21:59:18 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Wesley A Voigt Jr Subject: Re: Sci.ag.beekeeping address Please post the address to the list (along with information on how to get online - I am still a newbe with the internet :-} ) - I would like it as well, and there may be more of us that would like to get online with them - I know I can use all the information I can get. Thanks Wesley A Voigt Jr ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Aug 1997 06:55:53 -0600 Reply-To: ribac@wi.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Randy, Isa & Alina Chase" Subject: Re: Anti Sting ointment MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have washed my hands in a common bleach solution prior to working the bees. The smell keeps all but the most determined bees off my hands. I have also used surgical latex gloves to keep propolis off my hands. The bees that attempt to sting through the latex have a tough time, but they can get me if they are persistant. I find that a sting now and then in the hand is good for the arthritis. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Aug 1997 11:26:31 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: John Justin Spaulding III Subject: Moving Hives In-Reply-To: <9708072322293330@beenet.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII I have to move some hives due to construction any reccomendation. On how to least upset them. 1) What time of day to move them. (Early morning/Early Evening) 2) How far do I have to move them. It's right at the beginning of a good honey flow so I prefer not to go that far. But if they come back to the spot where the hives were I'm just wasting Bees anyway. Thanks, John Spaaulding juggler@nesc.org ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 22:38:41 +0200 Reply-To: jtemp@xs4all.nl Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jan Tempelman Organization: Home Subject: Re: Plans for Hives MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Computer Software Solutions Ltd wrote: > If the WBC (William Broughton Carr) hive takes British National Frames I > would also be interested in it. see http://www.xs4all.nl/~jtemp/index3.html -- Jan Tempelman / Ineke Drabbe | EMAIL:jtemp@xs4all.nl Sterremos 16 3069 AS Rotterdam, The Netherlands Tel/Fax (SOMETIMES) XX 31 (0)10-4569412 ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Aug 1997 17:00:01 +0200 Reply-To: jtemp@xs4all.nl Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jan Tempelman Organization: Home Subject: CORK HIVE MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit new photo's from a cork hive in Portugal (sommer '97) http://www.xs4all.nl/~jtemp/index3.html TOP -- Jan Tempelman / Ineke Drabbe | EMAIL:jtemp@xs4all.nl Sterremos 16 3069 AS Rotterdam, The Netherlands Tel/Fax (SOMETIMES) XX 31 (0)10-4569412 http://www.xs4all.nl/~jtemp/index3.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Aug 1997 19:35:24 +0200 Reply-To: jtemp@xs4all.nl Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jan Tempelman Organization: Home Subject: Re: Drone comb MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sid Pullinger wrote: > > <<<< However, I cannot find a supplier who sells > drone comb foundation anymore. I tried Dadant, Kelley, A.I.Root, and Mann > Lake and struck out. Anybody have any suggestions for finding drone > foundation in the U.S?>>>> > > You don't need it. Let the bees make their own. If your brood combs are > in good shape, all worker cells and no patches of drone, you can > concentrate all the drone brood on to one comb. I split a brood comb > horizontally in two with a quarter inch strip of wood. The bottom half is > fitted with worker foundation and the top half is given a half inch starter > strip fixed to the top bar. Invariably the bees will turn the top half > into drone comb and fill with eggs. When capped this section is cut out, > leaving the starter strip for next time, and checked for mites. see the check frame on http://www.xs4all.nl/~jtemp/index3.html >>>visit the varroa > The comb goes to the bird table and is quickly cleaned out. you can eat it!!! it tast good!! see the pictures on http://www.xs4all.nl/~jtemp/index3.html > I normally use two such > combs for each hive, putting them in at intervals to get continuous > production. Drone production here is from April to mid July so if your > season is the same you have left it too late for this year. > If you raise your own queens and select fathers as well as mothers this is > a good way to fill a hive with drones. You can still check for the > presence of mites by doing a one in ten sampling instead of destroying the > comb. Sid P. nice method Sid, well done. friend here in Holland makes (wooden) thin removable droneframes.(a quarter [or 1/3] of a normal frame) He centrifuges the drone pulpa out (like honeyextration, but smaller) with a old handdriving dillmachine. When you use the drone method (a broodless period, with only drone pulpa cells for the varroa) it is better to wire the frames. To push the pulpa out, is a hard push (and more than one), without wireing the combs will broke. -- Jan Tempelman / Ineke Drabbe | EMAIL:jtemp@xs4all.nl Sterremos 16 3069 AS Rotterdam, The Netherlands Tel/Fax (SOMETIMES) XX 31 (0)10-4569412 http://www.xs4all.nl/~jtemp/index3.html ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Aug 1997 13:48:50 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Walter T. Weller" Subject: Finding queen What's a better way to find and catch the queen (unmarked) in a normal colony (i.e., two deeps full of bees and brood)? My straightforward approach of pulling frames and looking them over, one by one, doesn't work very well for me. My eyeglasses get covered with sweat so I can't see, and I get covered with mad bees stinging through my bee-suit, before I find the old lady. Walter Weller Post Office Box 270 Wakefield, Louisiana 70784 ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Aug 1997 15:16:46 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Keith B. Forsyth" Subject: Re: Finding queen Comments: To: "Walter T. Weller" In-Reply-To: <19970809.134852.3774.3.feliciana@juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Walter; Unless there is a specific need to find the queen, you need only to confirm her being there by seeing properly laid eggs. However, if you need to find the queen(eg. to replace her), I might suggest placing a queen excluder between the two brood boxes, returning in 3 or 4 days, checking for eggs. The box with eggs in it should be the box with the queen. Once found, she could be marked, making things easier in the future. Light coloured queens are easier to find than darker ones. Queen location is a challenge. Good luck :) KBF PS. As with all things in beekeeping, there are several ways to solve a problem. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 08:49:53 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: ",Michael Vercoe" Subject: Re: PRODUCING ROYAL JELLY MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Mathhew Allan,thanks for your reply. Mailing address is - Company Bee Honey Galloway,P.O.Box 241 ALEXANDRA NEW ZEALAND Cheers Michael ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Aug 1997 16:56:55 -0400 Reply-To: dronebee@norfolk.infi.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "\\Dr. Pedro P. Rodriguez" Organization: Independent non-profit research Subject: Re: Finding queen MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Walter T. Weller wrote: Dear Walter: It is not easy to find a queen especially if it is unmarked and the population large. Whenever I am going to replace a queen I always follow the following procedure. First, make sure that there is a queen (presence of properly laid single eggs in the cells). 1. I take the hive apart. 2. Place a queen excluder on the bottom board and replace the first brood chamber. 3. Place a white cloth (a piece of a sheet will do) in front of the landing board. 4. Remove the frames one by one and carefully shake them on the sheet watching carefully for the elusive queen. 5. Place each frame that has been shaken into a empty brood box. Do as many brood boxes as you may have. 6. Examine the walls of the brood chambers for the queen. 7. If still not found, remove the brood chamber and look under the excluder. Sometimes the queen will elude our first scrutiny, but will become trapped under the excluder. Usually you will find it surrounded by a small group of bees. Good luck. Best regards. Dr. Rodriguez Virginia Beach, VA ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Aug 1997 20:56:57 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "W. G. Miller" Subject: Queen hunting The following is the Miller method for finding reclusive queens: First, put queen excluders between all the brood chambers, put the hive back together again, and come back in a week. The queen will now be confined to one box. If you do not feel confident in your queen spotting ability, visit a local observation hive and find the queen in that a couple of times. Note how many differences you can see between the queen and the other bees. After the week is up, come back with a spare box. Examine frames from your colony. The frames that have eggs and/or young brood in them are from the box that has the queen in it. Use as little smoke as possible, and in general disturb the colony as little as possible during the queen hunt. Also, if you have beekeeping friends, an extra pair of eyes helps. When you are done examining a frame from the box with the queen in it, put it in the spare box. If you empty the original hive box without success, that means you have passed over the queen. Take the frames out of the spare box, and examine them again as you put them back. Queens are generally on frames with eggs/ young larvae in them. Queens are rarely on honey or nectar. If you find the queen, then mark her, pull the queen excluders, reassemble the hive, and you are back in business. If you don't find the queen, reassemble the hive with the queen excluders, and try again tomorrow. You will know which box to look in. If you suspect a queenless colony, put a frame of eggs from another colony in the suspect colony and come back in a week. Examine the frame. If you find queen cells on it, then the colony was queenless. Good luck. W. G, Miller Gaithersburg, MD ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 9 Aug 1997 22:12:35 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Mark F Almond Subject: Fable Time MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Did your hear about new beginner beekeeper complaining about the awful oder that was coming from one of his beehives. He checked with another fellow beekeeper about the problem he was having with his hive of bees. This fellow beekeeper went over and check the stinging hive of bees. He said " That don't look like honey either, Maybe your QUEEN has got crossed with a HORSEFLY and the bees started bring in HORSE MANURE". The beginner took his WORD for it too. Mark F. Almond Concord, NC 28025 malmond@ctc.net ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 09:39:27 +0200 Reply-To: jtemp@xs4all.nl Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jan Tempelman Organization: Home Subject: Re: Finding queen MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Walter T. Weller wrote: > > What's a better way to find and catch the queen (unmarked) in a normal > colony (i.e., two deeps full of bees and brood)? My straightforward > approach of pulling frames and looking them over, one by one, doesn't > work very well for me. My eyeglasses get covered with sweat so I can't > see, and I get covered with mad bees stinging through my bee-suit, before > I find the old lady. I read the following method - 2 hives - take from each hive a frame with brood in all stadia - exchange them - wait 10 min. - on those frame the queen can be found (she is looking for her rival) -- Jan Tempelman / Ineke Drabbe | EMAIL:jtemp@xs4all.nl Sterremos 16 3069 AS Rotterdam, The Netherlands Tel/Fax (SOMETIMES) XX 31 (0)10-4569412 http://www.xs4all.nl/~jtemp/index3.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 12:06:42 +0200 Reply-To: jtemp@xs4all.nl Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jan Tempelman Organization: Home Subject: Beescene questions and there outcome MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit a little of the hook, but I don't know any other access. In april/may '97 I put a message asking for any beescene in Portugal. Refering to our vacationtrip in our VW-Bus. No anser from there, but only a reaction on the bus from someone (USA) how has the same bus. During our trip through France/Spain/Portugal (total 6000 KM/4000 Miles) we came up with the following idea. Woud it be nice to exchange Campers/VANS (or homes) during the july/aug period in 1998. We have: - nice house on the outskirts/suburb of big city Rotterdam. - a 25 year old Volkwagen Bus with: - new engine - new gear box - new brakes - we have exchange the orginal chairs to two SAAB chairs - bikes(2) frame on the backsite - on board is: bed (140 x 190)/ch toilet/ coolbox on gas(and 220V-12V)/one cooking gas/two chairs and table for outdoor use/and the usual camping equipment. We can be helpfull in providing all sorts of information on the Europian countries. Photo on http://www.xs4all.nl/~jtemp/busphoto.html hoping for all sorts of reactions greeting, ineke and jan -- Jan Tempelman / Ineke Drabbe | EMAIL:jtemp@xs4all.nl Sterremos 16 3069 AS Rotterdam, The Netherlands Tel/Fax (SOMETIMES) XX 31 (0)10-4569412 http://www.xs4all.nl/~jtemp/index3.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 12:07:46 +0200 Reply-To: jtemp@xs4all.nl Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jan Tempelman Organization: Home Subject: Beescene questions and there outcome MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit a little of the hook, but I don't know any other access. In april/may '97 I put a message asking for any beescene in Portugal. Refering to our vacationtrip in our VW-Bus. No anser from there, but only a reaction on the bus from someone (USA) how has the same bus. During our trip through France/Spain/Portugal (total 6000 KM/4000 Miles) we came up with the following idea. Woud it be nice to exchange Campers/VANS (or homes) during the july/aug period in 1998. We have: - nice house on the outskirts/suburb of big city Rotterdam. - a 25 year old Volkwagen Bus with: - new engine - new gear box - new brakes - we have exchange the orginal chairs to two SAAB chairs - bikes(2) frame on the backsite - on board is: bed (140 x 190)/ch toilet/ coolbox on gas(and 220V-12V)/one cooking gas/two chairs and table for outdoor use/and the usual camping equipment. We can be helpfull in providing all sorts of information on the Europian countries. Photo on http://www.xs4all.nl/~jtemp/busphoto.html hoping for all sorts of reactions greeting, ineke and jan -- Jan Tempelman / Ineke Drabbe | EMAIL:jtemp@xs4all.nl Sterremos 16 3069 AS Rotterdam, The Netherlands Tel/Fax (SOMETIMES) XX 31 (0)10-4569412 http://www.xs4all.nl/~jtemp/index3.html ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 07:49:14 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Trevor Weatherhead Subject: Re: Egyptian bees I was interested to note Andy's comments about Egyptian bees. I am not sure of his context but I do recall reading an article where bees in the USA had some DNA work carried out on them and were shown to be Egyptian in origin. Eleven years ago I researched and wrote a book on the beekeeping history of Queensland (a State in Australia). When I was loking at the origins of the Italian bee in Australia I came across several references to Egyptian bees. Apparently in the American Bee Journal and Gleanings in Bee Culture in the 1890's and early 1900's there is mention made of developing a yellow Italian by crossing the ligurian bees with Cyprian bees, Egyptian, and Holyland bees. In the 1890's, here in Australia they were importing Punic bees from the USA and breeding this in Australia. Apparently the Punic bees originated from the area around Algeria and Tunisia in north Africa. There was an American, Mr. Frank Benton who had established an apiary in Cyprus and was exporting Cyprian bees to the USA and Australia. So I suppose it will not be surprising when some DNA work is done to find that the USA and Australia have a background of many of these races. Our Italian today is far removed from those ligurians that were originally imported from Italy. In a newspaper article in Australia in 1887 it says "Even in Italy the purity of the Ligurian strain cannot be universally guaranteed for beekeepers there are now constantly experimenting with the crosses of Cyprian, Syrian, Carniolan etc. It is not unlikely, therefore, that Kangaroo Island will in time become the depot from which all the world's beekeepers obtain their pure Italian strain." Kangaroo Island is an island off South Australia which is a sanctuary for the ligurian bee. Trevor Weatherhead AUSTRALIA ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 08:02:41 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Curtis Atkinson Subject: Black body on an Italian bee MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT I have an Italian bees in one hive. When I checked this hive recently, a few of the bees has a black body with the head being Italian, and a few bees have a black head and regular colored body. I have never seen this before. What gives? Curtis Atkinson 2701 S. Caraway Jonesboro, Ar 72401 501-932-7838 catkinson@intellinet.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 08:09:00 -0500 Reply-To: bkeep200@concentric.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "J.Troyer" Subject: Re: Finding queen Comments: To: jtemp@xs4all.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have a queen finding method that works when all else fails. Spread a large white sheet flat on the ground near the hive. Disassemble the entire hive shaking all bees onto the sheet. Get down and search until the queen is located. Reassemble the hive and shake bees back into it. This method is hard on the hive and on the beekeeper, but it works. -- JTroyer Mail to:bkeep200@concentric.net http://www.concentric.net/~bkeep200 Honey Hill Farm - Handcrafted Honey & Beeswax Soaps ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 23:08:21 +0900 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: j h & e mcadam Subject: Bee fables Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Just to start the ball rolling: Fable 1 (source - a textbook on "Myths of the Greeks and Rome"by H.A. Guebner, which is no longer in my possession.) In Greek mythology honey bees were the responsibility of the 9 Muses, females who were the divine aspect of music, the arts and rational debate. The Muses would meet and dance on the slopes of the divine mountain. A goat-herd named Comatas glimpsed them dancing and, overcome with awe, sacrificed a kid goat to them. When the owner of the goat herd discovered his loss he ordered that Comatas be sealed into a chest to die. The Muses took pity on his plight and sent their servants the honey bees to carry honey to him through a chink in the chest. When the chest was eventually re-opened Comatas emerged in perfect health. Fable 2 (source - The ABC and XYZ of Bee Culture - which also contains some fascinating material on ancient beekeeping) Democritus a Greek philosopher advised that bee swarms can be obtained by: Killing an ox and confining in a one-room building, which has had all the openings closed with clay. On the 32nd day the building may be opened to discover it full of bees "crowded in clusters on each other, and the horns and the bones and the hair and nothing else of the bullock left". Betty McAdam HOG BAY APIARY Penneshaw, Kangaroo Island j.h. & e. mcadam Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: j h & e mcadam Subject: Re: Queen replacement Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >I read ( 2-3 years ago) in a french publication (Abeille de France), an >original method to replace old keen and introduce a neuw one ( in cell by >preference or virgin in a keen box?) without finding and killing the old. > >The method: >- introduce the new keen (cell) in a back corner of the hive, or >- let the virgin walk slowly in a corner of the entrance... > >With this method, we are able to replace the old queen by natural selection. >That is, if the new virgin keen are not considered better than the old, >bees kill her. >But if the young keen is accepted, he kill the older. Either of these methods may work but lack certainty. The old queen may not find a queen cell in a back corner of the hive and it may hatch as in normal supersedure but if the cell is found and destroyed, this has been a waste of valuable time. The difficulty with releasing a virgin queen into the hive is that she may be distinguishable as not being hatched in that hive. A virgin queen will normally hatch and parade the comb for several days during which time she will attack any rivals. Normally the younger queen will win. A third method of requeening without locating the old queen is to use a splitter board, which is a dividing screen between the old queen with the original brood and an additional super with sufficient bees to raise a queen and a separate entrance. The splitter board has a centre hole of gauze so that both lots of bees have a common hive odour. When the virgin has flown and mated and her egg output assessed as satisfactory, the splitter board is removed and the two queens will come together. Again, the younger queen will normally triumph. This is a variation of the Demaree method. I do not have the original source material but will describe the method further if anybody is interested. The down-side of all three methods is that there is a risk of injury to the new queen and considerable time may elapse before the outcome is known. I hav heard of beekeepers faced with a vicious hive who place queen cells bred from a desirable strain in the hive each month forcing a succession of supersedures until the temperament modifies. Betty McAdam HOG BAY APIARY Penneshaw, Kangaroo Island j.h. & e. mcadam Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Filtering honey In-Reply-To: <33EDDABE.1A18@worldnet.att.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT > What size mesh do you use for your final filtering? I know I read in > one of my books that either 40 or 80 mesh was used. I am looking into > getting some stainless steel mesh to strain my honey. 80 mesh is required for #1 grading, but it is very hard to get honey through without heating above 120 degrees F. We have an OAC strainer (From Jones in Quebec), but never use it. We simply hold the honey in tanks for a week at about 85-90 degrees or so and find then that it is clean enough that we can sell it without receiving complaints. Of course you have to avoid drawing the honey off the *very* bottom -- or having the scum that forms on top get into pails. Over the years (25) we tried everything from flash heating and fine filtering to creaming it to sending it out for packaging, but have come down to this 'non-violent' method. We are now even careful that the honey does not contact any surface over 95 degrees F. This excludes hot knife uncapping -- we use a chain uncapper. Why do we do it this way? Because our customers can tell the difference. Many want totally raw natural honey, and we have found that *any* heat over 100 degrees F is detectable by some of them! This is particularly true for those who use it in European style cures. Allen ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 10:57:35 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Re: Finding queen MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT > I read the following method: > > - 2 hives > - take from each hive a frame with brood in all stadia > - exchange them > - wait 10 min. > - on those frame the queen can be found (she is looking for her rival) After reading that here last year, we tried it on about twenty-five hives and found it did not work at all for us. Allen ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 13:12:03 EDT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Ross L Anderson Subject: Varroa Treatments Hello everyone, I am in my first year as a beekeeper. Of course I have received many warnings about varroa mites and the inevitable destruction of the hives occupants. I am told that apistan strips are the official treatment and all others are undocumented. A friend in our local beekeeping association has suggested essential oils as good alternative to chemical compounds. In fact information has been released saying chemical manufacturers are already working to develope the successor to apistan because varroa are becoming resistant to apistan. I would certainly enjoy hearing what your opinions are about this matter, especially those with much experience which I lack. Thank you for your help. Ross L Anderson New Washington, Ohio RLAFLA@JUNO.COM ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 14:08:53 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Walter T. Weller" Subject: Re: Bee fables On Sun, 10 Aug 1997 23:08:21 +0900 j h & e mcadam writes: >Fable 2 >(source - The ABC and XYZ of Bee Culture - which also contains some >fascinating material on ancient beekeeping) > >Democritus a Greek philosopher advised that bee swarms can be obtained by: >Killing an ox and confining in a one-room building, which has had all the >openings closed with clay. On the 32nd day the building may be opened to >discover it full of bees "crowded in clusters on each other, and the horns >and the bones and the hair and nothing else of the bullock left". The connection between bulls and bees is a lot older than Democritus -- by about 3000 years. The iconography of the (pre-Greek) neolithic and chalcolithic cultures of southeastern Europe is full of bull-gods and bee-goddesses. (Source: Marija Gimbutas, "Goddesses and Gods of Old Europe".) The idea that bees are generated from dead animals seems to have been widespread in the ancient eastern-Mediterranean area (remember Samson and the lion in the Bible?) I wonder why. Some wasps, of course (yellow-jackets, for example) are carnivorous and will flock to meat if given the opportunity, but honey-bees --- ?? Walter Weller Post Office Box 270 Wakefield, Louisiana 70784 ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 14:34:42 -0500 Reply-To: bkeep200@concentric.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "J.Troyer" Subject: Re: Finding queen Comments: To: allend@internode.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit We have also found that exchanging brood frames hasn't worked for us. We waited and waited, but the queen never came to examine the new frame. -- JTroyer Mail to:bkeep200@concentric.net http://www.concentric.net/~bkeep200 Honey Hill Farm - Handcrafted Honey & Beeswax Soaps ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 20:40:39 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "luichart.woollens@virgin.net" Organization: Luichart Woollens Subject: Re: Finding queen MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Walter T. Weller wrote: > > What's a better way to find and catch the queen (unmarked) in a normal > colony (i.e., two deeps full of bees and brood)? My straightforward > approach of pulling frames and looking them over, one by one, doesn't > work very well for me. My eyeglasses get covered with sweat so I can't > see, and I get covered with mad bees stinging through my bee-suit, before > I find the old lady. Hi Walter, The idea of inserting an excluder between the two brood chambers is a good one as it halves the size of the hive. There are two problems to this, 1. You have to wait about three days after inserting the excluder before you re-examine the hive and 2. the queen may have stopped laying in which case you have wasted you time. I don't like the idea of shaking all the bees out on to a sheet as it is going to be difficult to concentrate on finding the queen while being under attack by a lot of angry bees. If you have a spare hive then you can move the original hive to a different location leaving the second hive in its place. All the flying bees will go to the original site and you will be left with younger bees and the queen in the old hive. The younger bees are usually less agressive and you will be able to concentrate more on finding the queen. If you want to use a second excluder you can do so further reducing the amount of bees you have to examine. If you have a second brood box it is a good idea to examine the frames alternately from the outside working your way into the centre. Each frame after examination being placed into the spare box. The queen will usually be found in the centre. Look for her on the frames with the youngest brood or eggs. Hope this is of some help. -- Harry Scotland Knitwear Web pages: http://freespace.virgin.net/luichart.woollens/ ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 17:23:17 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Albert W Needham Subject: Re: Varroa Treatments On Sun, 10 Aug 1997 13:12:03 EDT Ross L Anderson writes: >Hello everyone, > I am in my first year as a beekeeper. Of course I have >received many warnings about varroa mites and the inevitable >destruction of the hives occupants. I am told that apistan strips > are the official treatment and all others are undocumented. > A friend in our local beekeeping association has suggested >essential oils as good alternative to chemical compounds. Ross: As a new beekeeper, in my opinion, the best advice is to stick to the tried and true methods for awhile, such as the use of apistan to combat varroa, grease patties to hold back tracheal mites and of course Fumidil. All of these should be administered at the right time and in accordance with standard practices. You will read of many different approaches here on BEE-L, and I am not knocking any of them. However, I do not believe that it is good practice for someone new to beekeeping to vary from the standard approach. Wait until you have more experience and then maybe you can muck around with other methods. Otherwise, you could err and lose what you have and become discouraged too early in the game. My 2 cents. Al, ----------------------------------------------------------- awneedham@juno.com - Scituate,MA,USA Cerberus - Three Sites In One Honey Bees-LottoLand-Doktor Finkle http://www.xensei.com/users/alwine/ ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 18:40:24 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "(Thomas) (Cornick)" Subject: Re: Varroa Treatments In a message dated 97-08-10 18:18:42 EDT, you write: << Hello everyone, > I am in my first year as a beekeeper. Of course I have >received many warnings about varroa mites and the inevitable >destruction of the hives occupants. I am told that apistan strips > are the official treatment and all others are undocumented. > A friend in our local beekeeping association has suggested >essential oils as good alternative to chemical compounds. >> http://pw2.netcom.com/~griffes/treatment.html The web address above gives good info Treatment Timing Tips On some computers the above line will take you directly to the web address ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:58:00 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Andy Nachbaur Organization: WILD BEE'S BBS (209) 826-8107 LOS BANOS, CA Subject: Re: Egyptian bees TW>From: Trevor Weatherhead >Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 07:49:14 -0400 >Subject: Re: Egyptian bees TW>I was interested to note Andy's comments about Egyptian bees. I am not sure >of his context but I do recall reading an article where bees in the USA had >some DNA work carried out on them and were shown to be Egyptian in origin. Hello Trevor from Australia where the clocks run backwards or is it the flush toilets? Yes, so called "feral" hive in California, and in Arizona are said to have Egyptian blood lines. Could be honeybee swarms that survive in "rock" cave hives somehow brings out the Egyptian in them. Last I heard the wild hives in California were doing well, but not so for the ones in Arizona. TW>Apparently in the American Bee Journal and Gleanings in Bee Culture in the >1890's and early 1900's there is mention made of developing a yellow Italian >by crossing the ligurian bees with Cyprian bees, Egyptian, and Holyland bees TW>In the 1890's, here in Australia they were importing Punic bees from the USA >and breeding this in Australia. Apparently the Punic bees originated >from the area around Algeria and Tunisia in north Africa. TW>There was an American, Mr. Frank Benton who had established an apiary in >Cyprus and was exporting Cyprian bees to the USA and Australia. Yes, Benton who also invented the queen cage I think, did set up breeding stations maybe to find new stock that could survive EFB that some said destroying 100% of the US bee population. He also set up test yards in California with all these imported queen bees. He had government support. It is interesting, one, nothing is written that indicates they were destroyed at the end of the tests, or queens and drones were discouraged from nature flights, at least I don't remember a point being made of it. Other then that the bees that turned out to be the hardest to handle were the Cyprian Bees, but none were as bad as selected (for bad temper) USA stock of the time. More interesting is the African bees were reported also as bad and discarded as breeders but the Cyprian bees were not discarded by the bee breeders of the day, maybe because they were very beautiful, some say. We had Cyprian breeders in California into the 1940's and I saw a glass hive of them as a child I will never forget at our state fair with all the other bees then reared in California to compare with and for sure the Cyprian bees were indeed a beautiful bee to behold. I guess in those days DNA did not count and imported bee breeder stock was picked by color, light or dark, and then tested for other traits. All of the so called different races of honeybees came in light or dark, and the bees we today think of being dark like the Caucasian or Carnolian also could be selected so they were as yellow as the Italian. TW>So I suppose it will not be surprising when some DNA work is done to find th >the USA and Australia have a background of many of these races. >Our Italian today is far removed from those ligurians that were >originally imported from Italy. In a newspaper article in Australia >in 1887 it says "Even in Italy the >purity of the Ligurian strain cannot be universally guaranteed for beekeeper >there are now constantly experimenting with the crosses of Cyprian, Syrian, >Carniolan etc. It is not unlikely, therefore, that Kangaroo Island will in >time become the depot from which all the world's beekeepers obtain their pur >Italian strain." Kangaroo Island is an island off South Australia which is >sanctuary for the ligurian bee. That sounds like a commercial I have heard before from within the Northern California Beebreeders but makes little difference here in the US as long as the federal government is controlling who gets what the average beekeepers will end up paying more for less bee it new stock or new chemicals. Bee breeding is itself is a personal thing, and many say they are the best, or isolated from others but few come up to the standards of the Banta's, Reives, or the Koehnen's who have set standards yet to be met by any government or most bee breeders DNA tests or not. IMHO, Andy- (c) Permission is granted to freely copy this document in any form, or to print for any use. (w)Opinions are not necessarily facts. Use at own risk. --- ~ QMPro 1.53 ~ ... To sway its silent chimes, else must the bee, ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 23:02:26 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "(Thomas) (Cornick)" Subject: Bees I am wodering about bee breeding for specific traits . Has anyone thought of breeding honeybees with longer tongues to extend the variety of blossums they can forage nectar from? Maybe I am thinking too much out in the beeyard. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:14:31 -0700 Reply-To: dehenry@mb.sympatico.ca Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: doug henry Subject: Re: Trefoil MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Vladimir Ptacek wrote: > > On Tue, 29 Jul 1997 05:52:13 -0500, Excerpts from BEE-L wrote: > > >From: Doug Henry > >Reply-To: BEE-L@CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU > > > >Does anyone on the list have any experience > >with it as a honey production source? Also will honey from trefoil > >crystalize like canola honey. Most of the honey from my nine hives will be > >from trefoil this year. > > > >thanks > > > >doug henry > >Lockport MB > > In our country Kropacova (prof. Kubisova,today, Agric. Univ., Brno,) > did some research with this plant species and found it to be only > moderately important honey source for honey bees because of the wery low > nectar concentration. I observed mostly Bombus lapidarius workers on it. > (For details, quotation or so, write directly on my e-mail address.) > Would it be possible to know the honey yield you obtained from your bees? > > Best regards, > Vladimir Ptacek > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > Fac. Sci., Dept. Anim. Physiol. E.mail: ptacek@sci.muni.cz > Masaryk University phone: ..420/5/41129 562 > 611 37 Brno, Czech Republic fax: ..420/5/41211 214 Vladimir, thanks for reply. I haven't extracted yet so I don't know the exact yield. I am expecting to get about 400 kilos. A couple of my hives are not doing so well. I will let you know more soon. Thanks for reponse. Doug Henry Lockport, Manitoba Canada ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 21:04:21 +0900 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: j h & e mcadam Subject: Re: Moving Hives Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >I have to move some hives due to construction any reccomendation. >On how to least upset them. > >1) What time of day to move them. (Early morning/Early Evening) > >2) How far do I have to move them. > >It's right at the beginning of a good honey flow so I prefer not to go >that far. Close the hive entrances after the bees have ceased flying for the day. Whether you travel at night and put the hives down in the dark or shut the hive before sunrise and move them then depends on your own preference and the difficulty of the move. Hives must be moved 2 miles to ensure that the field bees do not return to the previous site although if the country is forested so that the landmarks are markedly different, 1 mile should suffice. Hive entrances can be closed with strips of foam rubber (easy to insert and remove), wet newspaper or cloth. Betty McAdam HOG BAY APIARY Penneshaw, Kangaroo Island j.h. & e. mcadam Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: j h & e mcadam Subject: Re: Egyptian bees Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > >So I suppose it will not be surprising when some DNA work is done to find that >the USA and Australia have a background of many of these races. Our Italian >today is far removed from those ligurians that were originally imported from >Italy. In a newspaper article in Australia in 1887 it says "Even in Italy the >purity of the Ligurian strain cannot be universally guaranteed for beekeepers >there are now constantly experimenting with the crosses of Cyprian, Syrian, >Carniolan etc. It is not unlikely, therefore, that Kangaroo Island will in >time become the depot from which all the world's beekeepers obtain their pure >Italian strain." Kangaroo Island is an island off South Australia which is a >sanctuary for the ligurian bee. Further to Trevor Weatherhead's comments, I add that the beekeepers of Kangaroo Island take very seriously the conservation of the only known pure strain of Ligurian bee. The Island's bee population is also free of European Foul Brood, American Foul Brood and Chalkbrood, due to the geographic isolation from the mainland. In order to protect the disease free status and the pure Ligurian genetic heritage no bees, used beekeeping equipment,honey or bee goods may be brought to the Island. Maintenance of the disease-free status and protection of the sanctuary depends upon the co-operation of the public and the support of the Apiaries Inspectors in advising upon protection of the genetic resource and monitoring of the embargo on bee goods. It is due to the efforts of a great many people that the Ligurian bee has been conserved for future generations. Betty McAdam HOG BAY APIARY Penneshaw, Kangaroo Island j.h. & e. mcadam Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Trevor Weatherhead Subject: Re: Egyptian bees Andy, thanks for your information. Yes, here in Australia the toilets flush the opposite way to the northern hemisphere and our light switches go down for on and up for off. Anyway, back to the subject. We had Cyprian bees imported into Australia in the early 1950's and these were aggressive compared to the bees in Australia at that time, so they were not proceeded with. With all those imports in the early days, I wonder what happened to all those bees. Yes, Frank Benton was the man of the mailing cage fame. Not a bad winter's day here today. At home, a minimum of 3 degrees centigrade and a maximum of 25 degrees centigrade. Trevor Weatherhead AUSTRALIA ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 10:39:14 EDT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Blaine S Nay Subject: Re: Moving Beehives On Sat, 2 Aug 1997 11:02:23 +0100 Computer Software Solutions Ltd writes: >I am a beginner. I need to re organise my apiary a bit. The ideal answer is >to move two of my hives forward of their present position by about 8 feet >(240cm). > There are two ways to deal with the problem: 1. Move the hive a significant distance (a couple of miles) for a couple of weeks, then back to the new spot you want them. 2. Move them a few inches at a time. Anything else will confuse the bees. They'll leave the hive to forage and return to the old spot -- finding the hive gone! Because they're creatures of instinct and habit, they aren't smart enough to identify their hive unless it's in relation to familiar surroundings such as a tree or fence. You'll wind up with a very angry swarm of bees 8 feet from the hive! However, the bees seem to adjust very well to completely new surroundings. This is why I prefer to use method 1. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 10:39:14 EDT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Blaine S Nay Subject: Re: filtering honey ================================================================== >From: Mason Harris[SMTP:smharris@ed.co.sanmateo.ca.us] >Sent: Monday, August 27, 1956 1:44 PM >To: BEE-L@CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU >Subject: filtering honey > >Hello Bee folks! > >My lightest honey has very fine, suspended particles in it >which I can't seem to get out. I have filtered it through gross and >fine filters, the last one being a women's stocking. I think these >suspended particles are fine pollen specks. It is most visible in >the lightest honey. Does anyone have a method for clearing up this >honey? >Thanks! > In my experience, very fine filtration introduces very fine bubbles which don't easily rise to the surface. Warming the honey helps greatly. So does time. If you indeed do have particles of pollen or dust, I don't know of a more effective filter than women's hose. Anything that would trap more solid particles would probably absorb too much honey and therefore be wasteful (coffee filters come to mind). ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 07:57:53 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Andy Nachbaur Subject: Re: Egyptian bees In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 08:22 AM 8/11/97 -0400, you wrote: >Anyway, back to the subject. We had Cyprian bees imported into >Australia in the early 1950's and these were aggressive compared to >the bees in Australia at that time, so they were not proceeded with. >With all those imports in the early days, I wonder what happened to >all those bees. Really, in the 1950's, that sounds like they still are around in the bush. >Yes, Frank Benton was the man of the mailing cage fame. I believe he was from the San Jose, California area as that was the main bee breeding area of the time. During his day honeybees had only been in California a short time, maybe 30 to 35 years so any stock introduced had lots of room. >Not a bad winter's day here today. At home, a minimum of 3 degrees centigrade and a maximum of 25 degrees centigrade. In California we are into our brown season, we only have green and brown seasons. Lots of brush fires burning up 50 year old bee pasture in southern California, but it needs it and will come back in a few years better then ever if not covered with houses. Beekeepers are moving to fall wildflower pastures which are hard to find because of the dry year we had, no rain since January, but there is more then anyone expected. Blue Curls, Tarweed, and even some Jack Ass Clover and June Weed are the common names for a few of the flowers in bloom. At one time many of these were producers of large crops of honey but today most beekeepers are happy with fresh pollen and enough nectar to get a couple cycles of brood before everything dries up. ttul Andy- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 16:12:21 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Bridget Beattie Subject: Re: filtering honey In-Reply-To: <19970811.073737.8383.0.b.nay@juno.com> >> >>My lightest honey has very fine, suspended particles in it >>which I can't seem to get out. I have filtered it through gross and >>fine filters, the last one being a women's stocking. I think these >>suspended particles are fine pollen specks. It is most visible in >>the lightest honey. Does anyone have a method for clearing up this >>honey? > > If you indeed do have particles of pollen or dust, I don't know of a more > effective filter than women's hose. Anything that would trap more solid > particles would probably absorb too much honey and therefore be wasteful > (coffee filters come to mind). > Try fine muslin or cheese cloth. Warming the honey helps to speed up filtering. The particles may be minute crystals beginning to form, in which case warming will remove them. Time and temperature should be managed though, to prevent loss of quality. Bridget. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 10:44:37 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Ed Kear Subject: Re: Sci.ag.beekeeping address Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >Could someone supply the address for the sci.ag beekeeping list. I would like >to subscribe. sci.ag.beekeeping is a newsgroup, not an e-mail group. Just point your newsreader at it. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 12:47:37 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Richard Drutchas Organization: Bee Haven Honey Subject: freelance beekeepers MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'm looking to talk with other beekeepers who travel around and work with commercial beekeepers for a season or two then head on to another location and another job. I am based in Vermont and work here in the summers then head elsewhere in the winter. I am 32 and female and would love to know if there are other women out there living this kind of life but want to talk with guys doing it, too. I'm on my summer boss's computer now so respond to my address, not his. Mine is beebabe@together.net My name is Susan. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:07:10 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: OAKES DAVID W Subject: Re: Moving Beehives In-Reply-To: <19970811.073737.8383.1.b.nay@juno.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Reference to moving the hive in the yard. I have found that if you move the hive in the night and place a plywood board in front of the hive at a 45 degree angle so that the bees must go around the board to enter or leave the hive- then the bees say,"hey what up, this is new and I will pay attention to what is different." One can remove the board approx 2-3 days later. This has worked for me in the past. Dave in Indiana ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 07:42:16 -1000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Walter Patton Subject: Re: freelance beekeepers MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit hi susan what do you do in the winter?snow ski instuctor. consider coming an d working bees in hawaii some smmer . aloha walter Walter & Elisabeth Patton hihoney@ilhawaii.net 808-964-5401 Hale Lamalani { House of Heavenly Light } {Hawaii Std. Time} Bed & Breakfast www.alohamall.com/hamakua/lamalani.htm Hawaiian Honey House { Beekeepers & Honey Packers } 100 % HAWAII HONEY www.alohamall.com/hamakua/hihoney.htm 27-703 A. Ka`ie`ie Rd., Papa`ikou, Hawaii 96781 " ALOHA ALL " " The Beehive, the Fountain of Youth and Health " ---------- > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 13:55:22 EDT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Blaine S Nay Subject: Software Comments: To: apimo@post4.tele.dk Please send info on your Beekeeping software for Windows 3.1 win95. Blaine Nay 7127 Provost Road, NW Bremerton, WA 98312-1195 b.nay@juno.com ================================================================== ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 13:55:21 EDT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Blaine S Nay Subject: Re: Fructose Pump Comments: To: snapshot@pbmo.net On Wed, 6 Aug 1997 14:12:41 -0500 "M. C. Michel" writes: >I have finally found a good source for fructose in a drum. >International sweetener in St. Louis Missouri. Where do I get a pump to >pump out the fructose to get into smaller containers. Right now I do >not have enough hives to justify a gas powered portable pump on a >truck. What I do what is a way of pumping out the syrup into five >gallon jugs for me to take to the apiaries. > >Any suggestions? > >Thanks! > >M. Chris Michel > Try a company in Salt Lake City called "Emergency Essentials". I don't know the address, but they have a web site at www.beprepared.com. They have a plastic hand pump that cost just a few bucks. It's made for pumping water, but might work for syrup. Blaine Nay b.nay@juno.com ================================================================== ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 13:55:21 EDT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Blaine S Nay Subject: Re: exposed hive On Thu, 7 Aug 1997 10:07:19 -0600 Tim Channell writes: >I have been a beekeeper for about 4 years, but never encountered the >following situation: a friend called me yesterday and ask if I would come >over and remove a hive that is hanging from the ceiling of her porch. She >tells me it is in full view and quite pretty with 4-5 nice drawn out comb - >overall about the size of a soccer ball. My question to you learned >bee-keepers is once removed, how do I set the brood comb up in standard >deep frames? > >Please email me directly (chanel@elpn.com). Thanks > >Tim Channell - El Paso, Texas > In the past, I've simply tied the combs into deep frames with cotton string wrapped around the frame and comb. This holds the comb in place long enough for the bees to wax it into place. They usually (but not always or completely) remove the string after a while. I move the combs above an excluder as soon as possible, because you invariably get a lot of drone cells. After the brood has hatched from these "wild" combs, I melt 'em down with my cappings. Blaine Nay b.nay@juno.com ================================================================== ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 19:07:29 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: OAKES DAVID W Subject: Hive Stands MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Glen ask about stands, I read your message concerning hive stands. I have made a hive stand that I thing are very good. I made them from 1.5 inch pvc pipe. Using 4 pipe T's and pipe cut to the length of the bottom board; and pipe cut to the height desired and then caps to put on the leg ends. All this is glued together with pcv glue. This concept allows me to slip 2- 1 inch metal pipes through each parallel(to the hive)pvc and carry the hive after it has been secured with a strap. It does require two people to carry the hive. This concept may seem unstable, but I have stacked 2 brood and 2 suppers on this stand out in the open area and have not had any fall over. My height is the same as a cement block and the length is the pvc cut the length of the bottom board and then the T's extend beyond the bottom board. I also cut some other lengths of pvc and install a landing board in front of the hive. I'll try and draw this concept. __________________ + + + + + + I hope that this is of some value. Dave in Indiana oakes.d@lilly.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 15:30:43 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "(Thomas) (Cornick)" Subject: Re: Hive Stands In a message dated 97-08-11 15:09:21 EDT, you write: << Glen ask about stands, I read your message concerning hive stands. I have made a hive stand that I thing are very good. I made them from 1.5 inch pvc pipe. >> Paint em - PVC pipe gets brittle from sunlight ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 19:45:48 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: OAKES DAVID W Subject: Re: Hive Stands In-Reply-To: <970811152955_563775930@emout07.mail.aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Did not know that pvc get brittle, thanks Dave in Indiana ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 21:54:13 +0200 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "K. Bokhorst" Subject: Re: Mineral Oil (Last time) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Re FGMO Last week I reported that Food Grade Mineral Oli is no longer at the FDA list. That is 100% true BUT ,I contacted ESSO ,SHELL and WITCO, three well-known Oil suppliers and it turned out that the story is as follows. What last year was called Food Grade Mineral OIL is now called: White Mineral OIL or PARAFFINUM LIQUIDUM. In the chemical industry every chemical must be classified and it has a so-called CAS number (Chemical Abstract Service number) For FGMO it was 8042-47-5 If one now goes to this list you see the name White Mineral Oil. (I am certain that you Americans will soon abriviate that to WMO) They just abandoned the name food grade. I have got that from Witco in writing so our problem is over Dr Rodriguez, I do hope that I did not upset you to much, at any rate I apoligize for the misinterpretation I got from the first dealer I contacted ,and nearly threw your eleven years work into the wastebasket.I'll give it a try and forget about the MCT's greetings from Holland, Karel Bikhorst ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 21:33:10 +0100 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Computer Software Solutions Ltd Subject: Beekeeping Software Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I should be glad to hear of beekeeping software suitable for running under Windows 3.11. I have a fill kit of software on my PC including MicroSoft Excel, MicroSoft Access and Visual Basic. As I am a beginner beekeeper I an anxious to learn as much as I can from as many sources as I can. Thanks to the contributors of Bee Line for all of the very valuable data I have received in the last month. Sincerely Tom Barrett 49 South Park Foxrock Dublin 18 Ireland e mail: cssl@iol.ie ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 13:02:39 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Andy L. Kettlewell" Subject: Re: Egyptian bees Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Could somebody send me the originol Egyptian bees message please. I am gathering information for our State Honey Queen. Andy L. Kettlewell Rungun305@Earthlink.net -- Editor of the Piechowski Home page http://home.earthlink.net/~rungun305/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:12:27 -0400 Reply-To: dronebee@norfolk.infi.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "\\Dr. Pedro P. Rodriguez" Organization: Independent non-profit research Subject: Re: Mineral Oil (Last time) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit K. Bokhorst wrote: Dear Friends: By now most of you must have read the post from Karel Bokhorst regarding FG mineral oil. Needless to say, I spent last weekend preparing a presentation paper to the FDA and a host of Congressmen asking for a reprieve. I am glad that will not be needed. My work with mineral oil continues to produce positive results as a method of control for bee mites. I have not lost a single colony to bee mites (or bee diseases) since I started using mineral oil. I will continue in search of application methods that may make the use of mineral oil suitable for commercial beekeeping. To those of you who have written in reference to this subject, thanks for your concern. Special thanks to Karel Bokhorst for his efforts looking into the subject. He saved me a lot of worries, legwork and embarrassment. Best regards. Dr. Rodriguez Virginia Beach, VA ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 15:16:56 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Andy L. Kettlewell" Subject: Re: filtering honey Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Cheesecloth will introduce particless into it that will be detected in a honey show At 04:12 PM 8/11/97 +0100, you wrote: >>> >>>My lightest honey has very fine, suspended particles in it >>>which I can't seem to get out. I have filtered it through gross and >>>fine filters, the last one being a women's stocking. I think these >>>suspended particles are fine pollen specks. It is most visible in >>>the lightest honey. Does anyone have a method for clearing up this >>>honey? >> >> If you indeed do have particles of pollen or dust, I don't know of a more >> effective filter than women's hose. Anything that would trap more solid >> particles would probably absorb too much honey and therefore be wasteful >> (coffee filters come to mind). >> >Try fine muslin or cheese cloth. Warming the honey helps to speed up filtering. > >The particles may be minute crystals beginning to form, in which case warming >will remove them. >Time and temperature should be managed though, to prevent loss of quality. > >Bridget. > > Andy L. Kettlewell Rungun305@Earthlink.net -- Editor of the Piechowski Home page http://home.earthlink.net/~rungun305/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:30:58 -0500 Reply-To: bkeep200@concentric.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "J.Troyer" Subject: Re: Egyptian bees MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The discussion of bee heredity is very fascinating. I am curious to know if any "Italian" type bees can be imported into the USA from the Australian islands. Also, are there any USA suppliers who have essentially the same stock. Does anyone have information. -- JTroyer Mail to:bkeep200@concentric.net http://www.concentric.net/~bkeep200 Honey Hill Farm - Handcrafted Honey & Beeswax Soaps ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 20:55:05 PDT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Dean Breaux Subject: Move For anyone interested in contacting Hybri-Bees Inc. we have moved our new address is 11014 Stephenson Hwy, Onsted MI. 49265 our e-Mail address Hybri Bees@ aol.com. The Breeding Program is alive and well albeit futher north. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 20:33:02 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Elizabeth M. Bowles" Subject: bee collection MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I've given up trying to get real bees for my research and have decided to do pictures. I've found quite a few this week that will help. I'll get a few from local bee keepers for a collection and then I'll present a picture book. Soooooooo if anybody wants to send a nifty bee picture you welcome to do so or even suggest an I-address to download some. BTW, Thanks again for the education I'm getting from BEE-L Sincerely, Elizabeth ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 00:38:42 +0200 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Kuyckx Maurice Subject: Apimondia congress MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hallo Beekeepers all over the World.Don't forget... It's beekeeping time in Antwerp/Belgium.From 01 to 06 of september '97, we have(Apimondia) our 35th World Congress . Greetings, Maurice. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 21:21:44 -0500 Reply-To: bkeep200@concentric.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "J.Troyer" Subject: Re: bee collection MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Elizabeth, Glad you switched to pictures. As a beekeeper, I get attached to bees and would never dream of killing one to use in a collection. I try to keep as many alive as I can, and it isn't easy sometimes with all the bee diseases and mites. Good Luck. -- JTroyer Mail to:bkeep200@concentric.net http://www.concentric.net/~bkeep200 Honey Hill Farm - Handcrafted Honey & Beeswax Soaps ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 11:41:06 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Albert W Needham Subject: Re: bee collection On Mon, 11 Aug 1997 20:33:02 -0500 "Elizabeth M. Bowles" > even suggest an I-address to download some. Elizabeth: For really nice close-up photos check out P-O Gustafsson's web site: http://www.kuai.se/~beeman Al, ----------------------------------------------------------- awneedham@juno.com - Scituate,MA,USA Cerberus - Three Sites In One Honey Bees-LottoLand-Doktor Finkle http://www.xensei.com/users/alwine/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 22:51:54 +0000 Reply-To: Barry@Birkey.Com Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Barry Birkey Organization: BIRKEY.COM Subject: Help needed with Adobe Acrobat MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello all - Can someone help this man with getting the Adobe software installed on his computer properly? Obviously someone who has already downloaded it and is on a PC. Thanks. Reply to: karltoni@apci.net Regards -Barry ----------------------------------------------------------- > Subject: adobe download > Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 22:18:39 -0000 > From: "karltoni" > To: > > I have downloaded into my hard drive-however still cannot access these > files-it is a packard bell pc that i'm using-any help from anybody would be > appreciated thanks Karl ------------------------------------------------------------ -- Barry Birkey West Chicago, Illinois USA barry@birkey.com http://www.birkey.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 09:17:54 GMT+0200 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Garth Organization: Rhodes University South Africa Subject: AHB thead Hi all I see a lot of reasonably strange feelings about the AHB expressed here. The egyptian honeybee is an afican honey bee which genetically is very very similarr to the AHB's of the est of africa. People talk about low yields from AHB hives and the absconding problem. I have a friend who kept well bred AHB in Zimmbabwe and fequently took eight supers of her best hiivees during the spring flow and a further four later in the yearr. That is not a bad yield. (shallows though) Also the stray swarm from Hawaii? AHB in Hawaii? AHB also are superior in theiir ability to build up and aree superior pollen gatherers. My two cents Keep well Garth --- Garth Cambray "Opinions expressed in this post may be those 15 Park Road of Pritz, my cat, who knows a lot about Grahamstown catfood." 6140 *garth@rucus.ru.ac.za* South Africa Phone 27-0461-311663 In general, generalisations are bad. But don't worry BEEEEEE happy. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 21:59:45 +0900 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: j h & e mcadam Subject: Re: Finding queen Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >What's a better way to find and catch the queen (unmarked) in a normal >colony (i.e., two deeps full of bees and brood)? My straightforward >approach of pulling frames and looking them over, one by one, doesn't >work very well for me. My eyeglasses get covered with sweat so I can't >see, and I get covered with mad bees stinging through my bee-suit, before >I find the old lady. A number of suggestions have been made all of which have merit and obviously fit the working pattern of the beekeepers who have adopted them. I especially agree that it is unnecessary to locate the queen unless you specifically need to. Recently laid eggs, well laid brood pattern,number of laid brood frames - all these are better indicators to queen health than glimpsing Herself. When we do need to locate a queen (for breeding daughter queens) we follow this method: Ensure queen is in lower brood box (we use a permanent queen excluder). 1. Smoke hive at front entrance. 2. Leave 2 minutes 3. Remove any top boxes and place to one side, covered. 4. Remove the outside frames of the brood box alternately, giving each an inspection for the queen (it is unlikely she will be there) and leaning on the outside so that bees can re-enter. Leave this space so that the frames are not next to the side of the box. 5. Remove each frame alternately from the outside, examining for queen ONLY. Do not get distracted by eggs, brood, honey. The queen will normally leap to your attention if you are focusing only on bees. 30 seconds a frame is normally sufficient examination. Use minimum smoke (only when the bees start to rise) and only across the top of the frames, never down between them. Replace each frame as you work, leaving a space between that frame and the unexamined frames. 6. Sometimes the queen will move away from you as you pick up each frame but in this event she will finish in the centre of the box on the last frame you pick up. This method avoids the queen getting lost outside the box, getting amongst the midst of bees on the side of the box or down into the bees at the entrance. It can be fun to practise finding the queen by taking a look at the brood box when it is first uncovered. There will be a concentration of bees. Pull out the middle frame where bees are most crowded and take a quick look for the queen, followed by the frames on either side. Betty McAdam HOG BAY APIARY Penneshaw, Kangaroo Island j.h. & e. mcadam Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Andy Nachbaur Organization: WILD BEE'S BBS (209) 826-8107 LOS BANOS, CA Subject: BEEKEEPING IN THE NEWSPAPERS *Ripped off the sci.beekeeping.newsgroup for you that can't get it.. ---------------------------------------- BEEKEEPING IN THE NEWSPAPERS What others are saying about beekeeping The last few weeks several stories have popped up on the approach of the so called KILLER BEES. You and I know that if you are killed by a truck it really does not make much difference as to what breed it was, but with bees its those nasty African bees who are going to get you... I have already posted the story on the "killer" bees coming in to the California & Hawaii sugar dock's, from Hawaii, I guess, that has no history of African bees. Also how the spray job done on them was so bad that the queen may have escaped and a search was on to find her.(BS) Another "story" found in the San Diego, California UNION TRIBUNE, (you must be a member to read this, the good news is it is free). Try this: http://www.uniontrib.com/ Its a short one anyway and little detail is included but I know that the University of California, and the Calif. Dept. of Agriculture has been looking at all bees in the Coachella valley and this story is headlined, KILLER BEES COLONIZE VALLEY....based on two bees captured at random last April and DNA tests just confirmed they were AFRIKANER. I guess they were still working on the OJ tests or something that it takes four months to test two bees? Anyway the article goes on to say this evidence combined with bee "contingents" found near the Salton Sea in September 1995 "indicate the entire Coachella Valley has been colonized" according to his lordship, Cal Kaminskas, a county ass. agriculture commissar. I think this was the same guy who says these "killer" bees are traveling by train, but never explained why they got off half way to the end of the track at the Canadian boarder in Washington state. I translated all this activity in San Diego and Riverside County as being a way out from what has been a very expensive experiment in regulatory process and if continued would cost 100's of millions in state costs and more in lost agriculture production if a real quarantine was put in place as advertised. The science in all this Africian bees stuff is so poor that legally it can not support a real quarantine and all federal Afro bee efforts are soon to be stopped. I wonder just what it takes to wake these people up to the fact that honeybees do not respect political bounders like their keepers... The TEXAS story continues.. I don't know how many counties there are in this great state but now 89 have been quarantined for Africanized honey bees. This story can be found in the LUBBOCK AVALANCHE-JOURNAL, 7-19-97, and is on the web. Use NEWSWORKS and you will find it by searching for Africanized or Killer bees. The meat of this story is that the Africanized bees have moved farther north in Texas then was planned for. Some of the BS (bee science) is this story is way out, TEXAS tails I would guess, like "in the spring the Africanized species divided its hive into as many as 14 units and begins moving. That swarm is often no larger than a softball, Jackson said." or how that "swarms four feed or closer to the ground.....Jackson says, "because the swarm may be Africanized honey bees." Then he continues, "The bees, however, also can go in trees or into the ground as well as in water meters." It was a busy week for the "killer" bees and their tails. ttul, the OLd Drone (c) Permission is granted to freely copy this document in any form, or to print for any use. (w)Opinions are not necessarily facts. Use at own risk. --- ~ QMPro 1.53 ~ Vereniging tot Bevordering van de Bijenteelt --- ~ QMPro 1.53 ~ "Where there are fruits & nuts, there are beekeepers" ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 09:56:41 -0500 Reply-To: snapshot@pbmo.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "M. C. Michel" Organization: Snap Shot Subject: Re: Bee Vision Colors MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Does anyone know just WHAT color is "Bee Yellow" or "Bee Blue-green"? I want to paint my hives some different colors to cut down on drifting and to make the more colorful. I do not know what colors the text are refering to when they say "BEE BLUE" etc. I would like to avoid the silly mistake of the other wise nice bee house on the cover of "Bee Biz". The hives all have very nice patches of colors, many of which the bees do not see. Nice try but not very useful. I need color names I can take to the hardware store. Thanks, Chris Michel Poplar Bluff, MO ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 10:18:10 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Walter T. Weller" Subject: Queen-hunting To the list - Thank you all for your many helpful suggestions anent queen-hunting. I think they will ease our queen-finding efforts in future. To allay concerns expressed by more than one respondent -- no, I do not search for queens just for fun. I only do it when I must requeen, and this is such a time -- I have a "hot" (i.e., vicious) hive, with terrible comb-building discipline (burr- and bridge-comb everywhere, erratically-drawn comb on foundations), and no offsetting good qualities. Ergo, the queen must die. Long live the queen. Walter Weller Post Office Box 270 Wakefield, Louisiana 70784 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 11:49:30 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Faith Andrews Bedford Subject: Re: Chemical Kill In a message dated 97-08-08 19:57:57 EDT, you write: << The Diazon was poured into mounds and put up under the hives in large quanties >> a landlord did this? Why? Had he asked you to move them and you hadn't? That's incredible. One would think you could sue for damages of at the very least, replacement of the bees. A very sad story. Faith Andrews Bedford, Ivy, Va and Tampa ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 11:50:57 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Faith Andrews Bedford Subject: Re: Ulees Gold- again Hi all - I had an opportunity this past weekend why attending "A Cross Creek Summer" (a festival focusing on the life and work of he writer Marjorie Kinan Rawlings) in Gainesville, FL to meet Victor Nunez, director of Ulee's Gold. His first film, Gal Young'Un - based on Rawlings story - was being shown. Afterward I complimented him on Ulee's Gold and told him how delighted I was with its verisimiltude regarding the bees and the care of them. He was pleased to know his efforts had been appreciated and told me that Ulee had been voted "Beekeeper of the Year" at the AFofB meeting. I had not heard that but was tickled. I was also saddened to hear that at that meeting the last ever merit badge for beekeeping as awarded to a Boy Scout. Has there really been no interest for decades Is that why it is being discontinued. Nunez is a net guy. Very unpretentous. And I loved Ulee's Gold.....on many levels. It was a very subtle movie. My favorite kind. Faith Andrews Bedford, Ivy VA and Tampa ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 11:10:18 -0500 Reply-To: "Arbor J. Buchanan" Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Arbor J. Buchanan" Subject: sci ag newsgroup problem MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII I am experiencing difficulty accessing the "sci agriculture beekeeping" newsgroup. I am using Netscape 2.02. "File" does not have an "add newsgroup" command. I found sci. agriculture beekeeping via a search, but was "not given permission" to read it. Any suggestions? ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 15:25:44 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Walter T. Weller" Subject: Re: Chemical Kill On Tue, 12 Aug 1997 11:49:30 -0400 Faith Andrews Bedford writes: > That's incredible. One would think you could sue for damages of at the very >least, replacement of the bees. A very sad story. >Faith Andrews Bedford, Ivy, Va and Tampa Oh, crikey. Here we go again. Doesn't anybody ever think of anything except suing somebody?! What has happened to us? What has happened to the legal profession? Walter Weller (RETIRED attorney) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 20:50:02 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Martin Braunstein Subject: Re: Mineral Oil Sourcing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi all! For those in the USA I'd like to suggest a major supplier of several different types of FGMO. Its name is Penreco and one of its most importan= t mineral oil plants is located at Dickinson, Texas. Their different MO brands are know by the name of Drakeol. They offer at least 7 kinds of MO and the main difference between them is their viscosity. On the other way, Witco produces what they call BLANDOL (white mineral oi= l) which is exactly alike DRAKEOL but a little bit more expensive. Both of them are purchased in large quantities by firms who use it as a raw material for baby mineral oil. The C&F quotation for these products in Argentine ports ranks between U$S 0.70 to U$S 0.90 per Kg in 55 Gal. drums as a full container load. Hope this information is useful for somebody on Bee-L trying get a realistic picture on the cost of this treatment for varroa mites. Mart=EDn Braunstein Malka Caba=F1a Ap=EDcola e-mail: malka@webnet.com.ar ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 20:23:05 -0400 Reply-To: dronebee@norfolk.infi.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "\\Dr. Pedro P. Rodriguez" Organization: Independent non-profit research Subject: Re: Mineral Oil Sourcing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Martin Braunstein wrote: Hello friends: As you should know by now, FG mineral oil has changed to white mineral oil. This is only a nomenclature change. Nothing else has changed. Good luck. This is also evidence that this type of mineral oil is not expensive. It is still far less expensive than other acaricides in the United States and I suppose in Canada. Martin: Muchas gracias amigo por tu amable contribucion. Se te agradece. Un abrazo. Oye, puedes escribirme en espanol si asi lo deseas. Pedro ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 21:27:45 -0400 Reply-To: dronebee@norfolk.infi.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "\\Dr. Pedro P. Rodriguez" Organization: Independent non-profit research Subject: Re: Ulees Gold- again MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Faith Andrews Bedford wrote: Dear Faith: I was a Boy Scout and have been a Boy Scout counselor for many years. I became sick to my heart when I was told that the merit badge for beekeeping had been discontinued. I wrote to the National Director of the Boy Scouts and was told that it had been discontinued and that there were no possibilities that it would ever be reinstated, period. I wrote letters to many prominent citizens and organizations in our country asking for support (I included copies of my letter and of the reply from NBS). I received only one reply to my letter (I believe from an Alabama organization). In my opinion, beekeepers get what we deserve, zilch. If we do not respond to things that concern our beloved bees, we can not expect the public to fight our battles for us! There are a lot that could be said on this subject, but I think that it would become just another wasted effort. Best regards. Dr. Rodriguez Virginia Beach, VA ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 21:39:37 -0400 Reply-To: dronebee@norfolk.infi.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "\\Dr. Pedro P. Rodriguez" Organization: Independent non-profit research Subject: Re: BEEKEEPING IN THE NEWSPAPERS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Andy Nachbaur wrote: Hi Andy: When you abbreviated "ass. agriculture . . . ," was that on purpose? Just kidding. Best regards. Pedro ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 22:50:32 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Albert W Needham Subject: Re: Chemical Kill On Tue, 12 Aug 1997 15:25:44 -0500 "Walter T. Weller" writes: > >Oh, crikey. Here we go again. Doesn't anybody ever think of anything >except suing somebody?! What has happened to us? What has happened >to the legal profession? >Walter Weller >(RETIRED attorney) > The same old story Walter $$$$$ RULE ! Tis the way it is these days..unfortunately! Even the criminals in jail are suing because they don't get finger doilies with their meals. I hope that the bees never take it into their mind to sue us for stealing their liquid gold! Al, ----------------------------------------------------------- awneedham@juno.com - Scituate,MA,USA Cerberus - Three Sites In One Honey Bees-LottoLand-Doktor Finkle http://www.xensei.com/users/alwine/ ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 19:50:00 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Andy Nachbaur Organization: WILD BEE'S BBS (209) 826-8107 LOS BANOS, CA Subject: JULY HONEY PRICES Some JULY 1997 Honey prices as reported in the NATIONAL HONEY MARKET NEWS and other sources for 1997 crop Honey.. __________________________________________________________ (//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////) (//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////) /~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~\ | Some selected US HONEY Prices for 1997 crop honey. | | | | IMPORTS May 1997 totals 36.3 million kilograms | | EXPORTS 1.6 million kilograms | | CANADA -Manitoba | : clover 73 water white : | ARGENTINA light amber | | mixed flower 69-89 E. Coast white-lt amber | | mixed flower 93 W. Coast white | | MEXICO Mixed 61-62 light amber | | Texas Tallow 64 light amber | | Louisiana Tallow 64 light amber | | NORTH DAKOTA | | Clover 70 new crop water white | | CALIFORNIA | | Alfalfa 85 white | | Orange 77 white | | Mixed Flowers 60-63 ex lt amber - amber | | MONTANA Clover 78-91 white | | S. DAKOTA Clover 88-91 white -light amber : | WASHINGTON | | Fire Weed 92 white | | FLORIDA Orange 90 amber | | Gallberry 80-85 white- ex lt amber | | Mixed Flowers 63-72 light amber -amber | |____________________________________________________________| \ The market continues lower with spotty new crop prospects/ \ and increased imports looking for the same US $$$$$! / \------------------------------------------------------/ (c) Permission is granted to freely copy this document in any form, or to print for any use. (w)Opinions are not necessarily facts. Use at own risk. 81297 --- ~~ "Where there is honey, there are beekeepers" --- ~ QMPro 1.53 ~ "Where there are fruits & nuts, there are beekeepers" ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 06:39:53 -1000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Walter Patton Subject: Re: AHB thead MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit For the record for those who wonder there are no AHB in Hawaii. I think someone mentioned this in jest. Let there bee no confusion NO AHB in HAWAII Aloha Walter Walter & Elisabeth Patton hihoney@ilhawaii.net 808-964-5401 Hale Lamalani { House of Heavenly Light } {Hawaii Std. Time} Bed & Breakfast www.alohamall.com/hamakua/lamalani.htm Hawaiian Honey House { Beekeepers & Honey Packers } 100 % HAWAII HONEY www.alohamall.com/hamakua/hihoney.htm 27-703 A. Ka`ie`ie Rd., Papa`ikou, Hawaii 96781 " ALOHA ALL " " The Beehive, the Fountain of Youth and Health " ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 05:48:32 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Curtis Atkinson Subject: Killer Bees on ESPN2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT A friend of mine said he saw a very good program on killer bees on ESPN2 afew weeks ago. Some of his comments were that African bees respond to CO2 or the breath of the person to attack. Some of the bee keepers used a tube to breath through and the bees were docile. The program also explained why requeening with Italian queens do not work. The Africian bees queens mature one day earlier than Italians. I wonder if anyone elso saw this program. I tried to contact ESPN to see if the program would be re-broadcast but I got no reply. Curtis Atkinson 2701 S. Caraway Jonesboro, Ar 72401 501-932-7838 catkinson@intellinet.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 05:48:32 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Curtis Atkinson Subject: Bees with black bodies MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT I have an Italian bees in one hive. When I checked this hive recently, a few of the bees has a black body with the head being Italian, and a few bees have a black head and regular colored body. I have never seen this before. What gives? Curtis Atkinson 2701 S. Caraway Jonesboro, Ar 72401 501-932-7838 catkinson@intellinet.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 08:17:18 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Conrad Sigona Subject: Re: Killer Bees on ESPN2 In-Reply-To: <199708131049.FAA21263@sibyl.intellinet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > The program also explained why requeening with Italian queens do not > work. The Africian bees queens mature one day earlier than Italians. I don't see why this would matter. If you killed the African queen and introduced an Italian, you would have an Italian no matter how early the Africans mature, no? Conrad Sigona conrad@ntcnet.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 01:25:38 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Albert W Needham Subject: TOBE For those of you who may be interested I recently discovered an alternative "FREE" browser available called appropriately "The Other Browser". At first use, it installed nicely and automatically picked up my Netscape Settings ( It does not appear that this automatic feature is available for that other Monster Browser so you will have to plug in its settings using its wizard ). It looks pretty good! It will also pick up Eudora's settings if you have that program. It is also useful to view your own web site to pick up any corrections you may need to make on your pages. It is available for Win 3.1 or better, WIN 95/NT. Requires 10mb and 8 meg memory suggested. Anyway, if you haven't heard of this alternative and would like to check it out, go to: http://www.theother.com Al, ----------------------------------------------------------- awneedham@juno.com - Scituate,MA,USA Cerberus - Three Sites In One Honey Bees-LottoLand-Doktor Finkle http://www.xensei.com/users/alwine/ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 12:17:09 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Ron Bogansky Subject: Pumpkin Honey Note: I sent this message yesterday, but I don't think it went out. If you receive it twice, my apologies. Hi All, A friend who grows pumpkins had a pollination problem last season. There were no bees in his area. They were probably wiped out by varroa. This year I put three hives on his property. According to him the fruit set is three times last year and the fruit is bigger than what he usually sees for this time of year. It has been dry this year. He said the bees are in the field till about 11 am. I think he has at least 20 acres in pumpkins/squash. The spring/early summer flow was good so I will keep this as a permanent yard and add more hives next year. My questions. Although he is happy with three colonies how many should there be per acre? Do bees make honey from pumpkins/squash? Frank Pellet's book on honey plants states that the honey is dark and poor quality. I have not seen dark honey in three years especially since I started treating for mites and leave the fall flow to the bees. I could use a little. By the way, if anyone was curious, the bear never returned, my family is still helping out a lot, and the cast came off last Wednesday. The Dr. said the bones mended quickly. Maybe the bee stings helped. I still have a "ton" of work to catch up on. But my patience has improved, a little. Thanks, Ron Bogansky Kutztown, PA ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 19:41:15 +0000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Gordon Scott Subject: Basingstoke Beekeeper (newsletter) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Our June-97 newsletter is finally on the WebSite, as are some older archived copies (1990..1994 (text), 1996, 1997 (html)). -- Gordon Scott gordon@apis.demon.co.uk gordon@multitone.co.uk (work) The Basingstoke Beekeeper (newsletter) beekeeper@apis.demon.co.uk Gordon's Apis Home Page Beekeeper; Kendo 3rd Dan, retd :-(; Sometime sailor. Hampshire, England. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 12:21:51 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Philippe Aras Subject: Bee Fables MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Not my kind of joke but some of you may appreciate Joke of the month from: http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Beekeeping/ A beekeeper had a summer house in the Maine woods. Each summer he'd invite a different friend to spend a week or two. On one occasion, he invited a Czechoslovakian to stay with him. They had a splendid time in the country - rising early and living in the great outdoors. Early one morning they went out to pick berries for their morning breakfast. As they went around the berry patch along came two huge bears. The beekeeper dashed for cover. His friend wasn't so lucky and the male bear reached him and swallowed him whole. The beekeeper ran back to his truck, drove to town as fast has he could, and got the sheriff. The sheriff grabbed his rifle and dashed back to the berry patch with the beekeeper. Sure enough, both bears were still there. "He's in THAT one!" cried the beekeeper, pointing to the male. The sheriff looked at the bears, and without batting an eye, leveled his gun, took careful aim, and SHOT THE FEMALE! "Whatd'ya do that for?!" exclaimed the beekeeper, "I said he was in the other!" "Yep," said the sheriff, "and would YOU believe a beekeeper who told you that the Czech was in the Male?" ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 12:43:46 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "(Thomas) (Cornick)" Subject: Re: Killer Bees on ESPN2 In a message dated 97-08-13 10:42:00 EDT, you write: << I wonder if anyone elso saw this program. I tried to contact ESPN to see if the program would be re-broadcast but I got no reply. Curtis Atkinson 2701 S. Caraway Jonesboro, Ar 72401 501-932-7838 catkinson@intellinet.com >> The program has bee broadcast on public TV stations here that past few weeks. It was pretty comprehensive including an interview with the researcher who first brought the bees from africa and some hindsight. And a commercial migratory beekeeper requeening an aggressive colony. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 11:45:12 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "FULVIO SANTAMARIA J." Subject: ELECTRICAL ALVEOLUS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Hi All, I need an electrical albeolus pressing machine, can anybody help me? My adress: fusantamaria@isa.com.co Thanks!!! ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 11:33:17 EDT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jim Moore Subject: Re: Killer Bees on ESPN2 I origianlly saw the show on TLC (The Learning Channel). The point about African queens emerging one day earlier has to do with swarm and supercedure cells. The African queen emerges and then kills her sisters or half sisters as the case may be. If you requeen with a queen which has not mated with any African drones then the first generation queens will be free of any African genes. So swarms of supercedure queens will be okay. However since these first generation queens mate in an uncontrolled environment the female offspring may well be from African drone matings. Thus the hives temperment may be partially African, depending on the proportion of matings with African drones. The second generation queen cells may produce Afican queens which emerge a day earlier and ensure genetic dominance. It is these African queens that will cause the biggest problems as now the drone offspring are African. These drones are the ones that cause the spread of the Africanized genes far and wide. This is the reason for prompt requeening of suspected Africanized hives. The first generation only the workers are Africanized and it is a hive problem. This is an alert signal! The next generation it is the workers and the drones. Now it is not just a hive problem but a local problem and the drones are free to mate far and wide. So be quick about requeening cranky hives and keep the hive from making any queen cells that produce Africanized queens and there will be far fewer Africanized drones about. Happily here in Afican bee free New England, but requeening cranky hives anyway. Who knows maybe one of those southern queens did mate with an African drone! Jim Moore 2nd year, 5 hives Massachusetts ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 14:12:39 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Ron Bogansky Subject: Pumpkins Hi All, A friend who grows pumpkins had a pollination problem last season. There were no bees in his area. They were probably wiped out by varroa. This year I put three hives on his property. According to him the fruit set is three times last year and the fruit is bigger than what he usually sees for this time of year. It has been dry this year. He said the bees are in the field till about 11 am. I think he has at least 20 acres in pumpkins/squash. The spring/early summer flow was good so I will keep this as a permanent yard and add more hives next year. My questions. Although he is happy with three colonies how many should there be per acre? Do bees make honey from pumpkins/squash? Frank Pellett's book on honey plants states that the honey is dark and poor quality. I have not seen dark honey in three years, especially since I started treating for mites and leaving the fall flow to the bees. I could use a little. By the way, if anyone was curious, the bear never returned, my family is still helping out a lot, and the cast came off last Wednesday. The Dr. said the bones mended quickly. Maybe the bee stings helped. I still have a "ton" of work to catch up on. But my patience has improved, a little. Thanks, Ron Bogansky Kutztown, PA ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 08:52:22 +1200 Reply-To: beeman@insurer.com Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jonathan KP Marshall Organization: Taranaki Honey Supplies Subject: Re: JULY HONEY PRICES MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Are these prices per kilo or per pound? > Some JULY 1997 Honey prices as reported in the NATIONAL HONEY > MARKET NEWS and other sources for 1997 crop Honey.. > __________________________________________________________ > (//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////) > (//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////) > /~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~\ > | Some selected US HONEY Prices for 1997 crop honey. | > | | > | IMPORTS May 1997 totals 36.3 million kilograms | > | EXPORTS 1.6 million kilograms | > | CANADA -Manitoba | > : clover 73 water white : > | ARGENTINA light amber | > | mixed flower 69-89 E. Coast white-lt amber | > | mixed flower 93 W. Coast white | > | MEXICO Mixed 61-62 light amber | > | Texas Tallow 64 light amber | > | Louisiana Tallow 64 light amber | > | NORTH DAKOTA | > | Clover 70 new crop water white | > | CALIFORNIA | > | Alfalfa 85 white | > | Orange 77 white | > | Mixed Flowers 60-63 ex lt amber - amber | > | MONTANA Clover 78-91 white | > | S. DAKOTA Clover 88-91 white -light amber : > | WASHINGTON | > | Fire Weed 92 white | > | FLORIDA Orange 90 amber | > | Gallberry 80-85 white- ex lt amber | > | Mixed Flowers 63-72 light amber -amber | > |____________________________________________________________| > \ The market continues lower with spotty new crop prospects/ > \ and increased imports looking for the same US $$$$$! / > \------------------------------------------------------/ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 08:54:12 +1200 Reply-To: beeman@insurer.com Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Jonathan KP Marshall Organization: Taranaki Honey Supplies Subject: Re: AHB thead MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Test seem to prove otherwise, Walter. > For the record for those who wonder there are no AHB in Hawaii. > I think someone mentioned this in jest. Let there bee no confusion NO AHB > in HAWAII Aloha ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 16:37:33 -0400 Reply-To: dronebee@norfolk.infi.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "\\Dr. Pedro P. Rodriguez" Organization: Independent non-profit research Subject: Re: Killer Bees on ESPN2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Conrad Sigona wrote: Dear Friends: In this scenario, what really matters is with what kind of drones the new queen mates. If the new queen should mate with africanized drones, the offspring of the new queen will have africanized traits! Best regards. Dr. Rodriguez Virginia Beach, VA ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 16:41:50 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Mike Swintosky ([330] 471-3128)" Subject: Applying Vegetable Oil or Mineral Oil With all the talk about experimental use of oils for mite treatments, I thought I'd add my two cents worth. One of the biggest issues with the FGMO treatment initiated by Dr. Rodriguez is the frequency of application, and thus relatively large labor cost. Why not combine the oil with solid vegetable shortening in grease patties? I did a simple test using 1 part oil, 3 parts solid shortening and 8 parts granulated sugar. All ingredients were dumped into a kitchen mixer and blended till smooth. The consistency was like a light cake frosting. A question I had was whether the oil might separate out at hive temperatures. I put a small mound of the mixture on a plate and put it in the oven which was pre-heated to 100F. After 2 hours at temperatures between 95F and 100F there was no sign of drooping or separation. I don't know how useful this information is but I hadn't seen any previous mention of the idea of mixing solid and liquid shortening. The proportions I used may not be ideal. Perhaps a higher proportion of oil is possible, or maybe the proportion I chose is adequate. I just thought that patties offer a means of applying the treatment less frequently. Mike Swintosky Dellroy, Ohio 3rd Year Beekeeper 3 Hives (Buckfasts) ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 14:09:33 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Bill Deer Subject: Re: Chemical Kill MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii thank you! ---"Walter T. Weller" wrote: > > On Tue, 12 Aug 1997 11:49:30 -0400 Faith Andrews Bedford > writes: > > > That's incredible. One would think you could sue for damages of at the > very > >least, replacement of the bees. A very sad story. > >Faith Andrews Bedford, Ivy, Va and Tampa > > Oh, crikey. Here we go again. Doesn't anybody ever think of anything > except suing somebody?! What has happened to us? What has happened to > the legal profession? > > Walter Weller > (RETIRED attorney) > _____________________________________________________________________ Sent by RocketMail. Get your free e-mail at http://www.rocketmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 14:32:11 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Bill Deer Subject: Geez.... what was that? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii A little red critter looking like a mobile red dot on the back of a bee. I tried to get a better look but it (the critter not bee) moved rather quickly to the underside of the bee and I lost the bee in the excitement... Bill Deer (newbee) _____________________________________________________________________ Sent by RocketMail. Get your free e-mail at http://www.rocketmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 18:01:17 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "(Thomas) (Cornick)" Subject: Re: Pumpkins Now we have some experts in pollination on this list and I am not one of them but here is my 2 cents worth. Pumpkins are a native crop in the americas in fact one of the three sisters the indians grew (corn beans and pumpkins or squash) If you wipe out the native pollinators by plowing fence to fence or using pesticides profusely then you will have to bring in honeybees. In my garden which has not seen much in the way of ag chemicals for more than 15 years there are wild bees I havn't found pictures of in books pollinating pumpkins and squash. Some of these bees can be seen on sunflowers also. Tom ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 14:59:47 PDT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Dennis Subject: Re: Pumpkin Honey In-Reply-To: <0044510002207898000002*@MHS> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; X-MAPIextension=".TXT" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Pumpkin Honey tastes like pumpkin pie to me! Got some by accident and = it may have been mixed with other things. Dennis Morefield Sideline Beekeeper, Oregon, USA denmar@mind.net ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 18:13:06 -0400 Reply-To: dronebee@norfolk.infi.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "\\Dr. Pedro P. Rodriguez" Organization: Independent non-profit research Subject: Re: Applying Vegetable Oil or Mineral Oil MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mike Swintosky ([330] 471-3128) wrote: Dear Friends: Thanks for your observations Mike. Good work. I tried patties as part of my initial work with FGMO last winter. My findings were not too encouraging because the oil did separate from the patties. I have been waiting for the onset of cold temperatures to try mineral oil patties again. Please remember that in order for the oil to work as a mite "killer" the oil must be readily accessible in order for it to block the respiratory and moisture intake pores of the mites. I am still working with this principle trying to find ways and means that will make the process cost effective for commercial application. Perhaps with the assistance of all of you combined a procedure will be developed that will meet that goal. Best regards. Dr. Rodriguez Virginia Beach, VA ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 17:40:36 -0500 Reply-To: bkeep200@concentric.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "J.Troyer" Subject: Re: Geez.... what was that? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bill Deer asked what that little red critter was running around the back of a bee. I would say it is a very healthy varroa mite based on size, color and agility. That is a good reminder that it is time to start mite treatments here in the midwest USA. -- JTroyer Mail to:bkeep200@concentric.net http://www.concentric.net/~bkeep200 Honey Hill Farm - Handcrafted Honey & Beeswax Soaps ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 15:00:02 -0800 Reply-To: beeman@Alaska.NET Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Tom & Carol Elliott Organization: Home Subject: Varroa life span MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I believe this question has been asked before (possibly even by me). Can anyone tell me what the life span of the varroa mites are? One of Brother Adams tools in hive management was a break in the brood cycle. How long would such a break have to be to eliminate varroa? If nothing else treatment during such a break might eliminate a larger proportion of the individual mites. Any answers? -- "Test everything. Hold on to the good." (1 Thessalonians 5:21) Tom Elliott Chugiak, Alaska U.S.A. beeman@alaska.net ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 15:02:44 -0800 Reply-To: beeman@Alaska.NET Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Tom & Carol Elliott Organization: Home Subject: Beekeepers in Mojave Desert MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I am interested in locating one or more beekeepers in the area of the Mojave Desert near Barstow. Anyone know of such a person? Any beekeepers from Barstow or Victorville or that part of California out there? Thanks for any help you can give. -- "Test everything. Hold on to the good." (1 Thessalonians 5:21) Tom Elliott Chugiak, Alaska U.S.A. beeman@alaska.net ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 19:15:20 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Chip McCurdy Subject: Re: Geez.... what was that? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit You have varroa mites. C. ---------- > From: Bill Deer > To: BEE-L@CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU > Subject: Geez.... what was that? > Date: Wednesday, August 13, 1997 5:32 PM > > A little red critter looking like a mobile red dot on the back of a > bee. > I tried to get a better look but it (the critter not bee) moved rather > quickly to the underside of the bee and I lost the bee in the > excitement... > > Bill Deer (newbee) > > > > > > > _____________________________________________________________________ > Sent by RocketMail. Get your free e-mail at http://www.rocketmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 23:23:15 +1200 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Nick Wallingford Organization: Bay of Plenty Polytechnic Subject: Re: Geez.... what was that? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT > You have varroa mites. Not that I doubt the diagnosis, but red spider mites also run around in the hives sometimes. I'd have someone who knows take a look at the critters. Don't send them to me! (\ Nick Wallingford {|||8- home nickw@wave.co.nz (/ work nw1@boppoly.ac.nz NZ Beekeeping http://www.beekeeping.co.nz ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 20:08:32 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Walter T. Weller" Subject: Re: Geez.... what was that? On Wed, 13 Aug 1997 14:32:11 -0700 Bill Deer writes: >A little red critter looking like a mobile red dot on the back of a >bee. >I tried to get a better look but it (the critter not bee) moved rather >quickly to the underside of the bee and I lost the bee in the >excitement... > >Bill Deer (newbee) You probably just saw your first Varroa mite, Bill Walter Weller Post Office Box 270 Wakefield, Louisiana 70784 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 21:14:39 PDT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Dean Breaux Subject: Re: Bees with black bodies >I have an Italian bees in one hive. When I checked this hive >recently, a few of the bees has a black body with the head being >Italian, and a few bees have a black head and regular colored body. I >have never seen this before. What gives? The body color of the bees is controlled by the action of two independent genic systems. The genic systems are a, Major factor genes of Black affected or modified by minor genes (polygenes). Having said that keep in mind that most "Italian" bees in the USA are blends of several races of bees that have been in this country for many years that have been selected and bred to perform as Italians. It would appear from your comments, that the stock of Italian bees, that you have is showing some genetic diversity in color. This diversity could be due to many factors both within the strain or from out side of the strain. An out side influnce could be from the drone source (a mating with one dark type drone or drone of another race). It is hard to comment on the two toned bee you speak of with out seeing it, but for general discussion. There was a two toned bee decribed as yellow face. It was decribed in the book Bee Genetics and Breeding. It is a genetic mutant along the lines of the cordavans. It is the partial replacement of the black cutical color on the head of the bee with yellow. I myself have never seen one. For more information try and secure a copy of Bee Genetics and breeding and look in the chapter about Visible Mutants. I hope this helps Dean M. Breaux Hybri-Bees Inc. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 01:13:00 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Andy Nachbaur Organization: WILD BEE'S BBS (209) 826-8107 LOS BANOS, CA Subject: 1996 SUE BEE EARNINGS *FYI* From the sci.agric.news group for those who are interested in such things that you won't find in your local newspaper or bee papers. ---------------------------------------- SIOUX HONEY ASSOCIATION FINAL EARNINGS ON 1996 HONEY POOL On August 4, 1997 the Sioux Honey Association a CO-OP of honey producers who market honey nation wide under the SUE BEE and AUNT SUE labels announced their final earning for the 1996 crop. They represent the largest pool of honey produced and marketed in the US and they have two major honey packing plants located in Southern California and Sioux City Iowa. Returns to producers represent what is left after all the costs of packing, selling, and shipping have been paid. A percentage of the honey producers returns are held back and invested in the company and is returned when the producer retires from the company. Membership is open to US producers only, and to be a member requires the production of the types of honey that are marketed by the association. What was left for the honey producer members of SIOUX HONEY ASSOCIATION: Sue Bee Bottlegrade Base Price $.8608 (USA $$) (Average Bonus for Color & Moisture) .0322 ((this is the Clover, Orange and ------ high quality table honey's)) $.8930 Aunt Sue Bottlegrade $.8508 (Average Bonus)((this is the high .0096 quality darker, or western type honey)) ------ $.8604 Pool #3 $.8308 ((darker Industrial use Honey)) Special Pool ((darker Industrial use $.8208 Honey such as TALLOW tree honey)) Pool #4 ((honey you would not want $.5000 to eat, melter, or high moisture)) BEESWAX Choice Wax $2.3749 Light Wax $2.3249 Dark Wax $2.2749 All Sioux Bee honey producers honey is regularly checked for adulteration and farm chemicals and if found is returned at the members expense and regulatory authorities are notified. A Sioux Bee member pays two or three times for honey promotion, they pay the government as producers, as packers, and pay to promote their own products with the only honey packer national advertising of honey. Sioux Honey is the #1 US quality and wholesale price leader and other large packers can only compete with lower price and using cheeper imported honey. Sioux Bee has one small producer in Mexico and exports packed honey world wide. ttul, the OLd Drone (c) Permission is granted to freely copy this document in any form, or to print for any personal use. (w)Opinions are not necessarily facts. Use at own risk. 081297 --- ~ QMPro 1.53 ~ http://suebee.com (HONEY LOVERS INFORMATION) ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 19:25:52 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Michael Simics Subject: Beevenom and MS Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi folks, I'm a little slow on the thread here but I did see Tom Barrett's inquiry on whether or not to try Bee venom for MS. While Michael Simics is in Calgary, Alberta collecting venom I offered to respond to his mail. I am very impressed with the positive feedback from a multitude of people who are using bee venom for their MS. No one finds it pleasant but all seem to state it is worthwhile trying. I also want to let you know Michael has a web site at http://www.direct.ca/beevenom. Darlene ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 21:58:56 -0600 Reply-To: ribac@wi.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Randy, Isa & Alina Chase" Subject: Re: Applying Vegetable Oil or Mineral Oil MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have been experimenting with a slurry made from FGMO and beeswax. I place a large spoonful of the glop on a transparency (the plastic sheets used with overhead projectors), place another transparancy on top and smooth the stuff out. I then proceed to the bee yards where the transparencies are separated and placed in the enterance of each hive. I still have mites but a lot fewer than when I started using the slurry. It takes about 10 days for the bees to clean off the plastic transparencies. A couple of hives have even expelled the offending plastic sheets when the amount of slurry has been reduced to a point that they can move it. I mix 16 ounces of FGMO to about 2/3 cup of melted bees wax (a little less of 2/3 cup or the slurry becomes too hard and isn't readily picked up by the bees). Just having fun in Wisconsin! ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 16:58:39 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Paul Cronshaw, D.C." Subject: Source of White Mineral Oil In-Reply-To: <199708130359.UAA09696@beach.silcom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Dr. Rodriguez, Did I miss something or was a US source of WHITE mineral given in previous posts? Honey is coming off my hives soon and I want to get ready to test some WMO vs Apistan on my bees using some of the Mann Lake sticky boards. Dislodged mites will fall off and be caught on the trap so they can be counted. BTW have you used the sticky board method to test the effectiveness of mites with WMO vs Apistan? Paul Cronshaw DC Cyberchiro and Hobby beekeeper Santa Barbara, CA ********** Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 20:23:05 -0400 From: "\\Dr. Pedro P. Rodriguez" Subject: Re: Mineral Oil Sourcing Martin Braunstein wrote: Hello friends: As you should know by now, FG mineral oil has changed to white mineral oil. This is only a nomenclature change. Nothing else has changed. Good luck. This is also evidence that this type of mineral oil is not expensive. It is still far less expensive than other acaricides in the United States and I suppose in Canada. Martin: Muchas gracias amigo por tu amable contribucion. Se te agradece. Un abrazo. Oye, puedes escribirme en espanol si asi lo deseas. Pedro ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 21:57:44 -0600 Reply-To: allend@internode.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: Allen Dick Organization: The Beekeepers Subject: Apistan and *Tracheal Mites* MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT I've been wondering: Apistan works on varroa when they are outside the cell -- the so called phoretic state. Fluvalinate is hard on varroa, but has relatively little effect on the bees. Here's the question: Tracheal mites have to spend time outside the bee in order to transfer to other (younger) bees. In such a state, are they susceptible to some extent to Apistan (R), or are they -- like the honeybee -- somewhat fluvalinate tolerant? Allen ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 22:44:53 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Paul Cronshaw, D.C." Subject: SF Chronicle Article on AHB Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Buzz on `Killer Bees' Wanes Experts note slower, `sweeter' swarms colonizing California Charles Petit, Chronicle Science Writer After advancing rapidly into Texas from Mexico in 1990, the much-feared ``killer bee'' invasion seems to be losing its sting as it slowly enters southeastern California. The insects have begun colonizing agricultural and desert areas east of San Diego. A handful showed up in Crockett recently, apparently after hitchhiking from Guatemala aboard a sugar freighter, and were killed by authorities. But while the bees are still a concern, experts say they seem to be losing some of their nastiness. ``The bee is moving pretty much along the path we expected . . . but it is moving much slower,'' said William Routhier, a California Food and Agriculture Department pest specialist based in San Diego. ``The bees were expanding their range at about 300 miles per year in Central America. Now it's down to about 40 miles per year.'' Possible reasons include genetic dilution from the high density of commercially raised, common European honeybees in the United States; parasitic mites that prey on all honeybees, which have recently hit those living in the wild particularly hard; and harsh conditions in the arid regions of Texas, Arizona, New Mexico and California that the bees have reached so far. The bees are descendants of a wild strain of African insects that escaped an agricultural experiment in Brazil 40 years ago. They tend to be more aggressive than ordinary honeybees and are blamed for hundreds of human deaths and widespread losses of livestock in South and Central America. But those showing up in California, Arizona, New Mexico and Texas may not quite live up to their Hollywood horror-movie reputations. ``They are not the same bees that left Brazil. Everybody recognizes that,'' said Hachiro Shimanuki, leader of bee research at the U.S. Agricultural Research Service in Beltsville, Md. ``The longer they take to spread, the more hybridized they will get with other bees, and the less dangerous. I think the bees are almost getting well-behaved.'' Almost. Despite their interbreeding, three deaths in Texas and one in Arizona have been blamed on mass-stinging by the bees. And they could accelerate their spread once they get beyond the southwestern deserts. In California, they could still colonize much of the Central Valley and coastal regions. After crossing the Colorado River from Arizona into Imperial County in 1994, swarms of the bees have made their way to parts of Riverside and San Diego counties, with 85 confirmed colonies discovered and destroyed so far. A mountain range has apparently blocked their way to the coast near San Diego. They are, however, expected to make their way into the Los Angeles basin, eventually arriving at the coast, by migrating through the low San Gorgonia Pass near Palm Springs. County agricultural commissioners are prepared to undertake vigorous education programs as soon as the bees appear, warning people to be cautious around swarms and to report them to authorities. ``We've been really aggressive on public outreach,'' said Stephen Birdsall, Imperial County agricultural commissioner. ``We've had a few minor stinging incidents, and people call us when they see swarms. Any swarm we find, we depopulate it. That's the politically correct way to say we kill 'em.'' The bees, known more formally as Africanized honeybees, get their bad habits from ancestors that evolved in Africa. They are more aggressive in defending hives, chase perceived enemies farther before buzzing off to other business, and reproduce more rapidly than ordinary honeybees, which are derived from European strains. Africanized bees tend to be slightly smaller than common honeybees, but even experts find it difficult to tell one type from another without genetic analysis. And, while they are more prone to stinging, their stings are no worse than those of other bees. The danger comes from the greater chance that a person or animal will be stung dozens, even hundreds, of times by aroused colonies. While commercial beekeepers in Mexico and other Latin American nations have largely surrendered in the battle against the new bees and now raise them -- very carefully -- for honey and pollination services, American beekeepers are aggressively rooting out Africanized queens that invade their hives. As a result, Africanized queens often mate with European drones, further diluting their genes and their propensity to short tempers. ``Our beekeepers have learned to live with them around, and to keep them out of their hives,'' Birdsall said. BEES MOVING NORTH MORE SLOWLY Seven years after reaching the United States, ``killer bees'' have slowed their spread. They are confined to parts of west Texas, Arizona, southern New Mexico and, in California, Imperial, Riverside, and eastern San Diego counties. They seem to be losing some of the mean disposition that gave them their nickname. They were accidentally released in Brazil 40 years ago. SOME BEE FACTS: -- More accurately called ``Africanized Bees,'' they are hybrids between an aggressive, tropical African bee, and the more common domestic, European honeybee. -- They are slightly smaller than European honeybee, but otherwise appear identical. -- The bees defend their hives aggressively, sometimes chasing a person or animal a quarter mile. -- They produce honey, but are more difficult to handle. -- If caught in a swarm of stinging bees, run away or find shelter. Do not swat. Crushed bees release an odor that incites more bees to attack. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 19:41:51 +1200 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Bryan Clements Subject: Re: Apimondia congress Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 09:16 PM 11/8/97 -0500, you wrote: >Reply-to: Discussion of Bee Biology >From: Kuyckx Maurice > >Hallo Beekeepers all over the World. > >Don't forget... It's beekeeping time in Antwerp/Belgium. > >>From 01 to 06 of september '97, we have(Apimondia) our 35th World Congress > >Maurice. > >Hi Maurice I would be keen to come, but think I may have left it to late. Do the organisers have a home page or is there some other way to get information Kind regards Bryan Clements Bryan Clements Waikato Honey Products Ltd 8 Short Street KihiKihi New Zealand Fax 64 7 8718885 bryan@honeynz.co.nz ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 11:30:40 +0200 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "THONE HUGO VE144 (240)9452" Subject: Re: Apimondia congress In-Reply-To: <199708140741.TAA06012@Axil.wave.co.nz> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII You can find all information on the 35th APIMONDIA CONGRESS on http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/APISERVICES/ap im_us.htm Cheers, Hugo +++++ Hugo Thone (SE144) (\ {|||8- ALCATEL TELECOM (/ F.Wellesplein 1 B-2018 Antwerp do bee do bee do .... email : thoneh@btmaa.bel.alcatel.be phone : (32) 3 240 94 52 fax : (32) 3 240 99 50 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 07:30:20 +0000 Reply-To: hector@together.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: John Znoj Subject: Re: Apimondia congress MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit THONE HUGO VE144 (240)9452 wrote: > > You can find all information on the 35th APIMONDIA > CONGRESS on > > http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/APISERVICES/ap > im_us.htm > > Cheers, > Hugo > > +++++ > > Hugo Thone (SE144) (\ > {|||8- > ALCATEL TELECOM (/ > F.Wellesplein 1 > B-2018 Antwerp do bee do bee do .... > > email : thoneh@btmaa.bel.alcatel.be > phone : (32) 3 240 94 52 > fax : (32) 3 240 99 50 Hello, The page you list abovew cannot be found Thanks, JZ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 21:00:45 +0900 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: j h & e mcadam Subject: Re: Queen-hunting Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >To allay concerns expressed by more than one respondent -- no, I do not >search for queens just for fun. I only do it when I must requeen, and >this is such a time -- I have a "hot" (i.e., vicious) hive, with terrible >comb-building discipline (burr- and bridge-comb everywhere, >erratically-drawn comb on foundations), and no offsetting good qualities. > Ergo, the queen must die. Long live the queen. If the death sentence has been pronounced, there are 2 other ways to find the queen which may enable you to get away with only a token penalty. One is splitting the hive leaving the queen with only the brood and nurse bees while you requeen the other half and unite when sentence has been carried out. The other is to place another hive box in the original site and shake all combs and bees down into an empty super separated from the brood box by a queen excluder. We have a permanently attached excluder and super to enable us to cull queens in the apiary. If a few combs of brood are placed in the bottom box and the top smoked, all bees will go down below the excluder leaving drones and the queen trapped above. If you wish more detail please email me direct and I will set out the steps to enable this process to be carried out smoothly. Betty McAdam HOG BAY APIARY Penneshaw, Kangaroo Island j.h. & e. mcadam Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: j h & e mcadam Subject: Re: Ulees Gold- again Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I was also saddened to hear that at that meeting the >last ever merit badge for beekeeping as awarded to a Boy Scout. Has there >really been no interest for decades Is that why it is being discontinued. Boy scouts do not study knot tying any more either. No respect for practical survival skills. I wish somebody had taught me to tie knots. Betty McAdam HOG BAY APIARY Penneshaw, Kangaroo Island j.h. & e. mcadam Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Conrad Sigona Subject: All Lined Up MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII With my recently reported instance of bald brood, I may have learned something of pupal development: the pupae are all lined up, that is to say, within the cells, you find them all belly down. They are not in random positions. They also all have their tongues sticking way out, but not out towards the capping, rather out towards their thorax. To get a better idea of what I mean, imagine you were reaching for your belly button with your tongue. Your head would be bent, chin down. Since they are lying in their cells belly down, their tongue is the lowest part of the body. It seems as if there's food in the cell, which due to gravity, is found down below the pupa's feet. The pupa would thus, if properly positioned to start with, only need to stick her tongue out and find the food. I don't know whether it's true, but it seems plausible that the pupae are lined up just so it's easier to reach the food. Can anyone confirm this? Conrad Sigona conrad@ntcnet.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 07:50:16 +0000 Reply-To: Barry@Birkey.Com Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Barry Birkey Organization: BIRKEY.COM Subject: Re: Apimondia congress Comments: To: hector@together.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit John Znoj wrote: > > THONE HUGO VE144 (240)9452 wrote: > > > > You can find all information on the 35th APIMONDIA > > CONGRESS on > > > > http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/APISERVICES/ap > > im_us.htm > > > > Cheers, > > Hugo > > > > +++++ > > > > Hugo Thone (SE144) (\ > > {|||8- > > ALCATEL TELECOM (/ > > F.Wellesplein 1 > > B-2018 Antwerp do bee do bee do .... > > > > email : thoneh@btmaa.bel.alcatel.be > > phone : (32) 3 240 94 52 > > fax : (32) 3 240 99 50 > > Hello, > > The page you list abovew cannot be found > > Thanks, > > JZ Try: http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/APISERVICES/apim_us.htm -- Barry Birkey West Chicago, Illinois USA barry@birkey.com http://www.birkey.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 14:41:07 +0200 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "THONE HUGO VE144 (240)9452" Subject: Re: Apimondia congress In-Reply-To: <33F2B40C.58A9@together.net> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII I have checked it once again. This address works fine for me : http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/APISERVICES/ap im_us.htm Hugo ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 09:51:02 -0400 Reply-To: jcooper@columbus.rr.com Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: jcooper Subject: Re: Apimondia congress Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dose NOT work for me. **************************************** Joseph Cooper jcooper@columbus.rr.com *************************************** ---------- > From: THONE HUGO VE144 (240)9452 > To: BEE-L@CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU > Subject: Re: Apimondia congress > Date: Thursday, August 14, 1997 8:41 AM > > I have checked it once again. This address works fine > for me : > > http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/APISERVICES/ap > im_us.htm > > > Hugo ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 09:54:51 GMT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Steven Turner Organization: Amigabee computer networking for beekeepers Subject: apinet bee news Apinet bee news can be found on URL: http://web.inter.nl.net/hcc/beenet/apinet.htm For membership contact John Goodman (apinet) j.m.goodman@csl.gov.uk BEE (Beekeeping Education and Extension) APINET Regards Steve Steven Turner G6LPF Beekeeper/gardener Sysop of Amigabee. http://www.users.dircon.co.uk/~beeman/ ... Platinum Xpress & Wildcat!..... Nice!!!! ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 06:53:12 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Robert A. Roach" Subject: AHB in Hawaii? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This started when someone said the swarm of AHB that arrived in Contra = Costa County came on a sugar boat from Hawaii. The boat was actually = from Guatemala. AHB is not found in Hawaii. This swarm survived a long = sea voyage but was quite small when it was discovered. Federal = officials attempted to kill the swarm with a fogging unit such as they = would normally use to fumigate a container. The swarm flew off to parts = unknown. Some dead bees were recovered by the County Agricultural = Commissioner, sent to the lab and found to be Africanized. It is = unlikely that the swarm was viable. The county is trapping the area to = be sure. Bob Roach ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 07:59:22 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Andy Nachbaur Subject: Re: AHB in Hawaii? In-Reply-To: <01BCA87E.EA2266C0@sns-ca1-12.ix.netcom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 06:53 AM 8/14/97 -0700, you wrote: >This started when someone said the swarm of AHB that arrived in Contra >Costa County came on a sugar boat from Hawaii. The boat was actually >from Guatemala. Oh Lord protect us, C&H Sugar from Guatemala, is nothing sacred anymore!! I don't know which is the worse case scenario, Afrikaner bees from Hawaii or California $ Hawaii sugar from Guatemala. >> AHB is not found in Hawaii. They don't need them the feral bees once found in Hawaii were at one time considered of hottest tempered type anyway. When Powers and Weaver set up rearing queens in Hawaii after a few years I wanted to send some business their way so I purchased a 100 queens to test. They turned out to be so foul tempered that the next year and for several years after when they offered to replace them free I wanted no part of them. >This swarm survived a long sea voyage but was quite small when it was >discovered. Federal officials attempted to kill the swarm with a >fogging unit such as they would normally use to fumigate a container. >The swarm flew off to parts unknown. Yep, "I am here from the government and I am here to help you!" Anyway thanks Bob for the real story on the bees, too bad the newspapers can't get it right. ttul, Andy- >Some dead bees were recovered by the County Agricultural Commissioner, >sent to the lab and found to be Africanized. It is unlikely that the >swarm was viable. The county is trapping the area to be sure. > >Bob Roach > > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 08:07:23 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Bill Deer Subject: Application of MO - Help MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii A request for detailed instructions for application of mineral oil. I have read alot of information on it but have never seen actual instructions as to where, how much and frequency. Thanx! Bill Deer _____________________________________________________________________ Sent by RocketMail. Get your free e-mail at http://www.rocketmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 13:17:12 +0200 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Max Watkins Subject: Re: Apistan and *Tracheal Mites* Comments: To: owner-bee-l@CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU Apistan has a limited effect on tracheal mites, certainly not a high enough efficacy for control. Tau-fluvalinate has a very low vapour pressure, it works by contact action. For tracheal mite control you need something which can permeate the trachae of the bees, ie a gas or vapour. Apistan will not cut it, as it was not designed for that target. However, the new product which Vita is currently submitting for registration in Europe seems to be much more effective against acarine, as well as varroa - the main target. I'll keep you informed as we get more data. Max Vita (Europe) Limited ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Apistan and *Tracheal Mites* Author: owner-bee-l@CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU at INTERNET1 Date: 8/14/97 6:28 AM I've been wondering: Apistan works on varroa when they are outside the cell -- the so called phoretic state. Fluvalinate is hard on varroa, but has relatively little effect on the bees. Here's the question: Tracheal mites have to spend time outside the bee in order to transfer to other (younger) bees. In such a state, are they susceptible to some extent to Apistan (R), or are they -- like the honeybee -- somewhat fluvalinate tolerant? Allen ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 18:28:20 GMT+0200 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Garth Organization: Rhodes University South Africa Subject: AHB thread Hi All I saw a few posts about the AHB problem. Firstly, a reasonable amount of genetic evidence is cropping up to show that the AHB's reaching and entering the US are probably not crossed with the Euro Bees already there. The Mitochondrial DNA analysis of Africanized bees shows that the bees had africanized mitochondrial DNA. This DNA only passes in the female line, therefore the whole beware of african drones thing is a myth. My bets are as follows: African bees are superior foragers and defenders and move about twice as fast as euro bees. They are more evolved because they have more generations per year. So, should an african hive swarm, it will scout about early in the morning, after spending a night in a tree, and find a nice space full of honey with no major defence up. This would be a weak euro hive. Then it will invade the hive by swarming in and take out the queen quite easily. (I have seen a strong swarm invade one of my own weak african hives. A strong swarm can fly early when it is cold and a weak swarm will be so cold it is no good at defence.) Secondly the business about an african queen hatching first is a bit unlikely as well. For the queen to be african it would imply that the queen laying the egg was african (given that the mitochondrial incompatibility probably rules out an african father euro mother story). Hence all the queens will hatch at the same time. My two cents. Six swarms stronger today. Two arrived at my house, and another four easy ones from my area!! Keep well Garth --- Garth Cambray "Opinions expressed in this post may be those 15 Park Road of Pritz, my cat, who knows a lot about Grahamstown catfood." 6140 *garth@rucus.ru.ac.za* South Africa Phone 27-0461-311663 In general, generalisations are bad. But don't worry BEEEEEE happy. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 13:34:43 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: MR MARK G SPAGNOLO Subject: Re: AHB & Hawaii Walter is correct. AHB is not found in Hawaii. In fact, neither is tracheal mite or varroa mite. Hawaii banned the import of all honey bees into the state in 1985. Although the ban is almost impossible to enforce, there is little pressure to bring bees into the state. Without the mites, and with a tropical environment, bees are plentiful. In fact, I know of several people who make a living just removing swarms! Now, to address Andy's comments.... The first bees in Hawaii were "German Blacks" introduced in the 1840's. These bees were truly mean! Thirty years ago double shirts and three pairs of pants were required when pulling honey. When Powers and Weavers arrived here twenty-five years ago they began changing this temperament through the introduction of Italian queens and through artificial insemination. In the last ten years the change has been noticable. Kona Queen has 15 full time beekeepers (full time is 52 weeks a year!) and only one pair of gloves in the whole operations. Partly due to the heat, but also because the bees are very gentle, nobody wears a long sleeved shirt. If you ever wonder about the success of a breeding program in a small closed population, you might want to look at the change in the temperament and breed of bees on the island of Hawaii over the last thirty years. Would Andy be interested in trying a few Kona Queens now? Let me know. I think he would be surprised! Mark at Kona Queen ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 13:37:06 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: MR MARK G SPAGNOLO Subject: Slovenian beekeeping Hello: I am taking a trip to Slovenia next week. I would like to meet any beekeepers in that country. My great-grandparents were born in this country and I will be traveling and meeting relatives. Please respond by E-mail. Mark at Kona Queen ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 12:46:21 -0500 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Steven Albritton Subject: Re: AHB & Hawaii Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" How much would it cost to ship bees from Hawaii to points in the US Mainland? At 01:34 PM 8/14/97 -0500, you wrote: >Walter is correct. AHB is not found in Hawaii. In fact, neither is >tracheal mite or varroa mite. Hawaii banned the import of all honey >bees into the state in 1985. Although the ban is almost impossible >to enforce, there is little pressure to bring bees into the state. >Without the mites, and with a tropical environment, bees are >plentiful. In fact, I know of several people who make a living just >removing swarms! > >Now, to address Andy's comments.... The first bees in Hawaii were >"German Blacks" introduced in the 1840's. These bees were truly >mean! Thirty years ago double shirts and three pairs of pants were >required when pulling honey. When Powers and Weavers arrived here >twenty-five years ago they began changing this temperament through >the introduction of Italian queens and through artificial >insemination. In the last ten years the change has been noticable. >Kona Queen has 15 full time beekeepers (full time is 52 weeks a >year!) and only one pair of gloves in the whole operations. Partly >due to the heat, but also because the bees are very gentle, nobody >wears a long sleeved shirt. > >If you ever wonder about the success of a breeding program in a small >closed population, you might want to look at the change in the >temperament and breed of bees on the island of Hawaii over the last >thirty years. > >Would Andy be interested in trying a few Kona Queens now? Let me >know. I think he would be surprised! > >Mark at Kona Queen > > Steven Albritton LDS Communications, Sports America, Chauvin Honey Farms Monroe, Louisiana ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 12:10:56 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Andy L. Kettlewell" Subject: pollination info Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hello all you beekeepers out there. I was just wondering if there are any of big time pollinators here. My sister is writing a paper about pollination. She is the Southeastern Wisconsin Honey Queen. We are only a small operation with only about 100 hives, so we don't do much with pollination. If you have any info Please email it to me. Thank you for all your help in advance Andy L. Kettlewell Rungun305@Earthlink.net -- Editor of the Piechowski Home page http://home.earthlink.net/~rungun305/ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 18:41:14 -0400 Reply-To: dronebee@norfolk.infi.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "\\Dr. Pedro P. Rodriguez" Organization: Independent non-profit research Subject: Re: Source of White Mineral Oil MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Paul Cronshaw, D.C. wrote: Dear Paul: I used Apistan strips until May of 96. I stopped using them all together because my bees were dying right and left even with fresh (brand new) strips. I do not plan to use Apistan in any other kind of test. I am positively sure of the effectiveness of mineral oil and of its sound physiological reason hence my only interest at present is to find a way(s) to apply mineral in a cost effective manner. I do not mean to sound negative. On the contrary, I just know that sooner or later mites will develop resistance to the active ingredient of Apistan in the U. S. like it has in Europe. I want to be ahead of that eventuality. Yes, there was post on white mineral oil source on Bee-L. I will forward it to you after this post (provided that I have not deleted the post already. (I don't think that I have). Good luck with your trials. Please keep me appraised and do not hesitate to write asking questions should you have any. Best regards. Dr. Rodriguez ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 15 Aug 1997 22:57:28 +1200 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Nick Wallingford Organization: Bay of Plenty Polytechnic Subject: Earthquakes and bees! Comments: cc: Pete Illgner MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT "Pete Illgner" wrote to me asking about an article that appeared in the New Zealand Beekeeper magazine back in 1986 about bees after an earthquake. He would, I'm sure, be interested in any stories or information any of you might have re: beekeeping as it relates to earthquakes/volcanoes. Rathter than just provide it to him, I've added it to my (ta da!) recently re-established New Zealand Beekeeping pages (address in my .sig file). I'll make a point of finding articles of interest to put on the pages regularly... (\ Nick Wallingford {|||8- home nickw@wave.co.nz (/ work nw1@boppoly.ac.nz NZ Beekeeping http://www.beekeeping.co.nz ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 19:19:53 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: bartlett Subject: Re: Bees with black bodies Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Does this mean that the Queen had more than one boyfriend?? ; < ) ---------- > From: Dean Breaux > To: BEE-L@CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU > Subject: Re: Bees with black bodies > Date: 14 ao{t 1997 00:14 > > >I have an Italian bees in one hive. When I checked this hive > >recently, a few of the bees has a black body with the head being > >Italian, and a few bees have a black head and regular colored body. I > >have never seen this before. What gives? > > The body color of the bees is controlled by the action of two independent genic > systems. The genic systems are a, Major factor genes of Black affected or modified by minor genes (polygenes). Having said that keep in mind that most "Italian" bees in the USA are blends of several races of bees that have been in this country for many years that have been selected and bred to perform as Italians. > > It would appear from your comments, that the stock of Italian bees, that you have is showing some genetic diversity in color. This diversity could be due to many factors both within the strain or from out side of the strain. An out side influnce could be from the drone source (a mating with one dark type drone or drone of another race). > > It is hard to comment on the two toned bee you speak of with out seeing it, but for general discussion. There was a two toned bee decribed as yellow face. It was decribed in the book Bee Genetics and Breeding. It is a genetic mutant along the lines of the cordavans. It is the partial replacement of the black cutical color on the head of the bee with yellow. I myself have never seen one. For more information try and secure a copy of Bee Genetics and breeding and look in the chapter about Visible Mutants. > > I hope this helps > > Dean M. Breaux > Hybri-Bees Inc. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 19:14:02 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Chip McCurdy Subject: Re: pollination info MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Don't know how much help I can be from middle GA, but I'll be happy to answer any questions you may have. I run about 1200 hives mainly on watermelon, canteloupe, cucumber, squash and some plums. Chip ---------- > From: Andy L. Kettlewell > To: BEE-L@CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU > Subject: pollination info > Date: Thursday, August 14, 1997 3:10 PM > > Hello all you beekeepers out there. > > I was just wondering if there are any of big time pollinators here. My > sister is writing a paper about pollination. She is the Southeastern > Wisconsin Honey Queen. We are only a small operation with only about 100 > hives, so we don't do much with pollination. If you have any info Please > email it to me. > > Thank you for all your help in advance > Andy L. Kettlewell > Rungun305@Earthlink.net > -- > Editor of the Piechowski Home page > http://home.earthlink.net/~rungun305/ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 19:19:45 -0400 Reply-To: dronebee@norfolk.infi.net Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "\\Dr. Pedro P. Rodriguez" Organization: Independent non-profit research Subject: Re: Application of MO - Help MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bill Deer wrote: Hi. I am posting this on Bee-L as a means of saving time and effort to those who might wish to comply with Bill's request. I sent Bill a copy of my original file a few minutes ago. Best regards Dr. Rodriguez ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 19:29:25 -0400 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Chip McCurdy Subject: Re: Apimondia congress MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I tried it and this is what I got: Page Not Found The Server [ourworld.compuserve.com] was unable to find the following page: Page [ap] User [APISERVICES] Category [homepages]. ---------- > From: THONE HUGO VE144 (240)9452 > To: BEE-L@CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU > Subject: Re: Apimondia congress > Date: Thursday, August 14, 1997 8:41 AM > > I have checked it once again. This address works fine > for me : > > http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/APISERVICES/ap > im_us.htm > > > Hugo ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 13:56:42 -1000 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: "Thomas W. Culliney -- Dept. of Agriculture" Subject: Re: AHB & Hawaii In-Reply-To: <199708141734.NAA15502@mime3.prodigy.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Both USDA-APHIS and the Hawaii Dept. of Agriculture have maintained a swarm-trapping program for the past 4 years to detect Africanized honey bees in Hawaii. So far, results of FABIS indicate all swarms tested are European with high probability. We consider the chances that Africanized swarms will enter and become established in Hawaii pretty slim. Tom Culliney Hawaii Dept. of Agriculture culliney@elele.peacesat.hawaii.edu ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 20:05:03 EDT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Aaron D Wolfenbarger Subject: bee venom and CF Hi loopers, I was wondering if there was any treatment (maybe that's not the right word) for Cronic Fatigue using beestings, or bee venom. I have a freind who has this and was wondering. Thanks in advanve. Aaron Wolfenbarger Norris, TN 1st year 3 hives AND NOT ONE STINKING DROP OF HONEY!!! ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 17:31:19 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Andy Nachbaur Subject: Re: Earthquakes and bees! In-Reply-To: <97Aug15.120230nzst.34568@gateway.boppoly.ac.nz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 10:57 PM 8/15/97 +1200, you wrote: >"Pete Illgner" wrote to me asking about >an article that appeared in the New Zealand Beekeeper magazine back >in 1986 about bees after an earthquake. He would, I'm sure, be >interested in any stories or information any of you might have re: >beekeeping as it relates to earthquakes/volcanoes. Earthquakes, mites, Egyptian bees, wee got them all.......! Lots of earthquakes here in California, and as a young man I had a bee yard directly on top of a shallow earthquake fault not knowing it at the time. I just assumed that everything naturally got out of plumb with the world given enough time as none of the fence lines were ever straight that I had seen up to then, and the old barns and building were always in need of shoring up, that was just the way it was. Anyway several years before as a child all us kids had ran several times out from the local flea house, the church, all us kids attended for ten cents every Saturday morning to catch up on Flash Gordon and the latest horse opera, I knew what earthquakes were. We had earthquake drills starting in nursery school and I always brown bagged it and ate outside through high school just in case one hit at lunch time as I did not want to miss it, or get trampled in the rush to get out of the school lunch room. Anyway we have lots of them and you never get use to it but sometime it is funny afterwards. Back to the bee yard on that fault. One spring about 1:00 PM two young beekeepers were working in a bee yard taking tall hives apart making increase and replacing old queens with new. The bees were stacked up with full shallow supers of spring honey and much pollen and brood. It was shirt sleeve weather, and a good flow was still on, the air was full of bees coming and going, drones were out looking for virgins, the hives were humming along with the birds and the occasional scampering of small rabbits in the bush. Several swarms were hanging in the bushes, and one or more took out for them as we worked away. It was slow and heavy work trying to identify the hives that needed queens, or could donate brood and such. It was a warm day with big puffy clouds low in the sky, a type of day that we often call "earthquake" weather here, but we took no special note of that as we were both enjoying our work. All of a sudden I felt faint and had to grab on to the nearest hive to keep from falling down. I really don't know what I thought at that moment, maybe I was coming down with the flu or should not have had such a big lunch, but something was wrong because I could not stand up without holding on to that hive. I sheepishly looked over the top of the hive to my friend who was working the hives at the other end of the yard and would you belive he also was holding on to one of his hives for dear life. It had become deathly quit, not a bird singing, not a rabbit rustling in the bush, not a bee in the sky. We soon both realized that it was nothing more then a heavy roller and could had not lasted more then a minute or two, and like a old steam engine picking up speed within minutes all was back to normal, no damage that we could not straighten out, a few supers ajar and tops off of the hives we had already worked. All in all it was a good day for bees in Monterey County, California that spring long ago as I remember it well. ttul, the OLd Drone ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 21:47:25 -0600 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Martin Braunstein Subject: Re: Hawain Queen Bees & Mite Resistance MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear beekeepers, I'm glad to hear such wonderful comments concerning the quality of Hawaia= n queens. However, I wonder whether the mite free status of Hawaii, Australia and N= ew Zealand will be a drawback in the long term for dealing with both trachea= l mites and varroa. As a matter of fact, selective pressure combined with=20 adaptation and evolution are working slowly but together in order to get = a mite resistant bee. How long this will take nobody knows, but with the ai= d of bee breeding tools we might weed out all mite susceptible strains of bees. If we continue to bring bees from mite free areas into mite infested area= s, I doubt we can improve the degree of mite resistance of our bees. If we persist doing so, I believe we are fighting against nature.=20 My opinion is that we should encourage the importation of queen bees from places where mites and honeybees are coexisting. Look forward to hearing your feedback. With best regards. Mart=EDn Braunstein Malka Caba=F1a Ap=EDcola e-mail: malka@webnet.com.ar ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 19:06:45 -0700 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Andy Nachbaur Subject: Re: AHB & Hawaii In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 01:56 PM 8/14/97 -1000, you wrote: >Both USDA-APHIS and the Hawaii Dept. of Agriculture have maintained a >swarm-trapping program for the past 4 years to detect Africanized honey >bees in Hawaii. So far, results of FABIS indicate all swarms tested are >European with high probability. We consider the chances that Africanized >swarms will enter and become established in Hawaii pretty slim. Yep, thats it, USDA-APISS, who also do the same job here in California, and now are looking for the "small" one that got away with a high probability they won't find it. Well you better watch those C&H Sugar Ships as now all those millions of dollar used to convince generations of us that C&H Sugar comes from Hawaii were only lies, and we are to believe that this ship came in from South America and not Hawaii. And I was just getting used to accepting a different version of the same song that goes "Afrikaner" bees travel first class by train in California, but all get off in the Imperial Valley and not at the end of track at the Canadian boarder. The truth as I know it is that in the years since so called "killer" bees were first found in the US bees semi loads of bees from the same areas, and in some cases the same beekeepers have been moving from state to state, north south east and west with no problems outside of the norm. All the rules, regulations, taxes, quarantine's, extra personal, and money are not going to keep disease, pests, or predators out of a livestock industry that lives on rubber and fuel oil and knows no boarders, and that includes national ones. (And pollinates a billion dollars worth of almonds in a few weeks in California alone.) The horse got out of the barn long ago, about time we make the best of what nature hands us and forget about regulating the illiterate bees or their keepers, maybe then I will tell you the rest of the story. IMHO, Andy- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 16 Aug 1997 02:23:45 +1200 Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Nick Wallingford Organization: Bay of Plenty Polytechnic Subject: Re: Hawain Queen Bees & Mite Resistance MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT > If we continue to bring bees from mite free areas into mite infested areas, > I doubt we can improve the degree of mite resistance of our bees. If we > persist doing so, I believe we are fighting against nature. My understanding of the resistance mechanisms are that they do not relate specifically to 'mites'. That is, the behaviour of bees that allows for them to successfully resist mites does not have anything to do with whether or not they have been exposed to mites. Best way to explain it, or at least the way it was presented to me, is that you don't *have* to expose a hive to American foulbrood to breed for AFB resistance. What you are selecting for, in that case, is hygenic behaviour (uncapping cells that haven't emerged, then removing the contents in a timely manner). 'Resistance' or 'susceptibility' to mites is a hygenic behaviour not specific to having a mite present... (\ Nick Wallingford {|||8- home nickw@wave.co.nz (/ work nw1@boppoly.ac.nz NZ Beekeeping http://www.beekeeping.co.nz ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 22:26:21 PDT Reply-To: Discussion of Bee Biology Sender: Discussion of Bee Biology From: Dean Breaux Subject: Re: Bees with black bodies Most Queens mate with many boyfriends from 7 to 15 with the norm about 10. So yes more than one boyfriend. Dean Breaux Hybri-Bees