From MAILER-DAEMON Fri Sep 17 12:52:16 1999 Received: from listserv.albany.edu (listserv.albany.edu [169.226.1.24]) by luna.oit.unc.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA27318 for ; Fri, 17 Sep 1999 12:52:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: from listserv.albany.edu (listserv.albany.edu [169.226.1.24]) by listserv.albany.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA11104 for ; Fri, 17 Sep 1999 12:52:11 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199909171652.MAA11104@listserv.albany.edu> Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 12:52:11 -0400 From: "L-Soft list server at University at Albany (1.8d)" Subject: File: "BEE-L LOG9906A" To: adamf@METALAB.UNC.EDU Content-Length: 154965 Lines: 3704 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 04:17:54 +1200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Nick Wallingford Organization: Bay of Plenty Polytechnic Subject: Honey for healing... With some of the recent threads, list members may find this link of particular interest: http://honey.bio.waikato.ac.nz/ Dr Peter Molan of Waikato University is a real world authority on the use of honey for wound healing and a wide variety of related uses (including veterinary!). (\ Nick Wallingford {|||8- home nickw@beekeeping.co.nz (/ work nick.wallingford@boppoly.ac.nz NZ Beekeeping http://www.beekeeping.co.nz ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 30 May 1999 11:34:00 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: John Valentine Subject: BumbleBee, question ? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello BEE Friends, I have always wanted a to keep Bumblebees. Well, upon inspective a squirrel house I built last year. I found in the rags inside Bumblebees have moved in. Question; how do I tend Bumblebees? Can they be split ??? John CT ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 30 May 1999 13:52:32 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Jorn Johanesson Subject: Sv: Quality of Colony MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit -----Oprindelig meddelelse----- Fra: Sr. Monica Ryan Til: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu Dato: 30. maj 1999 02:49 Emne: Quality of Colony >Hello to All! > >I just thought that many Beekeepers - experienced and otherwise, might >have some worthwhile ideas, of how it is possible to assess the quality >of a colony and its future potential by looking at its brood pattern. I have put up a new manual to my software. It is not a technical manual, but also gives some advice about slecting queens based on some criteria, that all are genetic bound and therefore possible to change over a few years. Have a lokk at this manual http://apimo.dk/programs/engmanus.zip is around 400KB best regards Jorn Johanesson EDBi = multilingual Beekeeping software since 1987 http://home4.inet.tele.dk/apimo (Denmark) http://wn.com.au/apimo (Australia) http://apimo.dk (USA) apimo@post4.tele.dk apimo@wn.com.au Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk > >I will indeed be grateful for all contributions, and then hopefuly, I >will better understand what's going on in the hive. (My sight is not >the best and I find it difficult enough to see the eggs.) > >Thank you for all the wonderful contributions to this list. (The >'computer operator' keeps me supplied). > >Sr. Catherine Duffy. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 30 May 1999 16:33:14 +0300 Reply-To: jtemp@xs4all.nl Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Jan Tempelman Organization: in R'dam Subject: Fwd: Aggressive bumblebees MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit of general intrest -------- Original Message -------- From: Catherine Plowright Subject: Aggressive bumblebees To: Multiple recipients of list BOMBUS-L From: laura@mearns.org.uk (Laura Smith) Date: Sat, 29 May 1999 14:06:22 +0100 Hi I'm from Scotland and run a small non-profit making web site dedicated to bumblebees (address below). Recently I've received a few e-mails from people in the US asking for advice about aggressive bumblebees. This is not something I've ever come across in this country, nor have I read about aggressive behaviour towards humans (unless they are disturbing a nest) in books or papers, consequently I do not know what advice to give. Have any of you come across aggressive bumblebees, or aggressive insects that look like bumblebees. I've had reports that the bees chase them indoors. They are always described as hairy, use a single exit hole, and usually nest above ground in wooden buildings. This is part of the latest e-mail: "I have bumblebees in my yard that I believe are nesting in a wood shed. I've heard, and read on your pages, that they are not aggressive and don't sting easily, but these ones seem to be swarming. I've seen about 10 at a time, and they all chase each other in the air wildly. They are always angry. Not only am I worried about getting stung when I go into the shed, but yesterday 4 flew into my face while I was gardening about 10 feet from where I think their nest is. They were buzzing very loudly - I backed off quickly! I really don't want to poison them, but we have big parties at my house with children, etc. If they scare me, an avid gardener and nature lover, imagine how a 6 year old playing would react!" I hope someone can help shed some light on this. Sincerely Laura Smith laura@mearns.org.uk http://www.mearns.org.uk/mrssmith/bees/bees.htm Comment from RCP: Yes, Laura, it is one of the sad facts of this world that some of the bumblebees of the New World are far more aggressive than their European counterparts. The species of the subgenus Fervidobombus--all of them, so far as I know (although I do not have any data for the huge B. dahl- bohmi that occurs in Chile and Argentina), but especially B. fervidus, pennsylvanicus, californicus and sonorus in N. America, and B.atratus, mexicanus, etc. in Central and South America, are exceedingly vicious and will often sting with no apparent provocation (even when they are FORAGING!). It is not safe, for example, to sit unprotected within 5- metres of a medium-to-large colony of B. pennsylvanicus (as one might wish to do, for instance, when recording nest-entrance traffic). All too often, a returning (or leaving) forager will decide that human scientists that have the effrontery to seat themselves within spitting distance of the colony should be taught a swift and painful lesson. The S. American Fervidobombus species, B. atratus Fkln. is well-known for its extreme aggressiveness (although the N. American B. pennsylv- anicus, which also produces huge colonies, can probably come close in terms of sheer unprovoked viciousness). When we naintained a labor- atory culture of B. atratus, we had to take extreme precautions: we used red light all the time when we had to handle them, and we found that an unprotected observer couldn't even enter the same flight-room of even a very small atratus colony! Of historical importance is the fact that in pioneering days, horses were routinely killed by the stings of B. fervidus in the northern parts of the USA and southern Canada. Why? Because B. fervidus, like the European species of the subgenus Thoracobombus (B. pascuorum, muscorum, humilis, sylvarum, and ruderarius) regularly makes its nest on the surface of the ground (in a rodent's nest in a grass tussock, for example). At hay-making time, when the poor horse was required to pull a mower across the fields . . . for some reason, I am more sorry for the horse than for the pretty little yellow B. fervidus workers. It might be worth adding that one of the British Bombus species, B. muscorum, has also attracted a small-scale reputation for ferocity, but I am sure that even a large muscorum colony (and I have reared quite a few) is absolutely no match for a healthy N. American Fervidobombus colony. The bottom line? Treat _all_ stinging insects with great respect, and _never_ ever convey to people that bumblebees are in any sense "safe". Too many people, over the centuries, have succumbed to anaphylactic shock, and I am told that sometimes it only takes one single sting. Regards, Chris Plowright. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 01:45:05 -0500 Reply-To: "David D. Scribner" Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: "David D. Scribner" Subject: Re: what to do about this comb MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lance Almond wrote: >on closer inspection the bees were surrounding a >foot ball size comb. i was able to put the swarm, comb, branches and leaves >in a auper with the frames removed >i only have three frames in the super, >there is too much comb that is hatching bees (fascinating to watch) i don't >know what to do next. >Any tips, advice would bee most appreciated. Two options that I've taken with natural comb, and have worked well for me are: 1.) Take the comb, brush the bees of it and wrap it loosely in a towel, taking it away from the hive to a place where you can work with it. Grap your remaining empty frames, some cotton twine and a knife. If your empty frames already have foundation installed in them, even better, though it's not absolutely necessary. If the frames have been wired horizontally, remove the wires on those frames you'll be inserting the natural comb into (see below). Take one of your combs, lay it (proper side up) on the foundation in the frame and "trace" around the edges with the knife to mark a hole you will cut out of the foundation. If it's crimp-wired foundation, you'll have to snip those wires at the cut marks. Using your knife, cut the foundation and fit the comb snugly into the hole. If you can fit more than one piece of comb into the frame, that's fine too. You may have to trim a bit of comb here and there if it's too large to fit in a frame. Once you have the combs fitting snug in the frames, make a verticle wrap around the frame and comb a couple times with the cotton twine, tying it off each wrap. Do the same horizontally. The twine will help secure the comb in the frames until the bees are able to. You can then put the frames back in the brood chamber. The bees will cut the twine and carry the pieces out of the hive. The resulting comb will "meld" with the comb they build to it. There may be a few "transition" cells (cells of odd size) drawn at the edges of the natural comb where it meets the drawn foundation, but this won't pose a problem. Some beekeepers use rubber bands instead of cotton twine, but as I mentioned in another post a while back, I've often wondered just how many bees get maimed or killed when those rubber bands snap! Another option is: 2.) Take an empty super out to your hive, with a queen excluder underneath it (setting these on top of the turned-over telescoping cover that you have taken off the hive works well for this, if you're using one). Remove the comb from the brood chamber (making sure the queen is not on them) and place the combs inside of this super, leaning up against the walls. Place your remaining frames in the now empty space in the bottom super. Put the queen excluder/super with combs on top of the chamber and close up. The queen excluder will prevent the queen from going up and laying more eggs in the natural comb, but the brood in them will still be cared for by workers. Providing an entrance to this top super would be optimal for allowing any drones in the chamber, or emerging drones, to escape (they won't fit through the excluder either). After three weeks or so, once all the brood has emerged, you could then: 2a.) Remove the comb and do what you wish with it. 2b.) If the comb has honey being stored in it (likely), crush it and lay the pieces on the inner cover. The bees will clean it up and take the honey back down into their super in a day or two. 2c.) Complete step #1 with the comb at that time, using the frames that will be going into the second super. This saves the bees a lot of energy, honey and time in not having to recreate the wax and comb all over again. Whichever option you take, feed the bees. They'll still have a lot of comb to build, and can use all the help you can offer. They may take the syrup slowly if a nectar flow is on, but better safe than sorry. --David Scribner - Ballwin, MO, USA Niche on the Net! - ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 30 May 1999 16:28:04 -0700 Reply-To: jslavett@worldnet.att.net Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: "Hasta B. Shasta" Subject: Re: Queen Cells/Fragility/Development MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A couple of my books recommend the following sequence: 1. Remove feeder can from package. 2. Remove queen cage from package. 3. Replace feeder can. 4. Place queen cage in hive. 5. Remove feeder can again. 6. Bump and dump bees. Following these instructions, the queen doesn't get pounded. Jerry J Bromenshenk wrote: > Also, in MD, I saw beekeepers banging packages > on the ground before pulling out the feeder can and the queen. Seems to me > that she got an awful pounding in her little cage when the beekeeper > pounded the package to throw all of the bees to one end. > > Something to think about. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 12:02:43 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Stefan Stangaciu Subject: Re: Honey for healing... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Nick Wallingford wrote: >With some of the recent threads, list members may find this link of >particular interest: > >http://honey.bio.waikato.ac.nz/ > >Dr Peter Molan of Waikato University is a real world authority on the >use of honey for wound healing and a wide variety of related uses >(including veterinary!). Hi all, Yes, Dr. Molan is an extraordinary specialist in honey and its use in wounds healing. References on the use of honey in Surgery and in many other medical fields (specialties) you can get from our Apitherapy Reference Data Base (www.sci.fi/~apither). Another big specialist in the use of honey in wounds healing is Prof. Descottes from Limoges, France. Best wishes, Stefan Stangaciu apither@gmb.ro ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 07:18:02 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Computer Software Solutions Ltd Subject: GM Foods Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hello All It was reported in BBC news bulletins this morning, that Prince Charles has sounded warnings about the need to carry out in depth and in extenso testings before an unrecallable nightmare is released on us all. Indeed he has questioned the need for the technology at all. His comments on the need to work with nature rather than against it will find support on this list. The possibility of contamination of non genetic modified crops by the modified variety must send a shiver up most spines. The recent reports in the USA on the effect on the caterpillars of the Monarch butterfly of pollen from genetically modified maize (I believe) seems to me to be a wake up call. Butterflies to day, perhaps bees tomorrow. Where will it end?. Would it be a good idea to write and e mail the Prince to express support for his stance, and maybe a strong movement against this folly may at last be put in train?. Sincerely Tom Barrett 49 South Park, Foxrock Dublin 18 Ireland Tel + 353 1 289 5269 Fax + 353 1 289 9940 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 11:46:48 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Stefan Stangaciu Subject: Re: allergy to bee venom MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bernard Heymans wrote: >Hi, > >It seems theses kind of stuff appends, My Dad had bee 50 years ago... and >he stopped 40 ago because he had become "allergyc"... > >When I started 7 years ago to have bees, He stated that it could be >dangerous for him because allergy NEVER vanish from itself but only by a >cure. He was helped in this assumption by some members of the family that >are doctors... > >He off course got stung and seems this raction seemed normal... So he went >back to the bees. We got them, togherther.. and for me it's a great help >(sometime...) > >Bernard. Hello dear Bernard and bee friends, Very often the so called "allergies" are only normal local reactions, even if the swelling, pains and redness are intense. The best way to see if somebody has really a BV allergy is to advise him/her to visit the local best allergologist. Besides the clasical desensitization method (used by the allergologists), there are many others used by alternative medicine practitioners. I believe its useful to try both of them, if this proves to be really necessary. More details on BV and allergies you can obtain from: * The Apitherapy Reference Data Base: www.sci.fi/~apither * MEDLINE (see the apitherapy related links from the above and/or below sites) * The American Apitherapy Society's Web Site: www.apitherapy.org/aas Best wishes, Stefan Stangaciu, MD, L.Acup. apither@gmb.ro ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 08:54:26 -0400 Reply-To: tvf@umich.edu Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Ted Fischer Organization: ACB Dept., Univ of Michigan Subject: Re: Laying workers, question ? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In my opinion, it is not worth the bother to try to requeen laying worker colonies. I just combine them with very strong queenright colonies, and the laying workers disappear. To be safe, use the newspaper method of combining, and perhaps at first put an excluder between the combined units as well. Ted Fischer Dexter, Michigan USA ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 08:57:49 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Bill Truesdell Subject: Re: Honey for healing... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Nick gave the link http://honey.bio.waikato.ac.nz/ which deals with why some honeys are better than others for antibacterial action. In view of Garth's post on extracting reducing the enzyme action, it seems that there are a lot of variables involved in maintaining honey healing properties. I did not see on the site what controls were used in insuring the different honeys were treated the same, from hive temperatures through bottling. If different extractors were used or heating for bottling, it could greatly change the healing properties, especially hydrogen peroxide activity. My guess is there were controls, but am interested in what they were. Nick, could you ask for info? Bill T Bath, ME ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 29 May 1999 07:17:18 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: De Witt Subject: Supers , medications, and oders MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Is this six week waiting period just for Teramycin or for Apistan also? I ask because I got my hives with Apistan strips in them and no label or other directions. This is my first year and I don't want to do anything wrong. Also I spent last night looking through my books and couldn't find any refferences to oders comming from the hive. One of my two hives has a strong smell every thing looks O.K. but it has a strong "pine-ish" smell. Any ideas? Cliff ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 10:59:14 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Aaron Morris Subject: Guidelines for BEE-L posting (Monthly Reminder) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Guideline for BEE-L Submissions 1. Do not include excessive quotes of previous submissions. If you must quote previous postings, include only what is necessary to make your point. Submissions that in- clude the entirety of previous posts will be rejected without comment or notice. 2. Submit your posts as TEXT ONLY! There are many sub- scribers whose mailers will not interpret text markup languages and to them, submissions which include markup characters (such as HTML) appear as gibberish. Sub- missions to BEE-L must be in the lowest common denomina- tor for all subscribers, which is TEXT ONLY! Posts submitted to BEE-L in markup languages will be rejected without notice. 3. Binary file attachments are not allowed on BEE-L. Simi- lar to markup languages, many subscribers have mailers not able to decipher binary file attachments (such as MS Word attachments). Submissions with binary attachments are never approved by the list moderators, most times without notice. Suggestions for binary attachments in- clude deciphering them at your end to include in the text of your submission or making them available at your site and advertising their availability on BEE-L. Please verify your URLs. If detected, submissions with invalid or nonexistant URLs will not be approved, possi- bly without notice. 4. Do not send personal responses to the entire list. If Bea Keepr posts something to the list that inspires you to write to Bea, DO NOT send your personal response to BEE-L, send it to Bea! Only send to the list that which you want read by everyone. Submissions to the list that appear to be personal responses are rarely approved by the list moderators, often without notice. 5. Trolling (name calling, baiting, incivility) is not tol- erated. Heated discussions are allowed, after all we're beekeepers and may not always agree. But as Rodney King put it, "Can't we all just get along?" This is a grey area up to the discretion of the moderators, but offend- ing submissions will be rejected without notice. 6. Do not send LISTSERV service requests to the list. Re- quests of LISTSERV for list services must be sent to: LISTSERV@listserv.albany.edu LISTSERV service requests sent to BEE-L are never ap- proved by the list moderators, no notice is given and the requested service is not provided. 7. Submissions to BEE-L must be related to the "Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology". SPAM is NEVER approved! Furthermore, submissions must be "Informed"! BEE-L is not intended to be a substitute for beginning texts on keeping bees. If your question is a basic beekeeping question, it has probably been asked and answered on BEE-L before, perhaps many times. Answers to frequently asked questions may be found by searching the BEE-L archives. Submissions of frequently asked questions may be approved or not, with or without notice. Approved frequently asked questions are often met with cries of "Search the Archives!". Cries of "Search the Archives!" are sometimes approved to drive home the point, but rarely. 8. Submissions to BEE-L should not contain misinformation. Although slow to admit it, the moderators do not know it all. However, blatant misinformation is rejected with- out notice. Realizing there is a fine line between new, thought provoking ideas and misinformation the modera- tors strive for leniency in their judgment and prefer to err on the side of thought provoking ideas. Reader be- ware that if you read it here it ain't necessarily so! 9. BEE-L is not a marketplace. Product reviews are wel- come. Product announcements are tolerated. Repeated announcements and marketing are less welcome proportion- ately to their frequency. Advertisements may be re- jected without notice. 10. Lastly, long signature files are discouraged. A guide- line of five lines is suggested. Life histories and driving directions to your doorstep or place of business are strongly discouraged and are often rejected without notice. The BEE-L moderators and subscribers thank you in advance for adhering to these guidelines. We hope you find your BEE-L experience informative, engaging, educational and most importantly, fun! ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 11:08:32 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Aaron Morris Subject: Searching BEE-L archives via LISTSERV MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Searching BEE-L archives is a two step process. The first step is to send the service request to the server: LISTSERV@listserv.albany.edu with a line or lines of mail that read: SEARCH BEE-L topic1 In the above case, LISTSERV will serch THE ENTIRE ARCHIVES(!) for all remote references to topic1. If the search request was SEARCH BEE-L Bears in the woods LISTSERV would return the number of ALL POSTS containing any subset of the words BEARS and IN and THE and WOODS. A post containing the phrase 'fruit BEARing' or 'BEAR with me' would be a hit. Obviously, Bears in the woods is not a good search arguement. The search item can be enclosed in quotes. SEARCH BEE-L 'topic1' will only return exact references to topic1. This can be good news and bad. SEARCH BEE-L 'Bears in the woods' will return all posts containing the exact phrase 'bears in the woods' but will not return the post about the bear in the wood. Searches may also be delimited with dates. SEARCH BEE-L topic2 since April 1998 LISTSERV will return to sender all general references to topic2 made since April, 1998. SEARCH BEE-L 'topic2' since April 1998 will only return EXACT references to topic2 made since April 1998. Retrieving the posts: Results of the SEARCH command will be the 'post numbers' containing the reference to the requested topic. In the same response LISTSERV will include excerpts of the post which contains the reference to the topic. If that excerpt shows that the post is of interest to the user, the user must submit the GETPOST command to the server: LISTSERV@listserv.albany.edu The format of the GETPOST command is: GETPOST BEE-L postnum1,postnum2,...,postnumn LISTSERV will THEN return to sender the entire post in which the topic was referenced. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 18:51:17 GMT+0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Garth Organization: Rhodes University South Africa Subject: Laying worker theory about flight MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Hi All Just to comment on the suggestion that laying workers cannot fly - I beleive this is highly unlikely - a worker bee can fly carrying a dead drone - well over twice her weight. She can fly carrying a polystyrene ping pong bal!! A worker is a machine - hse can fly very well - in fact a queens wings are so similar to a workers, that if this laying worker cannot fly concept were correct, a laying worker would have to be bigger than a queen. I think that what is happening here is that if one makes the bees fly back to a colony the elusive laying workers which smell like queens are not allowed into the hive and are killed by the guards at the entrance. I have often dumped laying workers here on the ground and within half an hour all bees are gone somewhere (don't know where). I know our bees can end up in hives up to five kilometers away from their original hives from my observations of marked bees from Rhodes experiments that end up in my own hives five k's away!! Keep well Garth Garth Cambray Camdini Apiaries 15 Park Road Grahamstown Apis mellifera capensis 6139 South Africa Time = Honey ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 17:50:17 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: CSlade777@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Where do queenless swarms go? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Layne's complete description of the behavior of the swarm in refusing the nice cosy hive he was offering them but returned to the vacum box suggests that, irrespective of whether they had a queen or not, there was something wrong with the hive. I once had a swarm that refused to stay in a hive. It wasn't until the second day and several atempts that i remembered that I had creosoted the floor months earlier. I quickly changed the floorboard and they trooped in in the traditional manner. Chris Slade ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 21:48:05 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Garry Libby Subject: FW: Honeybees As Land -----Original Message-----Mine Detectors? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Honeybees As Land Mine Detectors? .c The Associated Press By LINDA ASHTON RICHLAND, Wash. (AP) -- Honeybees equipped with radio tags no larger than a grain of rice may one day be used to detect antipersonnel land mines on battlefields and elsewhere. As farfetched as it might seem, a collaborative project seeks to train and track entire colonies of bees that may be conditioned to prefer something other than honey, such as TNT, the primary component of land mines. Ultimately, it may be possible to carry a hive to a site and release the bees to search for explosives or other things, such as methamphetamine-making ingredients or nuclear waste, said Ron Gilbert, who works on electronic systems at the Pacific Northwest National Laboratory here. ``This system is not unique for land mines,'' he said. The project, led by University of Montana entomologist Jerry Bromenshenk, depends on several factors -- particularly whether bees can smell and be taught to find TNT. ``It's amazing what you can train a bee to do,'' said UM postgraduate student Bob Seccomb, who took part in a media demonstration with the bees. ``We've got them flying through mazes.'' The Red Cross estimates there are 80 million to 120 million land mines in 70 countries around the world and that 60 people a day are killed or maimed by buried mines. In some developing countries, thousands of acres of productive land are unusable because they are death traps. If the bees can indeed be trained to seek out explosives, the next step is to find a way to keep track of them. That's where the radio tags come in. Several years ago, PNNL developed a first generation of radio-frequency tags for the garment industry to track inventory. The tags are similar to the microchips implanted by veterinarians as permanent identification for cats and dogs. The researchers brought some 20,000 bees in two hives to Richland for three days of tag testing, which ended May 22. UM student Jason Volkman carefully glued the tiny tags to the bees. To make them easier to work with, he chills the bees in a college dormitory-style refrigerator for four minutes, then attaches the tags to the bees' abdomens with tweezers. The tags have a 10-character code that identifies each bee individually. The tags are read by sensitive instruments attached to a portable hive which records when the bees leave to forage, the direction they go and when they return. A special spectrometer would be installed in the hive to ``sniff'' the bees for the presence of TNT residue. Bromenshenk has characterized the bees as ``flying dust mops,'' picking up samples everywhere they go. Land mines leak small amounts of explosives into nearby soil and water, and the TNT residue eventually makes its way into some plants. In the tag tests, researchers learned that the bees were not dissuaded from returning to the hive by the radio-tag reading equipment, Gilbert said. They also found that the 27-milligram tags they planned on using were a little too heavy for the bees; 25 mg is better. ``We know how to make them lighter,'' he said. The Sandia National Laboratories in New Mexico, the Oak Ridge National Laboratory in Tennessee and the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency also are part of the project, paid for by the federal Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency. AP-NY-05-31-99 1202EDT ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 10:54:18 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Thom Bradley Subject: Re: Supers , medications, and oders MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cliff, A rule of thumb. If it smells good, it probably is good. If it smells bad, it probably is bad. There are exceptions, such as Aster honey, while it is curing smells like foulbrood. After it cures however, is fine and edible. Pine smell could be pine sap used for propolis, new equipment or close proximity ti pine trees, needles. Anyone else know of others? Apistan strips need to stay on the hives 48-56 days for best effect. You can take the strips out and immediately place supers on for honey. (In the U.S.) Thom Bradley Chesapeake, VA De Witt wrote: > > Is this six week waiting period just for Teramycin or for Apistan also? I > ask because I got my hives with Apistan strips in them and no label or other > directions. One of my two hives has a strong > smell every thing looks O.K. but it has a strong "pine-ish" smell. > Cliff ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 09:09:31 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Robert Dahlgren Subject: Re: BumbleBee, question ? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi John, With my understanding of the Bumblebee they would not be able to be split. The Queens are raised near the end of the season when they mate. They then hibernate over the winter and start their new colony the next spring. They do not propagate like Honeybees by swarming. I've tried to get a queen Bumble bee to start a nest but haven't succeeded yet. There was information on raising Bumblebees in the ABJ a couple of years ago. Maybe you can find it. Best regards, Bob -----Original Message----- From: John Valentine To: BEE-L@listserv.albany.edu Date: Tuesday, June 01, 1999 8:04 AM Subject: BumbleBee, question ? >Hello BEE Friends, > >I have always wanted a to keep Bumblebees. Well, upon inspective a squirrel >house I built last year. I found in the rags inside Bumblebees have moved in. > >Question; how do I tend Bumblebees? Can they be split ??? > >John >CT > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 09:00:53 -0400 Reply-To: tvf@umich.edu Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Ted Fischer Organization: ACB Dept., Univ of Michigan Subject: Re: New Queen MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bob Unger wrote: > My question: Should I immediately purchase a new queen or wait for one > to emerge in about 2 more weeks ?? > > Also, I want to purchase a comprehensive book and have been thinking > about either "The Hive and the Honeybee" or "The ABC and XYZ of > Beeculture". Any recommendations between the two? Or is some other > book comprehensive? 1) Wait for the new queen. 2) The best choice among these would be The Hive and the Honeybee. I understand that Diane Sammataro also has an excellent book on the market, but I don't remember its name. Pehaps someone can help. Ted Fischer Dexter, Michigan USA ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 09:21:58 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Thom Bradley Subject: Blueberry and blackberry honey MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I live in southeastern Virginia, USA. Our usual main crop is from the Tulip Poplar tree. Tulip Poplar honey in this area is distinctive in it's color. It is about the color of dark brown tanned used leather with a little tinge of red to it. This year, for me, the Tulip Poplar did not produce. Among others, I have 8 double colonies plus supers on several acres of blueberries and blackberries. The honey produced from these plants in combination looks orange in the comb and in the opaque bucket, appears as dark as the Tulip Poplar but with a very definite orange tinge to it. The flavor is very smooth and complex, less sweet than most but lingers well. Very tasty. Does anyone have any experience with the honey from these 2 crops. I am wondering if this coincides with others experience with these crops. I believe the blueberry variety is Southern Highbush (definitely not a lowbush), but I am not sure. Thom Bradley Chesapeake, VA You can find me on the map by finding the mouth of the Chesapeake Bay. I am right off the southern bank a few miles toward the southeast. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 18:50:31 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Paul Nicholson Subject: Re: Laying worker theory about flight In-Reply-To: <199906012057.QAA25515@listserv.albany.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" At 18:51 -0700 6/1/99, Garth wrote: >Hi All > >Just to comment on the suggestion that laying workers cannot fly - I >beleive this is highly unlikely - a worker bee can fly carrying a >dead drone - well over twice her weight. She can fly carrying a >polystyrene ping pong bal!! A worker is a machine - hse can fly very >well - in fact a queens wings are so similar to a workers, that if >this laying worker cannot fly concept were correct, a laying worker >would have to be bigger than a queen. Maybe it's an issue of the laying workers center of gravity. Any flying machine has an acceptable CG range and outside of that range, stable flight is not possible. A tail heavy bee would stall when it tries to fly. Paul ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 23:48:29 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Tim Rich Subject: This springs split I did my first split this spring(about 7 weeks ago). Got the queen in the wrong hive, and had to purchase a queen from a local bee keeper(likes to catch swarms more than split hives). The good news is that the hive has responded quite well to the queen and now I have 3 medium supers of brood - and almost no honey. The hive did dip in population and now is picking back up. In fact, is quite full of bees. There has been little robbing, and the bees seem quite healthy. There is a great brood pattern - but almost no honey or pollen stored in the hive. Today I put a super of honey on top(with a queen excluder under it!) hoping to help them with getting the larvae fed, but is there something else to do? I don't know if they will produce honey, or if they will just produce bees! Tim Rich North West North Carolina, USA ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 21:50:37 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Allen Dick Subject: Re: Laying workers, question ? In-Reply-To: <199906011256.IAA16906@listserv.albany.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > In my opinion, it is not worth the bother to try to requeen laying > worker colonies. I just combine them with very strong queenright > colonies, and the laying workers disappear... Right. The only reliable, simple solution. THEN, if the combined colony is strong enough in a week or two, split off a second colony to replace the one you lost. Adding a queen to a split is easy. If the combined colony is not strong enough to split a little while after combining, then obviously you would not have accomplished anything by requeening the laying worker colony, since its bees were too old and did not add much to the good colony. The requeened colony would not have amounted to much -- even if you did manage to give them a queen. allen ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 23:07:17 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Allen Dick Subject: Re: Transporting queen cells In-Reply-To: <199905302134.RAA25269@listserv.albany.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > ...the time when it > > is critical to handle the cells with UTMOST care is the period when > > the queen pupae is developing her wings. > I regularly handle cells during that time and yet haven't > seen any proof of that statement. When I introduce cells to > a colony or a mating nuc they normally are 10 to > 11 days from grafting. They will hatch on day 12 or 13 > depending on temp. Sometimes I'm forced to use even younger > cells when I don't have the time to go twice to the > same yard for requeening. I was beginning to reply to this a few days ago, but I added some other thoughts and my reply did not make it past moderation, thus I was spared any 'snide' comments I might have suffered as result. Anyhow, Jack Griffes and his son have done a bit of experimental work on this and the results were reported in sci.agriculture.beekeeping, along with some discussion from Adam and myself, so I won't repeat it here. There are things in the BEE-L archives on this topic as well. I know. I wrote some of them, so I won't repeat them either. Since the sci.ag.bee articles have expired (Some are from 1997), I recommend going to http://www.DejaNews.com and searching for 'queen AND cell AND temperature' in the complete archive. If you are interested, I think you will find other fascinating things by changing the search parameters a bit to try 'chill' instead of 'temperature', etc. allen ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 09:33:46 +0000 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: IBRA Subject: IBRA News;letter - June Comments: To: IBRA Newsletter List MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT IBRA NEWS LETTER MAY/JUNE 1999 =#=#= APICULTURAL ABSTRACTS IS ALIVE AND WELL =#=#= In the dark days of the northern hemisphere December rumours circulated that this much admired journal had come to the end of the road. Even worse the lie was compounded with tale that the library was to close! Although fervently denied by senior staff there seemed to be many people out there that were prepared to believe the worst. Well they were wrong. The first AA of 1999 has been produced in a style and form that is almost as it ever was. What is more number 2 is well under way. The library too is running as normal, providing loans to members, and doing searches and document delivery as usual. However, there is one thing that we can't do without your help: please send us your research papers and publications so that we can abstract them in Apicultural Abstracts. Some people seem to have taken ill-founded rumour for truth - so now that we have put the record straight please send us your material as usual. /\/\ JOURNAL OF APICULTURAL RESEARCH /\/\ There is no denying that IBRA has undergone a terrific upheaval and that there have been some problems and delays. JAR has suffered a little but 1998 saw four editions. Indeed the last for the year AND the first for 1999, due out soon, have been bumper editions both in terms of quality and quantity. ~*~*~ BEE WORLD ~*~*~ 1999 is a big year for IBRA as on the 24 January we celebrated half a century of service to apiculture. The year is even bigger for Bee World which reaches octogenarian status It will be 80 in June. The first Bee World of 1999 has been published and number 2 is due out very soon. Remember that it is only available to members and subscribers so don't miss out. Make sure that you have done your paperwork and have paid up! *<>*<> A HISTORY OF BEEKEEPING *<>*<> The really big news of the month must be that Dr Eva Crane's long awaited book is due out any day *World history of beekeeping and honey hunting* any work by Dr Crane is authoritative and a truly seminal contribution to apiculture. Her new book will be no exception. It will be available through IBRA, the organization that she brought into being and for 35 years directed so ably. The price will be in the region of 90GBP or US$150 so place your order with us now AND remember IBRA members get their usual 10% discount! =================================================== This Newsletter was produced by Dr Pamela Munn Deputy Director of IBRA 18 North Road, Cardiff CF1 3DY, UK Tel: (+44) 1222 372409 Fax: (+44) 1222 665522 Email: ibra@cardiff.ac.uk IBRA WWW pages: http://www.cf.ac.uk/ibra =================================================== ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 04:43:36 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Zee Byrd Subject: Re: Neighbors and bees MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I spoke to one of our state inspectors last week and told him about my neighbors and their complaints about my bees. He came out to evaluate the situation on Friday. He even offered to mediate the situation. However, I didn't want to start that at this point as it didn't seem necessary. I'd rather wait to see if things got any worse between the neighbors and us. While the inspector was here, we stood around the hives and discussed a few things. The entire time we stood there, NOT one bee flew through my neighbor's yard. Their flight path, aided by the fence that surrounds the beeyard on three sides has forced them to go out the front parallel to the property line and continue going on their way. The inspector suggested putting up additional stockade fencing. So, to appease the neighbors, we put up two additional sections of 6' tall stockade fencing. This is placed beyond the existing stockade fence, and is parallel to the property line. Also, in the fall, we are going to move the hives closer to our shed - about 10 feet closer to our house than theirs. I doubt if this will make much of a difference, especially since the bees do not fly through their property in any great amount, but they will see that we are doing something to keep the bees away from them (even if its only psychological). We have a large pond in our backyard which provides a water source for the bees. There were a large number of bees collecting water there while the inspector was visiting. So, as far as providing a source of water, we cannot be faulted there. If some of our bees frequent the neighbor's pond, we cannot control that. We did notice our neighbors having a cookout on Memorial Day. We watched them every so often to see if they were having any "bee problems". It didn't appear that they were - no one was swatting at anything. We also noticed the neighbors working in their garden and not being bothered by any bees as well. I do think that "out of sight, out of mind" applies here. It certainly did the first three years that I had the bees when they were out of sight of the neighbors. Thank you to everyone who replied to my questions - it is much appreciated. I especially enjoyed the story about the empty hives and continuing complaints. I think this fence will help - they can't see the hives, nor can they see the amount of bees coming and going to and from the hives. Zee _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 08:10:46 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Dave Pehling Subject: Re: BumbleBee, question ? In-Reply-To: <199906020225.WAA00176@listserv.albany.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII The best two books I know of about bumbles is "Bumblebee Econcomics", by Heinrich (technical) and "Humblebee Bumblbee", by Griffin (for the layman). Both have chapters on catching/keeping bumblebees. Construction of a nesting box can be found at http://www.anet-chi.com/%7Emanytimes/page40.htm Cheers, Dave Pehling ============================================ | W.S.U. COOPERATIVE EXTENSION-SNOHOMISH CO. | | 600 128TH ST. S.E. | | EVERETT, WA. 98208 U.S.A. | | PHONE - (425)338-2400 | | FAX - (425)338-3994 | | EMAIL pehling@wsu.edu | ============================================ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 12:11:08 -0600 Reply-To: fltdeck1@ix.netcom.com Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Matthew Subject: Re: New Queen - book by Sammataro Comments: To: tvf@umich.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ted Fischer wrote in response to Bob Unger regarding the purchase of a comprehensive book for beekeeping. The book Ted refers to by Diane Sammataro is "The Beekeeper's Handbook" ($25-$30 US) and it's quite comprehensive. What I like most about the book is the easy-to-read sketches for management of supering, fall & spring management, etc. Something a beginning beekeeper can truly appreciate, as well as the 'mature' beekeeper looking for a new ideas. Richard Bonnie (Beekeeping:A Practical Guide, Hive Management & ?) is another author (among many good books out there!) worth investigating. Matthew Westall - Castle Rock, CO > > Beeculture". Any recommendations between the two? Or is some other > > > book comprehensive? > understand that Diane Sammataro also has an excellent book on the > market, > but I don't remember its name. Pehaps someone can help. > > Ted Fischer > Dexter, Michigan USA ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 23:20:14 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Allen Dick Subject: Article sur les huiles et varroa en integralite sur le Net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit The article below is from Abeilles-L Diffusion and point out an article (in French) about a simple method of using vegetable and mineral oils to combat varroa in a large number of hives. --- From: owner-abeilles@fundp.ac.be [mailto:owner-abeilles@fundp.ac.be] On Behalf Of Apiservices - Gilles Ratia To: Abeilles-L Diffusion Subject: Article sur les huiles et varroa en integralite sur le Net Claude Ivert a écrit: >>>> Dans l'abeille de France du mois de Mai, se trouve un article sur l'utilisation des huiles végétales ou minérales pour luter contre varroa . Cet article est le résultat des essais réalisés a l'INRA, Unité de zoologie et apidologie (Y Le Conte, M E Colin, M Treilles, D Crauser, A Paris).Reste a mettre au point une méthode d'utilisation simple sur un grand nombre de ruche. <<<< Cet article se trouve en intégralité sur le site Internet de l'Abeille de France dans la "Galerie Virtuelle Apicole". L'adresse raccourcie pour y parvenir: http://www.apiculture.com/articles/huiles.htm (25 Ko + 1 graphique). Merci aux gérants de la revue. Salutations. Gilles RATIA APISERVICES gilles.ratia@apiservices.com http://www.apiservices.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 14:32:51 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Lloyd Spear Subject: Contact help MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Can someone help me find the email address and fax number for Colmenares Werner Ltda. in Chile? I am specifically trying to contact Sr. Ricardo Kurz. Lloyd Lloyd Spear Owner, Ross Rounds(tm). The finest in comb honey production. http://www.rossrounds.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 11:45:40 -0600 Reply-To: fltdeck1@ix.netcom.com Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Matthew Subject: Re: Laying worker theory about flight MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi All! Since the laying workers are probably the last ones off the ground, it could be they have difficulty flying because they've been stepped on. Now that I found my first laying-worker nuc yesterday, I'll have the chance to try the 'shake-off' method - though I'll take some of Allen's advice and combine the returning bees with a swarm. Matthew Westall - Castle Rock, CO Paul Nicholson wrote: > Maybe it's an issue of the laying workers center of gravity. Any > flying machine has an acceptable CG range and outside of that range, > stable flight is not possible. A tail heavy bee would stall when it > tries to fly. > > Paul ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 15:48:19 -0400 Reply-To: Al Needham Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Al Needham Subject: Re: New Queen MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >"The Hive and the Honeybee" or "The ABC and XYZ of > Beeculture". Any recommendations between the two? I personally like "The Hive & The Honeybee", however, I was always under the impression that they were both considered to be the "Bibles Of Beekeeping". I think you would get a different answer from a number of beekeepers, like virtually all other beekeeping questions :-) Al Needham Scituate, MA.,USA Visit " The BeeHive " Learn About Honey Bees And Beekeeping http://www.xensei.com/users/alwine ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 16:07:39 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: John Partin Subject: Report on beetle In-Reply-To: Allen Dick 's message of Tue, 1 Jun 1999 23:07:17 -0600 Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) I live and beekeep in Florida. I try and make a living keeping bees. We keep from 400 to 1000 hives. We winter in north FLA, and go to the orange groves in the middle of the state south of Orlando. We then leave there and come back to north Fla. and make a crop of galberry and` palmeto. then we go south again to Fort Myers and make a fall crop. I'M telling you all of this to let you know that my bees have been exposed to 100 of thousands of other hives from all over the U.S. To those of y'all that are outside of the U.S. Fla is one of the favorite places for beekeepers to winter at. We have not seen any beetles in any hives. We may have some but if we do we have seen no damage from them. BUD ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 15:59:51 -0400 Reply-To: Al Needham Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Al Needham Subject: Re: BumbleBee, question ? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hiving Bumblebees: A fellow member of my Bee Club once attempted to try establishing a Bumblebee Hive that he could move about to pollinate cranberries. He did manage to create a home that the Bumbles liked. However,they simply did not like being moved about and absconded. Al Needham Scituate, MA.,USA Visit " The BeeHive " Learn About Honey Bees And Beekeeping http://www.xensei.com/users/alwine ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 15:47:35 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: John Partin Subject: Re: Transporting queen cells In-Reply-To: Allen Dick 's message of Tue, 1 Jun 1999 23:07:17 -0600 Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) We buy cells from one of the largest cell producers in the U. S. He is located in Florida. They sell from 1500 to 2000 cells every other day in the peak of the year. We pick them up from his place and keep them from one to three days. The cells are in a device that he makes that is 4 cells wide and 25 cells long that holds 100 cells at a time. They are wraped in an insulated blanket that is as big as the device. He sells an egg ecubator that we use to keep them in if you plan to keep them over nite. We bought a converter from WALMART for about $18 that you can plug into your truck and run the incubater. We could not get along without it. We always handle with care and the cells are carried upright. I know this will not harm them so who cares if other ways will harm or not harm them. We do get in a jack now and then and have to cool them down where it will give us an extra day to get them in. BUD ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 15:03:23 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: "Dr. Abdo Husseiny" Organization: Technology International Incorporated of Virginia, 429 West Airline Highway, Suite S, LaPlace, LA 70068-3817, USA Office: (504)652-1127, FX (504)652-1196, Cellular: (504)487-2182 Subject: 2nd query MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit is there anyone who know of the use of honey as a systemic antibiotic? ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 20:54:07 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Stefan Stangaciu Subject: Blueberry honey. Comments: To: BEE-L MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thom Bradley wrote: >The honey produced from these plants in combination looks >orange in the comb and in the opaque bucket, appears as dark as the >Tulip Poplar but with a very definite orange tinge to it. The flavor is >very smooth and complex, less sweet than most but lingers well. Very >tasty. >Thom Bradley >Chesapeake, VA Hello dear Thom and Bee-L friends, One possible use for these special types of honey is the medicinal one. You need: a) to prove through pollen analysis that your honey is really what you think it is; sometimes the organoleptical characteristics may not be enough; b) to be sure that it contains as less as possible residues (antibiotics, pollutants etc.); c) to ask the help of a local apitherapist (see details on the American Apitherapy Society's site: www.apitherapy.org/aas ); d) to speak with a good local MD, ND, Ayurveda specialist or any other health practitioner which respects your work, the bees and the surrounding Nature... e) to read as much as possible on the honey's general healing properties; f) to read as much as possible on the healing properties of your local bee plants (in this case blueberries and blackberries); g) to learn what are the best ways to administer honey for healing purposes. Hope this helps! Sincerely yours, Stefan Stangaciu (MD, LAcup.) apither@gmb.ro ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 17:02:14 -0500 Reply-To: honeygar@sover.net Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Comments: SoVerNet Verification (on garnet.sover.net) sover.net from arc1a100.bf.sover.net [209.198.80.100] 209.198.80.100 Wed, 2 Jun 1999 17:14:21 -0400 (EDT) From: "Todd D. Hardie" Organization: Honey Gardens Apiaries Subject: stopping crystalization MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Does anyone know how to arrest the natural tendency of honey to crystallize without the use of heat and filtering? We are working on a remedy with a receipe using raw honey and do not want the honey to crystallize when the cold weather comes. Can anyone refer me to published work on the dynamics of honey crystallizing? Is there any possibility of stopping crystallization changing the pH, say with lemon juice? Thank you. Todd Hardie Honey Gardens Apiaries 51 So. Maple St. Vergennes, VT 05491 USA tel. 802-877-6952 fax 802-877-6953 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 19:31:23 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Sherry Medders Subject: Re: Contact help MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >Can someone help me find the email address and fax number for Colmenares >Werner Ltda. in Chile? I am specifically trying to contact Sr. Ricardo >Kurz. > I found a home page that has the email on it. http://www.colmenaressuizos.co.cl/ Hope it helps. :) Kind Regards, Sherry Medders beekeeping.guide@about.com http://beekeeping.about.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 19:30:46 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Al Lipscomb Subject: Bellsouth Add Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Was watching the ball game today and they had a great add. The Bell South sales representative was talking to one of his customers out in the field. The customer was a beekeeper who was telling the rep all the wonderful things Bell South had done for his business. As the beekeeper was working the hives and talking the sales rep was watching bees fly past his veil (he was also wearing the cheap plastic coated gloves). They cut back to the beekeeper who is pulling frames out of the hive and then back to the rep who is now covered with bees (better than any bee beard that I have seen!). The beekeeper quips "just don't smile". The commercial ends with the beekeeper showing off a jar of his best. Not bad overall. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 19:59:57 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Al Lipscomb Subject: Memory of defending workers Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I had to move a hive yesterday a few feet so I got all suited up and put on the gloves (here in Florida it can be the things under the hive that sting the worst). I opened the hive to remove the top two supers so that the weight of the hive would not kill me. I completed the move and put the hive back together. In the middle of all this I removed a worker from my glove, sans the stinger she had just attached to it. Having finished the move I went back over to my house and removed the veil, coveralls and gloves. I then (ten minutes later) went back outside for a while and noticed a lone worker flying around the area I was standing in (a good distance from any hives). I thought I saw a fleck of yellow but was not sure if it was pollen or the result of her losing her stinger. A few seconds later she was after me, since I was standing around some non-beekeeping folks I started to move away so that I could either take the sting or lead her away from them (It sounds braver here than I am sure it looked). I turned around and walked over to my front door and on the way she got tangled into my hair. Not wanting to take a sting in the head I combed her out with my fingers and squashed her on the floor. >From the time the bee first encountered had I had changed clothes which should have altered any visual clues the bee could have had. With the gloves off any trace of attack pheromone was also gone. I am pretty sure the bee had no stinger and was just acting to harass an intruder that had bothered her hive. My guess is she either picked me at random, or picked up on some scent on my person. I had heard of this happening but this was the first time I experienced it. Al Lipscomb arl@suncoast.org 1275 4932 DFA1 97EB D3A1 903D 7563 2936 A66B 86B3 MCSE AA4YU ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 09:34:44 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Computer Software Solutions Ltd Subject: Swarming by first year queens Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hello All I recently came across the following comment by a beekeeping association. >Nowadays queens in their first year will swarm without hesitation. I am wondering if this is true as I have read in more than one bee book that one of the finest ways to cut down on swarming is to requeen every two years. Sincerely Tom Barrett 49 South Park, Foxrock Dublin 18 Ireland Tel + 353 1 289 5269 Fax + 353 1 289 9940 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 09:34:47 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Computer Software Solutions Ltd Subject: GM Foods and Prince Charles Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hello All I refer to my previous post. Prince Charles can be contacted at http://www.princeofwales.gov.uk/ You can fill out a form to indicate your support for his stance against GM foods. It is a site worth visiting. Sincerely Tom Barrett 49 South Park, Foxrock Dublin 18 Ireland Tel + 353 1 289 5269 Fax + 353 1 289 9940 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 22:11:19 -0500 Reply-To: highplains@midmo.net Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Terry Reynolds Organization: High Plains Subject: help MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'm in my first year of bee keeping and lost my first swarm over Memorial weekend. Upon returning from work this evening I found another small swarm had obsconded. My husband and I failed this weekend although we made to attempts to capture that swarm. Tonite we successfully got it out of the tree. Now what do I do? Here's the situation: I had no extra deeps for hive bodies, just mediums with undrawn foundation, no bottom board or lids. So used a medium, took most of the frames out to put in the cardboard box with few bees in it, sat it on an altered imerie shim (sorry!) atop a flat board for a bottom, and put another board atop it. The majority of the bees were on the limb which we cut down so we had first taken off what leaves were clustered with bees and put them inside the "hive". The remainder of the limb still had lots of bees so we gently layed it on the ground in front of the "hive", covered the whole thing up with sheets, hoping to form an extended hive and to be able to funnel the bees into the "hive". Any other suggestions? And if by chance we are successful at getting all the bees off the branch and accepting the "hive", how do i go about getting the cardboard box out of there and the rest of the frames in amongst the bees? I have some more questions, but this one is most urgent. Patty in Mid-Missouri 3 hives, 10 months Faithful reader of the Bee-list ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 17:16:54 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Scott Fairing Subject: Keeping a new queen I am in need of a little advice. Two new queens are due to arrive from Texas tomorrow. One can go into a hive that is queenless as soon as she arrives. The other needs to be kept for two days until I can take her to a hive I plan to split in central Oregon Saturday. What is the best way to keep her safe nd in good health until I can make the split. Thank you for your help In HIS Service Robert (Scott) Fairing Canby, OR E-Mail: fairing@juno.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 21:02:57 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Al Lipscomb Subject: New web site Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I am in the process of putting together a web site for the beekeepers on the net. If you or your club are looking for a place on the web I need the content! The site is bare bone right now (see http://www.beekeeper.org). I have a good deal of space available but lack the time to produce a good quality site. I would even consider letting someone else (help) manage the site if they were so inclined (I am not a graphic artist or web designer!). Please send me an email if you would like to contribute (content, not money!) to building the site. Thank you. Al Lipscomb arl@suncoast.org 1275 4932 DFA1 97EB D3A1 903D 7563 2936 A66B 86B3 MCSE AA4YU ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 09:00:29 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Musashi Subject: Re: Keeping a new queen Robert (Scott) Fairing says: "I am in need of a little advice. Two new queens are due to arrive from Texas tomorrow. ... What is the best wayto keep her safe nd in good health until I can make the split. ..." It is recommended to put a drop of water on the screen end away from the candy once a day and to keep the queen cage out of the sun at room temperature. I don't think you want to get the queen either overheated or too cool. I have used a small piece of "cotton swab" soaked in pure water and placed on the end away from the candy (on the screen) and kept one queen for a long time that way (it seemed like at least a couple of weeks or more) and still had a successful introduction. Of course it's best to get them introduced as soon as you can. One minor problem using the cotton swab is that sometimes the bees catch the fibers in their tarsi and pull them through the screen as the cotton dries but that's usually not too much of a problem. The attendant workers need the water to help them eat the queen candy and feed the queen. Good luck. Layne Westover College Station, Texas ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 22:12:12 +0300 Reply-To: jtemp@xs4all.nl Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Jan Tempelman Organization: in R'dam Subject: Re: Destroying glucose oxidase in honey with air MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit at the end and after the honey-analog we all will make combhoney from the file http://www.xs4all.nl/~jtemp/RossRounds.html - Sure, your bees can make more honey, when they don't have to build out the combs - But as the plumber /sewer worker say: " this is good stuff, nobody has ever touched it" Garth wrote: > Most enzymes are extremely easly 'killed' by foaming - miximg them > with air. greetings, jan -- Jan Tempelman Kerkstraat 53 7471 AG GOOR telefoon: 0547-275788 -- http://www.xs4all.nl/~jtemp/index3.html mailto:jtemp@xs4all.nl -- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 08:36:47 -0600 Reply-To: fltdeck1@ix.netcom.com Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Matthew Subject: Re: help with swarm catching and absconding Comments: To: highplains@midmo.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Terry asks about what to do with a swarm once collected: You'll get much of the same response on fetching swarms as there's not all that much to it. The idea is just to get the queen to fall into your box or hive - usually by shaking the branch(es) with a box or hive underneath. If you can imagine the queen in the middle of the bunch then you shouldn't have much trouble shaking her off. It usually helps to place a white sheet below your ladder or box to keep the bees from getting lost. After shaking, place your box somewhere close to where the swarm used to be and the remaining bees on the branches will smell the queen and start flying to the box. It takes about 10-15 minutes for the bees to start to scramble in search of their queen. I'll usually place my box on the top of a stepladder (within 5 feet or closer) and they'll sniff her out pretty easily. By dusk you should have all the bees (or within 45 minutes if you want to take 90% of them). If the bees don't search out the box, you've missed the queen and will have to re-shake the branch(es) where they congregate. After you have the swarm boxed, simply take them to your new hive, remove the top and dump them in. While the box is over the top of the hive, smack the bottom of the box to unleash clinging bees. Don't worry about the bees flying as they'll follow the queen which you should have dumped into the hive with the majority clinging to her. Remove the box from the area (20' is fine) or you're sure to have bees fly back for the remnants of pheromone on the box. Wait for the bees to start walking down into the hive through the frames and slowly maneuver the inner cover in place. I start by sliding it forward 3/4 the way, then all but the last 1/2" - and 10 minutes later, I'll close the thing fully. Put on the top (with feeder!) and it's done. Be SURE to do this in mild weather when the bees have enough daylight to see where the hive entrance is. Here's a trick to keep the bees from absconding: On the bottom of your new hive, between the hive body and the bottom board, place a queen excluder. If the queen stays, the hive stays. I've had one lively basketball-sized hive abscond on me and none since with the use of excluders. After you see the queen is laying, remove the excluder. Matthew Westall - Castle Rock, CO (p.s. - If you can't 'shake' the branches for swarms then a bee-vacuum would come in handy. E-mail me & I'll send you (or anyone here) a link on how to construct one complete with pictures.) Terry Reynolds wrote: > I'm in my first year of bee keeping and lost my first swarm over > Memorial weekend. Upon returning from work this evening I found > another > small swarm had obsconded. My husband and I failed this weekend > And if by chance we are successful at getting all the bees off the > branch and accepting the "hive", how do i go about getting the > cardboard > box out of there and the rest of the frames in amongst the bees? > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 10:24:43 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Marc Gravel Subject: Seeking Local Beekeeper MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I live in Ottawa, Ontario Canada I'm looking for a beekeeper to show me what it's all about. Can You Help? Thanks Marc === Founder of Yahoo's "General Beekeeping" Club. http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/generalbeekeeping _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 20:06:30 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: GImasterBK@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Keeping a new queen MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit First thing to do is give the queen a drink of water - one drop on the screen cage per day is more than enough - ONE drop, not a finger full. Then put the queen cage in a dark, cool place like the basement where the temperature might be 60 degrees As long as they get a little water, they can be kept this way for 7-10 days, but don't wait any longer than you have to. George Imirie. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 20:44:58 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Comments: RFC822 error: Incorrect or incomplete address field found and ignored. From: "Keith B. Forsyth" Subject: Re: Seeking Local Beekeeper MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi: Try contacting: Eastern Ontario Beekeepers' Association c/o David W.R. Dodge, President 39 Horner Drive Nepean, Ontario K5H 5E8 613 828-2275 I am sure he will be able to direct you to a beekeeper in your area. There are other associations in the Ottawa area, David may be able to comment on these, as to which might be closer to you. Best wishes ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 01:01:56 +1200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Nick Wallingford Organization: Bay of Plenty Polytechnic Subject: Wanted: pollen Comments: cc: mgoodwin@hort.cri.nz Dr Mark Goodwin, apicultural scientist at HortResearch at Ruakura, Hamilton, NZ is looking for companies who can supply him with commercial quantities of artifically collected pollen from either Asian or European pears. You can supply email address or fax numbers directly to him: "Mark Goodwin" Thanks... ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 18:03:17 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: CSlade777@AOL.COM Subject: Re: GM Crops MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'll go along with Tom on this one. The GM technology is proceeding like an express train and nobody has checked whether the brakes work. There is massive ignorance on all sides. The UK Ministry of Agriculture were quite sure that a 2 metre break was quite sufficient to ensure that pollen does not escape from a test plot: any beekeeper in the last hundred years could have told them differently and so could any hay fever sufferer. In only the last few weeks has an Agriculture Minister told Parliament that bees carry pollen for miles. Our County BKA has been concerned at GM crops. We have been unable to discover what experiments have taken place involving bees and honey in this connection, by the GM companies or anybody else. Unless anybody knows different we can only assume the answer is "None". I would not place too much trust on research paid for by people with a vested interest. There has to be suspicion that the questions that are asked are those to which they already have a good idea what the answer is and it is the answer they want. I am sorry to be so cynical but the path to public safety is paved with eternal vigilance. Chris Slade ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 09:17:38 +0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Ken Morris Subject: Bees sensing fear Comments: To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lisa Keeler wrote: >You bet they can sense fear. As a bug-o-phobe I sometimes forget that as a scientist everything is facinating to study! Whenever I am hit by a wave of panic the bees are on me very quickly. Sometimes I have to walk away to get me and the bees back into a proper mental state. I am pleased to see that at least one other beekeeper shares my view that bees sense fear in people around their hives. I listed my thoughts on this subject at www.wn.com.au/hillgrove/faqs.htm but I was beginning to believe that I was the only one around to believe bees sense anxiety/fear/indecision. Thanks, Lisa! Regards, Ken Morris Hillgrove Farm, Batavia Coast, Western Australia Phone: (08) 9926 1087 Fax: (08) 9926 1338 http://www.wn.com.au/hillgrove Bees & Honey, Beekeeping Software, Website Design and Dog Boarding Kennels. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 11:14:43 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Bernd Kuemmel Subject: Willow-Pollen and Family Build-up during Spring ? Comments: To: BEE-L@CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Dear Bee-Listers: I am currently investigating the following, unfortunately awkwardly difficult, questions: 1. If I have short-rotation coppicing (SRC) willow that is harvested every 2 to 4 years, what is the amount of pollen that male willow plants would produce during early spring (like grams per flower per day and how many flowering days can I count on or kg/ha @ c. 20000 stools/ha)? 2. How much of this pollen could be harvested by the bee families? 3. How much would this extra pollen during spring mean for the build-up of the bee family (like in how much would its size [or rise of number of bees in %] be enlarged)? 4. What would this better start during spring mean for the summer honey production? I especially need information on question 1. I would especially appreciate guidance to literature, or also IN, references. The question on the apico-economic value of willow is related to my work on the internal and external economics (and energy aspects) of a CFE system that integrates biofuel production in the form of energy-willow, SRC belts amongst field crops, for more please see the homepage indicated in the footer of this letter. Thank you in advance. Yours sincerely Med venlig hilsen Bernd Kuemmel ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- Bernd Kuemmel, stud.lic. (PhD.stud.) Royal Veterinary and Agricultural University (KVL) Agrovej 10 + DK-2630 Taastrup V: (+45) 35 28 35 33 + F: (+45) 35 28 21 75 http://www.agsci.kvl.dk/~bek/cfehtml.htm ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 22:02:08 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Ken Hoare Subject: Re help with swarm cartching MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Matthew wrote -"Here's a trick to keep the bees from absconding: On the bottom of your new hive, between the hive body and the bottom board, place a queen excluder. If the queen stays, the hive stays." But what happens if she is a virgin, no mating flight for that lady. Ken Hoare ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 01:42:52 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Jorn Johanesson Subject: Spring update of the beekeeping hivenote software! First of I will introduce you to a 'personal' website in english! http://www.agrsci.dk/plb/cjb/cjb_home.htm It is showing a part of what Projectgroup Beekeeping (Research group for beekeeping) is working with! The holder of the site is special working with Varroa research! Second I will introduce the spring Updata of my hivenote software! HTTP://apimo.dk/programs/30-5-99update.exe to use this update : DO NOT UNINSTALL BIDATA! extract this files to a temp directory of your choise. run the setup.exe and install upon the instalation you have. The update is ment to replace with new files. the manual(s) is in RTF format. You can load it into winword, and the save it as a doc file, hvich will decrease the size. The reason for the rtf format is that it then can be read by word6 and word7. I have only word97 so thats why. You can dlete the following files : Bidat3245.hlp Bimanual dansk.rtf Bimanual engelsk.rtf after converting to bimanual english.doc after deleting those files you will have saved around 20MB diskspace. New manual New help file so that all items should be covered. You can choose if you want the software to run as a queen breader softwware or as hivenote software. you can now search and printout! New language drivers suported. nearly the whole world is covered. did you know that you just by editing the languagefile in Notepad.exe can turn the software into your language. Even Chinese is covered :-) the software is free for up to 5 hives. If you register the software for 20 hive or full You will recive A Cd-room with beekeeping related stuff and the latest edition of the hivenote software. registration prices is fair : 10 hives registration is 20USD 20 hives registration is 45USD included one years service by e-mail! Full registration is 100USD included two years service and free updates and service by e-mail.. You can online pay the registration by creditcard and will then be getting the registration information to register the software with. se the manual for introduktion to the software: http://apimo.dk/programs/engmanus.zip about 400Kb best regards Jorn Johanesson EDBi = multilingual Beekeeping software since 1987 http://home4.inet.tele.dk/apimo (Denmark) http://wn.com.au/apimo (Australia) http://apimo.dk (USA) apimo@post4.tele.dk apimo@wn.com.au Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 08:12:53 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: RASpiek@AOL.COM Subject: Re: help with absconding MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mathew said, "On the bottom of your new hive, between the hive body and the bottom board, place a queen excluder." Is there an excluder made to cover the entrance and thus not have to dismantle the hive to remove the excluder later? Richard, West Ky. USA ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 23:04:58 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Stefan Stangaciu Subject: Re: 2nd query MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dr. Abdo Husseiny wrote: >is there anyone who know of the use of honey as a systemic antibiotic? Hello dear Dr. Husseiny and Bee-L friends, "Systemic" means something which affects the whole body and not only parts of it. Honey has powerful antibacterial properties, according to its origin (the best one seem to be thyme honey), but, in my personal opinion, it would be better to consider it as a potentially very good LOCAL antibiotic (like is the case in the treatment of wounds, burns and scalds) and not so much as a "systemic" antibiotic. Systemic antibiotic can be considered another bee hive product: the propolis. Best wishes, Stefan Stangaciu, MD, LAcup. apither@gmb.ro PS References on the antibiotic properties of honey you may find also in our Apitherapy Reference Data Base (www.sci.fi/~apither). Look for the following Pages: * Honey's Properties Bibliography * Bacteriology and Honey Bibliography * Infectious Diseases and Honey Bibliography GOOD LUCK! ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 08:53:25 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Lloyd Spear Subject: Queen excluders MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Richard asked "Is there an excluder made to cover the entrance and thus not have to dismantle the hive to remove the excluder later?" I have twice seen queen breeders use pieces of metal with slits cut "queen excluder size" to cover hive entrances when II (or AI, if that is your preference) queens are first introduced. I know that this is commercially made, but do not know where it can be purchased. Anyone help? Lloyd Lloyd Spear Owner, Ross Rounds(tm). The finest in comb honey production. http://www.rossrounds.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 08:54:12 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Aaron Morris Subject: One Day Seminar on June 19 in Greenwich, NY MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT The Southern Adirondack Beekeepers Association will sponsor a one-day seminar on current developments on the apian front and techniques for better beekeeping. This seminar will be hosted at The Betterbee on June 19, 1999 as part of the Betterbee's 25 Anniversary of doing business in Greenwich, New York. Commencing at 10 AM, guest speakers will include Roger Morse, Diana Sammataro and Richard Taylor. Topics of discussion will include tips from venerable masters, advice from accomplished producers and the latest updates regarding Varroa mites and African hive beetles. Ample time will be allocated in the afternoon for open discussion between attendees and speakers. Attendees are encouraged to bring a picnic lunch, or lunch can be purchased at fast food establishments within walking distance of Betterbee. Newly included this year will be a silent auction! People attending are encouraged to donate an item to be auctioned off. All donated items will be displayed on the auction table the morning of the seminar, along with a piece of paper upon which interested bidders will write their name and bid. At the end of the bidding period the item will be awarded to the highest bidder. Donated items need not be beekeeping related - anything goes! This can be a fun and profitable event for our association. If you will be attending the seminar, please bring an item to donating to the silent auction. Registration fees ($5 for SABA members, $10 for non-members) are encouraged by mail prior to June 12 and may be made by sending a check payable to SABA to: Virginia Van Schaick, SABA Treasurer. 6477 State Hwy 5 Fort Plain New York 13339 Please indicate "Summer Seminar" in the memo area of your check. Late registration ($10 for SABA members, $15 for non-members) will be accepted after June 12. Family members will be included in a single registration fee, but please indicate if (and how many) family member will attend. Volunteers will be needed to help check in registrants and set up the silent auction. Please consider lending a helping hand at the seminar. Further information is available by calling the Betterbee at 1-800 632-3379. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 06:02:11 -0700 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Marc Gravel Subject: Free Beekeeping Club Comments: To: BEE-L@CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I would like to invite anyone who is a beekeeper (Beginner, Intermediate and Expert) like myself to the General Beekeeping Club. The club offers a message board, great links, photo album, contact sheet, chat and more! If you're interested in becoming a member, email me at blacklabel_1998@yahoo.com and type . If you'd like to view the club, please do so... http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/generalbeekeeping Thanks Marc === Founder of Yahoo's "General Beekeeping" Club. http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/generalbeekeeping _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 14:15:20 +0000 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Comments: Authenticated sender is From: IBRA Subject: Bee info Comments: To: bee-l@CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Can anyone help her? Hello - My name is Amy Dorsett and I am a reporter at the San Antonio Express-News in San Antonio, TX. We are having quite a bee problem here - several dogs have been stung to death. I am looking for contacts who can let me know if this situation is unique right now. If you could, please send me in the right direction. Thanks, Amy 210/250-3227 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 09:20:21 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Michelle Greene <76053.704@COMPUSERVE.COM> Subject: Queen excluders MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message text written by Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology >I know that this is commercially made, but do not know where it can be purchased. Anyone help? < Brushy Mountain makes one called an "entrance guard"the # is800 233 7929 It costs 4.50 american... Bobby Lower hudson valley NY ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 09:57:35 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Thom Bradley Subject: Re: help with absconding MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit For the most value priced device. Take an old excluder not fit for use in the hive, cut it to fit with a suitable section, use hive staples or wire to hold it in place. For a more durable product, make a wooden or metal frame for it. Don't have an old one? Buy a new excluder and make 10. Trade 'em with another keeper for something he/she has a few extra of. Thom Bradley Chesapeake, VA RASpiek@aol.com wrote: > > Mathew said, > > place a queen excluder." > > Is there an excluder made to cover the entrance and thus not have to > dismantle the hive to remove the excluder later? > Richard, > West Ky. USA ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 00:21:09 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Paula Franke Subject: GM Crops MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I was very happy to see Tom's post about Prince Charles' site on the GM situation. As a weekly agriculture columnist for www.agdomain.com I've written about the GM problem several times. While Bt is only fatal to certain caterpillars, I'm still very concerned about the lack of comprehensive environmental impact studies before rushing this crops into production. Seems to me that there is too quick a reaction to make a buck for the corporations at the expense of future agriculture. Paula Head of Happy Hollow Farm ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Dec 1997 08:49:16 -0600 Reply-To: dscribner@bigfoot.com Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: "David D. Scribner" Subject: Re: Bee info MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The bees that are the culprit are (10:1 odds) not European honey bees, but Africanized honey bees that have been migrating up through South America and into the U.S. So far, five states in the U.S. have been affected by their migration. In Texas, many counties are under quarantine, of which, if I'm not mistaken, those in and around San Antonio are included (I'd check my Texas quarantine map but that's on my laptop, which died two days ago) :( More information about AHB (Africanized honey bees) can be found on Texas A&M's website. I don't have the URL handy (also on laptop), but I think it was something like http://www.tamug.edu or http://www.tamug.com . Look in their Agricultural News section. They have some very good info on the AHB, and their spread into the U.S., particularly relating to Texas. They may also have some contacts that you might be able to talk to. One of the more informed people in the U.S., with particular interest and experience with the AHB, is Dr. "Chip" Taylor. Back in about '92 I think, he was with Kansas State University I believe. I don't know if he's still there, but it might be worth a try to see if KSU has any of Chip's published works on AHB research. To date, IMHO, though the AHB migration has spread at a slower rate than once predicted, Chip's "prediction" of the spread of AHB has been "more on the mark" with the areas in the U.S. that would be affected than any other I've seen. Hope this helps, --David Scribner Niche on the Net! - IBRA wrote: > Can anyone help her? > > Hello - My name is Amy Dorsett and I am a reporter at the San Antonio > Express-News in San Antonio, TX. We are having quite a bee problem here > - several dogs have been stung to death. I am looking for contacts who > can let me know if this situation is unique right now. > Thanks, > Amy - 210/250-3227 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 4 Dec 1997 09:27:28 -0600 Reply-To: dscribner@bigfoot.com Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: "David D. Scribner" Subject: Re: Bee Info - San Antonio AHB Question MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Oops! My last post re: help on the AHB for the reporter from San Antonio, TX contained erroneous information. Dr. Taylor was with University of Kansas, NOT Kansas State University! Sorry! --David Scribner Niche on the Net! - ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 20:09:23 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: "Sr. Monica Ryan" Subject: Many drones - no pollen. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello to all! Wondering about what I saw? I sat in the apiary today for quite a while observing what was happening at the hive entrances. We have only 5 hives. The time was 3 p.m. June 1st and the temperature was 19 -20 C. I never before saw so many drones entering the hives. AS well, I did not see a scrap of pollen being brought in. The colonies have been in good shape up to now. We took off honey on the 15th May, and the supers are again almost ready for another extraction. I'm wondering what was going on - why were there so many drones? And why was there no pollen? The picture I got was completely different from any I observed before. Has anybody else had the same experience? Is what I saw a good or a bad omen? Am really wondering. Thanks, in advance Sr. Catherine Duffy (Sr. M. is just the typist) ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 15:34:23 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: "Robert M. Malley" Subject: Fw: Queen excluders MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >Message text written by Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee >Biology >>I know that this is commercially >made, but do not know where it can be purchased. Anyone help? The Walter T. Kelly Co. Inc. makes one called an "entrance guard" the Cat No. is 279 It costs 3.25 american... Telephone 1-800-233-2899 Just a NewBee Robert ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 22:27:21 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Leen & Maria van den Berg Subject: Re: GM Crops MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Chris Slade wrote >I'll go along with Tom on this one. The GM technology is proceeding like an >express train and nobody has checked whether the brakes work. There is >massive ignorance on all sides. What are the experiences from the pollinators in the GMcanola in Southern Alberta (Canada) ? Maria van den Berg, Peace River Country, Northern Alberta. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 15:09:47 -0700 Reply-To: beeman@kingston.net Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Kent Stienburg Subject: Re: help with absconding MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I might have missed something on this thread but instead of an excluder why not a frame of brood? That's what I have always used and I have never had a swarm abscond. I started out using excluders for honey but found them to cause the bees to fill up the brood boxs first before moving up into the supers so I don't use them anymore. -- Kent Stienburg Remove NOSPAM to reply. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 19:31:36 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Bill Mares Subject: H&HBvsABC&XYZ Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 15:48:19 -0400 From: Al Needham >"The Hive and the Honeybee" or "The ABC and XYZ of > Beeculture". Any recommendations between the two? I have them both and benefit from both. The HHB is like a regular text book, with individual chapters well-written and logical and informative by topic. The XYZ is much more ideosyncratic, illogical, discursive, 'funky' and, sometimes misleading. Both are worth having, but if I were buying two books, I'd get Sammaturo and then H&HB. Bee Happy in Your Work! ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 16:35:51 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: honey.road@SYMPATICO.CA Organization: My Beekeeping Homepage - http://www3.sympatico.ca/honey.road Subject: Re: H&HBvsABC&XYZ Comments: To: alwine@xensei.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > >"The Hive and the Honeybee" or "The ABC and XYZ of > > Beeculture". Any recommendations between the two? I too have both books, and was a little disapointed when I got ABC's. For the price difference, get The Hive & Honeybee, tons more info and information. Although, since ABC's is layed out as an encyclopedia, info is easier to find. The Hive has so much info, it's overwelming to read. If you get TH&HB, make sure to get the one with the black cover and gold lettering, it's is the most upto date. Some stores still have the older yellow cover, which is much older, and has less in it. If your spendding the same, might aswell make it worth your while. Allen B ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 09:04:01 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Beekeeperc@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Re help with swarm cartching MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ken, this will only work sometimes. When the queen and her subjects decide to swarm she will slim down enough to fit through a queen excluder, and off they go. Norm in Ct. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 22:05:16 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Scott Moser Subject: Closing Bees in Hive MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Greetings all, Today, the owner of the property of one of my yards asked today if it would be possible to close up three hives for a few hours one morning to move some concrete pipes by the hives. I told him that I thought I could, but I wasn't sure how long. Here in St. Louis, we have had daytime temps of 95, and night time temps of mid 70's. The hives are in early morning shade. I intend to screen the entrance, and add an empty super that has a screen top on it, so they can spread out and fan better. How long can they stay like this. He seems to think he would start at daybreak (6:00 am) and would be done by 9:00 am. Would this be a problem? Thanks! Scott Moser " I believe that beekeeping mirrors life. One must endure a few stings to reach the final sweet reward." S. Moser ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 10:27:27 -0500 Reply-To: beekeeper@honeyhillfarm.com Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: wtroyer Organization: Honey Hill Farm Subject: Re: Fw: Queen excluders MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I've been reading the recent posts about swarms with interest and decided to let the group know how we have been dealing with them. First, visit your local veterinarian and buy a cardboard cat carrying box. Second, take a regular deep frame that you will be using in your hive, preferably one that has drawn comb, and put it diagonally in the the box. (Diagonally only because that is how it fits best in this size box.) Now you are ready for a swarm. Hold the box under the swarm and shake the bees into it. Then place the box on the ground under the area where the swarm was. If the queen is in the box the bees will start fanning, if the queen is not in the box the bees will most likely fly back where they were. Just start over when they reform until you know the queen is in the box. Then, wait about 20 minutes until the bees get nestled in the cat box. Put your hive where you want it. Have about 4 or 5 frames in it. Carry the cat box to the hive. Put the frame from the cat box very carefully in the hive. The queen is most likely on the frame. Shake the rest of the bees into the hive. Very carefully, with ungloved hands preferably, put the rest of the frames in the hive. Put the inner cover over 2/3s of the hive, leaving an opening in the back until evening. At dusk position the inner cover normally and put the outer cover on. If you have a frame of honey use that as one of the regular frames in the box, or, use a feeder until the bees build up some honey on their own. We have not found it necessary to use any kind of queen excluder device using this method. We discovered that bees like this particular cardboard box and hive up better using this as an intermediary container before putting them in a hive. We don't know why, it just works. The cardboard container is lightweight and portable, has handles on top. Be sure to punch out the round holes on the sides because the bees love to come and go. Hope this helps, Joan from "Sweet Soaps" -- Web: http://www.honeyhillfarm.com Mail: beekeeper@honeyhillfarm.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 22:39:14 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Ian Watson Subject: Paradichlorobenzene (PDB) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello Bee-l I still have several supers of honey from last year and wax worms are starting to do their damage. I have read in "The Hive and The Honey Bee" that "paradichlorobenzine (PDB) should never be used to fumigate comb honey as it will permiate the cappings and ruin the flavour of the honey". I wasn't aware of this and have had the para crystals on the combs for a few days and am wondering if it is safe to extract it. Is PDB toxic? Will the smell go away if I air out the supers for a while? Thanks, Ian Watson ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 18:01:50 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: BeeCrofter@AOL.COM Subject: Re: H&HBvsABC&XYZ MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 6/5/99 7:48:53 AM EST, Bill@cvumail.cvu.cssd.k12.vt.us writes: > > >"The Hive and the Honeybee" or "The ABC and XYZ of > > Beeculture". Any recommendations between the two? > XYZ goes into the bathroom as it is short subjects Hive and the Honeybee goes to bed with you . ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 12:12:57 -0700 Reply-To: ryarnell@orednet.org Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Richard Yarnell Subject: Epinephrin Some time ago we had a discussion about keeping epinephrin on hand. The cost of "Epipens" or another autoinjecting device was a concern to many. The shelf life of epinephrin is 12-18 months. Hopefully, the stuff won't be used. Cheap insurance, maybe. However, for those who are comfortable or experienced giving IM injections, 1mg ampules are available. If paired with a syringe and hypo, the insurance can be purchased for around $5US (compared to $35 for an epi-pen.) In the US, a prescription is required. But if you are on good terms with your Doctor and point out that emergency medical response in remote apiaries is a problem, you should be able to get one. In searching through the archives, I noted that there were references to delivering epinephrin "sub-q." According to my pharmacist, the material should be delivered IM (the front of your thigh is handy). In addition, the epi dose should be considered "first aid" and prompt medical supervision should be obtained. Consult your doctor and pharmacist. -- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 17:01:11 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Stefan Stangaciu Subject: Re: New web site MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Al Lipscomb wrote: >I am in the process of putting together a web site for the beekeepers on >the net. If you or your club are looking for a place on the web I need the >content! The site is bare bone right now (see http://www.beekeeper.org). Dear Al and Bee-L friends, I am myself working for two new web sites: www.apitherapy.org and www.apitherapy.com If anything from your beekeeping activities and/or healing properties of your bee products reminds you of apitherapy please send me a short message to: apither@gmb.ro Thanks in advance! Yours, Stefan Stangaciu, Constanta, Romania. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 15:25:24 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Lloyd Spear Subject: Queen excluders on entrances MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "I know that this is commercially made, but do not know where it can be purchased. Anyone help?" I found one source, Kelley sells full size sheets, from which narrow strips can be cut for stapling over hive entrance. Kelley catalog #37. However, Kelley will only sell in lots of 100! Anyone know where (1) can be purchased? Lloyd Lloyd Spear Owner, Ross Rounds(tm). The finest in comb honey production. http://www.rossrounds.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 12:23:22 -0600 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Allen Dick Subject: Re: GM Crops In-Reply-To: <199906051241.IAA05008@listserv.albany.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > The GM technology is proceeding like an > > express train and nobody has checked whether the brakes > > work. There is massive ignorance on all sides. > > What are the experiences from the pollinators in the GMcanola > in Southern Alberta (Canada) ? Genetic Modification can take many forms. In the canola we pollinate in Southern Alberta, I believe that two simple traditional factors are involved: selection, and hybridization. There is no injection of human genes, BT emulation, or any such questionable activity -- AFAIK. I may be wrong, but I understand that the modification is merely by the same sorts of traditional methods that derived many different dogs, including the Irish Wolfhound and the Toy Poodle, from a common gene pool. AFAIK, each parent line of the canola is merely the result of careful selection from a worldwide population of plants for certain characteristics, among which are -- most significantly -- resistance to the effects of Liberty(r). Liberty is a weed control chemical produced by the company that owns the enterprise that developed -- and continues to develop -- the seed we are helping to produce. Historically, canolas have been extrememly sensitive to such sprays and great care had to be taken to avoid contact with any of these weed control chemicals. The advantage to tolerance of weed control chemicals is that canola crops can now be sprayed for weeds *after emergence* and thus be planted earlier than would be possible if farmers had to wait for weeds to emerge and be killed before planting the crop. There is also less danger of serious competition from fast-growing weeds overtaking the crop, since the canola can use its head start to develop a canopy and shade the weeds before they can get established. There are many considerations in the selection of the parent lines for this canola, such as plant sturdiness, disease resistance, yield, etc. Chemical based insect resistance is not presently one of them -- AFAIK. For one thing insect resistance or toxicity would be highly detrimental to the seed production since there is currently no feasible way of producing the commercial seed without the agency of bees: the 'male' and the 'female' lines are planted in very distinct and well-separated areas. Without bees enthusiastically transferring pollen between the two, no seed would be produced. Once the parent lines have been selected and grown, they are seeded in the fields we pollinate, and which will yield the final product: a canola that can be sprayed for weeds after emergence and which will out-yield standard commercial canolas by over 25%. The two parent crops are seeded in wide rows (See pictures at http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/) and the seed from the 'females' only is harvested and sold to farmers to seed commercial crops. The 'males' are mowed out and destroyed. Since there is no deliberate attempt to have a plant that is repulsive or harmful to insects at this time -- AFAIK -- this canola seems to me to be no different from any other 'Argentine' type rape. It welcomes bees, yields nectar and pollen, and is otherwise great for bees. The stocking rate of 3 hives per acre -- along with the deliberate avoidance of areas with nearby competing crops for the bees to forage -- does, however, very significantly reduce the likelihood of attaining a large honey crop. Moreover the other factors associated with hauling bees in and out and crowding them into locations does introduce some negative factors which result in noticably greater losses of queens and hives over the season that we would expect to experience in a stationary operation with less crowding of sites and with abundant alternate bee forage available continuously as the season progresses. Last season, we lost about 500 out of 3,100 hives between the time we finished splitting and verifying success and the time we wrapped in the fall. Our winter losses were also higher than we would have expected, and we think that is partly due to the additional stress of pollinating and the residual effect of sprays in some yards, since the crops were all sprayed at conclusion of flowering with Decis(r) while the bees were still present. I should mention that if spraying has to be undertaken near bees, that Decis(r) is a good choice. It works by contact, and has very low residual toxicity. If it is sprayed after the bees cease foraging for the day, little immediate damage is noticable -- assuming that there is no drift over the hives, and that they are given a reasonably wide berth. So, all in all, going back to the question about 'GM' canola, It seems to me that the term 'GM' is a catch-all that includes a wide variety of techniques, and does not really adequately differentiate between many matters that generate distinctly different concerns. It is one of those concepts that is designed to appeal to the (largely uninformed) public mind and generate popular movements, but which is largely meaningless in any specific case. There are some concerns that are legitimate and which are *associated with* the idea of 'GM'. Introduction of foreign genes into common plants and animals is a practice which presents more possibilities -- both 'good' and 'bad' than we can begin to imagine. The BT crops experience is a good case in point here. Even traditional non-'space age' methods of breeding new crops and plants can have huge effects that are difficult to predict. Monoculture and its many ramifications, even without GM, is cause for concern on many levels. allen ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 10:12:12 -0800 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: mason Subject: Berry pollonation vs. netting size Comments: To: Post to Bee List MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear Bee-L 'ers I am directing this question to those of you who have experience in pollinating berries. I keep many hives on an estate that has many formal gardens. As part of this estate, there is a very large berry garden which is kept under 3/4"x3/4" netting to keep the birds away. The netting is needing to be replaced and the owners are looking at different netting that is 1/2"x1/2". The question was raised, will the bees keep going through the netting if it is down sized to 1/2" square openings from 3/4" openings? The bees don not seem to mind going through the 3/4" netting at this time. Does anyone have the answer to this question?? What is the smallest size netting bees will pass through to get to the berry blossoms? They know the need the bees in the berries and don't want to buy netting that will keep them out. If anyone out there has experience with this sort of thing, please e-mail me personally as it most likely will not interest anyone else. My address is: mason@netwiz.net. Thanks so much. -- Mason Harris, KarinaBee Apiaries ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 11:44:01 -0600 Reply-To: fltdeck1@ix.netcom.com Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Matthew Subject: Re: Fw: Queen excluders - follow-up on original post from Terry MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi All! Since there have been multiple posts on the use of brood/drawn comb to keep swarms from absconding, I thought I'd follow-up from Terry's original post. Pulling out a frame or two of brood, or even the use of drawn foundation is a great way to hive a swarm and keep it from absconding. However, Terry posted for 'help' because' he only had undrawn foundation available. Those of use that collect a bunch of swarms each year likely can't afford the time or 'expense' from pulling a few frames of brood from our best hives just for a new swarms. Brood will definitely keep a swarm happy but drawn foundation will only 'likely' keep them from absconding. Swarms have a great tendency to draw out new foundation, so I'll feed the heck out of them after dumping them onto all new foundation - which saves time, brood and the demoralization (however small) of my existing hives. Later in the season (say mid-June for Colorado's weather) I'll start to give them drawn comb or combine them with other hives. If you hive a swarm on new foundation, try to keep them (all) there without a queen excluder, especially if you're using plastic foundation. You may come back to an empty feeder and hive. Happy Beekeeping, Matthew Westall Castle Rock, CO Joan wrote: > box. Second, take a regular deep frame that you will be using in your > hive, preferably one that has drawn comb, and put it diagonally in the > > the box. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 20:33:25 -0400 Reply-To: info@beeworks.com Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: Re help with swarm cartching In-Reply-To: <199906061407.KAA18504@listserv.albany.edu> On 6 Jun 99, at 9:04, Beekeeperc@aol.com wrote: > Ken, this will only work sometimes. When the queen and her subjects > decide to swarm she will slim down enough to fit through a queen excluder, > and off they go. I don't believe this statement is correct. It is the size of a queens thorax not abdomen which controls the fit through queen excluders. Mind you I've seen some very tiny scrubs which I think could fit through, but they were underfed poor specimens. > Norm in Ct. ***************************************** The Bee Works, 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, Orillia, Ontario, Canada.L3V 6H1. Phone (705)326 7171 Fax (705)325 3461 David Eyre, Owner e-mail http://www.beeworks.com This months special:- Labels **************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 20:33:25 -0400 Reply-To: info@beeworks.com Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: Queen excluders on entrances In-Reply-To: <199906061420.KAA18877@listserv.albany.edu> On 5 Jun 99, at 15:25, Lloyd Spear wrote: > I found one source, Kelley sells full size sheets, from which narrow > strips can be cut for stapling over hive entrance. Kelley catalog #37. > However, Kelley will only sell in lots of 100! Anyone know where (1) can > be purchased? Helps if you deal with the smaller guys. We have them in stock, white plastic, 1/32nd thick, 18"X18", easily cut. I used one to form a false entrance 3" deep and use it to keep in drones when mating too close a relationship. Please e-mail us direct if you want one. ***************************************** The Bee Works, 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, Orillia, Ontario, Canada.L3V 6H1. Phone (705)326 7171 Fax (705)325 3461 David Eyre, Owner e-mail http://www.beeworks.com This months special:- Labels **************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 07:19:56 -0500 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: John Caldeira Subject: Killing Africanized Bees Comments: To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit What is good way to kill africanized bees in a hive while leaving the combs in usable condition? Someone recommended burning sulfur powder inside the hive, but how is this done? My thinking is to kill the bees, then install a nuc colony into that hive. Due to the location, it is not practical to simply requeen and wait. I need those mean bees out now. Thanks. -John John Caldeira jcaldeira@earthlink.net Dallas, Texas, USA (972) 403-8488 http://home.earthlink.net/~jcaldeira/beekeeping/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 12:25:55 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Ken Hoare Subject: Queen excluders on entrances MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit May I clarify my beliefs of using queen excluders on entrances to prevent colonies swarming, or hived swarms absconding. I am TOTALLY against the idea, and NOT supportive as some of the offline correspondents have suggested. My input to this thread was to question when using a queen excluder attempting to prevent a swarm from absconding, should that swarm contain a virgin queen, I believe one 'lady' who would not get out for a mating flight, consequently a 'drone laying' and useless queen. Personally cannot remember experiencing an absconding swarm and maybe, repeat maybe, one of my methods of hive management make by boxes attractive to the bee. That method is the use of the gas torch to sterilise all woodware that has been brought back home. Having scraped the majority of wax and propolis from the box it is then flamed internally, just sufficient to discolour the wood (I'm not a beekeeping pyromaniac). Then smell the wood and it has that very attractive aroma of wax and propolis, maybe this is what my swarms (not confessing to many !!!) find an inviting home. But as for pinning a steel grid over the entrance, sorry not a method I wish to try. Ken Hoare bees@kenlia.enta.net ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 09:29:53 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Pollinator@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Killing Africanized Bees MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 6/7/99 8:35:09 AM Eastern Daylight Time, jcaldeira@earthlink.net writes: > What is good way to kill africanized bees in a hive while leaving the combs > in usable condition? Someone recommended burning sulfur powder inside the > hive, but how is this done? Sulfur fumes would work, but are extremely dangerous to your lungs, and you might also burn up your hive. Then (if you succeeded) you'd have to air out the hive for quite a while, and you still might have trouble inducing bees to live in that foul odor. I used sulfur in a bee smoker once to kill a bad hive. It worked, but it ruined the smoker. I never could get the smell out of it. Why not a shop vac? Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green Hemingway, SC USA The Pollination Scene: http://users.aol.com/pollinator/polpage1.html The Pollination Home Page: http://www.pollinator.com Jan's Sweetness and Light Shop (Varietal Honeys and Beeswax Candles) http://users.aol.com/SweetnessL/sweetlit.htm ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 10:47:41 -0400 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Greg Hankins Subject: Comfrey Honey? Comments: To: BEE-L@CNSIBM.ALBANY.EDU Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Pulled some Roos Rounds off a couple of hives this weekend and found an unusual honey that I think may be from Comfrey. I'm curous whether anyone on the list has experience with this sources and an describe the honey. The Comfrey in my yard has been in bloom for some weeks and has been worked steadily by bumblebees. The honey bees showed no interest until the tulip poplar played out, then I noticed them on the comfrey. The flowers are tubular and quite deep, so, while the bumbles dive right in from the end of the flower, the honey bees move to the bases of the petals and insert tongues there. I observed this consistently. The honey in question is quite dark. It appears black in the comb, but is a dark amber when it spreads out thin on a white saucer. It's thin and has a bit of a sourness in the taste - and sort of an acrid aftertaste. Does that sound like comfrey to anyone? The other possibility that comes to mind is honeydew from aphids on the peas and roses - but I haven't seen the bees near the aphids. Greg ______________________________________________________________ Greg Hankins Seven Lakes Times, L.L.C. ghankins@ac.net P.O. Box 602 Voice: (910)673-0111 1008 Seven Lakes Drive Fax: (910)673-0210 Seven Lakes, NC 27376 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 09:17:50 EDT Reply-To: mnasr@evbhort.uoguelph.ca Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Medhat Nasr Organization: Environ. Biology & Horticulture Subject: Re: Advanced Beekeeping Course MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Dear B- Line members: ADVANCED BEEKEEPING COURSE - SAULT STE. MARIE, ONTARIO, CANADA FRIDAY, JUNE 25, 1999 7:00 pm Small Hive Beetle Doug McRory, Provincial Apiarist 7:45 pm Bee Genetics and Breeding Dr. Medhat Nasr, Researcher, OBA 8:30 pm A Practical Breeding and Management Dr. Tibor Szabo, Researcher Program for Varroa Control 9:15 pm Breeding the SMART Varroa Resistant Bee Dr. Roger Hoopingarner, Holt, Michigan SATURDAY, JUNE 26, 1999 9:00 am Hive and Extracting Equipment for Beekeeping Paul Kelly, Bee Lab University of Guelph 9:45 am Honeybee Diseases and Parasites Dr. Medhat Nasr, Researcher, OBA 10:30 am Coffee 10:45 am Seasonal Field Management of Honey Bee Colonies Paul Kelly, Bee Lab University of Guelph 11:30 am Field Demonstration of Queen Rearing and Mating. Tibor Szabo, Researcher 12:15 pm Lunch 1:30 pm Pollination Biology and Managing Bees for Pollination Dr. Roger Hoopingarner, Holt, Michigan 2:15 pm IPM for Parasitic Mites Dr. Medhat Nasr, Researcher, OBA 3:00 pm Coffee 3:15 pm Big Picture of Beekeeping in Ontario Doug McRory, Provincial Apiarist Where? Holy Trinity Church, 352 Northern Avenue East (across from K-Mart on corner Hwy 17 N and Northern Avenue and Mary's Beeyard Cost? CND $75.00 including lunch + 7% GST Note: You must register in advance. Send name, address & cheque to Ontario Beekeepers' Association, Bayfield, ON N0M 1G0 as soon as possible. Medhat Nasr, Ph.D. Research Scientist, Ontario Beekeepers' Association Dept. Environmental Biology University of Guelph Guelph, Ontario, Canada N1G 2W1 Tel: (519) 824-4120 Fax:(519)837-0442 e-mail: mnasr@evbhort.uoguelph.ca ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 20:41:01 +0200 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: P-O Gustafsson Subject: Re: Killing Africanized Bees MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit John Caldeira wrote: > What is good way to kill africanized bees in a hive while leaving the combs > in usable condition? Petrol. Close up the hive in the evening with a few dl of petrol poured over the bottom board and the fumes will kill the bees. -- Regards P-O Gustafsson, Sweden beeman@algonet.se http://www.algonet.se/~beeman/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 21:43:16 +0100 Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: Ken Hoare Subject: re killing africanised honey bees MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The question is asked, "What is good way to kill africanized bees in a hive while leaving the combs in usable condition?" Secure the hive and place everything into the freezer. I do it when the wife is not looking but to retain family harmony place the box into a clean plastic sack and secure it. You will find that with the protection of the woodwork it takes about three days to kill them and the majority will have their heads deep within a cell, similar to a case of starvation. Then either a tedious job picking them out or allow the next colony to do so. Worth experimenting with the time as I am sure that with less than three days they are very immobile and could be shaken off the combs and killed with petrol or similar. If you call in for breakfast sometime make sure the sausages come from the refrigerator!! Ken Hoare bees@kenlia.enta.net ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 18:24:10 EDT Reply-To: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: CSlade777@AOL.COM Subject: Re: willow pollen and colony build up MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I don't have any of the answers, only more questions. Why only male clones? Are they more productive of biomass than females? I have not noticed that male willows are bigger than females. Willow pollen can be very important for spring build up in honey bee colonies. So can the nectar. If the objective is to maximise the energy that can be extracted from an area of plantation my guess is that a mixture is best. Probably the optimum mix will be different from season to season depending on weather patterns. The bees like both pollen and nectar and maybe the willows will like a few ladies around as well. Chris Slade ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 21:03:17 -0400 Reply-To: info@beeworks.com Sender: Informed Discussion of Beekeeping Issues and Bee Biology From: David Eyre Subject: Re: Killing Africanized Bees In-Reply-To: <199906071233.IAA03418@listserv.albany.edu> On 7 Jun 99, at 7:19, John Caldeira wrote: > What is good way to kill africanized bees in a hive while leaving the > combs in usable condition? Someone recommended burning sulfur powder > inside the hive, but how is this done? Please, please don't use sulphur. The damage to your lungs doesn't bear thinking about. Sulphur damage is the reason Canada is forcing the oil companies to remove sulphur from gasoline by 2003. A far better way, take a regular garden pressure spray, make up a 'STRONG' soapy water mix (washing up liquid) pump up the pressure and let 'em have it. We did it last year on a really bad hive, works a treat. To clean out the resulting mess, keep adding clear water to the sprayer and clean off the soap. If you don't there is a danger the incoming bees would be damaged by the residual soap left on frames and hive parts. ***************************************** The Bee Works, 9 Progress Drive, Unit 2, Orillia, Ontario, Canada.L3V 6H1. Phone (705)326 7171 Fax (705)325 3461 David Eyre, Owner e-mail http://www.beeworks.com This months special:- Labels ****************************************