Article 11257 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!207.69.200.121!news.mindspring.com!usenet From: ktjackson@mindspring.com (Todd Jackson) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Beekeeping organizations in southeastern TN ??? Date: Sun, 01 Mar 1998 02:44:20 GMT Organization: MindSpring Enterprises Lines: 7 Message-ID: <34f9cade.2217633@news.mindspring.com> Reply-To: ktjackson@mindspring.com NNTP-Posting-Host: user-38lcni5.dialup.mindspring.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Server-Date: 1 Mar 1998 02:45:37 GMT X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11257 Does anyone know of a beekeeping organization in southeast TN? As in the Chattanooga area. I would like to learn how to beekeep and would like to find a place where I could learn. Thanks Todd Article 11258 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!unc-cs!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!ptdnetP!ptdnetS!newsgate.ptd.net!nnrp2.ptd.net.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Russell T. Sears" Subject: Re: The more the merrier? Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <34F78886.28CBC40F@midtown.net> Organization: LIFT, Inc. Message-ID: <01bd44b5$fd51ae80$7b10bacc@beehive> X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1161 Lines: 28 Date: Sun, 01 Mar 1998 02:02:44 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: cs8-11.eph.ptd.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 21:02:44 EST Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11258 If your hive is strong this spring, split out three frames with lots of capped brood (and no queen!) and put them in a new hive. Fill out the new hive with combs or foundation. Replace the three frames in the original hive with frames of foundation. Give the new hive a new queen. It will build rapidly and produce some extracted honey for you, no comb honey this year though. The original hive will be less likely to swarm. I've found this to be far superior to using package bees. TiPnRiNg wrote in article <34F78886.28CBC40F@midtown.net>... > I'm about to be able to say I've been keeping bees for a year now. Last > spring I started with a pound and half and I think by winter they were > almost to the "add a third box" stage. I didn't, however, get any > honey. I'm getting the urge to start another hive going. My question > is, (I know,,FINALLY!), if I were to get, say three pounds of bees, > this year, ya think I would get honey before year end? Any down sides > to getting more bees at the start? Thanks Jer > > Article 11259 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: From: "Kidney John" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <34f9cade.2217633@news.mindspring.com> Subject: "Bees at the Bottom of the Garden" Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 10:01:31 -0000 Lines: 11 X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 NNTP-Posting-Host: pm1-230.dial.nildram.co.uk Message-ID: <34f934db.0@mercury.nildram.co.uk> Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!hearst.acc.Virginia.EDU!newsfeed.cv.nrao.edu!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!nntp.news.xara.net!xara.net!peer.news.nildram.co.uk!mercury.nildram.co.uk!pm1-230.dial.nildram.co.uk Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11259 Looking for a copy of the book "Bees at the Bottom of the Garden", by Alan Campion. Can anybody help? thanks, Kidney John gnimmelf@nildramnilspam.co.uk Remove to reply. "We are all in the gutter, But some of us are looking at the Stars" Article 11261 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!unc-cs!news-relay.ncren.net!rutgers!usenet.logical.net!news.dal.ca!sunqbc.risq.qc.ca!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!192.220.251.22!netnews.nwnet.net!news-hub.interserv.net!news.sprynet.com!not-for-mail From: "Ernest Scofield" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Honey Production Figures Date: 27 Feb 1998 09:43:53 GMT Organization: Sprynet News Service Lines: 5 Message-ID: <01bd4364$13526740$0261afce@default> NNTP-Posting-Host: hdn86-002.hil.compuserve.com X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11261 Does anyone know of a source for average honey production state by state on the web or in print form? -- E.L.Scofield Virginia Beach Honey Company Article 11262 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!unc-cs!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!news-peer.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!newshub1.home.com!news.home.com!Supernews60!supernews.com!Supernews69!not-for-mail From: "Tom" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Hive question Date: Sun, 1 Mar 1998 11:25:18 -0600 Organization: All USENET -- http://www.Supernews.com Lines: 5 Message-ID: <6dc5ot$hui$1@usenet54.supernews.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 18386@207.79.121.67 X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11262 Hello all. I am going to be adding Two hives this year,and I was wondering if I could use cedar to build the hives with (I have a free source for usable size cutoffs) Thanks for any input. Tom Article 11263 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!rutgers!usenet.logical.net!nntprelay.mathworks.com!news.idt.net!netnews.com!news.internetsat.com!news.arrakis.es!195.5.79.8 From: "Javier Soto Vázquez" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: 625 Agricultural Links Date: Sun, 1 Mar 1998 19:10:17 +0100 Organization: none Lines: 6 Message-ID: <34f9a78d.0@news.arrakis.es> NNTP-Posting-Host: caladan.arrakis.es X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11263 We increase in 45 the number of links, and now in our Web site we have 625 links. http://www.arrakis.es/~sotojavi/ In adition, we improve some sections, and the links have descriptions. Article 11264 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!europa.clark.net!192.148.253.68!netnews.com!news.internetsat.com!news.arrakis.es!195.5.79.8 From: "Javier Soto Vázquez" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: 625 enalces agrícolas Date: Sun, 1 Mar 1998 19:04:30 +0100 Organization: none Lines: 7 Message-ID: <34f9a77e.0@news.arrakis.es> NNTP-Posting-Host: caladan.arrakis.es X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11264 Hemos añadido 45 enlaces nuevos a nuestra página y ya son 625 los enlaces del sector agrícola que tenemos. http://www.arrakis.es/~sotojavi/ Además estamos mejorando la sección de enlaces y existen algunas con descripción sobre los links. Article 11265 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!Sprint!worldnet.att.net!newsadm From: "George Styer" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: First swarm of the year Date: 1 Mar 1998 21:05:39 GMT Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services Lines: 19 Message-ID: <6dcij3$gur@bgtnsc02.worldnet.att.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.64.101.194 X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1157 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11265 Well El Nino's effects in California are seen once again. I had it in my plans to begin my swarm management in earnest on Monday. Up until this point the only thing I did was to add 3 suppers for the space. Well mother nature did not want to wait so I had a swarm issue today. Next time I'll take the que when I see pollen coming in early Feb in large quantities. Settled about 50 ft so I quickly hived them and I have a couple of Q's: 1. Does the new hive need to be relocated at some distance from the old hive or have they already "forgotten" about their old home? 2. The local bee supply store is closed until Tues. I did manage to find 1 frame of foundation and 1 frame of drawn. Will this be sufficient until I can get more on Tues. If not, can I misappropriate some from the old hive or is it chemically "marked"? -- Geo Honey is sweet, but the bee stings. gstyLer@worldnet.att.net Get the "L" out to reply via e-mail! Article 11266 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!164.67.42.145!awabi.library.ucla.edu!132.239.1.220!ihnp4.ucsd.edu!news1.ucsd.edu!not-for-mail From: Bruce Ritchings Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: beekeeping journals Date: Sun, 01 Mar 1998 13:55:31 +0000 Organization: UCSD Lines: 10 Message-ID: <34F968D4.9410AF6@ucsd.edu> Reply-To: britchings@ucsd.edu NNTP-Posting-Host: cmm171-43.ucsd.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11266 Hello Bees, A friend of mine who's a monk asked me to try to find the name and address of any journals in the USA pertaining to beekeeping. Well, I've found a few names, but no addresses or phone numbers which would allow him to subscribe. I was thinking the "American Bee Journal" might be most appropriate, but I can't find their address/phone/fax, etc. Can anyone please help? Perhaps there are other equally appropriate journals? Unfortunately, my friend doesn't have access to the internet (monks aren't supposed to be spending their time wandering in cyberspace, I guess) so he needs a printed journal. Thanks in advance, Bruce Ritchings, Howard Hughes Medical Institute, UC San Diego, britchings@ucsd.edu Article 11267 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.direct.ca!Supernews60!supernews.com!Supernews69!not-for-mail From: Barry Birkey Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: beekeeping journals Date: Sun, 01 Mar 1998 19:43:54 +0100 Organization: BIRKEY.COM Lines: 20 Message-ID: <34F9AC63.30F0@Birkey.com> References: <34F968D4.9410AF6@ucsd.edu> Reply-To: Barry@Birkey.com NNTP-Posting-Host: 27400@206.68.164.45 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) To: britchings@ucsd.edu Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11267 Bruce Ritchings wrote: > > Hello Bees, > A friend of mine who's a monk asked me to try to find the name and address of > any journals in the USA pertaining to beekeeping. Well, I've found a few > names, but no addresses or phone numbers which would allow him to subscribe. I > was thinking the "American Bee Journal" might be most appropriate, but I can't > find their address/phone/fax, etc. Can anyone please help? Perhaps there are > other equally appropriate journals? Unfortunately, my friend doesn't have > access to the internet (monks aren't supposed to be spending their time > wandering in cyberspace, I guess) so he needs a printed journal. Thanks in > advance, Bruce Ritchings, Howard Hughes Medical Institute, UC San Diego, britchings@ucsd.edu http://www.birkey.com/BLB/Beekeeping/bejrnls.html -- Barry Birkey West Chicago, Illinois USA Barry@Birkey.com http://www.birkey.com Article 11268 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!logbridge.uoregon.edu!news1.mpcs.com!anon.lcs.mit.edu!nym.alias.net!mail2news Date: Sun, 1 Mar 1998 10:55:11 -0800 Message-ID: <199803011855.KAA00630@ix.netcom.com> From: Anonymous Comments: Please report problems with this automated remailing service to . The message sender's identity is unknown, unlogged, and not replyable. Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Varroa Detection in Field Bees References: <34F5B948.613BB192@mines.edu> Mail-To-News-Contact: postmaster@nym.alias.net Organization: mail2news@nym.alias.net Lines: 53 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11268 I think it would probably be possible to detect Varroa presence by sampling field bees, although whether anyone has been able to work out some sort of linear relation between the rate of field bee parasitization and total number of Varroa in the hive is an open question. Might make a good research project or subject for a doctoral dissertation. When the bees are in the hive, I believe the mites move from bee to bee rather readily, without regard to the age of the bees involved. Quick little buggers too, as anyone who has watched them crawling around on a bee for a while can attest. Even if they didn't change bees from time to time though, a certain percentage of young bees would mature into field bee age with a mite or two on 'em, wouldn't they? So it should definitely be possible to detect Varroa presence by sampling the field bees. I have a similar question about Varroa though, which is how to estimate the mite load on the bees for purposes of deciding whether to treat with Apistan or not. For most commercial beekeepers, I guess this is not an issue, since it is my understanding that they always treat. But I'm just a hobbyist with a few hives, like to be as "organic" as I can, and don't like the added expense of the miticide if it's not strictly necessary. Currently I'm trying some experiments to get a handle on this. But like much in agriculture, it's slow going. Anybody out there already try their own experiments, or have any words of wisdom on this question that they'd like to share? Brian asked: > >I am interested in information about how to detect Varroa mites in field >bees or if these mites just stay on nurse bees in the hive. I know the >location of at least one easily monitored wild hive which has been >apparently very healthy for at least three years in the Golden, Colorado >area and I am interested in attempting to determine if this wild hive >has any natural resistance to Varroa or simply has not been exposed yet. > >I am also interested finding and monitoring some wild hives for natural >varroa resistance. > >The problem is that most tests for varroa all specify to take bees from >brood comb, yet with wild hives it is very difficult to do this. Would >I be wasting my time to collect and monitor field bees leaving or >returning from the entrance of this and similar hives? How many bees >would be necessary to reasonably be expected to detect mites if any are >present? > > >Brian Allen >ballen@mines.edu > Article 11269 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: From: "Midnite" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <34f9cade.2217633@news.mindspring.com> <34f934db.0@mercury.nildram.co.uk> Subject: Re: "Bees at the Bottom of the Garden" Date: Sun, 1 Mar 1998 22:18:53 -0500 Lines: 25 X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 NNTP-Posting-Host: 208.232.50.226 X-NNTP-Posting-Host: 208.232.50.226 Message-ID: <34fa24e4.0@newsfeed1.cybertours.com> Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!144.212.95.13.MISMATCH!nntprelay.mathworks.com!news-peer.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!208.136.69.33!newsfeed1.cybertours.com!208.232.50.226 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11269 Greetings! Have you tried www.amazon.com? This site will let you find an author or book title. You may purchase the book at their site,if they can locate it. Herb(Midnitebee) -- Holly-B Apiary P.O. Box 26 Wells,Maine 04090-0026 www.cybertours.com/~midnitebee Kidney John wrote in message <34f934db.0@mercury.nildram.co.uk>... > >Looking for a copy of the book "Bees at the Bottom of the Garden", by Alan >Campion. Can anybody help? >thanks, >Kidney John >gnimmelf@nildramnilspam.co.uk Remove to reply. >"We are all in the gutter, But some of us are looking at the Stars" > > > > Article 11270 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: From: "Midnite" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <34f9cade.2217633@news.mindspring.com> Subject: Re: Beekeeping organizations in southeastern TN ??? Date: Sun, 1 Mar 1998 22:16:25 -0500 Lines: 20 X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 NNTP-Posting-Host: 208.232.50.226 X-NNTP-Posting-Host: 208.232.50.226 Message-ID: <34fa244f.0@newsfeed1.cybertours.com> Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!144.212.95.13.MISMATCH!nntprelay.mathworks.com!news-peer.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!208.136.69.33!newsfeed1.cybertours.com!208.232.50.226 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11270 Greetings! There is an extensive list of beekeeping assoc. worldwide at my web site:go to beelinks page. Herb(Midnitebee) -- Holly-B Apiary P.O. Box 26 Wells,Maine 04090-0026 www.cybertours.com/~midnitebee Todd Jackson wrote in message <34f9cade.2217633@news.mindspring.com>... >Does anyone know of a beekeeping organization in southeast TN? As in >the Chattanooga area. I would like to learn how to beekeep and would >like to find a place where I could learn. > >Thanks > >Todd Article 11271 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!206.172.150.11!news1.bellglobal.com!news.agtac.net!news.telusplanet.net!news From: Robert Boschman Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Looking for boxes and comb Date: Mon, 02 Mar 1998 09:45:53 -0700 Organization: TELUS Communications Inc. Lines: 8 Message-ID: <34FAE241.540E@telusplanet.net> Reply-To: boschman@telusplanet.net NNTP-Posting-Host: clgrtnt2-port-97.agt.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U) Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11271 I am a Saskatchewan-based beekeeper looking for 200 to 1000 boxes as well as drawn comb. Any information or equipement you know of for sale would be of great interest to my company--doesn't matter how far away you are. Rob Boschman boschman@telusplanet.net (403) 236-7457 Article 11272 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!144.212.95.13.MISMATCH!nntprelay.mathworks.com!newsfeed.direct.ca!Supernews60!supernews.com!Supernews69!not-for-mail From: tomas mozer Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Varroa Detection in Field Bees Date: Mon, 02 Mar 1998 05:56:53 -0800 Organization: All USENET -- http://www.Supernews.com Lines: 8 Message-ID: <34FABAA5.3106@juno.com> References: <34F5B948.613BB192@mines.edu> <199803011855.KAA00630@ix.netcom.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 15003@205.216.79.228 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E-BSNET (Win16; U) Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11272 as a gross rule of thumb, i use around 10% mite infestation rate (10 mites per 100 bees sampled) on an (admittedly unreliable but relatively easy-to-do) ether roll of bees from brood comb as a treatment threshold...i would guess half that rate for foraging bees, and double for uncapping brood (esp. drone) would be approximately equivalent; this is based more on subjective experience under florida conditions than any hard data, even though some research has been done (see delaplane's "strictly for the hobbyist" column in the aug.'97 abj) but regional/seasonal/genetic/virulent and other seemingly unlimited variability in hive conditions always can muddle any guesstimates... Article 11273 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: From: walter.bienz@amigabee.org.uk (Walter Bienz) Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!rill.news.pipex.net!pipex!join.news.pipex.net!pipex!news.pcug.co.uk!amigabee!walter.bienz Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: cake & eating it too part ll Message-ID: <888844992@amigabee.org.uk> Date: Mon, 02 Mar 1998 09:44:08 GMT Distribution: world Organization: Amigabee computer networking for beekeepers CHRS: IBMPC 2 CODEPAGE: 437 MSGID: 240:244/117 2d488e97 REPLY: 240:44/0 36115a70 PID: FDAPX/w 1.12a UnReg(79) M> From: "Midnite" M> Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping M> Subject: cake & eating it too part ll M> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 15:48:08 -0500 M> Lines: 18 M> X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: M> Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 NNTP-Posting-Host: M> 208.232.50.231 M> X-NNTP-Posting-Host: 208.232.50.231 M> Message-ID: <34e9f74f.0@newsfeed1.cybertours.com> M> Path: M> ibmpcug!news.pcug.co.uk!bowl.news.pipex.net!pipex!weld.news.pi M> pex.net!pipex!hose.news.pipex.net!pipex!grot.news.pipex.net!pi M> pex!bore.news.pipex.net!pipex!rill.news.pipex.net!pipex!cpk-ne M> ws-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci. M> com!208.136.69.33!newsfeed1.cybertours.com!208.232.50.231 Lines: 20 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11273 M> Greetings! M> I have added another "page" authored by George Imirie. This is M> a continuation on the January issue of the "Pink Pages".. this M> new topic "speaks" about the PROPER ratio of sugar M> syrup,splitting,why order queens,swarming, M> reversing,etc etc M> The article is entitled "Cake & Eating it Too", located at the M> beelinks page. M> Enjoy! M> -- M> Holly-B Apiary M> P.O. Box 26 M> Wells,Maine 04090-0026 M> www.cybertours.com/~midnitebee --- * Origin: Kent Beekeeper Beenet Point (240:244/117) Article 11274 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!dca1-hub1.news.digex.net!digex!newsreader.digex.net!not-for-mail From: bobe_inv@digex.net Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Honey Production Figures Date: Mon, 02 Mar 1998 21:07:23 GMT Organization: DIGEX, Inc. Lines: 11 Message-ID: <34fb1f64.17243317@news.digex.net> References: <01bd4364$13526740$0261afce@default> NNTP-Posting-Host: gate.usitc.gov X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.11/32.235 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11274 On 27 Feb 1998 09:43:53 GMT, "Ernest Scofield" wrote: >Does anyone know of a source for average honey production >state by state on the web or in print form? >-- >E.L.Scofield >Virginia Beach Honey Company You might try the following web site: http://mann77.mannlib.cornell.edu/reports/nassr/other/zho-bb/ Article 11275 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!207.69.200.121!news.mindspring.com!usenet From: ktjackson@mindspring.com (Todd Jackson) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Beekeeping organizations in southeastern TN ??? Date: Mon, 02 Mar 1998 21:23:35 GMT Organization: MindSpring Enterprises Lines: 13 Message-ID: <34fb2331.905402@news.mindspring.com> References: <34f9cade.2217633@news.mindspring.com> <34fa244f.0@newsfeed1.cybertours.com> Reply-To: ktjackson@mindspring.com NNTP-Posting-Host: user-38lcnio.dialup.mindspring.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Server-Date: 2 Mar 1998 21:24:48 GMT X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11275 "Midnite" wrote: >Greetings! >There is an extensive list of beekeeping assoc. worldwide at my web site:go >to beelinks page. >Herb(Midnitebee) Nothing there near me. Thanks anyway, you have got a good web page. Todd Article 11276 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!news-peer-east.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!Sprint!worldnet.att.net!newsadm From: "Gary L. Bradshaw" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: WHere to get bees? Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 17:25:47 -0500 Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services Lines: 23 Message-ID: <6dfbm6$356@bgtnsc02.worldnet.att.net> References: <34FAEE16.5A77D73B@polisci.tamu.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.68.157.57 X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11276 eaguilr wrote in message <34FAEE16.5A77D73B@polisci.tamu.edu>... >Folks, >I waited way way way too long to order a set of "startup bees". Any >ideas who I could contact to get somet his late in the season? >edwin > > Hi Ed It depends on where you live. We truck bees up the east coast into NJ and eastern PA and will make stops along I95 from NC and north with prior commitment from beekeepers. You can contact us at gbees@worldnet.att.net or 908 996 6331 If you don't live in this part of the world you can order them direct from York Bee Co (912 427 7311) or possibly contact your local extension service. Good Luck Gary Article 11277 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!rutgers!usenet.logical.net!news.dal.ca!sunqbc.risq.qc.ca!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news-backup-west.sprintlink.net!news-in-west.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!Sprint!131.216.1.86!news.nevada.edu!news.tamu.edu!not-for-mail From: eaguilr Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: WHere to get bees? Date: Mon, 02 Mar 1998 11:36:22 -0600 Organization: Texas A&M University, College Station, Texas Lines: 6 Message-ID: <34FAEE16.5A77D73B@polisci.tamu.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: cc129.tamu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit NNTP-Posting-Date: 2 Mar 1998 17:36:48 GMT X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11277 Folks, I waited way way way too long to order a set of "startup bees". Any ideas who I could contact to get somet his late in the season? edwin Article 11278 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!210.120.128.205!brown.dacom.co.kr!nntp.kreonet.re.kr!news.netins.net!not-for-mail From: "Rev Jim" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Africanized???? Date: 3 Mar 1998 00:29:03 GMT Organization: news.netins.net Lines: 5 Message-ID: <01bd463c$aff82820$360cb1cf@jim.smallwww.mebbs.com.www.mebbs.com> References: <34F4AD28.4DEF@swbell.net> Reply-To: "Rev Jim" NNTP-Posting-Host: ins8.netins.net X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155 Cache-Post-Path: ins8.netins.net!unknown@207.177.12.54 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11278 I am one whom bees do not like also. Without aftershave or hair tonic once in a while they will come after me, usually in the hair, upper face. Never have figured it out but I raise only 3-banded Italian with a brief unsuccessful attempt at Midnites. So I take the chance of getting stung. Article 11279 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!144.212.95.13.MISMATCH!nntprelay.mathworks.com!newsfeed.direct.ca!newsfeed.dacom.co.kr!brown.dacom.co.kr!nntp.kreonet.re.kr!news.netins.net!not-for-mail From: "Rev Jim" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Bees and vandals (formerly bees and horses) Date: 3 Mar 1998 00:34:19 GMT Organization: news.netins.net Lines: 7 Message-ID: <01bd463d$6c473fc0$360cb1cf@jim.smallwww.mebbs.com.www.mebbs.com> References: Reply-To: "Rev Jim" NNTP-Posting-Host: ins8.netins.net X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1155 Cache-Post-Path: ins8.netins.net!unknown@207.177.12.54 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11279 My experience with vandalism is slight but primarily if a kid tips over the hive and gets nailed the parents threaten a lawsuit. If a hunter tips over a hive and gets nailed, he threatens a lawsuit. When some kids pushed sticks into the hive and got stung (once) the parents threatened a lawsuit. See a pattern? Luckily nothing ever came of it but I did threaten to countersue for vandalism. Article 11280 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!boston-news-feed1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!news.bu.edu!dartvax.dartmouth.edu!not-for-mail From: bill greenrose Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Varroa Detection in Field Bees Date: Mon, 02 Mar 1998 20:54:41 -0500 Organization: Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH, USA Lines: 72 Message-ID: <34FB62E0.609467EB@valley.net> References: <34F5B948.613BB192@mines.edu> <199803011855.KAA00630@ix.netcom.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: v2-p-140.valley.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en] (Win95; I) Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11280 Anonymous wrote: > > I have a similar question about Varroa though, which is how to estimate the > mite load on the bees for purposes of deciding whether to treat with Apistan > or not. For > most commercial beekeepers, I guess this is not an issue, since it is my > understanding that they always treat. But I'm just a hobbyist with a few > hives, like to be as "organic" as I can, and don't like the added expense of > the miticide if it's not strictly necessary. > > Currently I'm trying some experiments to get a handle on this. But like much > in agriculture, it's slow going. Anybody out there already try their own > experiments, or have any words of wisdom on this question that they'd like to > share? > > Brian asked: > greetings, i've not checked this group regularly for most of the winter, but the recent warm weather up here in new hampshire made me realize that the new season is right around the corner and that i should catch up with what's going on in the rest of the bee world. i'm just a hobbyist, too, and coming off of my first season, but i thought i'd comment for what it's worth. last season i treated with mineral oil following dr. rodriguez' program. basically a thin bead of oil on the top of each frame once a week or so. i did not use any scientific methods of measurement, just careful weekly observation [all recorded in my logbook], but i did not see any signs of mite infestation. the bees all looked healthy, no deformations, no little 'hitchhikers', lots of brood, no signs of the runs or other indications of secondary infections. so, i THINK it worked well. however, even though the good doctor says that you can treat solely with m.o., i also used apistan strips in the fall [and will use them this spring]. like you, i prefer to minimize the use of drugs and chemicals on my bees, but in the case of varroa, i don't feel that there's much choice in the matter. i started beekeeping, because i was getting lousy pollination of my blackberry and raspberry bushes. [all right, i also had a lifelong fascination with bees. but, it's as good an excuse as any.] then, i realized that there were NO honeybees around. a little research on the net revealed the probable cause of the problem. joining the local beekeeping association and going to a few meetings confirmed that varroa is a problem in this area. so, i would rather be safe than sorry. it may seem like overkill, but i like the idea of hitting 'em with both a physical and a chemical control. hopefully, it will help reduce the chance of miticide resistant varroa developing in my area. with this warm [mid 40's] weather the past several days, i've seen nice clouds of bees coming out to do their 'elimination' runs in the early afternoon. looks like they are in good health. whether it's from the treatments or just blind luck, i don't know. after a couple of seasons worth of data points, maybe i'll be able to tell. anyway, my recommendation is that, regardless of whatever alternative treatment plan you use, unless you can positively, absolutely confirm that you've got varroa under control, you should also use apistan strips. they may cost a few bucks, but it's cheaper than replacing lost colonies. hope this helps, bill ########################################## don't shoot me, i'm only the guitar player bill.greenrose@valley.net [home] greenros@medicalmedia.com [work] http://www.geocities.com/Athens/1397 Article 11281 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!144.212.95.13.MISMATCH!nntprelay.mathworks.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!199.0.154.56!ais.net!ix.netcom.com!news From: "Susan K. Wehe" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: WHere to get bees? Date: Mon, 02 Mar 1998 21:53:08 -0600 Organization: Netcom Lines: 13 Message-ID: <34FB7EA4.6B70@ix.netcom.com> References: <34FAEE16.5A77D73B@polisci.tamu.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: san-tx6-03.ix.netcom.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Mar 02 9:47:16 PM CST 1998 X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11281 eaguilr wrote: > > Folks, > I waited way way way too long to order a set of "startup bees". Any > ideas who I could contact to get somet his late in the season? > edwin If you're ordering them for the College Station area then you might want to try: http://www.ipt.com/bweaver/rebweaver.htm Good Luck! susan Article 11282 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!rutgers!news.sgi.com!nntprelay.mathworks.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!207.0.56.122!news.eli.net!not-for-path-mail From: "Rimmmer" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: 14k gold & diamond Bee Ring Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 21:19:55 -0800 Organization: ELI.NET Usenet Newsreader Service Lines: 23 Message-ID: <6dg3ob$3cj$1@bigdog.eli.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: linq1-32.citylinq.net X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11282 I own a custom jewelry business in Bellevue Washington. Last Christmas I worked with a man on designing a special ring for his wife. The ring features a 14k Bee, pave set with diamonds all over his back, emerald cabochon eyes, pollen sacs on his legs and, a small daisy on either side of the ring with a diamond in the center. The woman who carved the wax, graduated as a zoologist and spent over 15 hours adding realistic features, while maintaining some character (he's cute!). Unfortunately, my client and his wife split the sheets and ended up not taking the ring. So after substantial investment on my part, naturally I would like to find a home for the little guy and recoup my investment. Since it is a one off custom piece that required significant amounts of labor in design and setting, he isn't cheap but he is first class all the way. If anyone is interested in seeing a photo or arranging a viewing, please email me at TheJConn@aol.com You may also reach me at 1-800-594-2950. Marlon Familton The Jewelry Connection Bellevue, Washington Article 11283 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!rutgers!news.sgi.com!nntprelay.mathworks.com!news-xfer.netaxs.com!xfer.kren.nm.kr!newsfeed.dacom.co.kr!chollian!KKPCR7 From: KKPCR7@chollian.dacom.co.kr (Chollian Newsgroup User) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Bees and vandals (formerly bees and horses) Date: 3 Mar 1998 08:36:35 GMT Organization: DACOM Internet Service Lines: 14 Message-ID: <6dgfej$45e$1@newstmp1.bora.net> References: <01bd463d$6c473fc0$360cb1cf@jim.smallwww.mebbs.com.www.mebbs.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: magicall2.dacom.co.kr X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11283 x Rev Jim (jim.small@www.mebbs.com) wrote: : My experience with vandalism is slight but primarily if a kid tips over the : hive and gets nailed the parents threaten a lawsuit. If a hunter tips over : a hive and gets nailed, he threatens a lawsuit. When some kids pushed : sticks into the hive and got stung (once) the parents threatened a lawsuit. : See a pattern? Luckily nothing ever came of it but I did threaten to : countersue for vandalism. Article 11284 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: From: "ayres" Subject: Re: Bee sting alergies Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping,alt.folklore.urban References: <34B3C27C.6772@fareway.on.ca> <696evb$e92@pyrtech.mis.pyramid.com> <34b7a3a0.0@scooby.nildram.co.uk> <01bd1e01$a9a7f800$240cb1cf@jim.smallwww.mebbs.com.www.mebbs.com> <699om0$c7d$1@news.goodnet.com> <69irb8$71u$1@news.jumpnet.com> <69itc1$9l5$1@ezekiel.eunet.ie> Message-ID: <01bd4327$dc93c820$97c19bd0@8> X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1162 NNTP-Posting-Host: 208.155.193.151 Date: 27 Feb 98 01:32:51 GMT Lines: 46 Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!209.89.75.15!News.Toronto.iSTAR.net!news.istar.net!tor-nx1.netcom.ca!209.136.2.9!pull-feed.internetmci.com!news.northlink.net!208.155.193.151 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11284 alt.folklore.urban:401464 Ben Walsh wrote in article <69itc1$9l5$1@ezekiel.eunet.ie>... > Quita Endicott wrote: > > > > ># My grandfather was a beekeeper and his children are all very sensitive to > > >#stings. > > > > > >Uh oh. I see some Lamarckian theories of evolution in that last statement. > > > > > What is Lamarckian about that - he doesn't imply that they CHOSE to become > > sensitive > > I don't know what definition of Lamarckism you're using, but it's not a > good one. The theory of Lamarckism was a precursor to that of natural > selection, and postulated evolution through inheritance of *acquired* > characteristics. > > > - all that is implied here as that the children are all > > sensitive > > No, that's what's stated explicitly. The *implication*, through the > juxtaposition of the two statements, is that the children's sensitivity > is due in some way to the grandfather's occupation. That is Lamarckian, > and therefore wrong. > > - perhaps the mother of said children passed on hypersensitivity > > genes to the kids. > > Indeed. > > ben "I was stung by a bee yesterday - £20 for a jar of honey" w. > > -- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > "If you name me a street | ben walsh > Then I'll name you a bar | benw at iona dot com > And I'll walk right through Hell | http://bounce.to/heretic > Just to buy you a jar" -- shane | > > Maybe the hypersensitivity is due to environment , > not heredity, as in exposure to dried venom on clothing Article 11285 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!netnews.com!dca1-hub1.news.digex.net!digex!newsgate.swbell.net!swbell!not-for-mail From: Jim Owen Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Africanized? or just Irate? Date: Tue, 03 Mar 1998 06:58:15 -0800 Organization: Southwestern Bell Internet Services, Richardson, TX Lines: 23 Message-ID: <34FC1A87.4AD0@swbell.net> References: <34F4AD28.4DEF@swbell.net> <01bd463c$aff82820$360cb1cf@jim.smallwww.mebbs.com.www.mebbs.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp-151-164-37-184.rcsntx.swbell.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: (null) 888929908 2366 (None) 151.164.37.184 X-Complaints-To: usenet@nnrp3 X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01KIT (Win95; U; 16bit) Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11285 Rev Jim wrote: > > I am one whom bees do not like also. Without aftershave or hair tonic once > in a while they will come after me, usually in the hair, upper face. Never > have figured it out but I raise only 3-banded Italian with a brief > unsuccessful attempt at Midnites. So I take the chance of getting stung. I had a few hives in Utah (1997) and I could basically work them in street clothes. Unless I was digging into the hive extensively, they didn't really care. In the colonies I now have, individuals will go out of their way to hunt me down anywhere in the yard (up to about 100'), and I don't dare go anywhere near the hives (10-20') without full suit. I'm in the process of building a new fence and relocating the hives to their own fenced area. During that process, I closed off the entrances to only about 1/4" wide. The bees could still get out if they wanted bad enough, but they seemed to change their attitude and didn't stray far from the hives (at least not in my direction). I thought maybe they had adjusted their attitude, but when I opened up the entrance yesterday (full suit) they got back in their bad mood. Oh well, the fence project should be done by this weekend, and I can keep them under control until the new queens (Caucasian) arrive. Article 11286 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!rutgers!usenet.logical.net!nntprelay.mathworks.com!portc04.blue.aol.com!audrey02.news.aol.com!not-for-mail From: silversail@aol.com (Silversail) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: beekeeping journals Date: 3 Mar 1998 17:19:32 GMT Lines: 5 Message-ID: <19980303171900.MAA19869@ladder02.news.aol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder02.news.aol.com X-Admin: news@aol.com Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com References: <34F9AC63.30F0@Birkey.com> Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11286 American Bee Journal is a Dandant product... Try Dadant.com should take you to their website. 903-784-6145 will get you in touch with someone who can take or direct you to someone who can take your order. Silver Article 11287 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!rutgers!usenet.logical.net!nntprelay.mathworks.com!portc04.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail From: silversail@aol.com (Silversail) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Hive question Date: 3 Mar 1998 17:22:26 GMT Lines: 4 Message-ID: <19980303172200.MAA24933@ladder03.news.aol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder03.news.aol.com X-Admin: news@aol.com Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com References: <6dc5ot$hui$1@usenet54.supernews.com> Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11287 Sure cedar's great to use...might even keep the wax moths away;) Just about any wood will do ...the main focus of larger beekeepers is the COST. Silver Article 11288 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!news-xfer.netaxs.com!news-peer.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!Sprint!newsfeed.internetmci.com!198.82.160.249!news.vt.edu!solaris.cc.vt.edu!vtaix.cc.vt.edu!adamf From: adamf@vtaix.cc.vt.edu (Adam Finkelstein) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Varroa Detection in Field Bees Date: 3 Mar 1998 19:33:54 GMT Organization: Virginia Tech Lines: 38 Message-ID: <6dhlv2$2vc$1@solaris.cc.vt.edu> References: <34F5B948.613BB192@mines.edu> <199803011855.KAA00630@ix.netcom.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: vtaix.cc.vt.edu Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11288 Anonymous postings are sort of taboo. If you have to post anonymously, well do what you have to do, but if a trend toward anonymous posting develops here, we'll have to change the charter to exclude anonymous postings-- nothing wrong with your post, it's just anonymous postings can and often are used for less than wholesome purposes. A Varroa level index is hard to develop. "Economic injury level" is the term, I think. But, since all our bees develop at different rates and interact with the new parasite differently, a single broad "mite number" or "mite count" isn't possible. The nicest way I've seen to check for mites in the Spring, when there is capped drone brood is to use a cappings scratcher on some of the drone brood. Pry up some cells with the scratcher a few times on different combs--if you see mites at any stage, you have an infestation you probably should treat for after the honey season. Another beekeeper's suggestion of definite yearly treatment with Apistan is probably the safest practise--remember to treat when there is no danger of super contamination, and remember to remove the strips after the time recommended. Fluvalinate (Apistan's active ingredient) will begin to taint comb wax after awhile, so keep a handle on which combs were treated, maybe rotating out old comb after a few years (not a bad practice to do anyway if you have the time and energy). The relationship Varroa has no with our bees, is very unique and dynamic. The bees are under pressure, as are the mites, to live long enough to reproduce. We're in the middle of a fascinating biological story--the end of which nobody can see, so as you buy Apistan, use other mite treatments, and clean out dead hives, remember that you've been keeping bees in exciting times! Adam -- Adam Finkelstein adamf@vt.edu http://sunsite.unc.edu/bees/adamf Article 11289 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!207.103.147.20!news.voicenet.com!nntp.upenn.edu!dolphin.upenn.edu!djt From: djt@dolphin.upenn.edu (David J Trickett) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: First swarm of the year Date: 3 Mar 1998 22:18:12 GMT Organization: University of Pennsylvania Lines: 18 Message-ID: <6dhvj4$vng$1@netnews.upenn.edu> References: <6dcij3$gur@bgtnsc02.worldnet.att.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: dolphin.upenn.edu X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2-upenn1.3] Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11289 George, It's already Tuesday, but I'll give you my 2 cents worth anyway. As for location, they should be fine. I've never found this to be a problem, particularly if we're having intermittently warm weather in the early SPring. As for foundation. You may find yourself amazed at how quickly and how much comb they will build... If you can get new foundation and frames on the hive immediately, then do so. In a pinch, you can divide a single sheet of foundation into three pieces and put those into three separate frames. Be sure that they are attached to the top (topbar) of the frames, rather than the bottoms - since they will build down... When doing this, don't have any wire reinforcements running along the frames except for where the foundation extends... I presume these will be for brood anyway, so the reinforcement is not really necessary... They will draw out the existing foundation and *hopefully* continue to build down within the frame. They may also of course just end up putting in cross comb, but I've had pretty good luck doing just as I've described when I was low on foundation. Dave T. Article 11290 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: From: peter.hutton@amigabee.org.uk (Peter Hutton) Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!logbridge.uoregon.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!rill.news.pipex.net!pipex!join.news.pipex.net!pipex!news.pcug.co.uk!amigabee!peter.hutton Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Hive question Message-ID: <888962448@amigabee.org.uk> Date: Mon, 02 Mar 1998 04:15:54 GMT Distribution: world Organization: Amigabee computer networking for beekeepers CHRS: IBMPC 2 CODEPAGE: 437 MSGID: 240:244/116 2d43bfa9 REPLY: 240:44/0 985b7cc2 PID: FDAPX/w 1.12a UnReg(226) Lines: 17 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11290 Sure, western red cedar (Thuja plicata) is used in the UK for hive making as it is naturally rot resistant and light weight as well. It machines well and is often clear of knots. If you are comb slotting the joints you must have a harder backing board to prevent spelching otherwise the cutters tend to tear out the back of the joint. Woodpeckers make quick work through the hand holds but they do that even in ply. A friend of mine uses Wellingtonia, (Sequoia dendron) for his hives again because of the wide boards and freedom from knots but these area lot heavier. Most important thing when making hives is that you get the beespace right and that the frames fit snugly. I make all my own hives, frames. foundation etc. Poor old dealers never see me these days. Best wishes from the Garden of England Peter Hutton --- * Origin: Kent Beekeeper Beenet Point (240:244/116) Article 11291 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!rutgers!news.sgi.com!news.iag.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.internetmci.com!24.128.1.125!chnws03.mediaone.net!24.128.1.107!chnws04.ne.mediaone.net!not-for-mail From: Kathy Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Varroa Detection in Field Bees Date: Tue, 03 Mar 1998 18:33:36 -0500 Organization: Red Maple Farm Lines: 115 Message-ID: <34FC9350.448150A7@ne.mediaone.net> References: <34F5B948.613BB192@mines.edu> <199803011855.KAA00630@ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: beesbest@ne.mediaone.net NNTP-Posting-Host: beesbest.ne.mediaone.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en]C-MOENE (Win95; U) To: Brian@ne.mediaone.net X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11291 Anonymous wrote: > I think it would probably be possible to detect Varroa presence by > sampling > field bees, although whether anyone has been able to work out some > sort of > linear relation between the rate of field bee parasitization and total > number > of Varroa in the hive is an open question. Might make a good research > project > or subject for a doctoral dissertation. I don't think it would be likely to detect varroa presence by sampling field bees. Two reasons, one is that field bees are older bees and there has been some recent research that indicates that the "mite resistance" that some breeders are finding has to do with the varroa and the trachael mites being able to sense the age of the bee and hitching a ride on (varroa) or entering the trachea of (trachael) *young* bees. Think about it.. would survival of varroa mites be better served by feeding on young nurse bees in the brood nest, then dropping into the cells to breed during the pupal stage of other bees? Or would the survival of the varroa be better served by hitchhiking a ride on any age bee and face the possibility of foraging with her, falling off, and never reproducing? The second reason is that it would be a PIA to sample bees loosely scattered in the field instead of concentrated in the hive. And, if one assumes that counting varroa on field bees was a reasonable way to assess infestation, then if you did find a varroa mite on a foraging bee, how would you know which colony to treat? However, I think the answer would be *all of them--now!* 'cuz i suspect that if you found a varroa mite on a field bee, it would probably be a really bad sign > When the bees are in the hive, I believe the mites move from bee to > bee rather > readily, without regard to the age of the bees involved. Quick little > buggers > too, as anyone who has watched them crawling around on a bee for a > while can > attest. Even if they didn't change bees from time to time though, a > certain > percentage of young bees would mature into field bee age with a mite > or two on > 'em, wouldn't they? So it should definitely be possible to detect > Varroa > presence by sampling the field bees. I don't think so. By the time a honeybee has matured to the point that she is a forager (14-20 days in the summer) the varroa have already had their blood meal and are in the soon to be capped cells laying their eggs. Pay attention to your colonies this summer when the honey supers are on, notice how many varroa aren't on the bees working the supers (especially if you have an upper hive entrance), or better yet--crouch next to your landing board and watch the bees landing on the bottom board, bet you see no varroa on them. > I have a similar question about Varroa though, which is how to > estimate the > mite load on the bees for purposes of deciding whether to treat with > Apistan > or not. For most commercial beekeepers, I guess this is not an issue, > since it is my > understanding that they always treat. But I'm just a hobbyist with a > few > hives, like to be as "organic" as I can, and don't like the added > expense of > the miticide if it's not strictly necessary. Read the publications... IBRA (International Beekeeping Research Association), whose web site is at http://www.cardiff.ac.uk/ibra/ has a marvelous publication on varroa mites. The publications indicate that for each type of mite, at different times of year and in different climates, there are different threshholds for treatment. Two extreme examples for MA, USA, if in September i found no more than two mites per colony in a bee yard (in ~50 scratched brood; 100 young adults in an ether roll; AND on the bottom board) I wouldn't treat any of the colonies in that yard. If, however, i found the same in April.. I'd definitely treat. > Currently I'm trying some experiments to get a handle on this. But > like much > in agriculture, it's slow going. Anybody out there already try their > own > experiments, or have any words of wisdom on this question that they'd > like to > share? FWIW, there it is... Kathy (who wishes there was an old, wild, possibly resistant colony near here also) P.S. Brian, sorry I missed your original post, i think that if you really want to test that colony's varroa resistance, try following some of the methods of colony trapping published in the recent years in the bee mags, or try a search through deja news. Once you get them onto moveable frames, you ought to be able to test them. I'd love to know what you find. > Brian asked: > > >I am interested in information about how to detect Varroa mites in > field > >bees or if these mites just stay on nurse bees in the hive. I know > the > >location of at least one easily monitored wild hive which has been > >apparently very healthy for at least three years in the Golden, > Colorado > >area and I am interested in attempting to determine if this wild hive > > >has any natural resistance to Varroa or simply has not been exposed > yet. > > Article 11292 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: From: "Durk Ellison" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Apitherapy Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 13:32:52 +0200 Organization: Scifi Communications International, http://www.sci.fi/, helpdesk@sci.fi, +358 3 2899111 Lines: 16 Message-ID: <6dgpoo$mhb$2@tron.sci.fi> NNTP-Posting-Host: dclxxvii.hdyn.sci.fi X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!nntp-xfer.ncsu.edu!gatech!205.252.116.205.MISMATCH!howland.erols.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!Sprint!newsfeed.nacamar.de!news-hh.maz.net!news-feed.dus.tfi.de!news-feed.sto.telegate.se!nntp.inet.fi!news.sci.fi!not-for-mail Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11292 For those of you that are interested " The Apitherapy Reference Data Base" WEB page is now available at http://www.sci.fi/~apither/ -- -- Regards from: Durk Ellison Vantaa, Finland BeeNet : 240:346/300.8 e-mail : Durk.Ellison@beenet.pp.sci.fi Packet : oh2zas @ oh2rbt.#hki.fin.eu Article 11293 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!206.20.110.210!fresh!anon.lcs.mit.edu!nym.alias.net!mail2news Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 08:47:49 -0800 Message-ID: <199803031647.IAA00594@ix.netcom.com> From: Anonymous Comments: Please report problems with this automated remailing service to . The message sender's identity is unknown, unlogged, and not replyable. Subject: Re: Varroa Detection in Field Bees Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <34FC9350.448150A7@ne.mediaone.net> Mail-To-News-Contact: postmaster@nym.alias.net Organization: mail2news@nym.alias.net Lines: 184 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11293 Kathy replied to my question: > >Anonymous wrote: > >> I think it would probably be possible to detect Varroa presence by >> sampling >> field bees, although whether anyone has been able to work out some >> sort of >> linear relation between the rate of field bee parasitization and total >> number >> of Varroa in the hive is an open question. Might make a good research >> project >> or subject for a doctoral dissertation. > >I don't think it would be likely to detect varroa presence by sampling >field bees. Two reasons, one is that field bees are older bees and there >has been some recent research that indicates that the "mite resistance" >that some breeders are finding has to do with the varroa and the >trachael mites being able to sense the age of the bee and hitching a >ride on (varroa) or entering the trachea of (trachael) *young* bees. If mites are able to do this, and never infest older bees, either leaving them for a younger bee or a pupa, that would be very significant, you're right. But if that's been conclusively established, it's news to me. However, I recall finding mites on bees that have ridden in on the fabric of my clothes when I've worked with them, and those were very likely field bees that were trying to repel an "invader" -- me, the beekeeper. >Think about it.. would survival of varroa mites be better served by >feeding on young nurse bees in the brood nest, then dropping into the >cells to breed during the pupal stage of other bees? Or would the >survival of the varroa be better served by hitchhiking a ride on any age >bee and face the possibility of foraging with her, falling off, and >never reproducing? True, but I don't think they they fall off very readily. Wish they did though. > >The second reason is that it would be a PIA to sample bees loosely >scattered in the field instead of concentrated in the hive. And, if one >assumes that counting varroa on field bees was a reasonable way to >assess infestation, then if you did find a varroa mite on a foraging >bee, how would you know which colony to treat? The easy way would be to sample by placing a trap at the colony entrance, such that as the bees enter or exit, a certain percentage could be inspected. I think that's what Brian was talking about anyway. >However, I think the >answer would be *all of them--now!* 'cuz i suspect that if you found a >varroa mite on a field bee, it would probably be a really bad sign > >> When the bees are in the hive, I believe the mites move from bee to >> bee rather >> readily, without regard to the age of the bees involved. Quick little >> buggers >> too, as anyone who has watched them crawling around on a bee for a >> while can >> attest. Even if they didn't change bees from time to time though, a >> certain >> percentage of young bees would mature into field bee age with a mite >> or two on >> 'em, wouldn't they? So it should definitely be possible to detect >> Varroa >> presence by sampling the field bees. > >I don't think so. By the time a honeybee has matured to the point that >she is a forager (14-20 days in the summer) the varroa have already had >their blood meal and are in the soon to be capped cells laying their >eggs. Pay attention to your colonies this summer when the honey supers >are on, notice how many varroa aren't on the bees working the supers >(especially if you have an upper hive entrance), or better yet--crouch >next to your landing board and watch the bees landing on the bottom >board, bet you see no varroa on them. > >> I have a similar question about Varroa though, which is how to >> estimate the >> mite load on the bees for purposes of deciding whether to treat with >> Apistan >> or not. For most commercial beekeepers, I guess this is not an issue, >> since it is my >> understanding that they always treat. But I'm just a hobbyist with a >> few >> hives, like to be as "organic" as I can, and don't like the added >> expense of >> the miticide if it's not strictly necessary. > >Read the publications... IBRA (International Beekeeping Research >Association), whose web site is at http://www.cardiff.ac.uk/ibra/ has a >marvelous publication on varroa mites. The publications indicate that >for each type of mite, at different times of year and in different >climates, there are different threshholds for treatment. Two extreme >examples for MA, USA, if in September i found no more than two mites >per colony in a bee yard (in ~50 scratched brood; 100 young adults in an >ether roll; AND on the bottom board) I wouldn't treat any of the >colonies in that yard. If, however, i found the same in April.. I'd >definitely treat. > >> Currently I'm trying some experiments to get a handle on this. But >> like much >> in agriculture, it's slow going. Anybody out there already try their >> own >> experiments, or have any words of wisdom on this question that they'd >> like to >> share? > >FWIW, there it is... Thanks. > >Kathy (who wishes there was an old, wild, possibly resistant colony near >here also) I have one here that is going into its third year. Article 11294 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!rutgers!news.sgi.com!csulb.edu!gatech!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!denver-news-feed1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!csn!nntp-xfer-1.csn.net!herald.Mines.EDU!not-for-mail From: Brian Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Low on foundation: Was - Re: First swarm of the year Date: Tue, 03 Mar 1998 19:56:53 -0700 Organization: Colorado School of Mines Lines: 29 Message-ID: <34FCC2F5.CB10D15@mines.edu> References: <6dcij3$gur@bgtnsc02.worldnet.att.net> <6dhvj4$vng$1@netnews.upenn.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: metsb.mines.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en] (WinNT; I) Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11294 David J Trickett wrote: > > > As for foundation. You may find yourself amazed at how quickly and how much comb they will > build... If you can get new foundation and frames on the hive immediately, then do so. In a > pinch, you can divide a single sheet of foundation into three pieces and put those into three > separate frames. Be sure that they are attached to the top (topbar) of the frames, rather than > the bottoms - since they will build down... When doing this, don't have any wire > reinforcements running along the frames except for where the foundation extends... I presume > these will be for brood anyway, so the reinforcement is not really necessary... They will draw > out the existing foundation and *hopefully* continue to build down within the frame. They may > also of course just end up putting in cross comb, but I've had pretty good luck doing just as > I've described when I was low on foundation. > > Dave T. I've also had pretty fair luck by spacing empty frames amongst fully drawn frames of wax. If the hive is level, the bees will usually do a pretty good job of filling out a frame with straight comb, assuming the combs on either side are straight and even. Not practical for a commercial operation I understand, but as I am a small hobbiest who cannot afford an extractor, I usually end up just cutting the honeycomb out of the frames anyway. Not as much honey as they have to replace all the wax each year, but I still have enough honey and I can use the wax anyway. Brian Allen Article 11295 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: From: "Chip McCurdy" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Packaged Bees Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 23:03:56 -0500 Lines: 24 Organization: Ambrosia Apiaries X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 NNTP-Posting-Host: pm3-1-user-39.cvl.hom.net X-NNTP-Posting-Host: pm3-1-user-39.cvl.hom.net Message-ID: <34fcd413.0@news1.mid-ga.com> Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news.oru.edu!nntp.mid-ga.com!news1.mid-ga.com!pm3-1-user-39.cvl.hom.net Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11295 I'm looking for a packaged bee supplier in central Louisiana. Anybody know of one? Thanks in advance... -- Chip McCurdy Ambrosia Apiaries 1304 Davis Avenue Perry, Georgia 31069 Beeman@Georgia.com http://www.GEORGIAHONEY.com ============================ Heart of Georgia Beekeepers Association http://www.hom.net/~beeman ======================== SEE OUR EXHIBIT AT THE GEORGIA NATIONAL FAIR IN PERRY, GEORGIA USA OCTOBER 9th thru 18th 1998 http://www.gnfa.com Article 11296 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!199.117.161.1!csn!nntp-xfer-1.csn.net!herald.Mines.EDU!not-for-mail From: Brian Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Varroa Detection in Field Bees Date: Tue, 03 Mar 1998 20:49:51 -0700 Organization: Colorado School of Mines Lines: 65 Message-ID: <34FCCF5E.31F549CA@mines.edu> References: <34FC9350.448150A7@ne.mediaone.net> <199803031647.IAA00594@ix.netcom.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: metsb.mines.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en] (WinNT; I) To: Anonymous Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11296 I was actually thinking of taking a sampling of bees from the enterance of the wild hive. Since this hive has appeared quite healthy for three years, and I believe there is Varroa in Golden, CO, I was hoping maybe they had some degree of resistance. If I find they do have mites, but they continue to survive then I may be on to something. If they have no mites, then they either have not been exposed or they are fully mite resistant (both of which seem unlikely), and I'm not sure if it would be possible to tell which without purposfully infecting them, which I am not inclined to do. It wouldn't be difficult to get a good quantity of bees from the entrance (difficult is a relative term, the hive is in a hollow maple tree with the hive entrance probably 25 feet up), but it would be relatively impossible to get a sample of bees from a brood comb as is mentioned in most varroa testing I have read about. The other issue is that the tree is actually in someone's front yard, and I am loath to approach them about it because I fear that if they do not already know about the hive they might over-react and call the exterminator. It seems to me that varroa mites MUST also infect field bees at least to a small degree or the mites would never be transfered from hive to hive. Either an infected field bee must enter a non-infected hive, a robber field bee from a non-infected hive must enter an infected hive and carry mites back out, or a mite must move from an infected field bee to a field bee from a non-infected hive while both are at the same flower. If varroa mites never infect field bees, I can't see how they can possibly spread other then by accompanying swarms. The intent of my question really was to try and determine how many field bees I would have to collect from the enterance of a wild hive to be sure of an accurate diagnosis of a hive. I assume even a single mite means the hive is invected, but do I need to sample 10, 100 or 1000 field bees at the hive enterance to ensure an accurate diagnosis? Of course this will vary with the infestation level of the hive, but you get the idea. Evidentally no one had done it yet, but as someone else said, it would be very interesting for someone to do a comparison experiment correlating varroa loads on different types and ages of bees from the same hive. Something like: 1mite/100 field bees = 10 mites/100 nurse bees = 7 mites/100 worker brood = 50 mites/100 drone brood. It wouldn't seem that hard to do. I'm just a hobbyist with (as of yet) mite free bees at a relatively remote mountain location, or I'd volunteer do it myself and post the results. How about it anyone? I also know there are honey bees in parts of a nearby national forest I hike occasionally. Since I see field bees working flowers quite deep into the forest, I am assuming they are from wild hives. As these bees are in very mountainous terrain, I assume they have not yet been exposed, but you never know. Since I have just been wandering around the woods anyway, and since I have long been interested trying "bee hunting" or "bee lining", I figured I could just combine some of these activities and monitor a few of these hives (if I ever find any and if they do turn out to be wild) for mite resistance. No offence to the many fine people who are trying to develop mite resistant bees, but I believe that the solution to this problem will likely come from mother nature rather than the hand of man. When it comes to higher yields, gentleness, or low swarm inclination, selective breeding is essential as natural selection will not breed for traits over and above what is required for species survival, but when it comes to sheer survival, no human program can possibly match the ruthless culling of the weak and the huge variety of genetic combnations going on in the "natural experiment". Brian Article 11297 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!rutgers!usenet.logical.net!nntprelay.mathworks.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!205.139.56.103!news.pe.net!ns From: amschelp@pe.net (Peter Amschel) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Low on foundation: Was - Re: First swarm of the year Date: Wed, 04 Mar 1998 04:19:14 GMT Organization: PE.net - Internet access from the Press-Enterprise Company Lines: 15 Message-ID: <6dikl5$po6$1@arlington.pe.net> References: <6dcij3$gur@bgtnsc02.worldnet.att.net> <6dhvj4$vng$1@netnews.upenn.edu> <34FCC2F5.CB10D15@mines.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: hem02ppp07.pe.net X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.01 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11297 In article <3bs on either side are straight and even. Not practical > for a commercial >operation I understand, but as I am a small hobbiest who cannot afford an > extractor, I usually end >up just cutting the honeycomb out of the frames anyway. Not as much honey as > they have to replace >all the wax each year, but I still have enough honey and I can use the wax > anyway. > >Brian Allen > I am a small but smooth operator, too, overseeing one top bar hive this year. Yesterday I gave a gift baggie of some of the comb honey to a lady and she was as happy as if I had given her gold. Top bar hive honeycomb is very fine indeed. Article 11298 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!205.139.56.103!news.pe.net!ns From: amschelp@pe.net (Peter Amschel) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Varroa Detection in Field Bees Date: Wed, 04 Mar 1998 04:43:31 GMT Organization: PE.net - Internet access from the Press-Enterprise Company Lines: 11 Message-ID: <6dim2q$r2k$1@arlington.pe.net> References: <34FC9350.448150A7@ne.mediaone.net> <199803031647.IAA00594@ix.netcom.com> <34FCCF5E.31F549CA@mines.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: hem02ppp07.pe.net X-Newsreader: News Xpress 2.01 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11298 In article < I'm with you Brian. Last month I was hiking in one of the Palm Springs Indian Canyons and there is a honeybee hive in a rock crevice that the guide showed us. Apparently that hive has lived there continuously for a quite a long time. A person should be able to check out a feral hive like that with one of those fiber optic arthroscopy tubes. Those tubes come equipped with lights and little snippers and magnifying glasses so that maybe you could confirm your theories with one of those medical instruments like that if you could figure out where the doctors get those items. Article 11299 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!titan.oit.unc.edu!usenet From: adamf@titan.oit.unc.edu (Adam Finkelstein) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Varroa Detection in Field Bees Date: 4 Mar 1998 08:23:25 -0500 Organization: SunSITE UNC-CH Lines: 70 Message-ID: <6djkkd$gca@titan.oit.unc.edu> References: <34FC9350.448150A7@ne.mediaone.net> <199803031647.IAA00594@ix.netcom.com> <34FCCF5E.31F549CA@mines.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: titan.oit.unc.edu Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11299 In article <34FCCF5E.31F549CA@mines.edu>, Brian wrote: >No offence to the many fine people who are trying to develop mite resistant bees, >but I believe that the solution to this problem will likely come from mother >nature rather than the hand of man. When it comes to higher yields, gentleness, >or low swarm inclination, selective breeding is essential as natural selection >will not breed for traits over and above what is required for species survival, >but when it comes to sheer survival, no human program can possibly match the >ruthless culling of the weak and the huge variety of genetic combnations going on >in the "natural experiment". I beg to differ. If one is going to assume that natural selection is a main driving force in evolutionary success, then one may also assume that *selection* itself drives the success. Artificial selection has been very successful in agriculture, for example observe any domesticated animals. How about dogs. In less than 500 years, the two dog breeds, Great Dane and Chihuahua have been selected for, by man. They are still the same species, but if given time, they'd probably become reproductively isolated. (I picked the breeds for that reason ;-) ). This time-frame of 500 years for this advanced divergence blows natural selection away in (philosophically speaking) efficiency. Artificial selection, via human program, has out done natural selection. Lets look at honey bees. First off, since _Apis mellifera_ is not native to North America, the comparison of natural selection to artificial selection is somewhat fruitless--since a "human program" brought the honey bees to this habitat. Perhaps honey bees would be very different if they had not crossed the Atlantic, perhaps not. Why didn't an analogous form evolve here in North America? Who knows, but bees in North America are here from man's intervention--as are Varroa. Therefore, the stage is set, selectionally speaking, to be biased toward artificial. Natural selection doesn't breed for traits. Natural selection isn't a mechanism--it's a concept. The key word in natural selection is random. Random. Why couldn't there be a bee phenotype that was Varroa resistant and produced honey? There could. Through the process of natural selection, via the mechanisms of each organism's gene expression in progeny, there will be random combinations. It is entirely feasible that through natural selection, there could be no offspring that could survive the environment, and the organism could locally go extinct. An example would be intense Winter colony losses a few years after Varroa appeared. You wrote: "but when it comes to sheer survival, no human program can possibly match the ruthless culling of the weak and the huge variety of genetic combinations going on in the "natural experiment"." Perhaps. But, since honey bees are agricultural animals and have been selected by man for a very long time, this "huge variety of genetic combinations" you describe is not too huge. The idea that out there somewhere is a hive with traits for Varroa mite tolerance is somewhat naive--since we haven't really determined exactly how this mite damages hives. Maybe, when knowledge is obtained about the mite's mode of action, and what exactly is happening at a physiological level, we'll be able to *know* what to select for, and push down hard on our selection. The model of "finding the single resistant hive" is optimistic, but I fear, not feasible. Phenotypes change in populations slowly. Honey bees are extremely difficult to breed. Ask any breeder. Adam (my margins are set to 75) -- ___________________________________________________________________________ Adam Finkelstein Internet Apiculture and Beekeeping Archive adamf@sunsite.unc.edu http://sunsite.unc.edu/bees Article 11300 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!205.252.116.205.MISMATCH!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!206.20.110.210!fresh!anon.lcs.mit.edu!nym.alias.net!mail2news Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 20:35:30 -0800 Message-ID: <199803040435.UAA00559@ix.netcom.com> From: Anonymous Comments: Please report problems with this automated remailing service to . The message sender's identity is unknown, unlogged, and not replyable. Subject: Re: Varroa Detection in Field Bees Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <34FCCF5E.31F549CA@mines.edu> Mail-To-News-Contact: postmaster@nym.alias.net Organization: mail2news@nym.alias.net Lines: 26 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11300 Brian wrote: > >It seems to me that varroa mites MUST also infect field bees at least to a >small >degree or the mites would never be transfered from hive to hive. Either an >infected field bee must enter a non-infected hive, a robber field bee from a >non-infected hive must enter an infected hive and carry mites back out, or a >mite >must move from an infected field bee to a field bee from a non-infected hive >while >both are at the same flower. If varroa mites never infect field bees, I >can't see >how they can possibly spread other then by accompanying swarms. > I have heard the theory that parasitized drones, drifting from hive to hive, are the primary means of spreading Varroa. Good luck, and let us know how it goes. Article 11301 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!news-peer-east.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!Sprint!rill.news.pipex.net!pipex!news.clara.net!nnrp1.clara.net!not-for-mail From: James Brown Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: LATEST NEWS ON B.S.E. -- COW.DOC (0/3) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 98 17:52:20 GMT Lines: 9 Message-ID: <980304175220.n0000908.james.b@mail.clara.net> Reply-To: James Brown NNTP-Posting-Host: 195.8.75.226 X-Attachment: COW.DOC (0/3) X-Newsreader: atlantis mail 32 X-No-Archive: yes Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11301 Thank-you for reading this news article. Please deccode the following attatchment to find out the very latest on B.S.E. James Brown james.b@clara.net Article 11302 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!news-peer-east.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!Sprint!rill.news.pipex.net!pipex!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!nntp.news.xara.net!xara.net!news.clara.net!nnrp1.clara.net!not-for-mail From: James Brown Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: LATEST NEWS ON B.S.E. -- COW.DOC (1/3) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 98 17:52:20 GMT Message-ID: <980304175220.n0000909.james.b@mail.clara.net> Reply-To: James Brown NNTP-Posting-Host: 195.8.75.226 X-Attachment: COW.DOC (1/3) X-Newsreader: atlantis mail 32 X-No-Archive: yes Lines: 2278 Xref: fddinewz.oit.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:11302 begin 644 COW.DOC MT,\1X*&Q&N$`````````````````````.P`#`/[_"0`&```````````````$ M`````0``````````$````@````(```#^____``````````"`````J@```*L` M``#_________________________________________________________ M____________________________________________________________ M____________________________________________________________ M____________________________________________________________ M____________________________________________________________ M____________________________________________________________ M____________________________________________________________ M____________________________________________________________ M____________________________________________________________ M_______________________]____(0```)P````B````!0````8````'```` M"`````D````*````"P````P````-````#@````\````0````$0```!(````3 M````%````!4````6````%P```!@````9````&@```!L````<````'0```!X` M```?````(````'\````I````(P```"0````E````)@```"<````H````*@`` M`)L````K````+````"T````N````G0```#`````Q````,@```#,````T```` M-0```#8````W````.````#D````Z````.P```#P````]````/@```#\```!` M````00```$(```!#````1````$4```!&````1P```$@```!)````2@```$L` M``!,````30```$X```!/````4````%$```!2````4P```%0```!5````5@`` M`%<```!8````60```%H```!;````7````%T```!>````7P```&````!A```` M8@```&,```!D````90```&8```!G````:````&D```!J````:P```&P```!M M````;@```&\```!P````<0```'(```!S````=````'4```!V````=P```'@` M``!Y````>@```'L```!\````?0```'X```#^____@0```%(`;P!O`'0`(`!% M`&X`=`!R`'D````````````````````````````````````````````````` M```````````6``4`__________\#``````D"``````#`````````1@`````` M`````````(:`E@$*P;P!`P```(`S`````````0!#`&\`;0!P`$\`8@!J```` M```````````````````````````````````````````````````````````` M`!(``@'_______________\````````````````````````````````````` M````````````````8@````````!7`&\`<@!D`$0`;P!C`'4`;0!E`&X`=``` M````````````````````````````````````````````````````&@`"`?__ M__\4````_____P`````````````````````````````````````````````` M``0````?>P```````$\`8@!J`&4`8P!T`%``;P!O`&P````````````````` M```````````````````````````````````````````6``$!`0````(````$ M``````````````````````````````"&4V4`"L&\`89390`*P;P!`````-0- M-!1`!-0-`0```/[____^____!````/[___\&````!P````@````)````"@`` M``L````,````#0````X````/````$````!$````2````$P```!0````5```` M%@```!<````8````&0```!H````;````'````!T````>````'P```"`````A M````(@```",````D````)0```"8````G````*````"D````J````*P```"P` M```M````+@```"\````P````,0```#(````S````-````#4````V````-P`` M`#@````Y````.@```#L````\````_O___SX````_````0````$$```!"```` M0P```$0```!%````1@```$<```!(````20```$H```!+````3````$T```!. 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